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Oilberta
July 1, 2013 11:56 AM   Subscribe

Canada has lost its famous politeness. With oil and gas now accounting for approximately a quarter of its export revenue, over the last decade Canada has not so quietly become an international mining center and a rogue petrostate.
posted by four panels (73 comments total) 12 users marked this as a favorite

 
I for one am sort of sick of the "polite Canadian" meme. I've worked with people from all over the world, and everyone, including Canadians, are basically the same - decent, polite, friendly, especially the Americans I've worked with.

Canada has always and forever been resource-based. This "petro-state" stuff is not new at all. For example, the social democratic provincial government of British Columbia branded environmentalists as "enemies of BC" in the early 90's, during the War of the Woods. It was under a social democratic government that Canada saw the largest mass arrests in Canadian history until the Toronto G20 protests more than a decade later.

In Canada we've always operated internationally under the facade of "niceness" as bland as our national flag. But the truth is something different.
posted by KokuRyu at 12:13 PM on July 1, 2013 [18 favorites]


This list of "Famous Fictional Canadians" speaks volumes about Canada's "image". Terrence & Philip? If they don't dominate what Americans think of Canadians, it's only because everyone knows South Park gets NOTHING right.
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:22 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


I for one am sort of sick of the "polite Canadian" meme.

It's easy to get a reputation as a good neighbor when you live next to a frat house.
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 12:35 PM on July 1, 2013 [31 favorites]


I keep this drawing handy as a reminder of who's awesome in Canada and who is decidedly to blame for what isn't. (Warning: Sweary.)
posted by delfin at 12:38 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


Crap, Peter Watts' future is coming true. At least Quebec hasn't seceded yet and turned into a rogue hydrostate.
posted by Apocryphon at 12:40 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


On 'polite canadians'.

I was a bar in SF which had communal sitting (benches) and accidentally brushed up against a woman. "I'm sorry" I said to her. She replied "I'm sorry", I responded back "No, I'm sorry", I responded back to her again "No, I'm sorry." She responded back to me "I'm sorry".

I looked at her carefully, and then asked her if she was Canadian. "Yes" was her reply.

While humans are humans, worldwide (assholes, humanitarians, selfish, selfless, etc, etc), I stand by the stereotype that Canadians are actually ridiculously polite.
posted by el io at 12:51 PM on July 1, 2013 [6 favorites]


Canadian Mining companies don't keep their environmental plunder within Canada
posted by el io at 12:54 PM on July 1, 2013 [2 favorites]


Canadian mining companies are unadulterated evil.

Sorry.
posted by five fresh fish at 12:58 PM on July 1, 2013 [3 favorites]


Canadian mining companies are unadulterated evil.

not entirely true. I'm aware of a few counter-examples. But even they would tell you, it's a mostly accurate accusation, particularly with regard to foreign interests.
posted by philip-random at 1:03 PM on July 1, 2013


This list of "Famous Fictional Canadians" speaks volumes about Canada's "image".

No Ricky or Julian? Not even Bubbles?
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 1:04 PM on July 1, 2013 [5 favorites]


The whole FTFY thing sucks, so I would like to point out that ALL mining companies are unadulterated evil.
posted by Aizkolari at 1:15 PM on July 1, 2013


Canada has always and forever been resource-based.

Totally agree. CAD and AUD are referred to as "commodity currencies" by ForEx traders because both countries' exports are so dominated by energy. Australia is the world's largest exporter of coal, fourth largest exporter of natural gas, and third largest of uranium; Canada is the largest exporter of oil to the USA, third largest world exporter of natural gas, and second largest of uranium. As a result, their international exchange value has an extremely high correlation with oil prices, especially against USD.
posted by ceribus peribus at 1:23 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


Canadians seem kind of smug, like they're always going on about how much better their country is then the US
posted by delmoi at 1:31 PM on July 1, 2013


Canadians seem kind of smug, like they're always going on about how much better their country is then the US
posted by delmoi at 1:31 PM on July 1 [+] [!]


