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Lost in The Canyons
January 10, 2013 9:04 AM   Subscribe

Here Is What Happens When You Cast Lindsay Lohan in Your Movie. The movie in question is The Canyons, the Kickstarter-funded erotic thriller written by Bret Easton Ellis and directed by Paul Schrader. There's no release date yet, but the film does have several retro-themed trailers.
posted by Horace Rumpole (155 comments total) 15 users marked this as a favorite

 
Two words: MUST SEE.
posted by freakazoid at 9:10 AM on January 10, 2013 [5 favorites]


Two other words: TRAIN WRECK.
posted by freakazoid at 9:10 AM on January 10, 2013 [7 favorites]


I read this and my first thought was that we as a human race probably deserve whatever hellish chaotic vortex might arise from any project with Bret Easton Ellis and Lindsay Lohan. I cannot think of a room I'd like to be in less than any room containing either or both of them.

That being said, this was a very interesting article.
posted by nevercalm at 9:11 AM on January 10, 2013 [6 favorites]


I read this and my first thought was that we as a human race probably deserve whatever hellish chaotic vortex might arise from any project with Bret Easton Ellis and Lindsay Lohan.

Don't forget James Deen (warning: famous porn star, might not want to google him at work).
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:12 AM on January 10, 2013 [3 favorites]


Don't forget James Deen (warning: famous porn star, might not want to google him at work).

Deen, unlike Ellis and Lohan, generally has a reputation for being a nice person.
posted by mightygodking at 9:17 AM on January 10, 2013 [43 favorites]


Wonder how Lohan will react to this article. I predict unintelligible Tweets placing the blame elsewhere and numerous angry voicemails to the NYTimes, left after business hours.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:18 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


I have to get out of Los Angeles.
posted by roger ackroyd at 9:23 AM on January 10, 2013 [5 favorites]


In 2006, she was the best thing in Robert Altman’s “Prairie Home Companion.”

Had to stop reading there.
posted by bonobothegreat at 9:24 AM on January 10, 2013 [10 favorites]


I'm shocked! It took them 280 words before the first mention of cocaine.
posted by dubold at 9:24 AM on January 10, 2013


That was great. I was chuckling all along, but I lost it when Lohan said "I eventually want to direct."
posted by languagehat at 9:24 AM on January 10, 2013 [11 favorites]


A Lindsay Lohan trainwreck I can easily imagine.

It's also no surprise that BEE is underwater with his condo.

But Paul Schrader deserves much, much, better than this.

What a fantastic post (great info), but it's sort of depressing.
posted by KokuRyu at 9:25 AM on January 10, 2013


Don't forget James Deen (warning: famous porn star, might not want to google him at work).

I work in the business...I'll take porn-star level talent who is unfailingly polite and always on time who can "be seen on set making sure the garbage bags were correctly hugging the trash-can lids" over a shitty, coked-up writer and an unpredictable, unreliable, constantly late woman with immense talent any day. ANY day.
posted by nevercalm at 9:26 AM on January 10, 2013 [29 favorites]


Deen, unlike Ellis and Lohan, generally has a reputation for being a nice person.


"Hello, casting department? Get me three massive pricks!"
posted by dubold at 9:28 AM on January 10, 2013 [124 favorites]


GQ had a long article about Deen last summer. He seems like a fascinating character. I'd be curious to hear more from him about what it was like to work with Lohan.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:31 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


immense talent

As a sometimes Lohan fan... this does not describe her at any stage of her career. "But Mean Girls!" people say. Watch it again and see how much of that film's success is based on Lohan's performance. Almost nil.
posted by yellowbinder at 9:31 AM on January 10, 2013 [4 favorites]


How is she not dead yet?
posted by tommasz at 9:33 AM on January 10, 2013


James Deen, Lindsay Lohan, and "the money clip that Robert DeNiro gave Schrader on the set of “Taxi Driver.” ". I misread part of that so badly.
posted by buzzman at 9:37 AM on January 10, 2013 [3 favorites]


This article is a perfect example of the New York Times corporation's webmasters losing my interest. If I could have loaded this one page I am pretty sure I would have read the whole thing. As it is I read page one and then decided it was a waste of time when confronted with the conscious decision to click on to page two.
posted by bukvich at 9:41 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


As a sometimes Lohan fan... this does not describe her at any stage of her career. "But Mean Girls!" people say. Watch it again and see how much of that film's success is based on Lohan's performance. Almost nil.

Agreed. She was pretty good in "The Parent Trap" remake, but a lot of the charm in that film was Dennis Quaid and Natasha Richardson.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:42 AM on January 10, 2013


How is she not dead yet?

She's waiting to join the 27 Club?
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:43 AM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


If I could have loaded this one page I am pretty sure I would have read the whole thing.

I linked to the single-page URL--sorry if it isn't working for you.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 9:46 AM on January 10, 2013 [8 favorites]


Schrader's been at Lohan's level of crazy or even worse at times earlier in his life so I can see why he'd be willing to deal with her.
posted by octothorpe at 9:50 AM on January 10, 2013


Putting BEE and Lohan together seems like the worst idea possible. I think Schrader must have his own addiction to failure.
posted by Ad hominem at 9:50 AM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


I don't have time to read the full thing now, but I assume her behaviour hasn't improved since 2005...
posted by yellowbinder at 9:51 AM on January 10, 2013


Horace Rumpole that link works fine. I linked earlier off the New York Times main page which was to page one of ten!

Is there a quick trick to quickly load all pages when they only want to serve you the first?
posted by bukvich at 9:51 AM on January 10, 2013


Now he never travels without thousands of dollars in the currency of half a dozen countries.

So, dollars and euros?

I can't believe I watched all five of those stupid trailers.

This whole things sounds like the confluence of three people desperate for one more success, one shining moment to redeem themselves. The only major direct-to-consumer streaming services are Netflix and Amazon, and I have the feeling that the market for this film is a little more computer savvy than the money guys hope for.

Savvy?
posted by the man of twists and turns at 9:53 AM on January 10, 2013


I linked to the single-page URL--sorry if it isn't working for you.

It worked for me. Really interesting article and it did make me interested in the film and not just in train wreck way. Until I saw the retro trailers, that is; interesting choice, unless you actually want to get a sense for what the actual film you will see might be like. Beyond having many shots of Lohan in poor makeup choices, that is.
posted by lesbiassparrow at 9:54 AM on January 10, 2013


I... dunno. A few years ago there was another film made by a director who'd been written off, starring two actors with indisputable talent but who'd been dismissed as unemployable, one for his attitude, the other for his drinking and drug-taking and his attitude. All three of them weren't just once-bankable, they'd been among the biggest names in the business. Now they were on the scrap-heap, and apparently had every reason to be there.

