Everybody Has a Box
December 18, 2018 3:33 AM Subscribe
Santore does not shy away from these questions: He has the word temptation tattooed on his right forearm. It’s a reminder, he told me. “What do safecrackers do?” he once asked. “They crack safes. It’d be better if they do it legally, but the game is the fucking game. I’m just saying, it takes a certain mindset to want to do this stuff, to have the patience for it, and some people can channel that in a positive way and other people fucking can’t.” Meet the Safecracker of Last Resort
Might as well give a shout to SAFE here, an entertaining novel by Ryan Gattis which is pretty much EndsofInventions' pitch above. Having enjoyed it immensely I'm looking forward to getting through the links.
posted by ominous_paws at 4:20 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by ominous_paws at 4:20 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
What a fascinating guy. Thank you for posting.
posted by Adridne at 4:21 AM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by Adridne at 4:21 AM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
Oh man, it never occurred to me you could hire people to break into safes. I had an office at my last university for 4 years that had a safe in it that no one knew the combination to. People thought it had probably been at least 20 years since anyone had been able to open it, but it could have been there for up to 60 years.
Every day for years I spent a few minutes trying to guess the combination. A bunch of friends from sciences once even came over with listening devices and high speed cameras and tried to crack it that way. We never succeeded. It was probably empty anyway. But it would have been cool to know for sure.
posted by lollusc at 4:33 AM on December 18, 2018 [12 favorites]
Every day for years I spent a few minutes trying to guess the combination. A bunch of friends from sciences once even came over with listening devices and high speed cameras and tried to crack it that way. We never succeeded. It was probably empty anyway. But it would have been cool to know for sure.
posted by lollusc at 4:33 AM on December 18, 2018 [12 favorites]
This is the sequel to Thief that I've been waiting for.
posted by Halloween Jack at 4:37 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by Halloween Jack at 4:37 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
That was the long article I didn't know I needed--thanks.
When my father died four years ago, my mother asked me to open a small, cheap lockbox from his closet. At her request, I burned the contents that evening, the night before the funeral.
posted by mecran01 at 5:33 AM on December 18, 2018 [7 favorites]
When my father died four years ago, my mother asked me to open a small, cheap lockbox from his closet. At her request, I burned the contents that evening, the night before the funeral.
posted by mecran01 at 5:33 AM on December 18, 2018 [7 favorites]
... but what were the contents???
posted by ominous_paws at 5:37 AM on December 18, 2018 [14 favorites]
posted by ominous_paws at 5:37 AM on December 18, 2018 [14 favorites]
Oh man, it never occurred to me you could hire people to break into safes.
I very nearly had to deal with this just a couple weeks ago. If you work with sensitive government information, you may be aware that the current state of the art safe lock is the X-09, an electromechanical beast that only activates when a user starts spinning it. It's secure but kind of touchy as quite a few electromechanical devices tend to be.
Anyway, I was at a site setting up for some testing a couple weeks ago where we have a safe with the trusty X-09 securing our computer hard drives and other stuff. A coworker pulled about half of our drives out of the safe and then wandered over to ask me if I remembered the safe combination. I said yes and asked him to close the safe so I could try to open it. He closed the safe, I spun the dial, and the display started showing an error symbol.
Four people and half an hour later, and the safe was still locked and showing an error message. With half our hard drives in it. Drives that we needed to start testing. Oh, and our test site was on a ship.
We were in the middle of trying to get in touch with a locksmith (who would ultimately need to destroy the safe to get it open) when someone on a whim decided to give the lock one last spin. It started showing numbers! We quickly got the safe open and then had to leave it open for the rest of the time we were there.
posted by backseatpilot at 6:05 AM on December 18, 2018 [13 favorites]
I very nearly had to deal with this just a couple weeks ago. If you work with sensitive government information, you may be aware that the current state of the art safe lock is the X-09, an electromechanical beast that only activates when a user starts spinning it. It's secure but kind of touchy as quite a few electromechanical devices tend to be.
