Comments on: I Ain't Afraid of No Pedeconferences

I Ain't Afraid of No Pedeconferences

WCityMike — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 17:24:14 -0800

If Aaron Sorkin had written Star Wars, Avatar, Ghostbusters, Twilight, and Harry Potter.

By: furiousxgeorge

furiousxgeorge — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 17:31:16 -0800

Well, I just watched the Star Wars sand scene one so far but the writing, acting, and direction is all improved from the original.

By: Mezentian

Mezentian — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 17:39:38 -0800

I feel like I missed something. Like a familiarity with Aaron Sorkin. How on note are these?

By: benito.strauss

benito.strauss — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 17:41:01 -0800

I like this new world we now live in where we make fun of Aaron Sorkin. It feels .... it feels ... liberating, yes, liberating.

By: Effigy2000

Effigy2000 — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 17:43:35 -0800

As a straight male, I've never been more attracted to Annakin Skywalker in my life.

By: kyrademon

kyrademon — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 17:50:32 -0800

Several of these were definite improvements on the originals. But were they improvements in a relative way or in an absolute way?

By: wierdo

wierdo — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 17:52:59 -0800

Wow, I have rarely wanted to claw my eyes out at dialog more. Unfortunately, they get the Sorkin writing pretty well, so it's not just the low production values. People don't talk like that in real life!

By: shakespeherian

shakespeherian — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 17:57:37 -0800

Not to defend Sorkin, whose stuff I don't like much, but people never spoke like Shakespeare in real life either.

By: Canageek

Canageek — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 17:59:08 -0800

I'm sorry, what? No, really, what? I....does someone actually make movies that sound like this?

By: This, of course, alludes to you

This, of course, alludes to you — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:00:45 -0800

not to put too fine a point on it but this whole thing feels top-down and weird like, i never even knew who this guy was except that he made a "west wing" that people liked, and now he is apparently a Public Laughingstock hmmmmm

By: mightygodking

mightygodking — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:06:02 -0800

I think we should all continue to excoriate Aaron Sorkin for writing dialogue that is overloaded with technique and which is not realistic in any way, because in everyday parlance I speak exclusively in action movie jargon. COME GET SOME!

By: kyrademon

kyrademon — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:06:08 -0800

For that matter, they don't talk in real life like they do in Twilight, Attack of the Clones, or Avatar. I'll take the position that if you must have your characters say things that are banal, obvious, or completely meaningless, you might as well have them try to be entertaining about it.

By: furiousxgeorge

furiousxgeorge — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:08:53 -0800

like, i never even knew who this guy was except that he made a "west wing" that people liked, and now he is apparently a Public Laughingstock He's an extremely economically and critically succesfull TV and film writer but a lot of vocal people don't like his style, and some misogynistic writing in his scripts. He is far from a laughingstock though.

By: wierdo

wierdo — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:09:45 -0800

I don't believe that dialogue that sounds more like firecrackers on the fourth of july is entertaining, but that may just be me.

By: lunasol

lunasol — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:10:22 -0800

Having watched the first two, they seem more like Mamet than Sorkin - too much quipping and interrupting, not enough factoid-dropping and monologuing.

By: Algebra

Algebra — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:11:42 -0800

The youtube rabbithole lead me to this. That is all.

By: vidur

vidur — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:12:20 -0800

I think we've reached Peak Sorkin.

By: This, of course, alludes to you

This, of course, alludes to you — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:14:48 -0800

@furiousxgeorge okay but when people try to hide the affiliations of the content they spread, it makes the content itself look hinky and suspicious

By: kyrademon

kyrademon — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:16:05 -0800

Bearing in mind that we are comparing it to the immortal "I don't like sand" soliloquy from Attack of the Clones, I will definitely take the firecracker barrage.

By: malocchio

malocchio — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:16:43 -0800

Why does a Sorkin/Gotye mashup feel inevitable?

By: zephyr_words

zephyr_words — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:16:53 -0800

Sand, sand? sand, sand SAND SANNNDDDD SANDD!! SSAAADASNNDNDNDNDND!!!

By: The World Famous

The World Famous — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:21:37 -0800

Having watched the first two, they seem more like Mamet than Sorkin Darth Vader. That's my name. You know why, Mister? 'Cause you drove a speeder to get here tonight, I drove an 80 trillion dollar Star Destroyer. That's. My name.

By: Hey Dean Yeager!

