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May 17, 2013 2:16 PM

A Burlingame, California restaurant, Monkutanya, that serves grilled exotic meats has announced on its facebook page that it has added lion to the menu, stirring up some controversy and publicity.
posted by agatha_magatha (79 comments total)

Yeah, come on, this restaurant knew exactly what the reaction to this would be.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:18 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

Judging by the website, are you sure they're serving lion and not some other animal with a similarly-spelt name?
posted by Jehan at 2:25 PM on May 17, 2013 [5 favorites]

...farm-raised lion's meat provided by an Illinois company.

what
posted by jquinby at 2:26 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

I didn't know it was legal to eat lion in the U.S. I mean WTF.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 2:27 PM on May 17, 2013 [3 favorites]

I'll bet it tastes like chicken.
posted by octobersurprise at 2:30 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

In Spike Trotman's alt-history webcomic Templar, Arizona, there exists the publicity stunt eatery "Xenophage" which promotes "Morally Indefensible Dining." They're the subject of protests pretty much every week, so they're always in the news.
posted by The Whelk at 2:30 PM on May 17, 2013 [4 favorites]

That is just disgusting.
posted by mermayd at 2:32 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

serve lion, get free publicity, including on metafilter.
someone always falls for it.
posted by mulligan at 2:34 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

what

Hunting the Lion Burger Butcher

posted by Hoopo at 2:36 PM on May 17, 2013

This is old hat. My restaurant is now serving lion exclusively raised on a shark fin diet.
posted by miyabo at 2:41 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

WEDNESDAY & THURSDAY​

Exotic Meat

Peacock,​ Iguana, Venison, Alligator, Buffalo, Wild boar, Kangaroo, Swan, Cocoon

what
posted by kagredon at 2:43 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

>Peacock,​ Iguana, Venison, Alligator, Buffalo, Wild boar, Kangaroo, Swan, Cocoon
what

"Coccon" is just a fancy word for Ameche & Brimley cutlets.
posted by codswallop at 2:48 PM on May 17, 2013 [12 favorites]

Jehan: "Judging by the website, are you sure they're serving lion and not some other animal with a similarly-spelt name?"

You mean like liger? It's pretty much my favorite animal... to eat.
posted by m@f at 2:50 PM on May 17, 2013 [3 favorites]

In Spike Trotman's alt-history webcomic Templar, Arizona, there exists the publicity stunt eatery "Xenophage" which promotes "Morally Indefensible Dining." They're the subject of protests pretty much every week, so they're always in the news.

Wow. I forgot how funny (and quicker-moving) early Templar was. Now I got a hankerin' for some Sassy Cavy.
posted by sourwookie at 2:51 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

It was all a mistake! They were serving ions!
posted by GenjiandProust at 2:57 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

Hoopo: "Hunting the Lion Burger Butcher"

I...never mind.

Nothing high-tech about this at all, but reading that article is almost certainly the most Gibsonesque moment I've had all week.
posted by jquinby at 2:57 PM on May 17, 2013

You mean like liger?

or perhaps the dreaded beef tender lion
posted by Hoopo at 2:57 PM on May 17, 2013 [11 favorites]

This is about 10 minutes away. I should go check it out.

Update: No lion. But the human baby yakitori was awesome.
posted by Kafkaesque at 2:58 PM on May 17, 2013 [10 favorites]

I have been active on Metafilter since 2007 (I was a lurker long before then) and it never ceases to amaze me just how gullible we can be sometimes.

My dream is that one day MeFites will stop giving free ad space/publicity to various business and get down to the important business of cat scans and hipster hand-wringing.
posted by Avenger at 2:58 PM on May 17, 2013 [4 favorites]

Venison is exotic in California? I actually did think that kangaroo meat was illegal in the US, though. The peacock reminds me of the excesses of the Shah of Iran -- not a good mental connection.
posted by Houstonian at 2:59 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

What reason would there be for kangaroo meat to be illegal in the US?
posted by Jimbob at 3:07 PM on May 17, 2013

I've eaten lion, and wildebeest, and giraffe, and crocodile. They were all terrible, tough and tasteless. The cooking method (huge cuts of meat held over an open flame pit on spears by guys in Maasai costumes) may have had something to do with that, but none of them are anything I would want to eat again.
posted by rodii at 3:08 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

Judging by the website, are you sure they're serving lion and not some other animal with a similarly-spelt name?