Anyway, I was at a site setting up for some testing a couple weeks ago where we have a safe with the trusty X-09 securing our computer hard drives and other stuff. A coworker pulled about half of our drives out of the safe and then wandered over to ask me if I remembered the safe combination. I said yes and asked him to close the safe so I could try to open it. He closed the safe, I spun the dial, and the display started showing an error symbol.
Four people and half an hour later, and the safe was still locked and showing an error message. With half our hard drives in it. Drives that we needed to start testing. Oh, and our test site was on a ship.
We were in the middle of trying to get in touch with a locksmith (who would ultimately need to destroy the safe to get it open) when someone on a whim decided to give the lock one last spin. It started showing numbers! We quickly got the safe open and then had to leave it open for the rest of the time we were there.
posted by backseatpilot at 6:05 AM on December 18, 2018 [13 favorites]
the current state of the art safe lock is the X-09
...
the display started showing an error symbol
I continue not to trust computerised locks...
posted by EndsOfInvention at 6:10 AM on December 18, 2018 [11 favorites]
...
the display started showing an error symbol
I continue not to trust computerised locks...
posted by EndsOfInvention at 6:10 AM on December 18, 2018 [11 favorites]
Can't you just blow the bloody door off?
posted by Flashman at 6:12 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by Flashman at 6:12 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
but what were the contents???
I think it's safe to assume that If mecran01's mother wanted people to know what was in the safe, she wouldn't have had mecran01 set it on fire.
posted by zamboni at 6:13 AM on December 18, 2018 [34 favorites]
I think it's safe to assume that If mecran01's mother wanted people to know what was in the safe, she wouldn't have had mecran01 set it on fire.
posted by zamboni at 6:13 AM on December 18, 2018 [34 favorites]
I'd imagine she would have preferred mecran01 not bring it up at all, yet here we are
posted by ominous_paws at 6:21 AM on December 18, 2018 [29 favorites]
posted by ominous_paws at 6:21 AM on December 18, 2018 [29 favorites]
the current state of the art safe lock is the X-09
I can do you one better. You can also install these in doors. I had a bunch on a project and one of the field electricians thought it would be fun to spin it a few times. Nobody had written down the reset SN and we had to order a new door.
posted by q*ben at 6:27 AM on December 18, 2018 [9 favorites]
I can do you one better. You can also install these in doors. I had a bunch on a project and one of the field electricians thought it would be fun to spin it a few times. Nobody had written down the reset SN and we had to order a new door.
posted by q*ben at 6:27 AM on December 18, 2018 [9 favorites]
Nobody had written down the reset SN and we had to order a new door.
Our little crisis did spur conversation about other times these locks failed (human-caused or otherwise) and most of those stories involved replacing large sections of building infrastructure.
posted by backseatpilot at 6:38 AM on December 18, 2018 [6 favorites]
Our little crisis did spur conversation about other times these locks failed (human-caused or otherwise) and most of those stories involved replacing large sections of building infrastructure.
posted by backseatpilot at 6:38 AM on December 18, 2018 [6 favorites]
Fascinating, thank you!
posted by jacquilynne at 6:53 AM on December 18, 2018
posted by jacquilynne at 6:53 AM on December 18, 2018
This guy sounds fascinating.
While we're sharing safe stories: I had never used a room safe until our last trip to Mexico, when for some reason I put both our passports in the safe of the cabana. The morning we were heading out, I went to grab them, and . . . no power to the safe.* I have just enough Spanish to muddle through explaining that, and to understand that someone who had a master key would be arriving soon.
As it turned out the safe was designed in such a way that bumping against it had knocked the batteries out, inside the safe.
