Carp, Congressman, is the main ingredient
September 1, 2015 7:54 AM Subscribe
The story behind the funniest e-mail Hillary Clinton has ever sent. Subject line: Gefilte fish.
I am not a carp farmer
Wait, go back.
posted by shakespeherian at 8:05 AM on September 1, 2015 [10 favorites]
Wait, go back.
posted by shakespeherian at 8:05 AM on September 1, 2015 [10 favorites]
Nog: That sort of foresight and due diligence is pretty common among the "job creators" out there, in my experience.
posted by entropicamericana at 8:06 AM on September 1, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 8:06 AM on September 1, 2015 [4 favorites]
For the record, gefilte fish is an abomination. Amen v'amen.
posted by Sophie1 at 8:06 AM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by Sophie1 at 8:06 AM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
It's 3am, where are we on the gefilte fish?
posted by dis_integration at 8:07 AM on September 1, 2015 [7 favorites]
posted by dis_integration at 8:07 AM on September 1, 2015 [7 favorites]
Metafilter: Carp is the main ingredient.
posted by Billiken at 8:08 AM on September 1, 2015 [11 favorites]
posted by Billiken at 8:08 AM on September 1, 2015 [11 favorites]
Well, I'm certainly glad everyone went to all that trouble to get this out there. It will be interesting to see what kind of scandal the Tea Baggers turn this into. Gefiltegate?
posted by TedW at 8:17 AM on September 1, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by TedW at 8:17 AM on September 1, 2015 [4 favorites]
Why did the US farmer and their Israeli buyer not realize the duty would be so high before they agreed to the transaction? I am not a carp farmer, but it seems like the kind of thing a carp farmer would know about?
Stop carping about it. It might be fishy, but they're still on the hook.
posted by kmz at 8:17 AM on September 1, 2015 [7 favorites]
Stop carping about it. It might be fishy, but they're still on the hook.
posted by kmz at 8:17 AM on September 1, 2015 [7 favorites]
Carp is The Main Ingredient
Before you do anything rash -- dig this:
Everybody plays the fool, sometimesposted by Herodios at 8:19 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
There's no exception to the rule (listen, baby!)
It may be factual, it may be cruel (I ain't lying)
Everybody plays the fool . . .
Why did the US farmer and their Israeli buyer not realize the duty would be so high before they agreed to the transaction?
Ignorance of the law is of course no excuse, but export/import duties are complicated business. Maybe there was a previous exception in place that the parties didn't realize had expired? Maybe they went into the transaction with the assumption that the exception would be applied but whatever omnibus bill or whatever it was supposed to be slipped into ended up getting stalled in committee.
posted by sparklemotion at 8:24 AM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
Ignorance of the law is of course no excuse, but export/import duties are complicated business. Maybe there was a previous exception in place that the parties didn't realize had expired? Maybe they went into the transaction with the assumption that the exception would be applied but whatever omnibus bill or whatever it was supposed to be slipped into ended up getting stalled in committee.
posted by sparklemotion at 8:24 AM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
I'm sure I'm not the only one who keeps reading carp as crap, or am I explaining the joke?
sometimes I think my purpose on this planet is be the guy in the room who has to explain/mansplain the joke to everyone
posted by nubs at 8:25 AM on September 1, 2015
sometimes I think my purpose on this planet is be the guy in the room who has to explain/mansplain the joke to everyone
posted by nubs at 8:25 AM on September 1, 2015
So did they get that exception?
posted by Reverend John at 8:25 AM on September 1, 2015
posted by Reverend John at 8:25 AM on September 1, 2015
Gesundheit
posted by griphus at 8:29 AM on September 1, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by griphus at 8:29 AM on September 1, 2015 [4 favorites]
I read Carp as Crap and didn't blink. I thought 'Kinda mean Hillary' but I was willing to accept it.
posted by French Fry at 8:29 AM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by French Fry at 8:29 AM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
So where can we download these emails?
