What do I do????
November 20, 2002 12:00 AM   Subscribe

what I told my father my daughter tells me I have discovered my 14 year old daughter listens to Green Day, smokes cannabbis at the weekend, misses school, avoids homework. What's a father to do? serious advice please!
posted by terrymiles (70 comments total)

This post was deleted for the following reason:



 
Most of those are serious concerns, sure, but Green Day..?
posted by jimmy at 12:01 AM on November 20, 2002


Am I missing something or is this... unnecessary?

like, what?
posted by The God Complex at 12:04 AM on November 20, 2002


Sure it's unnecessary. But what's the liberal establishment to do when it's kids do what they did and look like screwing up too. I do need advice here but I also wondered how you guys would deal with it!
posted by terrymiles at 12:10 AM on November 20, 2002


I don't know. Talk to their kids? Chalk it up to adolescent experimentation/rebellion? Applaud their kids' questioning of the educational establishment?

Beat them with a length of hose?

Use a lot of exclamation marks?!

Sorry, but I really don't think this is the place for this. It's not meant to be a discussion groups, but you can probably find a number of wonderful ones if you take a few minutes to google around (or maybe someone here can help you out before this thread gets axed?).
posted by The God Complex at 12:14 AM on November 20, 2002


Get her to listen to better music.
posted by monosyllabic at 12:25 AM on November 20, 2002


umm, get high with her? worked with my daughter -- but she was 19 at the time.
posted by DBAPaul at 12:28 AM on November 20, 2002


I've got no idea how much of this has been said before on MeFi (and I'm due at work in 10 minutes) but I'll stick in my tuppeneth...

Green Day - I'd argue she has bad taste, but that's her choice.

Cannabis - I have never taken it, but I assume you mean as a joint or two? In England it is generally considered to be less dangerous than cigarettes or booze. Considering she's 14 i'd say it was probably the lesser of the evils.

Missing school and homework? I think you should ask where there's a kid who hasn't. Unless you tell us that she's not been to school for a month...

Personally I'd tell my kid that I don't want the drug in my house, I don't want to have her smoking it in a public environment. And I'd try to make sure that she sticks to what she knows.

But maybe I'm odd...
posted by twine42 at 12:32 AM on November 20, 2002


I seriously wouldn't worry about it too much. I know that doesn't sound very helpful, but if you worry too much about your daughter's behaviour (which seems pretty normal to me) you will either end up putting too much pressure on her, or giving up and showing too little concern. Both are equally bad.

Green Day? There's nothing wrong with Green Day.
posted by chrid at 12:36 AM on November 20, 2002


I suggest that you sit her down and explain to her the dangers of posting meritless links to MetaFilter solely as a means by which to initiate conversation. Make it clear that you love her and are concerned by this behavior and, while many members her age may experiment by using MetaFilter as a discussion board, there are very real consequences to her actions. Most importantly, reassure her that she can ask you any questions about providing links solely to overcome the hardcoded requirements, and that she can do so without fear of having her account suspended.

Be open with her, and I'm sure she'll appreciate the honesty and imminent deletion of this post.
posted by Danelope at 12:51 AM on November 20, 2002


Have her read more. Like maybe Nabokov or Rand or something..or maybe 19th century French poetry, seriously. Why not?
posted by Kodel at 12:53 AM on November 20, 2002


Drugs at 14?

oh dear.

Using MetaFilter to sort out your family problems?

oh dear.


GO HERE
posted by Frasermoo at 1:00 AM on November 20, 2002


Cut the man some slack. How many people posturing and making jokes here even have daughters, or children of any sort? Those who don't can grow up or shut up. This may not be the right or the best place to discuss problems of this sort. But if people are free to write in to newspaper agony aunts, or even Salon's column, why not here?

I don't know what the answer is. I'd worry more about the drugs than anything else, because I think it is stupid to do them when your brain is still growing (and, yes, I did as much acid as I could find between the ages of sixteen and nineteen, which was not as much as I'd have liked to do; and I still occasionally smoke dope). Sixteen was too young. Fourteen is way too young. And the general pattern of skipping school, not giving a fuck, etc, is stupid and self-destructive, especially if it grows into a habitual way of looking at yourself as a fucked-up outsider. But it may have something to do with the school, and the pretence (widespread in England at least) that almost every teenager is better off studying than working. Worthwhile study is meaningful work, and anyone for whom it isn't should be trying to find meaningful work elsewhere.

