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June 25, 2003 2:06 PM   Subscribe

Scariest mug shot ever. So says the Smoking Gun. And hell, they should know.
posted by CunningLinguist (78 comments total)

 
Puts Nolte to shame, eh? Jesus, that's scary.
posted by WolfDaddy at 2:09 PM on June 25, 2003


This one is good too.
posted by CunningLinguist at 2:11 PM on June 25, 2003


:-0
posted by serafinapekkala at 2:11 PM on June 25, 2003


obligatory lily-livered police-hating pinko commie mefi comment: i bet beating him up made us and the police a lot safer.
posted by andrew cooke at 2:16 PM on June 25, 2003


What I find fascinating about this guy (and others like him), is the amount of hate they must have for themselves and others to tattoo such angry messages on their bodies.

sad, really.
posted by Julnyes at 2:17 PM on June 25, 2003


are they such angry messages? isn't it more about identifying with your group than expressing anger? i would have thought that when he's angry and full of hate he hits people, rather than tootling off for a tattoo.
posted by andrew cooke at 2:20 PM on June 25, 2003


Maybe he'll find a new friend
posted by fatbaq at 2:25 PM on June 25, 2003


I imagine the bloke who did that to him looks scarier.
posted by squealy at 2:27 PM on June 25, 2003


You know, we should be proud of him for standing up for what he believes in, for not bowing to the "PC" culture that is so prevalent these days, for sticking to his priciples in the face of persecution.
just like Geor.....nah
posted by MrMoonPie at 2:28 PM on June 25, 2003


Wow.
posted by me3dia at 2:30 PM on June 25, 2003


yes they symbolize belonging, but belonging to what? neo-nazis? the klan? what do these groups stand for? what actions do they advocate? Don't they advocate hate and violence?

and the fact that he has them on his face and neck - difficult to hide. It seems to me, ymmv, that he placed them there as a challenge.
posted by Julnyes at 2:31 PM on June 25, 2003


I would never advocate oppressing someone for their appearance or their beliefs.

And yet, on some deep emotional level, I can't help feeling that maybe the cops didn't hit him enough.
posted by George_Spiggott at 2:33 PM on June 25, 2003


He's like some sort of Frankenstein tribute to G.G Allen, Marilyn Manson, Boy George, and Owen Wilson.
posted by dgaicun at 2:35 PM on June 25, 2003


*mrowr*
posted by xmutex at 2:36 PM on June 25, 2003


Looks like the role model for J.K. Simmons. In Oz, not Law & Order, of course.
posted by billsaysthis at 3:04 PM on June 25, 2003


What irks me is that these people are still around! I mean, how can you believe in these organizations? It's one thing to belong to a religious group or something like that, and have people angry at you for having some foolish idea which no one accepts, but as Julnyes was saying, these are hate groups! They DO advocate violence. Of course this runs into all sorts of problems with the fundamental ideas of American freedom, but do people really not see that organizations of this type are dangerous?
posted by caustic at 3:06 PM on June 25, 2003


What's scary about it is that this guy must be as dumb as hell - you tell me why he would go ahead and adorn his face and neck in such fashion otherwise. If he is mean and after you, he is going to be one persistent annoyance to say the least. But you can't tell if he is really mean from a picture. Maybe he is just dumb. Looks like he got a good beating too.
posted by magullo at 3:07 PM on June 25, 2003


Using your body to espouse hatred. I hope this dude didn't get a chance to make any babies before he gets to spend his life in jail.

And really, just how stupid do you have to be to try and mail drugs into a prison?

My guess is that he's filled with hate and its squished his brain up against the side of his skull. But I bet he's an incredibly mean bastard too.

