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July 10, 2013 6:03 PM Subscribe
The World Ends with a Handshake: Unraveling the Apocalypse of 'Southland Tales' A writer meets Richard Kelly, writer/director of Donnie Darko, and talks about his flop Southland Tales and its enduring cult of fans.
Speaking as someone who loved Donnie Darko, and wanted to love this movie, I just think it isn't any good. It's ambitious as all get-out, creative, surreal, intellectual. It just doesn't succeed along any axis I can perceive, as much as I wish I could report otherwise.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 6:11 PM on July 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by Horace Rumpole at 6:11 PM on July 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
I too, love this film. Of all the awesome things in it, my favorite is probably the fact that Liquid Karma is apparently both a miracle energy source, and a powerful psychedelic. That, and the existence of the Jenny von Westphallen Mega-Zepplin.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 6:23 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by paper chromatographologist at 6:23 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
I WANTED to love Southland Tales, since I tend to like things others dismiss as 'pretentious', but it felt like it was trying to be weird without having the proper weirdness of its vision. And I think the article explains why I had a problem with it, why it didn't fit into my brain - Richard Kelly was being literal, so he didn't allow true abstract symbolism. Intead of being a David Lynch film it was an adaptation of a comic book that nobody read.
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 6:23 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 6:23 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Not a flop. Awesome. Probably the best, weirdest thing many of its actors have ever been in. Someday it'll be appreciated in retrospect like Lynch's Dune.
posted by unmake at 6:24 PM on July 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by unmake at 6:24 PM on July 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
Not a flop. Awesome. Probably the best, weirdest thing many of its actors have ever been in.
This movie is 100% an enormous flop, regardless of what history's ultimate verdict of it is. That's just mathematics.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 6:29 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
This movie is 100% an enormous flop, regardless of what history's ultimate verdict of it is. That's just mathematics.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 6:29 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
(Arguably Nowhere, too, which Kaboom is very similar to; Southland Tales actually sort of reminds me a lot of both films, but with stronger worldbuilding and messier everything else.)
Good interview/writeup, though. I, too, prefer to think of the movie as a psychedelic funhouse mirror more than a literal science fiction comedy thing. Also, I had no idea it was shot in only 29 days; that might explain a lot.
posted by byanyothername at 6:35 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Good interview/writeup, though. I, too, prefer to think of the movie as a psychedelic funhouse mirror more than a literal science fiction comedy thing. Also, I had no idea it was shot in only 29 days; that might explain a lot.
posted by byanyothername at 6:35 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
A review of Southland Tales by DirtyOldTown, in handy bar graph form.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:41 PM on July 10, 2013 [5 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:41 PM on July 10, 2013 [5 favorites]
I like it. But if Kelly is ever able to patch together the "finished" version, i'd probably like it a lot more. I mean, Serpentine was the secret villain behind the spacetime collapse? I'd have liked to know that, you know, while watching the thing.
"....can i see the C**k Chuggers?"
posted by ELF Radio at 6:42 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
"....can i see the C**k Chuggers?"
posted by ELF Radio at 6:42 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
I have a weird appreciation for Southland Tales. I think of it as either the greatest terrible movie I've ever seen, or the worst great movie, often both simultaneously. And that description of Kelly providing a whole series of matter-of-fact answers to inscrutable elements of the film being a bit disappointing *really* resonates... I got the same feeling watching the 'directors cut' of Donnie Darko with the added scenes and FX and explanations, along with the commentary track. Kelly decided to explain all the specific details and how the entire plot worked and I was just like 'no buddy, sorry, you're the director and that's cool but that's not what the movie is about.' It's fantastic that he has all the info about these things clearly mapped out and adhering to some sort of film-internal logic structure, but I honestly thinks it works better if it's not explained.
