Comments on: drumming is dancing, dancing is drumming

drumming is dancing, dancing is drumming

flapjax at midnite — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 20:46:22 -0800

I'm willing to bet that even a lot of you who say "I don't like drum solos" will, well... like this one.

By: flapjax at midnite

flapjax at midnite — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 20:52:50 -0800

Now, just for you folks who might find this kind of thing interesting, let me just tell you a little about the drums ol' Fred is using here. You'll note a couple of barrel-shaped tom-toms: those are Chinese, and in the early days of the drum kit (also known as the "trap set" or the "trap kit") it was those Chinese drums that were ubiquitous. Also note, the two pedals on either side of the drum assemblage: those are the precursors to the modern hi-hat. The hi-hat started out being, well, not so high. Those are called... low boys! OK, that's it for your evolution-of-the-modern-drum-kit primer!

By: unSane

unSane — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 20:53:06 -0800

That was awesome (although the drum sounds were all done in post, obviously... the mid-size tom on the left unaccountably had a snare sound). Does history record whether Fred could actually drum seriously?

By: unSane

unSane — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 20:54:03 -0800

Did the Chinese drums have snares on them? Cos I definitely heard them on one of them.

By: hanoixan

hanoixan — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:00:52 -0800

For the TLDW's, the good part's at 3:05 (but, you know, it's all good).

By: MaryDellamorte

MaryDellamorte — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:02:14 -0800

I'm not a fan of drum solos, it's a form of musical masturbation. But in that video, the drumming is secondary to his dancing and tapping skills so I wouldn't consider it a drum solo.

By: The Discredited Ape

The Discredited Ape — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:03:41 -0800

Well thank christ for that. I've just sat through some of the pure garbage in the BS of A post, which made me feel overwhelmingly fucking sad, so it's good to have found something to take some of the bad taste away. Thank you.

By: facetious

facetious — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:04:55 -0800

He's incredible. I've never seen anyone so light on their feet - he dances like his body weighs 20 pounds.

By: eye of newt

eye of newt — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:12:06 -0800

Here's another one.

By: unSane

unSane — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:20:28 -0800

I'm not a fan of drum solos, it's a form of musical masturbation. They're no more or less masturbatory than any other instrumental solo -- the big difference is because they're entirely rhythmic without a melodic or harmonic component, you usually have to be a drummer to really enjoy them. For example: watching this guy play a fluid 7/8 groove with a steady backbeat on the 3 and the 6 1/2 completely blew my mind, but if you don't know what he's doing it just sounds like, y'know, drumming.

By: empath

empath — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:31:28 -0800

I dunno, he's no Tommy Lee

By: armoir from antproof case

armoir from antproof case — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:32:11 -0800

Amazing. And he's smiling the whole. Frikkin. Time.

By: flapjax at midnite

flapjax at midnite — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:37:57 -0800

I'm not a fan of drum solos, it's a form of musical masturbation. Anyone who paints drum solos, with a broad brush, as being "masturbatory", is someone who has never heard this or this or this (solo at 1:14) or this or any number of other stunningly musical drum solos. Or, If they have heard these and so many others, then they are simply... not listening. They don't know how to listen. And the fact that they are proud to indicate such is only a reflection on their own limitations regarding artistic and musical perception.

By: Ickster

Ickster — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:39:10 -0800

Not enough explosions.

By: hippybear

hippybear — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:41:30 -0800

I'm not a fan of drum solos, it's a form of musical masturbation. You need to be better acquainted with Neal Peart's more recent drum solos, then. They're melodic, they have structure, and they transcend the typical drum solo in nearly every respect. (Apparently David Letterman did a full week of drum solos. Here's Shelia E from the same week. Not really a solo, but damn that chick can RAWK!) Also, this is more of a drum duet, but it's completely awesome. Okay, back to the actual content of this FPP.

By: louche mustachio

louche mustachio — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:44:14 -0800

I think when most haters of drum solos talk about their hatred of drum solos, they are thinking of ROCK drum solos, which do tend to be wankery.