Enjoy!
It's pretty tedious stuff, really.
posted by dis_integration at 8:31 AM on September 1, 2015
Enjoy!
It's pretty tedious stuff, really.
posted by dis_integration at 8:31 AM on September 1, 2015
Here is the follow up to the Gefilte fish missive: More on gefilte fish.
posted by dis_integration at 8:33 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by dis_integration at 8:33 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
You laugh, but the whole reason she killed Vince Foster was a disagreement over a tzimmes recipe.
posted by escabeche at 8:39 AM on September 1, 2015 [11 favorites]
posted by escabeche at 8:39 AM on September 1, 2015 [11 favorites]
I read Carp as Crap and didn't blink. I thought 'Kinda mean Hillary' but I was willing to accept it.
Yeah, I think that's a judgement call.
Still the best book about gefilte fish.
posted by Mchelly at 8:43 AM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
Yeah, I think that's a judgement call.
Still the best book about gefilte fish.
posted by Mchelly at 8:43 AM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
I don't believe that this is the funniest email she's ever sent.
posted by rhizome at 9:12 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by rhizome at 9:12 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
Still the best story that starts with a reference to gefilte fish. (ctrl F for Butch minds the Baby)
posted by TreeRooster at 9:14 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by TreeRooster at 9:14 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
Let's not miss the forest for the trees. The real reason Clinton was interested in fish was:
"...she was trying to fulfill a promise she had made to then-Illinois Rep. Don Manzullo, a Republican, who was fretting over the potential tax."
In other words:
* Businessman wants to get out of paying a tax.
* He calls his Congressman.
* The Congressman or his people take his call. This is key. Think about what it would take for your local Congressman's office to pick up the phone for you. If you said, "A big donation," you win a Kewpie doll.
* The Congressman reaches out to the foreign policy secretary of the most powerful nation on earth. Holy shit! Are you fucking kidding me? This Congressman thinks the Secretary of State should get involved.
* But she takes his call. Holy Jesus H. Christ shit! What the fucking fuck? What the fuck does she owe him?
* She in turn reaches out to the nation's only reliable (kinda) ally in the Middle East to alleviate the businessman's (legal!) tax burden. She gets the ambassador of a nuclear-armed nation so involved, he puts it in his memoirs!
The enormity of the favors and back-scratching and generalized horseshit going on behind this email is staggering. All because one American businessman didn't want to pay his taxes.
Of course, I suppose there's precedent for that being a potential worry.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:16 AM on September 1, 2015 [48 favorites]
"...she was trying to fulfill a promise she had made to then-Illinois Rep. Don Manzullo, a Republican, who was fretting over the potential tax."
In other words:
* Businessman wants to get out of paying a tax.
* He calls his Congressman.
* The Congressman or his people take his call. This is key. Think about what it would take for your local Congressman's office to pick up the phone for you. If you said, "A big donation," you win a Kewpie doll.
* The Congressman reaches out to the foreign policy secretary of the most powerful nation on earth. Holy shit! Are you fucking kidding me? This Congressman thinks the Secretary of State should get involved.
* But she takes his call. Holy Jesus H. Christ shit! What the fucking fuck? What the fuck does she owe him?
* She in turn reaches out to the nation's only reliable (kinda) ally in the Middle East to alleviate the businessman's (legal!) tax burden. She gets the ambassador of a nuclear-armed nation so involved, he puts it in his memoirs!
The enormity of the favors and back-scratching and generalized horseshit going on behind this email is staggering. All because one American businessman didn't want to pay his taxes.
