The Genius of Ringo
September 4, 2020 2:43 PM Subscribe
Drummer George Hrab explains why Ringo Starr is a genius of his craft (YouTube).
George Hrab previously on Metafilter. Hrab is also the creator of the very quirky Geologic Podcast, where more of his opinions, skits, stories, and music can be found.
George Hrab previously on Metafilter. Hrab is also the creator of the very quirky Geologic Podcast, where more of his opinions, skits, stories, and music can be found.
This is good. Also my favorite Beatle. I love his loose, sometimes lazy, shambolic feel. Another drummer who has taken that feeling even further is Jay Watson of Tame Impala in Mind Mischief.
posted by Mei's lost sandal at 3:08 PM on September 4, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by Mei's lost sandal at 3:08 PM on September 4, 2020 [2 favorites]
There was a great comment on Metafilter years ago that I used to have favorited that explained that Ringo was the only member of the Beatles that the other Beatles asked to join the band. It ends with the statement "They were right."
Hopefully someone knows the comment I am talking about and can post it here. I would like to read it again.
posted by wittgenstein at 3:17 PM on September 4, 2020 [8 favorites]
Hopefully someone knows the comment I am talking about and can post it here. I would like to read it again.
posted by wittgenstein at 3:17 PM on September 4, 2020 [8 favorites]
Most of the examples given to illustrate Ringo's genius involve his creative and unusual drumming choices. How do we know those were literally his choices and not just direction from Paul or John?
(I know this quesiton can be read as argumentative but it isn't...it's just pure curiosity from someone ignorant of the rock band songwriting process)
posted by jeremy b at 4:06 PM on September 4, 2020
(I know this quesiton can be read as argumentative but it isn't...it's just pure curiosity from someone ignorant of the rock band songwriting process)
posted by jeremy b at 4:06 PM on September 4, 2020
Awesome Youtuber, sina-drums, did this topic about a year ago quite well.
posted by 2N2222 at 4:07 PM on September 4, 2020 [4 favorites]
posted by 2N2222 at 4:07 PM on September 4, 2020 [4 favorites]
The Beatles wouldn’t have been the Beatles without Ringo. If you don’t believe me, just listen to what his predecessor, Pete Best, sounded like.
posted by vitout at 4:30 PM on September 4, 2020 [10 favorites]
posted by vitout at 4:30 PM on September 4, 2020 [10 favorites]
one of the things about ringo that people take for granted was his sheer ability to play well so the others weren't being slowed down by him trying to get his part right - even if his drum parts were directed by others (i don't know), he still played them right very quickly
that was a huge advantage in the studio at that time, as a lot of rock and roll bands didn't have that - it saved the beatles time and let them focus on other things
posted by pyramid termite at 4:31 PM on September 4, 2020 [4 favorites]
that was a huge advantage in the studio at that time, as a lot of rock and roll bands didn't have that - it saved the beatles time and let them focus on other things
posted by pyramid termite at 4:31 PM on September 4, 2020 [4 favorites]
How do we know those were literally his choices and not just direction from Paul or John?
If they were just direction from Paul or John, why didn't just direct Pete Best?
posted by Thella at 5:05 PM on September 4, 2020 [9 favorites]
If they were just direction from Paul or John, why didn't just direct Pete Best?
posted by Thella at 5:05 PM on September 4, 2020 [9 favorites]
I don't really know anything about drumming or, for that matter, the Beatles.
But whenever this argument comes up, I always think that, you know, the Beatles could have had any damn drummer in the world if they wanted to change.
They were, after all, the Freaking Beatles,
But they stuck with Ringo, so he couldn't have sucked all that badly.
posted by madajb at 5:08 PM on September 4, 2020 [8 favorites]
But whenever this argument comes up, I always think that, you know, the Beatles could have had any damn drummer in the world if they wanted to change.
