Let’s do things a bit differently and in a bit more civilised way.
March 7, 2016 10:46 AM   Subscribe

During a session with students at Goldsmiths, University of London Labour Leader Jeremy Corbyn was asked for his opinion on whether sex work should be decriminalised, he said: “I am in favour of decriminalising the sex industry. I don’t want people to be criminalised. I want to be [in] a society where we don’t automatically criminalise people. Let’s do things a bit differently and in a bit more civilised way.” But some of his backbenchers are unhappy with this position.

Amongst those opposed are former deputy leader Harriet Harman
who stated "Prostitution's exploitation and abuse not "work/an industry". Women should be protected and men prosecuted"

Also opposed was Jess Phillips, new MP for Birmingham Yardley, who has made a name for herself as a staunch feminist and who has spoken out before about misogyny from the Labour party leader.

These MPs (and others ) are in favour of the so called Nordic Model or sex Buyers Law, which criminalises the buying of sex acts, but decriminalises selling.

On the other side of the argument is Amnesty international "We spent more than two years gathering evidence through meetings with hundreds of individuals and organisations. We conducted first-hand research into the lived experience of sex workers under different national and legal contexts."

And MeFi's Own Margaret Corvid "By speaking out about the decriminalisation of sex work as Labour leader, Corbyn has demonstrated his courage, his consistent personal values, and his compassion."

It's important to note the difference here between legalisation (as seen in Germany or the Netherlands) with decriminalisation (which has only been tried so far in New Zealand).

lastly, it's worth asking, what do sex workers want?

(Note, I've tried to represent both sides of this disagreement as I believe they would like to be represented and avoid including my own bias. I have almost certainly failed, for which I apologise in advance.
posted by Just this guy, y'know (20 comments total) 25 users marked this as a favorite
 
  1. Jeremy Corbyn is a goddamned saint.
  2. All power to the sex workers.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:10 AM on March 7, 2016 [19 favorites]


Thank you for posting the link explaining the difference between decriminalization and legalization. Based in part on the arguments made by Dolores French in her biography about her life as a sex worker and political activist, I have long been for decriminalization and against legalization. Many people have no idea what I am talking about when I say that. It is good to see the distinction getting some press.
posted by Michele in California at 11:20 AM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]


There is also growing talk at Westminster of a potential leadership challenge to Corbyn, despite polls of grassroots members suggesting he still carries widespread support in the party.

Is this really about prostitution, or about another kick at the can of leadership?
posted by Capt. Renault at 11:36 AM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]


I was so pleased to see some sensible, sane, and above all, humanistic policies emerge from a politician's mouth on this subject that I felt incredibly narked off at Harman and Phillips' comments. Sex work is an emotive subject, to be sure, but not all sex work is violence - as Phillips suggested.

(Poor Phillips! She would have looked so good as an alternative left-wing spokesperson under any of the other leadership contenders. I mean, she seems a bit dumb, but that's probably what politicians are like behind closed doors. I'm a bit dumb about some stuff, I just don't get to vote on having nuclear weapons.)

For anybody who wants to get tooled up on writings about sex work, Verso Books just put out a list of stuff on their blog that might help: http://www.versobooks.com/blogs/2535-five-book-plan-sex-work-and-reproductive-labour
posted by The River Ivel at 11:42 AM on March 7, 2016 [5 favorites]


Morally, ideologically, practically, legally, there are no words for my opposition to the Nordic Model, or at least I cannot put them together without becoming angry. I am angriest, however, that its proponents have hijacked feminism to suggest that it is the Nordic Model is the proper feminist response to prostitution.

(And the middle-class dogooderism that it stinks of! I'm reminded of the Factory Acts which literally treated poor women as children. Watching middle-class woman preach about prostitution is like watching men prate about abortion. It's their right to say what they want, but good lord have some sense of shame when you're telling women what to do with their bodies.)
posted by Emma May Smith at 11:44 AM on March 7, 2016 [26 favorites]


Regarding decriminalisation having been only tried in New Zealand, Spanish law deals with prostitution thus: being a prostitute is legal in the sense that the law doesn't prohibit it for adults that aren't coerced. Buying sex is also legal in these conditions. What's criminalised is being a pimp: inducing others into prostitution (by force or deceit) and profiting from someone else's prostitution. Some cities do have rules and fines for sex workers who ply their trade in the streets, though.

Sex workers are very vulnerable, and criminalising their work would make them more vulnerable. Good on Corbyn indeed.
posted by kandinski at 12:28 PM on March 7, 2016 [8 favorites]


With an application of neoliberal economic principals, we can give sex workers all the benefits of UBER drivers.