Kiss Kiss Bang Bang. For my money one of the most enjoyable movies of the last decade.

You've just got to wait until they've got something to prove.
posted by Hogshead at 9:55 AM on January 10, 2013 [27 favorites]


Was The Parent Trap even any good?

Isn't there something a bit unsettling about making a movie in this day and age that proposes that children can reunite their estranged parents if only they are cute and clever enough?

Perhaps Lohan could star in a sequel in which the original twins' plucky tweens play pranks and sing songs to get their moms to stop drinking and doing blow.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 9:55 AM on January 10, 2013


OK I got to page two. Worth it for this alone:

Now he never travels without thousands of dollars in the currency of half a dozen countries.
posted by bukvich at 9:57 AM on January 10, 2013


Was The Parent Trap even any good? = I liked it a lot. YMMV.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:59 AM on January 10, 2013 [3 favorites]


Good article.
Those trailers are worse than something I shit out on iMovie on my lunch break.
posted by docpops at 10:00 AM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


That's a hell of a good NYT Magazine article. I like how he delivers the basic story we're expecting, the Lohan Train Wreck, but does so with taste and nuance and at least a little balance and sympathy.
posted by Nelson at 10:03 AM on January 10, 2013 [8 favorites]


Was The Parent Trap even any good?

She's not Hayley Mills, but who is.
posted by roger ackroyd at 10:09 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


Lohan may have a lot of problems with her life, but at least she doesn't make her money out of the porn industry like James Deen.
posted by colie at 10:11 AM on January 10, 2013


This tells the somewhat predictable story about Lohan. Although really it mostly reminds me that she just doesn't have the skills to cope, and no one around her who genuinely is there to help "assistants" notwithstanding. Schrader on the other hand, I'm less impressed with. When everyone tells you your edit isn't right you need to listen. Instead he seems to have decided he knows best. Oh well, I suppose some folks put a lot more than $30,000 into their own vanity press work, and they don't get Lohan and Deen to help make it happen, so he has that.
posted by meinvt at 10:11 AM on January 10, 2013


Kiss Kiss Bang Bang had a $15,000,000 budget. Money doesn't make a good movie by itself, but it certainly helps.

After reading the article I had a deep suspicion that this movie was, well, bad.The trailer doesn't do a lot to dispell that notion. No one can blame Lindsey for the dialogue, Deen, or the other guy who I presume is Nolan Funk.

Schrader on the other hand, I'm less impressed with.

Exactly.
posted by muddgirl at 10:14 AM on January 10, 2013


She's not Hayley Mills, but who is.

Hailee Steinfeld comes close.
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 10:15 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


Completely tangential, but this adds Schrader to my list of directors who lied through their teeth to George C. Scott to get a performance out of him. (E.g., Franklin Schaffner with "Patton" and Kubrick with "Doctor Strangelove".)
posted by McCoy Pauley at 10:15 AM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


I... dunno. A few years ago there was another film made by a director who'd been written off, starring two actors with indisputable talent but who'd been dismissed as unemployable, one for his attitude, the other for his drinking and drug-taking and his attitude. All three of them weren't just once-bankable, they'd been among the biggest names in the business. Now they were on the scrap-heap, and apparently had every reason to be there.

I've seen that comparison made before, but by that point Downey Jr had a really substantial body of work behind him, though - an awful lot more than Lohan, who was never one of the biggest names in the business. Mean Girls is a fun movie, but the belief that Lohan has some massive wellspring of talent based on it (or any of her other movies) has never made any sense to me. She's perfectly fine in those earlier roles, but they don't make you mourn for the loss to acting as much for the waste of a life.

Kiss Kiss Bang Bang is a fun movie, though.
posted by lesbiassparrow at 10:15 AM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


Why would trash can bags hug trash can lids?
posted by DU at 10:16 AM on January 10, 2013 [6 favorites]


Lohan may have a lot of problems with her life, but at least she doesn't make her money out of the porn industry like James Deen.

Go back to Plymouth Colony with that puritanical bullshit. Give me a polite and professional porn actor of prima donna nonsense any day.
posted by absalom at 10:16 AM on January 10, 2013 [54 favorites]


..."we as a human race probably deserve whatever hellish chaotic vortex might arise from any project with Bret Easton Ellis and Lindsay Lohan"...

Holy shit that's funny, and more so because I thought the exact same thing before I even clicked on the article.

Hope those guys don't run out of Bolivian marching powder or that project will never get finished.
posted by PuppyCat at 10:21 AM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


I'm hoping that Deen returns to working with professionals soon.
posted by delfin at 10:23 AM on January 10, 2013 [10 favorites]


Go back to Plymouth Colony with that puritanical bullshit. Give me a polite and professional porn actor of prima donna nonsense any day.

People here are having a pop at Schrader, Ellis and Lohan's personalities or habits, but I'm just suggesting that the average LA pornographer, for whom James Deen is politely happy to work, is probably a guy you'd want to avoid more than them.
posted by colie at 10:24 AM on January 10, 2013


The whole thing just made me sad.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 10:31 AM on January 10, 2013 [7 favorites]


I don't understand the kind of gleeful hatred that Lohan inspires. Is it simply based on the idea that she won the genetic lottery in the looks department and that this therefore means that every bad thing that has happened to her since is obviously and solely "her fault"? How many times do we have to see the crazy-stage-parents, fucked-up-child-star script play out before we gain at least a measure of compassion for the many, many people who fail to get out of that process unscathed? I don't know if Lohan's comment in the article about her father giving her lots of practice in responding to physical abuse is a glimpse into the reality of her upbringing or simply self-dramatization, but I don't think anyone who has read anything at all about Lohan's parents could find it remotely surprising that their child has psychological and emotional problems.

And, no, I'm not saying that everyone with bad parents automatically gets a free pass on every shitty thing they do in their lives, but there's a pretty wide range between that and laughingly laying odds as to whether or not she'll make it to 30.
posted by yoink at 10:31 AM on January 10, 2013 [49 favorites]


> Is there a quick trick to quickly load all pages when they only want to serve you the first?

Look for the "print" icon. Printer-ready pages are often stripped of graphics, too.
posted by mmrtnt at 10:32 AM on January 10, 2013


Why would trash can bags hug trash can lids?

I think it's a euphemism for some new sexual technique developed in the Valley that will form the basis of a self-published best-selling book in 2013.
posted by KokuRyu at 10:39 AM on January 10, 2013


I don't understand the kind of gleeful hatred that Lohan inspires. Is it simply based on the idea that she won the genetic lottery in the looks department and that this therefore means that every bad thing that has happened to her since is obviously and solely "her fault"?