*A member of our group also had food poisoning, and the concierge had lost the keys to the rental car (it turned out he had accidentally pocketed them on the way home) - it was an eventful morning.
posted by aspersioncast at 7:04 AM on December 18, 2018 [6 favorites]
While we're sharing safe stories: I had never used a room safe until our last trip to Mexico, when for some reason I put both our passports in the safe of the cabana. The morning we were heading out, I went to grab them, and . . . no power to the safe.* I have just enough Spanish to muddle through explaining that, and to understand that someone who had a master key would be arriving soon.
As it turned out the safe was designed in such a way that bumping against it had knocked the batteries out, inside the safe.
*A member of our group also had food poisoning, and the concierge had lost the keys to the rental car (it turned out he had accidentally pocketed them on the way home) - it was an eventful morning.
posted by aspersioncast at 7:04 AM on December 18, 2018 [6 favorites]
As it turned out the safe was designed in such a way that bumping against it had knocked the batteries out, inside the safe.
Batteries inside the safe - what an insane design choice.
posted by Ragged Richard at 7:12 AM on December 18, 2018 [3 favorites]
Batteries inside the safe - what an insane design choice.
posted by Ragged Richard at 7:12 AM on December 18, 2018 [3 favorites]
Years ago a read a book about the history of safes and safe cracking and what stayed with me was the safes don't have to be that impregnable... just secure enough to prevent casual theft for the most part. Even cash safes in offices (to keep the weekly wage payment) were often surprisingly crackable if you could get at them for several hours (like overnight).
Also the old stethoscope and twiddling the dials was for movies only - even explosives was a rarity (in the UK at least). You didn't bother with the lock or door at all...mainly the petermen* of old would chisel away welds that held the back of the safe on then crowbar open a big enough gap to reach in for the readies.
* 'Peter' being the old slang term for a safe
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 7:12 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
Also the old stethoscope and twiddling the dials was for movies only - even explosives was a rarity (in the UK at least). You didn't bother with the lock or door at all...mainly the petermen* of old would chisel away welds that held the back of the safe on then crowbar open a big enough gap to reach in for the readies.
* 'Peter' being the old slang term for a safe
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 7:12 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
... but what were the contents???
Burned. The contents were burned.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 7:16 AM on December 18, 2018 [18 favorites]
Burned. The contents were burned.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 7:16 AM on December 18, 2018 [18 favorites]
I was waiting the entire article to read about the one safe he couldn't crack... now how am I supposed to know which safe to buy for myself??
posted by Grither at 7:44 AM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by Grither at 7:44 AM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
The one safe he could not crack was himself. Truly knowing what was on the inside of his head.
posted by AugustWest at 7:48 AM on December 18, 2018 [15 favorites]
posted by AugustWest at 7:48 AM on December 18, 2018 [15 favorites]
We tried to buy a house that had a long-lost-combination safe in it, but we failed.
In other news, I would like to fucking thank this fucking author for writing literally the only fucking profile I've ever read of a man that even touches on trying to balance work and parenting.
posted by DarlingBri at 7:49 AM on December 18, 2018 [44 favorites]
In other news, I would like to fucking thank this fucking author for writing literally the only fucking profile I've ever read of a man that even touches on trying to balance work and parenting.
posted by DarlingBri at 7:49 AM on December 18, 2018 [44 favorites]
Years ago a read a book about the history of safes and safe cracking and what stayed with me was the safes don't have to be that impregnable... just secure enough to prevent casual theft for the most part.
As with bicycle locks, you're basically wanting to avoid being the low-hanging fruit. Or, as the old joke goes, "I don't have to outrun the bear, I just have to outrun you."
posted by Halloween Jack at 7:59 AM on December 18, 2018 [3 favorites]
As with bicycle locks, you're basically wanting to avoid being the low-hanging fruit. Or, as the old joke goes, "I don't have to outrun the bear, I just have to outrun you."
posted by Halloween Jack at 7:59 AM on December 18, 2018 [3 favorites]
Wait, bears can crack safes?
