On lunge feeding
May 24, 2012 10:21 PM Subscribe
Whales have a sensory organ unlike anything we’ve ever seen, reported originally in today's issue of Nature.
Man, with all the 'research' they do, you'd think the Japanese would have figured this out long ago.
posted by Malor at 10:31 PM on May 24, 2012 [42 favorites]
posted by Malor at 10:31 PM on May 24, 2012 [42 favorites]
So, if I'm reading this right, the organ seems to allow for razor-sharp proprioception when looming out of the deep at speed to gobble up krill in volumes of water the size of a swimming pool.
I was going to make a crack about the Japanese marine research industry, but damn if Malor didn't beat me to it. Plainly they need to start researching larger whale species if they're going to get published in Nature.
posted by figurant at 10:34 PM on May 24, 2012 [3 favorites]
I was going to make a crack about the Japanese marine research industry, but damn if Malor didn't beat me to it. Plainly they need to start researching larger whale species if they're going to get published in Nature.
posted by figurant at 10:34 PM on May 24, 2012 [3 favorites]
Man, with all the 'research' they do, you'd think the Japanese would have figured this out long ago.
They probably did, decided it was not a particularly tasty cut, and left it at that. Just because the subject is the same doesn't mean the study is.
posted by TwelveTwo at 10:36 PM on May 24, 2012 [1 favorite]
They probably did, decided it was not a particularly tasty cut, and left it at that. Just because the subject is the same doesn't mean the study is.
posted by TwelveTwo at 10:36 PM on May 24, 2012 [1 favorite]
I also have an organ unlike anything you've ever seen; MeMail me!
posted by hincandenza at 10:41 PM on May 24, 2012 [28 favorites]
posted by hincandenza at 10:41 PM on May 24, 2012 [28 favorites]
Fishpendix. I just named it. Must credit Camofrog.
posted by Camofrog at 10:46 PM on May 24, 2012 [10 favorites]
posted by Camofrog at 10:46 PM on May 24, 2012 [10 favorites]
Sometime I just open my jaw and lunge at the food around me to consume it, too; maybe I have one of these.
posted by XMLicious at 10:52 PM on May 24, 2012 [7 favorites]
posted by XMLicious at 10:52 PM on May 24, 2012 [7 favorites]
I also have an organ unlike anything you've ever seen; MeMail me!
I know you're proud, but clearly you've never seen a male whale.
posted by twoleftfeet at 10:53 PM on May 24, 2012 [4 favorites]
I know you're proud, but clearly you've never seen a male whale.
posted by twoleftfeet at 10:53 PM on May 24, 2012 [4 favorites]
Ask my dog about lunge-feeding.
posted by trip and a half at 10:55 PM on May 24, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by trip and a half at 10:55 PM on May 24, 2012 [2 favorites]
To acquire that food, they rely on their uncommonly large mouths and a technique known as lunge-feeding. When lunge-feeding, a hungry whale will accelerate to great speeds and open its mouth wide, allowing its pleated throat to expand like a parachute while taking in a giant gulp of water.Didn't we just discover this a few years ago?
They probably did, decided it was not a particularly tasty cut, and left it at that. Just because the subject is the same doesn't mean the study is.How do you think this research was done? Magic? X-Rays of wales in the ocean? They obviously did the exact same thing the Japanese do: captured, killed and dissected some wales. Probably not nearly as many, but they did look Minke and Fin whales, which are among the ones hunted by the Japanese (They kill about 645 Minke a year, and about 1 Fin whale every two years)
In fact, did they get these whales from the Japanese? Looking at this the only other country that does scientific whaling is Iceland, so they must have gotten these whales either from Japanese or Icelandic whalers, as far as I can tell.
posted by delmoi at 11:01 PM on May 24, 2012 [3 favorites]
twoleftfeet: I know you're proud, but clearly you've never seen a male whalePffft, whatevs.
I mean, I guess in his defense, that water is probably very cold.
posted by hincandenza at 11:11 PM on May 24, 2012 [18 favorites]
Or they could have done the research on beached whales, I guess, but that seems like it would be a lot more difficult. Norway does still hunt Minke whales commercially, they never signed the whaling treaty so they don't need to claim that they are doing it for scientific purposes. But they don't hunt Fin whales.