There is a wonderful exchange between Martin Amis, then a useless dope-smoking teenager, and his stepmother, Elizabeth Jane Howard, about "reading more books". It's in his autobiography, and in the recent Guardian profile. He turned out all right, but you relly can't bet on it. His brother and sister didn't.

The danger is what makes this stuff attractive, especially to middle-class kids, who can feel that slumming is much less dangerous than living up to expectations. That's not much of a consolation to a parent, for whom danger looks different and more frightening.
posted by alloneword at 1:15 AM on November 20, 2002


DBAPaul - exactly. i would be far less screwed up if my father had done such a thing with me. I have talked with people who smoke dope and have kids, and whilst their kids do not smoke yet, they (the children) do understand that cannabis is not something bad (as most would have you believe). i would rather my children smoke cannabis than tobacco as in terms of lung cancer and general ill health.. its far less of a danger.
having said that 14 is young and the affects of smoke on a growing body can be multiplied compared to say 18/19.
posted by carfilhiot at 1:32 AM on November 20, 2002


alloneword:
'But if people are free to write in to newspaper agony aunts, or even Salon's column, why not here?'

because this isn't a newspaper agony aunt, or a Salon's column.

carfilhiot, the funny thing was I stopped smoking pot when I got married and aquired a nine year old step-daughter and hadn't smoked for ten years.
posted by DBAPaul at 1:36 AM on November 20, 2002


Get her into Minor Threat, Stiff Little Fingers and the Buzzcocks inna quickstyle. Tell her Green Day learned everything they know from adding all the above and dividing by three.
That will take care of the pot.

Let her skip school. Buy her an iBook and a DSL connection. Devise a curriculum for her, using Internet sources, that you can discuss together - history, the sciences, civics, math, language and logic.
That will improve her chances of becoming an articulate, motivated citizen.

As for the rest? Let it slide. We do tend to turn out OK.
posted by adamgreenfield at 1:43 AM on November 20, 2002


www.advicefilter.com
posted by iamck at 1:49 AM on November 20, 2002


Ignore the truly fucked up people who are so up their own arse that they won't let a single thread slide by without checking it for whatever they think should be on the site they own and run. (they do own and run it, right?).

Anyway, chill out, it really is no big deal. Speak to your daughter, ask her how she feels. Ask her if she knows the dangers, even if you might not.

Basically, quit with the judging, and make sure you don't get your drug facts from anything connected to The Government. Chances are, she knows more about this than you do or if she doesn't then tell her what you know. Oh and get high with her too.



A liccle story.

I nearly died last year. As I was being rushed into surgery they asked the standard "Do you smoke/take drugs/blow goats" etc etc. My father heard my answers and freaked out. It was only when I pointed out to him that I was in searing agony and being rushed into life-saving surgery that he realised how far out of whack his priorities were. Be careful, as a parent you have such an immense desire to protect your daughter that sometimes, you may forget she's your daughter.

Good luck and don't worry. BE HONEST. 14 year old girls can smell bullshit from 100 miles away. It's not the drugs you need to worry about, its the fact that 14 year old girls have a tendency to think 17 year old boys are cool. Now that's the shit you need to be stopping :)
posted by fullerine at 1:49 AM on November 20, 2002


Getting high with her is a ridiculous idea. She's fourteen, which in the United States puts her in the eighth grade. As much as I support intelligent discussion about drugs, the brain is not yet finished developing at that age. Also, the change in maturity between fourteen and eighteen/nineteen is staggering. I doubt very much that your daughter will interperet your getting stoned with her in the way you want her to.
posted by Yelling At Nothing at 1:53 AM on November 20, 2002


Fullerine, that's exactly the attitude that caused so much crap on MeTa over the last couple weeks. Like it or not, some (many) things are not appropriate for Metafilter. This is one of them. Matt (who does own and run the site) is the one who set forth the guidelines, and we owe it to him to follow them.
posted by Yelling At Nothing at 1:56 AM on November 20, 2002


The links in the post are one & the same and neither one works for me...

Tell your daughter you're worried about her, if you haven't already.
posted by misteraitch at 2:04 AM on November 20, 2002


For the record, I also feel this shouldn't have been posted. But, since that will take care of itself soon enough if it needs to be, I'll comment:

The biggest danger to teenagers is disengagement. There needs to be something, anything that they can be emotionally committed to and base a positive self-esteem on. For many high schoolers, this is music (it was for me) or theater or writing or athletics, etc. I like Kodel's suggestion of literature, but reading and enjoying literature is a personal experience, probably not an effective stepping stone for a teenager who seems to enjoy social distractions.