Are we trolling?
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 1:45 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


> how much better their country is then the US

Depending on your metrics (life expectancy, income inequality, likelyhood of violent death, democracy, etc.), this could be said about many countries.
posted by anthill at 1:49 PM on July 1, 2013 [2 favorites]


With the floods in Calgary last week, I wonder if anyone has made the connection between record precipitation events, and living below an area that not only produces massive quantities of fossil fuel, but is itself one of the largest emitters of greenhouse gasses?

Fort McMurray is basically North Mordor now, so I hope the oil royalties were worth it.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 1:50 PM on July 1, 2013 [7 favorites]


I don't think you'll find that rainfall and petroleum extraction are correlated on the local scale.

But, yes, plenty of asshats have been saying Calgary got what it deserves.
posted by five fresh fish at 1:54 PM on July 1, 2013 [4 favorites]


Canada is the UNITED STATES without guns
posted by Postroad at 2:03 PM on July 1, 2013


Canada has always and forever been resource-based.

This, this, this. Exploiting the environment comprises the bulk of our history. We were founded by fur trappers, for fuck's sake!
posted by Sys Rq at 2:06 PM on July 1, 2013 [2 favorites]


"The author of this transformation is Prime Minister Stephen Harper, a right-wing policy wonk and evangelical Christian with a power base in Alberta, ground zero of Canada's oil boom."

I never new Harper was an evangelical Christian. I thank the author for pointing that out.

Can someone explain the connection between evangelical Christianity and plundering the land for political gain?
posted by otto42 at 2:06 PM on July 1, 2013


Canada is the UNITED STATES without guns
posted by Postroad at 2:03 PM on July 1 [+] [!]


"...without as many guns"

“I find that absolutely incredible” that they have the right to go into a person’s home and take their “belongings,” said resident Brenda Lackey, after learning Mounties have been securing residents’ guns. “When people find out about this there’s going to be untold hell to pay.”

and further on down the page

“This is the reason the U.S. has the right to bear arms,” said Charles Timpano, pointing to the group of Mounties.
posted by otto42 at 2:11 PM on July 1, 2013


While humans are humans, worldwide (assholes, humanitarians, selfish, selfless, etc, etc), I stand by the stereotype that Canadians are actually ridiculously polite.

Watch out for Scott, though. He's a dick.
posted by Navelgazer at 2:22 PM on July 1, 2013 [8 favorites]


I think these are good links that could have been framed much better so as not to elicit so much knee jerk Canadian image discussion and snark.
posted by planetesimal at 2:29 PM on July 1, 2013


Can someone explain the connection between evangelical Christianity and plundering the land for political gain?

I think it's a side-effect of Christians being in the center of the political and social structures of rich countries. A lot of the people who have the most to gain and greatest ability to avoid feeling the harms of plundering the environment happen to have been Christians, so it's not surprising that versions of Christianity with rationalizations for doing so sprang up among those people.
posted by straight at 2:35 PM on July 1, 2013 [3 favorites]


Canada has long been a mining powerhouse - mining companies from all over the world are listed on the Toronto Stock Exhange.
posted by jb at 2:52 PM on July 1, 2013


Can someone explain the connection between evangelical Christianity and plundering the land for political gain?

Sheep can be herded.
posted by Sys Rq at 3:10 PM on July 1, 2013 [6 favorites]


“This is the reason the U.S. has the right to bear arms,” said Charles Timpano, pointing to the group of Mounties.

I tend to agree with Mr. Timpano. Dick move by the RCMP, who, as per usual, has who a shit job managing the situation in High River.
posted by KokuRyu at 3:17 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


Those people do have a compelling reason to get back to their homes. Stuff is going to start rotting and molding soon if they can't go home to throw it out.

And I'd be pretty mad too if the RCMP "executed a forced entry" to see if I had any guns.
posted by Kevin Street at 3:26 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


It should be noted/recalled that oil is such a big part of the Canadian economy that they named a handful of hockey teams off the stuff (Oilers, Oil Kings).