So yeah, it seems most likely that they must have gotten these whales from either Iceland or Japan - which both do the exact same thing, as far as anti-whaling advocates are concerned.
Does anyone know where exactly they got these whales?
posted by delmoi at 11:16 PM on May 24, 2012 [1 favorite]
So yeah, it seems most likely that they must have gotten these whales from either Iceland or Japan - which both do the exact same thing, as far as anti-whaling advocates are concerned.
Does anyone know where exactly they got these whales?
posted by delmoi at 11:16 PM on May 24, 2012 [1 favorite]
I'm not sure where they got the whales, but the bigger question to me is, how did they get them wedged in the scanners?
posted by latkes at 11:28 PM on May 24, 2012 [4 favorites]
posted by latkes at 11:28 PM on May 24, 2012 [4 favorites]
Does anyone know where exactly they got these whales?
Iceland.
Iceland.
Our research team collected rorqual tissue from commercial catch operations in Iceland in 2009 and 2010. (These tissues would have otherwise been discarded as part of the standard processing of whale carcasses). We dissected and recorded observation on these tissues in Iceland, and then returned additional samples, under CITES permits, to our research laboratories in Canada, where we used digital imaging techniques (such as X-ray computed tomography and magnetic resonance imaging) and histology to better understand the anatomy of these unusual features. CT and MRI scans showed us the configuration of blood vessels and nerves that entered this new organ from the jaws; they also confirmed that this organ has asymmetric blood vessels and nerves.posted by unliteral at 11:37 PM on May 24, 2012 [3 favorites]
"Whales are like mammals from space," he explains. "they just have all these strange adaptations to living life in the water."
Uh, OK. Outer space is apparently filled with water now.
posted by UbuRoivas at 11:46 PM on May 24, 2012 [3 favorites]
Uh, OK. Outer space is apparently filled with water now.
posted by UbuRoivas at 11:46 PM on May 24, 2012 [3 favorites]
Agents Scully and Mulder are involved with this. Probably Spock too.
posted by Camofrog at 11:51 PM on May 24, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by Camofrog at 11:51 PM on May 24, 2012 [1 favorite]
It's metaphorical space.
posted by iamkimiam at 11:52 PM on May 24, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by iamkimiam at 11:52 PM on May 24, 2012 [2 favorites]
If you find the anatomy of awesome, huge, beautiful animals to be deeply fascinating, you should check out the blog of Professor John Hutchinson. He dismantles megafauna.
(I want to make this very, very clear: DO NOT CLICK this link if you are in the slightest bit squeamish, or are planning to eat in the next month or so.)
What's in John's Freezer?
posted by Combat Wombat at 11:54 PM on May 24, 2012 [14 favorites]
(I want to make this very, very clear: DO NOT CLICK this link if you are in the slightest bit squeamish, or are planning to eat in the next month or so.)
What's in John's Freezer?
posted by Combat Wombat at 11:54 PM on May 24, 2012 [14 favorites]
"Entirely new sensory organ" sounds otherwise like the hyping of a species or family-specific nerve plexus. Can it makes cute thermal image scans or determine when doughnuts are too old to eat? I thought not. Maybe I'm just neurocetaceae jaded.
posted by peacay at 12:01 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by peacay at 12:01 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
(first image on that site Com Wom told you not to click on)
I thought they smelled bad....on the outside!
posted by furiousxgeorge at 12:02 AM on May 25, 2012
I thought they smelled bad....on the outside!
posted by furiousxgeorge at 12:02 AM on May 25, 2012
make me some transparent aluminum.
You could always try making it yourself.
posted by not_that_epiphanius at 12:18 AM on May 25, 2012
You could always try making it yourself.
posted by not_that_epiphanius at 12:18 AM on May 25, 2012
(I want to make this very, very clear: DO NOT CLICK this link if you are in the slightest bit squeamish, or are planning to eat in the next month or so.)
I thought they smelled bad....on the outside!