Are you calling them liors?
posted by resurrexit at 3:12 PM on May 17, 2013 [9 favorites]

Is there any reason apart from the worldwide lion population being classified as vulnerable to extinction (which I agree is a reason not to hunt lion) why offering or eating lion meat is "disgusting" and "WTF"?
posted by eugenen at 3:26 PM on May 17, 2013 [3 favorites]

I've eaten lion, and wildebeest, and giraffe, and crocodile. They were all terrible, tough and tasteless.

Alligator is damn tasty though.
posted by eugenen at 3:27 PM on May 17, 2013 [5 favorites]

What reason would there be for kangaroo meat to be illegal in the US?

I'm not entirely sure, but when you hear of people serving kangaroo (sometimes explicitly, sometimes as an unmentioned substitute for other meat -- such as what happened many years ago with Jack in the Box), seems laws are usually mentioned. For example, NY had a ban on kangaroo meat due to them being endangered, then it was clarified to be only some types of marsupials?

Or maybe it's like horses. Until about a year ago it was illegal in the US to slaughter them for food, based on prevailing mores.
posted by Houstonian at 3:27 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

In the spirit of totally missing the point: guys, carnivore meat tastes awful. Why would anyone want to eat lion? I'll stick to some free range grass-fed beef, thanks.
posted by ZaphodB at 3:40 PM on May 17, 2013 [9 favorites]

weird weird weird.

Even in Japan I've never eaten at a restaurant that served Lion. Horse? of course! but not lion, no never.

The legality of it is a little suspect too, but I just saw raw milk cheese in the grocery store the other day so...
posted by PipRuss at 3:44 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

I'll bet it tastes like chicken.

No. It doesn't. Not in the least.
posted by Thorzdad at 3:44 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

In the spirit of totally missing the point: guys, carnivore meat tastes awful. Why would anyone want to eat lion? I'll stick to some free range grass-fed beef, thanks.

People should at least try housecat first to see if they like the taste of feline. We have a surplus population of them.
posted by Drinky Die at 3:45 PM on May 17, 2013 [6 favorites]

I've eaten lion, and wildebeest, and giraffe, and crocodile. They were all terrible, tough and tasteless. The cooking method (huge cuts of meat held over an open flame pit on spears by guys in Maasai costumes) may have had something to do with that...

Clearly bush meat is best prepared in a slow cooker.
posted by TedW at 3:47 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

Alligator is damn tasty though.

Apparently the feeling is mutual.
posted by srboisvert at 4:09 PM on May 17, 2013 [4 favorites]

That's weird regarding kangaroo - although I am from Australia and I can assure you that kangaroos killed for meat are very much not endangered, any more than deer are in the United States. I think it has ultimately got to be a social-norms thing, hasn't it? I've got two lots of kangaroo sausages in my freezer right now.
posted by Jimbob at 4:11 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

Savenor's Market in Cambridge, MA will occasionally have lion chops for sale (wicked expensive, though).
posted by AwkwardPause at 4:11 PM on May 17, 2013

kangaroo ... endangered

Ha! Yeah, no.
posted by Pre-Taped Call In Show at 4:12 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

Interestingly enough, lion tastes like ALF.
posted by ifandonlyif at 4:13 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

Why is killing a lion to feed a human inherently more disturbing than killing a cow to feed a human?
posted by Crotalus at 4:14 PM on May 17, 2013

Call me back when they have giant tortoise.
posted by poe at 4:16 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

Florida's losing out - the Tampa restaurant that was selling lion tacos there just gave up.
posted by dragoon at 4:19 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

That's weird regarding kangaroo - although I am from Australia and I can assure you that kangaroos killed for meat are very much not endangered, any more than deer are in the United States. I think it has ultimately got to be a social-norms thing, hasn't it? I've got two lots of kangaroo sausages in my freezer right now.

