Top secret winner's envelope
February 27, 2017 6:57 AM Subscribe
"It was also the last Oscars ceremony for which the names of winners were released to the press, or anyone for that matter, before the onstage announcement.... The academy's official history lays blame on The [Los Angeles] Times for breaking an embargo and publishing the winners in the paper's evening edition before the ceremony was underway. Think of it as the era's equivalent of a tweet that scooped everyone else. "
[Fanfare thread on this year's awards]
[Fanfare thread on this year's awards]
This entire debacle was simultaneously a total travesty and an absolute delight
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:03 AM on February 27, 2017 [25 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:03 AM on February 27, 2017 [25 favorites]
"Ready, Brother Pricewater?"
"Ready, Brother Housecooper."
posted by Faint of Butt at 7:05 AM on February 27, 2017 [28 favorites]
"Ready, Brother Housecooper."
posted by Faint of Butt at 7:05 AM on February 27, 2017 [28 favorites]
Yo, La La Land, I'm really happy for you, I'ma let you finish, but Moonlight was one of the best movies of all time! One of the best movies of all time!
posted by chavenet at 7:08 AM on February 27, 2017 [32 favorites]
posted by chavenet at 7:08 AM on February 27, 2017 [32 favorites]
The only Oscars in years that I'm actually glad I watched instead of just waiting to read the results the next morning. Also Moonlight deserved it. After a bit of confusion I jumped for joy at the switcheroo.
posted by dis_integration at 7:12 AM on February 27, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by dis_integration at 7:12 AM on February 27, 2017 [5 favorites]
Definitely the best movie of 2016, dammit. At least they got one right.
Emma Stone over Isabelle Huppert? Do you even see movies with your eyes, Academy?
posted by rokusan at 7:12 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
Emma Stone over Isabelle Huppert? Do you even see movies with your eyes, Academy?
posted by rokusan at 7:12 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
Note that Best Animated Feature remains "Best Animated Feature from Disney or Dreamworks, no others need apply".
Kimi no Na wa, "Your Name", wasn't even nominated.
posted by sotonohito at 7:14 AM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
Kimi no Na wa, "Your Name", wasn't even nominated.
posted by sotonohito at 7:14 AM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
Perhaps we can lay blame on whomever wanted to make the envelopes look all sexy and classy instead of readable?
Would it have killed someone to just write BEST PICTURE on the envelope in high-contrast lettering so an elderly presenter could see that the envelope was the wrong one?
posted by JoeZydeco at 7:15 AM on February 27, 2017 [28 favorites]
Would it have killed someone to just write BEST PICTURE on the envelope in high-contrast lettering so an elderly presenter could see that the envelope was the wrong one?
posted by JoeZydeco at 7:15 AM on February 27, 2017 [28 favorites]
I have no idea how this particularly niche bit of the accounting world works, but I've got to imagine somebody from a PricewaterhouseCoopers competitor was tasked with putting together a proposal for Academy business sometime around midnight last night just in case.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 7:16 AM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by MCMikeNamara at 7:16 AM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
Wow, no matter how I zoom that picture I can't read the lettering. Design fail.
posted by freecellwizard at 7:18 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by freecellwizard at 7:18 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Note that Best Animated Feature remains "Best Animated Feature from Disney or Dreamworks, no others need apply".
No shit!? The Red Turtle is one of the most breathtaking pieces of animation I've ever watched. I saw it a month ago alone on my day off in the middle of the day and I was in tears. I couldn't do anything for the rest of the day because I was thinking about that film.
I urge you to watch it, but to also prepare yourself mentally and emotionally. It's a draining film, in a good way, but man.
posted by Fizz at 7:21 AM on February 27, 2017 [11 favorites]
No shit!? The Red Turtle is one of the most breathtaking pieces of animation I've ever watched. I saw it a month ago alone on my day off in the middle of the day and I was in tears. I couldn't do anything for the rest of the day because I was thinking about that film.
I urge you to watch it, but to also prepare yourself mentally and emotionally. It's a draining film, in a good way, but man.
posted by Fizz at 7:21 AM on February 27, 2017 [11 favorites]
The card inside said:
EMMA STONE
LA LA LAND
Warren Beatty seemed to realize it was the wrong card. Faye Dunaway read it anyway, I'm not sure if she's made a statement but at this point, we're not sure if she didn't notice or just ignored that Emma Stone's name was on it. Regardless, they shouldn't have been handed the wrong card in the first place.
What a rollercoaster. I couldn't believe what I was watching.
posted by girlmightlive at 7:24 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
EMMA STONE
LA LA LAND
Warren Beatty seemed to realize it was the wrong card. Faye Dunaway read it anyway, I'm not sure if she's made a statement but at this point, we're not sure if she didn't notice or just ignored that Emma Stone's name was on it. Regardless, they shouldn't have been handed the wrong card in the first place.
What a rollercoaster. I couldn't believe what I was watching.
posted by girlmightlive at 7:24 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Yeah, Beatty has said that he did see Emma Stone's name.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:25 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:25 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Would like to see the back of the envelope, to see if / how the category is shown on the back.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:29 AM on February 27, 2017
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:29 AM on February 27, 2017
"BEST PICTURE" should have been on the card itself, not just the envelope. The Academy was so confident about their poor system that no one had been prepped on what to do if there was something that didn't seem right. Wasn't there another Oscars (R) where the same screw-up almost happened?
posted by user92371 at 7:31 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by user92371 at 7:31 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Much respect to the La La Land producer who actually dealt with the situation and handled it with grace and class, despite being the person the least responsible for creating that mess.
He has every reason to be proud today.
posted by Capt. Renault at 7:34 AM on February 27, 2017 [31 favorites]
He has every reason to be proud today.
posted by Capt. Renault at 7:34 AM on February 27, 2017 [31 favorites]
Wasn't there another Oscars (R) where the same screw-up almost happened?
IIRC, there's a rumor that a presenter once named the wrong winner and everyone just went with it.
posted by drezdn at 7:37 AM on February 27, 2017
IIRC, there's a rumor that a presenter once named the wrong winner and everyone just went with it.
posted by drezdn at 7:37 AM on February 27, 2017
Did Marisa Tomei Win Her Best Supporting Actress Oscar By Mistake?
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:38 AM on February 27, 2017
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:38 AM on February 27, 2017
Wasn't there another Oscars (R) where the same screw-up almost happened?
IIRC, there's a rumor that a presenter once named the wrong winner and everyone just went with it.
There has been a rumor for more than twenty years that Marisa Tomei's win for Best Supporting Actress was a mistake, and Jack Palance read her name off the teleprompter (she was the last nominee alphabetically). Last night pretty much proved that the producers would intervene to correct such a slip-up.
posted by Etrigan at 7:39 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
IIRC, there's a rumor that a presenter once named the wrong winner and everyone just went with it.
There has been a rumor for more than twenty years that Marisa Tomei's win for Best Supporting Actress was a mistake, and Jack Palance read her name off the teleprompter (she was the last nominee alphabetically). Last night pretty much proved that the producers would intervene to correct such a slip-up.
posted by Etrigan at 7:39 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Last night pretty much proved that the producers would intervene to correct such a slip-up.
In the snopes article, what they say would happen if the wrong winner was announced did happen last night.
posted by drezdn at 7:41 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
In the snopes article, what they say would happen if the wrong winner was announced did happen last night.
posted by drezdn at 7:41 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Lin-Manuel Miranda missing the EGOT last night is the real tragedy, folks.
posted by JoeZydeco at 7:41 AM on February 27, 2017 [43 favorites]
posted by JoeZydeco at 7:41 AM on February 27, 2017 [43 favorites]
Lin-Manuel Miranda missing the EGOT last night is the real tragedy, folks.
Hopefully he'll get it with Mary Poppins II, but the music in Moana is really, really good.
posted by drezdn at 7:44 AM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
Hopefully he'll get it with Mary Poppins II, but the music in Moana is really, really good.
posted by drezdn at 7:44 AM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
But Viola Davis is now just a Grammy away from an EGOT.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 7:44 AM on February 27, 2017 [26 favorites]
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 7:44 AM on February 27, 2017 [26 favorites]
Davis and Miranda should help each other out.
posted by drezdn at 7:47 AM on February 27, 2017 [35 favorites]
posted by drezdn at 7:47 AM on February 27, 2017 [35 favorites]
Apparently there was one Oscar that was rescinded once, at that was when "The Young Americans" won only to be found out to be ineligible a few days later.
posted by drezdn at 7:48 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by drezdn at 7:48 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Lin-Manuel Miranda missing the EGOT last night is the real tragedy, folks.
As soon as the performance started for his song, I knew he wasn't going to win. The song is nice but it's no "Let it Go" or "A Whole New World", which seems to be the bar if a song from a Disney movie is going to win an Oscar.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:49 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
As soon as the performance started for his song, I knew he wasn't going to win. The song is nice but it's no "Let it Go" or "A Whole New World", which seems to be the bar if a song from a Disney movie is going to win an Oscar.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:49 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Yeah, I love Lin but wasn't sort of meh on the song too (though Auli'i Cravalho performing it was outstanding); that said, because he came late to the game, my partner is now in that phase of Hamilton-fandom where Lin doing anything moves him to tears so that was pretty fun to see.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 7:53 AM on February 27, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by MCMikeNamara at 7:53 AM on February 27, 2017 [13 favorites]
Lin is so wonderfully sweet and gracious, though. After the ceremony his Twitter feed was about things like "I'm so proud of Auli'i Cravalho" and "HOLY SHIT Seth Rogen and Michael J. fox sang stuff from Hamilton" and "neat, everyone gets little chocolate statuettes!"