I once helped to bury a beached and dead humpback, so that its skeleton could be exhumed a year or two later. It was pretty ripe (indeed partially liquefied) by the time we got to it, and we had to do a fair bit of heaving and kicking and stomping to get it down into the hole.
Never got the smell out of that pair of boots.
posted by Ahab at 12:22 AM on May 25, 2012 [10 favorites]
I thought they smelled bad....on the outside!
I once helped to bury a beached and dead humpback, so that its skeleton could be exhumed a year or two later. It was pretty ripe (indeed partially liquefied) by the time we got to it, and we had to do a fair bit of heaving and kicking and stomping to get it down into the hole.
Never got the smell out of that pair of boots.
posted by Ahab at 12:22 AM on May 25, 2012 [10 favorites]
It's metaphorical space.
No, it's metaphorical rubbish.
posted by UbuRoivas at 12:39 AM on May 25, 2012 [1 favorite]
No, it's metaphorical rubbish.
posted by UbuRoivas at 12:39 AM on May 25, 2012 [1 favorite]
Ah. Yeah, like I said Anti-whaling advocates don't see any distinction between what Japan does and what Iceland does, and there is no way that Iceland would have re-started whaling if they weren't following Japan's lead. So there is basically no way that this would have been discovered without the kind of "scientific whaling" that those two countries do. (Although it's obviously not primarily done for scientific purposes.)
Iceland.Our research team collected rorqual tissue from commercial catch operations in Iceland in 2009 and 2010. (These tissues would have otherwise been discarded as part of the standard processing of whale; carcasses).
posted by delmoi at 12:43 AM on May 25, 2012 [1 favorite]
@Ahab: this is the very definition of eponysterical.
posted by bone machine at 1:00 AM on May 25, 2012 [5 favorites]
posted by bone machine at 1:00 AM on May 25, 2012 [5 favorites]
No, it's metaphorical rubbish.
That "mammals from space" stuff really got to me. I get that "from space" is supposed to mean "this shit is crazy!" but come on. What's the point in using that metaphor when the reality, that they're mammals from the goddamned ocean, is already good enough. Yes, they have unique adaptations to feeding in the ocean, it's not like that's so crazy that you have to go for the "from space" superlative. We can't be that stupid as a culture! It makes me fear for the future of, like, accurately describing things.
posted by palidor at 1:08 AM on May 25, 2012 [4 favorites]
That "mammals from space" stuff really got to me. I get that "from space" is supposed to mean "this shit is crazy!" but come on. What's the point in using that metaphor when the reality, that they're mammals from the goddamned ocean, is already good enough. Yes, they have unique adaptations to feeding in the ocean, it's not like that's so crazy that you have to go for the "from space" superlative. We can't be that stupid as a culture! It makes me fear for the future of, like, accurately describing things.
posted by palidor at 1:08 AM on May 25, 2012 [4 favorites]
I looked at the first photo and thought of the sandworms of Arrakis.
posted by Thistledown at 2:52 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by Thistledown at 2:52 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
What's the point in using that metaphor when the reality, that they're mammals from the goddamned ocean, is already good enough.
Perhaps Dr. Pyenson had just watched that "Dr. Who" episode with the Star Whale and was going off on a flight of fancy about cetacean space travellers.
posted by Alonzo T. Calm at 3:00 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
Perhaps Dr. Pyenson had just watched that "Dr. Who" episode with the Star Whale and was going off on a flight of fancy about cetacean space travellers.
posted by Alonzo T. Calm at 3:00 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
Now they just need to make a knockout whale that lacks this organ and carefully document it's feeding behaviour to confirm. Easy.
posted by kisch mokusch at 3:10 AM on May 25, 2012 [6 favorites]
posted by kisch mokusch at 3:10 AM on May 25, 2012 [6 favorites]
Ask my dog about lunge-feeding
Now, there's a bumper sticker I haven't seen. I'm much more likely to ask about that than about somebody's grandchildren.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 4:03 AM on May 25, 2012 [8 favorites]
Now, there's a bumper sticker I haven't seen. I'm much more likely to ask about that than about somebody's grandchildren.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 4:03 AM on May 25, 2012 [8 favorites]
Outer space is apparently filled with water now.