By: flapjax at midnite

flapjax at midnite — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:48:52 -0800

Okay, back to the actual content of this FPP. I for one have no problem with further discussion of drum solos (and any links to good ones!) because I think it does relate to the "actual content" of this post! For that matter, so do other tap dancing examples, and with that in mind, heck, here's the fabulous Nicholas Brothers in a number which, according to the YouTube uploader, was described by Fred Astaire as "the greatest dance number ever filmed."

By: bardic

bardic — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 21:52:47 -0800

This confirms my theory that America used to be a lot cooler.

By: MaryDellamorte

MaryDellamorte — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:05:02 -0800

I'm not a fan of drum solos or guitar solos or theremin solos or any form of music wankery. I appreciate musical technique on instruments of all sorts, but perfect technique does not a musician make. In the video you linked in your FPP, he is not a drummer and the talent he exhibits in the video is secondary to his "drumming." I wouldn't consider your FPP link to be a "drum solo" which is what my comment addressed.

By: cmoj

cmoj — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:19:52 -0800

This is the best of all possible threads.

By: 3FLryan

3FLryan — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:26:40 -0800

I'm not a fan of drum solos or guitar solos or theremin solos or any form of music wankery It's really, really sad that you equate "solo" with "wankery".

By: 3FLryan

3FLryan — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:28:41 -0800

I guess, in the strictest sense, since masturbation = solo for sex, masturbation = solo for music. But man, that solo can be a beautiful, intense, wonderful thing.

By: flapjax at midnite

flapjax at midnite — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:32:07 -0800

perfect technique does not a musician make. I'd be the first to agree with that. Many of my favorite musicians throughout history have had far from "perfect technique". But, also, I'd say that there is no such thing as "perfect technique". What does that even mean, anyway? For my part, I'm not interested in any kind of concept of "perfect technique". I am interested in good music, and that can happen in solos, duos, trios, quartets, quintest, sextets, septets, 8, 9, 10 piece bands, big bands, orchestras, and among planets.

By: zachlipton

zachlipton — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:32:11 -0800

I'm not a big drum solo person either, but I have been meaning to share Buddy Rich's West Side Story Medley on Parkinson (song starts at about 0:56, most epic drum solo at about 6:42). The sheer combination of exhaustion and exhilaration he displays as he comes down after the performance with his sweat rag in hand reminds me of an olympic athlete, at least if olympic athletes competed in v-neck pullovers.

By: bayani

bayani — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:39:59 -0800

Suave as fuck.

By: 3FLryan

3FLryan — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:40:56 -0800

and among planets Aha, a fan of Kepler!

By: flapjax at midnite

flapjax at midnite — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:46:21 -0800

Aha, a fan of Kepler! Yeah, but his second record sucked. He let Venus take too many solos. Total masturbation.

By: timsteil

timsteil — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:46:41 -0800

I already forwarded that to every drummer I know telling them to burn their sticks, because in the end, drummers suck.

By: flapjax at midnite

flapjax at midnite — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:48:19 -0800

aw, shucks, Tim, you're too kind!

By: This_Will_Be_Good

This_Will_Be_Good — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:51:13 -0800

I dunno, he's no Tommy Lee Oh, really?

By: flapjax at midnite

flapjax at midnite — Sat, 17 Dec 2011 23:59:55 -0800

Did the Chinese drums have snares on them? I've only ever seen them used, historically, as toms, quite separate from the snare drum, and I would imagine that they were very rarely, if ever, outfitted with snares to turn them into snare drums. But... maybe that one was retrofitted? Or, as you'd mentioned, post-production might be responsible for substituting the actual sound, that is replacing it with a snare sound.

By: twoleftfeet

twoleftfeet — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 00:00:36 -0800

Another guy playing drums with his feet.

By: dobie

dobie — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 00:04:19 -0800

What's awesome is the guy probably smoked two packs of cigarettes a day and drank like a fish. You don't see talent like that much anymore.

By: flapjax at midnite

flapjax at midnite — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 00:12:11 -0800

Another guy playing drums with his feet posted by twoleftfeet A kind of ultimate eponystericalicity.