posted by EndsOfInvention at 8:05 AM on December 18, 2018 [18 favorites]
posted by EndsOfInvention at 8:05 AM on December 18, 2018 [18 favorites]
Also, speaking of being reminded of things and last requests to destroy secrets, I have a T-shirt of Gandalf clinging to the precipice under the Mines of Moria, saying "Purge my browser history."
posted by Halloween Jack at 8:07 AM on December 18, 2018 [6 favorites]
posted by Halloween Jack at 8:07 AM on December 18, 2018 [6 favorites]
Fun fact, over time the rocking motion on a ship will cause the locking plates (platers?, I'm blanking on the right term) on any onboard safe to align and allow the door to open. The most common solution is to tape the dial down so it cant move.
posted by nestor_makhno at 8:14 AM on December 18, 2018 [11 favorites]
posted by nestor_makhno at 8:14 AM on December 18, 2018 [11 favorites]
If you work with sensitive government information, you may be aware that the current state of the art safe lock is the [Kaba Mas] X-09, an electromechanical beast that only activates when a user starts spinning it. It's secure but kind of touchy as quite a few electromechanical devices tend to be.
posted by zamboni at 8:20 AM on December 18, 2018 [8 favorites]santore_safecracker If there is a God...may He... She ... or It... bless Kaba. May they keep making temperamental locks prone to failure. .. and may they put my kid through college
I had an office at my last university for 4 years that had a safe in it that no one knew the combination to. .. It was probably empty anyway. But it would have been cool to know for sure.
In the philosophy department, they usually just have beetles in them
posted by thelonius at 8:23 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
In the philosophy department, they usually just have beetles in them
posted by thelonius at 8:23 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
"Purge my browser history."
Blast my cache!
posted by EndsOfInvention at 8:46 AM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
Blast my cache!
posted by EndsOfInvention at 8:46 AM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
In the philosophy department, they usually just have beetles in them
In the physics department they keep cats in them, along with poison and radioisotopes.
posted by TedW at 8:47 AM on December 18, 2018 [13 favorites]
In the physics department they keep cats in them, along with poison and radioisotopes.
posted by TedW at 8:47 AM on December 18, 2018 [13 favorites]
Wait, bears can crack safes?
Well, I do own a bear vault. And there was at least one bear who figured out how to open them. So… yes? Bear safecrackers are a thing.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 8:50 AM on December 18, 2018 [9 favorites]
Well, I do own a bear vault. And there was at least one bear who figured out how to open them. So… yes? Bear safecrackers are a thing.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 8:50 AM on December 18, 2018 [9 favorites]
Even cash safes in offices (to keep the weekly wage payment) were often surprisingly crackable if you could get at them for several hours (like overnight).
All security measures can be overcome with sufficient preparation, access, and time. Given a sufficiently skilled attacker, how long do you need to bust open a safe?
Underwriters Laboratories' Standard for Burglary-Resistant Safes grades safes based on resistance to tools (TL), torch (TR), and explosives (X), which sides are protected, and how long they can resist attack.
TL-15x6: resists tool-based entry on all 6 sides (x6) for 15 minutes.
TRTL-30x6 resists torch and tool-based entry, on all 6 sides, for 30 minutes.
The highest certification is 60 minutes. e.g. TRTL-60x6, TXTL-60x6.
Even the UL bank vault door standard tops out at 2 hours for Class III.
posted by zamboni at 8:51 AM on December 18, 2018 [21 favorites]
All security measures can be overcome with sufficient preparation, access, and time. Given a sufficiently skilled attacker, how long do you need to bust open a safe?
Underwriters Laboratories' Standard for Burglary-Resistant Safes grades safes based on resistance to tools (TL), torch (TR), and explosives (X), which sides are protected, and how long they can resist attack.
Before starting a test, UL technicians analyze the blueprints to a commercial safe to identify the weak points and plan out where and how to attack it. Their goal is to create an opening that’s large enough to remove its contents or pry open the door within a specified period of time.A Class TL-15 resists tool-based entry via the front face and door for 15 minutes.