My further guess is that he was spewing his hatred and trying to attack the cops who were arresting him. Like I said, not the sharpest knife in the drawer.
posted by fenriq at 3:16 PM on June 25, 2003


He looks faintly like Quan-Chi from Mortal Kombat: Deadly Alliance (unemployment = equating everything to video games).
posted by Zosia Blue at 3:18 PM on June 25, 2003


wow. i agree, the tats are there for a reason. you don't see many white supremacists wearing turtlenecks, methinks
posted by shadow45 at 3:18 PM on June 25, 2003


the nose! it's... quite ... mesmerizing ...
posted by poopy at 3:22 PM on June 25, 2003


It's one thing to belong to a religious group

It is my understanding that most of these hate groups are indeed "religous groups." Eric Rudolf and the Christian Church of Israel, for example.
posted by gruchall at 3:24 PM on June 25, 2003


the nose! it's... quite ... mesmerizing ...

No doubt, poopy. It's like an optical illusion.
posted by cortex at 3:25 PM on June 25, 2003


I didn't catch that post, gruchall. Hmm...1nt3r3$71ngz0rz.
posted by caustic at 3:28 PM on June 25, 2003


I am going to see this guy in my nightmares.

He and his bro are pretty smart. Sending drugs TO A JAIL. I'll say....
posted by aacheson at 3:28 PM on June 25, 2003


These people are everywhere. I was having a very nice conversation with an attractive woman in a bar a couple weeks ago when I noticed she had a tattoo on her lower back. When I asked to see it she lifted her shirt to reveal a swastika about 8 inches across.

"Isn't it great! Look, the one around my belly button says White Power!"

"Uh, sure... I think I hear my friends calling me..."
posted by InfidelZombie at 3:31 PM on June 25, 2003


Um, shouldn't we all just be thankful that the murderous, stupid, hate-spewing thugs out there see fit to adorn themselves in such an obvious manner? I mean, otherwise it'd be a *lot* harder to sort out the Bad People from the rest of us.
posted by freebird at 3:33 PM on June 25, 2003


InfidelZombie, be glad you saw her tat in the bar. Can you imagine coming across that filth when she's stripping to have sex?

Talk about a mood killer!

People get swastikas tattoed on themselves without even bothering to learn about what it really means.

Or even recognizing the sad and pitiful fact that, if Hitler were alive, he wouldn't want the white trash losers to be a part of the Third Reich. Too stupid, too inbred and essentially wastes of space.
posted by fenriq at 3:57 PM on June 25, 2003


I get the feeling that this guy is going to come after all the mefites who posted snarky comments about him.

In other news, I bet he makes a great chicken salad.
posted by DragonBoy at 3:59 PM on June 25, 2003


Again, I'm disappointed by armchair psychoanalysis.
posted by Hildago at 4:09 PM on June 25, 2003


I imagine some nice folk prison are making him regret getting those tats.
posted by Espoo2 at 4:13 PM on June 25, 2003


shouldn't we all just be thankful that the murderous, stupid, hate-spewing thugs out there see fit to adorn themselves in such an obvious manner? I mean, otherwise it'd be a *lot* harder to sort out the Bad People from the rest of us.

Hear hear! This is also why I'm against speech codes of any kind. If someone is an ignant-ass racist, I'd like them to feel free to speak up so I know right away not to waste any time on them.
posted by Ty Webb at 4:22 PM on June 25, 2003


On an unrelated topic, if you're about to have sex with the good looking stranger that you've just met, and you notice her swastika tattoo, do you stop and talk about then, or do you just pretend not to notice it and never call her again? What does Emily Post recommend in these situations?
posted by jonson at 4:22 PM on June 25, 2003


Am I the only person who's first thought was "why would you want to do a drug that makes you jumpy, hyper, twitchy and paranoid while you're in prison"?
posted by JoanArkham at 4:26 PM on June 25, 2003


1. roughed up a bit by the police. Well, it looks like the cornea on his right eye needs replacing. That must really hurt.
2. Heh - let's get all people who believe in attacking people because they look different. and. and. let's attack them because THEY look different.
3. Look at those goddamn ears - he's a vulcan.
4. Well, I think that boy's sure got a pruurty mouth.
5. Racism is baaaad.
6. Zosia Blue - ROFLMPO
7. Did I miss anything.
posted by seanyboy at 4:28 PM on June 25, 2003


you don't see many white supremacists wearing turtlenecks

I know one that could use one

jonson: an impromptu BSDM session would be my answer, but you risk a persistent annoyance in the form of a brother like the fellow up there
posted by magullo at 4:29 PM on June 25, 2003


I imagine some nice folk prison are making him regret getting those tats.