posted by FatherDagon at 6:49 PM on July 10, 2013 [7 favorites]
posted by FatherDagon at 6:49 PM on July 10, 2013 [7 favorites]
Also, I really wish people would address the role filesharing has played in certain works attaining cult status. The BSG creators have admitted this. I never watched Donnie Darko (or Ginger Snaps, orDog Soldiers) on DVD - if they blew up on college campuses it was probably because they were being shared on ResNet's. Hell, I watched, and shared with friends, a copy of Sex y Lucia which had been fansubbed!
posted by unmake at 6:49 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by unmake at 6:49 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
I like to think of the entire movie as just an excuse to have a dance number at the same skee-ball lane Aunt Dorian took me to when I was 9.
posted by The Whelk at 6:49 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by The Whelk at 6:49 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
Really tried to watch it once. After a few minutes I shouted "Show, Don't Tell!" and turned it off.
posted by borges at 7:32 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by borges at 7:32 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
It's one of my favorites. I'd definitely watch a recut.
posted by codacorolla at 7:38 PM on July 10, 2013
posted by codacorolla at 7:38 PM on July 10, 2013
This article is pretty amazing, even if you haven't seen the movie (I haven't).
posted by empath at 7:44 PM on July 10, 2013
posted by empath at 7:44 PM on July 10, 2013
I probably need to re-watch this movie now. I sat through the whole thing one night when I was back home in my parents' basement feeling like a disgruntled teen again, but I remember virtually nothing aside from the floating ice-cream truck scene. I think in the end I decided I liked it simply because it made me feel like I'd taken mushrooms when I was stone cold sober.
But yeah, great article/interview.
posted by mannequito at 7:58 PM on July 10, 2013
But yeah, great article/interview.
posted by mannequito at 7:58 PM on July 10, 2013
I interviewed Kelly years ago, and he struck me as a very sane, thoughtful, decent fellow. But this was around the time of the Donnie Darko director's cut, and I had some of the same problems then that this writer does now. Kelly basically does exactly what people said they wanted the Lost writers (or David Lynch circa Twin Peaks) to do: he has the whole story meticulously mapped out in his head, and all of the weird details have logical causes he is perfectly willing to explain. And in doing so, he really kills the power to be found in ambiguity. It's much more haunting to wonder if Donnie Darko is just a kid having a breakdown, than it is to know for sure that he's gotten stuck in some big Star Trek-y parallel universe deal.
I think this movie belongs in that handful of movies where questions of good and bad don't really apply, up there with Head and The Bed-Sitting Room. They are brilliant messes.
posted by Ursula Hitler at 8:00 PM on July 10, 2013 [5 favorites]
I think this movie belongs in that handful of movies where questions of good and bad don't really apply, up there with Head and The Bed-Sitting Room. They are brilliant messes.
posted by Ursula Hitler at 8:00 PM on July 10, 2013 [5 favorites]
It legitimately frightens me to recommend Southland Tales to people ... I know they're 70% likely to hate it, abhor it, scream "Show! Don't Tell" and shut it off ... and I just don't want that to happen to that movie again. It's dealt with so much pain already!
An apocalyptic sci-fi movie, directed as if it were a farce, by someone with the expert craftsmanship to know that could never possibly go down easy.
It's a brilliant mess. And I guess as people discover in finding too much out about it, part of its brilliance is that it's a mess.
Either you can dig that kind of thing, or you won't. And this is on such an epic level of the category that there's a good chance it will drive you absolutely mad even if you dig that kind of thing. Angry mad, not insane mad.
If you can watch it and love it though: you love it. You can't imagine not seeing it.
But yeah, I wouldn't watch it if I gave myself my strange form of recommendation. So I see how I can be euphoric every time I talk about it and still only convince one other person to watch it since it released.
Which worked out for everyone involved.
posted by pokermonk at 8:19 PM on July 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
An apocalyptic sci-fi movie, directed as if it were a farce, by someone with the expert craftsmanship to know that could never possibly go down easy.
It's a brilliant mess. And I guess as people discover in finding too much out about it, part of its brilliance is that it's a mess.
