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November 23, 2015 10:47 AM Subscribe
So Amazon opened a new bookstore, and Paul Constant covered it for the Seattle Review of Books and ended up writing an eloquent defense of independent bookstores.
(The Amazon bookstore previously.)
(The Amazon bookstore previously.)
elliot bay book company 4 lyfe
posted by palomar at 11:13 AM on November 23, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by palomar at 11:13 AM on November 23, 2015 [4 favorites]
The experience only served to remind me that e-readers now feel hopelessly outdated. I hadn’t held an e-reader in a long time, but the slow flashing of e-ink as I swirled through a menu felt like an old-timey experience...
Shelf Awareness called e-readers the "fondue pots of the 21st century" this morning. Zingggg.
The bit on the poetry section - I read an interview with someone involved in the creation and design of Amazon Books, in which they said that they "felt bad" for all the books that were shelved spine-out instead of face-out in bookstores, so Amazon Books chose to shelve everything face-out. Which, of course, meant that they effectively just got rid of all the books that would have been shelved spine-out.
This just served to remind me that I hate online reviews (of anything) even more than I hate Amazon, which is really saying something.
posted by sunset in snow country at 11:15 AM on November 23, 2015 [6 favorites]
Shelf Awareness called e-readers the "fondue pots of the 21st century" this morning. Zingggg.
The bit on the poetry section - I read an interview with someone involved in the creation and design of Amazon Books, in which they said that they "felt bad" for all the books that were shelved spine-out instead of face-out in bookstores, so Amazon Books chose to shelve everything face-out. Which, of course, meant that they effectively just got rid of all the books that would have been shelved spine-out.
This just served to remind me that I hate online reviews (of anything) even more than I hate Amazon, which is really saying something.
posted by sunset in snow country at 11:15 AM on November 23, 2015 [6 favorites]
I've noticed that when reading books on my tablet, I remember them less distinctively, because they all have the same font and page size and physical form. On the other hand, I read a lot more now than I would if I had to carry paperbacks everywhere. It's a tradeoff, but one I'm glad to make. (Especially since if I really cared I could set custom appearances for each book.)
posted by Rangi at 11:30 AM on November 23, 2015 [7 favorites]
posted by Rangi at 11:30 AM on November 23, 2015 [7 favorites]
Huh. My e-reader is the thing I use the most and love the most. I broke a Kindle and got a new one. I'm going to Thailand tomorrow to stay for a good while and I have five e-books I want to read and they're all in my jacket pocket weighing almost nothing. E-ink is my favorite technology since Wi-Fi and I can't wait to get an e-ink laptop once someone starts making them. I don't particularly love the feel of books; they're just glued together pieces of paper to me. My opinion is not an argument.
posted by mbrock at 11:34 AM on November 23, 2015 [19 favorites]
posted by mbrock at 11:34 AM on November 23, 2015 [19 favorites]
The poetry section of Amazon Books takes up a single bookcase. It has 26 titles in it, all faced out in even little stacks on four shelves
To be fair, that's probably more poetry than my local Barnes & Noble, which has a toy section bigger than its fiction section*.
Also, I'm not sure how I feel about fondue, but I'd be lost without my Nook reader.
* I might be exaggerating. But only slightly.
posted by madajb at 11:38 AM on November 23, 2015 [5 favorites]
To be fair, that's probably more poetry than my local Barnes & Noble, which has a toy section bigger than its fiction section*.
Also, I'm not sure how I feel about fondue, but I'd be lost without my Nook reader.
* I might be exaggerating. But only slightly.
posted by madajb at 11:38 AM on November 23, 2015 [5 favorites]
Isn't this the column Greg Kinnear's character wrote for Meg Ryan's character in You've Got Mail
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:45 AM on November 23, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:45 AM on November 23, 2015 [4 favorites]
Shelf Awareness called e-readers the "fondue pots of the 21st century" this morning. Zingggg.
Welp, pack it up. If the defense of bookstores relies on eReaders going away in favor of the rich authentic experience of print then print is vinyl and all but the most hipsterish bookstores are utterly doomed.
posted by Artw at 11:54 AM on November 23, 2015 [7 favorites]
Welp, pack it up. If the defense of bookstores relies on eReaders going away in favor of the rich authentic experience of print then print is vinyl and all but the most hipsterish bookstores are utterly doomed.
posted by Artw at 11:54 AM on November 23, 2015 [7 favorites]
I'm not crazy about e-readers for all the reasons everyone's mentioned plus one more, which is that I miss having a tactile sense of how far I am into the narrative. But I travel enough, and have a dire enough bookcase situation, so that it's important to have some alternative to paper.