Of course, I suppose there's precedent for that being a potential worry.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:16 AM on September 1, 2015 [48 favorites]
I haven't been able to find a nice obviously-comparable set of charts or maps or anything, but I get the impression that Illinois, formerly almost an aquaculture desert, has been growing in that area significantly over the past decade or so. Not unreasonable to think this was that U.S. farm's first sale to Israel and someone goofed on the tariffs situation.
posted by traveler_ at 9:22 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by traveler_ at 9:22 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
Ok, just to put to rest this speculation of did-they-or-didn't-they-know about the tariff? From Daniel Meron of the Israel Ministry of Foreign Affairs, to David S Adams of the US State Dept:
posted by dis_integration at 9:27 AM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
According to the Agricultural Agreement between Israel and the US from 2004 (ATAP), carp is not exempted from custom duties. Last December the Israeli customs realized that according to the tariff list their is no customs on the importation of carp to Israel. That was amended. A few weeks ago a representative of the relevant company in Illinois contacted our trade mission to inquire about the new customs tariff and was told that it would apply to all the carp his company will send to Israel. Therefore it should not have been a surprise to the company this new customs tariff. Their are now 2 containers of the fish that are sitting in the port in Israel waiting to be cleared and their are another 7 containers waiting in Illinois to get the green light to leave for Israel. Our trade representative here thinks he could get an exemption for the two containers already in Israel from the new customs tariff but probably not for the other 7. We at the embassy have asked he [sic] highest political level in Israel to see if we could get an exemption from customs for all the 9 containers.Incidentally, I'm now going to refer to officials at the "highest political levels", (and I assume this means, the PM of Israel in this case?) of any nation as "gefilte fish". As in, Russia's Gefilte Fish, Vladimir Putin...
posted by dis_integration at 9:27 AM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
I'm mainly disappointed that this means Clinton does not have a Dadaist sense of humor that involves emailing non-sequiturs to colleagues.
posted by bgal81 at 9:32 AM on September 1, 2015 [7 favorites]
posted by bgal81 at 9:32 AM on September 1, 2015 [7 favorites]
And so, Gefilteghazi begins.
posted by peeedro at 9:33 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by peeedro at 9:33 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
You laugh, but the whole reason she killed Vince Foster was a disagreement over a tzimmes recipe.
This is like some weird dreamworld merging of reality and Seinfeld
posted by clockzero at 9:37 AM on September 1, 2015 [3 favorites]
This is like some weird dreamworld merging of reality and Seinfeld
posted by clockzero at 9:37 AM on September 1, 2015 [3 favorites]
* The Congressman or his people take his call. This is key. Think about what it would take for your local Congressman's office to pick up the phone for you. If you said, "A big donation," you win a Kewpie doll.
While I agree with most of your post, this line strikes me as simply mistaken. Congresscritters make very, very sure they have loads of low-level staffers to take phone calls, because constituent service is how you get out the vote. There's a reason that polls show people who hate "Congress" but love *their* congressperson.
Despite doing nothing whatsoever for my Congressperson, I managed to get a passport renewal expedited simply by calling my Congressperson and talking for around two minutes to a staffer, Not only was the passport renewed, someone actually called me from the passport renewal office to apologize for the delay! And I am a total nonentity.
Granted, I doubt I could much influence a Congressperson in a matter like this as an individual caller, but lots of calls from the local Jewish community? Sure thing.
posted by kewb at 9:40 AM on September 1, 2015 [7 favorites]
While I agree with most of your post, this line strikes me as simply mistaken. Congresscritters make very, very sure they have loads of low-level staffers to take phone calls, because constituent service is how you get out the vote. There's a reason that polls show people who hate "Congress" but love *their* congressperson.
Despite doing nothing whatsoever for my Congressperson, I managed to get a passport renewal expedited simply by calling my Congressperson and talking for around two minutes to a staffer, Not only was the passport renewed, someone actually called me from the passport renewal office to apologize for the delay! And I am a total nonentity.