By: neuromodulator

neuromodulator — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 00:40:09 -0800

wait the flute

By: palidor

palidor — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 01:29:27 -0800

The sheer combination of exhaustion and exhilaration he displays as he comes down after the performance with his sweat rag in hand reminds me of an olympic athlete, at least if olympic athletes competed in v-neck pullovers. Come on now this is just inviting the masturbation comparisons!!!!

By: KevinSkomsvold

KevinSkomsvold — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 01:42:44 -0800

MaryDellamorte: "I'm not a fan of drum solos, it's a form of musical masturbation." See also: Any "blues" guitar player at any open blues jam as the do the SRV Overbite and smoke the competition.

By: Drumhellz

Drumhellz — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 01:47:16 -0800

Derail here, but how the hell can you compose a sentence that includes the phrases "with all due respect" and "fucking retard"? That aside, having a brother who is a drummer(and used to compete in competitions,) I can definitely appreciate the musicality that goes into drum solos.

By: Decani

Decani — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 01:47:54 -0800

It's really, really sad that you equate "solo" with "wankery". posted by 3FLryan at 7:26 AM on December 18 Indeed. To claim "Solos are wankery" is plain wrong, not least because that statement doesn't have the words "Joe Satriani" at the beginning.

By: taz

taz — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 01:53:36 -0800

[Comment deleted; maybe the commenter would like to rephrase?]

By: MartinWisse

MartinWisse — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 02:12:26 -0800

To be fair, let's not forget there's at least a whole music generation that grew up under the shadow of punk and its visceral hatred of anything that smacked of prog rockery, bearded weirdies or pomposity. Any solo, drums, guitar, whatever, trigger those buttons. For others, the song is everything and solos disrupt the song; my late wife was like that. But for most people a drum solo at a concert is just a good time to get another beer....

By: flapjax at midnite

flapjax at midnite — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 02:24:03 -0800

To be fair, let's not forget there's at least a whole music generation that grew up under the shadow of punk and its visceral hatred of anything that smacked of prog rockery, bearded weirdies or pomposity. Yeah. How tragically limiting, though, to have punk be your litmus test for all the other musics of the world. The rich diversity of musical expression throughout the ages, all seen through the prism of whether or not Sid Vicious would've liked it. How incredibly provincial, how ridiculously absurd.

By: Drumhellz

Drumhellz — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 02:55:18 -0800

Well the cool thing about rich diversity of musical expression is that it can attract different tastes. Someone who has played a certain instrument may enjoy the dedication to craft that an incredible solo displays in the same way that a punk enthusiast would enjoy the raw emotion and message of a particular track. I think the division in some of the posts in this thread really speaks to the appreciation of different forms of art.

By: MartinWisse

MartinWisse — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 03:07:37 -0800

And the ironic thing is, some of the punks shouting the loudest about drum solo wankery also owned more thna their fair share of King Crimson, Yes or Genesis albums...

By: Hartham's Hugging Robots

Hartham's Hugging Robots — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 03:47:56 -0800

That was awesome (although the drum sounds were all done in post, obviously... Really? I mean, I know a lof of on-set sound is dubbed in post even now, but (in parts of this at least) the sync is very, very tight. Watch the sequence with him kicking the snare at http://youtu.be/DtwWQMwRf-M?t=1m4s. That's pretty tight. Granted there is also an obvious lack of visible mics (although goodness knows how drums would actually have been recorded then anyway)... but are we absolutely sure the sound comes from post? Given he's so capable of doing this beautifully anyway, and it's such a great gag that he can do it whilst dancing... gah, perhaps what I'm saying is, it just seems such a shame if they couldn't use the sounds he actually made...

By: cavalier

cavalier — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 03:57:42 -0800

Fred Astaire continues to blow my god damned mind with every clip. Thanks for this! (Was originally going to wank on about Neil Peart and either his recent Letterman appearance (thx hippybear!) or that 3D YYZ video, but, I mean, damn.)