Either you can dig that kind of thing, or you won't. And this is on such an epic level of the category that there's a good chance it will drive you absolutely mad even if you dig that kind of thing. Angry mad, not insane mad.
If you can watch it and love it though: you love it. You can't imagine not seeing it.
But yeah, I wouldn't watch it if I gave myself my strange form of recommendation. So I see how I can be euphoric every time I talk about it and still only convince one other person to watch it since it released.
Which worked out for everyone involved.
posted by pokermonk at 8:19 PM on July 10, 2013 [3 favorites]
In the A.V. Club article, he simply refers to the director as Kelly, even in the first instance. Several usages later he calls him R. Kelly (exactly once), but at no time does the article fully name him. Is this just basic fail or is it some kind of joke I'm not getting, as the writer seems to sort of half-assedly imply when called out in the comments?
posted by George_Spiggott at 8:37 PM on July 10, 2013
posted by George_Spiggott at 8:37 PM on July 10, 2013
Either you can dig that kind of thing, or you won't. And this is on such an epic level of the category that there's a good chance it will drive you absolutely mad even if you dig that kind of thing. Angry mad, not insane mad.
Yeah, this. I rented it because, hey, I like weird shit, and I love sci-fi, and I loved Donnie Darko. So even if other people disliked Southland Tales, I'd like it. But... it hurts. Like there's a 3 hour space carved out in my brain, and thinking about it just hurts. Every time I try and grasp it it slips away. I'm partly reminded me of the Aeon Flux live action movie, but that was all gorgeous visuals.
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 8:51 PM on July 10, 2013
The Agony Booth has done an exhaustive, collaborative Mega Recap of Southland Tales, which is a great primer on making sense (or at least discussing) this clusterfuck of a film. It's an entertaining read, if nothing else, and definitely makes the movie seem intriguing, in an "it can't possibly be that weird and shitty, can it?" way.
Note: yes, it can.
posted by ShutterBun at 8:59 PM on July 10, 2013
Note: yes, it can.
posted by ShutterBun at 8:59 PM on July 10, 2013
There is a 'Cannes Cut' of the film with the additional 20 minutes of unreleased footage and fairly decent vid quality if you ::cough:: know where to look.
posted by FatherDagon at 9:29 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by FatherDagon at 9:29 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
My favorite part was when Jon Lovitz said, "Flow, my tears."
That was great.
posted by Steely-eyed Missile Man at 9:37 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
That was great.
posted by Steely-eyed Missile Man at 9:37 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
My favorite part was when Jon Lovitz said, "Flow, my tears."
That was great.
I think I clapped when he said that.
The Agony Booth review makes it sound normal at the start:
This is a movie where government-funded think-tanks employ midgets wearing translucent raincoats to spy on the internet. This is a movie where good old-fashioned Marxism has spawned a massive underground movement. This is a movie where people speak in song lyrics, and the Republican candidate for vice president quotes the poetry of Robert Frost in his everyday speech for no reason.
Like... isn't Marxism already an underground movement? Don't some people already speak in song lyrics (I tend to)? Isn't Robert Frost a safe poet to quote?
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 9:44 PM on July 10, 2013
I fucking love Southland Tales. I've watched it more than I've watched any other movie. It is a batshit insane glorious mess: equal parts acidic, prophetic, hilarious, absurd, and maddening. Maybe slightly more maddening than anything else.
A couple of years ago, Strand Books finally got a copy of the graphic novel prequels. I was there IMMEDIATELY to buy it. The checkout clerk saw the book and said "Oh. I watched this movie once. I think it gave me a migraine."
"I can't stop watching this movie," I said. "I've watched it twenty times in the last six months."
She gave me the weirdest look and said: "Oh. You're one of those."
"Uh, yeah," I said. "I guess I am."