They were, after all, the Freaking Beatles,
But they stuck with Ringo, so he couldn't have sucked all that badly.
posted by madajb at 5:08 PM on September 4, 2020 [8 favorites]
I know this quesiton can be read as argumentative but it isn't...it's just pure curiosity
But it is insulting to Ringo and those who admire him. It's a negging kind of question.
posted by Thella at 5:12 PM on September 4, 2020 [3 favorites]
But it is insulting to Ringo and those who admire him. It's a negging kind of question.
posted by Thella at 5:12 PM on September 4, 2020 [3 favorites]
Jay Watson of Tame Impala in Mind Mischief.
This is totally a derail, but that's Kevin Parker on drums. Jay Watson only played piano and keyboards on two tracks, neither of which is "Mind Mischief."
I'm not enough of a Beatles studio maven to know to what extent Ringo's parts were or weren't orchestrated by others, but for me, his drumming is equally about the tone and texture of his kit. The woody thump of all that late-'60s stuff does it for me above all other aspects of their music.
posted by mykescipark at 5:13 PM on September 4, 2020 [1 favorite]
This is totally a derail, but that's Kevin Parker on drums. Jay Watson only played piano and keyboards on two tracks, neither of which is "Mind Mischief."
I'm not enough of a Beatles studio maven to know to what extent Ringo's parts were or weren't orchestrated by others, but for me, his drumming is equally about the tone and texture of his kit. The woody thump of all that late-'60s stuff does it for me above all other aspects of their music.
posted by mykescipark at 5:13 PM on September 4, 2020 [1 favorite]
it is insulting to Ringo and those who admire him.
Sorry. I tried to word my question to avoid that sort of thing. The Beatles are my favorite band.
posted by jeremy b at 5:37 PM on September 4, 2020 [1 favorite]
Sorry. I tried to word my question to avoid that sort of thing. The Beatles are my favorite band.
posted by jeremy b at 5:37 PM on September 4, 2020 [1 favorite]
Ringo is a great drummer. Love those fills at the end of 'A Day in The Life'.
Hrab mentions that Ringo was patient with those many retakes on the White Album, but Ringo defected from those sessions, like G. Martin and G. Emerick, although probably more from sour vibes than retakes.
(Personally I don't like the drum sound of Hrab's studio. It kinda sounds like a tinny Bonham boom.)
posted by ovvl at 6:12 PM on September 4, 2020
Hrab mentions that Ringo was patient with those many retakes on the White Album, but Ringo defected from those sessions, like G. Martin and G. Emerick, although probably more from sour vibes than retakes.
(Personally I don't like the drum sound of Hrab's studio. It kinda sounds like a tinny Bonham boom.)
posted by ovvl at 6:12 PM on September 4, 2020
fills
I was looking for, but cannot find, a video that explained that one distinctive feature of his style was that he led fills by starting with the "wrong" hand
posted by thelonius at 6:20 PM on September 4, 2020 [1 favorite]
I was looking for, but cannot find, a video that explained that one distinctive feature of his style was that he led fills by starting with the "wrong" hand
posted by thelonius at 6:20 PM on September 4, 2020 [1 favorite]
That reminds me of this video from a few years back: The World's Greatest Drummers Salute Ringo Starr. They sit at a copy of his Beatles kit, play some of his fills, and vehemently agree with Hrab.
posted by JonathanB at 7:09 PM on September 4, 2020 [7 favorites]
posted by JonathanB at 7:09 PM on September 4, 2020 [7 favorites]
Funny, I was just thinking about George Hrab the other day, and here he is!
posted by jazon at 7:53 PM on September 4, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by jazon at 7:53 PM on September 4, 2020 [1 favorite]
My favourite Beatle, and one of the most influential drummers of all time.
posted by Pouteria at 8:06 PM on September 4, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by Pouteria at 8:06 PM on September 4, 2020 [3 favorites]
Whether or not Ringo's parts were completely dictated to him is almost irrelevant. When one goes to a classical music performance, one does not expect to hear a soloist make up their own part in a song. No, it is the "feel" that the musician brings to the already-composed part that can make a classical musician one of the great performers. Same deal with Ringo. Also, over the years, I've had conversations with various people that really are into "prog rock", and they look down on Ringo for not playing Zappaesque 32nd notes in 5/16th time, or whatever. Ringo at his most creative didn't work with that philosophy of "more=better". His best work takes advantage of the pauses between his strikes. He makes that space work to his advantage. Listen to his fills on "A Day In The Life", for example. He doesn't just work his way from snare drum to floor tom with evenly-spaced strikes; there are pauses of differing lengths. That's the magic of his most creative work. And to think that he did all of that work with only a snare drum, one rack tom, and a floor tom. Amazing.