My god, have you never seen The Voyage Home?
posted by The 10th Regiment of Foot at 4:30 AM on May 25, 2012
My god, have you never seen The Voyage Home?
posted by The 10th Regiment of Foot at 4:30 AM on May 25, 2012
I was hoping for some sort of psychic powers or quantum hearing or something. "This nerve cluster helps them open and close their mouths" is a bit of a letdown.
Still very interesting, but on a non-Star Trek level.
posted by Riki tiki at 4:38 AM on May 25, 2012 [3 favorites]
Still very interesting, but on a non-Star Trek level.
posted by Riki tiki at 4:38 AM on May 25, 2012 [3 favorites]
Outer space is apparently filled with water now.
Perhaps not - - however Europa has more water than Earth.
posted by fairmettle at 4:58 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
Perhaps not - - however Europa has more water than Earth.
posted by fairmettle at 4:58 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
You could always try making [transparent aluminum] yourself.Ugh, come on. You can't just call any transparent compound with aluminum in it 'transparent aluminum'. That's like calling glass "transparent silicon" or salt "transparent sodium". the thing is, sapphire is an aluminum compound as well, and when it's completely pure it's completely clear, I think. And we obviously knew that before the movie came out.
In fact, we were using a transparent aluminum compound Alum long before we ever even knew what aluminum ever even was. In fact Aluminum is called Aluminum because it's the principle element found in Alum!
posted by delmoi at 5:02 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
I was hoping for some sort of psychic powers or quantum hearing or something. "This nerve cluster helps them open and close their mouths" is a bit of a letdown.
Yeah, but when the mysterious aliens come on by, how else are the whales going to say howdy? Cell phones?
(I think I know what I'm doing tonight, and it totally involves the Star Trek Save the Whales movie!! Thanks Nature!)
posted by jetlagaddict at 5:02 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
Yeah, but when the mysterious aliens come on by, how else are the whales going to say howdy? Cell phones?
(I think I know what I'm doing tonight, and it totally involves the Star Trek Save the Whales movie!! Thanks Nature!)
posted by jetlagaddict at 5:02 AM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
What's In John's Freezer is my new favorite thing on the internet! What's currently in my lab's freezers? Two gorillas, an orangutan, and some frozen monkey shit.
As far as space whales, I think he meant "This is really alien!" It's, you know, a turn of phrase. Not literal. A way to communicate just how bizarre what we're seeing is.
posted by ChuraChura at 5:39 AM on May 25, 2012
As far as space whales, I think he meant "This is really alien!" It's, you know, a turn of phrase. Not literal. A way to communicate just how bizarre what we're seeing is.
posted by ChuraChura at 5:39 AM on May 25, 2012
Here in Tacoma we could use some of that transparent aluminium (that's al-yoo-mini-um) for our vehicles.
posted by roboton666 at 7:59 AM on May 25, 2012
posted by roboton666 at 7:59 AM on May 25, 2012
I had no Idea there was a Tacoma in Great Britain.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 8:05 AM on May 25, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by Kirth Gerson at 8:05 AM on May 25, 2012 [1 favorite]
That is a really cool blog, but I can't help but remember this chip on my shoulder.
In my old lab there was this veterinarian professor we often worked with who would occasionally just walk in and take stuff he needed for whatever, from pippette tip boxes to hapless undergrads. This was kind of annoying but he ended up putting together a lab that was starting to be able to reciprocate when he finally did something just fundamentally unforgivable.
We had a cold room (A giant meat locker built into the building) in the basement where we kept a library of invaluable stocks of mutants that stretched back to the 50s. It is a collection from our lab and a few closed ones, with thousands of mutants that would each take months to years to recreate, and for many of them the knowledge of how is just lost. People come from around the world to get mutants from us, and it is all in that cold room. The collection takes up a pretty enormous shelf but is pretty contained to only one side, and so the rest of the area is dedicated to being a shared space with other labs.
So this guy somehow ended up with a dead rotting llama, and he needed a place to put his dead rotting llama. He didn't want to freeze his dead rotting llama, he also didn't want to dismember it so that it would fit in his own fridges, even though apparently he didn't even need the whole thing. No. He dumped his dead rotting llama in our cold room and promptly forgot about it, for me to discover months later.