Hey Dean Yeager! — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:24:25 -0800

Sand, sand? sand, sand SAND SANNNDDDD SANDD!! SSAAADASNNDNDNDNDND!!! Sand in my shoooooes...Sand from Havanaaaa...

By: adamdschneider

adamdschneider — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:24:32 -0800

And now I know I can forever skip the West Wing with a clear conscience.

By: His thoughts were red thoughts

His thoughts were red thoughts — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:34:51 -0800

Why does a Sorkin/Gotye mashup feel inevitable? Now and then I think of political drama Like when you did Bartlett for America I told myself that you were right for me But felt so lonely in your company But that was fandom, it's an ache I still remember The you got addicted to a certain kinda cocaine Like so much smugness to the end, always the end So when your new show could not make sense Well I said that I could still be a fan But I'll admit that I was glad that it was over But you didn't have be so crap Make it like girls are bad and that they are useless I don't even need your love, but you treat me like a moron And that feels so rough No, you didn't have to stoop so low Have a mary sue rant insanely And then change history Guess that I don't need that though Now you're just some writer that I used to know

By: suburbanbeatnik

suburbanbeatnik — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:35:46 -0800

Now I'm waiting for a Sorkin/Call Me Maybe mash-up.

By: His thoughts were red thoughts

His thoughts were red thoughts — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:40:15 -0800

Come on, man. I have to get some work done sometime.

By: hal9k

hal9k — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:45:02 -0800

Displeased you I have, oh feckless Wan?

By: RobotHero

RobotHero — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 18:59:08 -0800

I'm with Alludes that this feels overly top-down; like they came up with the concept without ever getting a good feel for what makes Sorkin dialogue sound like Sorkin dialogue. So after watching one of those, I feel ... unsatisfied somehow. Like you offered me a burger but gave me a baloney sandwich.

By: The World Famous

The World Famous — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:01:09 -0800

A baloney sandwich?

By: Apocryphon

Apocryphon — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:01:58 -0800

By: rh

rh — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:04:03 -0800

Colbert asks Sorkin about his style (skip to 4:00 mark). (and an older one)

By: fleacircus

fleacircus — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:10:21 -0800

like they came up with the concept without ever getting a good feel for what makes Sorkin dialogue sound like Sorkin dialogue. So after watching one of those, I feel ... unsatisfied somehow. I thought the Avatar one was the most Sorkiny. Includes random walking and talking. Not sure if you hit that on in your sweeping survey of the links before you wrote your comment.

By: Apocryphon

Apocryphon — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:12:04 -0800

Not that I think any other filmmakers should get a pass. Would love to see similar parodies of the styles of say Joss Whedon or even Christopher Nolan.

By: RobotHero

RobotHero — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:21:30 -0800

A baloney sandwich? posted by The World Famous No thank you. I just had one.

By: mightygodking

mightygodking — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:22:53 -0800

Maybe I don't read enough comic books to make trenchant comparisons on dialogue in media as opposed to real life, but last time I checked no one was treating most creators of action movies as auteurs and sparkling luminaries of the intelligentsia like they do with Aaron Sorkin, MGK. Sorkin has been getting bitchslapped for his style practically since The West Wing first came on the air. (Here is a decade-old piece which manages to get his style better than the linked Youtubes above.) Yes, Sorkin relies on his personal dialogue and writing quirks. So does Mamet. So does Joss Whedon. So does Jonathan Nolan. So does Amy-Sherman Palladino (and one of the comments on those Youtubes got it right when they noted that the girls' writing sounded much more like Palladino than Sorkin). So does Woody Allen. So does just about every screenwriter, especially those who write entertaining dramedy. Critiquing Sorkin's treatment of female characters is a critique worth making, because that's engaging with the substance of his work. But a lot of criticism of Sorkin devolves to "I hate his talky-talkiness and here's a lot of examples of that - and also his female characters!" and that is just a waste of everybody's time because Sorkin's personal style is value-neutral; you like it, you don't like it, whatever, but it's how he writes his stuff and complaining about it is like complaining about how J.J. Abrams uses lensflare; all the complainant is doing is complaining for the sake of complaint because once you say "well Sorkin's characters talk fast and interchange in this sort of way" that's basically the end of the complaint!

