Mexican military flies over South Texas

September 5, 2011 7:55 PM

A Mexican government official confirmed that Mexican military helicopters have permission to use Texas as a staging ground for missions into Mexico to fight drug traffickers.
posted by Renoroc (48 comments total)

Well, this is certainly one issue that has zero possibility for media/political spin and pointless escalation.
posted by Horselover Phattie at 7:59 PM on September 5, 2011 [10 favorites]

Maybe whatever the Mexican government has in mind will work better than the ATF's plan of shipping the cartels truckloads of weapons.
posted by demiurge at 8:02 PM on September 5, 2011 [13 favorites]

As an American citizen I am outraged that another country would use our country as a staging ground in a war.
posted by The Hamms Bear at 8:04 PM on September 5, 2011 [49 favorites]

Well, unless the solution is ending prohibition it probably is going to involve Americans continuing to ship them truckloads of money.
posted by furiousxgeorge at 8:04 PM on September 5, 2011 [2 favorites]

There is a very persuasive gentleman on chron.com with some evidence that this is all part of Obama's plan to give the rest of our jobs to mexicans. Obama's shipments of arms into Mexico are part of the plan. Wake up sheeple, Obama tricked us into thinking he was from Kenya when he is actually Mexican!
posted by Ad hominem at 8:08 PM on September 5, 2011 [3 favorites]

mm, perhaps, if he agreed to it it, this will sink Perry
posted by edgeways at 8:09 PM on September 5, 2011 [1 favorite]

Still waiting for that Mexican covert operation special forces team which does an assassination mission on a drug lord who is living in an American city and it's accomplished before the US even knows about it happening and the uproar it causes in our government that any foreign government would DARE to do such a thing on our soil.
posted by hippybear at 8:12 PM on September 5, 2011 [4 favorites]

mm, perhaps, if he agreed to it it, this will sink Perry

If Perry agreed to it, someone should inform him that the Constitution explicitly denies states the power to enter into any agreement or compact with a foreign power.
posted by Flunkie at 8:15 PM on September 5, 2011 [3 favorites]

Mexico has a government?
posted by buzzman at 8:17 PM on September 5, 2011 [3 favorites]

If this is true, Perry is going to eat Obama alive over this. Americans of almost all political stripes (except the very liberal, such as myself) are incredibly sensitive about our national territorial integrity.

It's very hypocritical, of course. We don't mind it when we fly helicopters and drones into other people's airspace unannounced, but, hey, we're Americans. We can do what we want.

This has the potential to be an extremely explosive and damaging issue.
posted by Avenger at 8:19 PM on September 5, 2011

The U.S. is cooperating in Mexico's war on drug cartels? Wow! This is really news.

The most shocking part of this story is the first line - about how there are trigger-happy vets out there with, like, 50 cal sniper rifles or something, looking to shoot these helicopters down.
posted by Dasein at 8:21 PM on September 5, 2011 [3 favorites]

The U.S. is cooperating in Mexico's war on drug cartels? Wow! This is really news.

This isn't news to educated, informed people like you and I. But to John Q. Public and Aunt Betsy on your facebook feed, this is "Obama allowing foreign troops to operate on American soil". That's how this is going to be perceived. Those crazy vets trying to shoot down the Mexican helicopters are going to be admired by very large swaths of the U.S. population. And that is dangerous.
posted by Avenger at 8:25 PM on September 5, 2011 [2 favorites]

mm, perhaps, if he agreed to it it, this will sink Perry

I'd wager this was approved by a certain former Texas governor.
posted by brain_drain at 8:30 PM on September 5, 2011

If this is true, Perry is going to eat Obama alive over this.

mm, perhaps, if he agreed to it it, this will sink Perry

I'd wager this was approved by a certain former Texas governor.

In any case, this seems to be a rather massive part of the story that the press hasn't managed to provide an answer to, no?
posted by rollbiz at 8:43 PM on September 5, 2011 [1 favorite]

"Who's using who? What should we do?
Well, you can't be a pimp and a prostitute too"
posted by Bighappyfunhouse at 8:44 PM on September 5, 2011 [4 favorites]

If this is true, Perry is going to eat Obama alive over this. Americans of almost all political stripes (except the very liberal, such as myself) are incredibly sensitive about our national territorial integrity.