We had a sausage competition in my town a couple of weeks ago, and one of the offerings was kangaroo sausage. There were quite a few folks unwilling to taste test kangaroo. I find it a little odd because ostrich seems to be pretty popular round here, and it's not like that's any less "exotic" for English people.
posted by Jehan at 4:22 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

A restaurant famous for its rabbit burgers gets complaints that they're using horse meat.
An inspector comes, and asks the proprietor if the allegations are true.
"You got me," he says.
"Well, how much horse meat is in the rabbit burgers?"
"About fifty-fifty."
"Fifty-fifty?"
"Yeah. Fifty-fifty. One horse to one rabbit."
posted by Mister Moofoo at 4:22 PM on May 17, 2013 [4 favorites]

Why is the death of a lion to feed a human inherently more disturbing than the death of a cow to feed a human?

Possibilities:
We are gatherers that envy hunters
Apex Predators Club Membership Benefits*
Scavengers worship predators
Lions are cuddly

*does not apply to snakes
posted by ifandonlyif at 4:29 PM on May 17, 2013 [4 favorites]

Putting aside the ethical considerations, I seem to recall someone telling me (someone who'd know, a barbecue chef) that carnivores don't actually taste good, because of some chemical reaction or something. More information from someone maybe?
posted by jonmc at 4:36 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

I have had kangaroo, gator, rattlesnake, buffalo, frog and ostrich and they were all pretty tasty.
posted by jonmc at 4:37 PM on May 17, 2013

I've got two lots of kangaroo sausages in my freezer right now.

My local grocery store here in Canada randomly had kangaroo burgers the other day, and I was tempted but the last time I bought an unfamiliar meat burger (elk) I was unimpressed. How is kangaroo meat?
posted by Hoopo at 4:39 PM on May 17, 2013

I had it on a stick with some dipping sauce. It was tasty kind of like lamb. My wife said that if they'd had any style they'd have served it in a pita.
posted by jonmc at 4:41 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

How is kangaroo meat?

It is...pretty close to venison. Not as gamey. Very lean, so if you're cooking a steak you have to be careful to cook it hot and fast, or it will go as tough as rubber. But if you've got sausages or burgers, that shouldn't be a problem at all. It's good stuff.
posted by Jimbob at 4:41 PM on May 17, 2013 [3 favorites]

Yeah every guide to cooking that has mentioned kangaroo has said to treat it like venison, very slow and low stew cooking or grind it up and add extra add/flavoring.
posted by The Whelk at 4:50 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

I ate at Jack-in-the-Box at some point before the 'roo-burger scandal broke. I think I was an accidental consumer if a few 'roo-burgers along the way.
They should have offered it as a cool new treat instead of keeping it a secret. 'Roo might not be kosher or halal, but a free-range 'roo probably has less chance of carrying E. coli or salmonella than a cow, a pig, or a chicken.
I think elk is tastier than venison. I have had an ostrich burger once.
To me ostrich tastes like a totally evil combination of turkey and tuna. I never care to repeat the experience.
In Siberia, there are people who poach Siberian tigers. Those who have tasted it say it tastes like pork.
I have to say eating carnivores doesn't sound healthy. Every toxin which bio-accumulates in a predator animal is going to hit the next one up the food-chain exponentially. So yuck.
posted by Katjusa Roquette at 4:55 PM on May 17, 2013

I've got two lots of kangaroo sausages in my freezer right now.

This is a terrible, terrible euphemism.
posted by GenjiandProust at 4:56 PM on May 17, 2013 [15 favorites]

Rodii, since wildebeests and giraffe are herbivores, maybe it was the cooking method. Doesn't sound ideal especially for a lean meat.