I think there's a certain satisfaction in knowing that even though said genetic lottery exists, whether or not you are a reliable and decent human being is still at least partly a factor in success vs. failure.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:40 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


People here are having a pop at Schrader, Ellis and Lohan's personalities or habits, but I'm just suggesting that the average LA pornographer, for whom James Deen is politely happy to work, is probably a guy you'd want to avoid more than them.

He does quite a bit of work with Kink.com, who seem to be an ethical, values-based outfit that follows the quadruple bottom-line. Much nicer than many mainstream film production companies that willingly put crew at risk to make a shot.
posted by KokuRyu at 10:42 AM on January 10, 2013 [3 favorites]


She's waiting to join the 27 Club?

It's a testament to the damage she's done to herself when you look at her and then remember that she's only 26. She looks 36 in many pictures.

She really is a tragic figure. Great actress? Probably not. Good actress? Yes. And one with great potential. The rapidity in which the wheels came off is truly stunning, and I cannot bring myself to pin it all on her. It's pretty clear she was enabled over the cliff.
posted by Thorzdad at 10:44 AM on January 10, 2013 [10 favorites]


whether or not you are a reliable and decent human being is still at least partly a factor in success vs. failure.

As it says in the article, nobody goes to see a film because they've heard the lead actor is decent and reliable.

He does quite a bit of work with Kink.com, who seem to be an ethical, values-based outfit


According to this database, James Deen has appeared in 1,360 films, of which precisely 5 were produced by Kink.com.

I'm all for a bit of rumpy-pumpy, but I think it matters that James Deen's cash comes from the usual suspects in a shitty, abusive industry littered with far more exploitative and unpleasant characters than Lindsay Lohan or Bret Easton Ellis, yet he usually gets a free pass on here.
posted by colie at 10:48 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


The mainstream film industry is pretty well stocked with unpleasant characters too. That they are unpleasant characters with money doesn't change their nature.
posted by Justinian at 10:59 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


I'm all for a bit of rumpy-pumpy, but I think it matters that James Deen's cash comes from the usual suspects in a shitty, abusive industry littered with far more exploitative and unpleasant characters than Lindsay Lohan or Bret Easton Ellis, yet he usually gets a free pass on here.

Who's the worst bunch of people in LA: porn or non-porn producers, is not a winnable argument.

it's actually kind of shocking to me that they can't make money on $250,000 down on this, I mean, there has to be at least $250,000 in creep-o's on the internet willing to pay to see Lohan in a non-X-rated four way with Deen. Not to mention the lulz...
posted by ennui.bz at 11:00 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


As it says in the article, nobody goes to see a film because they've heard the lead actor is decent and reliable.

Completely true. But as Lohan's career makes clear, if you can't manage to be a decent and reliable human being, it can make it nigh-on impossible to get cast in films in the first place.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 11:02 AM on January 10, 2013


I don't understand the kind of gleeful hatred that Lohan inspires

I think the brilliant South Park episode Britney's New Look explains it best. It's ritual sacrifice, we are watching the maiden being torn apart by the Jaguar God. You can watch it here.
posted by Nelson at 11:12 AM on January 10, 2013 [19 favorites]


Weirdly, Schrader's firing off the 'Exorcist' sequel resulted in *two* pretty good films: Renny Harlin's skillful piece of enjoyable trash and Schrader's interesting and more thoughtful version, which was later completed and released.
posted by eugenen at 11:13 AM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


nobody goes to see a film because they've heard the lead actor is decent and reliable.

But being decent and reliable can get you cast often enough to sustain a major career, cf. Keanu Reeves.
posted by Ndwright at 11:15 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


All substantial issues aside, this woman is a publicity machine. Astonishing that she gets so much press relative to so little work. Her personal life is just too sad to discuss - if all this gets played out in public, I cringe over what goes on in private.
posted by Space Kitty at 11:15 AM on January 10, 2013


Two words: MUST-SEE TRAINWRECK
posted by rhizome at 11:23 AM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


It's pretty clear she was enabled over the cliff.

I can't help but look at her, the Olsen twins, Miley Cyrus, Beiber, and a long chain of broken childhood stars without thinking that Hollywood is literally killing children for $$$.
posted by Devils Rancher at 11:41 AM on January 10, 2013 [5 favorites]


In 2006, she was the best thing in Robert Altman’s “Prairie Home Companion.”

Had to stop reading there.


Indeed. Her presence basically ruined that movie, and Bobby. From everything I've seen her in, it seems like she just plain can not act. On film, she always comes across as an actor reciting lines, and never as a believably real human being. That's kind of a problem.

I hope she surprises me someday with a stellar performance. But mostly I hope she retires early to a safe, stable life away from the TMZ vultures.
posted by Sys Rq at 11:50 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


I can't help but look at her, the Olsen twins, Miley Cyrus, Beiber, and a long chain of broken childhood stars without thinking that Hollywood is literally killing children for $$$.

See Nelson's comment above about the brilliant South Park episode that dramatizes this complaint literally.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 11:50 AM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


I can't help but look at her, the Olsen twins, Miley Cyrus, Beiber, and a long chain of broken childhood stars without thinking that Hollywood is literally killing children for $$$.

The Olsen twins managed to rally OK- they run several fashion lines and keep out of trouble. They certainly don't court publicity the way Lohan & Co seem to.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 11:51 AM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


is there a way to read this without having to buy a nytimes online subscription ?
posted by spicynuts at 12:14 PM on January 10, 2013


I could read just fine... hey I wonder if the old mefi1/mefi1 username/password from so many years ago still works?
posted by yellowbinder at 12:17 PM on January 10, 2013


Nope!
posted by yellowbinder at 12:18 PM on January 10, 2013


is there a way to read this without having to buy a nytimes online subscription ?

Trim the URL (delete everything after the '?') and clear your cookies. Or access it from a browser in private/incognito mode.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 12:19 PM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


Maybe try clicking through from here.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 12:22 PM on January 10, 2013


In 2006, she was the best thing in Robert Altman’s “Prairie Home Companion.”

Had to stop reading there.


Yeah, seriously. That (dangerously underrated) movie has Lily Tomlin and Meryl Streep singing impeccable folk songs while Lindsay Lohan barely manages to sleepwalk through her scenes.
posted by zvs at 12:29 PM on January 10, 2013 [3 favorites]


I have a lot of empathy for Lohan. I'm not sure she's a great actress, but she was dealt a pretty bad hand with the wildcard of her beauty, and unfortunately that's a wildcard that's pretty common in Hollywood.
posted by maxwelton at 12:41 PM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


They certainly don't court publicity the way Lohan & Co seem to.

Aside from killing Heath Ledger, but indeed they have found a way to make money that doesn't involve said courting of publicity, where Lohan despite trying is still a step away from being a Kardashian.

