November 7, 2001

8:27 AM

Ecstasy approved by the FDAWell not exactly but I thought it would grab people's attention a lot better than the original title of the article. My only question is: Does seeing my fat, hairy, aunt naked qualify me as suffering from post-traumatic shock syndrome?
posted by Grok09 (42 comments total)

worth a try.
posted by asok at 8:42 AM on November 7, 2001

Perhaps it'll be prescribed for cases of post-traumatic shock caused by taking home-made E.
posted by liam at 8:42 AM on November 7, 2001

"I know of no evidence in the scientific literature that demonstrates the efficacy of Ecstasy for any clinical indication," said Alan Leshner, director of the government's National Institute on Drug Abuse.

That's probably because it's illegal to study.

Well, this is very good news indeed. I can't believe John Ashcroft is allowing this to happen.
posted by drunkkeith at 8:55 AM on November 7, 2001

Hmm.. the word pupils. I recall using it when I first came to U.S. as I was really studying English in a British kind of way. Here everyone's a student. That's no fun at all. Pee-u-peel.

I don't know, Ecstasy does sounds kinda like fun, but then I can't support a drug habbit and broadbad.
posted by tiaka at 8:57 AM on November 7, 2001

what about drugged hobbits?

they're handy around the house.
posted by fishfucker at 9:09 AM on November 7, 2001

I don't see how feeling incredibly happy and relaxed for a few hours then going straight back to normal can cure any kind of psychiatric problem. But then ecstasy shouldn't be illegal as it's non-addictive and health problems associated with it are usually to do with excessive water intake or the pills being mixed with something dodgy.
posted by Summer at 9:10 AM on November 7, 2001

Of course, the medical efficacy of tobacco, alcohol, and caffeine are why they are legal, right?
posted by yesster at 9:14 AM on November 7, 2001

I don't see how feeling incredibly happy and relaxed for a few hours then going straight back to normal can cure any kind of psychiatric problem.

Ummm, I'm guessing you've never played with powerful mind-bending drugs (recreationally)...just a hunch
posted by BentPenguin at 9:15 AM on November 7, 2001

I don't see how feeling incredibly happy and relaxed for a few hours then going straight back to normal can cure any kind of psychiatric problem.

Here's a theory.
posted by liam at 9:22 AM on November 7, 2001

Ummm, I'm guessing you've never played with powerful mind-bending drugs (recreationally)...just a hunch

Wrong
posted by Summer at 9:31 AM on November 7, 2001

"health problems associated with it are usually to do with excessive water intake"

Can you elaborate on that?
posted by David Dark at 9:40 AM on November 7, 2001

I was thinking of Leah Betts, who died from drinking too much water at a rave.
posted by Summer at 9:46 AM on November 7, 2001

Can you elaborate on that?

I think it refers to cases like that of Leah Betts, the first known death in the UK as a result of taking E.
posted by liam at 9:47 AM on November 7, 2001

Laboratory results show that on admission to hospital hours after taking the 10 pounds tablet, Leah's plasma sodium level - a measure of how dilute her blood had become - had fallen to 126 millimoles per litre...

Well good googeldy moogeldy, I wuold have thought that a ten pound tablet alone would have killed her. No matter what it was. I mean, I tired to eat three pounds of meatloaf once on a bet and it nearly did me in.
posted by emptyage at 10:01 AM on November 7, 2001

emptyage, that was pure genius. Someone knocked on the door of my office to ask me if I were okay, I was laughing so hard.
posted by Danelope at 10:22 AM on November 7, 2001

Today's other big ironic drugs story:
Central London police launch zero tolerance policy on middle-class drug use, with "City bankers, advertising workers and other middle-class professionals" who are found in possession of cocaine or even just one ecstasy tablet being jailed or fined £5,000.

"A Home Office source said: 'It's aimed at people who take cocaine at parties...' Superintendent Dean Ingledew, head of West End Central Police Station, said: 'In the past, people could expect to be cautioned but now they will be charged automatically. This should act as a serious deterrent. We are targeting the market because it will reduce low-level crime such as street robberies, burglaries and shoplifting as people try to get money to buy drugs.'"

