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Shots fired from within NY City Hall.
July 23, 2003 12:28 PM   Subscribe

Shots fired from within NY City Hall. Shooter still on the loose, but apparently wounded.
posted by Oddly (59 comments total)

 
"This is an attack on democracy. We will not stop until we find who did this. It is not terrorism. It appears to be a random act, but we cannot allow this to go on, ever. This is an attack on all Americans," Bloomberg said.

An attack on all Americans? An attack on democracy?

The hyperbole is getting deep in New York.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 12:46 PM on July 23, 2003


Bloomberg is a fool.

"This is an attack on democracy," said Bloomberg. "This is not terrorism -- it appears to be a random act."

Ok, if it's random, how does it have a motive, you fuckwit? If it's random, then it's just an attack, not an attack on an ideal. I can't believe you people voted for this idiot liberal.
posted by insomnyuk at 12:51 PM on July 23, 2003


"This is an attack on democracy," New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg said.

Michael Bloomberg is the ten of diamonds in your handy Hyperbole Playing Cards" deck.

Pass me a pike inside a pike, cause I fucking hate CNN. It makes me want to scream!
posted by DragonBoy at 12:54 PM on July 23, 2003


we didn't insomnyuk...it was the giuliani folks who voted him in...and he's no liberal at all...just a clueless billionaire playing at politics (meanwhile one of the victims has died, and i heard that the shooter came in with a councilperson's staff, bypassing the metal detectors)
posted by amberglow at 12:57 PM on July 23, 2003


  1. Dude, I didn't vote for him.
  2. It wasn't random -- the person who shot Councilman James Davis was standing with him when he opened fire -- they attended the meeting together. Two of Davis' staffers are being questioned about the person right now.
  3. No, not an attack on democracy. He is such a maroon.
posted by ltracey at 12:59 PM on July 23, 2003


Shooter still on the loose, but apparently wounded.

Thanks. If I see him, I'll be sure to avoid to try and avoid him.
posted by eyeballkid at 1:05 PM on July 23, 2003


I'm going to defend his not terrorism but still attack on democracy comment - a city councilman was shot dead in city hall conducting business. With that things have shut down all business for at least today, and depending on motive this may have been a direct result of said councilmans political position.

I'm really not one to speculate on things like this, but at the moment that part of his comments aren't that far off base.

The "random" comment... if taken as "random act of violence" and not what I suspect he meant it more as "isolated" is a bit more sketchy.
posted by 10sball at 1:05 PM on July 23, 2003


If only there were organizations that employed people to investigate and write about such incidents. Then their writings could be posted on the web -- let's call them "news sites" -- and we could get all our news from those sites! And not see it on the front page of MeFi!
posted by stupidsexyFlanders at 1:06 PM on July 23, 2003


wow, that was a strange little hiccup, but still oddly logical.
posted by eyeballkid at 1:06 PM on July 23, 2003


and be on the lookout for a man in the city hall/wall street area wearing a blue suit.

... and if you don't see at least a few dozen double check you're in lower manhattan
posted by 10sball at 1:07 PM on July 23, 2003


cause I fucking hate CNN.

Why, DragonBoy? Because they quoted what Bloomberg said?
posted by Vidiot at 1:10 PM on July 23, 2003


So, stupidsexyflanders, only news from your hometown paper that you post deserves FPPs? Your hypocrisy is mind-numbing.
posted by archimago at 1:16 PM on July 23, 2003


Sorry, is something happening in NYC? Should I care?

Sounds like somebody tried to copycat a famous San Francisco event... Police should be looking for a man with Twinkies on his breath...

BTW, What happened to that fire in the French landmark? Is it still standing? Is Paris FD better than NY's? (yes, I'm trolling for New Yawkers...)

Please remember, MetaFilter is NOT a local publication.

Besides, we Californians seceded last week (we spread petitions telling everybody we were recalling the Governor to replace him with Arnold... chuckle.)

