Phoenix Jones No More!

October 11, 2011 11:59 AM

Phoenix Jones, the real life superhero who's been in the news (and previously on the blue) for his vigilante work in Seattle, was arrested for pepper-spraying four people outside a nightclub... and his secret identity revealed.

Benjamin "Fear the Flattop" Fodor, a MMA (mixed martial arts) fighter, has already posted bail, and both Fodor and his spokesman are claiming that he was breaking up a fight.

posted by Halloween Jack (125 comments total)

[sad horn]
posted by stinkycheese at 12:04 PM on October 11, 2011 [7 favorites]

How anyone can view this guy as anything but a jackass is beyond me.
posted by Sternmeyer at 12:11 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

[sad horn].
posted by CynicalKnight at 12:13 PM on October 11, 2011

Video via NPR
posted by trueluk at 12:13 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

Well this doesn't come as much of a surprise.
posted by localroger at 12:13 PM on October 11, 2011

[sad horn]
posted by Ian A.T. at 12:15 PM on October 11, 2011

Wait, couldn't he just fly away, like a real superhero?
posted by Old'n'Busted at 12:18 PM on October 11, 2011

Also from Publicola: Fodor is claiming that the arresting officer has "a vendetta" against him, he and his family are in hiding, and he's getting a new suit since the po-po took his old one away.
posted by Halloween Jack at 12:18 PM on October 11, 2011

Best stick to attacking car wheel clamps, like Angle Grinder Man.
posted by exogenous at 12:20 PM on October 11, 2011 [3 favorites]

Well, looking at the video, it does seem like some sort of argument (not just "dancing around and having a good time") was going on, but I'm not sure if the situation needed a costumed superhero running into the middle of it, and blasting everyone with pepper spray.
posted by stifford at 12:21 PM on October 11, 2011

I love how his archnemesis is a badass chick with a shoe.
posted by villanelles at dawn at 12:23 PM on October 11, 2011 [14 favorites]

Costumed Kook Busted In Seattle Street Assaults

Ah, J. Jonah Jameson -- your headlines never cease to amuse me.
posted by PlusDistance at 12:25 PM on October 11, 2011 [24 favorites]

[sad horns]
posted by The 10th Regiment of Foot at 12:25 PM on October 11, 2011

I feel sorry for the people who live there. Young people are so damned annoying.
/grump
posted by Dodecadermaldenticles at 12:32 PM on October 11, 2011

The first thing that came to mind was Griff The Invisible. But this asshole doesn't deserve the comparison.
posted by charlie don't surf at 12:33 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

Kook stands next to niggardly in the Hall of Innocuous Words that Sound like Racial Slurs.
posted by dr_dank at 12:33 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

Best stick to attacking car wheel clamps, like Angle Grinder Man.

What about Axe Grinder Man? He finds people having discussions, then leaps in to harp on a pet issue until they walk away in disgust.
posted by Sangermaine at 12:37 PM on October 11, 2011 [4 favorites]

"You just contact the mayor's office. He has a special signal he shines in the sky; it's in the shape of a giant cock. "
posted by crunchland at 12:38 PM on October 11, 2011 [4 favorites]

What makes him a faux superhero? Seems pretty legit to me.
posted by OverlappingElvis at 12:41 PM on October 11, 2011

Consider this a data point in y argument that "realistic" superhero stories are kind of bullshit since what superheros do in no way works in the real world.

They could have at leasted chased him across rooftops firing a machinegin at him from a helicopter though.
posted by Artw at 12:42 PM on October 11, 2011 [2 favorites]

Man my money was on him getting shot first.
posted by The Whelk at 12:43 PM on October 11, 2011 [2 favorites]

What makes him a faux superhero?

Lack of any 'super' aspect whatsoever coupled with the 'hero' aspect being debatable.
posted by Babblesort at 12:44 PM on October 11, 2011

What about Axe Grinder Man? He finds people having discussions, then leaps in to harp on a pet issue until they walk away in disgust.

Curses! My identity has been revealed! I must flee!!!

(throws dry ice into water bucket, escapes under cloud of smoke while trying not to cough)
posted by spoobnooble at 12:45 PM on October 11, 2011 [2 favorites]

Real superheros do not need pepper spray. Busted.
posted by spitbull at 12:51 PM on October 11, 2011

They could have at leasted chased him across rooftops firing a machinegin at him from a helicopter though.

Now I want David Mamet to do a movie with Michael Bay.

Most of the movie is the unspeakably dreary life of a sad little man who grinds away at being a fake superhero. But there are fantasy sequences (the only bits Bay touches) where he rewrites the awkward, stupid things that happen when he crusades for justice into ACTION BLOCKBUSTER EXTRAVAGANZA.

