September 11, 2002

5:14 PM

Take Five - you won't be disappointedThe perfect way to end a day of stress and media overload. This will take about five minutes, but stay with it. Sure, it's funny (VERY), but it's the messages at the end that make it worth watching the whole thing. Just when I was feeling like there was nothing worth looking at today...
posted by sparky (50 comments total)

Wow.
posted by ColdChef at 5:32 PM on September 11, 2002

I believe I have seen this before. I'm not sure.
posted by Dark Messiah at 5:35 PM on September 11, 2002

Here's a save-target-as link: http://http.dvlabs.com/gnn/qt/gnn/redux/redux_bb.mov
posted by aeschenkarnos at 5:43 PM on September 11, 2002

Uh, ten minutes, actually. And fifty-four seconds.
posted by Acetylene at 5:47 PM on September 11, 2002

Loved it.
posted by donkeyschlong at 5:48 PM on September 11, 2002

Also here. But still notable.
posted by alterego at 5:59 PM on September 11, 2002

alterego: good to know I'm not a complete crack-head.
posted by Dark Messiah at 6:00 PM on September 11, 2002

My lasting question after watching all of that... is the Canadian Prime Minister retarded?
posted by xmutex at 6:02 PM on September 11, 2002

No, he's just Canadian.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 6:04 PM on September 11, 2002

So it really boils down to one thing. Either we realize that we're all on this spinning rock in space, and realizing this, that we only have each other to count on, OR we continue in this cycle of violence with brother killing brother until the last Cain slays the last Abel, and there's simply nothing left of humanity.

Hopefully GNN has managed to put enough honey with the castor oil, so that the message goes down easy. Hopefully this message will continue to permeate, and each individual on this planet will comprehend it and start trying to utilize this realization day by day. This GNN thing won't reach every person, but it's a seed. Maybe it's a start.

It starts with us. Each and every individual on the planet. Separately. It's not something that can be forced upon anyone, yet it's a simple truth that we either all accept or we all will fall.

United we stand. It's not just an American saying. A humanity standing together is a humanity with a better future. However, at the same time, it's not a call to 'goodthinking,' or religious and societal intolerance, where individual liberty is lost.

On a geologic timescale, humanity has been nothing but a child. Maybe what we're witnessing now are the first signs of puberty. Or maybe it's just the 'terrible twos.' God I just hope we grow up soon.
posted by ZachsMind at 6:13 PM on September 11, 2002

Ive come to the philosophical conclusion that war isnt really a problem and never has been. It kills relativly few people and often brings about ultimate change for the better. The problem is we focus so much time and attention on it we neglect the important things. Like, the environment, healthcare, food, space exploration.
posted by stbalbach at 6:21 PM on September 11, 2002

i thought this was very well done. a little silly in the beginning, but a great piece of art.

perhaps i'm all growed up and cynical and disillusioned, but don't we all know this? doesn't seem like things will ever change. i think it's primarily america's fault.

everyone is to blame, but we're the worst offenders.

collective non-guilt to the rescue, time for diablo.
posted by folktrash at 6:31 PM on September 11, 2002

No, he's just Canadian.

I resemble that remark. ;)
posted by debralee at 6:34 PM on September 11, 2002

Good point, StBalbach. Though one can rationalize and even constructively find positive aspects of war when looking at history, it just gets in the way.

When a parent is driving her kids to school, and all the kids are rowdy and punching each other in the backseat, it throws her off her game. It causes the parent to be more at risk for accidents, or it could just make the rest of her day crummy. Y'know? If the kids would just settle in and not punch each other in the arm or whine about how Joey's lookin' at Marcie funny...

We're all in this car together man. Wars are ultimately just whiny kids punching each other in the arms.

