Mars Wiggles
August 21, 2012 12:04 AM Subscribe
Mars Wiggles Enhancing Curiosity's imagery from Mars using the wiggle stereoscopy effect. [via mefi projects]
I wonder if Curiosity might have the means to implement my idea back from the Phoenix mission days.
posted by Anything at 3:24 AM on August 21, 2012
posted by Anything at 3:24 AM on August 21, 2012
As someone who only sees out of one eye*, and thus has little idea of stereoscopy or 3D what-have-you, is this wiggle stuff actually "neat" for people?
Honestly all I see is a pulsating image of two slightly different viewpoints which just kinda makes everything look squishy or, I suppose "wiggly."
Is there something I'm missing, where this is actually like an innovative way to interpret spacial differences or something? (honest question) Or is it just "haha! Wiggly pictures!"
* my left eye works at about 10% capacity, but my brain more or less totally ignores it unless I close my right eye
posted by ShutterBun at 3:35 AM on August 21, 2012
Honestly all I see is a pulsating image of two slightly different viewpoints which just kinda makes everything look squishy or, I suppose "wiggly."
Is there something I'm missing, where this is actually like an innovative way to interpret spacial differences or something? (honest question) Or is it just "haha! Wiggly pictures!"
* my left eye works at about 10% capacity, but my brain more or less totally ignores it unless I close my right eye
posted by ShutterBun at 3:35 AM on August 21, 2012
(hmm...from the Wikipedia link: "It is the only method of stereoscopic visualization for people with limited or no vision in one eye.") I guess I should be grateful. I mean, I get what they're doing (showing how "far away stuff" moves less than "close stuff,") but I wondered whether there was some "magic eye" effect that I'm not privy to.
Working as intended, in that case.
posted by ShutterBun at 3:38 AM on August 21, 2012
Working as intended, in that case.
posted by ShutterBun at 3:38 AM on August 21, 2012
ShutterBun, it depends on the image but in the best cases I at least get a surprisingly strong illusion of depth, vaguely similar to what I get with 3d glasses.
It's unfortunate if it doesn't work for you, but presumably those neurons are put to good use for something else :)
posted by Anything at 4:01 AM on August 21, 2012
It's unfortunate if it doesn't work for you, but presumably those neurons are put to good use for something else :)
posted by Anything at 4:01 AM on August 21, 2012
Out of curiosity, does it work the same with one eye closed?
posted by ShutterBun at 4:35 AM on August 21, 2012
posted by ShutterBun at 4:35 AM on August 21, 2012
Out of curiosity, does it work the same with one eye closed?
I wondered about that too -- for me it does work.
posted by Anything at 5:17 AM on August 21, 2012
I wondered about that too -- for me it does work.
posted by Anything at 5:17 AM on August 21, 2012
Good wiggle stereoscopy gives me the illusion of depth, but most of these aren't very well rendered, unfortunately. Probably because the images from which they were constructed weren't really meant for this. The two points of view are too far displaced from one another in the black and white close ups, don't appear to be displaced at all on the one with the shadow, generate too little parallax in the distance shots of the mountain... And the descendent imager doesn't seem like it's even an attempt at stereoscopy, just a short movie clip.
Only the two color close ups really give any depth illusion to me. And I wish I could also see the two images from which each is constructed side-by-side. I'm pretty good at crossing/parallelizing my eyes to do Magic Eye effects, and would probably get a stronger sense of 3D from that.
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:45 AM on August 21, 2012 [2 favorites]
Only the two color close ups really give any depth illusion to me. And I wish I could also see the two images from which each is constructed side-by-side. I'm pretty good at crossing/parallelizing my eyes to do Magic Eye effects, and would probably get a stronger sense of 3D from that.
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:45 AM on August 21, 2012 [2 favorites]
ShutterBun -- for what it's worth, these particular images mostly don't create a 3D effect for me either, even with two eyes. The wiggle effect seems to work best with two images that are very close together and with wide separation between the foreground and background, like this or this.