Granted, I doubt I could much influence a Congressperson in a matter like this as an individual caller, but lots of calls from the local Jewish community? Sure thing.
posted by kewb at 9:40 AM on September 1, 2015 [7 favorites]
The taxes sought to be avoided here were payable to the Israeli government, not the US government. From the POV of Congressman Manzullo and Secretary Clinton, getting the Israeli government to waive those taxes is nothing but a win. Manzullo gets to do a favor for a local business and take credit in the papers. Most Members of Congress would be glad to have their staff work on something like this, whether or not the business owners are contributors - if they're not, maybe this will encourage them to contribute in the future! And Secretary Clinton gets to do a favor for a Member of Congress, which she might be able to cash in later. Literally no one in Congress or the Executive Branch will be upset if the US gets what it wants here, so there's no political cost to anybody.
posted by burden at 10:01 AM on September 1, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by burden at 10:01 AM on September 1, 2015 [4 favorites]
So no-one else is enjoying the fact that her email address was "hrod17@clintonemail.com". Seventeen? I wonder who got one through sixteen?
posted by benito.strauss at 10:06 AM on September 1, 2015 [11 favorites]
posted by benito.strauss at 10:06 AM on September 1, 2015 [11 favorites]
her email address was "hrod17@clintonemail.com". Seventeen? I wonder who got one through sixteen?
It's obviously a coded message.
Flip 'hrod17' over and you get LIPOJY:
Lucifer, I Pledge (to) Overthrow Jesus (for) You
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:25 AM on September 1, 2015 [13 favorites]
It's obviously a coded message.
Flip 'hrod17' over and you get LIPOJY:
Lucifer, I Pledge (to) Overthrow Jesus (for) You
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:25 AM on September 1, 2015 [13 favorites]
Try asking your representative for a tax break for something you already legally owe.
What he said.
There's "taking your call" to do their jobs.
And then there's "taking your call" and triggering actions that end up with Secretary of State asking her staff, "Where are we with this?"
You know. The Secretary of State. The person in charge of a $57 billion budget and 69,000 employees.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 10:29 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
What he said.
There's "taking your call" to do their jobs.
And then there's "taking your call" and triggering actions that end up with Secretary of State asking her staff, "Where are we with this?"
You know. The Secretary of State. The person in charge of a $57 billion budget and 69,000 employees.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 10:29 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
It appears that Clinton wanted to get Manzullo to feel he owed her, presumably as a hedge against some future thing she might want to do that needed his support. I don't find that egregious. Back-scratching is how it gets done, most of the time, and it's not necessarily a bad thing, just a tool you need when you are trying to get stuff done.
It can be abused like anything else, but if making phone calls about some frozen carp later allowed Clinton to get something bigger taken care of, it was a worthwhile investment of her time.
posted by emjaybee at 10:33 AM on September 1, 2015
It can be abused like anything else, but if making phone calls about some frozen carp later allowed Clinton to get something bigger taken care of, it was a worthwhile investment of her time.
posted by emjaybee at 10:33 AM on September 1, 2015
Seventeen? I wonder who got one through sixteen?
Don't be silly, everybody knows seventeen is one of the most random numbers.
posted by Dr Dracator at 10:36 AM on September 1, 2015
Don't be silly, everybody knows seventeen is one of the most random numbers.
posted by Dr Dracator at 10:36 AM on September 1, 2015
For the record, gefilte fish is an abomination. Amen v'amen.
I declare this opinion officially treyf.
The current price of gefilte fish, on the other hand...
posted by thomas j wise at 10:42 AM on September 1, 2015
I declare this opinion officially treyf.