In conclusion: Scientists are saying the future is going to be far more futuristic than they originally predicted.
posted by davidjmcgee at 10:01 PM on July 10, 2013 [10 favorites]
A couple of years ago, Strand Books finally got a copy of the graphic novel prequels. I was there IMMEDIATELY to buy it. The checkout clerk saw the book and said "Oh. I watched this movie once. I think it gave me a migraine."
"I can't stop watching this movie," I said. "I've watched it twenty times in the last six months."
She gave me the weirdest look and said: "Oh. You're one of those."
"Uh, yeah," I said. "I guess I am."
In conclusion: Scientists are saying the future is going to be far more futuristic than they originally predicted.
posted by davidjmcgee at 10:01 PM on July 10, 2013 [10 favorites]
Join us for an in-depth discussion of the penetrating issues facing society today. Issues like: abortion, terrorism, crime, poverty, social reform, quantum teleportation, teen horniness, and war.
posted by davidjmcgee at 10:04 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by davidjmcgee at 10:04 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
I am too drunk tonight to comment on this thread, so I will just put this placeholder comment in before I unleash an unholy screed about how much I fucking love this movie. This movie is _my_ kind of weird. Like, a mix of High Weirdness By Mail, Cyberpunk, Phillip K. Dick, Heinlein, and Gonzo, with some strange Jungian overtones to boot.
Sigh, you had to post this after I had a really stressful day at work. I wish I had a copy of this. I'm going to have to buy a copy after my next paycheck, and subject everyone to this wonderful movie. And it is wonderful. Full of wonder. And spectacle. And so much subtext and beauty.
posted by daq at 10:17 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
Sigh, you had to post this after I had a really stressful day at work. I wish I had a copy of this. I'm going to have to buy a copy after my next paycheck, and subject everyone to this wonderful movie. And it is wonderful. Full of wonder. And spectacle. And so much subtext and beauty.
posted by daq at 10:17 PM on July 10, 2013 [2 favorites]
Be careful about recommending or showing this movie to friends. They may be really, really angry at you afterward.
Uh. I've heard. From people.
Who were angry at me.
posted by davidjmcgee at 10:19 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Uh. I've heard. From people.
Who were angry at me.
posted by davidjmcgee at 10:19 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Given that the director's cut of Donnie Darko certainly moved in the wrong direction, I wonder if someone could come up with the anti-director's cut of Southland Tales, that actually takes a few more scenes out to heighten and distill what we love about it -- without turning it into complete mush. The nice thing is a cut in that direction could actually be done by anyone, though instead of being like the usual fan cuts, it would work to magnify and concentrate the incoherence, insanity, and allusiveness.
Maybe then all my doubting friends would believe me. ...Or maybe not.
posted by chortly at 11:06 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Maybe then all my doubting friends would believe me. ...Or maybe not.
posted by chortly at 11:06 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
Just cut it up and splice it together at random.
posted by empath at 11:12 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by empath at 11:12 PM on July 10, 2013 [1 favorite]
And in doing so, he really kills the power to be found in ambiguity. It's much more haunting to wonder if Donnie Darko is just a kid having a breakdown, than it is to know for sure that he's gotten stuck in some big Star Trek-y parallel universe deal.
You don't really need ambiguity per se for that. You need to leave something open, and invite the viewer to fill it. That can be done by irresolvable symbolism or incomplete stories. Then again it can be done by asking compelling questions.
Since Richard Kelly evidently finished filming the film, and he's already sharing scripts and so forth, maybe he'd be amenable to sticking the raw footage in a torrent and letting his fans finish it.
posted by LogicalDash at 11:46 PM on July 10, 2013
You don't really need ambiguity per se for that. You need to leave something open, and invite the viewer to fill it. That can be done by irresolvable symbolism or incomplete stories. Then again it can be done by asking compelling questions.
Since Richard Kelly evidently finished filming the film, and he's already sharing scripts and so forth, maybe he'd be amenable to sticking the raw footage in a torrent and letting his fans finish it.
posted by LogicalDash at 11:46 PM on July 10, 2013
I told a kid I worked with about this thing a few years ago, the way I tell anyone about it: I said it was an incoherent bloody mess, and I loved it. He asked to borrow the DVD, and after he gave it back, asked to borrow it again like a week later.