For bonus annoying points, you could cut two different trailers for two different audiences and garner lawsuits on misleading trailers from two entirely separate groups! Send the action picture thriller trailer to the kind of people who like Fast and Furious, and the talky, bitter trailer to the people who liked Drive!
posted by winna at 12:51 PM on October 11, 2011 [7 favorites]

Man my money was on him getting shot first.

Let that bet ride.

Unless (or until) there is a reality show in his future, my bet is that Benjamin "Peter Parker" Fodor has no intention of hanging up the cape. The man might be crazy, but he doesn't appear to be a fool.
posted by three blind mice at 12:51 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

"it's like Suckerpunch but you can't wank to it!"
posted by Artw at 12:56 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

Video via NPR

Wait... what the - ? There are people brawling in the street... Costumed guy somehow knows about it... Races to break it up... Pepper sprays a girl... Accomplice (sidekick? henchman? video tapes it... This is the strangest thing I have ever seen.
posted by KokuRyu at 12:57 PM on October 11, 2011

"it's like Suckerpunch but you can't wank to it!"

no now don't underestimate people.
posted by The Whelk at 12:59 PM on October 11, 2011 [3 favorites]

Real superheros do not need pepper spray.

Bruce Wayne may tend to disagree.
posted by The 10th Regiment of Foot at 12:59 PM on October 11, 2011

On the vimeo video at ~4:06, one of the women hit with the pepper spray shouts at Phoenix Jones, "Get out of here, it's not fucking Halloween."

Awesome.
posted by jamaro at 1:08 PM on October 11, 2011

I don't think it's a good idea to go out as a vigilante; it's too easy to run into bullet-piercing armor. Also, it's too easy to screw up if one is making assumptions about activity on the street; mistakes are too easily made, like this Seattle incident.

I think it's interesting that none of these vigilante groups are patrolling the serious high-crime neighborhoods, where the worst-of-the-worst terrorize those unfortunate to live nearby - where crime seems rampant and mostly goes unchecked. That's where cities need the most help, because it's those areas that nurture the worst kind of crime. In those places, it would be good to see National Guard interventions, locking down certain neighborhoods for a month at a time, until the problem is cleaned up.

Last, the canister that he was holding doesn't look like regular-issue pepper spray. It looks like bear spray, which is similar to pepper spray, but a lot more powerful.
posted by Vibrissae at 1:08 PM on October 11, 2011

Lack of any 'super' aspect whatsoever coupled with the 'hero' aspect being debatable.

That kind of sums up Batman.

Color me surprised at this news.
posted by P.o.B. at 1:14 PM on October 11, 2011

Seattle's masked superhero crime fighter "Phoenix Jones" is now fighting an assault charge for allegedly spraying pepper spray on people who he claims were fighting. Seattle police claim the people were dancing.

It's fairly rare that my gut reflex is to absolutely trust and support the police.
posted by Stagger Lee at 1:16 PM on October 11, 2011

Man my money was on him getting shot first.

Well, he claims he was already shot before.

If I remember correctly, I think he randomly showed up on a Nerdist podcast because he was in the hallways with Rainn Wilson pitching a show. He talked about getting shot, and crawling underneath a dumpster in shock, but I don't remember the details of it.
posted by shinynewnick at 1:21 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

Does he at least have a theme song? Because with a name like Phoenix Jones, he needs a fucking theme song.
posted by NationalKato at 1:25 PM on October 11, 2011

Does he at least have a theme song? Because with a name like Phoenix Jones, he needs a fucking theme song.

He does, but it's really just the William Tell overture.


Phoenix, Phoenix, Phoenix Jones
Phoenix, Phoenix, Phoenix Jones
Phoenix, Phoenix, Phoenix Jones
Phoenix Jones!
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 1:29 PM on October 11, 2011 [3 favorites]

Watching the video is squirm inducing. I love superhero stories in comic books and movies - but that stuff is fantasy. Watching somebody try it in the real world is like looking at sleazy authority porn. Just some big guy in a ridiculous costume who thinks he can attack people with pepper spray when they momentarily step out of line.

It's hard to tell what was happening with the crowd before Fodor ran into it, but the consistency of their accounts would seem to indicate that it was an impromptu dance scene and not a fight. Somebody did attempt a hit and run afterwards, but that may have been because they were pissed off and/or blinded by pepper spray. If he'd left them alone that incident would never have occurred.
posted by Kevin Street at 1:36 PM on October 11, 2011

I don't think it's a good idea to go out as a vigilante; it's too easy to run into bullet-piercing armor.