I was under the impression that tribalists had better systems of protection in prison, and it's the timid, the principled, the individualists, the gays, and the pedophiles who are all at the most risk for prison abuse.
posted by dgaicun at 4:30 PM on June 25, 2003


I think this series of mug shots, admittedly for a different reason, are equally frightening.

[Scroll down for the full photo story.]
posted by Dunvegan at 4:34 PM on June 25, 2003


I imagine some nice folk [in] prison are making him regret getting those tats.

Ten to one he either got those tats in prision or immediately after being released.
posted by timeistight at 4:35 PM on June 25, 2003


Most of this seems like a lot of pointing and laughing by a group that has probably enjoyed a lot more life advantages than this man has experienced. If he lives up to his own self advertising, then he probably blindly objectifies certain individuals, unwilling to admit their humanity, in order to operate within a simple, easily grasped frame of reference that is much easier to deal with than the infinitely complex reality.

To be honest, a lot of the comments in this thread seem like pretty much the same thing, except by people who, if they live up to their own advertising, should really know better. Sorry. I hate to sound preachy, but this is just really too cheap and easy, isn't it?
posted by taz at 4:47 PM on June 25, 2003 [1 favorite]


Reminds me of the guy in Snow Crash who had "poor impulse control" tattooed on his forehead.

In other news, South Korea is cracking down on those who get tattoos in order to avoid the draft.

The mug shot tattoos look too well done to be prison work (not that I'm an expert). I also kind of like that font, I have to say.
posted by jokeefe at 4:56 PM on June 25, 2003


Am I the only person who's first thought was "why would you want to do a drug that makes you jumpy, hyper, twitchy and paranoid while you're in prison"?

Tis a small price to pay for 48 hour erections.
posted by dydecker at 5:10 PM on June 25, 2003


Taz: no, that would be complicated. And it would be very difficult to tell the Good People from the Bad People. Please stop saying these things.

heh. Yes, that was (largely) my point as well, though I was less explicit. Nonetheless, you must admit it's a scary photo, which is all the FPP ever claimed. Your wanton, irresponsible, party-poopin addition of thoughtful reflection to the mix really just increases the scariness, doesn't it?
posted by freebird at 5:18 PM on June 25, 2003


Yes. You are absolutely right, freebird. To make up for it, though, I'll just throw in the thought that it seems to me that no price would be too small to pay for 48-hour erections...
posted by taz at 5:21 PM on June 25, 2003


"On an unrelated topic, if you're about to have sex with the good looking stranger that you've just met, and you notice her swastika tattoo, do you stop and talk about then, or do you just pretend not to notice it and never call her again?"

Tell them about your African grandfather or Jewish mother. During the sex.
posted by Akuinnen at 5:31 PM on June 25, 2003


Most of this seems like a lot of pointing and laughing by a group that has probably enjoyed a lot more life advantages than this man has experienced.

Yeah, the only reason I don't have the same tattoos right now is because I had an Atari 2600 growing up.

Or, it could just be that I'm not a complete asshole and this guy is.
posted by anildash at 5:43 PM on June 25, 2003


Yeah, the only reason I don't have the same tattoos right now is because I had an Atari 2600 growing up.
Or, it could just be that I'm not a complete asshole and this guy is.


Or, maybe *neither* of your two choices fully address the complexities of one person's life. Come on, don't play False Dichotomy. Noone has said anything as stupid as your first option, but do you really think it's as simple as your second?

Look, how often have you heard about some Gangsta getting locked up and thought "gee, he is kinda a product of his environment and maybe we should look a little bit at the causes of his predicament before simply condemning him as a Bad Person"? Maybe never, but you should, because the world is a pretty complicated place. All that Taz is saying (I think) is that maybe this guy deserves some of the same thought?