Pigs will eat just about anything, and we eat them.
posted by emjaybee at 5:07 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

I've had alligator gumbo before (billed as "Cajun kaiju stew" by the cook) - it was okay. It was more fishlike than I had expected. (The same friend also made a venison and rabbit stew billed as "bambi & thumper stew").
posted by Karmakaze at 5:12 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

Killing predators has a much bigger impact on the ecosystem than killing their prey.
posted by kamikazegopher at 5:13 PM on May 17, 2013 [3 favorites]

My neighborhood bar in Philly used to have lion on the menu, back before I moved here. Apparently the controversy over it is part of what lost the chef his job there.

The article I linked above also refers to getting the meat from a farm in Illinois and names it - Fallows Farm - though once you start googling it you start finding suggestions that there may not actually be an Illinois lion farm.

I like eating weird meats and am generally up for trying anything that doesn't seem too ethically/environmentally questionable, so no judgment here, though given that everyone in the US who ever has lion on their menu gets it from some mysterious "Illinois farm" I'd probably think twice about actually ordering it - though I'd be tempted.
posted by jessypie at 5:15 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

Pumbaa: Hey, kid what's eating you?
Timon: Nothing! He's at the top of the food chain!

WRONG!
posted by mach at 5:20 PM on May 17, 2013 [2 favorites]

I always assumed the Savenor's lion meat was actually "mountain lion" and was somehow a byproduct of legal culling, but never really inquired because it seemed like the product existed just for people to talk about how Savenor's has lion meat.

Their current listings (sorry, no lion) suggest that it's appropriate to categorize alligator, python, and antelope at the same level as "haggis." I was also surprised to see that yak meat is so not-in-demand that they were giving it away for free, but apparently a price of $0.00 just means that it's out of stock.
posted by nev at 5:27 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

Too high up on the food chain for me. I'll stick to beef with a mercury chaser.
posted by Chinese Jet Pilot at 5:53 PM on May 17, 2013 [3 favorites]

I've eaten lion, and wildebeest, and giraffe, and crocodile. They were all terrible, tough and tasteless.

They're better cooked.
posted by dobbs at 5:59 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

I could never bring myself to eat giraffe. I love them too much. I'm sure they would taste fine. They eat leaves. They don't have a lot of fat. Tradicionalno HUNDRED gatherers used giraffe meat as a way to make mass quantities of jerky. It must dry well.
Back when giraffe were numerous, it was different. Now giraffe are in trouble. Two sub-species are endangered.
Nigerian and Ugandan subspecies, and the Angolan sub-species.
They are under a lot of hunting pressure from lions.
Lions tend to eat the babies, and older bull giraffes who are in declining health.
Giraffe reproduce slowly. They don't need humans hunting them.
posted by Katjusa Roquette at 6:03 PM on May 17, 2013 [5 favorites]

So, my grandparents lived in west Africa in the 80's.

At one point during this period in their lives, they attended a formal dinner where pretty much all the protein was different types of exotic bush meat. The meal came with a certificate of completion -- in French, of course -- which my grandparents had framed because they are insane.

I can think of no item I would rather inherit from them.

Not that I entirely approve of consuming possibly endangered species* for sport/as a novelty, but it's just such a weird document to own.

*I don't know for sure that they ate anything endangered, but this dinner happened at a time and in a place where it's very possible.
posted by Sara C. at 6:07 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

Also, I agree that lion probably wouldn't taste very good.

Alligator is shit and anyone who thinks otherwise must like their meat real chewy.

I bought my dog kangaroo dog food for the lols and he turned his nose up at it.

(FWIW I'm a huge fan of eating strange animals as long as they're not endangered. I take pride in my laundry list of weird meats that I've eaten. Though nothing remotely crazy as lion.)
posted by Sara C. at 6:09 PM on May 17, 2013

I'd eat lion if they weren't endangered, but seeing as they are, this seems like a bad idea. Even if they are only lions that die of old age and/or commit suicide, it just seems uncouth.

I wonder if this place is the meat purveyor? They occasionally get in trouble for having meats that they shouldn't have.

The creepiest thing I ever ate was a bison burger. At a zoo. 10 feet from the live bison enclosure. It seemed wrong.
posted by gjc at 6:44 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

Katjusa Roquette: "giraffe meat as a way to make mass quantities of jerky."