""Boys? If you don't knock it off, I will pull this car over and you can just walk to your painful deaths from here!"
- the character of Xander, Buffy the Vampire Slayer

Y'might think violence can resolve things. Sometimes it does for a time. Ultimately it just gets in the way of more important things.
posted by ZachsMind at 6:36 PM on September 11, 2002

Stellar. Absolutely worth watching.
posted by anathema at 6:46 PM on September 11, 2002

Actually, I found out it was on MeFi last December. But definitely a good repeat. Thanks for the "save target as" link. I agree - pass it on!!
posted by sparky at 7:03 PM on September 11, 2002

But, what happens when we all decide that we're "not gonna study war no more," we educate ourselves and our planetary neighbors, and make peace with each other. And a madman somewhere recruits a bunch of his (similarly misguided) friends and decides to blow us up anyways?

I appreciate the message. But I have trouble imagining a utopia so complete that someone out there doesn't want to kill us all anyways.

I suppose that still doesn't mean it isn't worth hoping for.
posted by Lafe at 7:10 PM on September 11, 2002

At this rate, the Vulcans are never going to let us know they're up there.

I anxiously await the day when we can progress to bigger and better things.
posted by precocious at 7:17 PM on September 11, 2002

Yeah, it really is up to us. Up to us to turn ourselves into a nation of docile sheep ready to be ordered around by anyone who is clever enough to use our conscience as a weapon against us.

A very catchy piece of propaganda, though. Hits all the high notes of the past year's worth of progressive thought, and it has a beat and you can dance to it too.
posted by kindall at 7:24 PM on September 11, 2002

Get over the hippy dippy crap.

Humans have never 'all gotten along' since the first caveman hit the second caveman on the head for that piece of venison.

The only thing that's changed is that we've replaced the wooden sticks with nuclear warheads and fighter jets, and the venison with religion and national boundaries.

It's human nature, and it's never going to stop.
posted by xmutex at 7:46 PM on September 11, 2002

*bonk*

takes xmutex's venison

Oh yeah. I like peace and love too.

"Fire bad. Tree pretty."
-- Buffy
posted by billder at 7:55 PM on September 11, 2002

kindall>Up to us to turn ourselves into a nation of docile sheep ready to be ordered around by anyone who is clever enough to use our conscience as a weapon against us.

To characterize the collective conscience of humanity as nothing more than an epithet derides the very foundations of the free world: fairness, sharing, kindness, and decency to others despite their actions.

To do any less demeans the very value of human life and this is what truly waters the seeds of war; because its been proven over and over that regular people won't kill until they feel that the life they are taking is worth less than theirs.

If it were about ordering us around, bombing the US with airplanes was an act of utter stupidity. If you want to order the free world about you don't do it in such an overt fashion.

It was a clear stab at the unity that makes the free world the free world -- Osama virtually said so himself. To suggest he would rather order the free world about is simplification to the utmost. He knows (or should know) its always a lot more effective to have us strip ourselves of those freedoms than to remove them by force.

xmutex>It's human nature, and it's never going to stop.

It is genetically engrained in humans to be taken aback, and perhaps hate, any person particularly different from ourselves.

We've managed to keep this at bay as a group. Individually (I hope) none of us are killing others. Why is it so hard to extrapolate this into being a group decision that we need to stop war, rather than being an individual decision to not kill what we don't love?

To sum it up: People, I implore that you stop evaluating love with the value of a human life. That's all for today. Thanks. :-)
posted by shepd at 7:57 PM on September 11, 2002

I can't believe how many people buy into the self-fulfilling prophecy of "It's human nature, and it's never going to stop." Saying that is giving up. Evolution did not stop with us growing thumbs. We as humans need to start evolving our ideas and values for the better - we being the free-willed creatures we are, it's our role, after all.
posted by spungfoo at 8:09 PM on September 11, 2002

Maybe because it was the last comment in the thread, but when I read your comment, spungfoo, it was like Kyle on South Park telling me the moral of the episode...

with the nice music and calm, understanding voice...
sorry.
posted by BirdD0g at 8:37 PM on September 11, 2002

Do I hear Americans making fun of my Prime Minister for being "retarded"? Oh, how my gut merrily twists at the agony of such superb irony manifested in patriotic denial and political cheap shot. If you somehow managed to miss your own President fumbling his way through a basic sentence, I cordially invite you to consider one of his countless linguistic disasters.