I really like it a lot, even if I am a little mystified about the poop stuff.
posted by Mister Moofoo at 1:08 AM on July 11, 2013
I really like it a lot, even if I am a little mystified about the poop stuff.
posted by Mister Moofoo at 1:08 AM on July 11, 2013
I'm going to reiterate the sentiment I'm seeing here about Kelly and the Donnie Darko directors cut. I liked the original framing of classic teen angst in an abstract "what if you knew you were going to die in a month" story. I once likened it to YA Charlie Kaufman. But I've become convinced that the original cut works as well as it does somewhat by accident.
I guess what I'm saying is I haven't seen Southland Tales yet but I'm far more interested in the version that doesn't make sense.
posted by atoxyl at 1:13 AM on July 11, 2013
I guess what I'm saying is I haven't seen Southland Tales yet but I'm far more interested in the version that doesn't make sense.
posted by atoxyl at 1:13 AM on July 11, 2013
Does this movie sound like pretty much any old opera you'd care to pick?
posted by mikelieman at 1:25 AM on July 11, 2013
posted by mikelieman at 1:25 AM on July 11, 2013
I've wondered about this one for a while, but I hated Donnie Darko, so I'm not sure where that leaves me.
posted by dhartung at 1:31 AM on July 11, 2013
posted by dhartung at 1:31 AM on July 11, 2013
I remember being pretty excited in the lead up to this. Not only was Richard Kelly, director of Donnie Darko, getting to make a big ambitious film, but Darren Aronofsky, director of Pi and Requiem for a Dream, had his big ambitious film The Fountain on the way as well.
I read the prequel comics and thought yes, this is a weird messed up world I can't wait to see where it's all going. It stars The Rock? And Stifler? That's crazy. Justin Timberlake bursts into song? Were it anything other than a film by Richard Kelly, director of Donnie Darko, that would just be silly! But this will be amazing!
Well, The Fountain ended up being just kind of flat and I've since managed to re-appraise it and appreciate it for what it is.
Southland Tales I watched and just had that sad creeping little voice in my head saying "This... this just isn't very good is it?" I've come back to it from time to time trying to find an in and just haven't had any luck. It's like every component of the film is screaming at me that I should be enjoying this, because by all rights I should. The director, the music, the actors (the ones I love and especially the ones I don't), the world, all of it. But it leaves me cold and disappointed.
Perhaps the Cannes cut!
posted by dumbland at 2:21 AM on July 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
I read the prequel comics and thought yes, this is a weird messed up world I can't wait to see where it's all going. It stars The Rock? And Stifler? That's crazy. Justin Timberlake bursts into song? Were it anything other than a film by Richard Kelly, director of Donnie Darko, that would just be silly! But this will be amazing!
Well, The Fountain ended up being just kind of flat and I've since managed to re-appraise it and appreciate it for what it is.
Southland Tales I watched and just had that sad creeping little voice in my head saying "This... this just isn't very good is it?" I've come back to it from time to time trying to find an in and just haven't had any luck. It's like every component of the film is screaming at me that I should be enjoying this, because by all rights I should. The director, the music, the actors (the ones I love and especially the ones I don't), the world, all of it. But it leaves me cold and disappointed.
Perhaps the Cannes cut!
posted by dumbland at 2:21 AM on July 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
I can see why Kelly is obsessed with the movie; he made a big stinking turd of a film, which turned him from a Spielberg-in-the-making to... what? Another guy hawking scripts? It'd probably be better for his mental health if we buried all the copies of this movie next to the ET game, somewhere in the desert.
