January 28, 2002

6:13 PM

Rock band Creed is not fond of free speech.Creed was slammed on this site recently and their actions toward this music critic in Cleveland doesn't help their cause. In this case, Creed seems to be doing a lot of "Do as I say, not as a I do" speak. I was at the Cleveland show Sunday night and I enjoyed the concert, but this story is disappointing.
posted by munger (94 comments total)

well, as much as i loathe creed, this is their Handlers, not them--unless they left instructions regarding this, which i doubt they have time for...
posted by th3ph17 at 6:21 PM on January 28, 2002

You went to a Creed concert?

On purpose?
posted by brittney at 6:25 PM on January 28, 2002

Must resist urge to bash lame band. Must not turn thread into discussion of how much Creed sucks. Must focus on band's unkind treatment of music reviewer. Resistance crumbling. Blinded by incredible lameness of band. A lameness which appears to lack boundaries. A lameness which grows stronger with every passing second. Must run. Must find a place to hide from all-encompassing lameness, which now dwarfs even the Sun itself. There is nowhere. We are all doomed. Tell my Mom I loved her.
posted by Optamystic at 6:36 PM on January 28, 2002

This seems less like a free speech issue and more like a plain old dumbass issue. Their publicist wasn't engaging in censorship -- he was just being a dumbass.
posted by tweebiscuit at 6:38 PM on January 28, 2002

Must resist urge to they suck. God, do they suck.
posted by Ty Webb at 6:39 PM on January 28, 2002

...though, the lead singer guy seems to think he is god-like. Perhaps he did leave instructions with his handlers to make sure this poor critic was turned away from the gates of heaven, err, the concert.
posted by th3ph17 at 6:49 PM on January 28, 2002

Must resist to propagating lame saying about a lame band.

Screw it; some things have to be said:

I liked Creed better the first time around when they went under the name of ”Pearl Jam”
posted by plemeljr at 6:49 PM on January 28, 2002

Despite Creed's closeness to God, I still think they're one of the sings of a coming apoclypse. I'm an athiest, but I think that if there is a god, he/she would have better tase in music.
posted by SweetJesus at 7:20 PM on January 28, 2002

If there were a God, He would have verily smitten these chumps long ago.
posted by Optamystic at 7:32 PM on January 28, 2002

amen!
posted by mcsweetie at 7:35 PM on January 28, 2002

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Creed are not that bad. They are far from my favorites(that honor belongs to my beloved Replacements) but if "Higher" comes on my car radio, I'll start singing along. Save your hatred for a band that really desrves it like LFO or Britney.
As far as the story goes, if it did go down the way this dude says than that's not good. But if it didn't it sure wouldn't be the first case of a music critic venting sour grapes.
posted by jonmc at 7:49 PM on January 28, 2002

Ugh. "Higher" sounds like it could be the love theme for a Jerry Bruckheimer movie.
posted by schmedeman at 7:51 PM on January 28, 2002

Y'know I think you all doth protest too much. I'm willing to bet that among all your Cure, Smiths, and Belle and Sebastian records lurk some egregiously unhip hair-metal and stadium rock. It's time you all came out of the closet and embraced your inner mullet-head.
I mean I love my Replacements, Captain Beefheart, and Husker Du, but I also dig my Creed, Journey and Blackfoot. And I have no trouble reconciling these seemingly antagonistic impulses. So, if you'll excuse me...

*flicks bic*

"Anyway you want it...that's the way you need it"
posted by jonmc at 8:01 PM on January 28, 2002

Look, there is no way they are the worst "new" rock band. They aren't very good; I would even venture that they suck. But when the time has come to compile a list of the worst new rock bands (and perhaps we're doing it here), Creed will not be high on the list. At least they can agree on the frickin' tempo. Witness new rock by Alien Ant Farm, Hubastank and Disturbed; it can't even be called musical.

Whoops, but that's not really what this thread is about. Sorry.
posted by Yelling At Nothing at 8:08 PM on January 28, 2002

I'm willing to bet that among all your Cure, Smiths, and Belle and Sebastian records lurk some egregiously unhip hair-metal and stadium rock.