I don't know if you did that on purpose or not, but it shut my brain down for about 10 seconds of processing time. Which is a handy superpower.
posted by Shepherd at 1:38 PM on October 11, 2011 [7 favorites]

I know it's a typo, and I do them all the time, but I'm seriously pondering what bullet-piercing armor would be now. Giant spikes that stab the bullets as they come at you. Like reactive armor on your chest.
posted by dragoon at 1:40 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

So, did they also arrest Ryan McNamee, the guy with the vidcam who seemed to be egging the the boy blunder on?
posted by crunchland at 1:45 PM on October 11, 2011

Watching that video makes me feel embarrassed about owning comics. How can this guy think what he does is a good idea? If you want to fight crime, fight the causes, like poverty and poor education.

Don't run at tense, potentially violent people with a balaclava on, in the middle of the night. That behavior always results in crime.
posted by ScotchLynx at 1:50 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

As a lifelong superhero fanboy, a longtime Seattle resident, and an all-around interventionist at heart...I have steadfastly done my best to ignore this dude and his peers. Hell, I can't even bring myself to read these articles.

Superheroes don't pull off their craziness because of their superpowers or their costumes. They pull it off because they have writers on their side.* Real life doesn't work like that.

If "Jones" and the others like him were really serious about doing something to help their communities, they wouldn't do it while dressed like fucking clowns. And they'd find better things to do than jumping headlong into situations they don't understand.

(*--except Peter Parker, whom Quesada clearly despises)
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:54 PM on October 11, 2011 [2 favorites]

Wearing a silly costume and pepper spraying the shit out of people doesn't make you a superhero. In fact, it makes you very similar to many police officers.
posted by IvoShandor at 1:56 PM on October 11, 2011 [13 favorites]

There are many ways to help people in the real world, like volunteer work at hospitals and aid services, Meals On Wheels, Doctors Without Borders, and on and on. Someone could easily spend their whole life being a real superhero without ever putting on a costume or attacking other people.
posted by Kevin Street at 1:58 PM on October 11, 2011

Congratulations on the title, BTW.
posted by Artw at 2:03 PM on October 11, 2011 [4 favorites]

Fodor Frodo Lives!
posted by ericb at 2:16 PM on October 11, 2011

Funny how my brain processed that. I could not figure out why I kept stumbling and having to re-read "bullet-piercing armor". Seriously, I read that several times before my subconscious said "Fuck it, you know what he means, keep going." I didn't even realize what had happened until I saw it in a comment later.
posted by Xoebe at 2:32 PM on October 11, 2011 [2 favorites]

Don't run at tense, potentially violent people with a balaclava on

Run at them, instead, with a baklava on. Nobody will be able to resist your delicious pastry attack.
posted by Joey Michaels at 2:32 PM on October 11, 2011 [11 favorites]

And I just watched Kick-Ass today. Synchronicity? I think not!
posted by sfts2 at 2:35 PM on October 11, 2011

I think it's interesting that none of these vigilante groups are patrolling the serious high-crime neighborhoods

Less "interesting" and more "duh, they don't want to actually get into real danger".
posted by kmz at 2:45 PM on October 11, 2011

Watching this video has given me a hankering to see J. Walter Weatherman as a superhero vigilante.

[arm falls off, screaming and mayhem ensues]

AND THAT'S WHY YOU DON'T FIGHT IN THE STREETS
posted by speicus at 2:46 PM on October 11, 2011 [7 favorites]

Kick Ass SPOILER in this comment. Read at your own risk.


That's a good example of why super heroes work in fiction. Kick-Ass does the same thing as Benjamin Fodor, but he lives in a fictional world where crime is clearly out of control, which makes the whole vigilante thing seem justifiable. In the world of Kick-Ass, thousands of people will send you email looking for help if you advertise yourself as a superhero, because they're not getting assistance from anybody else, and criminals like Frank D'Amico operate out in the open, beyond the reach of police.
posted by Kevin Street at 2:46 PM on October 11, 2011

kick-Ass, both the comic and the movie, but much more so the movie, tries to have it both ways - starting out with the premise that this is superheroics in the real worlds facing the challenges a real world superhero would face, starting out with the whole thing being utterly stupid and goofy, and then gradually sliding into a world which operates under the same hazy logic as superhero stories anyway.
posted by Artw at 2:49 PM on October 11, 2011 [2 favorites]

So, did they also arrest Ryan McNamee, the guy with the vidcam who seemed to be egging the the boy blunder on?

Be fair now. When the women started retaliating for being pepper sprayed, McNamee was on the phone to the cops faster than a speeding bullet to complain about how his life was in danger...

If only the poor sap had had the smarts to call the cops *before* his buddy started running around, pepper spraying citizens at random.
posted by PeterMcDermott at 2:50 PM on October 11, 2011

This looks entirely ridiculous, but let's wait until we hear what Aquaman and Martian Manhunter have to say.
posted by panboi at 2:56 PM on October 11, 2011 [2 favorites]

This is kind of like the alternate Superman mythos, where there is no Superman. He's just a fantasy by Clark Kent, who is too wimpy to approach Lois Lane. So he imagines he is in adventures that would impress her.