Please note that I'm not knocking anybody for liking this. Southland Tales has it's moments; not enough of them for my taste, but there's plenty of worse films. But imagine if something you did, or made, at the start of your career was the thing that you were always judged against. Seems like a pretty crap deal, to me. If he was a regular Joe, he'd have a chance to walk away and re-invent himself, but that's never going to happen in this situation.
posted by The River Ivel at 4:51 AM on July 11, 2013
Please note that I'm not knocking anybody for liking this. Southland Tales has it's moments; not enough of them for my taste, but there's plenty of worse films. But imagine if something you did, or made, at the start of your career was the thing that you were always judged against. Seems like a pretty crap deal, to me. If he was a regular Joe, he'd have a chance to walk away and re-invent himself, but that's never going to happen in this situation.
posted by The River Ivel at 4:51 AM on July 11, 2013
I am so relieved that other people understand how I feel about this movie -- so, so awful, yet amazingly and fascinatingly close to being wonderful. I couldn't believe something could be so shitty and almost great at the same time. When I watched Donnie Darko, I had to pause it for a minute in the middle just to calm down -- I was so excited and so stressed out by the incredible tension! When I watched Southland Tales, I was also stressed out . . . but not by its greatness. It really is a clusterfuck of a movie.
I love his soundtracks, though -- that creepy, lovely Star-Spangled Banner performance by Rebekah del Rio gives me the chills every time I hear it and is worth the price of admittance on its own.
posted by theredpen at 6:21 AM on July 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
I love his soundtracks, though -- that creepy, lovely Star-Spangled Banner performance by Rebekah del Rio gives me the chills every time I hear it and is worth the price of admittance on its own.
posted by theredpen at 6:21 AM on July 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
on the one hand, I can't blame anyone for thinking this movie is shit... but on the other hand, you poo too.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 7:49 AM on July 11, 2013
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 7:49 AM on July 11, 2013
I love this movie. It is very high on my list of favorite films. It is sprawling and ridiculous but I count these as successes. And it deals with realities of 21st Century America like few other films; it is interesting to hear Kelly address that in the linked article.
Also while the extra footage in the Cannes cut was interesting I found it less coherent and am not sure I would like the movie all that much if that was all I had seen.
posted by mountmccabe at 8:14 AM on July 11, 2013
Also while the extra footage in the Cannes cut was interesting I found it less coherent and am not sure I would like the movie all that much if that was all I had seen.
posted by mountmccabe at 8:14 AM on July 11, 2013
I think the reason that I like Southland Tales so much is that you get a sense that it's a very complete world, and that you're getting a brief snapshot from that world. The plot is confusing, but it doesn't matter because it's bolstered by the world built around it.
It's the reason that I like Last Year at Marienbad in spite of its opaque plot (something is definitely happening, but the main draw is getting lost inside the shifting maze of the mansion alongside the characters), Lynch's puzzle movies (Mulholland, Lost Highway, and Inland Empire are all 'solvable', but the main draw is that you're getting drawn in the madness and dream logic of the protagonist's mind), and the overwhelming atmosphere of Carruth's films (the insane contortions of Primer and the zenlike quality of Upstream Color).
In a similar fashion, I recently rewatched the stupefying early 90s Mario Bros movie, and found myself really enjoying it because there was this barely explored background atmosphere of the Koopa society, which captured the same deprecated high technology feel as Alien, decaying urban futurist landscape as The Fifth Element, and strange S&M clothing trends. The plot, at that point, is almost besides the point (which is good, because the plot is as moronic as you'd expect a Mario Bros movie to be), and gives you a reason just to exist in a bizarre place for an hour and a half.
I'd like any excuse for Kelly to spend a little more time in the world, but I don't know that I care so much about the plot that allows that to happen. I think I'd be fine with extended cut if it allowed that to happen.
posted by codacorolla at 8:43 AM on July 11, 2013 [5 favorites]
It's the reason that I like Last Year at Marienbad in spite of its opaque plot (something is definitely happening, but the main draw is getting lost inside the shifting maze of the mansion alongside the characters), Lynch's puzzle movies (Mulholland, Lost Highway, and Inland Empire are all 'solvable', but the main draw is that you're getting drawn in the madness and dream logic of the protagonist's mind), and the overwhelming atmosphere of Carruth's films (the insane contortions of Primer and the zenlike quality of Upstream Color).