His time will come.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:53 AM on February 27, 2017 [23 favorites]
His time will come.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:53 AM on February 27, 2017 [23 favorites]
Moonlight was great in its first half. Then it got really slow and boring. La La Land was too long.
/2 cents
posted by jeff-o-matic at 7:54 AM on February 27, 2017
/2 cents
posted by jeff-o-matic at 7:54 AM on February 27, 2017
I hope there's finally a movie version of In The Heights, and Lin writes a new song for the film version.
posted by gladly at 7:56 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by gladly at 7:56 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
Man this has been the ERA of dramatic upsets in voting
posted by The Whelk at 7:56 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by The Whelk at 7:56 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
Lin is so wonderfully sweet and gracious, though.
If Lin had beaten Leslie Odom Jr. for the Tony, I genuinely believe he would have broken down in tears of grief.
posted by Etrigan at 7:58 AM on February 27, 2017 [16 favorites]
If Lin had beaten Leslie Odom Jr. for the Tony, I genuinely believe he would have broken down in tears of grief.
posted by Etrigan at 7:58 AM on February 27, 2017 [16 favorites]
Man this has been the ERA of dramatic upsets in voting
I kind of wonder if all the think pieces did "La La Land" in.
posted by drezdn at 7:59 AM on February 27, 2017
Lin actually must have been nervous as hell, though - jimmy Kimmel went to talk to him right before the Best Score and Best Song were announced, and he was pretty much monosyllabic. It's the only time I've ever seen him in that state.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:01 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:01 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
It was smart of the La La Land producer to show the card to the audience. There are already conspiracy theories flying but there would be way more if he hadn't.
posted by girlmightlive at 8:02 AM on February 27, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by girlmightlive at 8:02 AM on February 27, 2017 [13 favorites]
"BEST PICTURE" should have been on the card itself, not just the envelope.
It was. Look at picture 7. I mean, there's a serious problem with the legibility (especially for aging eyes), but the category is bottom center on the card.
The Academy was so confident about their poor system that no one had been prepped on what to do if there was something that didn't seem right.
There is indeed a system*, and it sprung into action. In some of the photos you can see one of the PWC accountants on stage comparing envelopes. Maybe the presenters themselves hadn't been given enough guidance, but the producers and the accountants were on top of it (that is, on top of it after one of the two accountants handed over the wrong envelope).
* For those categorically opposed to reading Huffington Post, the system is that there are two accountants from PWC with identical briefcases containing 24 identical envelopes. One accountant is in each wing of the stage. As a presenter goes onstage, the accountant on that side hands over what's supposed to be the correct envelope. That seems to be the part that broke down. But the fact there are two accountants and two sets of envelopes explains how Emma Stone could give an interview saying she was holding her card while Warren Beatty held a card with her name on it: there are two.
posted by fedward at 8:11 AM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
It was. Look at picture 7. I mean, there's a serious problem with the legibility (especially for aging eyes), but the category is bottom center on the card.
The Academy was so confident about their poor system that no one had been prepped on what to do if there was something that didn't seem right.
There is indeed a system*, and it sprung into action. In some of the photos you can see one of the PWC accountants on stage comparing envelopes. Maybe the presenters themselves hadn't been given enough guidance, but the producers and the accountants were on top of it (that is, on top of it after one of the two accountants handed over the wrong envelope).
* For those categorically opposed to reading Huffington Post, the system is that there are two accountants from PWC with identical briefcases containing 24 identical envelopes. One accountant is in each wing of the stage. As a presenter goes onstage, the accountant on that side hands over what's supposed to be the correct envelope. That seems to be the part that broke down. But the fact there are two accountants and two sets of envelopes explains how Emma Stone could give an interview saying she was holding her card while Warren Beatty held a card with her name on it: there are two.
posted by fedward at 8:11 AM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
The same sort of mix-up happened in 1964, except the categories and nominees were mismatched in a way that made clear it was the wrong card. (Sammy Davis Jr. with the off-the-cuff joke FTW.)
posted by sallybrown at 8:12 AM on February 27, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by sallybrown at 8:12 AM on February 27, 2017 [5 favorites]
Lin-Manuel Miranda missing the EGOT last night is the real tragedy, folks.
Even though I'd love to see LMM EGOT at some point, this definitely wasn't the song of his that will do it. The REAL real tragedy is Sing Street not getting a single stinking nom for any of the compulsively hummable/singable/drummable original songs in its soundtrack. "Drive It Like You Stole It" is the '80s top 40 radio hit that I didn't know was missing from my childhood.
posted by Strange Interlude at 8:13 AM on February 27, 2017 [10 favorites]
Even though I'd love to see LMM EGOT at some point, this definitely wasn't the song of his that will do it. The REAL real tragedy is Sing Street not getting a single stinking nom for any of the compulsively hummable/singable/drummable original songs in its soundtrack. "Drive It Like You Stole It" is the '80s top 40 radio hit that I didn't know was missing from my childhood.
posted by Strange Interlude at 8:13 AM on February 27, 2017 [10 favorites]
The real conspiracy goes deeper than Moonlight vs La La Land people! Way deeper.
This, Steve Harvey's mixup at Miss Universe in 2015. Haven't you noticed that live awards shows have been going off the rails like crazy since 2014? That's right, sheeple! Scientologists have been engineering these screwups to push John Travolta's mangling of "Idina Menzel" at the 2014 Oscars out of the public's memory! Don't fall for their lies!
#AdeleDazeem #NEVERFORGET!
posted by Naberius at 8:14 AM on February 27, 2017 [13 favorites]
This, Steve Harvey's mixup at Miss Universe in 2015. Haven't you noticed that live awards shows have been going off the rails like crazy since 2014? That's right, sheeple! Scientologists have been engineering these screwups to push John Travolta's mangling of "Idina Menzel" at the 2014 Oscars out of the public's memory! Don't fall for their lies!
#AdeleDazeem #NEVERFORGET!
posted by Naberius at 8:14 AM on February 27, 2017 [13 favorites]
Like Neil Young says, it's better to burn out than Faye Dunaway.
posted by porn in the woods at 8:18 AM on February 27, 2017 [22 favorites]
posted by porn in the woods at 8:18 AM on February 27, 2017 [22 favorites]
Just announced: Dr Chuck Tingle's new tingler "Pounded by the Sentient Manifestation of my Incorrectly Announced Best Picture Winner".
That was fast, even for him.
posted by Capt. Renault at 8:27 AM on February 27, 2017 [11 favorites]
That was fast, even for him.
posted by Capt. Renault at 8:27 AM on February 27, 2017 [11 favorites]
effluvia: "Art imitates life."
And Nicole Kidman claps.
posted by chavenet at 8:37 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
And Nicole Kidman claps.
posted by chavenet at 8:37 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
See, there's a lesson here. Warren Beatty is getting all the jokes , but he did literally NOTHING wrong. Of course this all started because they were given the wrong envelope, but Beatty didn't even make the mistaken announcement. That was Faye Dunaway!
Watch it on YouTube. Beatty looks at the card and clearly realizes something isn't right. He shows the card to Dunaway, and she's the one that says La La Land won. Beatty was just the guy who stuck around onstage after everything got weird and tried to explain what happened. Dunaway's nowhere on stage after that. Her ass was out of there and she's apparently still refusing to comment. Nobody's making Faye Dunaway jokes this morning.
Beatty didn't make the mistake in the first place, but he stuck around in a hugely embarrassing situation and tried to clear things up. Also, here's a quote from Moonlight director Barry Jenkins: "I wanted to see the card and Warren refused to show the card to anybody before he showed it to me. He said, 'Barry Jenkins has to see the card. He needs to know." (Apparently the PWC folks brought out the right card and gave it to Beatty - this is probably the long-established procedure for that potentiality - and things were going on while the La La Land people were still making acceptance speeches and the audience didn't realize what had happened. When we and the live audience found out, what we saw was La La Land producer Jordan Horowitz making the announcement on the mic and showing the right card to the camera. But you see him take the card from Beatty, who apparently had made a point of making sure the Moonlight people saw the card so they knew this wasn't some stunt.)
So Beatty was a class act under difficult circumstances and he's the one taking crap about it, on stage and this morning, while Dunaway who was more responsible for the mistake in the first place, bailed out and left him holding the bag.
Correction: porn in the woods is making Faye Dunaway jokes.
posted by Naberius at 8:37 AM on February 27, 2017 [62 favorites]
Watch it on YouTube. Beatty looks at the card and clearly realizes something isn't right. He shows the card to Dunaway, and she's the one that says La La Land won. Beatty was just the guy who stuck around onstage after everything got weird and tried to explain what happened. Dunaway's nowhere on stage after that. Her ass was out of there and she's apparently still refusing to comment. Nobody's making Faye Dunaway jokes this morning.
Beatty didn't make the mistake in the first place, but he stuck around in a hugely embarrassing situation and tried to clear things up. Also, here's a quote from Moonlight director Barry Jenkins: "I wanted to see the card and Warren refused to show the card to anybody before he showed it to me. He said, 'Barry Jenkins has to see the card. He needs to know." (Apparently the PWC folks brought out the right card and gave it to Beatty - this is probably the long-established procedure for that potentiality - and things were going on while the La La Land people were still making acceptance speeches and the audience didn't realize what had happened. When we and the live audience found out, what we saw was La La Land producer Jordan Horowitz making the announcement on the mic and showing the right card to the camera. But you see him take the card from Beatty, who apparently had made a point of making sure the Moonlight people saw the card so they knew this wasn't some stunt.)