A lot of people might have this fantasy, many of them might not even realize it. But you'd have to be insane to try to act on this fantasy.
posted by charlie don't surf at 2:57 PM on October 11, 2011

Not trained as a police officer, does something that even trained (Bologna) officers do.

Maybe this says something about how we train police officers or how we allow them to enforce authority as opposed to keeping the peace...
posted by Slackermagee at 2:59 PM on October 11, 2011

TheWhiteSkull, I think a better tune to use for a theme song is Dennis Moore:

Phoenix Jones, Phoenix Jones, over in Seattle,
Phoenix Jones, Phoenix Jones, looking for a battle,
...

Never was any good at parodies, though.
posted by Araucaria at 3:05 PM on October 11, 2011 [2 favorites]

I fully support this insane man going around and pepper-spraying douchebags making trouble in the street.
posted by rhizome at 3:16 PM on October 11, 2011 [2 favorites]

So, when does ol' Tony Baloney get arrested?
posted by darkstar at 3:17 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

Kick-Ass, both the comic and the movie, but much more so the movie, tries to have it both ways - starting out with the premise that this is superheroics in the real worlds facing the challenges a real world superhero would face, starting out with the whole thing being utterly stupid and goofy, and then gradually sliding into a world which operates under the same hazy logic as superhero stories anyway.

Isn't that Millar's shtick, though? I was a little surprised at how the movie devolved a into the old trope of guy gets the girl, and no real consequences for his actions. Which was worlds apart from the comic, then I realized they were reselling the same idea to the same group of people but just gave it a happier ending. At least for the main character.
posted by P.o.B. at 3:17 PM on October 11, 2011

I fully support this insane man going around and pepper-spraying douchebags making trouble in the street.

I... I can't even tell anymore. What have you done, Poe's Law?
posted by kmz at 3:18 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

TBH I prefer the movie, which is more honest about saying goodbye to real world concerns once Hit-Girl and Big Daddy show up. the comic is more "Look! Everything is grim! Isn't that realistic? It's so gritty!"
posted by Artw at 3:20 PM on October 11, 2011

"In this particular case, he perceived that this group was fighting and when we contacted them, they said they weren't fighting," said Det. Mark Jamieson, a Seattle Police Department public information officer.

Well, then. if that's what they *said*. Because obviously, people who were brawling in the street would admit that to a cop.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 3:22 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

"kick-Ass, both the comic and the movie, but much more so the movie, tries to have it both ways - starting out with the premise that this is superheroics in the real worlds facing the challenges a real world superhero would face, starting out with the whole thing being utterly stupid and goofy, and then gradually sliding into a world which operates under the same hazy logic as superhero stories anyway."

Yeah, the comic is far more satirical and bitter. Hollywood did the same thing with Millar's Wanted by filing off the most disturbing bits and reworking the story into something a bit more conventional.

Mark Millar is an interesting writer. Some of his work falls into the same deconstructionist grouping as Pat Mills and Garth Ennis, but those guys are completely upfront about their dislike of superhero story conventions. Millar works both sides of the fence, doing satire and totally straight superhero stories, and (imo, anyway) it's hard sometimes to tell just how far he has his tongue in cheek. In the most satirical stuff like Kick-Ass and Wanted he seems to be making fun of superhero fans more than the heroes themselves, and audiences eat it up.
posted by Kevin Street at 3:23 PM on October 11, 2011

He's very much a post Moore/Millar writer, in that everything that Moore and Millar did that was different and shocking in Watchmen and Dark Knight he takes as being a baseline, with emphasis, of course, on bits that are grim, gritty and violent rather than the narrative tricks.
posted by Artw at 3:28 PM on October 11, 2011

TheWhiteSkull, I think a better tune to use for a theme song is Dennis Moore:

Which is a parody of the (Richard Greene) Robin Hood theme.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 3:32 PM on October 11, 2011

I think Frank Miller himself is a post Frank Miller writer these days. ;) Sometimes it works with stuff like Sin City, and then there's Holy Terror...
posted by Kevin Street at 3:34 PM on October 11, 2011

I find Kick-Ass to be great fun, even though it's a one-note concept and dumber than a bag of hammers.