The reason my Prime Minister may be a little hard to understand is because of a childhood case of polio that left him deaf in his right ear and with a slightly twisted mouth. But alas this is just the kind of trivial detail that gets lost when you raise a nation to be full of cocky bravado, if little else. It should be no wonder to you why most of the world, allies or enemies, bites their thumb at you when you're not looking.

Or perhaps I should completely ignore anything said by someone that refers to the possiblity of progressing beyond neolithic sensibilites as "hippy dippy crap".
posted by will at 8:42 PM on September 11, 2002

Without getting involved in the debate between Life-Is-a-Hobbesian-War-of-All-Against-All-and-It-Rocks! and We-Are-But-Children-Yearning-to-be-Enlightened, I want to talk about the video itself.

(Grumpiness ahead...)

It strikes me as a recognizable and not terribly original offshoot of the culture jamming/adbusters/negativeland practice of taking video clips from mainstream media, doing a little juxtaposition and soundtrack addition to make explicit what goes through the mind of the doubting thomases and thomasinas out in the cheap seats.

It's a good trick, insofar as it performs an efficient reversal on the commercial media's own strategies of blinding image overload, manipulative music, etc. But haven't we all seen this kind of thing before? It bugged me to sit through its longer-than-advertised duration and see...what? Kool tricks which connect Bush to the idiot-savant hillbilly banjo kid in Deliverance?

And in service of what point? What did it attempt to say that its intended audience doesn't already believe? What did it use its mixmastering to show us? That the media is playing the tune called by the government and conservatives? That Bush is embarrassingly unskilled with verbal operation of any kind? That TV and politicians together exploit war as the quick way to ratings? These aren't presented as challenges -- the whole thing is an in-joke for a certain kind of leftist, with a preachy bit at the end that doesn't add much substance.

I saw nothing there but preaching to the converted. And that comment isn't coming from the right, by the way; I was so hoping to see something that made me laugh with surprise, or made me notice something I hadn't seen before. I don't see it there.

Okay, somebody convince me that I'm all wet.
posted by BT at 9:01 PM on September 11, 2002

And in service of what point? What did it attempt to say that its intended audience doesn't already believe?

There's the problem. This type of message needs to reach the masses. Would you see this on a major TV network? Hell no. This trickling down of ideas isn't working all that well, there needs to be a major change to the status quo, and the status quo is doing all that it can to make sure it's not challenged. The breaking of the self-fulfilling prochecy I mentioned in my previous post needs to get its foot in the door, hopefully then things will snowball from there.
posted by spungfoo at 9:16 PM on September 11, 2002

Dammit.

Forgot to close my tags. *issues 40 lashes with wet noodle to self*
posted by spungfoo at 9:17 PM on September 11, 2002

I can't believe how many people buy into the self-fulfilling prophecy of "It's human nature, and it's never going to stop." Saying that is giving up.

Well, then, how do we change human nature? What's your solution? How do we make everyone get along? And how do we do it without becoming monsters ourselves? We can't just invade all their countries and convert them to Christianity, or something.

The last influential batch of people who thought they could change human nature called themselves Communists, and we all know how well that experiment turned out.

Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems obvious to me that there's no practical way to completely end violent conflict and still have humans left over. I mean, stunningly, blindingly obvious, so much that I can't believe anyone still thinks this is really possible.

shepd: I see you have quoted some things I said and put some text under your own under it, but I don't see how it your text any way responds to what I said. "To characterize the collective conscience of humanity as nothing more than an epithet derides the very foundations of the free world"? The words are English and I know what they mean individually, but not put together like that... the phrase "collective conscience of humanity" seems particularly content-free to me. You seem to be accusing me of something, but I can't quite figure out what it is. Can you elucidate further?
posted by kindall at 11:01 PM on September 11, 2002

Up to us to turn ourselves into a nation of docile sheep ready to be ordered around by anyone who is clever enough to use our conscience as a weapon against us.

Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems obvious to me that there's no practical way to completely end violent conflict and still have humans left over. I mean, stunningly, blindingly obvious, so much that I can't believe anyone still thinks this is really possible.

No doubt Bin Laden and followers would agree wholeheartedly with your sentiments...your reasoning. No doubt it was all "obvious" to them, as it is to you. No doubt they seethed with a measure of hatred and fear sufficient for violence to become acceptable. Touched by violence, and teaching the doctrine of violence eternal, they rationalized their own terrible touch.

No doubt they "missed something" too.
posted by fold_and_mutilate at 12:40 AM on September 12, 2002

So, as near as I can tell, this video makes two main points:

• We shouldn't prejudge our supposed enemies on the basis of their cultural or ethnic backgrounds, and
• President Bush is from the South and is therefore ignorant and stupid.

.... Why does this not strike me as a well-thought-out argument?
posted by webmutant at 12:49 AM on September 12, 2002

As a Canadian, I can confirm that our Prime Minister is, in fact, retarded.
posted by islander at 12:57 AM on September 12, 2002

Brilliant. Especially being an European and not getting a lot of US television here, it's really an eye-opening look into the whole 11/9 thing.
posted by rosmo at 1:06 AM on September 12, 2002

At the risk of sounding snooty, I'm surprised that nobody has pointed out that this is almost the exact same thing as EBN's video for "Electronic Behavior Control System," which came out in 1995.

"Made as a video for the title song on EBN's 1995 Telecommunication Breakdown album (TVT), the short film Electronic Behaviour Control System consists mostly of video clips that the group sampled from broadcast and cable television. Cutting quickly from excited infomercial cast members to network news talking heads, EBN artfully uses a disturbing barrage of disconnected images to make a powerful point about the dulling effects of media overload. 'Television has really evolved into this electronic behavior control system,' says Deocampo, 'and that's what this piece is about.'"

More here.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed this take on it a whole lot, but anybody who thinks that this is a revolutionary approach to making a music video is about 7 years wrong.
posted by textureslut at 2:33 AM on September 12, 2002

What's with the praise? That was godawful annoying. Somebody owes me the last 10 minutes back.
posted by GhostintheMachine at 4:10 AM on September 12, 2002

In Italy for 30 years under the Borgias they had warfare, terror, murder, and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci, and the Renaissance. In Switzerland they had brotherly love - they had 500 years of democracy and peace, and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock - Harry Lime (Played by the Great Orson Welles)

Just like the Lions will never "EVERRRR" win a Super Bowl... There will always be WAR. The Weapons & Tactics might change but never do's Human Nature.

Poland, 1938... They gave Peace a chance ;)
posted by Dreamghost at 5:03 AM on September 12, 2002

"I believe I have seen this before. I'm not sure." - Dark Messiah

Probably over here. It seems a safe bet given this comment.
posted by urban greeting at 5:12 AM on September 12, 2002

I wasn't crazy about the link. It's seems to oversimplify like crazy, which just gives me a headache. Does the Progress of Civilization (by which I mean political/economic/social/scientific progress) cause casualties? Yes. Are some of these casualties innocent? Yes. Are some of the casualties people who oppose progress, and will use any means necessary to put down the other guy and take his stuff? Yes.

We are never going to have a world without police. That is what freedom is all about. Freedom to go to a ball game, freedom to start a fight at the ball game. Nothing you can do about it. As long as there are people who are willing to impose violently on others, the State will have to impose violently on them to protect everyone else.

I turn now to that remarkable man, Jesus of Nazareth, for guidance. He said something like "love your neigbhor as yourself". Everyone remembers it, no one does it.