So Beatty was a class act under difficult circumstances and he's the one taking crap about it, on stage and this morning, while Dunaway who was more responsible for the mistake in the first place, bailed out and left him holding the bag.
Correction: porn in the woods is making Faye Dunaway jokes.
posted by Naberius at 8:37 AM on February 27, 2017 [62 favorites]
Warren Beatty is getting all the jokes , but he did literally NOTHING wrong.
"Unfortunately it looks like someone handed me the wrong card - this is the card for Best Actress" is what both he and Faye Dunaway should have said. But I think in the moment it would be very hard to overcome the sense of surreality and "what if I'm wrong" etc to say something like that.
posted by sallybrown at 8:49 AM on February 27, 2017 [12 favorites]
"Unfortunately it looks like someone handed me the wrong card - this is the card for Best Actress" is what both he and Faye Dunaway should have said. But I think in the moment it would be very hard to overcome the sense of surreality and "what if I'm wrong" etc to say something like that.
posted by sallybrown at 8:49 AM on February 27, 2017 [12 favorites]
I really got the impression Beatty didn't expect Dunaway to read the card, and he was showing it to her for confirmation he wasn't imagining it was the wrong card. And she just plowed on and read the movie title anyway, without really comprehending (in a split second) that it wasn't the right card. He knew but didn't believe it; she didn't know.
posted by fedward at 8:55 AM on February 27, 2017 [34 favorites]
posted by fedward at 8:55 AM on February 27, 2017 [34 favorites]
I suspect that's what he was trying to do by handing to Dunaway - "Confirm I'm not seeing things here", while Dunaway is thinking he's just doing one of those Oscar presenter shticks, so she reads the first movie name she sees without processing the rest. It's probably significant that La La Land was the favorite and thus the name she expected to see.
While it might be nice if they had been able to do a heroic recovery and fix the issue before the Moonlight people get screwed out of their moment and the La La Land people get humiliated, it can't be blamed on the presenters really.
posted by tavella at 8:56 AM on February 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
While it might be nice if they had been able to do a heroic recovery and fix the issue before the Moonlight people get screwed out of their moment and the La La Land people get humiliated, it can't be blamed on the presenters really.
posted by tavella at 8:56 AM on February 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
Nobody's making Faye Dunaway jokes this morning.
That's because the best one was made at 12:30 last night.
posted by fedward at 8:59 AM on February 27, 2017 [12 favorites]
That's because the best one was made at 12:30 last night.
posted by fedward at 8:59 AM on February 27, 2017 [12 favorites]
fedward, why is Faye Dunaway getting slapped repeatedly a good joke - under any circumstances - but especially this one one?
posted by Faintdreams at 9:04 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Faintdreams at 9:04 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Isn't the joke about her universally-panned portrayal of Joan Crawford?
posted by girlmightlive at 9:08 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by girlmightlive at 9:08 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
He's making a Chinatown reference. But I'm not going anywhere near that. I've already taken heat from a friend about the misogyny of defending Beatty while blaming Dunaway, which honestly, I was never trying to do. What happened was not that big a deal in the end. I'm just interested in the fact that the memory of it seems to be all about Beatty screwing up, when he didn't.
posted by Naberius at 9:09 AM on February 27, 2017
posted by Naberius at 9:09 AM on February 27, 2017
That's a major, major spoiler for Chinatown.
posted by fedward at 9:09 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by fedward at 9:09 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
I like the guy giving his speech then he's all we lost by the way but whatever
posted by angrybear at 9:11 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by angrybear at 9:11 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
I'm just interested in the fact that the memory of it seems to be all about Beatty screwing up, when he didn't.
I wonder this too...maybe a combination of his long pause being the first indication something was wrong + his giving an explanation for what happened as the Moonlight team walked onto the stage? Dunaway just melted into the background like "I want no part of this train wreck bye."
posted by sallybrown at 9:14 AM on February 27, 2017
I wonder this too...maybe a combination of his long pause being the first indication something was wrong + his giving an explanation for what happened as the Moonlight team walked onto the stage? Dunaway just melted into the background like "I want no part of this train wreck bye."
posted by sallybrown at 9:14 AM on February 27, 2017
I like the guy giving his speech then he's all we lost by the way but whatever
I also liked that guy.
posted by straight at 9:15 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
I also liked that guy.
posted by straight at 9:15 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
Isn't calling out a comment for being a major, major spoiler just an even more major major spoiler?
posted by emelenjr at 9:18 AM on February 27, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by emelenjr at 9:18 AM on February 27, 2017 [10 favorites]
I suspect that's what he was trying to do by handing to Dunaway - "Confirm I'm not seeing things here", while Dunaway is thinking he's just doing one of those Oscar presenter shticks, so she reads the first movie name she sees without processing the rest.
I agree with that, because right after she announced La La Land, he said "But it says Emma Stone."
posted by Lucinda at 9:21 AM on February 27, 2017
I agree with that, because right after she announced La La Land, he said "But it says Emma Stone."
posted by Lucinda at 9:21 AM on February 27, 2017
Forget it Faintdreams, it's Chinatown
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:21 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:21 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
That's a major, major spoiler for Chinatown.
I have seen Chinatown and that tweet means nothing to me. All I remember is Jack Nicholson had a band-aid on his nose.
posted by thelonius at 9:23 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
I have seen Chinatown and that tweet means nothing to me. All I remember is Jack Nicholson had a band-aid on his nose.
posted by thelonius at 9:23 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
Isn't calling out a comment for being a major, major spoiler just an even more major major spoiler?
Maybe?
posted by fedward at 9:24 AM on February 27, 2017
Maybe?
posted by fedward at 9:24 AM on February 27, 2017
It was a pretentious show put on by the Academy
Plus ça change.
posted by nickmark at 9:25 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Plus ça change.
posted by nickmark at 9:25 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Another Oscars Gaffe: In Memoriam Video Included Photo of Living Woman
posted by porn in the woods at 9:35 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by porn in the woods at 9:35 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
Faye Dunaway was like "I've been through this before with Warren Beatty where we both go down in a hail of bullets, not this time dammit." Exit stage left.
posted by e1c at 9:35 AM on February 27, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by e1c at 9:35 AM on February 27, 2017 [16 favorites]
Wasn't there another Oscars (R) where the same screw-up almost happened?
In 1985, Olivier announced the first alphabetical nominee as the winner, and got lucky in that Amadeus really did win.
posted by Shmuel510 at 9:41 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
In 1985, Olivier announced the first alphabetical nominee as the winner, and got lucky in that Amadeus really did win.
posted by Shmuel510 at 9:41 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
The sense I got was that Dunaway was trying to get Beatty to hurry up and get on with it, as he was trying to process the contradictory information and figure out what to do, all on live TV with millions watching. He showed her the card more in the sense of "are you seeing what I'm seeing," but she took it more as a "oh let's get on with it" and just said La La Land. And, well, here we are.
posted by zachlipton at 9:42 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 9:42 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Much respect to the La La Land producer who actually dealt with the situation and handled it with grace and class, despite being the person the least responsible for creating that mess.
He has every reason to be proud today.
Except, it made me so sad the way he snatched the envelope out of poor Mr Beatty's hand.
posted by gorgor_balabala at 9:52 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
He has every reason to be proud today.
Except, it made me so sad the way he snatched the envelope out of poor Mr Beatty's hand.
posted by gorgor_balabala at 9:52 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Could people please stop linking to Twitter without the text of the tweet? Please? Twice in this comment thread alone I've clicked to read something and gotten a screen that says I'm not authorized to read the tweet. They're 140 characters--just quote the damn thing and put a link to it after, on the credit, if you must.
(And in other whiny rants: we're worried about spoiling Chinatown??? Really?)
posted by tzikeh at 9:57 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
(And in other whiny rants: we're worried about spoiling Chinatown??? Really?)
posted by tzikeh at 9:57 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
As amazing as Envelopegate is, I find even more amazing the fact that Amy Adams was utterly ignored for Best Actress despite a beautiful performance in Arrival. That La Streep got a nom for FFJ, and Adams got bupkis (also setting aside her work in Nocturnal Animals) is a typical Oscars travesty that is no less galling for its predictability. Adams was Arrival. The lovely (and variously nominated) score, cinematography, production design, &c., providing the perfect setting for her performance. < /impotent litigation>
tldr: #Amywuzrobbed.
posted by the sobsister at 10:02 AM on February 27, 2017 [21 favorites]
tldr: #Amywuzrobbed.
posted by the sobsister at 10:02 AM on February 27, 2017 [21 favorites]
The sense I got was that Dunaway was trying to get Beatty to hurry up and get on with it, as he was trying to process the contradictory information and figure out what to do, all on live TV with millions watching. He showed her the card more in the sense of "are you seeing what I'm seeing," but she took it more as a "oh let's get on with it" and just said La La Land. And, well, here we are.
Yeah, it seems to me she simply didn't entertain the possibility of an envelope mix-up because it's almost never happened. I can't really fault her much for that. Maybe if Warren had spoken up a bit louder faster the envelope people might've run onstage sooner to sort it out.
posted by dnash at 10:03 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Yeah, it seems to me she simply didn't entertain the possibility of an envelope mix-up because it's almost never happened. I can't really fault her much for that. Maybe if Warren had spoken up a bit louder faster the envelope people might've run onstage sooner to sort it out.
posted by dnash at 10:03 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
I hope there's finally a movie version of In The Heights, and Lin writes a new song for the film version.