Sure, he looks to me like Bad News. But the comments have been a bit knee-jerk and superior. I bet you $100 that there's some multiplex aspects to his story, and as long as people keep seeing the Nazis and Assholes of the world as Bad People Different From Themselves, they'll be around.

Or, um, yah, it could just be Good People and Bad People running around, and thank goodness we're on the right team. Sheesh.
posted by freebird at 6:05 PM on June 25, 2003 [1 favorite]


Can't shake the devil's hand and say you're only kidding!
posted by padraigin at 6:07 PM on June 25, 2003


anildash, I think both you and I are in the "incomplete asshole" camp, but I do have the feeling that, tragically, it might have gone completely the other way without that Atari 2600.
posted by taz at 6:11 PM on June 25, 2003


While I doubt it applies in this case, it's worth mentioning that I've heard of people, the day before a prison sentence starts, will go out and get a white power tatoo. They may not have a racist bone in their body, but, in prison, you have to align yourself with somebody, and quick, for protection's sake.
posted by GeekAnimator at 6:22 PM on June 25, 2003


I don't care about why he looks like that - if I saw him coming towards me on the street, I would suddenly need to be on the other side.
posted by dg at 6:37 PM on June 25, 2003


I read all the comments before finally clicking the link, and was sorely disappointed. Tattoos are something I dislike very badly, and I can't help but lose a little respect for anyone with one-or-more. (That's one reason why I haven't met up with any MeFites in RL) And it's why I'm not terribly happy to be living so close to "Studio City Tattoo".

But I have seen worse. Much worse, not just in the tat department, but in the facial damage, gaunt-ness and hateful expression department (due partly from a recent experience with The Housemates From Hell who actually had 'friends' like that). Some people just lead a sheltered life (and I used to be one of those people).

Anyway, Dunlevy's link was much more impressive to me - if the woman was still turning tricks during the time of her 'after' pic, he clientele must have been exclusively necrophiliacs.

And, in the case of the guy in Cunning's link, it is helpful to see a total asshole so well labeled. (Truth in Labeling Laws for assholes... hmmm...)
posted by wendell at 6:55 PM on June 25, 2003


Despite whether he deserves a good beating, I'm pretty disturbed by the bruises on his face. Whoever was hitting him, was punching him square in the face. Which doesn't sound a whole lot like a policeman taking down someone resisting arrest.

The few times I've seen such things it more resembles a high school wrestling match than boxing.

But that is just speculation from a photo. The few people I've met with such blatantly racist tattoos have all been exactly as advertised. So, I highly doubt he is one of the really scaring looking tattoo/bod mod people who turns out to be the nicest thing since Mother Teresa.
posted by obfusciatrist at 7:11 PM on June 25, 2003


Does this woman's shirt say "hamas?"

This guy makes me sad.
posted by magnificentsven at 7:32 PM on June 25, 2003


Uck. Sad all around.

"every time you make a choice you are turning the central part of you, the part of you that chooses, into something a little different from what it was before. And taking your life as a whole, with all your innumerable choices, all your life long you are slowly turning this central thing into a Heaven creature or into a hellish creature: either into a creature that is in harmony with God, and with other creatures, and with itself, or else into one that is in a state of war and hatred with God, and with its fellow creatures, and with itself. To be the one kind of creature is Heaven: that is, it is joy, and peace, and knowledge, and power. To be the other means madness, horror, idiocy, rage, impotence, and eternal loneliness. Each of us at each moment is progressing to the one state or the other."

– that C.S. Lewis guy
posted by weston at 7:38 PM on June 25, 2003


Tattoos are something I dislike very badly, and I can't help but lose a little respect for anyone with one-or-more.

Well I dislike people like you, so I guess that makes us even.
posted by Dark Messiah at 7:54 PM on June 25, 2003


magnificentsven writes:
Does this woman's shirt say "hamas?"