posted by frodisaur at 8:51 PM on September 4, 2020 [16 favorites]
posted by frodisaur at 8:51 PM on September 4, 2020 [16 favorites]
I once had a dream that Ringo Starr and I were breaking into Patrick Swayze's house together. He had an elaborate security system so Ringo took the lead. As you might imagine his ninja skills are nonpareil. The dream ended with our discovery and Swayze pointing a big gun at my face.
posted by Ice Cream Socialist at 8:54 PM on September 4, 2020 [14 favorites]
posted by Ice Cream Socialist at 8:54 PM on September 4, 2020 [14 favorites]
These vids are terrific for an inside-baseball take on the band. I went to the two-part 4hr Abbey Road live lecture. Dude is really personable and a very good player, to boot.
posted by j_curiouser at 9:10 PM on September 4, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by j_curiouser at 9:10 PM on September 4, 2020 [2 favorites]
That's an interesting point about (some) prog rock fans. George Hrab is actually also really into prog rock, and talks a lot about enjoying its technical virtuosity, and has written a number of pieces in odd time himself. But clearly that doesn't stop him from also appreciating the different, perhaps more subtle, skill set of a drummer like Ringo Starr. The difference is probably that a practitioner like Hrab has a more complete understanding of what goes into the art of drumming, whereas someone who's a fan but doesn't have that same level of experience is only able to assess skill based on more obvious, seemingly "objective" criteria. Which is also probably why in the video JonathanB linked you have so many drummers who play so many different styles who all seem to agree that Ringo is great at what he does.
It's one of the things that's really nice about listening to experts talk about their craft. I'm not a drummer myself and I don't have any real opinion as to how great Ringo Starr is (except inasmuch as I enjoy his music), but hearing someone like George Hrab talk about it is a chance to get to see the world through his eyes a little bit, and understand something I otherwise wouldn't about what it's like to have that skill.
posted by biogeo at 9:23 PM on September 4, 2020 [5 favorites]
It's one of the things that's really nice about listening to experts talk about their craft. I'm not a drummer myself and I don't have any real opinion as to how great Ringo Starr is (except inasmuch as I enjoy his music), but hearing someone like George Hrab talk about it is a chance to get to see the world through his eyes a little bit, and understand something I otherwise wouldn't about what it's like to have that skill.
posted by biogeo at 9:23 PM on September 4, 2020 [5 favorites]
It's as if nobody ever has the balls to say Ringo was a shitty drummer who played some good drum parts in some really great pop songs. So what? The guy is a humble cool dude who likes drumming and fell bass-ackwards into the greatest gig of his life. One rack tom and one floor tom? Listen to Brian Blade, Roy Haynes, or Jack DeJohnette if you want to hear what a genius can do with a rack tom and a floor tom. I bet Ringo would idolize them too.
posted by Chickenring at 9:52 PM on September 4, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by Chickenring at 9:52 PM on September 4, 2020 [2 favorites]
I was looking for, but cannot find, a video that explained that one distinctive feature of his style was that he led fills by starting with the "wrong" hand
Was it this one, perhaps, where he talks to Dave Stewart about his drumming style?
posted by daniel_charms at 10:04 PM on September 4, 2020 [4 favorites]
Was it this one, perhaps, where he talks to Dave Stewart about his drumming style?
posted by daniel_charms at 10:04 PM on September 4, 2020 [4 favorites]
That is it! The part I was recalling is here
posted by thelonius at 10:50 PM on September 4, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by thelonius at 10:50 PM on September 4, 2020 [3 favorites]
Thank you for this. Hrab is pretty amazing too.