I have no such records of any of these kinds. Put some Neutral Milk Hotel in your stereo, y'all!
posted by mcsweetie at 8:16 PM on January 28, 2002

Journalists shouldn't be relying on freebies from bands and their corporations anyway. In a perfect world, the newspapers would pick up the tab. When I was a reporter, I knew I could go to any play, see any concert, own any CD or piece of software, just by picking up the phone and claiming to be interested in writing a review. But that ability gets so seductive it starts to feel like a privilege -- hence the whiny tone of this guy's "story."
posted by argybarg at 8:19 PM on January 28, 2002

"I will say Creed was easier to stomach with several muffling layers of steel and stone between us."

Game, set and match to the writer. And for the record, Creed sucks.
posted by swerve at 8:21 PM on January 28, 2002

mcsweetie, my man, my Neutral Milk Hotel sits right next to my Lynyrd Skynyrd, my Sigur Ros right next to my Rush, my R.E.M. right next to my Alice Cooper.
I am large, I contain multitudes.
As many wise men have said before me, It's all good.
posted by jonmc at 8:27 PM on January 28, 2002

Put some Neutral Milk Hotel in your stereo, y'all!

Obey the McSweetie.

But yes, I own some pretty unhip music.
posted by Optamystic at 8:31 PM on January 28, 2002

Wait wait... LFO? Are we thinking of the SAME LFO? The LFO with Mark Bell? Guess you weren't to fond of of his work with bjork onselmasongs and post either?

Or am I so ignorant that theres another LFO out there and i just dont know it?
posted by atom128 at 8:31 PM on January 28, 2002

Whoa. How can someone even mention Creed and Journey in the same breath?

I may have been an uber-cool late-80s/early90s college-radio DJ, when alternative was still alternative, but damnit...Journey still didn't suck!

I didn't think they sucked when I worshipped the Pixies, and I don't think they suck now.

Now CREED.......blargh blargh blargh...
posted by metrocake at 8:32 PM on January 28, 2002

/me thinks about that NMH song that starts out 'I love you Jesus Christ, Jesus Christ I love you..."
You may all form conspiracy theories now.
posted by darukaru at 8:33 PM on January 28, 2002

atom128 - yes there is another LFO out there, possibly the worst band in history, they did that positively execrable "Summer Girls" song. Compared to them Creed are Led Zeppelin...
posted by jonmc at 8:35 PM on January 28, 2002

and brother metrocake, thank you for testifyin' let your mullet fly brotherman
posted by jonmc at 8:36 PM on January 28, 2002

Um.......

That's *sistah* to you, babe... :D
posted by metrocake at 8:39 PM on January 28, 2002

I thought publicists were supposed to know how to relate with the press?
posted by tomorama at 8:40 PM on January 28, 2002

That's *sistah* to you, babe... :D

oops, my bad. guess you'd have to have a fe-mullet then.
posted by jonmc at 8:43 PM on January 28, 2002

What's with the intense hatred of Creed? I have no doubt that they suck, but MOST bands suck. Why are they singled out by so many people? I'm actually curious, cause maybe there's a reason. I have heard the lead singer has a Jesus complex. Is that it?
posted by Doug at 8:50 PM on January 28, 2002

Doug, my theory is that Creed are singled out for hatred for a couple of reasons. One is simply some people just really don't like them, whish is fine and dandy. Secondly, they're a "Christian" band, which brings out the ire in some folks, although they're actually pretty restrained about their faith compared to some other bands in the Christian Rock set such as DC Talk or the Newsboys.
The third reaon, as I see it, is a little more complex, Creed and other 'stadium rock' or 'hair metal' outfits bring with them all sorts of connotations, most more about the bands audience than about the band itself. People tend to see (nonpunk)hard-rock fans as dumb beer-swilling losers, which is an unfair and unfortunate prejudice.
posted by jonmc at 8:59 PM on January 28, 2002

Why are they singled out by so many people?

Doug, it's one of those things that's so obvious, that gushes from their every pore, that screams lame, that cries disingenuousness, that reeks of preachiness and sanctimoniousness ......it's almost so overt that ironically it's hard to describe, and it's too late in the evening for a rant, but Creed pretty much embodies all trite bandwagon hoppers who've dined out on some kind of "edgy" image---and that makes a lot of people disgusted. With all the coverage they get, you'd think they're visionaries, which is an insult to compelling bands everywhere.