I believe the "Ba" prefix is not visible in the photo...
posted by Schnauzer at 8:35 PM on June 25, 2003


I'd hit it.

No, I'm just kidding, really. But as for the "meet a hot girl in a bar" quandry... well, that's a tough one. I mean, you don't have to date her, and I'd bet the sex would sure be, um, cathartic. She'd probably be in to all sorts of freaky-deaky shit, you know? Who knows what you might be missing out on...
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 8:41 PM on June 25, 2003


Tell them about your African grandfather or Jewish mother. During the sex.

I assume the "...and then hold on for dear life" is implied?
posted by Ufez Jones at 9:09 PM on June 25, 2003


Most of this seems like a lot of pointing and laughing by a group that has probably enjoyed a lot more life advantages than this man has experienced. If he lives up to his own self advertising, then he probably blindly objectifies certain individuals, unwilling to admit their humanity, in order to operate within a simple, easily grasped frame of reference that is much easier to deal with than the infinitely complex reality.

To be honest, a lot of the comments in this thread seem like pretty much the same thing, except by people who, if they live up to their own advertising, should really know better. Sorry. I hate to sound preachy, but this is just really too cheap and easy, isn't it?


I know plenty of people who haven't had fantastic 'life advantages' that turned out just fine. I'm sure he does indeed have a serious problem with grasping any sort of reality.

I certainly feel sympathy for the waste that this guy has made of his life, this fellow who no doubt didn't have the advantages that many of us had growing up, but this is a guy who is jail for murder charges, was caught trying to smuggle crank into the jail, and also pulled a gun on an officer. He is a violent man who obviously has strong enough views about the rest of the human race that he felt compelled to tattoo a swastika on his throat, and white power slogans over his eyebrows.

I don't think he did all these things because he didn't have the 'advantages' that others have. Are you going to tell me that the complex reality here is that none of these things were really his choice, and that nobody who hasn't gone through what he's gone through can even deign to feel one way or another about his actions?
posted by GriffX at 9:18 PM on June 25, 2003


Any compassion for this guy? Maybe I have a soft heart for the wicked and insane. That tat around his neck is hella cool, minus the swastika - I'm not a fan of the facial tatoos at all.

I wonder if his nose is like that, or just broken from the beating he took. I wonder if he'll get it set right or end up with a crooked nose for the rest of his life. Fix the nose and he has quite an intersting shape to his face. Very cool in some ways.
posted by tomplus2 at 9:21 PM on June 25, 2003


...could look at bit like like this.
posted by tomplus2 at 9:37 PM on June 25, 2003


"gee, he is kinda a product of his environment and maybe we should look a little bit at the causes of his predicament before simply condemning him as a Bad Person"

And looking a little bit at the causes is going to accomplish what? Bring the victim back to life? Give us an excuse to let him back out into society?

Come on, be real: the guy is a creep who smuggled drugs, pulled a gun on the cops, and is in on murder! Lock him up and throw away the key: he's completely unnecessary to this society, and we're far better off without him.

Let's not waste our time when there are people who can be helped.
posted by five fresh fish at 10:20 PM on June 25, 2003


And looking a little bit at the causes is going to accomplish what?

Prevent recidivism? Prevent crime in the first place?

No, you're right, perhaps there are no causes, only effects.
posted by Hildago at 11:59 PM on June 25, 2003 [1 favorite]


Or perhaps each effect becomes the cause of subsequent effects, as though all of existence were a chaotic web of interacting events? :)

There are all kinds of causes that drove this guy to become the freak he now is. Had you followed his exact life-path, you'd be the same, because you'd be him. But right now, if someone offered to shave your head, tattoo your neck and eyebrows, and bend your nose into the shape of a capital C, you would refuse, because your series of life events has led you to become a much saner person than our friend in the mugshot.