She needs something to ground herself on, to define herself by; for most teenagers (including, possibly, this one), I'd wager, that's peer acceptance, which is certainly a lot healthier than sexual attractiveness or physical intimidation. But something she can take pride in and accomplish independantly would be more what I assume the poster is looking for.

Get her on the soccer team. Get her in the marching band. Get her in Habitat for Humanity. And get her some kind of positive reinforcement for any committment or dedication she gives to whatever she gets involved in.

I also don't think the skipping school/DSL idea would accomplish much sadly. And mood altering chemicals are never good, even the harmless ones.
posted by gsteff at 2:05 AM on November 20, 2002


The reason terrymiles' post has a good chance of being deleted as soon as Matt notices, is described here. This FAQ has Matt's approval.
If you find the advice posted here useful, copy/paste it soon because it might disappear anytime now.
posted by talos at 2:10 AM on November 20, 2002


Anyway, chill out, it really is no big deal.

Yeah, after all she is just a child experimenting with drugs. I mean if you think about, by the time she leaves college/university, that's about 8 years of drug use she'll have under her belt.

Fullerine - your 'liccle' cutesy pieces of advice show me exactly why this thread shouldn't be here.
posted by Frasermoo at 2:16 AM on November 20, 2002


You need to church that girl up right.

This includes a regimen of daily or multi-daily bible devotionals. This includes perhaps the christian tough-love approach of locking her down in her (hopefully) emptied bedroom, consisting of nothing but her bed, a lamp and a bible. This also consists of berating her endlessly for doing nothing with her life and that she's gonna end up just like cousin Ruth. Fucking moronic kids.

No really though. She'll grow up one way or the other. All you can do is be there for her. Love her unconditionally and throw caution to the wind. She sure as hell will, with or without your consent. It's not worth having her hate you. If you raised her right, she'll be fine.
posted by crasspastor at 2:17 AM on November 20, 2002


And that's "likkle," dammit!

Just kidding.

Yeah, this shouldn't have been posted here. But it was, in good faith. mathowie will probably zotz it, yes, but that doesn't prevent us from weighing in with our own good-faith advice in the interim.

Like we don't have enough Angst already. (Pronounce that with a pseudo-Freudian accent for full effect.)

Take care of yourselves.
posted by adamgreenfield at 2:20 AM on November 20, 2002


For what it's worth, here are my thoughts...

Ignore the music, my parents hated mine too.

Have a discussion about the drugs that includes responsibility and risk/reward. You might want to educate her on our draconian drug laws and what a few convictions of even posession can do to her chances in life.

I tell my son & stepchildren that they have jobs, and right now those jobs are their education. Perhaps you could approach it like an employer does - if drinking (a more common example) negatively impacted my work performance it becomes an issue. If said drinking is under control it is not their concern.

Nearly all kids experiment, if that is all this is - don't lose a lot of sleep over it. Showing concern over her choices might be all that is needed at this point.

[sarcasm] Getting high with her is a wonderful idea if your goal is to risk losing custody of your children. [/sarcasm]
posted by revbrian at 2:36 AM on November 20, 2002


Get her into Minor Threat, Stiff Little Fingers and the Buzzcocks inna quickstyle. Tell her Green Day learned everything they know from adding all the above and dividing by three.
That will take care of the pot.


Yeah, but getting her to move on to meth isn't exactly a positive step ;-P

On a more serious note, here is my take:

On the music, who cares what she's listening to? She could listen to things which are a lot worse than Green Day. Well, on a "moral" level - on a musical level she is pretty far down there!

On the drugs. If it's moderate and only weekends, I wouldn't hassle her a whole lot about it. Make sure she is well educated on the dangers of other drugs and I'd especially make sure that she is enguaging in safe sex. You didn't mention it but I'd bet huge bank that your little angel is somebody else's little devil - this is also inevitable but you want to make every attempt to keep her healthy and childless!

On the homework/school issue. I have a serious problem with this issue. She needs to learn that having fun is great but that other responsibilities must be met first. You didn't allude to the degree to which she is "avoiding homework" and "missing school" so the seriousness of this issue is hard to guage.
posted by RevGreg at 3:20 AM on November 20, 2002


Dont worry about the music, she could be rocking Ramenstein or So Solid Crew.

As for the the weed, you said she smokes at the weekend, which shows she has some sort of control over it. speak to her about your feeling on it, and the possible implications of its use. but dont preach as she will then do stuff just to spite you.