And seeing I've commented I'll echo the sentiments that she was by far the worst thing about Prairie Home Companion which was an otherwise beautiful film! Goddamnit. That said, this story made me feel rather sorry for her, as she seemed doomed from the beginning with parents who are such trainwrecks, and her inability to sever ties with them, or at least her father!
posted by opsin at 12:44 PM on January 10, 2013


Never undervalue the importance of being a decent person to work with on a daily basis. After all, the movie industry (porn or non) is an industry, only a tiny little percentage of the people employed in the industry show up on screen or have their name become well-known, and if you can't get through a movie without pissing everybody else off, you'll eventually be hired only by other people who are just like you, and working with people just like you, and the end result is that you'll do a crap job, your movies with suck, and you'll need a new industry to work in.

Remember, a movie industry person's resume isn't just a list of the body of work they've done: it's a reference that helps other people in the industry know how hard you are to work with, largely on the basis of how the quality of your movies are trending and who's been willing to work with you lately. Even once-huge-but-now-almost-unknown actors can keep working steadily with quality people on quality projects, if they're of a similar bent.
posted by davejay at 1:15 PM on January 10, 2013 [3 favorites]


By coincidence, I saw "Mean Girls" for the first time a couple of days ago. I didn't know anything about Lohan except what I'd seen in the news about her problems. I was quite amazed at how she carried that movie, and it made me interested in her for the first time. Great supporting cast, too, mind you.
posted by No Robots at 1:19 PM on January 10, 2013


I have a lot of empathy for Lohan. I'm not sure she's a great actress, but she was dealt a pretty bad hand with the wildcard of her beauty, and unfortunately that's a wildcard that's pretty common in Hollywood.

I'm not sure I understand this. Obviously there are plenty of popular, rich, beautiful young actresses that don't totally melt down and become uninsurable disasters. (I was worried for Emma Watson [Hermione in the 'Harry Potter' films] for a while, but she seems to be making smart choices and doing just fine.) To me it seems like Lohan was totally unprepared for what was coming her way and surrounded herself with the wrong people, with a side of addiction and maybe mental illness. Which is not uncommon and not undeserving of empathy, but it's not like her beauty was some sort of curse.

Mean Girls was great.
posted by eugenen at 1:22 PM on January 10, 2013


I read the piece this morning and found it fascinating. Though the movie itself sounds terrible and the trailers aren't serving to convince me otherwise. When my parents were in town we watched Liz & Dick and while I thought it was a complete trainwreck they enjoyed in a non-snide kind of way. Which was maybe more interesting than the movie itself.

In some ways, I feel badly for Lindsay Lohan in the same way I feel badly for anyone who had an abusive childhood. But I also tend to think you can't use it as an excuse forever and at some point need to get your shit together or... don't. I don't think she will and that's sad on a human level. She 's reasonably talented and was once really pretty but so are many other people in Hollywood. She's not super special that way.

James Deen comes off really well in this piece, but as it says, he has a rep for being a pro. And I'm preeeeetty sure he's done more than 5 films for Kink.com (someone might have borrowed my computer and whaddya know there they are...). I'm not clicking on that link, but I suspect they think of a movie slightly differently than what Kink produces on their website.
posted by marylynn at 1:38 PM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


"Aside from killing Heath Ledger"

what
posted by mr_crash_davis at 1:39 PM on January 10, 2013


freakazoid:
"Two words: MUST SEE.
Two other words: TRAIN WRECK.
"

You know, I am the kind of chap that will rubberneck a train wreck a bit, as long as I don't get rousted by the bulls.
posted by Samizdata at 1:44 PM on January 10, 2013


opsin is referring, with some hyperbole, to the scuttlebutt that the pills on which Ledger overdosed were said to come from Mary-Kate Olsen.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:45 PM on January 10, 2013


"Aside from killing Heath Ledger"

what


The last thing he heard was 'You're in big trouble, mister!'
posted by FatherDagon at 1:45 PM on January 10, 2013 [9 favorites]


I too sympathize with Lohan, and I don't see why people hate her. She's not even a massive trainwreck, and even if she was so what? When did people stop idolizing drugged out trainwrecks? Is it when Hunter S Thompson died? When rock and roll was replaced by DJs and Mumford and Sons? At best we should sympathize with a mentally ill young woman and at worst we should love her for being a total trashbag party monster.
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 1:46 PM on January 10, 2013 [5 favorites]


And I'm preeeeetty sure he's done more than 5 films for Kink.com

Kink.com also has a jillionty different sub-domains for more specific things, so his works likely aren't all listed under the main company.
posted by FatherDagon at 1:47 PM on January 10, 2013


I don't see why people hate her

I think it's more that people love to hate all celebrities for one reason or another (especially female celebrities). Lohan is 'hated' for being a drunken party girl. I recently read a post all about how Zooey Dechanel's bangs DRIVE PEOPLE CRAZY. It seems even stranger to hate on a celebrity because their bangs don't conform to your ideal aesthetic.

When did people stop idolizing drugged out trainwrecks?

I have a theory that drugged out trainwrecks lose sympathy when they start drunk driving. That's become, like, over the line for modern culture (which is probably a good thing). Also, rich people shoplifting (understandably) pisses people off vicariously.
posted by muddgirl at 1:55 PM on January 10, 2013


Why? Shoplifting is just a thing rebellious or messed up kids do.
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 2:01 PM on January 10, 2013


But I think when *rich* people, or people perceived as rich, shoplift, there's an element of rich entitlement that pisses people off. Like, "Wynona Rider is so rich and famous, she thinks she can get away with anything, which is why she steals." I'm not saying it's right. I'm just saying it's understandable for people to feel that way.
posted by muddgirl at 2:05 PM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


Just wanna say I recently tried Ellis' Lunar Park again and actually busted my nuts in half laughing at it, it's amazing. And I'm always happy to admit that Glamorama is one of my favourite novels. He's a comic writer, guys, get with it. I am pretty certain inside my brain that the only reason he is doing this is so that he can write a big insider-type book about Hollywood next. It's research. (Yeah I know he's done film work heaps in the past, it was all leading up to this.)
posted by turgid dahlia 2 at 2:05 PM on January 10, 2013


Who cares. Deen works with a other companies that are not Kink.com but neither of those points proves anything. I'm sure there are murderers that go to church on Sundays. Personally as an end consumer I care whether he can deliver a credible performance.
It reminds me of how people talk about Sasha Grey and how brilliant she is but that didn't do anything for her performance in The Girlfriend Experience which was achingly bad. Her saving grace in Entourage was that she had the mildly easy job of playing herself.
posted by P.o.B. at 2:06 PM on January 10, 2013


I don't want to see this movie.

