If you can't be with the one you love…

December 17, 2017 8:51 PM

Sexual interactions between snow monkeys and sika deer could be a new behavioural tradition within a group of monkeys observed in Japan, researchers have suggested. While the first report of a male Japanese macaque, or snow monkey, and female sika deer taking to each other was revealed earlier this year (previously), scientists say they are now confident the behaviour is sexual after scrutinising adolescent females suggestively interacting with stags at Minoo in Japan.
posted by Johnny Wallflower (56 comments total)

"Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together – mass hysteria."

posted by Fizz at 8:54 PM on December 17, 2017 [15 favorites]

This hasn't hit my personal slice of furry twitter yet, but I assume it will. There will be artwork, there will be pontificating, there will be many things.

Mostly I'm not surprised, because sex is a thing. A thing that happens. And exactly how or why it happens is not as important for the horny as the fact that it is happening.
posted by hippybear at 8:58 PM on December 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

Is it the same monkey? That might be like, the monkey-Captain Kirk, and not a new behavior
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:04 PM on December 17, 2017 [41 favorites]

So an Evo biologist is going to come into this thread to explain this, right?
posted by rdr at 9:07 PM on December 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

Practice makes perfect
posted by Start with Dessert at 9:12 PM on December 17, 2017

The deer just looks at the camera like, “Yeah? So what.” Sika deer don’t take slut shaming.
posted by vorpal bunny at 9:31 PM on December 17, 2017 [33 favorites]

Surprising/not-surprising.
posted by bonobothegreat at 9:34 PM on December 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

Eponysexual ^^^
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:35 PM on December 17, 2017 [19 favorites]

Maybe the monkey was delivering a pizza, and things just progressed from there?
posted by mosk at 9:36 PM on December 17, 2017 [33 favorites]

That monkey looks to be more of the plumber persuasion, if you take my meaning.
posted by Iris Gambol at 9:51 PM on December 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

Halfway through summarizing the article:

me: you can imagine where it goes from here.
mr mitt: he fixes the cable?
posted by ovenmitt at 9:59 PM on December 17, 2017 [18 favorites]

This was the headliner in my google news feed: Yes, that’s a monkey grinding on top of a deer
Classy.
posted by piyushnz at 10:35 PM on December 17, 2017

what is to be DONE about this MORAL TURPITUDE in the LEWD AND LICENTIOUS ANIMAL KINGDOM
posted by poffin boffin at 12:27 AM on December 18, 2017 [9 favorites]

Anarcho-beastiality 82%
Eco-primitivism 79%
Classical Marxism 61%

Paleoconservatism -65%
Three Principles of the People -65%
Strasserism -71%
posted by sfenders at 12:36 AM on December 18, 2017 [49 favorites]

Do we know that this is consensual? Maybe we should be stopping it.
posted by Joe in Australia at 12:59 AM on December 18, 2017

Tale as old as time...
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 1:00 AM on December 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

booty and the beasts
posted by poffin boffin at 1:00 AM on December 18, 2017 [15 favorites]

Man, I don't like the deer watching me while I am watching them.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 1:05 AM on December 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

Having been chased by an angry Japanese monkey who thought I was after his lunch, and years later getting roughed-up by a Japanese deer that was trying to steal my lunch, I am worried by this news that deer and monkeys are getting on together so well.
posted by BinaryApe at 1:17 AM on December 18, 2017 [39 favorites]

I'm wondering if this is a place where the deer are seen as an invasive species destroying the local fauna (they're actually holding contests to design drones with sensors to detect and track deer herds and putting up fences and stuff...). Maybe the monkey's have something to do with it.
posted by zengargoyle at 2:01 AM on December 18, 2017

A+ for post title
posted by stevedawg at 2:03 AM on December 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

Do we know that this is consensual? Maybe we should be stopping it.

Given the size difference, I imagine the deer would have no problem resisting if it wasn't. And I suspect snow monkey social organisation is nowhere near sophisticated enough to establish a system of institutional coercion.
posted by acb at 2:26 AM on December 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Notably, the article does specify: the monkeys in question are adolescent females, and the deer being mounted in this specifically sexual manner are generally adult males, as adolescent males or females mounted in this way have been observed to rear up, dislodging the initiating monkey. This specific behavior has only been observed during the period in which both species reproductive cycles coincide.
posted by jsnlxndrlv at 2:50 AM on December 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

The difference between a minnow and a snow monkey? One fears ducks, the other fucks deer.
posted by Devonian at 3:23 AM on December 18, 2017 [35 favorites]

Do we know that this is consensual? Maybe we should be stopping it.