By: fearfulsymmetry

fearfulsymmetry — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 03:59:52 -0800

Yeah, but straight afterwards Ginger Rogers did it backwards and in high heels

By: nathancaswell

nathancaswell — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 04:36:46 -0800

that would bring the Andopolis drum kit to an even thirty pieces

By: Ice Cream Socialist

Ice Cream Socialist — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 04:56:06 -0800

I'm not a fan of drum solos or guitar solos or theremin solos or any form of music wankery Ah, like vocal solos or violin solos or piano solos. It's all wankery until it's ensemble, then it progresses to a circle jerk, with which you seem more comfortable. You don't like music, and you're here to tell people who do that they actually like listening to people masturbate. In any case, I applaud the strong and courageous statement of self you've delivered here, though it's unclear whether your bravery is inspired by idiocy or vice versa.

By: pyramid termite

pyramid termite — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 05:16:42 -0800

By: unSane

unSane — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 05:26:32 -0800

are we absolutely sure the sound comes from post? Absolutely 100%. You could get frame accurate sync in post even back then. The sound of the kit is just too good and there are no mics. It's impossible to mic up a kit to sound that good and not have mics visible. The drums are all close mic'd (there's almost no room ambience at all). Not to mention the fact that the toe of a leather shoe isn't going to produce a nice 'crack' like a stick. AND the fact that one of those Chinese toms that Flapjax mentioned seems to be playing a snare sound!

By: unSane

unSane — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 05:28:28 -0800

Incidentally, the tom sounds on that recording are fantastic -- a massive crunch and no boing at all.

By: flapjax at midnite

flapjax at midnite — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 05:30:22 -0800

drum solos and bass solos got a very bad reputation in the 60s and 70s Hmm... were there really that many bass solos going on? I mean, in rock, which is what you're talking about, right pt? I dunno, I grew up with a lotta 60s and 70s music, but I just don't recall all that many bass solos. Have I blocked 'em out of my mind?

By: nathancaswell

nathancaswell — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 05:36:48 -0800

When I think epic wanking 70s solo I think flute.

By: Wolof

Wolof — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 05:37:29 -0800

I like a little bit of boing in a tom sound. Boing! High harmonics! Rubber ball!

By: ersatz

ersatz — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 05:46:05 -0800

and among planets. Holst?

By: Philosopher Dirtbike

Philosopher Dirtbike — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 05:47:28 -0800

Music is, from one perspective, a completely unnecessary past-time; it is a useless way to pleasure our dumb brains that evolved musical expression as an accident. All forms of music are wankery, not just the one you choose to dislike. All forms of music are also awesome. Our lives would be incomplete without music. Why all the hating on wanking, figurative or literal?

By: pracowity

pracowity — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 05:54:43 -0800

I like drum solos like I like tap dancing: never, unless the guy on the drums is as good a drummer as Fred Astaire was a dancer. In this case, of course, we pretty much have both. I also like masturbatory performances, but the same rule holds: only if the wanker is as good a wanker as Fred Astaire was a dancer. So... almost never. (And I'd pay good money to see Fred Astaire masturbate with his tap shoes.)

By: nathancaswell

nathancaswell — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 05:56:42 -0800

I'd pay good money to see Fred Astaire masturbate with his tap shoes. That sounds painful.

By: pyramid termite

pyramid termite — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 06:05:36 -0800

Have I blocked 'em out of my mind? it will take years of therapy for you to work through this and when you remember, you'll hate your therapist for it they weren't as common as the drum solos, but yeah, they did happen - they weren't recorded as much, though - focus 3 has one, which is overlong - james gang's first album has one on "lost woman", but that one happens to be kickin', with the drummer playing along - i think vanilla fudge's "break song" and canned heat's "refried boogie" has them, but i'm not going through an hour of musical torture to confirm that - oh, and rare earth's "get ready", which isn't bad, but not as good as the sax or the drum solo somewhere around 69 or 70, some bands thought recording drum solos was a good idea - maybe because it meant they could fill up 10 minutes of a record without having to come up with a song i wonder if anyone's cataloged these - might be an interesting project for masochists

By: pyramid termite

pyramid termite — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 06:06:54 -0800

oh, yeah, james gang live has another bass solo, but that's a lot longer and a different bassist

By: Songdog

Songdog — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 06:25:34 -0800

fearfulsymmetry wrote

Yeah, but straight afterwards Ginger Rogers did it backwards and in high heels

Or in this case, Ginger Baker.