The current price of gefilte fish, on the other hand...
posted by thomas j wise at 10:42 AM on September 1, 2015
Ah, I remember when this was a B-plot of the West Wing. Margaret comically overpronouncing "gefilte", Sam having a painstaking sit-down with the State Department in which he incredulously repeats what he's being told, and Leo telling Fitzwallace to have the fish escorted by the Sixth Fleet.
posted by Clandestine Outlawry at 11:02 AM on September 1, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by Clandestine Outlawry at 11:02 AM on September 1, 2015 [3 favorites]
Don Manzullo was on the Committee on Foreign Affairs, which has jurisdiction over at least some activities of the Department of State. This may help explain why Clinton would be so willing to take his call and pull a few strings to do him a favor. Like it or not, building and maintaining good relationships on the hill is a big part of any cabinet secretary's job.
posted by burden at 11:18 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by burden at 11:18 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
Related? Obama finds closure of H&H Bagels "shocking".
posted by Mchelly at 11:23 AM on September 1, 2015
posted by Mchelly at 11:23 AM on September 1, 2015
It sounds like the company had a pre-existing relationship with a buyer in Israel that got screwed up by the imposition of a new tarrif. The US Israeli relationship is incredibly dysfunctional and both sides play little games to influence larger issues. Sometimes these little side issues can be used as grease to provide an out on a bigger disagreement where compromise is impossible.
posted by humanfont at 11:45 AM on September 1, 2015
posted by humanfont at 11:45 AM on September 1, 2015
17 is the first double digit prime number that isn't associated with a superstition (unless you're Italian)
posted by numaner at 11:53 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by numaner at 11:53 AM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
my favourite book was the one where the family kept the pre-gefilted fish in the bathtub for a week and then KILLED IT AND ATE IT WHY WAS THIS A CHILDREN'S BOOK
anyway it led to a lifetime of suspicion about pre-holiday bathroom goings-on
older male relative who just pooped: whew, no one go in there for a while!!
tiny suspicious me: ARE YOU KEEPING A FISH IN THERE
omrwjp: ...what
tiny suspicious me: A FISH YOU ARE GOING TO KILL AND FEED US
posted by poffin boffin at 12:14 PM on September 1, 2015 [17 favorites]
anyway it led to a lifetime of suspicion about pre-holiday bathroom goings-on
older male relative who just pooped: whew, no one go in there for a while!!
tiny suspicious me: ARE YOU KEEPING A FISH IN THERE
omrwjp: ...what
tiny suspicious me: A FISH YOU ARE GOING TO KILL AND FEED US
posted by poffin boffin at 12:14 PM on September 1, 2015 [17 favorites]
Like it or not, building and maintaining good relationships on the hill is a big part of any cabinet secretary's job.
Again, we're not talking about staff. We're talking about the Secretary of State going, "Hey, I better check up on my staff to ensure they're taking care of this very important matter." Meaning, there were previous conversations but ohmigawd I need to know what's going on because this is very, very important. Meaning, she's burning calories on this.
We'd like to think she's this. When, really, she's looking like this.
OK, want something more serious?
This email regarding very important U.S.-Israeli relations was sent on March 5, 2010.
Five days later, the family of Rachel Corrie had their day in an Israeli court.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 12:55 PM on September 1, 2015
Again, we're not talking about staff. We're talking about the Secretary of State going, "Hey, I better check up on my staff to ensure they're taking care of this very important matter." Meaning, there were previous conversations but ohmigawd I need to know what's going on because this is very, very important. Meaning, she's burning calories on this.
We'd like to think she's this. When, really, she's looking like this.
OK, want something more serious?
This email regarding very important U.S.-Israeli relations was sent on March 5, 2010.
Five days later, the family of Rachel Corrie had their day in an Israeli court.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 12:55 PM on September 1, 2015
For the record, gefilte fish is an abomination.