I used to hear that Ringo's beat was really following the music, a kind of timing that sounded good but was not always technically correct, but apparently not. I listened to a bunch of Beatles songs earlier this year on a better sound system than before (I love The Beatles) and even non musically expert me thought, wow, he truly is amazing. One thing that (ahem) struck me was that especially as their music progressed, Ringo's precise, brilliantly understated drumming actually gives many of the songs a surprisingly hard edge that works perfectly with the rest.The way he builds up sequences is just masterful.
posted by blue shadows at 11:02 PM on September 4, 2020 [1 favorite]
I used to hear that Ringo's beat was really following the music, a kind of timing that sounded good but was not always technically correct, but apparently not. I listened to a bunch of Beatles songs earlier this year on a better sound system than before (I love The Beatles) and even non musically expert me thought, wow, he truly is amazing. One thing that (ahem) struck me was that especially as their music progressed, Ringo's precise, brilliantly understated drumming actually gives many of the songs a surprisingly hard edge that works perfectly with the rest.The way he builds up sequences is just masterful.
posted by blue shadows at 11:02 PM on September 4, 2020 [1 favorite]
It's as if nobody ever has the balls to say Ringo was a shitty drummer who played some good drum parts in some really great pop songs.
I've definitely heard people call Ringo that. They have invariably either been prog rock fans or jazz fans. You mentioned Brian Blade, Roy Haynes, & Jack DeJohnette. Note that they're all jazzmen. They speak a different musical language than that of pop-rock. It's not to say that their musical genre or their abilities are better or worse, it's just that they're in a different realm of music; but man, a lot of jazz fans sure do hate on the rock. And by the way, saying Ringo just got lucky betrays a total lack of understanding about his musicianship and how it fit into the sound of rock & roll. The Beatles wanted him in because he was the best (pun intended) drummer in Liverpool, bar none. Check out this first song from The Beatles' first U.S. concert. It's "Roll Over Beethoven" and George's nervous guitar intro doesn't have the energy that the record had. But then Ringo comes in and punches the things up into overdrive, providing it with an energy that Terry Bozzio or Neil Peart could only dream of having. Some drummers have the technical chops. Some have the energy. Ringo struck a balance between the two. He's been a musical inspiration of mine since 1983.
posted by frodisaur at 11:43 PM on September 4, 2020 [13 favorites]
I've definitely heard people call Ringo that. They have invariably either been prog rock fans or jazz fans. You mentioned Brian Blade, Roy Haynes, & Jack DeJohnette. Note that they're all jazzmen. They speak a different musical language than that of pop-rock. It's not to say that their musical genre or their abilities are better or worse, it's just that they're in a different realm of music; but man, a lot of jazz fans sure do hate on the rock. And by the way, saying Ringo just got lucky betrays a total lack of understanding about his musicianship and how it fit into the sound of rock & roll. The Beatles wanted him in because he was the best (pun intended) drummer in Liverpool, bar none. Check out this first song from The Beatles' first U.S. concert. It's "Roll Over Beethoven" and George's nervous guitar intro doesn't have the energy that the record had. But then Ringo comes in and punches the things up into overdrive, providing it with an energy that Terry Bozzio or Neil Peart could only dream of having. Some drummers have the technical chops. Some have the energy. Ringo struck a balance between the two. He's been a musical inspiration of mine since 1983.
posted by frodisaur at 11:43 PM on September 4, 2020 [13 favorites]
Ringo at his most creative didn't work with that philosophy of "more=better". His best work takes advantage of the pauses between his strikes.
That's what I like about Nick Mason's drumming as well. Both players are masters of sufficiency.
As a mediocre hobbyist drummer myself, I can attest to the fact that not succumbing to the temptation to flood the zone with sound is hard.
posted by flabdablet at 1:50 AM on September 5, 2020 [4 favorites]
That's what I like about Nick Mason's drumming as well. Both players are masters of sufficiency.
As a mediocre hobbyist drummer myself, I can attest to the fact that not succumbing to the temptation to flood the zone with sound is hard.
posted by flabdablet at 1:50 AM on September 5, 2020 [4 favorites]
I enjoyed this and while I'm not a Beatles fan the way some people are, I'm inclined to agree.