I want to see the movie that was made about the making of this movie, "Three Weeks in July".
posted by Mad_Carew at 2:20 PM on January 10, 2013 [7 favorites]


"Aside from killing Heath Ledger"

what


Backstory.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 2:29 PM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


> I think the brilliant South Park episode Britney's New Look explains it best.

Now I understand everything. Retus... hote homnibus...
posted by languagehat at 2:43 PM on January 10, 2013


I first met Schrader in 2009 while he was trying to get a combined Bollywood-Hollywood thriller starring Leonardo DiCaprio made.

I must see this movie.
posted by dhartung at 2:51 PM on January 10, 2013


He's a comic writer, guys, get with it.

"It's satire!" has never made bad satire into good.
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 2:58 PM on January 10, 2013 [4 favorites]


I read this with great interest this morning and am so glad to see it posted here. I am the same age as Lindsay Lohan and idolized her when the Parent Trap came out, and then Mean Girls a few years later. I thought she was naturally beautiful, not too thin (this was before she started looking like this), and a good actress, which set her apart from a lot of the other young actresses gracing TV and film at the time. The Vanity Fair cover came out and I think since then it has all gone down hill for her--I don't think she has ever looked as beautiful as she did on that cover, and after all her plastic surgery and substance abuse, I don't think she ever will again. It's really all very sad.

For years I remained a steadfast fan, hoping for LiLo's comeback that has never come. I'm happy she's getting work again and hope that, as she said in the article, she really is trying to turn her life around. I can relate to her on so many levels (dysfunctional family and abusive father a big one) that I too do not understand the gleeful vitriol others heap on her. I will keep quietly cheerleading, and hope she lives a long life (jokes about the "27 club" are truly tasteless, imo). Thanks, Horace Rumpole.
posted by nonmerci at 2:59 PM on January 10, 2013 [4 favorites]


Meanwhile, Selena Gomez is just trolling the parents of girls just entering their rebellious phase.
posted by KokuRyu at 3:21 PM on January 10, 2013


These behind-the-scenes Hollywood pieces are like candy--I can't stop reading. Thanks for the link.
posted by zardoz at 4:25 PM on January 10, 2013


> I hope she surprises me someday with a stellar performance. But mostly I hope she retires early to a safe, stable life away from the TMZ vultures.

Doing what? I agree with you, but it's not like she could just take an office job somewhere and I doubt she has anywhere near enough money to retire on. I really don't understand how she keeps herself afloat financially right now, let alone in the future.
posted by The Card Cheat at 4:37 PM on January 10, 2013


I haven't watched the trailers yet, but after reading the whole thing, it sounds like it could be an ok film. I mean, I could get through a boring opening segment if it then gets good and doesn't focus entirely on Lohan like the writer states. How bad can it be?
posted by mathowie at 4:58 PM on January 10, 2013


I think of all the red flags, the fact that there were no reshoots is the scariest, when it comes to movie quality. A universally-acknowledge boring opening segment should be fixed, period. A good movie can have a bad opening, but if they can't fix that then what other serious flaws are they ignoring? And looking at the trailer, it looks like they didn't really have time for multiple takes at all. The line readings really are very poor.

But heck, maybe Schrader will pull a Wiseau and claim that it's an intentional piece of satire, or something.
posted by muddgirl at 5:11 PM on January 10, 2013


"It's satire!" has never made bad satire into good.

I think it's funny. I don't know if it's satire or vaudeville or if it's just amusing Weird Al songs, but it makes me laugh. He really takes the piss out of himself in Lunar Park, too. I think it's grand. Haven't read Imperial Bedrooms thought and don't believe I will, I found his first three books pretty annoying even when I was 15. American Psycho and Glamorama and Lunar Park are enough for me.
posted by turgid dahlia 2 at 5:24 PM on January 10, 2013


Paul Schrader has earned a lifetime pass from Taxi Driver alone and between him and BEE this film will at least be interesting. Hopefully in a nihilistic and alienated way.
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 5:26 PM on January 10, 2013


It'd be great if this broke James Deen's career into the mainstream, thereby saving him from the big bad evil porn industry peoples.
posted by mannequito at 5:27 PM on January 10, 2013


I think Lindsay Lohan has charisma, not acting ability. And, like most child stars, she's just too under-educated and out-of-touch to play adult roles believably in either movies or real life.
posted by fshgrl at 5:33 PM on January 10, 2013 [3 favorites]


I am not usually sympathetic to assholes, but Lohan seems so doomed that I can't help it. She's been surrounded by enabling leeches her entire life and there's no one close to her who will call her on her shit because she's their paycheck/gateway to celebrity life. She was adorable in Parent Trap. It is sad what she has become.
posted by missmerrymack at 5:37 PM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


I feel sorry for Lohan. She got dealt a difficult hand. Yes, I know, other people also get bad hands, and some of them succeed despite everything, but many of them don't and they just don't fail in the public eye like Lohan has.
posted by jeather at 5:43 PM on January 10, 2013


turgid dahlia 2, sorry for being so rude. I guess it was the "get with it" that made my eye twitch. Like his critics haven't figured out what he's going for after twenty-eight years.

Anyhoo, his sensibility probably works better in movies, so I want to see the one this crew's making.
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 5:59 PM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


Looking this up lead me to Resurrected, which I need to see now:

On paper, Paul Schrader's mind-meltingly odd new film, Adam Resurrected, sounds disconcertingly like The Day The Clown Cried, the notorious unreleased Jerry Lewis monstrosity about a clown who leads children into the gas chambers at Auschwitz. Actually, to give Schrader and co-conspirator Jeff Goldblum full credit for their lunatic ambition, Adam may be even crazier than Lewis' comedy-drama; for all its surreal bad taste, Clown probably doesn't feature a protagonist with psychic gifts, a burning bush in the Israeli desert, and a feral wolf-boy who forms a strong emotional bond with a man who lived extensively in the role of a dog in a concentration camp. Yes, Resurrected has the potential to be not just awful, but a crime against cinema, taste, and solid judgment. Not being offensively terrible consequently counts as one of the film's strongest virtues.

In a stunning lead performance, Goldblum stars as a brilliant, apolitical jester whose wife and family end up in the concentration camps of Nazi Germany. Goldblum survives by reluctantly agreeing to act as the pet dog of warped fan Willem Dafoe, a Nazi officer who remembers Goldblum's pre-camp fame and exploits his gift for physical comedy in the creepiest manner imaginable. After the war, Goldblum lives in an Israeli mental hospital for Holocaust survivors, where he carries on a sordid affair with one of the nurses and becomes a curious father figure to a dog-boy who blossoms under his tutelage.

posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 6:12 PM on January 10, 2013 [5 favorites]


Not to pile on, but I don't understand why Colie is shitting on James Deen, the only person who comes off as a total professional from this piece. Yes, he works with a lot of disreputable people in his day job, and that was probably a great practice for working with a bunch of flaky, disreputable, egocentric people.