It's very hypocritical, of course. We don't mind it when we fly helicopters and drones into other people's airspace unannounced, but, hey, we're Americans. We can do what we want.

This has the potential to be an extremely explosive and damaging issue.

I don't see why anyone would give a damn.
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 8:49 PM on September 5, 2011

I don't think anyone will care about this. We hear about Ramstein Air Force Base and Incirlik and Landstuhl all the time, and the American public (yes, even the stupid wing of the American public) understands these are in other countries. This isn't even that -- this is a staging area, this is flyover by an ally in a conflict our government supports. And if there's one thing conservative assholes love, it's the drug war. Sure, a few fringe types might be pissed, but otherwise? This smells like a nonstory to me.
posted by incessant at 8:54 PM on September 5, 2011 [1 favorite]

Why is this even necessary? Couldn't they stage missions into to Mexico from, well, Mexico?
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 9:01 PM on September 5, 2011 [1 favorite]

Heck, didn't we just fly two helicopters into Pakistan to execute a bad guy?
posted by muddgirl at 9:03 PM on September 5, 2011

Well...as long as they don't mess with it...
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 9:06 PM on September 5, 2011 [4 favorites]

This is obviously a ploy to show the Pakistanis that all governments let other governments stage operations just outside their borders.
posted by Quonab at 9:07 PM on September 5, 2011 [2 favorites]

Heck, didn't we just fly two helicopters into Pakistan to execute a bad guy?
posted by muddgirl at 12:03 AM on September 6

Hey grandma, quit it with the ancient history lessons. That was like four news cycles ago.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 9:29 PM on September 5, 2011 [1 favorite]

Why is this even necessary? Couldn't they stage missions into to Mexico from, well, Mexico?
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 12:01 AM on September 6

I'm guessing that would be kind of like staging a counter-forest-fire operation from the center of the blaze.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 9:31 PM on September 5, 2011

The bit at the end that mentions an episode where no one seems to know if a helicopter was Mexican military or drug cartel painted to look like Mexican military was interesting.
posted by mediareport at 9:38 PM on September 5, 2011 [2 favorites]

How long until they start using those helicopters to smuggle drugs into the USA?
posted by Iax at 10:18 PM on September 5, 2011

> How long until they start using those helicopters to smuggle drugs into the USA?

Why would Cartels bother with such visibility? They already transport tons of the stuff using cargo trucks and civilian cars. No need to take such risks with expensive gear like choppers when they can offload the hazard to the low-ranking smuggler.
posted by Horselover Phattie at 10:29 PM on September 5, 2011

incessant: "Sure, a few fringe types might be pissed"

Unfortunately, the "fringe" don't seem to be very "few" anymore.
posted by Rhaomi at 10:39 PM on September 5, 2011 [1 favorite]

This has been going on since 1987.

I don't think this is a big deal for anyone, Perry or Obama.
posted by Ironmouth at 10:45 PM on September 5, 2011

Look, how long has our military been occupying Texas? And all to no good at all. I think its time we pulled out and left the unstable and corrupt Texan government to its own devices. Texan oil isnt worth sacrificing American lives.
posted by happyroach at 11:16 PM on September 5, 2011 [8 favorites]

The most shocking part of this story is the first line - about how there are trigger-happy vets out there with, like, 50 cal sniper rifles or something, looking to shoot these helicopters down.

Heh. My (reserve) unit cooperates with the US National Guard and we exchange a few guys for training and excercises each year. Should I fear for our guys' safety in case some local nutjob decides they are invading?
posted by Harald74 at 11:43 PM on September 5, 2011

I am glad that the drug war is only a sham being fed to the press otherwise reality is getting really hard to believe.
posted by doctor_negative at 11:47 PM on September 5, 2011

I feel like I should have added an "oh the irony" or something to my comment upthread. I hope no one is [+]ing that at face value.
posted by The Hamms Bear at 12:18 AM on September 6, 2011

I wonder how the 'trigger happy vets' would feel if some of my trigger happy countrymen took pot shots at US planes in local Australian air space?
posted by bystander at 12:44 AM on September 6, 2011

not likely, The Hamms Bear...I think most MeFites have a pretty well-honed sense of irony.
posted by squasha at 1:29 AM on September 6, 2011 [1 favorite]

I think you people are way over estimating how much the average American will care about this.