Meanwhile, the Home Secretary David Blunkett recommends that cannabis be downgraded from Class B to Class C.
posted by skylar at 11:10 AM on November 7, 2001

Meanwhile, British celebrity and journalist drug-taking in a fashionable club gets publicity. (The relevant extract from the book mentioned in the article.)
posted by liam at 11:37 AM on November 7, 2001

I don't see how feeling incredibly happy and relaxed for a few hours then going straight back to normal can cure any kind of psychiatric problem.

Let me rephrase an earlier question: I assume you haven't tried E then.
posted by fooljay at 1:29 PM on November 7, 2001

technical question: what is the difference between MDMA(ecstasy) and MDA(what was known as the "love drug" back in the "70's.......
posted by bunnyfire at 1:41 PM on November 7, 2001

That's kind of what I was thinking, fooljay... but the trip can vary a bit depending on the setting; someone who's only taken X in a club or rave setting may have focused on the sensory experience and not noticed the more profound emotional effects.

I can see how MDMA-assissted therapy sessions could be a powerful technique for treatment of PTSD and other ailments. I look forward to seeing what this research uncovers.

-Mars
posted by Mars Saxman at 1:42 PM on November 7, 2001

technical question: what is the difference between MDMA(ecstasy) and MDA(what was known as the "love drug" back in the "70's.....

One M. :-)

Actually, I just got finished reading the Secret Chief: Conversations With a Pioneer of the Underground Psychedelic Therapy Movement. All proceeds go to MAPS, the group funding the study. (So buy the book if you'd like to contribute to the study) The subject of the book talks about the differences between MDA and MDMA. I'll try to dig them up.

As an aside, I corresponded briefly with Rick Doblin, the head of MAPS and the guy quoted near the end, after reading an article about him in Rolling Stone. They are doing very good things over there.
posted by fooljay at 1:59 PM on November 7, 2001

Yeah, Mars, E is a very environment-sensitive drug. It FEELS different at a rave, or in the middle of the desert, or sitting at home with 4 or 5 really close friends, or in a therapist's office.

People who haven't done E in the latter two settings really can't judge the efficacy of E in those settings. Sorry, it's just a different drug...
posted by fooljay at 2:02 PM on November 7, 2001

You know, I should probably give this link for buying the book. I'm not sure if there is as much profit through Amazon...
posted by fooljay at 2:04 PM on November 7, 2001

By the way, this is a much more complete article (Wall Street Journal).
posted by fooljay at 2:12 PM on November 7, 2001

Here are the differences that I have noticed;
MDA provides more of a hallucengenic high.
MDMA provides more euphoria & sensual sensations.

I don't know the chemical diiference, but erowid should know.
posted by thekorruptor at 2:12 PM on November 7, 2001

stupid question:

has anyone ever died of excessive water intake while not on drugs, but just because they drank a shitload of water?

I'd never heard her story before, BTW. Thanks for the links.
posted by David Dark at 2:54 PM on November 7, 2001

Let me rephrase an earlier question: I assume you haven't tried E then

Wrong
posted by Summer at 2:56 PM on November 7, 2001

I've never found a drug that's life changing. You take it, your brain gets rewired for a little while, then it returns to normal. What you felt while under the influence doesn't affect your normal life. At least, that's how it felt to me. But then I'm not suffering from post traumatic stress disorder.
posted by Summer at 3:03 PM on November 7, 2001

has anyone ever died of excessive water intake while not on drugs, but just because they drank a shitload of water?

Kelly Barret, a 43-year-old distance runner may well have.
posted by Carol Anne at 3:23 PM on November 7, 2001

I've never found a drug that's life changing. . . At least, that's how it felt to me.

If that's your experience then cool beans. Color me anal retentive w/r/t proper pronoun usage, but your other statements seem to generalize to other people:

You take it, your brain gets rewired for a little while, then it returns to normal. What you felt while under the influence doesn't affect your normal life.