I have a lot of friends in the industry, and they're all catty bitches (that's a gender-free 'catty bitches', mind you) who love to talk shit and throw shade on everyone else in the industry, and none of them have anything bad to say about JD. Personally, I'll go as far as to say his near-ubiquity in the mainstream alt porn world is interfering with my enjoyment of a lot of scenes, but I'm kind of a contrarian asshole, and not very into porn "stars". I feel like I can recognize his whole sexual repertoire before a scene starts, and porn is predictable enough without that.
posted by elr at 7:23 PM on January 10, 2013


People don't like Lindsay Lohan because she has blamed "big black guys" several times for things it turned out she did, she has almost run people over in LA AND New York and acted like it wasn't her fault, she's stolen things and acted like it wasn't her fault, it's more than drug use. I don't enjoy watching terrible things happen to her but it's hard for me to have sympathy for her with the racism and constant disdain for people in service roles, etc that she seems to show.

I agree she's been dealt a pretty bad hand, but it's kind of weird that people keep saying things like "where are her parents?" when she is 26. I know it can be difficult to get out under the thumb of those things but there are plenty of 26 year olds in jail, on welfare, etc that made a lot of the mistakes she made but because they're not her they face much bigger consequences than she does.

I know it might be impossible for her to ever see she needs a way out of her current life, but I hope she does see it and I don't want anything bad to happen to her. But I don't think "let's tear down the beautiful people" is the only thing at play here.
posted by sweetkid at 7:32 PM on January 10, 2013 [7 favorites]


Wow, I had no idea so many people liked the Prairie Home Companion movie. Glad to see that it's not just me.
posted by Halloween Jack at 7:35 PM on January 10, 2013


It's pretty sad that Schrader has to go through all this to get a film made. I feel like once you've reached a certain level of creative accomplishment somebody - maybe the State, maybe rich donors - should take care of you and fund whatever you need. Perhaps that's what Kickstarter is, but it's not enough. We need to preserve these treasures.
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 9:11 PM on January 10, 2013 [2 favorites]


DirtyOldTown: But as Lohan's career makes clear, if you can't manage to be a decent and reliable human being, it can make it nigh-on impossible to get cast in films in the first place.
Did you just say the exact opposite of what you meant to say? Because at 25 film credits, despite being Hollywood's biggest train wreck, the truth is the opposite of what you said.
posted by IAmBroom at 9:20 PM on January 10, 2013


She's gone from being cast in big box office first run movies to made for TV schlockfests, shitty aimless horror movies, and now this. If you can't see the downward trajectory of her career, I would strongly recommend you see an optometrist.
posted by to sir with millipedes at 9:46 PM on January 10, 2013 [1 favorite]


There are a few shitty actors who apparently keep getting roles because they're nice, decent people - Keanu Reeves comes to mind. I tend to hold to the rough 'more of an asshole = better artist' formula, but that might work better for directors and music producers and singers than actors.
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 9:53 PM on January 10, 2013


Never undervalue the importance of being a decent person to work with on a daily basis. After all, the movie industry (porn or non) is an industry, only a tiny little percentage of the people employed in the industry show up on screen or have their name become well-known, and if you can't get through a movie without pissing everybody else off, you'll eventually be hired only by other people who are just like you, and working with people just like you, and the end result is that you'll do a crap job, your movies with suck, and you'll need a new industry to work in.

Remember, a movie industry person's resume isn't just a list of the body of work they've done: it's a reference that helps other people in the industry know how hard you are to work with, largely on the basis of how the quality of your movies are trending and who's been willing to work with you lately. Even once-huge-but-now-almost-unknown actors can keep working steadily with quality people on quality projects, if they're of a similar bent.


This. I'm no great name or talent, but I've crewed a lot of stuff in my time with just about anyone you can name. Whether through luck, ability or personality I've gotten to the point where I can pick and choose projects. I have and will continue to turn down work with talent, directors and producers who are nightmares to work with. I can go work somewhere pleasant for 18 hour days, thank you very much, I don't need to worry about stepping in the star's puke or having to usher her endless entourage of worthless hangers-on out of my way or out of the way of my lights ever again, thankfully. The same goes for all my crewmates, who will also not hesitate to turn down projects like this in a heartbeat. You will, as an asshole in the business, eventually wind up relegating yourself to working with the bottom of the barrel in every conceivable way.
posted by nevercalm at 5:33 AM on January 11, 2013 [1 favorite]


These stories just make me sad. I've got kids ranging in age from 4 to 10, so that means we've seen several arcs of Disney kids unfold on the TV sets in our household. We watched in real time as Miley and Demi went from sweet little girls to troubled near-adults, and now I look at the newly minted ones like Bella and China and think, okay, how long until they've used her up and spit her out, too? I just don't understand why any parent would wish celebrity upon their kid.

I don't blame Lindsay or any other former child star for their failures. They were failed by the adults that were supposed to protect them from the world until they were old enough to protect themselves.
posted by jbickers at 5:37 AM on January 11, 2013 [2 favorites]


I think people hate her because she is 26 but acts 5 and it's annoying. She lets her parents use and abuse her and then blames everyone else for her actions. She needs to get into deep talk therapy, cut off ties with her parents, cut off ties with Hollywood as an actress, and stop hanging with people who use her in general. She acts like life is one big suprise to her and she plays victim. She takes no awareness for her illnesses, no steps towards treatment unless it's forced upon her, and is codependent on her parents beyond words.

Do I think Michael abused the mom (latest story buzz) and her. Hell yea. He is well known to be violent. Do I think the mom is her major problem right now? Yes. That scuzbag lady is trying to live a 20 year old famous life through her daughter and gives two shits about her wellbeing beyond what is it it for me. I mean the mom goes to The Canyons discussion and sits nearby listening? What sane mother at Lindsay's age would do that? What sane daughter would allow that?

It's beyond sad how her life has become. And we all get beyond annoyed that she has/had so much potential and is throwing her life away. I'm not even talking about the drugs/drink issues. I'm talking about her codependence issues. I found it beyond sad that it seems she cannot be alone nor face rejection without a complete meltdown and desperation (which allows for others to say "meal ticket" to her behavior).

She's going to end up like Barbara Payton.
posted by stormpooper at 7:41 AM on January 11, 2013 [2 favorites]


I don't find Lindsay Lohan annoying at all.