One more thing: Pike, you bunch of Winers.
posted by wendellseviltwin at 1:17 PM on July 23, 2003


amberglow: Anybody that bans cigarettes from all buildings in New York City and raises taxes to well-nigh astronomic heights is liberal in my book.
posted by insomnyuk at 1:22 PM on July 23, 2003


archimago, many things people post here happen to be in newspapers. If you can't see the difference between that post and this one, I don't know who can help you.
posted by soyjoy at 1:23 PM on July 23, 2003


Latest reports indicate that the first victim has died, and the second victim may have died as well. Also, the second victim may have been the shooter.

amberglow: Anybody that bans cigarettes from all buildings in New York City and raises taxes to well-nigh astronomic heights is liberal in my book.

Insomnyuk: Huh? Words mean things, and you should learn to use them properly.

Liberal does not mean "someone I don't like". It denotes a certain body of political ideals and beliefs that Bloomberg certainly does not subscribe to.

Bloomberg ran on the Republican ticket and is generally considered to be a moderate Republican.

Bloomberg didn't ban cigarettes all on his own, and he certainly didn't raise taxes all on his own. To pretend that he is the king of NYC, and then randomly slap him with a label is the worst kind of straw man argument, and frankly, I would expect more of you.
posted by bshort at 1:32 PM on July 23, 2003


amberglow: Anybody that bans cigarettes from all buildings in New York City and raises taxes to well-nigh astronomic heights is liberal in my book.

A ha. So someone against cigarette smoke is a liberal while someone against pot smoke is a conservative. Plus, even though he's the millionaire owner of a major financial research group (those leftists and their international stock services organizations!) who ran on the Republican Party ticket with the endorsement of every conservative paper in New York, he's a liberal "in your book" for doing what George Bush did.

Please clarify, as I'm having lots of trouble figuring out how that isn't the dumbest fucking thing I've ever heard.
posted by XQUZYPHYR at 1:38 PM on July 23, 2003


raises taxes to well-nigh astronomic heights is liberal in my book

I guess "liberal" now means "fiscally responsible".
posted by Armitage Shanks at 1:39 PM on July 23, 2003


It's this guy --Councilman Davis, from Brooklyn-- who is dead now...

imsomnyuk--what bshort said...and look to your friends in the adminstration as to why taxes had to go up...when you starve the states and cities, that's what happens (it's happening now with first responders too--the gop in the u.s. senate just killed an increase in funding for them)
posted by amberglow at 1:39 PM on July 23, 2003


Vidiot, I believe it's a joke about yesterday's hysterical post linking to CNN's front page. Check DragonBoy's links and all will be revealed.
posted by stefanie at 1:40 PM on July 23, 2003


Facts and logic make baby trolls cry.
posted by substrate at 1:46 PM on July 23, 2003


It's kind of sad that that guy died.
posted by drobot at 1:51 PM on July 23, 2003


A witness described the shooter as a man in his 40s wearing a cream-colored suit.

I wouldn't think cream-colored is exactly shooter's colors. I mean, think of the CLEANING, will you?
posted by Ogre Lawless at 1:52 PM on July 23, 2003


>I'm having lots of trouble figuring out how that isn't the dumbest fucking thing I've ever heard.

This is what happens when politics becomes namecalling. Ever listen to talk radio? insomnyuk is the like the stereotypical 4am caller. Don't like something, call it liberal. The problem is, outside of talk radio and Fox News people will call you on your nonsense.

>So someone against cigarette smoke is a liberal while someone against pot smoke is a conservative.

Heh, I guess stuff like "state's rights" and "personal responsbility" only extends to the particular drug you happen to like.
posted by skallas at 1:52 PM on July 23, 2003


I don't have any friends in the administration, thanks. Liberal obviously means a lot of things, and if Bloomberg was fiscally responsible, he would have cut budgets, not raise taxes. On another note, Bloomberg merely joined the Republican party in the last few years so that he could run for mayor on a post-Giuliani ticket. Bush is a moderate AT BEST, and Bloomberg is definitely a liberal, with his social-democratic platform.