So I've never tried it, but how is gefilte fish different from, say, Swedish fiskbullar or Norwegian fiskeboller (i.e. "fish dumplings" made by poaching ground fish.)
posted by effbot at 1:03 PM on September 1, 2015
So I've never tried it, but how is gefilte fish different from, say, Swedish fiskbullar or Norwegian fiskeboller (i.e. "fish dumplings" made by poaching ground fish.)
posted by effbot at 1:03 PM on September 1, 2015
it comes encased in a vile jelly and if you don't eat it you can't have any babka
posted by poffin boffin at 1:05 PM on September 1, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by poffin boffin at 1:05 PM on September 1, 2015 [5 favorites]
it is the 11th plague
posted by poffin boffin at 1:06 PM on September 1, 2015 [5 favorites]
posted by poffin boffin at 1:06 PM on September 1, 2015 [5 favorites]
it is the 11th plague
I'm with poffin boffin on this one.
posted by Sophie1 at 1:09 PM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
I'm with poffin boffin on this one.
posted by Sophie1 at 1:09 PM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
I dunno, I guess I don't find it all that surprising that the SoS would prod her staff to resolve or provide an update on an issue that was identified as a priority by a Member of Congress with oversight authority over the State Department. Even if she personally thought it was dumb, the fact that he thought it was important makes it important.
posted by burden at 1:17 PM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by burden at 1:17 PM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
I give it like a week until someone makes a rap and a youtube video out of this.
posted by lucidium at 3:36 PM on September 1, 2015
posted by lucidium at 3:36 PM on September 1, 2015
How would Bernie Sanders have handled this delicate bit of diplomacy?
posted by humanfont at 5:05 PM on September 1, 2015
posted by humanfont at 5:05 PM on September 1, 2015
he'd have covered the gefilte fish in maple syrup
posted by pyramid termite at 5:30 PM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by pyramid termite at 5:30 PM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
17 is the first double digit prime number that isn't associated with a superstition (unless you're Italian)
Pesce D'aprile!!!!!
posted by bq at 6:25 PM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
Pesce D'aprile!!!!!
posted by bq at 6:25 PM on September 1, 2015 [1 favorite]
This is reminding me how Gene Weingarten was debating whether Hillary has a sense of humor or not. (Washington Post chat link.) I think the eventual verdict was "on the one hand, she can get and laugh at jokes, on the other hand she doesn't crack her own jokes."
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:14 PM on September 1, 2015
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:14 PM on September 1, 2015
The enormity of the favors and back-scratching and generalized horseshit going on behind this email is staggering. All because one American businessman didn't want to pay his taxes.
Yeah, sorry I'm not seeing this. This is an incredibly typical chain of events in response to a constituent reaching out to their local elected official, even in other, non-plutocratic countries. Helping out your constituents is where the rubber meets the road of democracy. I get that it seems weird that something so parochial took on an...international flavour, but people ask their elected official for help with weird shit all the time, and politicians want their votes come election time. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
There was value for this congressmen in being seen as responsive to his district's needs, and there was value for Clinton in the Congressmen owing her a favour. This is how politics works.
posted by dry white toast at 10:28 PM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
Yeah, sorry I'm not seeing this. This is an incredibly typical chain of events in response to a constituent reaching out to their local elected official, even in other, non-plutocratic countries. Helping out your constituents is where the rubber meets the road of democracy. I get that it seems weird that something so parochial took on an...international flavour, but people ask their elected official for help with weird shit all the time, and politicians want their votes come election time. The squeaky wheel gets the grease.
There was value for this congressmen in being seen as responsive to his district's needs, and there was value for Clinton in the Congressmen owing her a favour. This is how politics works.
posted by dry white toast at 10:28 PM on September 1, 2015 [2 favorites]
Greg Nog: This is not me trying to diss the carp farmer or his carp buyer, btw, I'm sure they're lovely and talented people, ...
Do you even realize how incredibly carpist you sound?
posted by IAmBroom at 11:19 AM on September 2, 2015 [1 favorite]
Do you even realize how incredibly carpist you sound?
posted by IAmBroom at 11:19 AM on September 2, 2015 [1 favorite]
look, I'm not saying Greg's isn't being carpist, but are we so PC now that even mentioning how a catfish is stinking up a place merits being called a yellow-tail-chaser?
posted by numaner at 11:36 AM on September 2, 2015
posted by numaner at 11:36 AM on September 2, 2015
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