For years I had an ancient barebones Nook. It finally bit the dust a few months ago. I hemmed and hawed about what to replace it with. I manage everything with Calibre anyway so the distribution and format questions were moot. Amazon knows too much about me as it is, I don't want them obsessively tracking which pages I re-read. In the end I got a Kobo Glo HD. It's fine.
I've never owned a fondue pot, but as someone who served baked fontina with garlic and herbs to guests the weekend before last, I can attest that there's something to be said for keeping melted cheese hot.
posted by tangerine at 11:57 AM on November 23, 2015 [1 favorite]
For years I had an ancient barebones Nook. It finally bit the dust a few months ago. I hemmed and hawed about what to replace it with. I manage everything with Calibre anyway so the distribution and format questions were moot. Amazon knows too much about me as it is, I don't want them obsessively tracking which pages I re-read. In the end I got a Kobo Glo HD. It's fine.
I've never owned a fondue pot, but as someone who served baked fontina with garlic and herbs to guests the weekend before last, I can attest that there's something to be said for keeping melted cheese hot.
posted by tangerine at 11:57 AM on November 23, 2015 [1 favorite]
in which they said that they "felt bad" for all the books that were shelved spine-out instead of face-out in bookstores, so Amazon Books chose to shelve everything face-out. Which, of course, meant that they effectively just got rid of all the books that would have been shelved spine-out.
That's so bizarre, and the point about space is a good one.
I recall once walking through a smallish indie bookstore with my mom, who for a long time managed and/or bought books for a succession of smallish indie bookstores, and she pointed out the large number of books shelved face-out. A sign that their shelves would otherwise be bare, she said: if you don't have the stock in the back to re-shelve, you can make your shelves seem fuller by strategically turning books out.
(I suppose these days publishers also make arrangements for certain books to be shelved face-out so they're more eye-catching, the way big food companies battle over end space in grocery stores. Who knows. I still associate a large number of face-out books with a store whose inventory management is lacking, and I think I'd go insane in a store that only shelved books face-out.)
posted by kenko at 12:12 PM on November 23, 2015 [3 favorites]
That's so bizarre, and the point about space is a good one.
I recall once walking through a smallish indie bookstore with my mom, who for a long time managed and/or bought books for a succession of smallish indie bookstores, and she pointed out the large number of books shelved face-out. A sign that their shelves would otherwise be bare, she said: if you don't have the stock in the back to re-shelve, you can make your shelves seem fuller by strategically turning books out.
(I suppose these days publishers also make arrangements for certain books to be shelved face-out so they're more eye-catching, the way big food companies battle over end space in grocery stores. Who knows. I still associate a large number of face-out books with a store whose inventory management is lacking, and I think I'd go insane in a store that only shelved books face-out.)
posted by kenko at 12:12 PM on November 23, 2015 [3 favorites]
Now, even though the Kindle Paperwhite is supposedly Amazon’s top-of-the-line e-reader, it felt silly and awkward, a rickety reminder of a moment in 2007 when a man, high on internet hubris, actually believed he could render the book obsolete. I looked up from the soggy grey text of the Kindle, and blinked, and looked around at the bookstore, at all the kids poking at the tablets mounted in the childrens’ section, and thought to myself that everything eventually looks old and stupid and slow. Except books.
I have no problem with people preferring paper books, but this paragraph seems humorously oppositional and desperate, like parody, almost. When I look at my kindle, the words "silly, awkward, rickety, soggy, old, stupid, slow" aren't what pop to mind. In fact, some of those are words I associate with books, and I love the Kindle because it's the opposite of those words.
posted by Huck500 at 12:14 PM on November 23, 2015 [13 favorites]
I have no problem with people preferring paper books, but this paragraph seems humorously oppositional and desperate, like parody, almost. When I look at my kindle, the words "silly, awkward, rickety, soggy, old, stupid, slow" aren't what pop to mind. In fact, some of those are words I associate with books, and I love the Kindle because it's the opposite of those words.
posted by Huck500 at 12:14 PM on November 23, 2015 [13 favorites]
Oops, didn't mean to start a debate on the merits of e-readers - that was far from the most interesting thing about this for me. I love my romance-novel-reading-machine, but I also love a sick burn.