I have good news for you announced last night. Playbill: Jay Z Will Be Among Producers of Lin-Manuel Miranda’s In the Heights Film
posted by MCMikeNamara at 10:07 AM on February 27, 2017 [15 favorites]
I have good news for you announced last night. Playbill: Jay Z Will Be Among Producers of Lin-Manuel Miranda’s In the Heights Film
posted by MCMikeNamara at 10:07 AM on February 27, 2017 [15 favorites]
I don't think Dunaway did anything wrong at all. It didn't even occur to her that there was a mixup. Beatty suspected a mixup and could have said something instead of trying to communicate telepathically. But I don't really fault him either, because I'm sure it all goes by in a split second when you're on the Oscars stage about to announce the biggest award of the night.
This is on PwC. I read about their procedure and how there are two CPAs, each with a complete set of envelopes in case one is late to the show. That makes sense but having both sets of envelopes in play during the ceremony seems reckless. Huffington Post put out an article on Friday, with assurances from one of the CPAs about the unlikelihood of the wrong name being read. Oy.
posted by mama casserole at 10:12 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
This is on PwC. I read about their procedure and how there are two CPAs, each with a complete set of envelopes in case one is late to the show. That makes sense but having both sets of envelopes in play during the ceremony seems reckless. Huffington Post put out an article on Friday, with assurances from one of the CPAs about the unlikelihood of the wrong name being read. Oy.
posted by mama casserole at 10:12 AM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
I think it's a bit silly to aggressively take a side on which of the two almost-80 year-old actors on the stage failed to take lightning-quick decisive action to clear up the confusion caused by a totally unprecedented accountancy screw-up during the most prestigious and long-pedigreed awards show in all of show business.
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:16 AM on February 27, 2017 [35 favorites]
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:16 AM on February 27, 2017 [35 favorites]
So given that PwC has apparently been tallying the votes for 83 years, I imagine they'll be back next year. I bet there will be two new accountants (and hopefully some better frickin' card design) by next year, though.
posted by TwoStride at 10:16 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by TwoStride at 10:16 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
(And in other whiny rants: we're worried about spoiling Chinatown??? Really?)
Well, I am, anyway. Yes, it's old, but it's old enough we can no longer assume a majority of people have seen it (evidenced by the fact people on this very thread didn't get the reference) and I personally enjoy every chance to experience even a classic movie for the first time without knowing the big plot points. I just watched All the President's Men for the first time yesterday and there was so much to enjoy about it – and that's one where everybody knew the ending but not the middle. Part of the fun of Chinatown is that the audience learns the facts at the same time Jake Gittes does.
Also FWIW I check all my twitter links in a browser that isn't logged in before I post them.
posted by fedward at 10:17 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Well, I am, anyway. Yes, it's old, but it's old enough we can no longer assume a majority of people have seen it (evidenced by the fact people on this very thread didn't get the reference) and I personally enjoy every chance to experience even a classic movie for the first time without knowing the big plot points. I just watched All the President's Men for the first time yesterday and there was so much to enjoy about it – and that's one where everybody knew the ending but not the middle. Part of the fun of Chinatown is that the audience learns the facts at the same time Jake Gittes does.
Also FWIW I check all my twitter links in a browser that isn't logged in before I post them.
posted by fedward at 10:17 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
I'm sure it all goes by in a split second when you're on the Oscars stage about to announce the biggest award of the night.
AND it's the last one of the night, and the show's run half an hour long, and most people kinda assumed what was going to win this and were in a "get this over with already" mental state.
posted by dnash at 10:20 AM on February 27, 2017
AND it's the last one of the night, and the show's run half an hour long, and most people kinda assumed what was going to win this and were in a "get this over with already" mental state.
posted by dnash at 10:20 AM on February 27, 2017
So basically Bonnie and Clyde fucked up.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 10:26 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 10:26 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
Was Frank Drebin in the premises? Maybe he was backstage trying to intercept an envelope with a bomb.
That said, unless Beatty was quicker on his feet and trusted his instincts over the professionalism of a company that has been doing this without issues for decades, and calling Emma Stone for her unprecedented second best actress award in the same year while showing it while one of the idiots that mishandled the envelopes backstage rushed in with the proper one, I'm not going to blame him or Dunaway for this.
Also, I woke up early tonight with a noise. I guess it was millions of backspace keys being pressed at the same time on tweets calling the Oscars "shameful" being deleted.
posted by lmfsilva at 10:26 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
That said, unless Beatty was quicker on his feet and trusted his instincts over the professionalism of a company that has been doing this without issues for decades, and calling Emma Stone for her unprecedented second best actress award in the same year while showing it while one of the idiots that mishandled the envelopes backstage rushed in with the proper one, I'm not going to blame him or Dunaway for this.
Also, I woke up early tonight with a noise. I guess it was millions of backspace keys being pressed at the same time on tweets calling the Oscars "shameful" being deleted.
posted by lmfsilva at 10:26 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
I'm writing this just because I don't want to forget this later:
I angrily turned off the show once I heard dude say something about his "fantasy baby" (ugh). But I never, ever, ever turn off the Oscars early. And it's the only awards show I watch every year. THE ONE YEAR I turn it off early (like I do when a team I hate wins some championship) and this is what happens. I headed up to bed, kept catching up on Twitter, then I kept seeing "WHAT" from various people. Then I saw mentions of "Moonlight actually won!" from multiple folks -- I honestly thought for a second that they were just being funny. But then people I would never imagine could make that kind of joke were saying the same thing. When I pulled up the Oscars website and it gave the correct winner, I was frustrated I didn't get to see it happen. My wife (wisely) pointed out that if we didn't change the channel, the DVR was still buffering the last hour of the show. So I ran back downstairs and we watched it all from the moment the original flub was announced.
So weird. So odd. So'mazing.
posted by grubi at 10:34 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
I angrily turned off the show once I heard dude say something about his "fantasy baby" (ugh). But I never, ever, ever turn off the Oscars early. And it's the only awards show I watch every year. THE ONE YEAR I turn it off early (like I do when a team I hate wins some championship) and this is what happens. I headed up to bed, kept catching up on Twitter, then I kept seeing "WHAT" from various people. Then I saw mentions of "Moonlight actually won!" from multiple folks -- I honestly thought for a second that they were just being funny. But then people I would never imagine could make that kind of joke were saying the same thing. When I pulled up the Oscars website and it gave the correct winner, I was frustrated I didn't get to see it happen. My wife (wisely) pointed out that if we didn't change the channel, the DVR was still buffering the last hour of the show. So I ran back downstairs and we watched it all from the moment the original flub was announced.
So weird. So odd. So'mazing.
posted by grubi at 10:34 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
“Sure that was awkward. But coulda been worse: coulda happened the other way around.” — @HannahRKeyser
posted by glhaynes at 10:34 AM on February 27, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by glhaynes at 10:34 AM on February 27, 2017 [20 favorites]
LMM might have won if they've gone with the actual best song from Moana, "You're Welcome" which will be fondly remembered years after anyone who hasn't rewatched the film within the last six months forgets how "How Far I'll Go" even goes. Plus, we'd have had The Rock singing on TV.
Emma Stone won best actress for her uncanny ability to portray a twentysomething actress film with a nice smile and a mildly snarky demeanor. She really went out of her wheelhouse for that one.
I haven't seen The Red Turtle yet, so it could be that film was the self-evident winner. But Kubo and the Two Strings was about three orders of magnitude better than Zootopia, so there is that.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:36 AM on February 27, 2017 [14 favorites]
Emma Stone won best actress for her uncanny ability to portray a twentysomething actress film with a nice smile and a mildly snarky demeanor. She really went out of her wheelhouse for that one.
I haven't seen The Red Turtle yet, so it could be that film was the self-evident winner. But Kubo and the Two Strings was about three orders of magnitude better than Zootopia, so there is that.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:36 AM on February 27, 2017 [14 favorites]
the actual best song from Moana, "Thank You"
this made my day
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:38 AM on February 27, 2017
this made my day
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:38 AM on February 27, 2017
I corrected that, as I had it backwards. But yeah, that was funny.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:38 AM on February 27, 2017
posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:38 AM on February 27, 2017
Yeah the pile on Faye is boggling.
Announcing at the Oscars is Pressure, she just read the first movie name she saw. Beatty had time to process, he could have prepped her ("looks like we got the best actress card") but honestly given the SNAFU, this was the best way for it to go down and not have conspiracy people wetting themselves with excitement. Imagine a switch without showing the Emma Stone card? They both did great.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 10:44 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Announcing at the Oscars is Pressure, she just read the first movie name she saw. Beatty had time to process, he could have prepped her ("looks like we got the best actress card") but honestly given the SNAFU, this was the best way for it to go down and not have conspiracy people wetting themselves with excitement. Imagine a switch without showing the Emma Stone card? They both did great.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 10:44 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Let us all admire The Rock's face.
That entire reaction shot was golden.
Although Charles Addams got there first.
posted by non canadian guy at 10:48 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
That entire reaction shot was golden.
Although Charles Addams got there first.
posted by non canadian guy at 10:48 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
Chuck Tingle is already on the case!
posted by zombieflanders at 10:51 AM on February 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 10:51 AM on February 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
This, Steve Harvey's mixup at Miss Universe in 2015. Haven't you noticed that live awards shows have been going off the rails like crazy since 2014? That's right, sheeple! Scientologists have been engineering these screwups to push John Travolta's mangling of "Idina Menzel" at the 2014 Oscars out of the public's memory! Don't fall for their lies!