Llamas have a distinct smell, it isn't pleasant, but dead rotting llamas have an indescribably overpowering odor that is related but awful and sticky. Sadly the undergrad I found it with and I were in a hurry, we needed a particular strain that moment in order to avoid losing weeks of work. So we went in. She had been an EMT for years before joining the lab and so had smelled some horrific shit, but even that did not compare to the slowly fermented dead rotting llama we needed to navigate. It took us 20 minutes to find the damn strain we needed but we got it, and we were proud, but I will never forget what happened when we got back upstairs.
When the elevator door opened there was a crowd of professors and students chatting, hard microbiologists used to Pseudo and C. diff, and they all fell back like a wave had hit them. You see, the llama was leaking, and got all over our shoes, but the stench had also soaked into our hair and clothes. We ended up getting some spare clothes, some serious detergent and permission to use the lab shower, but we still smelled ugly for days. I'm told that elevator still reeks of llama.
posted by Blasdelb at 8:14 AM on May 25, 2012 [33 favorites]
In my old lab there was this veterinarian professor we often worked with who would occasionally just walk in and take stuff he needed for whatever, from pippette tip boxes to hapless undergrads. This was kind of annoying but he ended up putting together a lab that was starting to be able to reciprocate when he finally did something just fundamentally unforgivable.
We had a cold room (A giant meat locker built into the building) in the basement where we kept a library of invaluable stocks of mutants that stretched back to the 50s. It is a collection from our lab and a few closed ones, with thousands of mutants that would each take months to years to recreate, and for many of them the knowledge of how is just lost. People come from around the world to get mutants from us, and it is all in that cold room. The collection takes up a pretty enormous shelf but is pretty contained to only one side, and so the rest of the area is dedicated to being a shared space with other labs.
So this guy somehow ended up with a dead rotting llama, and he needed a place to put his dead rotting llama. He didn't want to freeze his dead rotting llama, he also didn't want to dismember it so that it would fit in his own fridges, even though apparently he didn't even need the whole thing. No. He dumped his dead rotting llama in our cold room and promptly forgot about it, for me to discover months later.
Llamas have a distinct smell, it isn't pleasant, but dead rotting llamas have an indescribably overpowering odor that is related but awful and sticky. Sadly the undergrad I found it with and I were in a hurry, we needed a particular strain that moment in order to avoid losing weeks of work. So we went in. She had been an EMT for years before joining the lab and so had smelled some horrific shit, but even that did not compare to the slowly fermented dead rotting llama we needed to navigate. It took us 20 minutes to find the damn strain we needed but we got it, and we were proud, but I will never forget what happened when we got back upstairs.
When the elevator door opened there was a crowd of professors and students chatting, hard microbiologists used to Pseudo and C. diff, and they all fell back like a wave had hit them. You see, the llama was leaking, and got all over our shoes, but the stench had also soaked into our hair and clothes. We ended up getting some spare clothes, some serious detergent and permission to use the lab shower, but we still smelled ugly for days. I'm told that elevator still reeks of llama.
posted by Blasdelb at 8:14 AM on May 25, 2012 [33 favorites]
We ended up getting some spare clothes, some serious detergent and permission to use the lab shower, but we still smelled ugly for days. I'm told that elevator still reeks of llama.The hilarity of that story is definitely amplified by the fact you seem to have posted it in the wrong thread.
posted by delmoi at 9:17 AM on May 25, 2012 [4 favorites]
What do you call what delmoi just did?
posted by Ayn Rand and God at 9:49 AM on May 25, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by Ayn Rand and God at 9:49 AM on May 25, 2012 [3 favorites]
I'M SO CONFUSED
posted by Blasdelb at 10:14 AM on May 25, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by Blasdelb at 10:14 AM on May 25, 2012 [1 favorite]
Maybe he's using "wrong thread: as a metaphor?
posted by benito.strauss at 10:47 AM on May 25, 2012
posted by benito.strauss at 10:47 AM on May 25, 2012
I definitely want to know what thread you think the rotting llama anecdote belongs in instead, delmoi. I hope it's not the the oreo one.