Did I say it's too late for a rant? : )
posted by Karl at 9:09 PM on January 28, 2002

jonmc- phew. had me worried.
posted by atom128 at 9:09 PM on January 28, 2002

"Um.......

That's *sistah* to you, babe"

True.

metrocake and Alex Kingston.

Any relation?
posted by mr_crash_davis at 9:12 PM on January 28, 2002

Oh we're gonna play that game...



jonmc
andTom Green

related?



posted by jonmc at 9:22 PM on January 28, 2002

Tom Green, no.

That guy who played Spivey in Dances With Wolves, yes.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 9:33 PM on January 28, 2002

Did anyone see any of the Creed tour-opening show on VH1? Maybe it was just the sound engineering, but when I came across the show, the band sounded painfully out of tune on an entire song. Dogs were probably howling all over metro Atlanta, site of the show. Don't remember what the song was, and didn't care at the time, actually, but I was screaming at the TV. I've never seen any performance so awful, ever, except for maybe the highly obscure pre-grrl garage band STD in Memphis in '87, opening for Scruffy the Cat. They had a song called, "I'm So Sad." The morose little number went, "I'm so sad / I'm so fucking sad / It's bad." Again, that Creed song was worse.

Also, the Jesus pose of the lead singer, as seen on several videos, is pretty creepy.
posted by raysmj at 9:35 PM on January 28, 2002

raysmj, I'd noticed that too. He does tend to strike that "crucify me" pose a little too frequently.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 9:39 PM on January 28, 2002

As many wise men have said before me, It's all good.

*bows*
posted by mcsweetie at 9:42 PM on January 28, 2002

He does tend to strike that "crucify me" pose a little too frequently

And there's never a hammer-weilding Roman Centurion around when you need one.
posted by Optamystic at 9:46 PM on January 28, 2002

People are defending Creed?

"Better nuke the planet from orbit. It's the only way to be sure."

Fucking Tallahassee white-trash martyr arrogant neo-Christian wannabe-rocker poseurs, their vomitous dirge pouring through the speaker mesh like the Blob only stinking of self-righteousness instead of bile, their utter lack of talent disguised by their "harmlessness." They are Pink Boys to such a disquieting degree, they embrace their mediocrity and wear it like a crown of thorns. They make the Dave Matthews Band look like Sigur Ros. A neutron bomb could have gone off in that Cleveland arena and the world would be no poorer. The sooner someone makes a dress out of their skin, the better. Kill them, fuck them, eat their eyes, chop off their hands, and rip out their tongues so their utter shit will clog our planet no more.

</utter, utter hate>
posted by solistrato at 9:46 PM on January 28, 2002

Fucking Tallahassee white-trash...

sjc- thanks you just proved my point for me.
posted by jonmc at 9:48 PM on January 28, 2002

they embrace their mediocrity....

As do I my freind. As should all...Embracing your mediocrity is the tru epath to inner peace...
posted by jonmc at 9:52 PM on January 28, 2002

I think Lao Tsu said that very thing. No, not the mediocrity thing. The thing that sjc said. It turns out that Creed's sucked a hole in the space-time continuum.
posted by Optamystic at 9:57 PM on January 28, 2002

Sheesh, all this fuss over a gay band:

I mean, in the sack, I assume these young Floridians are breeders or britneys. But the Creeders compose on the same principle as generations of queer rockers: lyrics coded so if you were skimming or repressed or something, you could hear them as all heteromantic, then file under love song, buy, listen, yearn, and move on. Sort of like with Erasure's "Chains of Love," or Melissa Etheridge's first three albums. Sure, when queer acts speak with forked tongue, in part it's about profitability. But it has the drama of someone on the outside looking in. Creed might never have heard about the outside if they hadn't been sent a copy of the Staind album.

posted by allaboutgeorge at 10:00 PM on January 28, 2002

In every Creed Is The Worst Band Ever thread I must point out: "Radiohead still sucks"

That is all.
posted by owillis at 10:41 PM on January 28, 2002

owillis: Actually, I'm the only person who used "worst" and "ever" in the same sentence here (in re to a Creed performance), and I'm not a Radiohead fan. Just for the record.
posted by raysmj at 10:47 PM on January 28, 2002

Now that we're full-tilt Creedbashing, I have to ask:

Is there a term for the I'm-so-earnest voice mutation that lead singer Stamp often does? It sounds like he's retracting his neck into his chest to try to widen his throat and force his voice to adopt a lower, more tortured and noble tone. I think he's got decent pipes but this affectation makes him sound like an overacting parody of Eddie Vetter.