Also I really dig Hrab's dress sense and am making notes...
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 1:59 AM on September 5, 2020
Also I really dig Hrab's dress sense and am making notes...
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 1:59 AM on September 5, 2020
Next up in drumming hot takes: (1) Lars Ulrich is good at playing the drums. (2) Buddy Rich is only famous because he could play fast.
posted by Pyrogenesis at 3:30 AM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Pyrogenesis at 3:30 AM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
A thread about Ringo's drumming needs a link to Tomorrow Never Knows. That is all.
posted by jeremias at 3:41 AM on September 5, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by jeremias at 3:41 AM on September 5, 2020 [3 favorites]
As someone who has played the drums intermittently for about 30 years now, I too wanted to have a several paragraph long Hot Take about this. Instead, here's the actual best drummer of all time, Bernard "Pretty" Purdie splaining - remember that word, it's not explaining - how to play the legendary Purdie Shuffle.
posted by Pyrogenesis at 5:20 AM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Pyrogenesis at 5:20 AM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
I live with two drummers of the prog persuasion (the elder is a Rush disciple while the younger leans more toward Dream Theater) and they agree whenever the subject of the Beatles arises that Ringo was an essential part of their sound and an amazing drummer and that people who dump on Ringo don't know what they're talking about. There are a lot of prog-rock people that just don't have an ear for music.
posted by Daily Alice at 5:21 AM on September 5, 2020 [5 favorites]
posted by Daily Alice at 5:21 AM on September 5, 2020 [5 favorites]
I quite literally grew up with the Beatles' version of "Twist and Shout" - my parents bought one Beatles single, and that was it. As an adult, I listen to it over and over partly because it is really good, but partly because I never get tired of Ringo's drumming. I love the time change in the middle, and how he drives the song without being intrusive.
I recall reading that John Lennon once said that Ringo would have been a big star even had he not joined the Beatles - he was a star in Liverpool before they were. The world is a better place because Ringo has been in it.
posted by tallmiddleagedgeek at 6:22 AM on September 5, 2020 [5 favorites]
I recall reading that John Lennon once said that Ringo would have been a big star even had he not joined the Beatles - he was a star in Liverpool before they were. The world is a better place because Ringo has been in it.
posted by tallmiddleagedgeek at 6:22 AM on September 5, 2020 [5 favorites]
It is interesting to me that Ringo Starr spent much of his childhood at death's door due to illness, yet later excelled. Andy Warhol is another creative person who spent a chunk of his childhood sick in bed, and said that that period of time helped to make him who he was. I wonder if there are other examples?
posted by jabah at 6:34 AM on September 5, 2020
posted by jabah at 6:34 AM on September 5, 2020
“He wants a click. I am the fiucking click!”
one of the things about ringo that people take for granted was his sheer ability to play well so the others weren't being slowed down by him trying to get his part right - even if his drum parts were directed by others (i don't know), he still played them right very quickly
that was a huge advantage in the studio at that time, as a lot of rock and roll bands didn't have that - it saved the beatles time and let them focus on other things
Geoff Emerick mentioned somewhere (perhaps his biography? Sorry I have no cite) that in all the Beatles sessions he recorded, they only had to stop a take because of a Ringo flub twice. Twice. Considering the number of takes they recorded, that’s utterly incredible.
posted by Devils Rancher at 8:10 AM on September 5, 2020 [6 favorites]
one of the things about ringo that people take for granted was his sheer ability to play well so the others weren't being slowed down by him trying to get his part right - even if his drum parts were directed by others (i don't know), he still played them right very quickly
that was a huge advantage in the studio at that time, as a lot of rock and roll bands didn't have that - it saved the beatles time and let them focus on other things
Geoff Emerick mentioned somewhere (perhaps his biography? Sorry I have no cite) that in all the Beatles sessions he recorded, they only had to stop a take because of a Ringo flub twice. Twice. Considering the number of takes they recorded, that’s utterly incredible.
posted by Devils Rancher at 8:10 AM on September 5, 2020 [6 favorites]
I don't know much about drumming technically but I do know that I can identify easily dozens of Beatles songs just from the isolated drum tracks. Obviously this has something to do with the fact that I've heard this songs since I was born; my older sisters played a stack of Beatles 45s constantly on a little portable record player. His parts were so specific to the song though that they jump out at you.
posted by octothorpe at 8:23 AM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by octothorpe at 8:23 AM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
are people familiar with the generic rock beat of kick drum on beats 1 and 3, snare on 2 and 4, and constant 8th notes on the hi-hat? that recipe right there is like 85% of rock drumming, allowing for variations.
