the snow instigateth not lugubriosity within me…

June 4, 2014 5:26 AM

The Egyptian singer Nesma Mahgoub, in the song’s chorus, sings, “Discharge thy secret! I shall not bear the torment!” and “I dread not all that shall be said! Discharge the storm clouds! The snow instigateth not lugubriosity within me…” From one song to the next, there isn’t a declensional ending dropped or an antique expression avoided, whether it is sung by a dancing snowman or a choir of forest trolls. The Arabic of “Frozen” is frozen in time, as “localized” to contemporary Middle Eastern youth culture as Latin quatrains in French rap.

So Disney used to translate its movies into Egyptian Arabic but recently switched to Modern Standard Arabic, which is somewhat more formal.
posted by MartinWisse (19 comments total)

"Love Those Dried Apricots" will never be the same.
posted by Ice Cream Socialist at 5:28 AM on June 4, 2014

It's all just corruption from the beautiful elegance of the original Klingon anyway.
posted by Etrigan at 5:33 AM on June 4, 2014 [5 favorites]

I would love to see a full *re*translation of the formal Arabic back into high English. Actually, that would be a pretty cool project - word-for-word redubs of translated movies.
posted by Think_Long at 5:53 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]

I'm teaching young women from the Middle East at a college in the GCC right now, and they were telling me how Disney movies have shaped their Arabic and how they have absorbed Egyptian Arabic because of them. I wonder why they switched from the Egyptian dialect and if it has anything to do with the turmoil in Egypt.
posted by mecran01 at 6:13 AM on June 4, 2014

you can't really do that though. MSA isn't just 'formal' in the way English can be formal, meaning by word usage, but rather the whole grammar structure. In essence, things that are implied in regular language are made very explicit in MSA.
posted by MisantropicPainforest at 6:15 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]

in other words, word-for-word can't be done.

in english: "It was written"

In MSA: kutiba.
posted by MisantropicPainforest at 6:18 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]

I saw this on Twitter the other day, it was quite interesting. The multi-lingual video mentioned in the piece Is quite interesting to watch, as well --- they manage to get and/or create a remarkable similarity in tone in so many different languages.
posted by Diablevert at 6:20 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]

Now I want a Disney movie in Latin !
posted by Pendragon at 6:20 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]

Well, not word-for-word I guess, but a similar literal translation as the small one in the article.
posted by Think_Long at 6:25 AM on June 4, 2014

Exaggerate that "literal" translation just a little bit more, and
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 6:36 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]

As everyone knows, "Frozen" is best viewed in the original Klingon.
posted by ZenMasterThis at 6:59 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]

Previously: The Wonderful World of Babel, on translating Disney movies around the world.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:02 AM on June 4, 2014

Now I want a Disney movie in Latin!

Which one? Old Latin, Classical Latin, Vulgar Latin, Medieval Latin, Renaissance Latin? I can see skipping Contemporary Latin, that's us shepherding a language, not one growing naturally through common use.

But the difference between Classical Latin and Vulgar Latin is the same problem set as the difference between Modern Standard Arabic and Egyptian Vernacular Arabic. Note that Vulgar, here, is the original meaning of the word, which is closer to "Common" or "vernacular", not the pejorative sense that we use it today (though speakers of Classical Latin probably did thing that Vulgar Latin was vulgar in our sense.)
posted by eriko at 7:16 AM on June 4, 2014 [1 favorite]

I was thinking the same thing, but I'll settle for Lilo and Stitch in Classical Latin. Re-recording the Elvis songs might get tricky, though.
posted by McCoy Pauley at 10:51 AM on June 4, 2014

... but I'll settle for Lilo and Stitch in Classical Latin. Re-recording the Elvis songs might get tricky, though.

It's already been done.
posted by benito.strauss at 10:55 AM on June 4, 2014

It would be really interesting to know why Disney chose to go this route. If they've been successful releasing films in Egyptian Arabic in the past, why make Frozen suddenly more formal?

It's not like the material in the film lends itself to formality. As the author of the TFA points out, the characters in Frozen actually use far more idiomatic, informal English than any past Disney leads that I can think of. (Okay, since The Emperor's New Groove. Ugh.)

Is it a snub to Egyptian audiences? A sop to cultural conservatives in the Gulf states? Laziness in an attempt to avoid demands to localize more specifically?

It seems odd, and Disney is, as usual, inscrutable.
posted by Kadin2048 at 11:11 AM on June 4, 2014

It would be really interesting to know why Disney chose to go this route. If they've been successful releasing films in Egyptian Arabic in the past, why make Frozen suddenly more formal?

The author points to the Arab-speaking world itself:

It reflects, rather, an ideology propagated by linguistic purists in the region, rooted in many centuries of literary and religious history.

I would assume this decision was made by whatever division of Disney operates in the Arab-speaking world, and presumably the executives of that division are as immersed in its lingu-cultural battles as anyone.
posted by Think_Long at 2:19 PM on June 4, 2014

She writes beautifully.
posted by Sebmojo at 4:33 PM on June 4, 2014

Kadin2048: "Okay, since The Emperor's New Groove. Ugh."

Hey, Warburton is gold in that movie.
posted by Chrysostom at 9:48 AM on June 5, 2014