If you're lucky enough to visit Milwaukee, where a local rock station is credited with "breaking" the band onto the national scene, you'll find that not only are the songs played beyond stone-cold death, but station-identification breaks are full of Milwaukee-loves-Creed-and-Creed-loves-Milwaukee stroking. Ick.
posted by Tubes at 10:56 PM on January 28, 2002

Oh. And, actually, I've been listening to Millie Jackson's Caught Up / Still Caught Up this evening. Just to throw in something totally irrelevant.
posted by raysmj at 10:56 PM on January 28, 2002

Secondly, they're a "Christian" band, which brings out the ire in some folks,

From the snippets I caught of their VH1 Behind the Music (why the hell did they deserve one already?) they're not, really. They're pseudoChristians/former Christians/truthseeking semi-Christians, which is even worse. They're kinda, but not quite, but still dabbling and babbling.

They lost any hope of ascending to greatness with me when Stapp threw a temper tantrum backstage at a festival concert a couple of summers ago, and refused to go on. The entire concert was delayed, meaning that the acts meant to follow Creed were all sitting around twiddling their thumbs, waiting for Stapp to pull his thumb out and take the stage. When Fred Durst confronted Stapp, Stapp gave him a brochure on anger management. Wussy little punk.
posted by Dreama at 11:20 PM on January 28, 2002

Look! It's another Creed-bashing thread! Wake me when it's over.
posted by KLAX at 11:21 PM on January 28, 2002

Creed is nothing but Pearl Jam with Mutt Lange producing and somebody from their label dressing them according to the latest MTV/VH-1 "look".

They're so slick and contrived, they're repulsive.

Now that we've done the Creed thing, does that mean it's time to start another kill-Dave-Matthews-Band thread?
posted by BarneyFifesBullet at 11:50 PM on January 28, 2002

What I hate about Creed is the lead guy's singing style, which Seattle music writer/producer Jack Endino calls "yarling" (scroll down a bit). He mentioned Dio, Eddie Vedder and Al Green (though thow shall not fuck with Rev. Al) as prime offenders.
And everytime I watch a Creed video, I wanna put "Jesus Christ Pose" by a REALLY GOOD BAND, Soundgarden...
posted by black8 at 1:26 AM on January 29, 2002

:: giggling ::

mr_crash_davis, you just cracked me up -- and I was having a bad morning 'till now. Thanks! :)

I actually get more of this -- especially when I'm in a bar, for some reason:
me
Chelsea Clinton

(And, y'know, now that I've had time to sleep on it and all.....Creed still sucks. :D)
posted by metrocake at 5:23 AM on January 29, 2002

For some reason all this CreedBashing™ makes me want to go out and buy their latest album, even though I have never really had any inkling in the past to do so...
posted by internal at 5:28 AM on January 29, 2002

Creed's an insanely popular band that critics hate. I think that's as much to blame for their bashing as the stuff that's already been mentioned here.

My wife has a weakness for pop stations that are otherwise being listened to by teen-agers, so I get to hear a lot of Creed.

Personally, I'd rather hear them than most of the other bands that get all the play on pop music stations. Anyone who thinks Creed's the most loathsome popular artist hasn't listened to enough Backstreet Boys or Missy "Misdemeanor" Elliot.
posted by rcade at 6:03 AM on January 29, 2002

For some reason all this CreedBashing™ makes me want to go out and buy their latest album, even though I have never really had any inkling in the past to do so...

And thus, the Dark Side gains another convert. I blame myself.
posted by Optamystic at 6:05 AM on January 29, 2002

Coming in at the end of the Creed Bash...stepping over the exhausted body of jonmc (I take your weary bic from your blistered hand and tuck it into the pocket of your flannel shirt, reverently; for you fought well)...I must ask, didn't anyone else think that this rock critic just didn't try very hard with this article? I mean, yeah, the publicist was an idiot, but he should have gotten a friend to buy him a (non-scalped) ticket and gone inside, then really ripped the band. I thought this was a little too pat, too brief, too unsatisfying. Although not as lame as a Creed song, it being over much more quickly.
posted by BT at 6:10 AM on January 29, 2002

Wait, can someone answer a question for me...