If those aren't doing anything for you either, the best analogy I can offer is this video of head tracking with a WiiRemote. The 3D effect once he turns head tracking on is basically the same effect that these wiggle images create.
posted by jhc at 5:47 AM on August 21, 2012
If those aren't doing anything for you either, the best analogy I can offer is this video of head tracking with a WiiRemote. The 3D effect once he turns head tracking on is basically the same effect that these wiggle images create.
posted by jhc at 5:47 AM on August 21, 2012
Is this going to become the new tilt/shift and bore the arse off me when every film and TV programme starts using it?
posted by GallonOfAlan at 6:09 AM on August 21, 2012
posted by GallonOfAlan at 6:09 AM on August 21, 2012
Enhancing?
I've seen "wiggle" pics that actually do achieve the intended simulation, but these are total crap. The difference between the images used are too great.
posted by Thorzdad at 6:28 AM on August 21, 2012 [1 favorite]
I've seen "wiggle" pics that actually do achieve the intended simulation, but these are total crap. The difference between the images used are too great.
posted by Thorzdad at 6:28 AM on August 21, 2012 [1 favorite]
ShutterBun - I also have amblyopia, I imagine most of us lack the ability to sense depth or 3 dimensions. as our brains developed and only processed the image of one eye, something got lost in the wiring. I often get asked what it's like to see in only 2 dimensions, of course i have no idea what 3 dimensions look like, it's like asking a colorblind person what it's like to not be able to tell the difference between red and green. you can't explain a phenomenon you don't experience. so yeah, for the others there is an illusion of depth, for us it's just 2 flickering images.
posted by camdan at 6:32 AM on August 21, 2012
posted by camdan at 6:32 AM on August 21, 2012
This one works OK. A lot of the other ones are just not a good use of this technique. Or aren't even this technique at all and are just animated GIFs. Feels like a case of "gotta fill the page with something."
posted by smackfu at 7:26 AM on August 21, 2012
posted by smackfu at 7:26 AM on August 21, 2012
This Mars, it vibrates?
posted by Kabanos at 9:01 AM on August 21, 2012 [1 favorite]
posted by Kabanos at 9:01 AM on August 21, 2012 [1 favorite]
I'm not getting any 3-D off of these guys, but the back and forth replay of the heat shield drop is timed perfectly to "Pump Up The Volume", and even fits in with the imagery from its video.
posted by benito.strauss at 9:59 AM on August 21, 2012
posted by benito.strauss at 9:59 AM on August 21, 2012
Wiggler here. They're not all great wiggles -- especially where the rover's Navcam is involved, due to the unnatural distance between the lenses -- but I'll glean what clean parallax I can get from any paired image on the MSL raw image feed.
And yes, there are cases where I'm GIFing for the sake of the GIF, not actually wiggling, but going for a sense of movement or dimensionality. I try to mark those as "not wiggles" in the captions.
posted by brownpau at 12:04 PM on August 21, 2012 [4 favorites]
And yes, there are cases where I'm GIFing for the sake of the GIF, not actually wiggling, but going for a sense of movement or dimensionality. I try to mark those as "not wiggles" in the captions.
posted by brownpau at 12:04 PM on August 21, 2012 [4 favorites]
Another amblyopian checking in late. Works ok for me.