As for missing school and not doing homework, that needs to be sorted out asap. just talk to her, find out why shes doing it and try and help her see how important it is to get a decent education.

there's my 2cents.
good luck, hope everything works out.
posted by bhell13 at 3:26 AM on November 20, 2002


Maybe you should hook her up with some smack, so she can get her first taste of heroin. She may vomit, but you both will become so totally cool and close. If you get her hooked, there are a lot of possibilities for you to make extra cash. Maybe trip with her on LSD? Turn her into an invalid with crack? Or get her really wacked out on cocaine and PCP so she thinks she can fly off a high-rise!!!

Or you could just treat her like a fourteen year-old daughter and punish the hell out of her, and if she does it again, call the cops.
posted by hama7 at 3:41 AM on November 20, 2002


Frasermoo - i don't understand. why does a pretty funny anecdote that certainly adds plenty to the subject under discussion show you why this thread shouldnt be here?

oh you're being hiply spiteful? - no no no thats *my* role here.
posted by carfilhiot at 3:48 AM on November 20, 2002


hama7 - erm i see your point, but you seem completely ignorant as far as drugs go. you're talking about highly addictive substances, we're not. thats probably why _you_ would punish your daughter (shame for her) - but responsible adults who know better needn't get so nasty.
posted by carfilhiot at 3:56 AM on November 20, 2002


Introduce her to Rand? WTF kind of advice is that? Why not introduce her to Scientology as well while you're at it?

Honestly, people, if you're going to introduce your children to something that deems itself philosophy perhaps you should start with something that actually has an ontology?

As for the cannabis, simple discussion: "Honey, a little pot isn't that bad, but prolonged use has been proven to make a retard out of you. I'm not thrilled, but I can't stop you, so here's the deal - I won't punish you for it if you don't do it in the home where I can get arrested for it. Deal?"

As for Greenday . . . there's no point in trying to stop that. The overwhelming majority of high school aged females I have encountered in my life had even WORSE taste in music than I did at that age, which is saying something. She'll realize it's shit when she's ready, and absolutely nothing you can say will turn her on or off to anything.

You might try introducing her to Godspeed You Black Emperor by means of actual 'check this out right now' . . . I've never seen anybody walk away from a whole song the first time saying "that was a load of crap."
posted by Ryvar at 4:10 AM on November 20, 2002


everyone knows cannabis is one of those Gateway drugs, I predict oxycontin before she's 16
posted by DBAPaul at 4:11 AM on November 20, 2002


Terry, you could consult with one or more trained specialists who have made some sort of evaluation of your daughter's maturity level and have at least attempted to identify what issues she is dealing with.

Or you could solicit advice from random people off the street, which is basically what is happening here.
posted by taz at 4:16 AM on November 20, 2002


Drop a hit of acid in her orange juice and then blame it on the pot she's been smoking.
posted by a3matrix at 4:23 AM on November 20, 2002


I generally agree with gsteff. But, to even begin to help, I think you need to show good understanding on your part of what she is presently going through that made her behave the way you complained of. Often, problems do not appear overnight. If there hasn't been sufficient communication with your teenaged daughter, you and your spouse got to make the efforts to discuss issues with her and do things together with her as a way of better understanding her and in the process, guiding and supporting her through to a positive girlhood / womanhood. There is no one cure-all approach, but the earlier you and your spouse work hard and sensibly on the issues that both of you see are responsible for the rebelliousness in your daughter, and encouraging & sharing with her alternative stimulation in sports , music, outings etc., you'll have better chances of improving the situation as you wish for. If all your soft approaches do not work, well, hama7's suggestion of treating her
like a fourteen year-old daughter and punish the hell out of her....
will have to be it.
posted by taratan at 4:28 AM on November 20, 2002


Ryvar's advice is truly wrong. It might be right for some legal reasons (and if your daughter has this other child as her role model), but it's pushing her out of the house for her intimate moments (and she won't listen to you anyway). Instead, my dad did a very smart thing - when I mentioned to him that my friends were doing drugs and I wanted to do too, he said "I don't think it's a good idea at all, for xyz reasons, but if you ever seriously want to do it, let me know and I will buy it for you so you don't get some low-quality stuff that may kill you". That took the entire point out of it, how cool is it when it's parents-authorized and sponsored? Almost as boring as a chess club. I've never done drugs as a result but if I ever would I know it would be accepted with no qualms. The rest of your complaints are trully not something to worry about and you know that.
posted by bokononito at 4:31 AM on November 20, 2002


<aqualung>
wot school was that, mate?
</aqualung>
posted by quonsar at 4:33 AM on November 20, 2002


I'll say it, because I think it needs to be said. (And please refrain from arguments that I have no business telling anyone else how the site should be used -- because everyone, by using the site, is saying something about how the site should be used.)