Ringo used that groove maybe 30% of the time. The rest was compositional invention, in service of the song, with a premium placed on economy - only play what the song requires, no more.
There isn’t another drummer who would have approached things this way. And that’s why he was the perfect drummer for a band that also counted among its members two of the greatest composers to ever grace our species.
(Ringo did indeed bail on the White Album sessions, but only for 10 days. That’s Paul -with overdubs - drumming on USSR and Prudence.)
posted by fingers_of_fire at 8:35 AM on September 5, 2020 [11 favorites]
Ringo used that groove maybe 30% of the time. The rest was compositional invention, in service of the song, with a premium placed on economy - only play what the song requires, no more.
There isn’t another drummer who would have approached things this way. And that’s why he was the perfect drummer for a band that also counted among its members two of the greatest composers to ever grace our species.
(Ringo did indeed bail on the White Album sessions, but only for 10 days. That’s Paul -with overdubs - drumming on USSR and Prudence.)
posted by fingers_of_fire at 8:35 AM on September 5, 2020 [11 favorites]
There was a great comment on Metafilter years ago that I used to have favorited that explained that Ringo was the only member of the Beatles that the other Beatles asked to join the band.
And George was the only one who asked to be a member (and was let in, eventually). But then, George was the youngest, and Ringo was the oldest.
How do we know those were literally his choices and not just direction from Paul or John?
Because he was several years older, I'd guess Ringo wasn't getting much direction (except maybe from Brian Epstein or George Martin). On the other hand, George, the kid, was being directed, at least by Paul, which you can see in "Let It Be".
posted by Rash at 9:33 AM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
And George was the only one who asked to be a member (and was let in, eventually). But then, George was the youngest, and Ringo was the oldest.
How do we know those were literally his choices and not just direction from Paul or John?
Because he was several years older, I'd guess Ringo wasn't getting much direction (except maybe from Brian Epstein or George Martin). On the other hand, George, the kid, was being directed, at least by Paul, which you can see in "Let It Be".
posted by Rash at 9:33 AM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
Really enjoyed the video. I get a lot more enjoyment out of people who are making a case for someone's talent than someone trying to argue why something a lot of people like is actually not that good. In my book, Ringo will always be a legend of rock drumming. He's inspired countless people to pick up the sticks and do their own thing, and seems like a decent human to boot.
With music, there's enough to go around. Like, there doesn't have to be one best drummer or one best guitarist. You can have many, many people who are just the very best at their own thing and fitting their music right next to somebody else who's also the best but in a different way. Ringo is one of 'em. Hope I get to meet the man someday, I'd really love to thank him for all the good vibes and especially for "Yellow Submarine" which was a big favorite of mine as a kid and never, ever gets old.
posted by jzb at 9:42 AM on September 5, 2020 [3 favorites]
With music, there's enough to go around. Like, there doesn't have to be one best drummer or one best guitarist. You can have many, many people who are just the very best at their own thing and fitting their music right next to somebody else who's also the best but in a different way. Ringo is one of 'em. Hope I get to meet the man someday, I'd really love to thank him for all the good vibes and especially for "Yellow Submarine" which was a big favorite of mine as a kid and never, ever gets old.
posted by jzb at 9:42 AM on September 5, 2020 [3 favorites]
On the other hand, George, the kid, was being directed, at least by Paul
George was being pushed around by Paul, a self-regarded asshole/visionary at the time of Abbey Road and Let it Be.
Which is one reason george dgaf about the breakup and had 3 LPs worth of already written material for All Things Must Pass.
posted by j_curiouser at 9:52 AM on September 5, 2020 [4 favorites]
George was being pushed around by Paul, a self-regarded asshole/visionary at the time of Abbey Road and Let it Be.