In a similar fashion, I recently rewatched the stupefying early 90s Mario Bros movie, and found myself really enjoying it because there was this barely explored background atmosphere of the Koopa society, which captured the same deprecated high technology feel as Alien, decaying urban futurist landscape as The Fifth Element, and strange S&M clothing trends. The plot, at that point, is almost besides the point (which is good, because the plot is as moronic as you'd expect a Mario Bros movie to be), and gives you a reason just to exist in a bizarre place for an hour and a half.
I'd like any excuse for Kelly to spend a little more time in the world, but I don't know that I care so much about the plot that allows that to happen. I think I'd be fine with extended cut if it allowed that to happen.
posted by codacorolla at 8:43 AM on July 11, 2013 [5 favorites]
In a similar fashion, I recently rewatched the stupefying early 90s Mario Bros movie, and found myself really enjoying it because there was this barely explored background atmosphere of the Koopa society, which captured the same deprecated high technology feel as Alien, decaying urban futurist landscape as The Fifth Element, and strange S&M clothing trends. The plot, at that point, is almost besides the point (which is good, because the plot is as moronic as you'd expect a Mario Bros movie to be), and gives you a reason just to exist in a bizarre place for an hour and a half.
For some reason my friend had a screener VHS of Super Mario Bros. when I was a kid so I have seen that movie upward of ten times. Probably well upward. I wouldn't claim it to be good but it's far from unwatchable, and it has Dennis Hopper in it.
posted by atoxyl at 2:43 PM on July 11, 2013
For some reason my friend had a screener VHS of Super Mario Bros. when I was a kid so I have seen that movie upward of ten times. Probably well upward. I wouldn't claim it to be good but it's far from unwatchable, and it has Dennis Hopper in it.
posted by atoxyl at 2:43 PM on July 11, 2013
It's the reason that I like Last Year at Marienbad in spite of its opaque plot (something is definitely happening, but the main draw is getting lost inside the shifting maze of the mansion alongside the characters), Lynch's puzzle movies (Mulholland, Lost Highway, and Inland Empire are all 'solvable', but the main draw is that you're getting drawn in the madness and dream logic of the protagonist's mind), and the overwhelming atmosphere of Carruth's films (the insane contortions of Primer and the zenlike quality of Upstream Color).
The difference is, though, I didn't feel like Southland Tales had the confidence of Lynch or Carruth, or their trust in images.
posted by Charlemagne In Sweatpants at 4:33 PM on July 11, 2013
Cool. I remember the movie and how bad everyone said it was, then totally forgot it. Now I gotta see it.
posted by mrgrimm at 11:43 PM on July 11, 2013
posted by mrgrimm at 11:43 PM on July 11, 2013
"You don't really need ambiguity per se for that. You need to leave something open, and invite the viewer to fill it."
I'm not really sure how ambiguity is different from leaving something open.
posted by Ursula Hitler at 3:55 AM on July 12, 2013
I'm not really sure how ambiguity is different from leaving something open.
posted by Ursula Hitler at 3:55 AM on July 12, 2013
ambiguity : leaving something open :: oversharing : withholding a secret.
posted by mrgrimm at 10:00 PM on July 12, 2013
posted by mrgrimm at 10:00 PM on July 12, 2013
More or less what mrgrimm said. In place of ambiguity I prefer my fiction to use broad strokes, that I may understand it as-is or imagine the real story as I choose.
posted by LogicalDash at 1:53 AM on July 13, 2013
posted by LogicalDash at 1:53 AM on July 13, 2013
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Which sounds just lovely to me.
posted by byanyothername at 6:08 PM on July 10, 2013 [15 favorites]