Fundamentally, there is no link here. MetaFilter is about posting links and commenting on those links. Because the link is a generic one, to the Green Day home page, that is meant as a stepping-off point for a discussion the poster wants to have, this is a bad post. It's a bad post because it's meant to generate a discussion for the benefit of the poster, rather than a post that's meant to be interesting for the readers.

The fact that this is a bad post needs to be emphasized for a few reasons. First of all, Matt is probably asleep at the moment. If he was awake and watching the site when this was posted, it would have been deleted long before a significant number of comments had been made. The fact that it's still here is not an indication that this ought to be at MetaFilter, merely that Matt hasn't caught it yet. No one should get the idea that posts like this are a good idea.

Second, the number of people who are jumping in and offering advice suggests that they don't "get" MetaFilter -- that they think that this is a discussion board like any other. MetaFilter wasn't designed to be a discussion board, folks, though some of you will probably bristle at being told that. It's links plus commentary, with commentary focusing on the links. Matt has left things pretty open-ended, in the hope that we'll follow the guidelines he set out, but it doesn't mean we ought to post anything we want.

Third, we're basically nice people, and when a post like this is made, many of us will try to be helpful despite the fact that this runs counter to the spirit of the place. I'll just reiterate the comments above that in spite of our best impulses, this can't become AdviceFilter. Our kindness in individual cases may encourage other posts like this, and we'll end up spending most of our time helping members out rather than making neat discoveries on the web and talking about them.

If there is anything I want to argue most forcefully, it's that MetaFilter is not about us, it's about what we find out there. Let's keep ourselves in the background as much as possible.

At least, that's what I think.
posted by mcwetboy at 4:42 AM on November 20, 2002


This thread is an annex to Metatalk. That said, there's no bright line test for whether a post is appropriate or not for Metafilter. This one is sufficiently "different" that I would say it works--as long as it's understood to be en exception. Five more advice posts, no, TWO more, and both of those are inappropriate.



The post: it's too late by age 14 to teach your kid that this kind of activity is not good. You should have been "teaching" non-conformism (and believe me, this IS conformism) five years ago. So ride it out. And hope it doesn't last.
posted by ParisParamus at 4:51 AM on November 20, 2002


I can't belive anyone would raise their child on the basis of advice of a bunch of (semi-)anonymous blog-posters.

What would Mary Worth say?

The obvious problems with this post notwithstanding - drug use? music taste? This thread would have all the makings of a full scale flame war if not for

A) The fact that Matt is surely about to delete this threat at any moment

and

B) The fact that the Mefi massive are being very polite to one another just now, since they fear the site may be shut down any day...
posted by backOfYourMind at 5:13 AM on November 20, 2002


As a father myself, I would say you have a normal kid. What's your problem?
posted by mischief at 5:18 AM on November 20, 2002


Ryvar: Introduce her to Rand? WTF kind of advice is that?

Uh, that'd be ironic bad advice there, cowboy. Nabokov, heh.
posted by cortex at 5:29 AM on November 20, 2002


MetaFilter is not about us, it's about what we find out there.

The sentence of the year.
posted by iconomy at 5:29 AM on November 20, 2002


Terry, you should be getting advice from a professional, not here. While many Mefites may have lots of good ideas, this simply isn't the place to do it, for all kinds of reasons reasons but primarily because you can't access the hundreds of services that exist in every city/town (much less London England) that address this issue.
posted by ashbury at 5:33 AM on November 20, 2002


This actually could have been a good post. With a little research and links to various resources. Perhaps someone with a little more time on their hands could put together a rewrite of how much better it could be instead of slamming how bad it is?
posted by revbrian at 5:38 AM on November 20, 2002


You want some advice?

Learn to use the internet.

Here's a starter...go to www.google.com, type 'parenting' & 'advice' into the search box & hit the Enter key. Ker-ching! Hey, look! I've done it for you!

Or maybe try the Google Directory & click thru to Home - Family - Parenting. So much choice!

And so on...

mcwetboy summed it up perfectly.

The problem with advice is, it contradicts the whole point of MeFi. You're not finding good stuff on the 'net, you're asking others to do it for you. And then everyone else starts asking for advice cuz you did and MeFi isn't MeFi anymore.