That film though... It takes a special talent to screw up something so simple. I can't remember at which point I wanted to cry - it was either the jetpack or the Scarface quote. Or possibly any moment Nic Cage was on screen.
posted by panboi at 3:44 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

It's an odd equation. Millar keeps it real like MC Hammer did (does?). The very intent of the message they're delivering is inverted by the fact that the medium cannot inherently support and deliver that idea. Millar has done the "superheroes are real" bit a number of times various ways, but in the end the narrative is always going to dictate an un-realness to make it enjoyable.
posted by P.o.B. at 3:49 PM on October 11, 2011

Scratch 'enjoyable', and make that 'palatable'.
posted by P.o.B. at 3:50 PM on October 11, 2011

I fucking love the jetpack, the Scarface quote, and any moment Nic Cage is on screen, FWIW.
posted by Artw at 3:54 PM on October 11, 2011 [3 favorites]

Got to agree with Artw on Nicolas Cage. If only he was a real life superhero! He was even the victim of a real life comic book crime. It's like a mini series that yearns to be written.
posted by Kevin Street at 4:05 PM on October 11, 2011

I fucking love the jetpack, the Scarface quote, and any moment Nic Cage is on screen, FWIW.

The jetpack-anyone-can-learn-to-use-in-5-mins was a poor proxy for Hit Girl with a flamethrower.

I have lots of love for Nic Cage, but that goofy performance was 2 steps removed from Big Daddy - who managed to be very convincing in the comic, lending weight to the big reveal at the end.

You know, there's comics - and then there's cartoons. And I think Matthew Vaughn and Jane Goldman were clearly channeling Tex Avery cartoons when scriptwriting Kick-Ass.

Arguing with Artw on Metafilter - it's like the old days again :-)
posted by panboi at 4:19 PM on October 11, 2011

And I think Matthew Vaughn and Jane Goldman were clearly channeling Tex Avery cartoons when scriptwriting Kick-Ass.

I think it started vaguely real world and then superhero silliness started and it escalated into something that, yes, is like a Tex Avery cartoon. That's kind of it's charm. I think l the comic-book does the same thing but when it reaches the heights of unreality it's more Millarish and there fore grim-and-gritty, which I'd argue isn't the same thing as 'realistic" in the slightest.

Arguing with Artw on Metafilter - it's like the old days again :-)

(Will be attending a meetup tonight. I have hand-outs.)
posted by Artw at 4:29 PM on October 11, 2011

Did anybody see Super? There was precisely one funny bit, where Dwight was wearing the beard and talking to some woman at the library(?), and one OMG NO YOU DIDN'T bit where he used a wrench to smash some dude in a line for the movies, and the rest was godawful and that bit with Dwight having sex with the tiny girl from Juno was fucking creepy as shit.
posted by tumid dahlia at 4:44 PM on October 11, 2011

JAMES GORDON JR: Why's he running, Dad?

LT. GORDON: Because we have to chase him.

JAMES GORDON JR: Because he pepper-sprays people like a thuggish, power-crazy New York cop?

LT. GORDON: Because he's the hero Seattle deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll hunt him because he can take it. Because he's not a hero. He's a silent guardian. A watchful protector. A dark . . . oh, the hell with it. He's an attention whore in spandex who isn't making enough money panhandling in Pioneer Square.
posted by George Clooney at 4:49 PM on October 11, 2011 [8 favorites]

Did anybody see Super? There was precisely one funny bit, where Dwight was wearing the beard and talking to some woman at the library(?), and one OMG NO YOU DIDN'T bit where he used a wrench to smash some dude in a line for the movies, and the rest was godawful and that bit with Dwight having sex with the tiny girl from Juno was fucking creepy as shit.
posted by tumid dahlia at 4:44 PM on October 11 [+] [!]

It was supposed to be creepy, because (if you'd paid the slightest bit of attention, which your post leads me to believe, you didn't) - he didn't want it, she all but raped him.
posted by cerulgalactus at 4:53 PM on October 11, 2011

Does he at least have a theme song? Because with a name like Phoenix Jones, he needs a fucking theme song.

close enough

JAMES GORDON JR: Why's he running, Dad?

LT. GORDON: Because we have to chase him.

JAMES GORDON JR: Because he pepper-sprays people like a thuggish, power-crazy New York cop?

LT. GORDON: Because he's the hero Seattle deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll hunt him because he can take it. Because he's not a hero. He's a silent guardian. A watchful protector. A dark . . . oh, the hell with it. He's an attention whore in spandex who isn't making enough money panhandling in Pioneer Square.
posted by George Clooney

Those grapes must be pretty sour, Mr 'Worst Batman Ever'.
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 5:18 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

Christ, what an asshole.
posted by eyeballkid at 5:56 PM on October 11, 2011

Super asked questions and went places Kick Ass was afraid to. Plus no Nicholas Cage.
posted by stinkycheese at 6:18 PM on October 11, 2011

I'm wondering if the alleged showdown last night over the #occupyseattle between the police and mayor's office had anything to do with this. There might have been a lot of pissed off cops on the street after being told they couldn't break up the protest.
posted by formless at 6:19 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

It was supposed to be creepy, because (if you'd paid the slightest bit of attention, which your post leads me to believe, you didn't) - he didn't want it, she all but raped him.

