Cage does Cage

May 30, 2012 12:52 PM

Nicolas Cage performs John Cage's 4'33"
posted by elgilito (61 comments total)

Cage Match?
posted by Celsius1414 at 12:53 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

Warning: Turn down your speakers. The guy who uploaded this video did it at like 500% volume...
posted by schmod at 12:57 PM on May 30, 2012 [8 favorites]

Previously (in comments).
posted by Lutoslawski at 12:57 PM on May 30, 2012

Cajun. And to the right, Cage deux.
posted by hal9k at 12:58 PM on May 30, 2012 [3 favorites]

 
posted by Edogy at 12:58 PM on May 30, 2012 [13 favorites]

Adaptation was a great movie.
posted by mrgrimm at 12:58 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

Fuck that guy. (John, not Nick.) Remember, this is the guy who sued someone else for recording and playing back silence... he claims, and the courts seem to agree, that silence as a performance piece is owned by John Cage, forever.

So fuck him. Fuck him and the horse he rode in on. Pirate silence like crazy, man.
posted by Malor at 12:59 PM on May 30, 2012 [7 favorites]

THE PIECE IS NOT SILENT, THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT
posted by shakespeherian at 1:02 PM on May 30, 2012 [29 favorites]

Needs more bees.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:05 PM on May 30, 2012 [3 favorites]

This. Is. Amazing.
posted by brand-gnu at 1:05 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

I had no clue that Nicolas Cage starred in a biopic about a late Victorian sculling champion.
posted by Iridic at 1:06 PM on May 30, 2012

Wait, he didn't lift the piano lid! This doesn't count!
posted by shotintoeternity at 1:09 PM on May 30, 2012 [3 favorites]

Something about his hair.
posted by TheRedArmy at 1:11 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

he claims, and the courts seem to agree, that silence as a performance piece is owned by John Cage, forever.

So if I put 2 seconds of silence at the beginning and ending of my recordings I have to pay him a sampling royalty?
posted by ZenMasterThis at 1:12 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

Everybody's favorite confused horse.
posted by polywomp at 1:15 PM on May 30, 2012 [3 favorites]

I heard a rumor this was produced by Francis Ford Coppola.
posted by ZenMasterThis at 1:16 PM on May 30, 2012

Fuck that guy. (John, not Nick.) Remember, this is the guy who sued someone else for recording and playing back silence... he claims, and the courts seem to agree, that silence as a performance piece is owned by John Cage, forever.

Well, except that it appears that the lawsuit you're talking about took place after John Cage died, and was settled out of court. Unless there's another lawsuit, which I would love to hear about.
posted by jrb223 at 1:17 PM on May 30, 2012 [11 favorites]

Malor, the man who was sued credited the work in question to both Cage and himself, and then insulted the composer to boot ("my version is so much better because I was able to say everything I wanted in less time"). So there's something else going on with that lawsuit besides Mike Batt just using "silence as a performance piece."

Also, Cage didn't sue the guy; he'd been dead for a while when that happened. But don't let that stop the knee-jerking!
posted by the_bone at 1:19 PM on May 30, 2012 [12 favorites]

Malor: “Fuck that guy. (John, not Nick.) Remember, this is the guy who sued someone else for recording and playing back silence... he claims, and the courts seem to agree, that silence as a performance piece is owned by John Cage, forever. So fuck him. Fuck him and the horse he rode in on. Pirate silence like crazy, man.”

He died in 1992. That happened in 2002. Not that I'm a huge John Cage fan or anything, but I'm not sure he's the one you should blame. Also, the issue wasn't the silence itself; it was a collaborative attribution in which John Cage was named as partial author of a track. That was obviously a joke, and I think the music publisher was full of crap for bringing the lawsuit, but it's worth noting that the album in question still has that song on it; it's that now it's attributed to "Clint Cage." They settled out of court, and it was for six figures, but no royalties or anything like that were exchanged. CNN news article here.
posted by koeselitz at 1:19 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

the lawsuit you're talking about took place after John Cage died

The rest is silence.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:19 PM on May 30, 2012 [4 favorites]

You don't hear the screaming? That's because it was recorded in SPACE.

_h/t
posted by tilde at 1:19 PM on May 30, 2012

(I should really preview. Meh.)
posted by koeselitz at 1:19 PM on May 30, 2012

Fuck that guy. (John, not Nick.) Remember, this is the guy who sued someone else for recording and playing back silence... he claims, and the courts seem to agree, that silence as a performance piece is owned by John Cage, forever.

John Cage died in 1992.

The lawsuit was filed in 2002. The grounds for the lawsuit were not simply that someone recorded silence, but that they credited it to Cage. The composer Mike Batt settled out of court.