PP: Well I'd like advice on finding programmers to help on a shareware music project to port from Win C++ to OSX, sorting out my holiday to Japan next year, mountain biking in NW Scotland & wheat-free diets. Times that by lots of other MeFites that would like other bits of advice and there's a lot of chatter going on. I think its easier to say 'AdviceFilter bad'.
posted by i_cola at 5:52 AM on November 20, 2002




Dear Dad,

I listen to Green Day cause you never taught me what good music sounds like with all your stupid Pink Floyd and shit. I smoke pot cause I couldn't water down your vodka any more. Missing school? How would you know? When was the last time you spent 10 minutes helping me with homework that I avoid cause it's some damn useless!

You should be worried more about the weird ideas I get here. These people are truly wack! They're like my family now. I spend all day here and they say my name all the time and stuff.

Dad. Want advice? Sit down and talk. Stop waiting until you discover shit or the next time you post will be the "I discovered this weekend my daughter has a web cam and is telling stupid men she's 19."

Not that I'd do that, of course, mom brought me up with some sense and shit.

Your darling daughter,

fuckwit
posted by fuckwit at 6:21 AM on November 20, 2002


Bad post. Worse advice. Reading this thread, I understand better how the country has gotten into the position it's in.
posted by rushmc at 6:33 AM on November 20, 2002


Wow, this is the biggest collection of burn-outs I've ever seen congregating since I had the misfortune of stumbling on a teen-age chatroom.

If it's moderate and only weekends...
Are you serious?

I won't punish you for it if you don't do it in the home where I can get arrested for it...
What??

Nearly all kids experiment...don't lose a lot of sleep over it...

Unbelievable and sad.
posted by eas98 at 6:38 AM on November 20, 2002


The best way for a parent to turn a "rebellious teenager" off something is to say how cool they think it is. Start talking to her about how great Greenday is, take her to shows, etc. pretty soon, she'll find some other noise to listen to. As for the weed, I'd say just stay involved with her, if I'd had some more time spent with my dad at 14 I'd have smoked a hell of a lot less pot back then and I might have been a little better educated. Try to figure out why it is she feels like she needs to rebel in the first place, could it be because dad asks for advice from internet strangers rather than from his own daughter (not downing you man, just ask HER before you ask me)? She's pretty normal though, I wouldn't be terribly freaked out. I would advise though, coming down too hard on her will just drive her in another direction. Think of her young mind as clay, give it light touches and you can mould it into something beautiful, squeeze it too hard and its going to squirt the other direction. Good luck.

Now that I've said all that, please save your posts for material that this site is designed for, that would be my only other bit of advice. Matt's will be done.
posted by Pollomacho at 6:50 AM on November 20, 2002


As a teenager who doesn't smoke, and occasionally listens to Greenday, I'd say this doesn't belong on MeFi. But then so have lots of others, so I'll say something else:

By age fourteen, its too late. She'll make up her own mind about what to do. If you taught her smoking and missing school is bad, then she'll stop eventually. If you didn't, then she might not. Basically, whatever you say will most likely not have an effect. Hope your parenting was good...
posted by Orange Goblin at 6:55 AM on November 20, 2002


(A) What everyone else said about the inappropriateness of this post.

(B) My kids will never be allowed to play with y'all's fcsk-ed up kids. I'm all for liberal attitudes towards music and drugs, but SHE'S FOURTEEN. There was this wonderful concept developed in the 50's and 60's called childhood. Shame it's falling by the wayside.
posted by mkultra at 7:04 AM on November 20, 2002


I know very well now that Metafilter is not for this but I seriously wondered if you had any intelligent ideas or links to offer. Thanks for all your contributions. I've printed it all out. Feel free to delete the thread, if you must.

54 comments isn't bad for something that apparently shouldn't have been here in the first place....
posted by terrymiles at 7:14 AM on November 20, 2002


Green Day? Buy her a guitar for Christmas.

Pot? Tell her not to do it with people she doesn't like. And tell her the effect is better if you just have a few puffs. Kids don't know this and end up smoking three joints and freaking out.

School at 14 sucks. Tell her it gets better in two years and to stick it out. I don't think a lack of effort at 14 is such a problem. But she has to realize how important passing the finals tests is. Don't let the system beat her; let her know if she fights she can beat the system.

Good luck.
posted by dydecker at 7:21 AM on November 20, 2002


One: If your daughter is smoking the reefer at 14, she's sure as hell going to be doing a lot more that you don't approve of before she's 18.