It goes beyond awards shows, too. Think Villanova, Cavs, Cubs, Clemson, Patriots, Brexit, Drumpf, etc.
posted by non canadian guy at 10:55 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
It goes beyond awards shows, too. Think Villanova, Cavs, Cubs, Clemson, Patriots, Brexit, Drumpf, etc.
posted by non canadian guy at 10:55 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Yeah the pile on Faye is boggling.
What pile on, it's Beatty that's generally getting the beat down. Faye managed to waltz away, most likely because Beatty stayed in it and felt the need to correct things/set the record straight etc.
But it was Faye who made the most visibly public mistake, in a long string of them.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 11:02 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
What pile on, it's Beatty that's generally getting the beat down. Faye managed to waltz away, most likely because Beatty stayed in it and felt the need to correct things/set the record straight etc.
But it was Faye who made the most visibly public mistake, in a long string of them.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 11:02 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Lately I have been turning on awards shows for the last 30 minutes or so just to see the last few big awards. I know I can usually read/see the good speeches if they happen earlier. It worked well for both the Grammies and the Oscars this year.
posted by soelo at 11:07 AM on February 27, 2017
posted by soelo at 11:07 AM on February 27, 2017
Well done, Oscars for giving whoever hosts next year at least one easy joke.
posted by emjaybee at 11:11 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by emjaybee at 11:11 AM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Well done, Oscars for giving whoever hosts next year at least one easy joke.
And giving it to every other host of every other awards show.
posted by Etrigan at 11:17 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
And giving it to every other host of every other awards show.
posted by Etrigan at 11:17 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Lin-Manuel Miranda missing the EGOT last night is the real tragedy, folks.
That (stupidly talented) asshole is only 37, so I think he'll get there sooner or later.
posted by Lazlo Hollyfeld at 11:24 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
That (stupidly talented) asshole is only 37, so I think he'll get there sooner or later.
posted by Lazlo Hollyfeld at 11:24 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
#oscarssobotched
posted by New Frontier at 11:25 AM on February 27, 2017
posted by New Frontier at 11:25 AM on February 27, 2017
And when the (inevitable) half-assed criticism of the proceedings emerges (if it already hasn't) from the right-wing, the proper response is "Yeah, but at least when Hollywood made a mistake, they corrected it immediately and apologized for it."
posted by grubi at 11:44 AM on February 27, 2017
posted by grubi at 11:44 AM on February 27, 2017
Lin-Manuel Miranda missing the EGOT last night is the real tragedy, folks.
Music for the MBMBAM movie, probably.
posted by graventy at 11:51 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
Music for the MBMBAM movie, probably.
posted by graventy at 11:51 AM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
The only thing about all this that makes me sad, and it does make me VERY sad, is that the snafu (which I blame on the backstage folks, not the presenters who were caught in a completely unexpected situation) overshadowed everything else about these Academy Awards. Which were up until that moment a good deal less bloated than usual and all in all a classy, funny refutation of everything DJT has been saying America is about. Kimmel in particular did a great job, but I wonder if anyone will remember that.
posted by bearwife at 11:54 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by bearwife at 11:54 AM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Music for the MBMBAM movie, probably.
Great job! 👋👋
posted by yellowbinder at 12:00 PM on February 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
Great job! 👋👋
posted by yellowbinder at 12:00 PM on February 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
Kimmel in particular did a great job, but I wonder if anyone will remember that.
I would amend this to "Kimmel in particular delivered a cavalcade of microaggressions, but I wonder if anyone will remember that."
posted by Shmuel510 at 12:12 PM on February 27, 2017 [19 favorites]
I would amend this to "Kimmel in particular delivered a cavalcade of microaggressions, but I wonder if anyone will remember that."
posted by Shmuel510 at 12:12 PM on February 27, 2017 [19 favorites]
I'm just annoyed because I was nearly asleep, in bed, watching on a laptop. The mixup earned a loud WTF that woke me and the dog. He goes back to sleep faster than I do.
posted by theora55 at 12:13 PM on February 27, 2017
posted by theora55 at 12:13 PM on February 27, 2017
Which were up until that moment a good deal less bloated than usual
Whoa, what? Listen, I liked the Oscars a lot, but less bloated?! They had pointless montages for each of the acting awards of previous winners, they had one of those "Salute to the movies" type montages midway through, they spent entirely too long with the tour bus people. There were several 30 minute chunks of time where they didn't hand out a single award!
It has been worse, to be sure, but this was no lean and mean Oscars.
posted by graventy at 12:14 PM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
Whoa, what? Listen, I liked the Oscars a lot, but less bloated?! They had pointless montages for each of the acting awards of previous winners, they had one of those "Salute to the movies" type montages midway through, they spent entirely too long with the tour bus people. There were several 30 minute chunks of time where they didn't hand out a single award!
It has been worse, to be sure, but this was no lean and mean Oscars.
posted by graventy at 12:14 PM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
NYTimes: Oscars Mistake Threatens Reputation of PricewaterhouseCoopers
posted by ZeusHumms at 12:33 PM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by ZeusHumms at 12:33 PM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Alternate headline: Forehead-Slapping Incompetency Still an Issue in Some Fields, Thank God
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:34 PM on February 27, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:34 PM on February 27, 2017 [12 favorites]
PwC Partner Tweeted Backstage Minutes Before Oscar Best Picture Mix-Up - Brian Cullinan posted photo of Best Actress winner Emma Stone just before giving wrong envelope to Best Picture presenter Warren Beatty (tweet w/ picture of article)
posted by gladly at 12:56 PM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by gladly at 12:56 PM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Ex-PwC partner by now, surely.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:58 PM on February 27, 2017
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:58 PM on February 27, 2017
PwC Partner Tweeted Backstage Minutes Before Oscar Best Picture Mix-Up - Brian Cullinan posted photo of Best Actress winner Emma Stone just before giving wrong envelope to Best Picture presenter Warren Beatty (tweet w/ picture of article)
Ex-PwC partner by now, surely.
The ceremonial breaking of his pen over his commander's knee will commence at 5.
posted by Etrigan at 1:08 PM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Ex-PwC partner by now, surely.
The ceremonial breaking of his pen over his commander's knee will commence at 5.
posted by Etrigan at 1:08 PM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
gorgo_balabala, YES.
I mean, I know he was in a state of anguish because his movie only won most and not AAAALLLLLL, GIVEMEEVERYSINGLEOOOOONE of the awards, but why, why did he have to snatch the envelope without any patience or kindness and with clear disgust, just, "Give me that, you doddering old idiot" when from the git to the bitter bitter end Warren Beatty soldiered bravely on through the terrible swap of awkward endlessly trying to recover and do the right thing by everybody? It absolutely kills me. I felt exactly as I felt when a store clerk treated my grandfather like an infant in front of me.
posted by Don Pepino at 1:11 PM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
I mean, I know he was in a state of anguish because his movie only won most and not AAAALLLLLL, GIVEMEEVERYSINGLEOOOOONE of the awards, but why, why did he have to snatch the envelope without any patience or kindness and with clear disgust, just, "Give me that, you doddering old idiot" when from the git to the bitter bitter end Warren Beatty soldiered bravely on through the terrible swap of awkward endlessly trying to recover and do the right thing by everybody? It absolutely kills me. I felt exactly as I felt when a store clerk treated my grandfather like an infant in front of me.
posted by Don Pepino at 1:11 PM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
why did he have to snatch the envelope without any patience or kindness and with clear disgust, just, "Give me that, you doddering old idiot"
This was not at all clear. Just reading this description gives me a sense of disorientation, because it does not match what I saw at all. You might be reading into this incident a bit more than is warranted.
(or...
Warren-ted.)
posted by a fiendish thingy at 1:17 PM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
This was not at all clear. Just reading this description gives me a sense of disorientation, because it does not match what I saw at all. You might be reading into this incident a bit more than is warranted.
(or...
Warren-ted.)
posted by a fiendish thingy at 1:17 PM on February 27, 2017 [6 favorites]
Eh. It's one of the most humiliating moments of his professional life, and short of harm to his loved ones likely one of the most personally painful. He wants to get the shit straightened up, get the right people up on stage and talking, and himself off of it probably so he can go start drinking. I'm not going to criticize him.
Also, it demonstrates that being able to react decisively in high stress moments is a genuine skill. It's an odd comparison I know, but in emergency response training they'll teach you to stand up and start giving people orders if there isn't a scene commander already, because a whole lot of people will be flummoxed and not sure what they should do even though they want to help. And for people who aren't naturally good at that decisiveness, they'll teach you to rehearse your plans beforehand. I don't know how much rehearsal presenters get, but I bet it isn't a lot and I doubt it includes being handed the wrong envelope without warning and rehearsing the emergency plan. They probably get *told* what to do but acting on it immediately is not going to happen for most people.
posted by tavella at 1:26 PM on February 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
Also, it demonstrates that being able to react decisively in high stress moments is a genuine skill. It's an odd comparison I know, but in emergency response training they'll teach you to stand up and start giving people orders if there isn't a scene commander already, because a whole lot of people will be flummoxed and not sure what they should do even though they want to help. And for people who aren't naturally good at that decisiveness, they'll teach you to rehearse your plans beforehand. I don't know how much rehearsal presenters get, but I bet it isn't a lot and I doubt it includes being handed the wrong envelope without warning and rehearsing the emergency plan. They probably get *told* what to do but acting on it immediately is not going to happen for most people.
posted by tavella at 1:26 PM on February 27, 2017 [7 favorites]
When my partner asked his mother if she saw the end of the Oscars last night, she said she did, that her husband (my partner's step-father) was pleased with the results because he doesn't like musicals, and she just felt so bad for "Robert Wagner" for being given the wrong envelope and saying the wrong name.