Why is this even necessary? Couldn't they stage missions into to Mexico from, well, Mexico?

Only if they want their heads cut off.

Why would Cartels bother with such visibility? They already transport tons of the stuff using cargo trucks and civilian cars. No need to take such risks with expensive gear like choppers when they can offload the hazard to the low-ranking smuggler.

Actually these days Submarines are the new hotness.
posted by delmoi at 3:13 AM on September 6, 2011

Bah, if they'd just legalize the drugs, prices would drop, and all this smuggling would become economically unfeasible. We'd also have way less criminals and way less cops.
posted by TheKM at 3:30 AM on September 6, 2011 [1 favorite]

Actually these days Submarines are the new hotness.

Well, I think those are used by the Colombians to bypass the Mexicans. The cartels just south of Texas are fine with throwing waves of disposable mules at the problem.
posted by Horselover Phattie at 3:48 AM on September 6, 2011

The cartels just south of Texas are fine with throwing waves of disposable mules at the problem.

Actually, my favorite smuggling across the border story came from earlier this year, where a teacher who crosses the border between Juarez and El Paso every day for work fell victim to being an unwitting drug mule.

Clever scheme all around.
posted by hippybear at 4:06 AM on September 6, 2011

Americans of almost all political stripes (except the very liberal, such as myself) are incredibly sensitive about our national territorial integrity.

Yeah, what's next, stationing the bloody Luftwaffe in Texas?!
posted by Skeptic at 4:34 AM on September 6, 2011

Ooops, New Mexico, as a matter of fact
posted by Skeptic at 4:35 AM on September 6, 2011

And the unit emblem, with the Iron Cross over the state flag of New Mexico, is curiously crass...
posted by Skeptic at 4:39 AM on September 6, 2011

There's a French missile frigate docked at the Newport Navy base right now. It's doing it's tour of the northern shipping lanes, and is taking on fresh water and other supplies, and uniformed French naval officers and sailors are walking around on shore leave right now.

American military bases are designed to accommodate allied troops and infrastructure. We pioneered multinational joint-operations doctrine, and our bases are designed for it from the bones up. If an ally needs our help, we have the facilities to help... and Mexico is an ally. I'm not terribly keen on prohibitionist policies, but the Mexican government sort of is in a civil war with organized crime, and I'd much rather the elected government win that one.

So, yeah, I don't see the fuss.

Actually, I do - it's the Black Hellicopter/New World Order conspiracy bullshit. the House of Reps is talking about defunding the UN again, so you know whacko season is in full bloom.
posted by Slap*Happy at 4:42 AM on September 6, 2011 [1 favorite]

The bit at the end that mentions an episode where no one seems to know if a helicopter was Mexican military or drug cartel painted to look like Mexican military was interesting.

Would it be any diferent if they painted it to look like US military?

How long until they start using those helicopters to smuggle drugs into the USA?

Again, it would probably be easier for them to use US military aircraft. (Much more traffic, you see).
posted by Skeptic at 4:59 AM on September 6, 2011

THEY TOOK OUR JERRRRBS!
posted by Saxon Kane at 5:05 AM on September 6, 2011

This map seems relevant.
posted by ninebelow at 5:36 AM on September 6, 2011 [1 favorite]

Ending Prohibition didn't get rid of the mafia, and legalizing drugs won't get rid of the Mexican cartels.

They'll switch their primary efforts to the things that are now just sidelines, such as kidnapping, extortion, murder for hire, weapons smuggling, prostitution, robbery, prescription drug smuggling and counterfeiting, illegal antiquities, protected species trading, etc.

Legalizing drugs will make things much worse in the short run.
posted by jamjam at 9:06 AM on September 6, 2011 [1 favorite]

Canadian Army units have trained at the National Training Center at Fort Irwin, in southern California. I think some British Army units have trained there, too.
posted by Chocolate Pickle at 3:29 PM on September 6, 2011

And the unit emblem, with the Iron Cross over the state flag of New Mexico, is curiously crass...

shh, don't tell bonaparte
posted by clavdivs at 5:59 PM on September 6, 2011