Carry on.
posted by JoeXIII007 at 3:27 PM on July 1, 2013


Canadians have lost a lot more than that in the last decade, thanks to the packs of horrifying harperite shithounds they keep electing.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 3:51 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


Can someone explain the connection between evangelical Christianity and plundering the land for political gain?

Can you please explain what you see as the discrepancy?
posted by telstar at 4:12 PM on July 1, 2013


Canada is more than just Alberta in the same way that the U.S. is more just than Texas.

I agree that our "niceness" is a bit overblown, but caricaturing the personality of an entire country based on the actions of a few mercenary mining companies and our unfortunate choice of leadership is equally ridiculous.

(thank you)
posted by arkady at 4:44 PM on July 1, 2013 [3 favorites]


Surely Nickelback ended any ideas of Canada and politeness?
posted by juiceCake at 5:02 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


No Ricky or Julian? Not even Bubbles?

Ricky is very polite when he expresses himself in court (NSFW).
posted by juiceCake at 5:05 PM on July 1, 2013 [3 favorites]


As a B.C. Canadian, I find this article makes some good explanatory connections about the current social and political climate. It also makes me sad because I can now see history replaying itself. When will we ever learn?
posted by polymodus at 5:07 PM on July 1, 2013


el io: what you don't know is that 'I'm sorry' is how a Canadian apologizes, but it's also how we say "Piss off, a-hole", "What the Hey is WRONG with you" and "Listen, I'm just about to clock you one, jerkface".

It's all in the intonation. We're not really polite, just passive-aggressive and smug.

And yes, Harper is a prize a-hole and the Tar Sands are the hand of the devil.
posted by jrochest at 5:19 PM on July 1, 2013


Of course Canadians aren't the nicest people in the world – who is? Canadians are like anyone else, and speaking as a Canadian, many people I have met are horrible and mean.
posted by 8LeggedFriend at 5:44 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


Can you please explain what you see as the discrepancy?
posted by telstar at 4:12 PM on July 1
[+] [!]

No I can't. But as long as we are making spurious assumptions, written to get a rise, I blame drunken aborigines for the pollution in Alberta.
posted by otto42 at 5:54 PM on July 1, 2013


I HATE the fact that my government is using my tax dollars to tell me how great the tar sands development is. Since most of Canada is owned by "The Crown", I'd really be greatful if anyone can point me towards anything that wil explain exactly how the development of our common resources is directed and then divied up.
posted by bonobothegreat at 6:13 PM on July 1, 2013


With the floods in Calgary last week, I wonder if anyone has made the connection between record precipitation events, and living below an area that not only produces massive quantities of fossil fuel, but is itself one of the largest emitters of greenhouse gasses?

I have certainly seen a few (mostly ill-timed and sneerlingly self-congratulatory) attempts to link these things. Of course, it helps if you understand enough about the geography of Alberta to know that Fort Mac and Calgary are not on the same river nor even part of the same drainage system. Or did I misunderstand your use of "living below"?
posted by gompa at 7:19 PM on July 1, 2013 [2 favorites]


I can't easily find it right now, but there is a religious declaration to which Harper subscribes, that essentially states that humans can't fuck things up because God made the planet for people. Ergo, carbon emissions, over-fishing, and crop failures aren't a worry.

The guy is a religious loon.
posted by five fresh fish at 7:21 PM on July 1, 2013 [4 favorites]


I for one am sort of sick of the "polite Canadian" meme

Put so nicely, it becomes eponysterical. If you were one of us hyperbolic USA'ers, you would have said something like 'I am so fucking sick of retards who think...'
posted by lumpenprole at 7:56 PM on July 1, 2013


Of course, it helps if you understand enough about the geography of Alberta to know that Fort Mac and Calgary are not on the same river nor even part of the same drainage system. Or did I misunderstand your use of "living below"?