(meme of the day: "the Uber of Sex Work")

(but then again, aren't more of the 'new careers' in the 'sharing economy' just like working for a pimp?)
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:36 PM on March 7, 2016


There's a lot of room for disagreement among feminists of good will on sex work. I've met several feminists who support the Nordic Model, and though I take the position of decriminalization I don't think the advocates of the Nordic Model are necessarily bad feminists. I do agree with Emma May Smith that the position has elements of paternalism, thus my position as favoring decriminalization.

That said, its wonderful to see any nation moving away from the model of simply banning sex work. Its never worked, it almost inevitably results in a misogynist system where prostitutes are the main victims of prosecution while johns are all but ignored, and it makes it vastly harder for sex workers who are coerced to get out (much less to seek justice against those who coerced them).

Whether the conversation favors the Nordic Model or my own preference for simply decriminalizing, the fact that the conversation is happening at all is a giant step forward.
posted by sotonohito at 12:45 PM on March 7, 2016 [8 favorites]


1. Introduce a minimum guaranteed income.
2. Provide quality public health care - including abortion and birth control.
3. Train and task police with protecting sex workers rights.
4. Legalize prostitution.
posted by Anoplura at 12:54 PM on March 7, 2016 [11 favorites]


do you mean "make prostitution legal" or "legalize" as spelt out above in the links?
under legalisation, sex work is controlled by the government and is legal only under certain state-specified conditions.
posted by andrewcooke at 1:17 PM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]


Manisha Shah and I find that decriminalization reduces violence against women and sexually transmitted infections using a natural experiment in Rhode Island that effectively legalized "indoor prostitution" from 2003 to 2009.
posted by scunning at 3:13 PM on March 7, 2016 [6 favorites]


If you know the colleges, Goldsmiths was a rather dangerous place to broach that subject. Or, at least it used to be when my sister was there.
posted by Burn_IT at 3:38 PM on March 7, 2016


In Victoria, sex work in a registered, licensed brothel or as an escort is lawful (including for patrons), but street work is not, and is policed. Given that sex work always has been and likely always will be with us, this seems like a commonsense, safety first, pragmatic approach to the problem.
posted by wilful at 4:51 PM on March 7, 2016


nicely composed post, BTW, and yes perfectly neutral.
posted by wilful at 4:56 PM on March 7, 2016


People argue against legalizing sex work by listing the consequences of illicit sex work (abusive pimps, women being forced into the profession).

Did people argue ending alcohol prohibition would lead to more speakeasies and mafia profits?
posted by mccarty.tim at 6:16 PM on March 7, 2016 [4 favorites]


I had never really looked into the difference between decriminalization and legalization, and was really surprised to learn that decriminalization is actually less restrictive than legalization, not more as I had assumed. You'd think that with the various discussions about marijuana decriminalization that I would've figured this out by now, but no.
posted by chrominance at 7:38 PM on March 7, 2016 [3 favorites]


decriminalisation (which has only been tried so far in New Zealand)

Despite many predictions at the time, the sky did not fall in.
posted by HiroProtagonist at 8:23 PM on March 7, 2016 [1 favorite]


I'm a big fan of decriminalisation, but the NZ model is in a country with high trust in the legal system, low corruption and, more importantly, a country that isn't by its geographical position and economic status, significantly involved in human trafficking. It's as specific as the nordic model seemed to be a great answer before.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 9:41 PM on March 7, 2016


Given that sex work always has been and likely always will be with us, this seems like a commonsense, safety first, pragmatic approach to the problem.

Given that sex workers who do street work are more likely to be marginalised homeless women without the meagre safety net of friends and co-workers and so are more likely to experience abuse and physical violence (often from the hands of the police and state), I don't see how this approach is any "safer", except maybe for people who aren't the women on the streets.

Sex work is work. All workers deserve basic rights under capitalism. All workers, not just the ones which are "easier" for middle class folks to approve of.
posted by fight or flight at 3:25 AM on March 8, 2016 [3 favorites]


Additionally, the idea that the Nordic Model decriminalises sex work while criminalising the buying of sex acts is a complete lie. Reporters and pro-Nordic MPs in the UK have been wording it like that because it makes it sound more humane. In reality, sex workers in Ireland and Nordic countries are still being prosecuted, criminalised and deported for selling sex through loophole legislature which criminalises things like "brothel keeping" (i.e. working with a friend or partner for safety, or working in shared premises, again for safety reasons).
posted by fight or flight at 3:45 AM on March 8, 2016 [4 favorites]


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