Do, it was creepy that that fucking Dwight Schrute guy, whoever his name is, wrote a screenplay and directed a movie that, presumably, he had some say in casting for, and got a tiny little girl-looking thing to have sex with his character, who was actually him. Yes I know they didn't actually have real actual penetrative sex but jesus, ugh. All it made me think was that he wrote the movie and got financing for it solely because he wanted Hard Candy squirming in his lap for fifty takes. It's like Chloe Sevigny and Vincent Gallo all over again, except worser.
posted by tumid dahlia at 8:02 PM on October 11, 2011

Do? I don't even know what I meant there any more. Maybe "no".
posted by tumid dahlia at 8:02 PM on October 11, 2011

It was supposed to be creepy, because (if you'd paid the slightest bit of attention, which your post leads me to believe, you didn't) - he didn't want it, she all but raped him.

Do, it was creepy that that fucking Dwight Schrute guy, whoever his name is, wrote a screenplay and directed a movie that, presumably, he had some say in casting for, and got a tiny little girl-looking thing to have sex with his character, who was actually him. Yes I know they didn't actually have real actual penetrative sex but jesus, ugh. All it made me think was that he wrote the movie and got financing for it solely because he wanted Hard Candy squirming in his lap for fifty takes. It's like Chloe Sevigny and Vincent Gallo all over again, except worser.

If somebody looks or plays a creepy character, they're not allowed to write and direct movies. And a 23 year old woman must be an underage girl because she starred in movies when she was a kid. You must be a huge Woody Allen fan.
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 8:12 PM on October 11, 2011

Do, it was creepy that that fucking Dwight Schrute guy, whoever his name is, wrote a screenplay and directed a movie that, presumably, he had some say in casting for, and got a tiny little girl-looking thing to have sex with his character, who was actually him. Yes I know they didn't actually have real actual penetrative sex but jesus, ugh. All it made me think was that he wrote the movie and got financing for it solely because he wanted Hard Candy squirming in his lap for fifty takes. It's like Chloe Sevigny and Vincent Gallo all over again, except worser.

According to both IMDB and Wikipedia, it was written and directed by James Gunn, not by Rainn Wilson (a.k.a. that fucking Dwight Schrute guy, whoever his name is).
posted by Flunkie at 8:41 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

Yep pretty much everything about that comment was wrong, except for the part about Ellen Page being hot.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:56 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

I'm conflicted about this dude. According to that video he seems like a weird tool, but also he doesn't seem to pepper spray anyone until they attack him. I suppose he should be fighting poverty instead of crime, but if he wants to help protect people he shouldn't go to jail for it. What happened to those paramilitary guardian angel dudes, they still around?
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:01 PM on October 11, 2011 [2 favorites]

I hate Woody Allen too! And I never said she was hot, I said she was tiny, she is, and it's creepy to the max and I don't even care what any of you people say!
posted by tumid dahlia at 9:48 PM on October 11, 2011

Weren't you just complaining about Australians' cultural illiteracy in another thread? Hmmm.....
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 9:49 PM on October 11, 2011

Dude, if you're going to hold up Super as an artefact worthy of intelligent scrutiny and a product of cultural literacy then you need to put a stop to that fast and think, really think about what it is you are potentially/possibly/maybe going to suggest.
posted by tumid dahlia at 10:05 PM on October 11, 2011

It was in response to I hate Woody Allen too!
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 10:05 PM on October 11, 2011

Oh. Well, I do because I consider his movies dull and unfunny and he irritates me on some weird primal level, but that's just a matter of my subjective taste. I can understand why people might consider him great, but I prefer Larry David, because at least he has some charisma.
posted by tumid dahlia at 10:08 PM on October 11, 2011

Can you at least admit that your base reasons for finding the scene creepy are wrong?

I don't give a crap if you like the film or not, just at least have your facts correct before you demonize something.
posted by cerulgalactus at 10:10 PM on October 11, 2011

You might be creeped out by Super and this guy because Australia and Germany are two cultures that seem slightly ‘herophobic

posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 10:10 PM on October 11, 2011

No I won't admit that it's wrong because it isn't. Even in the context of the film it is completely ridiculous - he could have easily overpowered her - but the idea that a bunch of people got together and thought it would be an awesome thing to put in a movie just squicks me out enormously. Plus, in the film, she was contextualised as super-young, and he as quite-oldish, and it was like watching a horrible thing happen in a park at night. However, I will admit that my assumption about the writer/director was unfounded and I retract that and apologise to all the people hurt and upset by my furious frothing.
posted by tumid dahlia at 10:15 PM on October 11, 2011

Also I'm not hero-phobic, because I like Animal Man and Swamp Thing. Superman is a real jerkface though.
posted by tumid dahlia at 10:17 PM on October 11, 2011

Wait...we're hero-phobic because we didn't like Captain America? Maybe we've just got superior taste because we don't like tremendously shitty films!
posted by tumid dahlia at 10:18 PM on October 11, 2011

Also I'm not hero-phobic, because I like Animal Man and Swamp Thing. Superman is a real jerkface though.