So, to review:

1) Cage was 10 years dead when this lawsuit was filed. Dead people really shouldn't be fucked.

2) The lawsuit wasn't simply about recording silence. It was about playfully "crediting" a dead man. Shockingly enough, estates of dead artists are often humourless and greedy.

3) Cage probably wouldn't have tolerated this nonsense.

Cage was after [Jacques] Monod’s ‘absolute newness’ of pure chance. He was not out to discover any hidden self, nor did he think chance operations would reveal any hidden, already-existing divine reality, as ancient diviners thought. ‘Composition is like writing a letter to a stranger,’ he once said. ‘I don’t hear things in my head, nor do I have inspiration ….’”

If Hyde is right, then pursuing a claim that Cage’s moral rights had been infringed by Batts would be to assert a claim Cage himself did not believe in. If Cage had understood that, would he have refused to assert the claim? I think there’s a good chance of that. Would you sue someone for doing something you thought was a perfectly legitimate thing to do even if someone told you that if you sued them you’d get money? It’s important to understand that a lawyer represents the client, not the client’s abstract legal rights. But when someone’s rights pass to another (whether by contract, by trust instrument, by will, or otherwise), the new owner of the rights may have his own idea of what is important to protect.

So does anyone want to go out for a nice, fresh, hot cup of McDonalds coffee?
posted by maudlin at 1:21 PM on May 30, 2012 [10 favorites]

And honestly, after Raising Arizona and Matchstick Men, this collaborative piece is Nick's greatest performance.
posted by tilde at 1:21 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

Brilliant!
posted by TwoWordReview at 1:21 PM on May 30, 2012

I've never seen anyone say "fuck John Cage". That's just crazy talk.
posted by Burhanistan at 1:32 PM on May 30, 2012 [6 favorites]

His name is Nic, not Nick
posted by shakespeherian at 1:33 PM on May 30, 2012

THE PIECE IS NOT SILENT, THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT

It is if you listen to it in here.
posted by straight at 1:42 PM on May 30, 2012

This is Nicholas Cage's best work. Bravo!
posted by jbickers at 1:49 PM on May 30, 2012

THE PIECE IS NOT SILENT, THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT

Neither is the video (and that's not the whole point, I don't think, though my music teacher spun it that way too.)
posted by mrgrimm at 1:52 PM on May 30, 2012

Did he dress up as Luke Cage?
posted by jonmc at 2:05 PM on May 30, 2012

Neither is the video

Yeah, outrage only directed at lulzy comments in this thread. The linked video is ace.
posted by shakespeherian at 2:07 PM on May 30, 2012

Also, from el Wikipedia:

In 1951, Cage visited the anechoic chamber at Harvard University. An anechoic chamber is a room designed in such a way that the walls, ceiling and floor absorb all sounds made in the room, rather than reflecting them as echoes. Such a chamber is also externally sound-proofed. Cage entered the chamber expecting to hear silence, but he wrote later, 'I heard two sounds, one high and one low. When I described them to the engineer in charge, he informed me that the high one was my nervous system in operation, the low one my blood in circulation.' Cage had gone to a place where he expected total silence, and yet heard sound. 'Until I die there will be sounds. And they will continue following my death. One need not fear about the future of music.' The realisation as he saw it of the impossibility of silence led to the composition of 4′33″.

posted by shakespeherian at 2:10 PM on May 30, 2012 [9 favorites]

I guess there were no scenes in "Valley Girl" featuring introspective silence?
posted by not_on_display at 2:10 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

Also, from el Wikipedia:

His account of being in the chamber is in the opening of the amazing collection Silence.
posted by Lutoslawski at 2:19 PM on May 30, 2012 [2 favorites]

Okay, this is totally awesome.

(But you know, I do wish some of John Cage's other less-gimmicky or less-conceptual stuff got some attention. I mean, I like 4'33", but it's hardly the most interesting thing he wrote, or even the most original or culturally influential or whatever, and it sort of turns him into a cheap snarky joke if it's the only thing of his that you know. Maybe this is how Serious REM Fans feel about "Shiny Happy People"?)
posted by nebulawindphone at 2:24 PM on May 30, 2012 [6 favorites]

It's silent if you, like me, are at work and are to lazy to push the speaker wire through the little hole on your hands and bees er knees (Freudian slip).
posted by jimmythefish at 2:33 PM on May 30, 2012

But you know, I do wish some of John Cage's other less-gimmicky or less-conceptual stuff got some attention

Me too.
posted by Lutoslawski at 2:35 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

And?
posted by Burhanistan at 2:58 PM on May 30, 2012

THE PIECE IS NOT SILENT, THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT

That always seemed less cool to me than silence being the point. Silence is as important as anything else in music despite feeling (not being) inaudible, in the same way air is vitally important in life despite being invisible. It's so easy to forget, and think of rests as the absence of music. I love to be reminded that they're just as present and musical as the notes. And when you think of silence as a thing in itself instead of not a thing at all, it becomes perceptible all the time. I hear it happening alongside sound, not just between instances of it - but only when things like 4'33'' remind me to think that way.
posted by two or three cars parked under the stars at 3:28 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

Maybe this is how Serious REM Fans feel about "Shiny Happy People"?