My favorite indies all have robust poetry sections, and I love them for it.
posted by sunset in snow country at 12:19 PM on November 23, 2015
My favorite indies all have robust poetry sections, and I love them for it.
posted by sunset in snow country at 12:19 PM on November 23, 2015
When I was a book reviewer, I used to look at novels in manuscript form. After a while, it stopped mattering that I was handling a pile of generically typeset paper. The format just melted away, and all I cared about was whether the book was any good. I read the first Hunger Games in that format, curled up in bed with my laptop.
So I can't make that argument against e-readers. But I still prefer bound books on paper and all they stand for. I just do.
posted by the_blizz at 12:19 PM on November 23, 2015 [1 favorite]
So I can't make that argument against e-readers. But I still prefer bound books on paper and all they stand for. I just do.
posted by the_blizz at 12:19 PM on November 23, 2015 [1 favorite]
I love physical books, but unfortunately I like to keep them in pristine condition, but carrying paperbacks around in a backpack tends to collide with that. I've been more mobile in the past recent years and focused on decluttering, so e-readers are helping me bridge my transition into what type of book buyer I'd like to be.
However, independent bookstores provide a world of curation that I would have not been exposed to otherwise, so I always tend to buy 1 or 5 books or magazines everytime I go to one.
posted by yueliang at 12:39 PM on November 23, 2015 [3 favorites]
However, independent bookstores provide a world of curation that I would have not been exposed to otherwise, so I always tend to buy 1 or 5 books or magazines everytime I go to one.
posted by yueliang at 12:39 PM on November 23, 2015 [3 favorites]
The experience only served to remind me that e-readers now feel hopelessly outdated. I hadn’t held an e-reader in a long time, but the slow flashing of e-ink as I swirled through a menu felt like an old-timey experience. ... Now, even though the Kindle Paperwhite is supposedly Amazon’s top-of-the-line e-reader, it felt silly and awkward, a rickety reminder of a moment in 2007 when a man, high on internet hubris, actually believed he could render the book obsolete.
Christ, that's dumb. I love physical books too—I have thousands of them—but my reading life would be drastically impoverished without my Kindle. What, should I refuse to read anything that's not available in a reasonably priced print edition? I basically have all of Russian literature available to me for download, and I can carry months' worth of reading in that one compact book-shaped object. I know people who refuse to read anything not available in electronic format; that's over the top as far as I'm concerned, but to claim that e-readers are "the fondue pots of the 21st century" is a flat-out lie and makes me feel bad for the people who are so desperate to convince everyone else that they resort to such bullshit.
posted by languagehat at 12:51 PM on November 23, 2015 [18 favorites]
Christ, that's dumb. I love physical books too—I have thousands of them—but my reading life would be drastically impoverished without my Kindle. What, should I refuse to read anything that's not available in a reasonably priced print edition? I basically have all of Russian literature available to me for download, and I can carry months' worth of reading in that one compact book-shaped object. I know people who refuse to read anything not available in electronic format; that's over the top as far as I'm concerned, but to claim that e-readers are "the fondue pots of the 21st century" is a flat-out lie and makes me feel bad for the people who are so desperate to convince everyone else that they resort to such bullshit.
posted by languagehat at 12:51 PM on November 23, 2015 [18 favorites]
t felt silly and awkward, a rickety reminder of a moment in 2007 when a man, high on internet hubris, actually believed he could render the book obsolete.
...and then went ahead and pulled it off, at least as far as a lot of people's reading needs go.
Sincerely,
An American who once bought a book while sitting on a German train during a business trip, and who was able to thereby bring a single lightweight Kindle instead of a thick stack of heavy paper.
posted by Tomorrowful at 12:57 PM on November 23, 2015 [1 favorite]
...and then went ahead and pulled it off, at least as far as a lot of people's reading needs go.
Sincerely,
An American who once bought a book while sitting on a German train during a business trip, and who was able to thereby bring a single lightweight Kindle instead of a thick stack of heavy paper.
posted by Tomorrowful at 12:57 PM on November 23, 2015 [1 favorite]
What, should I refuse to read anything that's not available in a reasonably priced print edition?
I don't get this tone from the article at all. Going with the analogy as presented, people still make fondue. They just don't use the thousands and thousands of cheaply made fashion pots that were made in a hurry to capitalize on the trend. When you go to Switzerland, you just get your fondue in an old, inglamorous pot. Not a tweedy $100 Berghoff stainless steel pot. So let's dial back the rage about a total tangent in this story, since it seems like it's saying the ereader hasn't settled into an esthetic that is as functional and facile as the ugly old Swiss fondue pot, or a paper book.