Two: Pot itself is no worse than getting drunk. That said, I wouldn't want a 14-year-old kid of mine getting drunk. Pot may be relatively non-addictive, but it still removes a lot of your decision-making capacity. When you're 14, you're decisions are bad enough already. When you're 30, your decisions are still pretty bad.

Three: A very significant number of pot smokers will do another drug and get addicted to it. It may not be because of the pot, but a variety of reasons, from simply knowing dealers to hanging in a drug-using crowd to "wanting to try a new experience", do cause the same effect.

So tell her there really are consequences. She may rebel, probably in fact. If you give in and accept the pot use, you lose your control over your daughter's upbringing. She is not a friend who is smoking - she is a 14-year old and it's the parents' responsibility to serve as a guide.

As for the Greenday, I think there's no hope. Even So Solid would be a step up :-)
posted by Kevs at 7:24 AM on November 20, 2002


54 comments isn't bad for something that apparently shouldn't have been here in the first place....

tell us she is obese and addicted to flying, then stand back.

hoo boy.
posted by Frasermoo at 7:28 AM on November 20, 2002


Actually, childhood's always been around. The 50's saw th birth of the teenager (which she is!), and the 90's saw the start of the end of the child.

My 2c: What Crasspastor said.
posted by armoured-ant at 7:29 AM on November 20, 2002


tell us she is obese and addicted to flying, then stand back.

tell us she is an obese Palestinian atheist and addicted to flying El Al airlines and she hates SUV's, then stand back
posted by matteo at 7:33 AM on November 20, 2002


I'm going to take her out for a pizza this evening. Just the two of us. And maybe the printout of this thread. I might even tell you what happens if the thread is still here tomorrow. Once again. Thankyou very much.
posted by terrymiles at 7:35 AM on November 20, 2002


I'll add my own dribble to this shit hole.

Kids experiment. They experiment with dangerous situations of all kinds. Most of them turn out OK. In fact, kids are better at foolling around with drugs than adults are, if we would only look at the data. So all you "punish the shit out of her" moralists out there, I hope you realize just how much that would alienate her.

I also get the impression from the post that the father has not spent a whole lot of time talking to his daughter about anything important. How long has she been smoking pot?

I also hope everyone here realizes that this person's daughter is also a person: someone who is already making decisions about their life. Someone who deserves a little respect. Treat her like a small child and you will lose her. I'm sorry if you don't like the idea of her making up her own mind, but tough shit. Go ahead, be authoritarian. See how far it gets you.
posted by botono9 at 7:42 AM on November 20, 2002


54 comments isn't bad for something that apparently shouldn't have been here in the first place

Oh, well that makes all the difference then. My weblog posts or family photographs don't belong here. But if I post them and people comment, that means they get to stay, right? What you have to understand is: some people don't know better, and some people desperately want to make sure they learn. I wish you luck with your daughter, but yours is a bad post.

I might even tell you what happens if the thread is still here tomorrow

If the thread isn't here tomorrow, please do not post another one.
posted by UnReality at 7:44 AM on November 20, 2002


And maybe the printout of this thread.

Ixna on the readtha. Just go hang out. Find out who her friends are. What does she do? Buy her a Beatles cd. Hang out somewhere at least once a week. Start having breakfast somewhere every Friday morning. This is really none of my business.
posted by four panels at 7:56 AM on November 20, 2002


Bad post. Worse advice. Reading this thread, I understand better how the country has gotten into the position it's in.

Nothing annoys me more than people who claim to be able to infer the decline of civilization from a bunch of comments on the Internet. Besides, which country are you talking about? The country you live in isn't the same as the country the original poster is posting from.

54 comments isn't bad for something that apparently shouldn't have been here in the first place....

Even if a third of the comments are about how misguided the thread is in the first place?

Do you spend much time with your daughter? I'm divorced, and I have a thirteen year old daughter who spends about half her time with me. We hang out together. If I'm doing something by myself, she asks me to come join her in front of the TV. She calls me at work to ask me for help with her algebra. Her mother (whom I dislike rather intensely) and I talk regularly about what's going on with her schoolwork and the rest of her life. I know who all her teachers are and how much she likes or dislikes each of them.