Two non-traditional, nature based characters who barely qualify as superheroes and, assuming you're using Morrison's Animal Man run, at one point were used as a mouthpiece for vegatarianism. Stereotypes busted!
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 10:18 PM on October 11, 2011

It's not really clear to me at this point whether you're kidding or not. Your entire rant seemed based upon the idea that Rainn Wilson wrote and directed the film. It doesn't seem like you said anything in there that was not directly attacking the film based upon that idea.
posted by Flunkie at 10:18 PM on October 11, 2011

That's a really big-ass can of pepper spray. Is he shooting people with bear spray?
posted by Horselover Phattie at 10:19 PM on October 11, 2011

So, you don't like Super, for reasons that others have PROVEN to you to be erroneous. And now you call Captain America a bad film?

Have you ever stopped to think that maybe the problem lies with you and your awful taste?
posted by cerulgalactus at 10:20 PM on October 11, 2011

Although apparently a bunch of us saw Transformers 3 too, so I dunno.

Flunkie: yeah, and that makes it worse, because it means somebody thought it would be sweet to have David Sandstrom's surly daughter squirming around in Dwight Schrute's lap for fifty takes. It is literally slash fiction! Gah!
posted by tumid dahlia at 10:22 PM on October 11, 2011

assuming you're using Morrison's Animal Man run, at one point were used as a mouthpiece for vegatarianism

Oh dear me no. I'm talking Peter Milligan and also the latest one, whoever that's by. Morrison's run was okay but made me shrug heartily at the end when he put himself in it all Romper-Stomper.

cerulgalactus: Thor was okay though.
posted by tumid dahlia at 10:24 PM on October 11, 2011

Where the hell do you get "fifty takes" from? Seriously - I'm honestly starting to think that you are trolling us all.

And, it's only slash fic because you can't seem to differentiate roles that actors are playing in a super hero parody from roles that they played in other projects.
posted by cerulgalactus at 10:25 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

Flunkie: yeah, and that makes it worse, because it means somebody thought it would be sweet to have David Sandstrom's surly daughter squirming around in Dwight Schrute's lap for fifty takes. It is literally slash fiction! Gah!

No, slash fiction is when two characters of the same gender, usually male, are paired on screen. The closest 'official' productions are Velvet Goldmine (Bowie/Iggy/Lou Reed) and that episode of Torchwood where Spike showed up.


You probably hated Captain America based on the premise, right?
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 10:27 PM on October 11, 2011

cerulgalactus: Thor was okay though.

Hey, what country did the actor playing Thor come from again?
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 10:27 PM on October 11, 2011

Oh dear me no. I'm talking Peter Milligan and also the latest one, whoever that's by. Morrison's run was okay but made me shrug heartily at the end when he put himself in it all Romper-Stomper.

and Romper Stomper wasn't even metafictional! guh!
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 10:28 PM on October 11, 2011

Three Aussies arguing about American super hero films - GO TECHNOLOGY!

/injecting some positiveness in this thing.
posted by cerulgalactus at 10:30 PM on October 11, 2011

There was an Aussie take on this whole thing, Griff the Invisible, but I don't think anyone saw it.
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 10:31 PM on October 11, 2011

I have no idea who David Sandstrom is. I assume that by "surly daughter" you're somehow referring to Ellen Page again, though she doesn't seem surly to me. I don't know whether the repeated "fifty takes" is something that you know happened or a product of feverish imagination. I am at a loss for understanding how it is "literally slash fiction". I don't get how things went from "it's creepy because he wrote and directed it" to "it's even creepier because he didn't write or direct it".

In short, I find myself at a total loss of comprehension in this conversation. If that was your objective, kudos. Well done.
posted by Flunkie at 10:33 PM on October 11, 2011 [1 favorite]

I've got Griff coming on my Quickflix list pretty soon, I am jazzed to see it - heard nothing but good.

And Flunkie - that is a reference to Trailer Park Boys, Ellen Page played the daughter of one of the characters.
posted by cerulgalactus at 10:36 PM on October 11, 2011

I bet Outlaw Vern is involved
posted by Lovecraft In Brooklyn at 10:42 PM on October 11, 2011

I must say that the video is like watching a version of Kick-Ass written by the Breaking Bad guys and shot Blair Witch Project style. There's a movie in this.
posted by AccordionGuy at 1:08 AM on October 12, 2011

We don't get much violent crime up here in Seattle.