By: Apocryphon

Apocryphon — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:28:33 -0800

But making fun of writers' creative quirks is fun and funny because it reminds all of us that we all have different styles and tastes, and sometimes that's okay to laugh at. We already had a serious discussion about how out-of-touch he is substantively with regards to understanding modern media in The Newsroom. This is just continuing to dig at his style. I'm certainly open to spoofs of other would-be auteurs.

By: RobotHero

RobotHero — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:34:07 -0800

I don't think they're complaining. Why would they use Attack of the Clones and Twilight as starting points if they were complaining?

By: Apocryphon

Apocryphon — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:39:24 -0800

Not to defend Sorkin, whose stuff I don't like much, but people never spoke like Shakespeare in real life either. The question is, did people speak like Marlowe or Robert Greene or any of other Shakespeare's contemporaries?

By: pearlybob

pearlybob — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:44:07 -0800

yeah.

By: germdisco

germdisco — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 19:53:41 -0800

My expectations are not being met.

By: mediareport

mediareport — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 20:00:57 -0800

Peak Sorkin was confirmed for me last week as I sat at a traffic light listening to his interview with Terry Gross. She was clearly (but very pleasantly) laughing at him while asking about how unrealistic his dialogue and plot points were, and he kept on answering lightheartedly, as if she wasn't (very pleasantly) asking him to stop writing at us as if we were children. It was surprisingly interesting mainstream radio.

By: kandinski

kandinski — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 20:11:05 -0800

World Famous, that's exactly what I was thinking. The dialogue in these parodies is more "Everybody needs ~~money~~ unobtainium! That's why it's called ~~money~~ unobtainium!" than anything else.

By: Rory Marinich

Rory Marinich — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 20:25:41 -0800

Sorkin's personal style is value-neutral; you like it, you don't like it, whatever, but it's how he writes his stuff and complaining about it is like complaining about how J.J. Abrams uses lens flare What? Style isn't "value-neutral", not now, not ever. Style determines how a piece feels, how it builds, how it flows. Disliking a writer for their style is one of the main central reasons to dislike a writer. Plenty of excellent criticism has been written about various authors' various styles. LOST would have been better without a lot of J. J. Abrams's stylistic quirks, and the Sorkin pieces I've seen would have been — well, not better, but less deceptively flawed — without Sorkin's.

By: wierdo

wierdo — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 21:22:42 -0800

wierdo: "People don't talk like that in real life!" You know, thinking about it more, I realize I lied. Tweakers talk like that in real life. Perhaps that's why it's so grating to me.

By: town of cats

town of cats — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 21:38:18 -0800

I've got to say, the girl playing Hermione in the Harry Potter one nailed the crazy eyebrows overacting that Emma Watson used to do. Well done.

By: Bwithh

Bwithh — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 21:39:20 -0800

Every single one of these is substantially better than the original.

By: CheeseDigestsAll

CheeseDigestsAll — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 21:52:46 -0800

PEOPLE WILL YOU please learn how to balance your LEVELS.

By: mmoncur

mmoncur — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 21:58:11 -0800

I thought they did a pretty good job, except that they forgot to include the word "Okay" every 60 seconds. (And I'm a huge fan of Sorkin, faults and all.)

By: furiousxgeorge

furiousxgeorge — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 22:06:59 -0800

Every single one of these is substantially better than the original. Yeah, even with the Ghostbusters scene, which is by far the best movie on the list. The drawn out dialogue just makes the final "Yeah I'm the keymaster" punchline even better. Now someone write one for, "Are you a god?"

By: thivaia

thivaia — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 22:53:11 -0800

I don't love the way he writes women on the whole, but I think Sorkin's a pretty good dialogue writer. As shakespeherian noted above, people in real life don't talk like characters on stage. Aaron Sorkin is just an unusually visible example of someone who writes in a theatrical idiom and has acheived crossover success. (Slightly Irrelevant HBO Sidenote: I watch "The Newsroom" with the exact same level of half-squicked/half-intrigued as I did "Girls" for very different and oddly similar reasons.)

By: pete_22

pete_22 — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 05:05:43 -0800

Reminds me more of Dragnet. And of course Mathnet.

By: aught

aught — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 05:54:51 -0800

Having watched the first two, they seem more like Mamet than Sorkin - too much quipping and interrupting, not enough factoid-dropping and monologuing. Making fun of Sorkin dialogue is the new making fun of Mamet dialogue.

By: KokuRyu

KokuRyu — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 14:21:21 -0800

These were great. Thanks for posting.