She looks like she has a lot of fun when not doing her job, and how many of us enjoy doing our jobs? I'd love to hang out with her. And even in these abysmal trailers she totally owns the screen.
posted by colie at 8:27 AM on January 11, 2013 [1 favorite]


It was the sobbing of a child lost in the woods.

Indeed.
posted by fiercecupcake at 8:31 AM on January 11, 2013


She looks like she has a lot of fun when not doing her job

Wait, upthread you condemn the entire pornography industry but here you're saying you want to hang out with Lindsey Lohan? What seems particularly like fun with her? The arrests for theft, the DUIs, or the assaults? Or maybe you prefer the massive drug binges and occasional rushes to the hospital with near fatal overdoses? Clearly she's a barrel of laughs.
posted by Nelson at 8:37 AM on January 11, 2013 [8 favorites]


Wait, upthread you condemn the entire pornography industry but here you're saying you want to hang out with Lindsey Lohan?

Isn't it OK to not like the porn industry at the same time as liking Lindsay Lohan?

She has not been convicted of assault and the other stuff you list is just the usual mayhem that accompanies your life when you get out of your mind a lot, same as Robert Downey Jr.
posted by colie at 8:48 AM on January 11, 2013 [2 favorites]


usual mayhem that accompanies your life when you get out of your mind a lot, same as Robert Downey Jr.

Wow.

I get out of my mind a lot and I haven't been to court for DUIs, assaults, or waking up in someone else's house. I also haven't been to jail. I also haven't sobbed in a hallway because I was late to my job due to my partying and got yelled at by my boss.


When I do get out of my mind a lot, I usually go on Metafilter and read comments that make me laugh.

I also meme the shit out of every experience I have in one day. Grumpy Cat, oh how you save my sanity.

That's it! Maybe Lindsay should read more Grumpy Cat memes.
posted by stormpooper at 9:47 AM on January 11, 2013 [2 favorites]


I get out of my mind a lot and I haven't been to court for DUIs, assaults, or waking up in someone else's house. I also haven't been to jail. I also haven't sobbed in a hallway because I was late to my job due to my partying and got yelled at by my boss.

A single drink driving incident does not make you one of the bad guys. The nightclub fight charge has not been proven and the jailing came from missing appointments with parole for the DUI. None of the rest is of any consequence.

I do think she sets off disproportionate amounts of hate - over at the Daily Mail they are running this same story and the comments thread is full of 'train wreck' and 'I hate her.' I don't think it's because of her run-ins with the law.
posted by colie at 10:11 AM on January 11, 2013 [1 favorite]


She is a celebrity-journalism whipping-person. They love those, and give these activities way more exposure and critique than they warrant. Frankly, as someone who doesn't pay attention to celebrity journalism, whenever I have cause to reflect on what's gone on I'm left with "that's it?" If anything, the level of publicity for her problems seems to be inversely proportional to the significance, and may simply be motivated by laziness. "If she keeps going down this path, we're going to have to find another fuckup and work to establish their significance to the celebritymag-reading population."
posted by rhizome at 10:19 AM on January 11, 2013 [1 favorite]


Interestingly, there is now an audio clip of Lohan saying to Deen on the set "Please James, say your line as you're walking over ... cause we're doing rehearsal ... do your f*cking job," and the press are reporting it as a 'tantrum'.

It actually sounds more like she's becoming frustrated at trying to get Deen to do some acting, something she is very experienced at, rather than politely adjusting the garbage can liners before going off to shoot his 1,361st ultra-hardcore porn film.
posted by colie at 10:34 AM on January 11, 2013


to sir with millipedes: She's gone from being cast in big box office first run movies to made for TV schlockfests, shitty aimless horror movies, and now this.
You didn't claim she was getting worse jobs; you claimed she couldn't get work. She's getting work, and your personal opinion of the quality of the scripts she's accepted has nothing to do with the fact that you just proved you're wrong. (Liz & Dick, for instance, was highly publicized, and probably paid pretty well).
posted by IAmBroom at 11:38 AM on January 11, 2013 [1 favorite]


That was my first comment in the thread. I never claimed she couldn't get work. You must have me confused with someone else.
posted by to sir with millipedes at 12:32 PM on January 11, 2013


A single drink driving incident does not make you one of the bad guys.

First of all, yes, it does.

And there was more than one.
posted by Sys Rq at 12:38 PM on January 11, 2013 [7 favorites]


Way more than one. And that's not even counting the jewelry theft, car hijacking, and so many, many other incidents criminal or just tacky. I'm not understanding this breathless defense of a mediocre actress (who, again, I have been a great fan of and still have affection for) while vilifying a by all accounts pleasant and professional porn star.
posted by yellowbinder at 12:43 PM on January 11, 2013 [2 favorites]


The tradition of the Great Internet Contrarian must continue to enlighten the rest of us still chained up in the cave, that's why.
posted by absalom at 1:06 PM on January 11, 2013 [2 favorites]


It's really hard to make a movie that people want to see and talk about, and it looks like Schrader and Lohan have failed miserably. All that stuff with scripts and ideas etc.

But at least they gave it a shot, rather than made porn.
posted by colie at 1:20 PM on January 11, 2013


Actually I do want to see it. Despite the drama, 1) this could be her shot at something big but honestly, I doubt it. Disaster of her character fits her but I think her acting is...well...bad. and 2) I want to see it because James Deen is yummy. There. I said it.

What's your hangup about porn? Ever see his films? The girls have a great time in it and he's a very desired porn star in the industry. Sorry if your vision of it is tainted by Kahn Tusion-like films (which are brutal and yea, a turn off). James' stuff? Good times.
posted by stormpooper at 1:28 PM on January 11, 2013


to sir with millipedes: That was my first comment in the thread. I never claimed she couldn't get work. You must have me confused with someone else.
My apologies. DirtyOldTown made the comment I replied to, and I thought you were then refuting my statement.
posted by IAmBroom at 1:46 PM on January 11, 2013


What's your hangup about porn? Ever see his films? The girls have a great time in it

Well I guess we don't need another "porn: good or bad?" thread, but I don't think a central part of that debate has ever been whether the female performers enjoy the work or not.

It seems that James Deen has a reputation on here for doing a sort of modern non-exploitative porn, but I did try to point out earlier that the vast majority of his films do not seem to fit that description - it seems that only 5 of his 1,363 films were made by kink.com. Posters here did not correct me on that figure, they just refused to accept it.

I just think the pressure Lohan was under to make the film work was enormous, because it all depended on her, whereas Deen was just trying something new.
posted by colie at 1:50 PM on January 11, 2013


colie: I don't think a central part of that debate has ever been whether the female performers enjoy the work or not.
It has been discussed almost every single time, and many, many performers have repeatedly said they do, both during and after their careers, at interviews, in personal statements, and on blogs.