Heh, I guess stuff like "state's rights" and "personal responsbility" only extends to the particular drug you happen to like.

Heh. Actually, you unclefucking fuckwit, I don't think any drugs should be banned or restricted, and it should in fact be a local issue. I stand by what I said about Bloomberg being an idiot liberal. Note how the word "idiot" modifies the word "liberal." Now, if you understood grammar, you would know that this does not mean that I think all liberals are idiots, there are a few intelligent ones. Some of them even post here, on occasion. If I did any namecalling, it was using the word "idiot," I used the term "liberal" as a convenience.
posted by insomnyuk at 1:55 PM on July 23, 2003


insomnyuk: "Anybody that bans cigarettes from all buildings in New York City . . ."

and as of tomorrow no smoking in New York State Public Buildings, or (most) restaurants or bars.

Bloomberg isn't a big politician or even particularly powerful despite predating the state ban with his NYC ban.

/derail [you may now return to your unscheduled newsfilter post]
posted by DBAPaul at 1:56 PM on July 23, 2003


More on the late councilman and reverend James E. Davis.
posted by lisa g at 1:57 PM on July 23, 2003


This "news", is it something I need a TV to see?
posted by Outlawyr at 2:00 PM on July 23, 2003


It's this guy --Councilman Davis, from Brooklyn-- who is dead now...

Anyone from NY care to speculate why this person? It seems so random, and so pointless, to kill a person that is part of a group that helps pass local laws and run a town. People sitting in a council seat don't exactly have much power to do anything substantial in the world, so why would someone want to kill one specifically?
posted by mathowie at 2:00 PM on July 23, 2003


And now it looks like it was a shootout between Davis and a political rival of Davis (Askew, not sure of spelling.)
posted by SuzySmith at 2:01 PM on July 23, 2003


>Actually, you unclefucking fuckwit

Keep it up, troll.
posted by skallas at 2:11 PM on July 23, 2003


if Bloomberg was fiscally responsible, he would have cut budgets, not raise taxes.

He did both, because both were necessary. That's fiscally responsible. As opposed to, say, running an astronomical deficit by cutting taxes in a recession while spending a billion dollars a week on an overseas adventure. Good grief, what kind of fantasy land do cut-and-spend Republicans live in these days?
posted by Armitage Shanks at 2:15 PM on July 23, 2003


Egad! My sincere apologies to all for the CNN link. 'twas very bad form in retrospect. I'll re-check the manual regarding FPP standards, and flog myself with a pike while doing so. In the meantime, it's good to know I can count on my fellow mefites for rehabilitation through castigation!
posted by Oddly at 2:16 PM on July 23, 2003


Thanks skallas, you're my favorite!

Good grief, what kind of fantasy land do cut-and-spend Republicans live in these days?

Beats me, I'm not a Republican.
posted by insomnyuk at 2:19 PM on July 23, 2003


People sitting in a council seat don't exactly have much power to do anything substantial in the world, so why would someone want to kill one specifically?

i could write you a book.
posted by quonsar at 2:22 PM on July 23, 2003


here you go insomnyuk: on our local news station NY1, they just announced that Davis, who was killed, was 1 of only 3 democrats on the council to vote against the recent property tax increase.

Additionally, they say that Askew, the shooter, was running against Davis in a 3-way primary for the council seat.
posted by amberglow at 3:18 PM on July 23, 2003


Anyone from NY care to speculate why this person?

I'm not from New York, but this might be something.
posted by Ignatius J. Reilly at 3:19 PM on July 23, 2003


i could write you a book.

That Bitch Won't Let Me Keep My Spaceship on Blocks in Front of my Trailer
by quonsar
posted by Ignatius J. Reilly at 3:22 PM on July 23, 2003


insomnyuk: So can you explain to us all why Bloomberg is a liberal? And, as part of your answer you should also comment on your view of the president, and explain what you feel his ideological affiliation might be.