Which is one reason george dgaf about the breakup and had 3 LPs worth of already written material for All Things Must Pass.
posted by j_curiouser at 9:52 AM on September 5, 2020 [4 favorites]
Ringo's drum part in Revolution slays me--it's such a heavy song, which he makes room for by completely (and counter-intuitively) eschewing the hi-hat (which is one of my fave things about his style) and the way he hits the crash at the beginning of the first chorus almost makes no sense, but elevates a standard 12-bar blues into something psychedelic and crazy-feeling. the Beatles are under-rated.
posted by Zerowensboring at 9:55 AM on September 5, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by Zerowensboring at 9:55 AM on September 5, 2020 [3 favorites]
only play what the song requires, no more
100% this. People notice showy talent more, but this kind of talent makes anything they work on better. Charlie Watts gets overlooked in the same way.
posted by InfidelZombie at 10:05 AM on September 5, 2020 [7 favorites]
100% this. People notice showy talent more, but this kind of talent makes anything they work on better. Charlie Watts gets overlooked in the same way.
posted by InfidelZombie at 10:05 AM on September 5, 2020 [7 favorites]
Both players are masters of sufficiency.
I'll see your Starr and Mason and raise you one "Benny" Benjamin, from whom both of them blatantly and constantly cribbed.
posted by aspersioncast at 10:09 AM on September 5, 2020
I'll see your Starr and Mason and raise you one "Benny" Benjamin, from whom both of them blatantly and constantly cribbed.
posted by aspersioncast at 10:09 AM on September 5, 2020
I hadn't realized how many Beatles songs are instantly recognizable from the drum line alone.
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 10:57 AM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 10:57 AM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
Yeah, his parts we clever, thoughtful & simple. He has technique for miles. I love watching videos of him because of how perfectly he swings a stick. I was trying to describe Ringo’s playing a while back, & basically, it’s meat & potatoes, but it’s the best damn meat & potatoes you’ve ever tasted.
posted by Devils Rancher at 12:41 PM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Devils Rancher at 12:41 PM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
Samuel Taylor Coleridge wrote an essay in which he doubts his ability to judge the merits of the Bible because he realizes how much of his moral and aesthetic/literary values that he uses to make judgements are from the Bible in the first place.
When people talk about what kind of drumming works best with rock music, a big chunk of the standards they are using were created by Ringo and the Beatles in the first place. The idea of trying to decide whether "A Day in The Life" or "Come Together" would be better played by a different drummer seems absurd. Our sense of what "Come Together" sounds like, what the song is, is much more solid than our shifting opinions about what kinds of drumming we like in general. "Come Together" with a different drummer might sound interesting, we might like it, but it wouldn't really be "Come Together."
posted by straight at 1:26 PM on September 5, 2020 [7 favorites]
When people talk about what kind of drumming works best with rock music, a big chunk of the standards they are using were created by Ringo and the Beatles in the first place. The idea of trying to decide whether "A Day in The Life" or "Come Together" would be better played by a different drummer seems absurd. Our sense of what "Come Together" sounds like, what the song is, is much more solid than our shifting opinions about what kinds of drumming we like in general. "Come Together" with a different drummer might sound interesting, we might like it, but it wouldn't really be "Come Together."
posted by straight at 1:26 PM on September 5, 2020 [7 favorites]
When people talk about what kind of drumming works best with rock music, a big chunk of the standards they are using were created by Ringo and the Beatles in the first place.