By: 3FLryan

3FLryan — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 06:43:44 -0800

Indeed. To claim "Solos are wankery" is plain wrong, not least because that statement doesn't have the words "Joe Satriani" at the beginning. Some of his stuff is wankery. Some of his stuff is beautiful. Sure is cool to hate, though.

By: nathancaswell

nathancaswell — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 06:51:26 -0800

So what you're saying is not all solos are wanking but all wanking is done solo.

By: TDavis

TDavis — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 06:51:46 -0800

All this talk about the merits of the drum solo and everyone overlooks the one truly astounding thing about Astaire's performance: "One continuous shot beginning 0:12 all the way to the finish-- absolutely no cuts." Unbelievable.

By: zennie

zennie — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:00:35 -0800

: Does history record whether Fred could actually drum seriously? Seems likely... I found a picture of him on the drums at home.

By: MartinWisse

MartinWisse — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:02:29 -0800

Anyway, shouldn't be too scornful about wanking: it's sex with somebody you love after all.

By: pts

pts — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:10:14 -0800

While we're talking about midcentury novelty tap dance routines, here's Gene Kelly performing my favorite midcentury novelty tap dance routine of all time. And while we're on the subject of tap dance routines that incorporate drums in impressively creative ways, here's Eleanor Powell performing my favorite drum-incorporating tap dance routine of all time, with bonus Buddy Rich.

By: sixswitch

sixswitch — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:12:57 -0800

Yeah, but straight afterwards Ginger Rogers did it backwards and in high heels And then Fred dubbed her taps for her in post because she wasn't precise enough.

By: StickyCarpet

StickyCarpet — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:17:34 -0800

Not enough explosions. Or cowbell.

By: Guy_Inamonkeysuit

Guy_Inamonkeysuit — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:29:44 -0800

Papa Jo Jones doesn't need sticks...

By: Guy_Inamonkeysuit

Guy_Inamonkeysuit — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:30:26 -0800

Not that he doesn't use them...

By: marco_nj

marco_nj — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:33:46 -0800

Fred Astaire was always a percussionist in his dancing, even without the gimmick of actual drums. For a more understated example, there is his ashtray sand dance in Top Hat, which is sort of his answer to subtle brushwork on the snare.

By: moonmilk

moonmilk — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:49:52 -0800

Those chinese drums look more like big cheeses to me. Could it be...? And speaking of theremin solos, here's Pamelia Kurstin playing backwards and in high heels. (No, really, she has a left-handed theremin! I'm not sure about the footwear, though.)

By: moonmilk

moonmilk — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:52:34 -0800

(Confirmed the heels at 8:05, though they're not very high)

By: 3FLryan

3FLryan — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:54:22 -0800

So what you're saying is not all solos are wanking but all wanking is done solo. I'm saying wanking is in the hand of the beholder.

By: oddman

oddman — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 07:58:46 -0800

"here's the fabulous Nicholas Brothers" Holy hell! That was excellent.

By: kmz

kmz — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 08:13:13 -0800

drum solos and bass solos got a very bad reputation in the 60s and 70s when it seemed that half the rock bands out there insisted that we be subjected to what was, indeed, wankery - and i'll add the 10 minute wanking on a guitar with the rest of the band sitting out excursions to that Place: Some music fest in Austin in the early 2000s. Time: The penultimate act, The Blues Travelers. The closing band was going to be Black Crowes, who we liked alright and were interesting in seeing. Didn't have anything against Blues Traveler per se, either. 30 minutes later: After the 3rd or 4th interminable harmonica solo, we decided that we didn't need to see the Black Crowes that bad and went home.

By: not_on_display

not_on_display — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 08:48:21 -0800

The next time some drummer gets all snappish because I looked at their kit for too long or got too close, or I breathed near it, I am sending them this link. With a note saying, "When you are sleeping, I will sneak into your practice space."