The larger point seems to be that the forced integration of ereaders into this bookstore is just that, forced and maybe a little superfluous, and that is one of the multiple features that somehow results in this place being counterintuitively the dullest bookstore imaginable.
posted by late afternoon dreaming hotel at 1:03 PM on November 23, 2015
I don't get this tone from the article at all. Going with the analogy as presented, people still make fondue. They just don't use the thousands and thousands of cheaply made fashion pots that were made in a hurry to capitalize on the trend. When you go to Switzerland, you just get your fondue in an old, inglamorous pot. Not a tweedy $100 Berghoff stainless steel pot. So let's dial back the rage about a total tangent in this story, since it seems like it's saying the ereader hasn't settled into an esthetic that is as functional and facile as the ugly old Swiss fondue pot, or a paper book.
The larger point seems to be that the forced integration of ereaders into this bookstore is just that, forced and maybe a little superfluous, and that is one of the multiple features that somehow results in this place being counterintuitively the dullest bookstore imaginable.
posted by late afternoon dreaming hotel at 1:03 PM on November 23, 2015
> Hooray for Third Place Books Ravenna
Team Third Place LFP
posted by The corpse in the library at 1:28 PM on November 23, 2015 [5 favorites]
Team Third Place LFP
posted by The corpse in the library at 1:28 PM on November 23, 2015 [5 favorites]
I want to go to the Amazon store just so I can shout at somebody in person for getting rid of the page-turn buttons on the Kindles.
posted by Faint of Butt at 1:55 PM on November 23, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by Faint of Butt at 1:55 PM on November 23, 2015 [4 favorites]
> I don't get this tone from the article at all. Going with the analogy as presented, people still make fondue.
Uh, the fondue quote wasn't from the article. Did you read the pullquote at the top of my comment, which was? If you want to defend what's said there, go right ahead, but don't try to gaslight me into thinking I made up an animus that wasn't there. It's there, and it's bullshit. And it is not "a total tangent in this story," it's one of the main points.
> I want to go to the Amazon store just so I can shout at somebody in person for getting rid of the page-turn buttons on the Kindles.
Wha-a-a-at?! *cradles beloved Kindle possessively* How are you supposed to turn pages, then?
posted by languagehat at 2:48 PM on November 23, 2015 [1 favorite]
Uh, the fondue quote wasn't from the article. Did you read the pullquote at the top of my comment, which was? If you want to defend what's said there, go right ahead, but don't try to gaslight me into thinking I made up an animus that wasn't there. It's there, and it's bullshit. And it is not "a total tangent in this story," it's one of the main points.
> I want to go to the Amazon store just so I can shout at somebody in person for getting rid of the page-turn buttons on the Kindles.
Wha-a-a-at?! *cradles beloved Kindle possessively* How are you supposed to turn pages, then?
posted by languagehat at 2:48 PM on November 23, 2015 [1 favorite]
I have a Nook Simple Touch that I love because it's not like sinister Kindles that can communicate with the mothership (and vice versa) and because it has a microSD slot that means I can cram a substantial fraction of Project Gutenberg into a nice cheap 64GB card. It's the perfect tradeoff for access to an immense library of ancient, old, or otherwise out of copyright books, and I'll put up with the clunkiness of e-reading in exchange for having thousands of books on hand. If I'm going to buy a book, though, I want paper, because the e-reading UX is nowhere near being done yet and I want comfort, form, and permanence for my money. It's interesting to compare it to digital music, which I'm perfectly happy with, because the sonic experience is the same regardless of the source, whereas my Nook, which was, at the time, the most hand-friendly e-reader on the market, is a good effort, but it's still weird and clunky in my hand and while the text looks fabulous, getting from page to page or navigating within the book takes me right out of the prose dreamtime in a way that skipping around a book does not. So I read Tom Swift on the Nook and new stuff on lovely paper and it's all good.
I like to have the best of all worlds, inasmuch as it's available.
Mind you, I have six mid-century campy fondue pots, too, and the harlequin party pants to go with them, because sometimes you just gotta be a glamorous host.
posted by sonascope at 3:17 PM on November 23, 2015 [2 favorites]
I like to have the best of all worlds, inasmuch as it's available.