BTW, I've always been able to draw "in 3d" better than most people, and I have long held a pet theory that this is due in part to my amblyopia, the idea being that I don't get distracted or thrown off by the difference in stereoscopic cues between the real world and a flat piece of paper, because I'm not getting any of those cues. Wondering if other amblyopians also find they are able to draw better than most people.
posted by smcameron at 5:31 PM on August 21, 2012
BTW, I've always been able to draw "in 3d" better than most people, and I have long held a pet theory that this is due in part to my amblyopia, the idea being that I don't get distracted or thrown off by the difference in stereoscopic cues between the real world and a flat piece of paper, because I'm not getting any of those cues. Wondering if other amblyopians also find they are able to draw better than most people.
posted by smcameron at 5:31 PM on August 21, 2012
I know everybody's (justifiably) moved on to the new hotness that is Curiosity, but every time I'm reminded of it it blows my mind that 8 and a half years on, Opportunity is STILL GOING. Wow.
posted by the painkiller at 7:15 PM on August 21, 2012
posted by the painkiller at 7:15 PM on August 21, 2012
smcameron - i have read somewhere that amblyopes are great artists for just the reason you describe. no idea where, though.
posted by camdan at 9:53 PM on August 21, 2012
posted by camdan at 9:53 PM on August 21, 2012
OK, I think I'm getting what I more or less suspected, but didn't really want to say in so many words (since this was a MeFi project and all) but it seems that "wiggle pictures" can kinda give the 3D effect, but that these (for the most part) aren't particularly strong examples of it. Makes sense.
I also wonder about "drawing in 3D" as you describe, painkiller, since essentially everything I see is in 2 dimensions, so it's not so much of a trick to "convert" it to a drawing. Can't really confirm anything other than that I've never really "had a problem with it."
Another uhhh, benefit, would be "not having to close one eye when looking through a telescope" or microscope, although from what I understand, the correct procedure even for stereo-sighted people is to keep both eyes open, and train your brain to ignore the other eye.
But as long as we're on the subject, is it OK if I ask about binoculars in movies? In movies, it is always presented as sort of a "figure 8" type of shape, with two circles which partially overlap, forming a more or less coherent view. People have told me that the "actual" view through binoculars is just a circle, the same as a telescope would be. When I look through binoculars, I get two circles, partially overlapping but not "connected" to each other.
In other words: this.
So tell me, do binoculars really provide simply a circular view?
posted by ShutterBun at 5:05 AM on August 22, 2012
I also wonder about "drawing in 3D" as you describe, painkiller, since essentially everything I see is in 2 dimensions, so it's not so much of a trick to "convert" it to a drawing. Can't really confirm anything other than that I've never really "had a problem with it."
Another uhhh, benefit, would be "not having to close one eye when looking through a telescope" or microscope, although from what I understand, the correct procedure even for stereo-sighted people is to keep both eyes open, and train your brain to ignore the other eye.
But as long as we're on the subject, is it OK if I ask about binoculars in movies? In movies, it is always presented as sort of a "figure 8" type of shape, with two circles which partially overlap, forming a more or less coherent view. People have told me that the "actual" view through binoculars is just a circle, the same as a telescope would be. When I look through binoculars, I get two circles, partially overlapping but not "connected" to each other.
In other words: this.
So tell me, do binoculars really provide simply a circular view?
posted by ShutterBun at 5:05 AM on August 22, 2012
I think what I see through binoculars depends on how far away they're focussed. If they are weak enough that I can still see things relatively close up, where my eyes still have different points of view, then my over all field of view will still be wider than it is tall, a sort of oblong shape (I don't see any closing in of the circles toward the middle -- my brain happily ignores any black areas in the field of view of one eye that happen to be covered by the field of view of the other eye the same way it normally ignores my nose -- unless I'm looking for it.) If they are focussed so far away that both eyes see essentially the same thing, my brain fuses those two nearly identical images into a single circle --but I'm pretty sure I don't have any depth perception in that case.
With two toilet paper tubes, I'm pretty sure I can vary the angle between them to see single circle, an oblong, a "movie binoculars" view, or two distinct circles, by pointing them further and further away from one another.
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:33 AM on August 25, 2012
With two toilet paper tubes, I'm pretty sure I can vary the angle between them to see single circle, an oblong, a "movie binoculars" view, or two distinct circles, by pointing them further and further away from one another.
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:33 AM on August 25, 2012
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