By: BozoBurgerBonanza

BozoBurgerBonanza — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 09:17:26 -0800

are we absolutely sure the sound comes from post? The tap sounds from his shoes are more than likely post also, so I would figure the drum sounds are also post

By: nathancaswell

nathancaswell — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 09:22:16 -0800

I'm saying wanking is in the hand of the beholder. I suppose that's better than wanking in the eye of the beholder.

By: LogicalDash

LogicalDash — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 10:03:26 -0800

I honestly don't know what anyone means to communicate when they describe a product of any sort as "masturbatory". Perhaps if the solo was done alone in a sound-insulated practice space; or perhaps if it was deliberately grating, to feed the performer's inner troll; or perhaps if only the performer could hear it; but if someone else, even one person, is enjoying it? That's regular artistic intercourse of a kind that you apparently don't like, for whatever reason.

By: Kronos_to_Earth

Kronos_to_Earth — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 10:28:13 -0800

I've always liked them, even if it's just a hi hat: Mr. Hi Hat. Gee. It's kinda fun to play a bunch of these solos at once in separate tabs!

By: Relay

Relay — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 10:41:27 -0800

Hi, bass player here. Not only did I start playing in the 70s, but I started out in jazz and my closest friend, Greg, was a king-hell drummer, who was also in jazz band with me. We lived fairly close to each other, so in the first four years I spent playing I probably spent 80% of those hours jamming with just this one guy, just drum and bass. There's a thousand stories I could relate about solos that he did that lasted for hours, or our discussions about what makes good music or bad solos, or how I would come back at mid-morning Saturday after playing until midnight Friday and have him say (already seated and playing at his kit), "Hey! Do that, da-da-dat, da-da-dat, da-da-DAH thing from last night. Now! Hurry up and plug in!" But the one story from this wholly unexpected MeFi thread that just hit me like a ton of bricks was the one that just happened ten minutes ago ... I came by Greg's house one day, and I'm telling him about this interview I just read with Buddy Rich. They started talking about what kind pieces Rich liked to have in his kit, and when they were talking about bass drums he said something like 'But my favorites were the Slingerland such-and-such.' And the interviewer said, 'That was the same kind of kick drum you played in your famous double bass solo in 1949 at the New York Paramount.' And they got off into the is tangent about this legendary solo that Buddy Rich played only once using just a double kick drum set up. Everybody knew about it, but there were no known recordings, no known photographs. I told this to Greg, and we spent the next span of time talking about how could that even be possible, how could you make anything using just two kick drums. It was different back then. You'd cling to little scraps of information, pictures seen in advertisements; "What is that next to the keyboards," "Whoa dude, check out the drum kit in this shot!" I hadn't thought about that, literally, since 1976 when I read upthread that someone mentioned Buddy Rich. So I typed in "buddy rich twin bass solo" into Google, and I swear to God, there it was! After more than thirty years, that I could find this just floors me.

By: ovvl

ovvl — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 11:10:11 -0800

Yeah, but straight afterwards Ginger Rogers did it backwards and in high heels Or in this case, Ginger Baker. Baker would, while smoking a cigarette down to the end without dropping an ash.

By: stebulus

stebulus — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 11:18:41 -0800

LogicalDash: I honestly don't know what anyone means to communicate when they describe a product of any sort as "masturbatory". [...] but if someone else, even one person, is enjoying it? That's regular artistic intercourse of a kind that you apparently don't like, for whatever reason. Well, one person can enjoy watching another masturbate. The claim of "masturbatory" is that the musician's main goal is to pleasure themselves — in the case of solos, by making a display of prowess, observing it, and being all, "I am so awesome". If the audience is involved, it is only (as far as the musician is concerned, and according to this theory of the musician's motives) to feel awe and thereby feed the musician's ego. Of course, there are the usual problems with attributing motive, but I think that's what people mean.

By: clvrmnky

clvrmnky — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 11:23:36 -0800

If it has the little cymbal that goes "pssh" I like it.

By: Splunge

Splunge — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 12:05:58 -0800

I'll watch Terry Bozzio masturbate any day of the week.

By: Quasimike

Quasimike — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 12:30:20 -0800

How about a little gyroscopic drumming?