I'm not sure anybody else is going to find this story as amusing as I did, but my Twitter account is public enough that I don't want to joke about my mother-in-law on it and if I don't tell this story to somebody else immediately, I might burst.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 1:34 PM on February 27, 2017 [16 favorites]
I'm not sure anybody else is going to find this story as amusing as I did, but my Twitter account is public enough that I don't want to joke about my mother-in-law on it and if I don't tell this story to somebody else immediately, I might burst.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 1:34 PM on February 27, 2017 [16 favorites]
Horowitz handled it like a boss.
And as has been pointed out, him showing the card to the camera was very sharp as it squashed most conspiracy theories before they could even begin.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:34 PM on February 27, 2017 [13 favorites]
And as has been pointed out, him showing the card to the camera was very sharp as it squashed most conspiracy theories before they could even begin.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:34 PM on February 27, 2017 [13 favorites]
>"...but Beatty didn't even make the mistaken announcement. That was Faye Dunaway!"
Once again a woman does the work and a man gets all the credit.
posted by BurntHombre at 1:40 PM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Once again a woman does the work and a man gets all the credit.
posted by BurntHombre at 1:40 PM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Give me that, you doddering old idiot"
If you watch the video again, there's a second before where an Oscar producer (wearing headphones) is trying to get the card free from the envelope in Beatty's hands...then Horowitz snatches it away. I saw it as being exasperated with the show's producers, not Beatty.
posted by CrazyLemonade at 1:41 PM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
If you watch the video again, there's a second before where an Oscar producer (wearing headphones) is trying to get the card free from the envelope in Beatty's hands...then Horowitz snatches it away. I saw it as being exasperated with the show's producers, not Beatty.
posted by CrazyLemonade at 1:41 PM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
I loved La La Land a great deal, and I was hoping it would Best Picture, because I loved it so. But I also hoped Moonlight would win, because I've loved Mahershala Ali since his turn on the 4400, and I've heard great things about the movie from people I trust. So as I watched the last ten minutes of the Oscarcast, I was rooting for both films.
So, as I watch, I see Warren Beatty squinting, puzzled, at the paper out of the envelope... Once Faye makes the announcement, all the LLL people come up, give all these emotional and political speeches... Then five minutes later someone comes and whispers in the producer's ear that no, Moonlight wins, and he announces gracefully as he can that Moonlight is the actual winner! And me and my friends wonder out loud, what, is he giving his Oscar away? Is this a joke? What's going on!?
It turns out that it's not a joke, someone gave them the wrong envelope. Everyone's milling around in confusion for a minute... the LLL crowd are ushered off and the Moonlight crowd are brought in instead to make their round of speeches. I checked out at that point, because the whole thing left such a bad taste in my mouth.
It was a sour, infuriating end to the evening. I felt awful for everyone. It was shitty, and it was even worse watching it in the moment. What a nightmare for the La La Land crew, and how awful for the Moonlight people, to have their win overshadowed by this colossal fuck-up.
Ugh. I hope heads roll for this.
posted by suburbanbeatnik at 1:42 PM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
So, as I watch, I see Warren Beatty squinting, puzzled, at the paper out of the envelope... Once Faye makes the announcement, all the LLL people come up, give all these emotional and political speeches... Then five minutes later someone comes and whispers in the producer's ear that no, Moonlight wins, and he announces gracefully as he can that Moonlight is the actual winner! And me and my friends wonder out loud, what, is he giving his Oscar away? Is this a joke? What's going on!?
It turns out that it's not a joke, someone gave them the wrong envelope. Everyone's milling around in confusion for a minute... the LLL crowd are ushered off and the Moonlight crowd are brought in instead to make their round of speeches. I checked out at that point, because the whole thing left such a bad taste in my mouth.
It was a sour, infuriating end to the evening. I felt awful for everyone. It was shitty, and it was even worse watching it in the moment. What a nightmare for the La La Land crew, and how awful for the Moonlight people, to have their win overshadowed by this colossal fuck-up.
Ugh. I hope heads roll for this.
posted by suburbanbeatnik at 1:42 PM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
If you want to talk smack about the La La Land team's reaction, the guy you want to target isn't Horowitz (about whose grace and poise Barry Jenkins has been tweeting his awe and appreciation ) it's that guy who was talking just as the word came through, who kind of petulantly cut his speech off with, "We lost by the way."
I mean, I feel his pain, but if you want to go after someone for not handling the moment well, there's your man.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:43 PM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
I mean, I feel his pain, but if you want to go after someone for not handling the moment well, there's your man.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:43 PM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
> I mean, I feel his pain, but if you want to go after someone for not handling the moment well, there's your man
I doubt I'd do any better, on the spot.
posted by The corpse in the library at 1:47 PM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
I doubt I'd do any better, on the spot.
posted by The corpse in the library at 1:47 PM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
I would've done worse. I'm notoriously bitchy in stressful situations.
As for his colleague, I actually think this is probably going to help Horowitz's career nearly as much as the award would have. I don't know how you watch that clip without thinking Well here is a decent human being who knows how to take charge and get shit settled. That's the kind of person you want as a producer. For real.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:49 PM on February 27, 2017 [16 favorites]
As for his colleague, I actually think this is probably going to help Horowitz's career nearly as much as the award would have. I don't know how you watch that clip without thinking Well here is a decent human being who knows how to take charge and get shit settled. That's the kind of person you want as a producer. For real.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:49 PM on February 27, 2017 [16 favorites]
And there's the real problem -- we end up talking about the La La Land people's reaction, not about how awesome it is that Moonlight won. It's natural, because we see overwhelmed Best Picture winners every year, but watching people go from ecstatic and bubbling about it to crushed and trying to deal with it in a handful of minutes is exceptional. But Moonlight's extraordinary win is still being overshadowed.
posted by tavella at 1:52 PM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by tavella at 1:52 PM on February 27, 2017 [8 favorites]
If we're talking about Oscar flubs & snubs, we need to talk about how Will Smith was shut out of the nominations despite doing the end credits raps for three best picture nominees:
posted by mhum at 1:52 PM on February 27, 2017 [9 favorites]
- oh wow, I didn't know Will Smith was still rapping, or that he did the credits rap for Arrival. wonder why this didn't get nominated #Oscars
- wow, Will Smith's rap career was under the radar last year. Who knew he did the credits rap for Hacksaw Ridge. He wasn't even in it. #Oscars
- does anybody know if Will Smith is gonna perform one of his credits raps at the #Oscars this year? I hope it's the one he did for Moonlight
posted by mhum at 1:52 PM on February 27, 2017 [9 favorites]
I think (and hope) the overshadowing of Moonlight will be short-lived. The cachet Jenkins and his team will get as part of this win is basically a form of currency, to be applied towards making something new with more eyes on them, heavier promotion, and quite probably a larger budget. I can't wait to see what he does next.
Fun Barry Jenkins thing: his Closet picks vid for Criterion. In this series, great directors are invited to visit the Criterion Collection's stock closet and take what they please, as long as they explain why they choose what they do. Jenkins is sooooo fun, radiating so much excitement and pure love for the movies.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:58 PM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
Fun Barry Jenkins thing: his Closet picks vid for Criterion. In this series, great directors are invited to visit the Criterion Collection's stock closet and take what they please, as long as they explain why they choose what they do. Jenkins is sooooo fun, radiating so much excitement and pure love for the movies.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 1:58 PM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
> I mean, I feel his pain, but if you want to go after someone for not handling the moment well, there's your man
I doubt I'd do any better, on the spot.
I'm still mad about the unfair re-do they did after I won the district spelling bee in 4th grade, so yeah, I guess I shouldn't throw any stones at that guy.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 2:05 PM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
I doubt I'd do any better, on the spot.
I'm still mad about the unfair re-do they did after I won the district spelling bee in 4th grade, so yeah, I guess I shouldn't throw any stones at that guy.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 2:05 PM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Well, but, tavella, this doesn't really bear that out about the decisive action at all, rather the opposite. Warren Beatty was trying to suss the thing out and confer and figure out what was right to do before making an informed decision about the best course of action. That is actually what was called for, because the problem was not simple. Had he been able to do what he was trying to do, the whole CF could have been avoided. But Faye Dunaway acted decisively in a high-stress moment, and it led to what happened, not that I'm blaming her, either, 'cause I'm not.
Whatevs: I'm just going to decide to believe CrazyLemonade's theory that dude was blameless and merely trying to get the card out of whatever hand had ahold of it so he could get it in front of the camera. I am officially telling myself that I did not see an irritated youngbrain taking over a job for an old person whom he'd deemed incompetent. But I am not watching that again, not for money would I watch that again. I can't even particularly stand Warren daggity Beatty, either, but damn that is not how to treat somebody, anybody. I hope he said sorry.
The Oscars is always something of a circus of dumb but I'm so glad Moonlight won because it'll stick around a while and I can finally go see it. All my go-to moviemates are philistines, so all of the Oscars ones I saw were Hidden Figures and Manchester by the Sea because I managed to get my mom (who is not a philistine) to come out to a matinee at the last possible second.