Did they make novelty super-long strips of jerky? I know I would.
posted by Joakim Ziegler at 7:12 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

From jessypie's link: The meat is the byproduct of a skinning operation owned by another man, Czimer said in an interview with CNNMoney.com. He declined to name that gentleman.

"This man buys and sells animals for the skin, and when I need something and he has ability to get it, I will bargain for the meat. It's a byproduct," he said.

And where does that mystery man get the lions? "I wouldn't have any idea," said Czimer, who operates a small retail store in addition to his wholesale business. "He has his sources, and I do not infringe on his business, just as he does not infringe on mine."

This is so blatantly sketchy that it's starting to cross over from alarming into sort of hilarious.
posted by kagredon at 7:22 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

"Why does SeaWorld have a seafood restaurant? I'm halfway through my fishburger when I suddenly realize, 'I could be eating a slow learner.'"
posted by zarq at 7:33 PM on May 17, 2013 [3 favorites]

Or maybe it's like horses. Until about a year ago it was illegal in the US to slaughter them for food, based on prevailing mores.

Only for five years, evidently. And weirdly, PETA is in favor of horses being slaughtered in the U.S., according to that article.

I was completely unaware of that. Good thing I didn't try to eat any passing horses.
posted by XMLicious at 7:42 PM on May 17, 2013

Alligator is shit and anyone who thinks otherwise must like their meat real chewy.

I lived in Florida for two years where it's offered at just about every bar and grill and I tried it twice. One time it was like you describe, the other it was actually pretty delicious. Maybe it was marinated or something.
posted by jonmc at 7:45 PM on May 17, 2013

Yeah it can be kind of OK if it's marinated well and then fried to high heaven.

Note also that it is only served in "bar & grill" type contexts. I think you have to be a little bit buzzed to enjoy it beyond the novelty factor.

(Then again I also think calamari is revolting, so maybe I'm just a snob about my fried aquatic snacks.)
posted by Sara C. at 7:52 PM on May 17, 2013

Before I went vegetarian I was a pretty adventurous carnivore and I'll echo everyone who says that ALL land-based carnivores taste like ass. What you sit on, not the beast of burden. The closest I came to something you might actually want to eat was at a Native American gathering where they had prepared cougar in a dutch oven and it had cooked for at least eight hours. But even then, it still didn't taste good. Easy(er) to chew, perhaps, but the flavor was very unpleasant.

I had the good fortune to watch a friend try to win a bet by killing, cooking and then eating coyote. On the second bite, the vomiting commenced. And continued for the next couple of hours. Hilarious.

I've had fox, black bear (done as a smoked ham with lardoons of pork fat to keep it kinda moist), cougar, brown bear and bobcat. All horrible. Probably the least offensive of that group was the bear ham, but even that, yick.

Otoh, moose was wonderful. Seriously, they eat watercress all day and eat very little dry fodder. A very sweet and nice flavored meat, as long as you added a lot of fat to keep it moist, since it's so very lean. Not even remotely gamey. But a lot of conscience bothering, knowing that Bullwinkle was the main course that night.
posted by Purposeful Grimace at 8:02 PM on May 17, 2013 [3 favorites]

On the anecdotal side, I've been told that there are ethnic markets of the Russian or Ukrainian variety in the Twin Cities that offer bear sausage. I have not tried it.

Other variety meats in the area: I've personally seen camel for sale at markets that cater to the local Somali population. And there has been at least one Tibetan restaurant here that has had "tender broiled yak meat" on the menu.

Squirrel I've had. I don't recommend it, although there's nearly an endless supply.
posted by gimonca at 8:23 PM on May 17, 2013

Is there any reason apart from the worldwide lion population being classified as vulnerable to extinction (which I agree is a reason not to hunt lion) why offering or eating lion meat is "disgusting" and "WTF"?

No, that's the reason. Lion farm? Riiiiiiiight.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 8:49 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

I've tasted all the strongest meats,
And laid them down in colored sheets.
posted by prize bull octorok at 8:51 PM on May 17, 2013

Lion farm?