I suggest that it is his fault that he is what he is only to the extent that he is capable of acting differently. Which is likely to be broad, and not include tattooing himself and actively committing crimes, but is not likely to include being a person of low intelligence with a desperate need to be noticed.
posted by aeschenkarnos at 1:23 AM on June 26, 2003


these people want to turn israel into the bahamas ....
why are we not supporting them ?
posted by sgt.serenity at 3:33 AM on June 26, 2003 [1 favorite]


<superficial>
tomplus2, if you keep doing that you'll turn him into Lenin.
</superficial>
posted by Songdog at 6:05 AM on June 26, 2003


It looks like instant karma hit that guy right in the face.

When I become dictator, we'll bomb neo-Nazi installations on the grounds that it's a mop-up battle from World War II.

(I'll never be dictator, so don't bother getting indignant.)
posted by Mayor Curley at 6:28 AM on June 26, 2003


So if you became dictator you'd send in the military to liquidate undesirable portions of your own civilian population? ...Whos side exactly were you planning on mopping up for?
posted by dgaicun at 6:51 AM on June 26, 2003


I just want to point out for future reference - I came from a disadvantaged background so I can point and laugh at everyone </end snark>

But seriously, I'm from the South Bronx and had to step over crack addicts to get to school somedays - am I currently typing this from a jailhouse library? no.

When you come from a harsh background it is sometimes easier to slide into groups or gangs that think for you, but it isn't the only choice.

So yeah, he probably had a rough time of it, but he still made the choice to tattoo those things on his face. I'm sure all his white power friends would still respect him if he had that crap on his back or legs, right? It didn't have to be so visible.

Where you are from doesn't have to control where you go in life.
posted by Julnyes at 7:08 AM on June 26, 2003


You want a scary mugshot? Try this:

                          I fell down down down into a burning ring of fire...
posted by y2karl at 7:23 AM on June 26, 2003


GriffX, you asked "Are you going to tell me that the complex reality here is that none of these things were really his choice, and that nobody who hasn't gone through what he's gone through can even deign to feel one way or another about his actions?"

Actually this wasn't really my point. I object most to the whole "spectacle" aspect of the thread. If the post had been made simply about a guy who brandished a gun, resisted arrest, smuggled drugs, etc., the response would have been "so what?". This thread was about "look at this guy, doesn't he look creepy? Isn't he gross?" and it's bothersome to me because it's a lot of people in much cozier circumstances titillating themselves with the physical spectacle of a guy who has been pretty much pulped, who is probably mentally/intellectually/emotionally disabled, and who will spend most of what will probably be his short and miserable life in prison... It's just too easy; it's like crowing over the fact that you beat the crippled guy in a foot race. I object to the cheapness of the shot.

And, the truth is that I can envisage a lot of circumstances in my own life, that, had they been different, would have turned me into an entirely different creature. Let's just say I'm an agnostic who to some degree looks at this guy and says whatever the atheist/agnostic version is of "there, but for the grace of god, etc."
posted by taz at 7:25 AM on June 26, 2003 [1 favorite]


If I brand the words "I'm a complete asshole" on my face, I don't think I can expect much sympathy when people point and laugh.
posted by CunningLinguist at 7:47 AM on June 26, 2003


I'm with taz.
posted by squirrel at 10:31 AM on June 26, 2003


the physical spectacle of a guy who has been pretty much pulped, who is probably mentally/intellectually/emotionally disabled

Suitably chastened, here.
posted by jokeefe at 12:45 PM on June 26, 2003


who is probably mentally/intellectually/emotionally disabled
Wow, you can tell all that just from a photo? Me, I'm with CunningLinguist on this one.
posted by dg at 3:27 PM on June 26, 2003


I object most to the whole "spectacle" aspect of the thread.

But Mr. Tattoo chose to make himself a spectacle.

I third CL's statement. Asshole is as asshole does.
posted by five fresh fish at 10:07 AM on June 27, 2003


The whole point of The Smoking Gun is schadenfreude. Does it really make much difference whether we're enjoying this misfortunes of Hugh Grant or this loser?
posted by timeistight at 10:41 AM on June 27, 2003


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