The philistine thing worked in one way: I got to see Get Out. Get Out is worth all the time it takes. I absolutely loved Get Out.
posted by Don Pepino at 2:06 PM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
Whatevs: I'm just going to decide to believe CrazyLemonade's theory that dude was blameless and merely trying to get the card out of whatever hand had ahold of it so he could get it in front of the camera. I am officially telling myself that I did not see an irritated youngbrain taking over a job for an old person whom he'd deemed incompetent. But I am not watching that again, not for money would I watch that again. I can't even particularly stand Warren daggity Beatty, either, but damn that is not how to treat somebody, anybody. I hope he said sorry.
The Oscars is always something of a circus of dumb but I'm so glad Moonlight won because it'll stick around a while and I can finally go see it. All my go-to moviemates are philistines, so all of the Oscars ones I saw were Hidden Figures and Manchester by the Sea because I managed to get my mom (who is not a philistine) to come out to a matinee at the last possible second.
The philistine thing worked in one way: I got to see Get Out. Get Out is worth all the time it takes. I absolutely loved Get Out.
posted by Don Pepino at 2:06 PM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
I've loved Mahershala Ali since his turn on the 4400
Holy crap.
I watched The 4400 regularly. I saw Moonlight. I did not make that connection until just now, and now I don't know how I missed it.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 2:18 PM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
Holy crap.
I watched The 4400 regularly. I saw Moonlight. I did not make that connection until just now, and now I don't know how I missed it.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 2:18 PM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
I really don't understand the talk of heads rolling or conspiracy theories or whatever else for this. It's a significant embarrassment, to be sure, but it's also...live tv, which reflects real life, where mistakes happen. This wasn't exactly world-changing and has no serious lingering consequences, except maybe to PwC's brand (well, that and we missed the last part of that thoroughly enjoyable Damon bit).
I mean, I feel a little bad for the La La Land folks, but they've still been extremely successful and they're adults and they'll recover. Hopefully the Moonlight folks still feel like they got the recognition they deserve and enjoyed sufficient time to bask in their victory. I'm glad that everyone involved seemed to handle the situation with decency and professionalism, all things considered - it's refreshing after these months we've had.
posted by R a c h e l at 2:22 PM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
I mean, I feel a little bad for the La La Land folks, but they've still been extremely successful and they're adults and they'll recover. Hopefully the Moonlight folks still feel like they got the recognition they deserve and enjoyed sufficient time to bask in their victory. I'm glad that everyone involved seemed to handle the situation with decency and professionalism, all things considered - it's refreshing after these months we've had.
posted by R a c h e l at 2:22 PM on February 27, 2017 [3 favorites]
> I mean, I feel his pain, but if you want to go after someone for not handling the moment well, there's your man
I thought that was actually remarkably good humor. How do you even finish your sentence, trying to thank the people who matter most, and hearing people saying behind you that, actually, Moonlight won?
It's actually a pretty standard gag. "I'D LIKE TO THANK EVERYONE FOR THIS AMAZING HONOR...andsaythatactuallyididn'twintheraceafterallbye."
posted by straight at 2:40 PM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
I thought that was actually remarkably good humor. How do you even finish your sentence, trying to thank the people who matter most, and hearing people saying behind you that, actually, Moonlight won?
It's actually a pretty standard gag. "I'D LIKE TO THANK EVERYONE FOR THIS AMAZING HONOR...andsaythatactuallyididn'twintheraceafterallbye."
posted by straight at 2:40 PM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]
I haven't watched the Oscars in years, but I watched last night. I didn't particularly enjoy it and haven't seen any of the movies, so when they announced Best Picture I brushed my hands together and felt like I'd accomplished something and said "OKAY. BEDTIME!"
Then I woke up this morning and checked my phone for the news and it was like, Holy shit, I sat through that entire thing and missed the one part of it that was actually interesting??
(Also, when Warren Beatty did the double-take after opening the envelope, Faye Dunaway playfully scoffed at him and said something like "Oh, you're the worst." I think she thought he was mugging, and I think she thought SHE was playing into the bit by taking the card away from him and just reading it.)
posted by mudpuppie at 3:45 PM on February 27, 2017
Then I woke up this morning and checked my phone for the news and it was like, Holy shit, I sat through that entire thing and missed the one part of it that was actually interesting??
(Also, when Warren Beatty did the double-take after opening the envelope, Faye Dunaway playfully scoffed at him and said something like "Oh, you're the worst." I think she thought he was mugging, and I think she thought SHE was playing into the bit by taking the card away from him and just reading it.)
posted by mudpuppie at 3:45 PM on February 27, 2017
The card mix up will make more sense when everyone in rows 1-5 realize their jewels are missing.
posted by drezdn at 3:51 PM on February 27, 2017 [29 favorites]
posted by drezdn at 3:51 PM on February 27, 2017 [29 favorites]
Jordan Horowitz: "Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences, is THIS your card?"
posted by straight at 3:58 PM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by straight at 3:58 PM on February 27, 2017 [2 favorites]
Also, pleased to see Marvel TV veterans in the winners' and nominees' circles, with Mahershala Ali excellent as Cornell "Cottonmouth" Stokes on Netflix's Luke Cage and Ruth Negga the compelling Raina on ABC's Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. (who's also been lending her talents to DC in Preacher). I could see Deborah Ann Woll ("Karen Page" on Daredevil) doing that level of film work. I find her character and performance the most compelling on that show.
posted by the sobsister at 4:21 PM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by the sobsister at 4:21 PM on February 27, 2017 [4 favorites]
Why It's Important to Recognize That "Moonlight" Was Robbed Of Its Moment
posted by rewil at 6:17 PM on February 27, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by rewil at 6:17 PM on February 27, 2017 [9 favorites]
I have seen lots of people criticizing Horowtiz for being a grand-standing white man, and I totally get that and don't think it's completely wrong, but also, what a terrible situation to be in and at least he cut through the confusion and started to make things right. In the middle of what had to be a personally devastating moment.
posted by lunasol at 10:28 PM on February 27, 2017
posted by lunasol at 10:28 PM on February 27, 2017
It is weird that Warren never thought to say, "I think this is the wrong envelope."
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:52 PM on February 27, 2017
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:52 PM on February 27, 2017
> I mean, I feel his pain, but if you want to go after someone for not handling the moment well, there's your man
> I doubt I'd do any better, on the spot.
I kind of agree on both counts
> I have seen lots of people criticizing Horowtiz for being a grand-standing white man,
For whatever reason I watched the video of the whole thing around a million times yesterday! Here's what I saw:
- Horowitz and Fred (the last La La Land producer to speak) both found out what happened at the same time, while the second producer (the short one) was speaking. (They both were shown either the correct card or the wrong one that was read.) You can see Fred saying "Wow."
- Producer #2, unaware of what's happening, finishes his speech and calls up Fred, who first says "No" and then agrees to go on. During his speech, Horowitz drifts off away from the center of the stage.
- When Fred goes "Oh, btw, we lost, but whatever," Horowitz turns around, stares, and says "What? Guys, guys, I'm sorry, no!" and rushes to the mic to announce the mistake.
I read this as Horowitz having expected Fred, who is a producer just like he is, to speak for La La Land, make the announcement, and do it in what he considered the obvious right way - as in, be gracious, recognize that it sucks possibly even more for Moonlight, and make everyone on both movies come off as well as possible. When Fred instead handles things in a way that just continues the confusion and makes the La La Land guys look like victims ("We lost, now watch the Academy pull the award out of our passive hands" instead of "Moonlight won, watch us actively give them what's rightfully theirs") he seems to decide that this is a case of doing something yourself if you want it done right, and takes over.
I think everything he does after that is in the spirit of compensating for how Fred handled it and making it clear that that's not La La Land's official response. Jimmy Kimmel's reactions are all about how much this sucks for LLL and not at all about Moonlight having been shafted: he says "I think you guys should keep it anyway," "This is really unfortunate what happened" (here you see Horowitz starting to give him A Look and step closer to the mic) and then "I would like to see you get an Oscar anyway, why can't we [just devalue the whole award]" and Horowitz clearly feels Kimmel is not getting it either, hence the "I'm going to be really proud to hand this to my friends from Moonlight."
I saw the way he snatched the card as impatience not with Beatty but with Fred (and maybe with Kimmel, who was also just hovering ineffectually at that point, and the showrunners in general; and maybe it was even that kind of claustrophobic antsiness you get when a lot of people are all jostling and being jostled pointlessly and in a small space).
If anyone should have been more thoughtful towards Beatty it was Kimmel (who at least stepped in to help Beatty give his explanation). But at some point, he really should have put aside his shtick for a moment and said "Sorry Warren, and sorry, Faye, for putting you in this ridiculous situation; sorry La La guys, this must have been really hard etc.; and most of all sorry to Moonlight, whose win should not have been overshadowed like this, because it is a truly amazing picture." Instead, what Kimmel said was "Well, I don't know what happened," and "It's just an awards show, we hate to see people disappointed, but the good news is we got to see some extra speeches" - and that was after both Horowitz and Jenkins had gone out of their way to be classy and after the Moonlight team had wrapped up their speeches in a way that was both upbeat and considerately quick.
So it looks like Horowitz made the right decision to be Decent with a capital D, because no one else was going to.
posted by trig at 3:52 AM on February 28, 2017 [34 favorites]
> I doubt I'd do any better, on the spot.