If we choose to start policing the animal and plant kingdoms, we're going to have plenty of work ahead.
posted by fairmettle at 3:25 AM on December 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Notably, the article does specify: the monkeys in question are adolescent females,...

The first report was of a male monkey mounting female deer. While you're reading that article take care not to miss how one of the deer participants consumes the monkey's ejaculate. So many questions...

This whole thing is odd but I think female monkeys limiting themselves to mounting male deer is an extra bit of weirdness.
posted by rdr at 3:45 AM on December 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Do we know that this is consensual? Maybe we should be stopping it.

Sorry. Busy with ducks. Ball's in your court. Good luck.
posted by Splunge at 3:55 AM on December 18, 2017 [14 favorites]

This whole thing is odd but I think female monkeys limiting themselves to mounting male deer is an extra bit of weirdness.

Maybe it's because there's more to hang on to.
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:00 AM on December 18, 2017

Well, we know snow monkeys will use hot springs to keep warm in the winter. Maybe this is what they do when a hot spring isn't handy.
posted by Bee'sWing at 5:45 AM on December 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Oh, deer.
posted by GenjiandProust at 5:50 AM on December 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

I'm sure the Rose McGowan and Matt Damon will have something to say about this, and it will just not go well for one, if not both of them.
posted by Major Matt Mason Dixon at 5:52 AM on December 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

BinaryApe: Having been chased by an angry Japanese monkey who thought I was after his lunch, and years later getting roughed-up by a Japanese deer that was trying to steal my lunch, I am worried by this news that deer and monkeys are getting on together so well.

You live a weird neighborhood.
posted by dr_dank at 5:55 AM on December 18, 2017 [14 favorites]

Welcome to the monkey house!
posted by TedW at 6:12 AM on December 18, 2017

Doe, a deer, a female deer
hoo-ray, a drop of monkey cum!
Meat, what monkeys slip Bambi
Far, how far up Bambi's bum
Sow, those simian wild oats
Lah, they're eyeing up the goats
Tea, a short break to recoup
And that will bring them back to does.
posted by Devonian at 6:18 AM on December 18, 2017 [11 favorites]

me: you can imagine where it goes from here.
mr mitt: he fixes the cable?

Don't be fatuous.
posted by clockzero at 6:20 AM on December 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

This isn't as funny once you learn about Japanese macaques tendency to have simian herpes B which is something like 80% lethal for humans. If those fuckers ever generalize to human humping we are in big trouble.

[I know about this because the Lincoln Park Zoo got macaques and I mentioned it to a friend who worked at Brookfield Zoo and he went off about how awful it was to work with them because you had to wear hazmat suits]
posted by srboisvert at 6:33 AM on December 18, 2017 [14 favorites]

But you fuck one deer . . .
posted by Obscure Reference at 7:04 AM on December 18, 2017 [12 favorites]

Oddly enough, I was most struck by the researcher's hypotheses that the adolescent females were either practicing for males, protecting themselves from scary threatening males, or unable to attract males. Not that queer identity is a thing among macaques (probably), but really the only thing she's missing is "maybe they're performing to arouse males." Humans gonna human, I guess.
posted by fast ein Maedchen at 7:12 AM on December 18, 2017 [7 favorites]

NOT THAT HUMAN QUEER IDENTITY INVOLVES SEX WITH DEER OH GOD
posted by fast ein Maedchen at 7:20 AM on December 18, 2017 [18 favorites]

I remember when I was staying on Miyajima, the tourist shops were selling statues of monkeys sitting on deer, and when I hiked up Mt Misen, I saw a monkey riding a deer like it was a horse. The monkey looked very dignified, like a regency dandy parading through Hyde Park.
posted by betweenthebars at 7:23 AM on December 18, 2017 [20 favorites]

Is it possible that the mere act of mounting another animal, which these monkeys are already known to do, is somehow physiologically related to the fucking instinct?
posted by clockzero at 7:42 AM on December 18, 2017

I, for one, welcome our new monkey-deer hybrid overlords, and remind them that as a trusted internet personality, I can be helpful in rounding up others to toil in their underground salt caves.
posted by SansPoint at 7:56 AM on December 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

Oh goody. When self-righteous, militant, evangelical, christian terrorists start screaming again how homosexuality is "not natural" or a "perversion of nature" or "goes against Against Mother Nature" or any of that crap, I shall point them to the monkeys humping deer and ask them to kindly STFU.
Again.
posted by pjsky at 8:14 AM on December 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

Thank you for this, ad placement robots.
posted by Fig at 9:12 AM on December 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

Here's an interview with Jean-Baptiste Leca, one of the researchers:

As It Happens: 'They have a monkey on their back and they seem to like it': Why are Japanese macaques humping deer?
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 9:15 AM on December 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

I have nothing astute to say about this.
posted by ChuraChura at 9:25 AM on December 18, 2017 [9 favorites]

The abstract is pretty good:

Further research will be necessary to ascertain whether this group-specific sexual behavior was a short-lived fad or an incipient cultural phenomenon and may also contribute to better understanding the proximate and ultimate causes of reproductive interference.