UL’s most basic test addresses a combination-locked safe designed to offer limited protection against common mechanical and electrical tools. UL technicians attack the safe for 15 minutes using hand tools, picking tools, mechanical or electrical tools, grinding points, carbide drills and devices that apply pressure.
At the more extreme end, UL technicians test a combination-locked safe designed to offer protection not only against these types of tools but also against cutting devices, such as power saws and high-level explosives like nitroglycerin. Additionally, UL technicians either attack the door and front face, or the door and body. Because of the size and shape of some safes and vaults, UL technicians travel all over the world to conduct their tests on-site.
UL collaborates with experts in security and the banking industries to help develop its standards and test methods. Upon completion of safe testing, manufacturers receive ratings that indicate a safe’s resistance to attack against specific tools and for a specified period of time.
TL-15x6: resists tool-based entry on all 6 sides (x6) for 15 minutes.
TRTL-30x6 resists torch and tool-based entry, on all 6 sides, for 30 minutes.
The highest certification is 60 minutes. e.g. TRTL-60x6, TXTL-60x6.
Even the UL bank vault door standard tops out at 2 hours for Class III.
posted by zamboni at 8:51 AM on December 18, 2018 [21 favorites]
Now I have an awesome idea for Ocean's 14: it's all bears.
posted by EndsOfInvention at 8:53 AM on December 18, 2018 [18 favorites]
posted by EndsOfInvention at 8:53 AM on December 18, 2018 [18 favorites]
The one safe he could not crack was himself.
But the real safes he cracked were the friends he made along the way.
posted by solotoro at 9:15 AM on December 18, 2018 [22 favorites]
But the real safes he cracked were the friends he made along the way.
posted by solotoro at 9:15 AM on December 18, 2018 [22 favorites]
I used to have a bookstore. It was in an old building where there was originally a merchant exchange; Portland Maine is a harbor town, ships arrived with goods, got paid, etc. The storefront had a built in vault - it's all stone in the basement beneath it, inside is a fridge-sized safe, inside that a wall safe. A locksmith set me up with the combination so I could use the wall safe. While I was on leave having a baby, the manager was having trouble with the safe, neglected to mention this, and it became locked shut with credit card info (remember paper?) checks and cash.
I was referred to a specialist who said if he could drill in he could get it open, and if he couldn't, no charge. He spent 5 - 6 hours drilling in through the solid steel front, and could not get the lock to open, and did not charge me. So, in a safe in town there's hundreds of dollars, as well as checks that can no longer be cashed. I was able to get the credit card charges sorted.
posted by theora55 at 9:25 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
I was referred to a specialist who said if he could drill in he could get it open, and if he couldn't, no charge. He spent 5 - 6 hours drilling in through the solid steel front, and could not get the lock to open, and did not charge me. So, in a safe in town there's hundreds of dollars, as well as checks that can no longer be cashed. I was able to get the credit card charges sorted.
posted by theora55 at 9:25 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
'A Retrieved Reformation' by O'Henry
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 9:54 AM on December 18, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 9:54 AM on December 18, 2018 [2 favorites]
The one safe he could not crack was himself.
But the real safes he cracked were the friends he made along the way.
posted by solotoro
And the name of that safe? Albert Einstein.
posted by Splunge at 10:03 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
But the real safes he cracked were the friends he made along the way.
posted by solotoro
And the name of that safe? Albert Einstein.
posted by Splunge at 10:03 AM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
Here's a low security Sentry Safe opened quite easily by the "lock picking lawyer" on his youtube channel. Ha!
Along with classic lock picking, he's used some unusual tools on padlocks and bike locks.
18 inch hand powered hydraulic rebar cutter
A nut splitter and ratchet wrench.
Ramset concrete nail gun.
A ratcheting cable cutter
posted by jjj606 at 10:20 AM on December 18, 2018 [5 favorites]
Along with classic lock picking, he's used some unusual tools on padlocks and bike locks.
18 inch hand powered hydraulic rebar cutter
A nut splitter and ratchet wrench.