I meant "south of", but the actual watershed is kind of irrelevant when there have been record rainfall and weather disturbances across the region; and which appear to be part of a larger pattern of weather disturbances, and disruption of the jet stream, which may or may not be related to overall increases in global temperatures. Of course, even if it were the case, we'd never hear it from the environment ministry under the "Harper Government."

I in no way meant to imply that Calgarians "got what they deserved." I feel terrible for people whose homes were damaged, and I'm also somewhat envious of your local government and mayor. Mayors of certain other municipalities would likely not have handled this nearly as well. I would hope that this year's flooding is simply an anomaly, and not part of an emergent pattern.

Of course, the tar sands still look like fucking Mordor.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 8:33 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


Oh, and I should clarify- I don't think the average Albertan has seen a penny on the dollar of the actual oil royalties coming out of the tar sands. That was more directed at Harper and his cronies. Calgarians are getting as screwed as anyone.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 8:36 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


Why has everyone forgotten how to spell? There's an edit function now- use it.

Calgary is nowhere near the oil sands, as Gompa pointed out. We're "below" the Rockies, and the foothills received more than a FOOT of rain in one day. That on top of snow melt is why we, and Canmore and High River and the Stoney and Siksika First Nations, flooded so dramatically and horrifically.

The floods have been followed by the most achingly beautiful instances of charity and community that I have ever seen in my life. I made it through two hurricanes when I lived in Alabama and never saw a shred of what I've seen in my city in the past 11 days.

Happy Canada Day.
posted by ethnomethodologist at 9:51 PM on July 1, 2013 [4 favorites]


Harper follows The Cornwall Alliance. It is batshit.
posted by five fresh fish at 10:04 PM on July 1, 2013


Seriously batshit.

More about Harper and his batshit faith.
posted by five fresh fish at 10:07 PM on July 1, 2013 [3 favorites]


telstar: Can you please explain what you see as the discrepancy?

otto42: No I can't. But as long as we are making spurious assumptions, written to get a rise, I blame drunken aborigines for the pollution in Alberta.


I think the point of emphasizing Harper's religion is that many Canadians believe it dictates his agenda, particularly because his church is explicitly theocratic: its vision statement includes "Pray for our nation - the government - that godly agendas be required through minority rule". The thinking behind relating this to environmental issues is an interpretation of Genesis 1:26 ("And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.") that confers a mandate of thorough use rather than gentle stewardship.

I don't know if there's direct evidence that Harper follows the Cornwall Alliance, though.
posted by gingerest at 10:08 PM on July 1, 2013 [1 favorite]


Gingerest: Ya think?
posted by five fresh fish at 10:10 PM on July 1, 2013


Wait, that Cornwall Alliance newsletter says, "we can’t help preening a bit over their belief that somehow or other, without our even having tried, we have powerfully influenced the policies of Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper on environment and energy." Tantamount to a denial?

Which doesn't mean I believe it. Certainly, Harper's Church holds as central to the faith that the second coming is imminent (which, if you're into certain sorts of literal readings of the Bible, is only a couple steps short of "hey, it's time for the Apocalypse anyway, so who cares about global warming?")
posted by gingerest at 10:20 PM on July 1, 2013


I spent 2 years of my young adult life in Southern Alberta (with a very brief stint in Sparwood, BC), as one of those pesky Mormon missionaries, no less.

Given the nature of my "job" while in Canada, I spent an average of 60 hours a week knocking on doors, walking around in public spaces trying to talk to folks...needless to say I met and interacted with a TON of Canadians.

I spent time in some of the most affluent areas of Calgary, and I also spent 6 months in a Spanish-speaking congregation in Calgary, which was an amazing cultural cross-section. I lived in Brooks and hobnobbed with Sudanese, Cambodian, and Somalian families, all refugees, nearly all working in a massive meat packing plant. I ranged around Taber with the farmers and the ranchers and the beet sugar factory workers. I hung out in Drumheller with oil slickers and ex-cons and prison guards. I went down to Cardston and hung out with some of the most insulated Mormons I have ever met outside of Provo, Utah. And let's not forget the coal miners in Sparwood, and the occasional ski-bum waiting for winter to arrive.