Soooo...more to...come?

*gets coat off back of chair, turns off lights, closes door*
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 10:13 AM on December 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

That deer is like, "Sometimes a monkey jumps on your back and just starts humping away, what're you gonna do?"
posted by e1c at 10:14 AM on December 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

I saw them present this last year at the International Society of Primatologists meetings, and just kind of shrugged. On the bright side, this is the one piece of popular primate news my grandma hasn't emailed all the coverage about, probably because it is fairly scandalous.

The only thing I'll say is that often primates (often females) use mounting as a dominance display. They're totally dominant to those deer, I guess.
posted by ChuraChura at 10:16 AM on December 18, 2017 [9 favorites]

Well, more than one culture uses stags as a symbol of wild male virility and power, e.g.Herne the Hunter. Maybe the adolescent macaques are engaged in a bit of wry social commentary.
posted by Joe in Australia at 11:07 AM on December 18, 2017

Maybe the adolescent macaques are engaged in a bit of wry social commentary.

Re the intent above to use the snow monkey-on-deer action to shut up evangelical homophobia, I should note that Ezekiel Mutua, head of the Kenyan Film Classification Board, claimed that male lions found shagging each other must have learned it by watching Western tourists 'behaving badly'.

I have no doubt that similar claims will be made, that the researchers who documented the simian-cervidae intercourse initiated the behaviour by rutting with a few stags themselves while the curious monkeys looked on.

(And if anyone does in fact travel to lion country in order to have gay sex within eyesight of the mighty predators, I whisk my sola topee off in frank admiration.)
posted by Devonian at 1:40 PM on December 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

YOU GUYS. These are teen girl monkeys, in Japan, angling for sex with aloof deer. To quote: "The team also found that the adolescent females emitted high pitched calls at the deer when gazing at them, and threw tantrums – including body spasms and screams." How are we not all, to a reader, demanding a manga of this?!

Deer: *ruminates mysteriously*
Teenage loli monkey girl: I HOPE SENPAI WILL NOTICE ME 😍

Or, the article says "the paper notes, it could be a "short-lived fad."" So:

Teen monkey Heather: *makes eyes at deer*
Other teen monkey Heather: Gawh, Hethar, we're so over deer now. You can't hang out with us anymore.

Or, you know:

Doofy fuckup deer: *stands outside with a boom box in its antlers*
College-bound teen monkey: *realizes the error of her decision*
*cut to scene of deer and monkey on plane*

This stuff writes itself.
posted by gusandrews at 1:49 PM on December 18, 2017 [11 favorites]

Given the size difference, I imagine the deer would have no problem resisting if it wasn't.

From the video, they look surprisingly close in size. I’m not sure this would work as well with bigger deer.
posted by Dip Flash at 7:43 PM on December 18, 2017

horny monkey horny monkey, humping on a deer horny monkey
posted by poffin boffin at 8:21 PM on December 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

This isn't as funny once you learn about Japanese macaques tendency to have simian herpes B which is something like 80% lethal for humans. If those fuckers ever generalize to human humping we are in big trouble.

[I know about this because the Lincoln Park Zoo got macaques and I mentioned it to a friend who worked at Brookfield Zoo and he went off about how awful it was to work with them because you had to wear hazmat suits

OK, I had to look up the monkey herpes that was 80% lethal in humans, and while it certainly seems like a hazard not to be taken lightly, the National Organization of Rare Diseases says only that it can be life threatening without treatment. In context:

"Simian B Virus Infection is caused by a type of herpesvirus. It is an infectious disorder contracted chiefly by laboratory workers exposed to infected monkeys and/or simian tissue cultures. It is characterized by a viral invasion of the brain (Encephalitis) and the membranes (meninges) surrounding the brain. Occasionally, the infection affects the spinal cord structures as well (Encephalomyelitis). Neurological damage may result from this infection. Without treatment, some cases of Simian B Virus may be life- threatening."
posted by mrmurbles at 8:22 PM on December 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

when I hiked up Mt Misen, I saw a monkey riding a deer like it was a horse. The monkey looked very dignified, like a regency dandy parading through Hyde Park.

Now I want to see this, but I fear the search term "monkey riding deer" is forever spoiled...
posted by Harald74 at 1:37 AM on December 19, 2017 [2 favorites]