Against this mountain of evidence, we have ... well, nothing, really.
posted by IAmBroom at 1:57 PM on January 11, 2013


Nobody seemed too invested in whether I enjoyed the work of being a grocery store cashier in high school. Sometimes you do a job because you want the money and not out of a sense of deep personal satisfaction.
posted by Justinian at 2:43 PM on January 11, 2013 [1 favorite]


I'm thinking a fair amount of Lohan's shine in Mean Girls was actually reflected light from McAdams.
posted by Burhanistan at 3:10 PM on January 11, 2013 [5 favorites]


@IAmBroom I thought it was obvious I didn't intend to claim Lohan wasn't getting into any films. There are always desperate people willing to put her in something. But unless you're of the opinion that La Lohan could get cast in A-list films these days, but simply chooses basic cable schlock and microbudgets, you'd have to admit there was a serious drop in the quality of her job offers and it's fairly obvious why that is: she is a troublesome and unreliable person.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 3:19 PM on January 11, 2013


I didn't actually see Liz & Dick but I enjoyed the hell out of the Fug the Fromage coverage.

Lindsay has never really registered with me, I don't think I've seen a single one of her movies, but from the way she conducts herself I have no sympathy for her. Why anyone would want to put up with her shit is beyond me. Schrader knew what he was getting when he cast her. He deserved all the aggravation, and all the torment she caused. Sounds like Deen, on the other hand, did not deserve the pain of having to put up with her behavior. I wish him well and hope he gets a another chance at non-porn with a good director and a professional cast.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:01 PM on January 11, 2013 [1 favorite]


You know, I think the Jezebel article on this has it right: Lindsay is just an asshole. I feel sorry for her with her upbringing, but she's 26 damn years old and she refuses to stop spending money, she doesn't pay her debts, she flakes, she DRIVES DRUNK, REPEATEDLY, and she acts like an asshole. Unabashedly so. And dumb. She can act, but she's dumb.

I no longer have hope that she'll "clean up" someday and I no longer have sympathy for her as an adult. She doesn't seem to have it in her to clean up her life--god knows she doesn't have the desire to--and there's nothing nice left about her to salvage anyway. She's just an asshole and someday will probably kill someone with her drunk driving. I guess that's what it'll take to stop her. Or joining the 27 Club, one or the other.

It's just sad. But I give up. Assholes be assholes, and that's what she wants to be.
posted by jenfullmoon at 4:15 PM on January 11, 2013 [1 favorite]


I still want to see the movie, because even this article made it sound good. If you stopped liking things made by drunken assholes you'd have a pretty bad music collection.
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 5:37 PM on January 11, 2013


it seems that only 5 of his 1,363 films were made by kink.com. Posters here did not correct me on that figure, they just refused to accept it.

Yes they did. A couple of people have pointed out that he has made far more than 5 videos with kink, and that your source is incorrect. I will be another - I am 100% sure that he has done more than 5 things for kink and its various subsites.
posted by flaterik at 5:45 PM on January 11, 2013


Music made by drunken assholes is like, what, Metallica and Van Halen? Old country & western?

I think much more great music can be traced back to heroin and lsd.
posted by mannequito at 5:53 PM on January 11, 2013


Yes they did. A couple of people have pointed out that he has made far more than 5 videos with kink, and that your source is incorrect. I will be another - I am 100% sure that he has done more than 5 things for kink and its various subsites.

Only one site seems to compile a complete database of this stuff and it can be found at www.rame.net. Therefore that's the source for the 5 out of 1,363 movies. Until anyone comes up with a different and more accurate set of stats, I can only go on that. I will be happy to be corrected, but even if he's made 50 videos with Kink, that's still a very small percentage of his output and my point still stands.

MetaFilter is usually pretty keen to 'follow the money' in these kind of debates and people are usually happy to debate the economic interactions that underpin things like porn.
posted by colie at 12:50 AM on January 12, 2013


"Schrader knows he should be terrified, but he’s as giddy as the son of dour Calvinists can be."
posted by valeries at 5:15 AM on January 12, 2013


NO, The New York Times, I am not going to watch an ad in order to watch a trailer.

Are you out of your mind?

posted by mmrtnt at 6:16 AM on January 12, 2013 [1 favorite]


I can't believe I'm talking about something so irrelevant, but someone is wrong on the Internet! This very NSFW kink.com page is their page for James Deen, and links to 218 different videos available for download. You can also read James Deen's very NSFW blog about his kink.com work. I found these with about 30 seconds of Googling, which leads me to believe you didn't bother to look. Not sure why the fraction of Deen's oeuvre that's from kink.com is such a point of contention, but there's more than 5 films. The larger point is that Deen's reputation is he's one of the "good guys" in porn, an actor that is pleasant to work with. Also he has had an unusual following among women (as discussed here on Metafilter).

All of which is only marginally relevant to this fine article about The Canyons. The key thing here is Deen has a reputation for professionalism. Ms. Lohan, not so much.
posted by Nelson at 8:55 AM on January 12, 2013 [4 favorites]


Bonus link: James Deen's tweet about The Canyons drama. "I laughed and enjoyed the memories :-)"
posted by Nelson at 8:59 AM on January 12, 2013


DirtyOldTown: @IAmBroom I thought it was obvious I didn't intend to claim Lohan wasn't getting into any films.
Perhaps you should have said what you meant, then.
posted by IAmBroom at 9:36 PM on January 14, 2013


I think I did say what I meant, it was pretty easy to follow, and adding a bunch of obvious stipulations wouldn't have served any purpose at all, outside of better insulating me against pointless nitpicking.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 2:27 PM on January 15, 2013


I've heard of but never seen James Deen, but the article and the random comment hate-on for porn here have now piqued my interest in him. Any recs for the best of JD's films? Whatever level or kind of sex is okay, but woman-positive, ethically produced, and/or kink.com smut is preferred!
posted by nicebookrack at 6:03 PM on January 17, 2013 [1 favorite]


Awesome thread, folks. Wasn't expecting to read all the way to the bottom. Good work.
posted by laconic skeuomorph at 8:09 AM on January 18, 2013


Any recs for the best of JD's films?

Scene on a big brown couch co-starring Nicole Ray. Or so i've heard from... people.
posted by prefpara at 9:48 AM on January 18, 2013


prefpara, that brown couch scene is adorable. And WILDLY NSFW DO NOT CLICK ON THAT LINK IF UNPREPARED.
posted by nicebookrack at 12:33 PM on January 18, 2013


Bafflingly, here's James Deen pretending to be Darwin the IKEA monkey (NSFW titles, possibly).
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 7:09 AM on January 26, 2013


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