Some of 'em are polite as hell. Some aren't.

Once I met a homeless man who shared my first name, a forlorn First Nations man with a penchant for drinking and fighting (sadly I never had the presence of mind to learn his actual tribal identity). We tried to take him to dinner at a nearby restarant only to watch, helpless, as he was bounced on ass right out the front door by a very angry security guard. Didn't matter that we were paying, he simply wasn't welcome there. Troubled times indeed.

Another time some rednecks out in Vauxhall set their rottweilers after us. I've never run faster in all my life. Later that week in the same town a little old lady, originally from Newfoundland, invited us in for lemonade and the most amazing butter tarts. Couldn't understand a lot of what she said, I wasn't too used to the Newfie accent, but she sure made our day.

I met a Holocaust-denier who was a prominent member of the local congregation, respected in the community. A disgusting racist who hid behind his own intellectual posturing.

Then there was Otto, an ill-tempered old German, veteran infantryman of WWII, living out his days in Cambria, alone, raging at the world for all the ills he'd witnessed. He had a glass eye that looked infected, and he was always going on about his children, how they couldn't wait for him to die so they could be rid of him. He'd serve us herbal tea and show us his latest puzzle, how he'd found a flawed piece, was going to write a letter to the manufacturer.

The couple from El Salvador who made the most fantastic pupusas. The Czech skiing-olympian and her oil-slick husband lounging in their downtown penthouse, plying us with dumplings and ice cold tumblers of coca-cola. The slightly-loopy bakery owner who gave us a free loaf of bread every time we walked past her shop. The gentle, quiet fellow who introduced me to Arvo Pärt's music and brought me to tears. A hockey rink in every town, no matter how small.

I was also there when the planes hit on 9/11. I was in a diner in Calgary, eating breakfast with an old Australian expatriate. It was surreal. My home country felt so far away, and being a missionary I was already so removed from normal society I never really knew what to think. I can tell you this though: every Canadian I met in those first weeks after was amazing, the embodiment of kindness and compassion.

It's usually assumed that if you're a Mormon missionary you're also from the 'States. Not a bad stereotype because it's true 90% of the time. So in those first few weeks after the attacks, when all the post was shut down and we hadn't heard from our loved ones (missionaries aren't allowed to call home), all the kind words and embraces from my fellow humans meant a lot.

They'd see you on the street: Hey missionaries! Come over here. You boys from the US? Yes sir. Well. I'm real sorry about what's going on right now. I bet you miss your family. You wanna come in for some hot chocolate? No, no, I'm not interested in your religion, but it's a chilly day, come on in and sit for awhile.

So yeah. Canada=Polite is kind of a silly stereotype, and it does some disservice to the notion that most humans are genuinely decent people. That being said, I'll allow myself a little indulgence: they may not the only polite people in the world, but Canadians are pretty badass in the human decency category.

I've said it before: Canada stole a little piece of my heart and I'm just fine with that.
posted by Doleful Creature at 11:14 PM on July 1, 2013 [15 favorites]


The dark secret behind the "polite Canadian".
posted by sebastienbailard at 1:22 AM on July 2, 2013 [6 favorites]


Can't put politeness in my gas tank.
posted by telstar at 1:30 AM on July 2, 2013 [1 favorite]


"Liberal critics like to say that Harper's political revolution caught many Canadians, generally a fat and apathetic people, by surprise"

This man seems to be on a one man mission to test Canada's famous politeness and restraint.
posted by MuffinMan at 3:40 AM on July 2, 2013 [2 favorites]


A friend of mine spent some time in Japan and he asked a few people there what they thought of Canadians. One of the responses was:

They are honest and eat donuts.
posted by juiceCake at 7:19 AM on July 2, 2013


They are honest and eat donuts.