He also said, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one." (LK22:36)

People forget that part.
posted by ewkpates at 5:18 AM on September 12, 2002

GNN actually host a bunch of EBN videos on their site, here.
posted by ToothpickVic at 5:20 AM on September 12, 2002

Thanks for pointing that out, ToothpickVic. I'm glad to see that GNN acknowledges them.
posted by textureslut at 5:40 AM on September 12, 2002

Will: "Do I hear Americans making fun of my Prime Minister for being 'retarded'? "

Hasty generalization, Will. No, it was just one and he was from Seattle. That city hasn't been in America since they let the Pilots slip away. I think we traded it for a couple of hockey teams.
posted by ?! at 5:45 AM on September 12, 2002

Folks, I give you Metafilter's new tag line: No hippy, dippy crap!
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:05 AM on September 12, 2002

My apologies on the time estimate - it is actually slightly over TEN minutes. Oops! I'm enjoying the threads and wanted to note that the GNN guys used to work for MTV according to their site. That explains a lot about their style. But, really, doesn't most of the world (besides the geniuses here at MeFi) only have a five-second attention span?
posted by sparky at 8:26 AM on September 12, 2002

Will: that was beautiful.
posted by mapalm at 9:04 AM on September 12, 2002

No doubt Bin Laden and followers would agree wholeheartedly with your sentiments...your reasoning.

I haven't consulted them. Thanks for taking the time to hypothetically run it by them, though. I'm glad to see you're so intimately familiar with their thought processes.

So: what is your solution, exactly? How do you suggest we force all people everywhere to behave nicely without using, er, force? Come now, let's have the fold_and_mutilate point-by-point plan for world peace. No fair keeping it to yourself.

Are those crickets I hear?
posted by kindall at 9:05 AM on September 12, 2002

I thought the point of the video was that this is a religious war. It's the crusades versus the conquest. And that as long as the West acts as a crusader, the mid-East will fight back.

It strikes me that there are few cross-border wars at this time in our history. Most nations have established their borders and stay within them. Most nations... except the USA and China.

Most of the warfaring is national, not international. And in most cases, other nations are keeping their noses out of internal wars. No one stormed into Britain to "solve" the wars in Ireland. Pakistan and India are always at each other's throats, with high probability of using nukes, yet because our (Western) militaries haven't been invited in, we aren't taking control of the situation.

But there are exceptions.

And it appears to me that, except for China's actions toward Tibet (and possibly Taiwan), the one nation that keeps warring against and invading other countries is the USA.

A lot of the US's problems would be solved if it'd just keep to its borders.
posted by five fresh fish at 9:28 AM on September 12, 2002

What's with the praise? That was godawful annoying. Somebody owes me the last 10 minutes back.

I'm inclined to agree. Chop up unrelated statements and rearrange them to say what you want, no matter how badly you distort the messages being given - since when is that good political discourse? The whole thing struck me as being directed at people with five second attention spans and sub-fifth grade educations. My attention only lasted throught the whole thing to see how low they could go and they did not disappoint. Pathetic.
posted by RevGreg at 3:37 PM on September 12, 2002

?!: I didn't mean to give the impression that I was generalizing about all Americans, just pointing out that the offenders were from that country. Next time I'll use excruciatingly accurate language.

mapalm: Why thank you, I believe that's a first for me here.
posted by will at 5:54 PM on September 12, 2002

Will: No need to be "excruciatingly accurate." Just accurate.

In this case, rather than generalize to "Americans" you could have said "xmutex." After all, at the point you made your very well written comment you were responding to (1) the original poster with an address in Seattle (2) a person with an address in Utah who said "no, he's just Canadian" and (3) a self-professed Canadian who "resembled that remark".

When I posted I agreed with a lot of your comment and none of the comment of xmutex. I directed my comment to you partially because I have found many Internet forums such as this suffer from a plethora of hasty generalizations. Especially since it so simple to address your response to the source. I guess I also wanted to make sure you realized that "Americans" hadn't been insensitive regarding the PM -- just "An American."
posted by ?! at 6:25 PM on September 12, 2002

?!: I hear ya. No harm done, friend.
posted by will at 8:11 AM on September 13, 2002