I believe that Creed is a *real* christian band... I think that they are on an independent record label, and I think that this independent record label is christian, and i know that they are into talking about their 'faith' and stuff. is it actually a christian record label? does anyone know? does the money go directly to jerry falwell?
I think that people have the right to believe whatever they want to, but I don't like the idea of the christian right co-opting teenage rebellion. that's freaky if they are really that staged...
can we discuss the christian metal/hardcore phenomenon, because it's really really fascinating...
posted by goneill at 6:39 AM on January 29, 2002

Have you guys heard any other Christian music? We have one guy at my work who will not listen to secular music and would play this during closing. Before long, we were begging him to play Creed instead.
posted by dagnyscott at 6:40 AM on January 29, 2002

I was at the release party for the first Creed album. It was held in the parking lot of a shabby used record store in Tallahassee. The Creed boys really just enjoyed playing rock, plain and simple. And the kids really dug them. It was reminiscent of a metal & mullet sound that you didn't usually hear so much at the time. (1997 saw releases from Hanson, the Spice Girls, OMC, Puff Daddy and Elton John's "Candle in the Wind 97".)

Anyway, I still have their indy label release of My Own Prison. All the band members signed it at the release party. Well, except Stapp of course. He was busy flirting with some of the college girls.
posted by ahughey at 6:53 AM on January 29, 2002

This interview with Creed guitarist Mark Tremonti is full of so many idiot-isms, it's hard to know where to start. I'll start here:

"Take the term "crown of thorns," for example. It sounds very biblical, but Scott doesn't mean Jesus wearing a crown of thorns; he describes domestic abuse of women and their injuries."
posted by Karl at 6:55 AM on January 29, 2002

There was an article in the Cleveland Free Times that is much more vitriolic in its treatment of Creed.

What I want to know is, yeah, Creed sucks, but why do we care? For a lot of people, music is just the mayonnaise that holds the sandwich of life together, and bands like Creed and DMB (another MeFi love-to-hate) are perfect for that role because they don't demand much of the listener. And other bands that are a little more demanding might be the horseradish and spicy mustard--more flavorful and more complex. If you like the spicier condiments, great, but who really cares that most of the world wants mayo?

I made myself hungry.
posted by turaho at 6:56 AM on January 29, 2002

Save your hatred for a band that really desrves it like LFO or Britney.

I don't know what LFO is, but I can say this - Britney makes dumb music that appeals to our lowest common denominator. It's got wacky beats, huge boobs, and insane production values, and it's SUPPOSED to be fun.

Creed does all of those things, sans boobies and beats, and pretends to be 'earnest' and 'important'. It's absolutely MADDENING. Someone above compared them to Pearl Jam.

Shit, Creed make Pearl Jam look like the Beatles.
posted by glenwood at 6:56 AM on January 29, 2002

How did a Christian band get big, everyone knows the Jews control the Entertainment industry, (or is it the velvet mafia, I can never keep up with delusional conspiracy theories)?
posted by Mick at 6:57 AM on January 29, 2002

On Creed's Christianity: The party line is that Creed is not a Christian band. They have no agenda to convert their listeners. However, some of the band members could probably be characterized as Christian, though they may not use the labels themselves.

No matter what their religious affiliation, their songs do ask questions about faith, which has led some to believe they are a Christian band. Their label is not a Christian label. Wind-up Records is as far as I can tell, just a label that features newer acts. (For example, one of their bands, Must, has an album called Androgynous Jesus. Probably not a big seller at the Baptist youth conventions.)
posted by ahughey at 7:02 AM on January 29, 2002

I think we're all wasting our time discussing whether or not Creed sucks (obviously, the former) when we could be considering whether the unified concept of Jethro Tull's Thick As A Brick is thematically similar to that of Aqualung, or whether their later offerrings, specifically Broadsword and the Beast and the superb yet underrated Under Wraps (which ties smoothly with Anderson's solo work on Walk Into Light) are more indicative of their decreasing reliance on jazz hooks for a more updated, technologically proficient sound.