I know of a few "wild animal preserves" in the US. Not sure whether they feature lions as a matter of course, though. Or whether they're nonprofits or what. Or how ethical they are in terms of stuff like this.

I mean, it's possible that there are lions on a preserve somewhere, and every once in a while one dies of old age and the people who run the place sell it to someone like this Czimer dude. It would probably not be in Czimer's interest to tell people that the lion he's selling is stringy elderly lionflesh that obviously won't taste good. So it could be that he's being shifty for perfectly ordinary reasons and not trying to protect people smuggling lion carcasses into the US. Or worse.

That said I just transcribed a documentary about the ivory trade that makes me think it's more likely that the lions are not coming from a "farm" in Illinois at all but are part of a smuggling operation. Because they definitely exist. It's even possible that people ordering lion on a menu in San Francisco are directly funding terrorism or people like Joseph Kony.

But it's also kinda sorta maybe possible that these lions are perfectly above-board, just probably not USDA-approved.
posted by Sara C. at 8:58 PM on May 17, 2013 [1 favorite]

Yeah. Bioaccumulation was my first thought. Sometimes taboos exist for a reason.
posted by Skwirl at 10:31 PM on May 17, 2013

I've eaten at this restaurant. The ramen was passable, but not great, and it has nice little traditional dining rooms, but the whole place reeks of smoke. I thought the "exotic meats" was a little weird, haven't tried any. It's stuck in a strip mall back from a street, so getting any publicity is probably good for them. I certainly won't be returning....not into apex predators ( bioaccumulation, shudder) or eating vulnerable or endangered species.
posted by Existential Dread at 11:20 PM on May 17, 2013

The only red meat I really eat is kangaroo, as it's local, wild-caught (so no issues wrt farming practices, hormones, etc), cheap, overpopulated (so you are doing the environment a favour by eating it), and very good for you. According to Wikipedia, I am not alone.

It is unbelievably lean (1.3g of fat per 100g of meat, on average), so even cooking it long and slow doesn't make it tender. Kangaroo sausages tend to have extra added fat (vegetable oils, for example). Kangaroo mince works fine in most dishes that you'd otherwise use ground beef for, but again, you need to add a lot of liquid and/or some extra fat to keep it juicy. Kangaroo steak is hard to cook well. The only way I've found is to marinate it for at least a day in a marinade that's really heavy on the oil, and not drain off too much of that oil when cooking it. Then cook it fast at a high heat and leave it a little rare in the middle.

Crocodile, on the other hand, is horrible.
posted by lollusc at 3:11 AM on May 18, 2013

I have an amazing kangaroo recipe I invented myself. It's fast and fabulous.

Ingredients:

Kangaroo fillets, cut into strips, lightly seasoned with salt and peppter
1 onion (and some garlic if you are partial, which I am)
say 4 or more rashers of free range bacon, diced
4 oranges, 1-2 juiced, 2-3 segmented
Mesclun or nice mix of bitter and mild lettuces (not too much bitter).

Fry the onion in some canola oil (or butter or olive oil) under a high heat,
Once browned, add the bacon. Fry until it has just started to crisp.
By this stage, a lot of fat should be coming out of it; in you go with the strips (and garlic if you added).
Cook them fast - 1-3 minutes, absolute max. Take them out and just put them on a plate.
Deglaze the pan with the orange juice and let it reduce for a minute or two, back in with the strips.
Mix the segmented oranges with the mesclun, plate, then tip the kangaroo, bacon, and orange deglaze over.

Done: Warm kangaroo salad with bacon and orange. Also pairs well with stone fruit like nectarine, but for mine the orange marries better to the bacon.
posted by smoke at 3:25 AM on May 18, 2013

I think this should be outlawed. Not because I'm certain that serving lion is morally wrong or anything, but instead because fuck the peninsula.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:41 AM on May 18, 2013

The worst part of farming lions is milking time.
posted by Kaleidoscope at 8:27 PM on May 18, 2013 [1 favorite]