I say all this not to show what a great father I am (though I am, of course), but because the only way to avoid these and worse problems is to be involved in your child's life. Getting your kid on a sports team won't help if she doesn't like sports. Telling her to read something is just a proxy for lecturing her. Not worrying about it because all kids do that is not an option. Spend time with her. Note that this will only work if you actually like her. If you don't like spending time with her, then you're both just screwed.
posted by anapestic at 7:57 AM on November 20, 2002


frasermoo & matteo. Almost made me cry I was laughing so hard ;-)

On topic: Being a parent must be hard ( I am not one myself). I can only say from the oppisite spectrum, do not try to impose draconian measures at this point. You will only push her farther away, possibly down a worse path.
Good luck with your daughter.
posted by a3matrix at 7:59 AM on November 20, 2002


This is a fucking joke, right? Tell me you're really a roadie for Green Day, Terry, and just wanted to link to the website in some Viral marketing campaign.

To all of those that have done the whole "This is inappropriate, but since you asked/since the thread is here/since it will be deleted, here's my point of view", you've been no more appropriate than the posting of the thread itself. Proof is in the statement "54 comments isn't bad for something that apparently shouldn't have been here in the first place...."
posted by Ufez Jones at 8:07 AM on November 20, 2002


The first and best line of defense is to establish respect in early childhood. Often, but not always, this brings greater respect to a parent’s requests in the teen years. Beyond this, I would set up rules with consequences for the more serious issues. I would then enforce them while explaining while I feel this is important to do. I would tell my child why I disagree with their behaviors and, beyond my own personal feelings, what the mental, social, physical and emotional consequences could be in the future. At this point, I would let my child make their decisions. I will enforce the consequences we set up and continue to warn them and encourage them to not do these things. But you can’t control them. First and also last, I would put my trust in Jesus Christ: let him know what I want and leave him to work in my child and not worry about it.
posted by grehy at 8:26 AM on November 20, 2002


Why wasn't the issue of whether or not this post is appropriate taken over to Metafilter?

A) Most of these posts contain the worst advice I have ever read. Please do not print this out and give it to your daughter. This isn't representative of anything, just the opinions of Metafilterites. Mostly ones I wish weren't here.

B) If you want your daughter to do her homework, there is only one means available to you. You have to sit down with her every night and watch her do it. This isn't Draconian. Its caring.

C) Green Day - So what? My thirteen year old cousin listens to Green Day, and believe me, that kid is on the fast track to MIT. His parents are Juilliard classical musicians, and they couldn't care less.

D) Drugs. I don't know much about your situation, so its hard to give advice. That said, don't take half measures on this issue. Get her involved in some other things, even if you have to sign her up for them. Fill up her time with enough useful and interesting activities that there is no time for drugs. And also tell her that it breaks your heart and have that conversation. Tell her you may be misguided, but that you have decided you have to do what you think is best - meaning you won't put up with any drug use. Come up with a punishment and have her tested every two months by a doctor.
posted by xammerboy at 8:29 AM on November 20, 2002


you're probably going to be pissed at me for posting this, but the fact you're posting to metafilter for advice is an obvious insight into the problem - you don't know how to parent your child.

but - you're trying to find out how, and that's commendable, so you're not a crappy father or anything.

show your kid you love her. i've never smoked pot myself, but i know a lot of people who do that didn't miss classes, didn't really get into any trouble, and are frankly really intelligent people who often have as good if not a better work ethic than the average non pot smoking joe.

I think your biggest concern should be missing classes, not smoking pot, and certainly not listening to Green Day. Every 14 year old girl listens to green day these days.. they think it's punk rock and it's the rebellious thing to do.. little do the poor saps realize it's just the same manufactured pop rock everyone else is listening to - but this time with blue, green, or purple hair.

Bottom line on Green Day and similar bands is that they're not saying anything in their lyrics that would really do any harm to your "impressionable daughter"...

Spend time with your daughter.. take her places she likes to go... talk to her.. tell her you trust her to be responsible, and act like you do - but that you don't want her missing classes... don't tell her pot is okay.. tell her you'd really rather she not - but you know you can't stop her and you just want her to at least be responsible about it... not to try the more dangerous drugs out there...

Most of all tell her you love her...

Some kids go do "bad" things just to see if their parents really give a shit about them..

It's worth noting that a lot of kids who do drugs do it because there's nothing else to do... If your daughter likes sports at all - take her to see her favorite team once in a while.. if she likes music, take her to a concert sometime, maybe even Green Day.. heck, since she seems into music - offer to get her guitar (or some other instrument) lessons...

you need to encourage activities in her life that keep her busy enough to not need to smoke pot and do stupid shit all the time...

encourage her schoolwork, encourage her fun outside of school and she won't have time to be the crapass teenager that most 14 year olds are, smoking pot, skipping class, and generally being obnoxious...
posted by twiggy at 8:39 AM on November 20, 2002


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