Sub in "Losing My Religion" or "Man on the Moon" and you have a deal.
posted by mrgrimm at 3:45 PM on May 30, 2012

Unbelievably awesome. Perfect choice for the final scene, too.
posted by Saxon Kane at 3:58 PM on May 30, 2012

 
posted by Wolfdog at 4:31 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

Wolfdog: " "

Be careful, Edogy might sue you.
posted by Splunge at 4:41 PM on May 30, 2012

I was fortunate to see Maestro Cage perform, not 4'33'' but other more and less random compositions, and it was just great fun, he had an amazing humor. He would have love the video, probably used it in another composition.
posted by sammyo at 4:47 PM on May 30, 2012

Coming Next on Metafilter: Kevin Bacon cooks some Bacon! Keep it locked....
posted by marienbad at 4:49 PM on May 30, 2012

"She sounds like she's hitting a baby with a cat."

"You have to listen to the notes she's not playing."

"Pfft. I could do that at home."
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 5:01 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

(Seriously, though, love this.)
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 5:01 PM on May 30, 2012

It's a relief that John Cage never composed anything for actual musicians to play, like fine orchestral work or choral music or anything. And thank God he didn't, you know, produce amazing electronic music and stuff.

Otherwise what would we talk about with the codgers?
posted by Fritz Langwedge at 5:20 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

I was shocked to find a clip of Snake Eyes in that performance. As far as I can remember, Nicolas Cage doesn't shut up for a single second of that movie.
posted by grog at 5:22 PM on May 30, 2012

I've never seen anyone say "fuck John Cage". That's just crazy talk.

Merce Cunningham might have thought it in a moment of heated passion.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 5:58 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

I had no clue that Nicolas Cage starred in a biopic about a late Victorian sculling champion.

Oh, sure you didn't...Walter.
posted by adamdschneider at 6:02 PM on May 30, 2012

Meh. Holding out for Nick Cave covering Nick Cage covering John Cage.

Maybe get Nick Fury in there somewhere too.
posted by Palindromedary at 6:15 PM on May 30, 2012 [2 favorites]

Elk? Yeah? I was watching TV - the game, right? Renaldo Hayes? He got tossed the ball and he was running with it, he was running running running. He jumped over three linebackers in mid-air. He sprouted antlers! Like a gazelle? Like an elk? He landed again - he ran ran ran - He scored a touch-down!
posted by porn in the woods at 6:44 PM on May 30, 2012

I adore Nicholas Cage. He's got that goofy grin that has made my heart melt since Valley Girl. As an actor though, this may be his best film...
posted by dejah420 at 7:00 PM on May 30, 2012

Frequently, I watch TV while surfing the net. When I come across something on the intertubes potentially worth hearing, I pause the ol' DVR, to better hear the video of a bird headbanging to heavy metal or whatever. Thus, I paused Rachel Maddow in order to watch this video. It was a good minute and a half before I realized what a moron I am.

On topic, I loved Raising Arizona.

FART

heh
posted by Drewstre at 7:17 PM on May 30, 2012

I've got a secret, John Cage - Water Walk.
posted by unliteral at 7:33 PM on May 30, 2012 [1 favorite]

Lutoslawski: "Me too. "

that was nice, but the credits at the end of part seven said the audio was Hecker - or was it Hecker doing/redoing a cage piece?
posted by idiopath at 11:05 PM on May 30, 2012

better than #9
posted by stormpooper at 8:31 AM on May 31, 2012

the_bone: "Malor, the man who was sued credited the work in question to both Cage and himself, and then insulted the composer to boot ("my version is so much better because I was able to say everything I wanted in less time")."

My thought was that he wasn't insulting the composer. He was insulting those people who give way more credit and reverence for this type of work than it really deserves. Much as they do for other works such as blank canvases and the like.
posted by 2manyusernames at 1:05 PM on May 31, 2012

I know Adam so I couldn't make the post myself but it's nice to see this move from something referenced in comments to a post of its own.
posted by safetyfork at 7:08 PM on May 31, 2012