:)
posted by UncleFes at 7:30 AM on January 29, 2002

I really hope the members of Creed aren't all vegetarians who think American foreign policy might have had something to do with September 11th, otherwise this post might go on forever.
posted by Cyrano at 8:16 AM on January 29, 2002

To hell with Creed. Everyone, go listen to the Crucifucks!

"The little hand is on the two....the big hand is pointing at YOU!"

Or Journey. Even better, mix 'em. It'll be fun. Promise!
posted by metrocake at 8:33 AM on January 29, 2002

Black8, thanks the "yarling" link! Now I have a name for my aggravation!

"Crahn yrou trake mree higharr" he yarls...

<howl>Owoooooo.....</howl>
posted by Tubes at 8:51 AM on January 29, 2002

When I was taking a night train across Europe last month, my friend and I spotted a poster in Germany advertising the new album from Creed, "America's Biggest Band." This led good Jeff and I to wonder just how tall the average member of Creed is. I mean, it's obvious that a great percentage of the American populous hates them, so how could they be America's Biggest Band unless each member were, say, seven and a half feet tall?
posted by kaibutsu at 9:02 AM on January 29, 2002

Wind-up Records is as far as I can tell, just a label that features newer acts.

According to the Behind the Music special on Creed, which is worth watching just to see Scott Stapp's creepy parents, Wind-Up Records was formed by the band's manager to release Creed's first album because no one else would.

Even if you hate Creed, you ought to be able to appreciate the way they got around the big labels in the recording industry.
posted by rcade at 10:05 AM on January 29, 2002

No problem, Tubes!

Friends don't let friends yarl. Please, stop the madness.
posted by black8 at 10:08 AM on January 29, 2002

Be sure to slap me if I ever yarl, black8. I know you will.
posted by Ty Webb at 10:37 AM on January 29, 2002

According to the Behind the Music special on Creed, which is worth watching just to see Scott Stapp's creepy parents, Wind-Up Records was formed by the band's manager to release Creed's first album because no one else would.

I think you may be confusing Blue Collar Records with Wind-Up. Blue Collar was the original label for My Own Prison. It was the band's private label. Later, they signed the contract with the "real" record company, Wind-Up. In fact, the Blue Collar album sounds very different from the Wind-Up album. As far as I know (and I could be wrong) Wind-Up was not founded by Creed's management.
posted by ahughey at 11:03 AM on January 29, 2002

For a less-than-comprehensive survey of contempo tunage that Jesus himself (allegedly) has no problem with, go here.

(Caveat: I have no idea whether any of these bands are any good. Found the site by typing "crucified punks" into Google.)

Are there any Christian death metal bands? That'd be fun, in a cosmically awful sort of way. They could have a Texas cage match with Deicide, may the best bogus belief system win.

Never mind. I answered my own question.

Oh -- and Creed still sucks.
posted by BitterOldPunk at 11:40 AM on January 29, 2002

According to the site referenced above, there's a Christian death metal band called "Vomitorial Corpulence", but the link to the band's site is dead. (perhaps it will rise again?)

I just HAD to share that band name with everyone.
posted by BitterOldPunk at 11:53 AM on January 29, 2002

Publicist != Band
posted by aaronshaf at 11:55 AM on January 29, 2002

Publicist != Band
posted by aaronshaf at 11:56 AM on January 29, 2002

Publicist != Band
posted by aaronshaf at 11:56 AM on January 29, 2002

Publicist != Band
posted by aaronshaf at 11:57 AM on January 29, 2002

Publicist != Band
posted by aaronshaf at 11:57 AM on January 29, 2002

/hands aaronshaf a glass of water and a paper bag
posted by Avogadro at 12:10 PM on January 29, 2002

Not to brag or anything, but I witnessed Stapp get a little taste of what he deserves in a bar in St. Augustine, FL. This kid named Cristoff walked up to Stapp, said "I sure liked your band a lot more when you guys were called Pearl Jam," and then wound up and punched him in the nose. The whole bar was laughing. Ahh, just thinking about it brings a little tear...
posted by saladin at 2:30 PM on January 29, 2002

It's one of those things that's so obvious, that gushes from their every pore, that screams lame, that cries disingenuousness, that reeks of preachiness and sanctimoniousness ... it's almost so overt that ironically it's hard to describe ... but Creed pretty much embodies all trite bandwagon hoppers who've dined out on some kind of "edgy" image---and that makes a lot of people disgusted.