But when we do, boy, is it ever fucking weird violence. Something in the water, I tell you whut.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 1:14 AM on October 12, 2011 [2 favorites]

I fight crime by flicking through the Daily Mail, making the occasional tutting sound and declaiming how much better it was in the old days when we had national service.
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 6:13 AM on October 12, 2011

Best I can tell from the video:

Having spent many evenings on the town this looks like the typical drunken brawls that happen over completely stupid shit just after all the bars let out from last call.

He's right that this wasn't a dance, there's some kind of drunken fisticuffs going on, you can see a guy throw a punch. Phoenix and Juggalo Guy come running in - it's difficult to tell but I think they pepper spray the guys throwing punches.

The punchy guys retreat, but now the drunken girlfriends retaliate against Phoenix, Juggalo Guy, and Cameraman. Angry Drunk Bitch whoops up on Phoenix with her shoe. Red Pants slaps Cameraman around a little bit.

During this time, the boyfriends retreat to their Escalade in a parking lot a block away. At this point someone flees in a BMW nearly running someone over.

Phoenix and Juggalo Guy follow the boyfriends back to the Escalade. They arrive about the same time as Angry Drunk Bitch and Red Pants.

The two girls rejoin their group at the Escalade while Phoenix and his cadre watch from across the street while calling the cops.

Red Pants starts sassing Phoenix and Co. from the middle of the street, angered by this, Angry Drunk Bitch flies into another furious attack but her shoe bounces off of Phoenix's body armor.

By now the boys have recovered from the pepper spray, and are still drunk and pissed off. They come charging across the street after Phoenix, and use beer, testosterone, and bravado to fight through a cloud of pepper spray to try and get a punch off.

Phoenix, Juggalo Guy, and Cameraman retreat into the Ferry Terminal to get away from the drunks who are now throwing rocks at them. Underpaid Security Guard tells them to get the hell off his property.

Now the cops show up, and arrest Phoenix not because he did anything wrong, but just because they're sick of dealing with his bullshit and just want him to go away.

Or something like that.
posted by smoothvirus at 7:00 AM on October 12, 2011 [3 favorites]

From the Seattle pi story here -

"There was a report earlier in the night in which several nightclub patrons had been reportedly been pepper-sprayed by (him) during some type of disturbance. Those people left the area before they could be contacted by police. Officers arriving on that call noted the odor of pepper spray was still in the air."

Oh yeah, that assault charge will stick.

Not sure if hanging around the nightclub district in a mask and body armor with your pals, and inserting yourself into drunken brawls is a good idea though.
posted by smoothvirus at 7:26 AM on October 12, 2011

They have not decided whether to file charges against this criminal or not. Why the heck would they approve and allow such blatant assault charges like this?

I
http://www.komonews.com/news/local/131797613.html
posted by 2manyusernames at 7:15 AM on October 14, 2011

They have not decided whether to file charges against this criminal or not.

If there haven't even been charges filed, let alone a conviction, then he's not a criminal.
posted by grouse at 12:13 PM on October 14, 2011

Seattle superhero walks free, vows to continue fighting crime
posted by homunculus at 12:18 PM on October 14, 2011

When I was in class yesterday, the guy next to me popped open his laptop and this was one of the top stories on MSN or whatever. I pointed it out and he begins to tell me he went to school with the guys older brother and that he was acquainted with the guy. He didn't know it was him until he was unmasked. So I had to ask. "He's, uh, a little off isn't he?" "Yeah, he's a bit weird. He grew up in foster homes and stuff so he kind of had a hard life. But, yeah, he's a little out there." We dropped it after that.
posted by P.o.B. at 12:39 PM on October 14, 2011

grouse: "They have not decided whether to file charges against this criminal or not.

If there haven't even been charges filed, let alone a conviction, then he's not a criminal."

There is no doubt he has assaulted people. There is zero doubt that he has committed crimes*. just because they chose to let him go doesn't mean he isn't a criminal. He is just a criminal that won't be punished unless he gets brought into a civil trial.

*I am assuming that if I was to pepper spray your wife you would expect me to spend some time in jail (perhaps after a hospital stay) even if she was in a fight.

It is one thing to act on your own to defend a victim of a crime and another thing to assault people to get them to stop fighting with each other.
posted by 2manyusernames at 1:13 PM on October 14, 2011

There is no doubt he has assaulted people.

That's a legal conclusion and there is, in fact, quite a bit of doubt that a court would make that conclusion in this case. Use of force can be lawful if it is justified in defense of one's self or others, which, if true here, would mean it not assault. I'm not ready to decide whether his use of force was justified or not based on the incomplete story so far.
posted by grouse at 1:37 PM on October 14, 2011