That brings to mind an interview I heard (perhaps on NPR, perhaps with a drummer and/or session musician but an accomplished musician regardless) where the subject of Ringo’s ability came up. Said musician was definitely a Ringo fan, and stated that when producers were having a hard time describing the sound they were looking for from a drummer, they would often end up saying “look, just play it like Ringo!” and get what they wanted.
posted by TedW at 2:17 PM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
That brings to mind an interview I heard (perhaps on NPR, perhaps with a drummer and/or session musician but an accomplished musician regardless) where the subject of Ringo’s ability came up. Said musician was definitely a Ringo fan, and stated that when producers were having a hard time describing the sound they were looking for from a drummer, they would often end up saying “look, just play it like Ringo!” and get what they wanted.
posted by TedW at 2:17 PM on September 5, 2020 [1 favorite]
"What key is it in, Robbie? F-demented? [slyt]
posted by hearthpig at 3:05 PM on September 5, 2020 [4 favorites]
posted by hearthpig at 3:05 PM on September 5, 2020 [4 favorites]
As a drummer but not a particular Beatles fan, I’ve never had much appreciation of Ringo’s work. This definitely gave me a better understanding of what made him innovative and how being subtle and understated can often be more musical than jamming in the most notes or the weirdest rhythms.
I still kinda wish it were framed more as “an appreciation” or looking at how underrated he is rather than the argument for “genius”, but ultimately that’s a subjective quibble. Also, the YT algorithm probably biases toward more extreme titles.
posted by Cogito at 10:58 AM on September 6, 2020
I still kinda wish it were framed more as “an appreciation” or looking at how underrated he is rather than the argument for “genius”, but ultimately that’s a subjective quibble. Also, the YT algorithm probably biases toward more extreme titles.
posted by Cogito at 10:58 AM on September 6, 2020
Yeah, the video does go a little overboard on the praise considering that he's kind of coasted for what is now a half century.
posted by octothorpe at 11:20 AM on September 6, 2020
posted by octothorpe at 11:20 AM on September 6, 2020
Also, not to be too sour on what I think is a genuinely good refutation of “X gets shit on unfairly, here’s why X is good”, but whenever I see a successful, white person heaped with praise for being the first rock-n-roll whatever, I wonder what significantly less famous or downright unknown black person they were taking inspiration from.
posted by Cogito at 11:44 AM on September 6, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by Cogito at 11:44 AM on September 6, 2020 [3 favorites]
Yeah, the video does go a little overboard on the praise considering that he's kind of coasted for what is now a half century.
To be fair, before "coasting for half a century", the Beatles did bang out 20 records in 10 years.
posted by mikelieman at 2:07 PM on September 6, 2020 [4 favorites]
To be fair, before "coasting for half a century", the Beatles did bang out 20 records in 10 years.
posted by mikelieman at 2:07 PM on September 6, 2020 [4 favorites]
Actually their recording career was a mere 7 years. Some 200 songs in 7 years. And let's not forget the rash of hit singles Ringo had in the early 70s.
The dude was neither a hired hand nor a fluke.
posted by fingers_of_fire at 6:15 PM on September 6, 2020 [7 favorites]
The dude was neither a hired hand nor a fluke.
posted by fingers_of_fire at 6:15 PM on September 6, 2020 [7 favorites]
only play what the song requires, no more
Ringo was the perfect drummer for The Beatles. What contemporaries would have been better fits? Keith Moon, for example, would probably not have been a good fit.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:16 AM on September 8, 2020 [2 favorites]
Ringo was the perfect drummer for The Beatles. What contemporaries would have been better fits? Keith Moon, for example, would probably not have been a good fit.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:16 AM on September 8, 2020 [2 favorites]
one distinctive feature of his style was that he led fills by starting with the "wrong" hand
A couple of the drummers in the The World's Greatest Drummers Salute Ringo Starr video linked above mention the same thing. Cool!
posted by kirkaracha at 10:10 PM on September 8, 2020
A couple of the drummers in the The World's Greatest Drummers Salute Ringo Starr video linked above mention the same thing. Cool!
posted by kirkaracha at 10:10 PM on September 8, 2020
Keith Moon would have lasted in The Beatles almost as long as Clem Burke lasted in the Ramones.
posted by Devoidoid at 9:55 AM on September 9, 2020
posted by Devoidoid at 9:55 AM on September 9, 2020
Moon and Ringo were good friends though.
posted by octothorpe at 10:54 AM on September 9, 2020
posted by octothorpe at 10:54 AM on September 9, 2020
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posted by The_Vegetables at 3:05 PM on September 4, 2020 [3 favorites]