It's one of those things that's so obvious, that gushes from their every pore, that screams lame, that cries disingenuousness, that reeks of preachiness and sanctimoniousness ...it's almost so overt that ironically it's hard to describe ... but those who loudly proclaim that Creed sucks while frantically pointing out their Neutral Milk Hotel CDs in an effort to convince others of their hipness pretty much embodies all trite bandwagon hoppers who've dined out on some kind of "edgy" image---and that makes a lot of people disgusted..
posted by Shadowkeeper at 5:04 PM on January 29, 2002

those who loudly proclaim that Creed sucks while frantically pointing out their Neutral Milk Hotel CDs in an effort to convince others of their hipness

shadowkeeper - what about those of us who like both? there's good stuff of all genres, I don't deny the "edgy" stuff(your term) it's great moments, but I don't deny that mullet-rock can be a blast when taken on it's own terms. As for that matter so can hip-hop, R&B, Jazz, Country, outsider music, whatever.

Step up to the musical buffett man, and take a double helping of both the Pixies and Twisted Sister. They taste more similar than youd imagine.
posted by jonmc at 5:35 PM on January 29, 2002

Buffett? Like Jimmy?
posted by fidelity at 6:55 PM on January 29, 2002

jonmc, your point is a good one, and well made. I may have seemed like I disagreed, because I was having so much fun wailing on Creed. (I'm a big fan of shooting suckerfish in a barrel).

I love the fact that I live in a time when I have access to such a wide variety of musical acts. I love everything from Frank Black to Clint Black. From the Beach Boys to my beloved Beastie Boys. From Blondie to Concrete Blonde. I love 'em all. Especially Neutral Milk Hotel.

Jeff Mangum is a phenomenal songwriter. A phenomenal songwriter who, at last report, was living on his friend's couch because record companies choose to sign and promote mundane bands like Creed. Creed tours stadiums, Mangum couch-hops in a rural trailer park. I am of the opinion that the world would be a far better place if the situations were reversed. Hence my mild vitriol.
posted by Optamystic at 7:02 PM on January 29, 2002

Oh, in case I didn't make it clear, Jeff Mangum is the lead singer, songwriter, and guitar player, and only permanent member of Neutral Milk Hotel.
posted by Optamystic at 7:08 PM on January 29, 2002

His band needs a better name.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 7:14 PM on January 29, 2002

I have a question for aaronshaf.

Aaron, is the publicist for a band the same as the band itself?
posted by rodii at 7:39 PM on January 29, 2002

1 - How in the hell did NMH come up in a Creed thread? Jeff Magnum is brilliant, but I am inclined to agree that most of the name dropping that has occured around him is a "hipness" thing, having less to do with his music and more to do with the "I can name all of the Elephant 6 Bands" indie pissing contest bullshit. But for the true believers out there, keep the faith. Last I heard, Jeff had a book of short stories in the works.

2 - Optamystic: from what I have heard from people I know who do/did hang in the Athens scene, Jeff is taking a break from music because he wants to. I hate the fact that mainstream acts are often the lowest common denominator, but using him as a posterboy does him a disservice. "In The Aeroplane..." was released on Merge and sold well ... while not a huge label, its big enough to support him if he chooses to make a career out of his muisc, which is not something that he's ever seemed very interested in.

3 - If I had my picture up anywhere, I'd do the "hipstertrash" - "Jay Farrar" comparison. Mistaken identity has actually resulted in a few free drinks here and there ...
posted by hipstertrash at 10:56 PM on January 29, 2002

Thanks for the clarifications, hipster. Good to hear that he's probably doing okay.
posted by Optamystic at 11:14 PM on January 29, 2002

Step up to the musical buffett man

Oh no, now the Parrotheads are in the fray. It's a free for all now.
posted by Dreama at 11:56 PM on January 29, 2002

metrocake - shit, I haven't heard anyone say 'the crucifucks' in ages ... damn good band

optamystic - have you heard the jeff magnum live disc that came out last year?
posted by hipstertrash at 12:23 PM on January 30, 2002

Yeah, I have it. Man, you think they could have mic'd that crying baby any more closely? It's still a good CD, on the strength of the content, but I gotta say, I prefer the fat sound the full band had on Aeroplane.
posted by Optamystic at 5:58 PM on January 30, 2002