I kind of agree on both counts
> I have seen lots of people criticizing Horowtiz for being a grand-standing white man,
For whatever reason I watched the video of the whole thing around a million times yesterday! Here's what I saw:
- Horowitz and Fred (the last La La Land producer to speak) both found out what happened at the same time, while the second producer (the short one) was speaking. (They both were shown either the correct card or the wrong one that was read.) You can see Fred saying "Wow."
- Producer #2, unaware of what's happening, finishes his speech and calls up Fred, who first says "No" and then agrees to go on. During his speech, Horowitz drifts off away from the center of the stage.
- When Fred goes "Oh, btw, we lost, but whatever," Horowitz turns around, stares, and says "What? Guys, guys, I'm sorry, no!" and rushes to the mic to announce the mistake.
I read this as Horowitz having expected Fred, who is a producer just like he is, to speak for La La Land, make the announcement, and do it in what he considered the obvious right way - as in, be gracious, recognize that it sucks possibly even more for Moonlight, and make everyone on both movies come off as well as possible. When Fred instead handles things in a way that just continues the confusion and makes the La La Land guys look like victims ("We lost, now watch the Academy pull the award out of our passive hands" instead of "Moonlight won, watch us actively give them what's rightfully theirs") he seems to decide that this is a case of doing something yourself if you want it done right, and takes over.
I think everything he does after that is in the spirit of compensating for how Fred handled it and making it clear that that's not La La Land's official response. Jimmy Kimmel's reactions are all about how much this sucks for LLL and not at all about Moonlight having been shafted: he says "I think you guys should keep it anyway," "This is really unfortunate what happened" (here you see Horowitz starting to give him A Look and step closer to the mic) and then "I would like to see you get an Oscar anyway, why can't we [just devalue the whole award]" and Horowitz clearly feels Kimmel is not getting it either, hence the "I'm going to be really proud to hand this to my friends from Moonlight."
I saw the way he snatched the card as impatience not with Beatty but with Fred (and maybe with Kimmel, who was also just hovering ineffectually at that point, and the showrunners in general; and maybe it was even that kind of claustrophobic antsiness you get when a lot of people are all jostling and being jostled pointlessly and in a small space).
If anyone should have been more thoughtful towards Beatty it was Kimmel (who at least stepped in to help Beatty give his explanation). But at some point, he really should have put aside his shtick for a moment and said "Sorry Warren, and sorry, Faye, for putting you in this ridiculous situation; sorry La La guys, this must have been really hard etc.; and most of all sorry to Moonlight, whose win should not have been overshadowed like this, because it is a truly amazing picture." Instead, what Kimmel said was "Well, I don't know what happened," and "It's just an awards show, we hate to see people disappointed, but the good news is we got to see some extra speeches" - and that was after both Horowitz and Jenkins had gone out of their way to be classy and after the Moonlight team had wrapped up their speeches in a way that was both upbeat and considerately quick.
So it looks like Horowitz made the right decision to be Decent with a capital D, because no one else was going to.
posted by trig at 3:52 AM on February 28, 2017 [34 favorites]
I didn't want to be the one writing the analysis (because I'm trying to take to heart the idea this shouldn't be about LA LA LAND) but trig's breakdown is essentially how I saw everything as well. I don't really agree with how glibly Fred handled it, but I'm also nearly 100% certain that I would have come across in exactly the same way if that happened to me. I recognize that glibness in myself.
posted by fedward at 8:37 AM on February 28, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by fedward at 8:37 AM on February 28, 2017 [1 favorite]
Hey! Oh my God, thank God, that makes sense and matches what I remember seeing. Thank you so much, trig. He was clearly irritated and impatient, and I just assumed it was because of the initial mixup and being suddenly yanked from glory and plunged into hideous awkwardness, but your read makes much more sense. It was the legitimately irritating rudeness to the Moonlight people that galvanized him. Also, I, too, like others here before me, must admit that all the various pieces of rudeness I witnessed were of a milder grade than what I likely would have displayed. I bet I would have snatched the Oscar and run offstage with it. I would not have thought it possible, but I have done a 180 on Horowitz. I feel much better. For real, thank you.
posted by Don Pepino at 1:21 PM on February 28, 2017
posted by Don Pepino at 1:21 PM on February 28, 2017
Trig's interpretation lines up with the few bits about Horowitz himself said later:
“There was a lot of confusion onstage, and at a certain point it was clear that the wrong envelope had been given,” Horowitz said. “Then they kind of showed us the Best Picture envelope and it said Moonlight, that’s when I jumped to the mic and made sure everybody knew what was going on and showed the card, because people needed clarity in that moment.”posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:41 PM on March 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
Horowitz also described seeing the Moonlight crew at the Oscars after-party: “They’ve become really close friends of mine. We shared a moment and gave each other a hug, one that was real. We congratulated each other on our work and put it all behind us."
And if you're wondering how Horowitz feels about the focus on how the mixup affected the La La Land team instead of on Moonlight, here's another quote:
“I want to make sure that we’re all talking about the fact that a $1.5 million picture about gay black youth in America won best picture at the Academy Awards. That’s a pretty sensational thing.”posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:45 PM on March 1, 2017 [8 favorites]
Both PwC accountants are banned from future Academy Awards shows.
Which would be the dude who was distracted by Emma Stone, and the woman who didn't fix the dude's fuck-up soon enough, I guess.
posted by rewil at 3:20 PM on March 1, 2017
Which would be the dude who was distracted by Emma Stone, and the woman who didn't fix the dude's fuck-up soon enough, I guess.
posted by rewil at 3:20 PM on March 1, 2017
That's such an upper class rich person punishment.
"You fucked up an important account in front of millions of people by failing to do perform an exceedingly simple menial task, damaging our brand and causing an international scandal. You can keep your high-paying jobs but can't volunteer to stand around movie stars anymore."
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:35 AM on March 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
"You fucked up an important account in front of millions of people by failing to do perform an exceedingly simple menial task, damaging our brand and causing an international scandal. You can keep your high-paying jobs but can't volunteer to stand around movie stars anymore."
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:35 AM on March 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
"Next year you have to do the Daytime Emmys"
posted by Huffy Puffy at 7:41 AM on March 2, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Huffy Puffy at 7:41 AM on March 2, 2017 [3 favorites]
Variety has an extensive backstage photo collection that appears to document Cullinan's fuck up minute by minute, including a photo of Cullinan onstage receiving the correct envelope from Ruiz. I wish more important fuck ups were this obsessively documented.
posted by gladly at 7:42 AM on March 2, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by gladly at 7:42 AM on March 2, 2017 [1 favorite]
That's such an upper class rich person punishment. ... "You can keep your high-paying jobs but can't volunteer to stand around movie stars anymore."
In fairness, that's the Academy's punishment, not PwC's. The Academy can't fire Cullinan and Ruiz from their PwC jobs. (I suppose they could pressure PwC to fire the two, with the threat that if PwC didn't comply they'd go to a different firm, but that seems extreme.) The accountants may well face additional internal discipline from PwC that wouldn't necessarily be made public.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 9:06 AM on March 2, 2017
In fairness, that's the Academy's punishment, not PwC's. The Academy can't fire Cullinan and Ruiz from their PwC jobs. (I suppose they could pressure PwC to fire the two, with the threat that if PwC didn't comply they'd go to a different firm, but that seems extreme.) The accountants may well face additional internal discipline from PwC that wouldn't necessarily be made public.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 9:06 AM on March 2, 2017
I was wondering why Ruiz was being blamed as well and this is the most complete explanation I have read and it is from a stage manager:
"When La La Land was announced, she did not try to get my attention, she did not say anything. And she's supposed to have memorised the winners."
posted by soelo at 9:51 AM on March 2, 2017 [4 favorites]
"When La La Land was announced, she did not try to get my attention, she did not say anything. And she's supposed to have memorised the winners."
posted by soelo at 9:51 AM on March 2, 2017 [4 favorites]
PwC's statement seems consistent with that report: "Once the error occurred, protocols for correcting it were not followed through quickly enough by Mr. Cullinan or his partner."
posted by mama casserole at 10:11 AM on March 2, 2017
posted by mama casserole at 10:11 AM on March 2, 2017
On the one hand, everyone is human, no one is perfect. Mistakes happened, no one died, though Moonlight was robbed of an important moment.
On the other hand (you knew this was coming), you had one fucking job that night, handing people the right damn envelope. Any backwards ass would know to check what they're handing to the person and then double check after they've handed it.
I do not envy the stars and what security they'll have to endure next year. But I will have my popcorn ready, lol.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 11:19 AM on March 2, 2017
On the other hand (you knew this was coming), you had one fucking job that night, handing people the right damn envelope. Any backwards ass would know to check what they're handing to the person and then double check after they've handed it.
I do not envy the stars and what security they'll have to endure next year. But I will have my popcorn ready, lol.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 11:19 AM on March 2, 2017
I'm glad, Don Pepino. It's been such an emotionally engrossing event, somehow.
posted by trig at 11:42 AM on March 2, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by trig at 11:42 AM on March 2, 2017 [1 favorite]
I've just read that somewhere, there was a movie theater that showed about 20 seconds of the trailer for "La La Land" before a screening of "Moonlight" as a joke. The audience apparently loved it.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:24 PM on March 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:24 PM on March 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
Ok yeah, that would be hilarious.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 2:38 PM on March 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 2:38 PM on March 3, 2017 [1 favorite]
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The LA Times truly is the enemy of the people.
posted by Naberius at 6:59 AM on February 27, 2017 [1 favorite]