Between that and the socialized healthcare, if the weather up there were better I'd move there tomorrow.
posted by Aizkolari at 7:41 AM on July 2, 2013


The problem with the RCMP wasn't that they were taking guns (including, from what I've read guns that were properly stored and locked up in cabinets, with ammo stored and locked separately). The problem was that they were rifling (no pun intended) through people's private property with no warrant after they were evacuated. Yes, the Emergency Management Act let them enter homes to ensure that people had indeed evacuated. But all they had to do was open the door to each room and make sure there were no people in the house. Going through property and confiscating it (even firearms) was a horrible Charter violation.

As for the main topic, I think we're far too invested on how others see us. I don't care if Canadians are perceived as polite or not, really. I try to be polite as I can be, but polite doesn't mean that we should stop trying to make a living. Most of my family has made our living from resource extraction of one sort or another, as is historically true of Canada. Selling oil is neither polite nor impolite. But it doesn't really pay to be too thin-skinned about what people say about you. The oil sands will exist as long as there's demand for oil. If we really want to stop them, we should focus on the demand side of this transaction rather than the supply.
posted by Kurichina at 8:05 AM on July 2, 2013 [2 favorites]


TEAM TIM HORTONS FOREVER
posted by Doleful Creature at 9:00 AM on July 2, 2013


My ex-girlfriend was from Australia and the first time we went for a drive around Toronto the exact words out of her mouth were "What's with all the donut stores?"
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:04 AM on July 2, 2013


The problem with the RCMP wasn't that they were taking guns (including, from what I've read guns that were properly stored and locked up in cabinets, with ammo stored and locked separately). The problem was that they were rifling (no pun intended) through people's private property with no warrant after they were evacuated. Yes, the Emergency Management Act let them enter homes to ensure that people had indeed evacuated. But all they had to do was open the door to each room and make sure there were no people in the house. Going through property and confiscating it (even firearms) was a horrible Charter violation.

Are you fucking kidding me? You should be thanking the RCMP for preventing a huge black-market gun trade.

Selling oil is neither polite nor impolite.


Extracting it in a way that destroys the planet and proudly ignoring millions of people's pleas to stop, however, is.

The fact that the Prime Minister is religiously opposed to the environment is just fucking disgusting. Wake the fuck up, Alberta.
posted by Sys Rq at 9:39 AM on July 2, 2013


Here's hoping that Alberta will come to see its advantages as a great responsibility.
posted by No Robots at 10:04 AM on July 2, 2013


Stephen Harper, a right-wing policy wonk and evangelical Christian

I know that Harper is right-wing, but I didn't know that he was an evangelical Christian. What countries are dumb enough to elect right-wing evangelical Christians to the head of their government after the '00s?
posted by Apocryphon at 12:59 PM on July 2, 2013


You should be thanking the RCMP for preventing a huge black-market gun trade.

So you're totally comfortable with a police force that violates the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, as long as they happen to be violating to take away something that you don't like? I'm not. Nor do I buy that the risk of black-market gun trade was that high, especially for the firearms that were appropriately locked and stored. Gun safes are not easy to break into.

But really, the fact that is was guns that were taken is not issue. It could have been drugs, or knifes or anything else. The issue is that there was unreasonable search and seizure of people's personal property.

Also, I've never supported Harper (or any right-wing politicians), but despite all the speculation about his religion, he's never used it justify his policy decisions and he's never spoke about it publicly. As long as he keeps his evangelicism to himself (and I have yet to see any conclusive evidence that hasn't kept it to himself, although I recall a few very speculative media attempts to link it - I'm thinking of Marci McDonald's Walrus article from 2006 that was thinner than air), why should anyone make an issue of it? One of the things we do relatively well in Canada (compared to other developed countries) is keep our politicians' personal lives separate from their professional lives. Why anyone who cares about democracy would want to go against this is beyond me. As a test, I like to think to myself, "If I were running for elected office, would I consider it fair if someone made a big deal about my ....?" (personal religious beliefs that I do not explicitly link to any political position, romantic life, family history, etc, etc) If I answer that question in the negative, I'll refrain from using that fact to attack a political opponent, because I don't want to live in the sort of place (i.e. south of the 49th parallel) where those sorts of attacks are an everyday, seemingly expected thing.
posted by Kurichina at 1:20 PM on July 2, 2013


Going through property and confiscating it (even firearms) was a horrible Charter violation.