Mind you, I have six mid-century campy fondue pots, too, and the harlequin party pants to go with them, because sometimes you just gotta be a glamorous host.
posted by sonascope at 3:17 PM on November 23, 2015 [2 favorites]
Wha-a-a-at?! *cradles beloved Kindle possessively* How are you supposed to turn pages, then?
Tap the screen. Tap it on the left hand side to turn back, anywhere else to move on. It sounds awkward but in practice its... slightly less awkward than you'd expect but still not great?
posted by Artw at 3:21 PM on November 23, 2015 [2 favorites]
Tap the screen. Tap it on the left hand side to turn back, anywhere else to move on. It sounds awkward but in practice its... slightly less awkward than you'd expect but still not great?
posted by Artw at 3:21 PM on November 23, 2015 [2 favorites]
I think the Voyage fixes this with pseudo-buttons on the bevel, FWIW.
posted by Artw at 3:25 PM on November 23, 2015
posted by Artw at 3:25 PM on November 23, 2015
Mr Corpse claimed I turned the pages so loud on my old Kindle that it kept him awake. The screen-touchy-button things have their place.
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:12 PM on November 23, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:12 PM on November 23, 2015 [2 favorites]
You guys are missing the point about the clunkiness of e-readers. It's not about digital vs. physical books, it's about those dedicated chunks of special-purpose plastic like the Kindle. People e-read on their phones and tablets now. Do you remember hand-held GPS devices?
posted by Harvey Kilobit at 9:10 PM on November 23, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by Harvey Kilobit at 9:10 PM on November 23, 2015 [2 favorites]
Exactly. My standalone GPS (top of the line in 2008 when I got it) still works fine. Like my e-reader, it's a lot easier on the eye than my phone.
posted by tangerine at 12:41 AM on November 24, 2015
posted by tangerine at 12:41 AM on November 24, 2015
Dedicated e-reader sales have been in decline since their 2012 peak, and e-reader ownership has dropped from 32% in early 2014 to 19% today. Interestingly, e-book sales are apparently also declining.
posted by Gerald Bostock at 9:32 AM on November 24, 2015
posted by Gerald Bostock at 9:32 AM on November 24, 2015
No, e-book sales are not falling, despite what publishers say
posted by Artw at 9:50 AM on November 24, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by Artw at 9:50 AM on November 24, 2015 [2 favorites]
I wish when I bought a paper book, it would come with an ebook version too. Because sometimes you want to reread that one book on the plane or something. And it's super annoying to have to purchase it again.
I'm living abroad for a year, and all I have access to is ebooks, through my library. (Which is my university library, because I carefully removed the library cards for my public library before I left home. And basically the ebooks at the library are all urban fantasy all the time. Grr. )
(And whoever recommended Serafina and The Goblin Emperor, thanks! Best books I've read in a while. )
posted by leahwrenn at 11:28 AM on November 24, 2015
I'm living abroad for a year, and all I have access to is ebooks, through my library. (Which is my university library, because I carefully removed the library cards for my public library before I left home. And basically the ebooks at the library are all urban fantasy all the time. Grr. )
(And whoever recommended Serafina and The Goblin Emperor, thanks! Best books I've read in a while. )
posted by leahwrenn at 11:28 AM on November 24, 2015
That's pretty standard in small press/kickstarted publications these days. If you suggested it at the offices of the bigger publishers these days you'd probably cause a bunch of old dudes to die from aneurysms.
posted by Artw at 11:33 AM on November 24, 2015
posted by Artw at 11:33 AM on November 24, 2015
And it's super annoying to have to purchase it again.
Given the ease of finding them... less than legitimately... "have to" is kinda strong language.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 12:58 PM on November 24, 2015
Given the ease of finding them... less than legitimately... "have to" is kinda strong language.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 12:58 PM on November 24, 2015
> I wish when I bought a paper book, it would come with an ebook version too
Amazon almost does that -- you have to pay $3 for the Kindle book, and I don't know how many books are in that program.
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:16 PM on November 24, 2015 [1 favorite]
Amazon almost does that -- you have to pay $3 for the Kindle book, and I don't know how many books are in that program.
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:16 PM on November 24, 2015 [1 favorite]
No, e-book sales are not falling, despite what publishers say
That's a useful corrective. Thanks for sharing it, Artw.
posted by Gerald Bostock at 3:13 PM on November 24, 2015
That's a useful corrective. Thanks for sharing it, Artw.
posted by Gerald Bostock at 3:13 PM on November 24, 2015
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