By: private_idaho

private_idaho — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 13:08:56 -0800

I find this an example of the breadth of "talent" that was required of actors in the early days. Like James Cagney singing and dancing instead of behind a machine gun. Would Fred Astaire be allowed even a bit part today? Now we have Bruce Willis, and Vin Diesel. Today, the biggest "stars" in movies are the special effects guys. Aside from the dancing, the most appealing part of the drum solo here is "timbre" not pyrotechnics. I say that as a former drummer with no talent. YouTube Max Roach or any of the old jazz drummers. It wasn't the fussilade, but the tension they created. I've seen guys play the stand of a high hat and a cowbell and leave me in awe.

By: lizarrd

lizarrd — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 14:53:20 -0800

Since we're talking about drum solos etc., I can't help but link this video from the recording session for Flora Purim's Speed of Light with Billy Cobham (drums) and Freddie Santiago (cajon). Disclaimer: Freddie is my uncle.

By: lizarrd

lizarrd — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 14:54:48 -0800

Huh, totally forgot to link it. Here it is.

By: Joseph Gurl

Joseph Gurl — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 15:05:29 -0800

Nope

By: Mike D

Mike D — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 17:29:07 -0800

Well this has been a day! This, and earlier I watched "An American In Paris" with its signature ballet at the end. A single malt before bed and I may just curl into the fetal position, so comfortable will I be. Thanks a bunch for posting this.

By: snsranch

snsranch — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 17:34:12 -0800

Yep, thank you flapjax, great post!

By: garlic

garlic — Sun, 18 Dec 2011 17:53:35 -0800

more awesome theremin in a ted talk

By: gen

gen — Mon, 19 Dec 2011 01:34:00 -0800

Jeff Porcaro explaining his drumming on Rosanna.

By: LeLiLo

LeLiLo — Mon, 19 Dec 2011 04:09:32 -0800

Hah. I was just watching that Fred/drum sequence three or four days ago; it showed up on the YouTube sidebar when I was looking for Sammy Davis, Jr. videos. (Speaking of remarkable tap dancing, here's Sammy in 1947 with his father and the man he called his uncle.) I'd been thinking about the time (April 1967) I saw Sammy at the University of Pennsylvania, and he was just mind-bogglingly good — not only dancing, singing, impressions, telling jokes, but also twirling guns, doing rope tricks, and yes, even taking a more than capable drum solo. When I interviewed Chick Corea (also many years ago) and asked about his influences, he simply said "Fred Astaire." Some people have technical skill, others have passion, he told me, and a few rare souls — like Fred (and Sammy, of course) have both.

By: LeLiLo

LeLiLo — Mon, 19 Dec 2011 04:24:00 -0800

I have been meaning to share Buddy Rich's West Side Story Medley on Parkinson You just can't talk about drumming without mentioning Buddy. To repeat myself (talking about a different Buddy Rich video in a different drum post started by the same flapjax four years ago), you also have to remember that on that show, he was about 65 years old! Astounding. When I saw him play that medley live, about 10 years earlier, he was even better. As toma said about Buddy in that earlier post, in one of my favorite all-time MeFi comments: "1.) Amazing... Everything thing he played was bad-ass. 2.) A freak, with those hands. Maybe the greatest hands in history... 3.) Never lost it. Maybe the most shocking — close to immortal. He was still a scary motherfucker the moment he died."

By: LeLiLo

LeLiLo — Mon, 19 Dec 2011 04:31:41 -0800

Correction: That earlier post was started by St Urbain's Horseman. I also was just revisiting this great flapjax post (from four years ago as well), "Give the Drummer Some."

By: chairface

chairface — Mon, 19 Dec 2011 08:13:38 -0800

I'm a big supporter of wankery and masturbation in all their forms and I won't stand for anyone sullying them by association with dance and drumming.

By: Decani

Decani — Thu, 22 Dec 2011 11:03:32 -0800

Some of his stuff is wankery . Some of his stuff is beautiful . Sure is cool to hate, though. posted by 3FLryan at 2:43 PM on December 18 There's nothing cool about hating Joe Satriani. The word is right, not cool.