The whole trajectory of my life was profoundly shifted in a very positive way by a well timed tab of acid, and I've had similar, lasting shifts in context occur with E. My point is just that drug experiences (like many experiences) are highly personal things and are not necessarily as ephemeral as you seem to suggest.
posted by donovan at 5:21 PM on November 7, 2001

the heffter research institute also does hallucinogenic research (or is that research into hallucinogens :) although it seems they've been dormant a few years. i thought this paper did a really good job explaining its relevance.

more stuff on drugs, religion and psychoanalysis at CSP.
posted by kliuless at 6:19 PM on November 7, 2001

for once the website i run is relevant, come to Bluelight for all your questions about MDMA. it's a message board, so you have to wade thru a lot of crap, but there's lots of helpful people there...

oh and the short answer on the difference between MDMA and MDA is that effects wise, MDA is longer lasting (5 to 8hours), "speedier", less empathic and has a higher incidence of visual hallucinations. MDMA last only 3 to 5 hours. is more empathic, "loved up". and has almost no visual element.
posted by johnboy at 7:04 PM on November 7, 2001

as far as the water intoxication question-yes, there have been cases of water intoxication leading to death. Actually anyone drinking too much would die...


On to MDA/MDNA.........I beg yall to be careful with that stuff....it messes directly with the seratonin in your brain......that is something that you DO NOT want permanently screwed up......

speaking from experience.
posted by bunnyfire at 8:13 PM on November 7, 2001

it might be asking too much, or be too personal, but i'd be interested to hear your experience, bunnyfire. what has been screwed up?
posted by pikachulolita at 9:17 PM on November 7, 2001

On to MDA/MDNA.........I beg yall to be careful with that stuff....it messes directly with the seratonin in your brain......that is something that you DO NOT want permanently screwed up......

Oh well, there's always 4-MTA.
posted by boaz at 9:47 PM on November 7, 2001

You make MDMA from MDA, that is the difference. Also MDA does not provide you with the empathy people feel when consuming MDMA, there is also MDEA which has hallucinogenic effects.

And skylar, thanks for that excerpt, i found it hilarious that the police believe there are city bankers, advertising workers and other middle-class professionals who need to commit crime such as street robberies, burglaries and shoplifting to support their drug use.
posted by Zool at 9:47 PM on November 7, 2001

has anyone ever died of excessive water intake while not on drugs, but just because they drank a shitload of water?

Yes, it's commonly called 'water toxicity'.

Summer wrote: Wrong and then I've never found a drug that's life changing. You take it, your brain gets rewired for a little while, then it returns to normal. What you felt while under the influence doesn't affect your normal life. At least, that's how it felt to me. But then I'm not suffering from post traumatic stress disorder.

Well then (assuming you didn't do E at a rave or some such scene) that's the first time I've ever heard anyone say that E didn't affect their lives afterwards at least in some small way. Like I said before, this is only small group/close friend groupings or therapy, otherwise, I can understand why you might not take anything away.
posted by fooljay at 12:30 AM on November 8, 2001

Back in my young and stupid days, I did try MDA.....actually i really felt empathy, along with a great love for anything and anybody in the universe....I remember just a couple of hallucinations-i also remember seeing myself in a bathroom mirror with pupils big as all get-out, kinda scary looking...


as to the long term affects, I do have a chemical imbalance that I have to take medication for...I will never know how much of my young-and-stupid activity I have to thank for that- but now, as i see scientists come out with studies on Ecstasy and long term effects, i have to wonder. In any case i didn't do myself any good with it, and I wish I had never touched the stuff.
posted by bunnyfire at 3:28 AM on November 8, 2001

Bunnyfire, MDA or MDMA?
posted by fooljay at 5:13 AM on November 8, 2001

MDA.....
posted by bunnyfire at 6:17 AM on November 8, 2001

Well then (assuming you didn't do E at a rave or some such scene) that's the first time I've ever heard anyone say that E didn't affect their lives afterwards at least in some small way

I've done it both in the context of a rave and at home with friends, but this was many years ago. It was a revelation at the time and taught me one valuable lesson: that mood and personality can be totally altered by the chemical balance of your mind and isn't necessarily dependent on outside influences. That's helped me understand myself and my reactions to life a lot more. So that's what I've taken away.

But what I haven't taken away is the loved up feeling E gives you. Taking E hasn't made me a nicer or friendlier person nor helped me form better relationships. That's the bit I find hard to take, but I fully recognise everyone's mind is different. But wouldn't it be great if E did change your attitude for the better. There'd be a whole generation of friendly, tolerant twenty-somethings out there, which manifestly isn't true.
posted by Summer at 8:56 AM on November 8, 2001

Bunny, thanks for your input. It is very appreciated.
posted by thekorruptor at 1:13 PM on November 8, 2001