Ramset concrete nail gun.
A ratcheting cable cutter
posted by jjj606 at 10:20 AM on December 18, 2018 [5 favorites]
Oh man, it never occurred to me you could hire people to break into safes.
This breaks my heart, because it means you've never seen a heist movie! Oh, my friend! There is such a wealth of movies awaiting you!!!
posted by praemunire at 1:40 PM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
This breaks my heart, because it means you've never seen a heist movie! Oh, my friend! There is such a wealth of movies awaiting you!!!
posted by praemunire at 1:40 PM on December 18, 2018 [4 favorites]
A nut splitter and ratchet.
Sounds like an ex of mine.
posted by Splunge at 2:19 PM on December 18, 2018 [3 favorites]
Sounds like an ex of mine.
posted by Splunge at 2:19 PM on December 18, 2018 [3 favorites]
There is such a wealth of movies awaiting you!!!
Heist movies are definitely the best movies, but I gotta say the idea of legal jobs for safecrackers was not one that I'd considered previously.
posted by asperity at 2:45 PM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
Heist movies are definitely the best movies, but I gotta say the idea of legal jobs for safecrackers was not one that I'd considered previously.
posted by asperity at 2:45 PM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
Hmmm. I was going to say that I do not have a box, but then realized that my skull would qualify.
posted by skyscraper at 4:53 PM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by skyscraper at 4:53 PM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
In the philosophy department, they usually just have beetles in them
In the physics department they keep cats in them, along with poison and radioisotopes.
This was humanities, so I was hoping for an unpublished manuscript or notebook by someone famous.
I told a colleague that once, and he said, "Yeah, that would be amazing: you could publish it under your name and get an easy line on your CV!" I vastly altered my opinion of that colleague after that conversation.
posted by lollusc at 5:01 PM on December 18, 2018 [3 favorites]
In the physics department they keep cats in them, along with poison and radioisotopes.
This was humanities, so I was hoping for an unpublished manuscript or notebook by someone famous.
I told a colleague that once, and he said, "Yeah, that would be amazing: you could publish it under your name and get an easy line on your CV!" I vastly altered my opinion of that colleague after that conversation.
posted by lollusc at 5:01 PM on December 18, 2018 [3 favorites]
In the physics department they keep cats in them, along with poison and radioisotopes.But, the combo is inevitably 1-3-7 (occasionally 3-1-4-1-5, or possibly 1-4-2-0-4-0-5 if you're in the astro wing and more digits are required) So, calling it a "safe" may be unreasonably grand. On the other hand, all the undergrads have a lock picking kit that they tried to use a couple of times, so perhaps it doesn't really matter.
Also. . . Prince kept unknown recordings in a safe? Of course he did.
posted by eotvos at 6:00 PM on December 18, 2018
EndsOfInvention: If you like tabletop role playing games, HONEY HEIST is here for your bears-doing-crimes needs.
posted by rmd1023 at 5:52 AM on December 19, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by rmd1023 at 5:52 AM on December 19, 2018 [3 favorites]
I'd imagine she would have preferred mecran01 not bring it up at all, yet here we are
posted by ominous_paws at 8:21 on December 18
Do me a favor and don't bring it up the next time you are at Wendy's with my mom getting dollar chili.
posted by mecran01 at 5:03 PM on December 19, 2018
posted by ominous_paws at 8:21 on December 18
Do me a favor and don't bring it up the next time you are at Wendy's with my mom getting dollar chili.
posted by mecran01 at 5:03 PM on December 19, 2018
I gotta say the idea of legal jobs for safecrackers was not one that I'd considered previously.
How do you feel about legal jobs for burglars?
posted by flabdablet at 6:43 AM on December 20, 2018
How do you feel about legal jobs for burglars?
posted by flabdablet at 6:43 AM on December 20, 2018
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posted by EndsOfInvention at 3:52 AM on December 18, 2018 [1 favorite]