There are no property rights in the Charter. It was considered, but purposefully not included. I'm with Sys Rq - taking the guns was a pretty reasonable precaution. Just like if you had a bunch of hazardous chemicals, they should be secured while the owner can't attend.
posted by Lemurrhea at 1:21 PM on July 2, 2013 [2 favorites]


There are no property rights in the Charter.

It stems from Section 8.
posted by Kurichina at 1:24 PM on July 2, 2013


What countries are dumb enough to elect right-wing evangelical Christians to the head of their government after the '00s?

Do you mean the 1900s? That's just about how long Albertans have been in love with the right wing evangelical Christian brand known first as Social Credit. Criminy, we're lucky its watered down from its crazy anti-semitic funny-money days.
posted by No Robots at 1:25 PM on July 2, 2013 [2 favorites]


Section 8 is about people. And, almost exclusively, about criminal investigations/evidence. A very different setting.
posted by Lemurrhea at 1:28 PM on July 2, 2013


Section 8 protects people against unreasonable search and seizure. What was at all reasonable about searching the homes of evacuated people for anything beyond what was authorized under the Emergency Management Act (ie. ensuring that people had indeed evacuated)?

What was reasonable about seizing lawfully owned property (in particular, those that were stored appropriately)?

Should we just trust that the RCMP have the best interests of Canadians at heart? Between the sexual harassment charges within the organization, bungled investigations and endemic racism, I can't just trust the RCMP. This is why we have court oversight and protection against unreasonable search and seizure.

If this was any other area of the country or any other type of property, it wouldn't even be controversial. The fact that it was firearms is blinding too many other reasonable people to what was a huge violation of personal privacy.
posted by Kurichina at 1:37 PM on July 2, 2013 [2 favorites]


I vote "Honest Donuts" replace the latin motto on the Royal Crest of Canada (it now says "Sea to Sea"). And that griffin on the top could hold up a maple cream!
posted by chapps at 8:11 PM on July 2, 2013


Yeah, but Social Credit just was one of those weird 1930s economic movements that tried to beat the Depression, like Huey Long's programs or Technocracy, Inc. Harper seems like a run-of-the-mill post-Reagan/Thatcher neoliberal. Why would canny Canadians elect their own Bush after carefully seeing what was happening to the south?

Also, I've never supported Harper (or any right-wing politicians), but despite all the speculation about his religion, he's never used it justify his policy decisions and he's never spoke about it publicly. As long as he keeps his evangelicism to himself (and I have yet to see any conclusive evidence that hasn't kept it to himself,

Oh, so he's sort of a Tony Blair on that point?
posted by Apocryphon at 10:38 AM on July 3, 2013


1930's? I grew up under BC's SoCred government in the 1980s and somehow we just can't shake that Bill VanderZalm...
posted by chapps at 9:28 PM on July 3, 2013


Why would canny Canadians elect their own Bush after carefully seeing what was happening to the south?

Because he and some of his MPs get a lot of support from evangelical Christian groups* who vote for whomever their churches tell them to vote? That's the alternative to rank stupidity, I guess...
posted by sneebler at 8:29 AM on July 4, 2013


Hah. I remember that loathesome huckster VanderZalm, too. As Harper is to Bush, so was he, in miniature, BC's mini-Reagan. My disgust for him galvanized my young political instincts almost as much as my similar feelings for ol' Ronnie.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 3:04 PM on July 4, 2013 [1 favorite]


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