posted by elizardbits at 10:49 AM on May 25, 2012 [5 favorites]
posted by elizardbits at 10:49 AM on May 25, 2012 [5 favorites]
Maybe it's the Pope's butler one.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 11:50 AM on May 25, 2012
posted by Kirth Gerson at 11:50 AM on May 25, 2012
The anecdote follows ahab's beached whale story and the ooey-gooey guts links. Also it's excellent, and flagged as fantastic. Sidebar needs more dead llamas.
posted by Hoopo at 3:24 PM on May 25, 2012 [5 favorites]
posted by Hoopo at 3:24 PM on May 25, 2012 [5 favorites]
My fault. I derailed an excellent post. With hippopotamus guts. Apologies to all, especially the hippo.
posted by Combat Wombat at 5:51 PM on May 25, 2012 [3 favorites]
posted by Combat Wombat at 5:51 PM on May 25, 2012 [3 favorites]
Is this the dead llama thread? I got this llama, someone needs to sign for it.
posted by TwelveTwo at 8:19 PM on May 25, 2012 [5 favorites]
posted by TwelveTwo at 8:19 PM on May 25, 2012 [5 favorites]
Ask my dog about dead llama stench.
posted by trip and a half at 11:09 PM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
posted by trip and a half at 11:09 PM on May 25, 2012 [2 favorites]
Are they sure this isn't just an anatomical equivalent of the tongue's sensory complex?
posted by gjc at 7:44 AM on May 26, 2012
posted by gjc at 7:44 AM on May 26, 2012
gjc, seriously, honestly: after that last run of snarks, I was trying in vain to figure out how your comment had any relevance to the comedy of errors in progress...
... and then I realized it was actually the only one on-topic for this FPP.
Isn't there a rule against that? I know members have been banished for less...
posted by IAmBroom at 11:58 PM on May 26, 2012
... and then I realized it was actually the only one on-topic for this FPP.
Isn't there a rule against that? I know members have been banished for less...
posted by IAmBroom at 11:58 PM on May 26, 2012
I'm always amazed when it turns out we only just found out something like this. I keep thinking we must know everything there is to know about large mammals and then... not.
Also, "extreme feeding" seems like a very useful phrase. I will no doubt have reason to employ it frequently in the future. Mainly when there is cake around.
posted by lollusc at 11:59 PM on May 26, 2012 [1 favorite]
Also, "extreme feeding" seems like a very useful phrase. I will no doubt have reason to employ it frequently in the future. Mainly when there is cake around.
posted by lollusc at 11:59 PM on May 26, 2012 [1 favorite]
Now, really seriously: the structure is located in a gap between the jaw bones, so I doubt it evolved as part of the tongue.
posted by IAmBroom at 11:59 PM on May 26, 2012
posted by IAmBroom at 11:59 PM on May 26, 2012
My apologies for the derail as well, but awesome story Blasedelb!
I just sent this to someone via memail, and then remembered it might actually be relevant (and hell cute) here too. It's a baby humpack that came up to a friend's boat to bump its nose (jaw? face?) against the bow, so he assumed it wanted to scratch its nose and helped out by giving it a bit of a nose rub.
Apparently it really was a baby - under 8m long. Thinking about it just now, it may well have been trying out it's amazing new sensory organ.
Can I lunge feed this boat, ma? Can I, huh? Huh?
posted by Ahab at 8:00 AM on May 29, 2012
I just sent this to someone via memail, and then remembered it might actually be relevant (and hell cute) here too. It's a baby humpack that came up to a friend's boat to bump its nose (jaw? face?) against the bow, so he assumed it wanted to scratch its nose and helped out by giving it a bit of a nose rub.
Apparently it really was a baby - under 8m long. Thinking about it just now, it may well have been trying out it's amazing new sensory organ.
Can I lunge feed this boat, ma? Can I, huh? Huh?
posted by Ahab at 8:00 AM on May 29, 2012
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Great job scientists, now make me some transparent aluminum.
posted by furiousxgeorge at 10:26 PM on May 24, 2012 [16 favorites]