You know, just so we can all be clear.

Also, you might want to reconsider your rather offensive name-calling. It really reflects poorly on you.
posted by bshort at 3:27 PM on July 23, 2003


insomnyuk: "Anybody that bans cigarettes from all buildings in New York City..."

Considering that the statewide anti-smoking law takes effect tomorrow, a law that is even more stringent than NYC's, I assume you also regard Republican Gov. Pataki as liberal?

Maybe you would be willing to expand on your definition of liberal?
posted by cedar at 3:49 PM on July 23, 2003


I was googling for background on the shooter, didn't find much. But something interesting is that this page does not include his name, even though according to google's cache, it was there originally.

The page says last changed on July 14th-- perhaps the shooter was removed from the ballot for whatever reason, and this is his revenge?
posted by cell divide at 4:16 PM on July 23, 2003


Think the original article has changed since first being posted.
Askew walked into the building with Davis and the two men did not go through magnetometers,

The article mentioned Davis being a councilman which allowed him to bypass the magnetometers, but why not Askew? Then too Davis walking Askew in, it gave him the privilege too, why?

Make sure I have this straight, Askew was a running mate not a council member? Again why was he exempted from search? It makes no sense to have prevention if not used uniformly.
PS liberal: broad-minded which I think a lot are here as most seem to let folks think for themselves not forcing it on them.
posted by thomcatspike at 4:51 PM on July 23, 2003


insomnyuk - jesus dude, mellow out. You are really making yourself out to be a total asshole. Personal attacks like yours really ruin this site.
posted by tr33hggr at 5:53 PM on July 23, 2003


I know what a statesman is. He's a dead politician. We need more statesmen. - Robert C. Edwards.
posted by SPrintF at 8:36 PM on July 23, 2003


Leave him alone, folks, Insomnyuk was just emulating an ironic, text-book example of conservative doublethink.

People who oppose personal freedoms are "liberals". Cutting budgets is the only way to be fiscally "responsible". The only "liberals" who aren't complete idiots are the ones whos' opinions have some overlap with my own.

Take a look at yourselves! It was all a big joke! Wasn't it?
posted by Jimbob at 9:18 PM on July 23, 2003


So is it clear the councilman was shot because he supported gay-friendly policies, or was it just a deranged rival that wanted him dead for more personal reasons?
posted by mathowie at 1:28 AM on July 24, 2003


This seems to be the story along with more on the shooter

And this is an interesting piece showing what a rare event this was.
posted by amberglow at 5:20 AM on July 24, 2003


I was watching the news last night and hearing about this guy. It's beyond a crying shame.

Not only was Davis both a former cop and an ordained minister, he was on his way to recieving a doctorate. I think one of the biggest struggles in this story is trying to grasp how in the hell anyone would have malice towards this man, let alone enough to go out and kill him.
posted by XQUZYPHYR at 7:24 AM on July 24, 2003


insomnyuk - jesus dude, mellow out. You are really making yourself out to be a total asshole. Personal attacks like yours really ruin this site.

I am mellow! I said "heh." Well, quite frankly, I usually don't engage in name-calling, but this was a special case. I am sick and tired of skallas' bullshit, imputing identities and motives on people which aren't true. Makes for a convenient argumentative tactic. So I decided to use an equally convenient tactic. I'm just pointing out skallas for the slender douchebag that he really is.

And i don't see what the big deal is, this semantic argument about the word "liberal." Sure, it means many things, I just used it in the most common, Americanized form of the word. Certainly liberal can mean someone who is for economic and personal freedom, but today, it typically does not. Have a nice day everybody.
posted by insomnyuk at 7:56 AM on July 24, 2003


I'm just pointing out skallas for the slender douchebag that he really is.

Oh, OK, here we thought you were being an asshole. But that clears it all up.

Certainly liberal can mean someone who is for economic and personal freedom, but today, it typically does not.

If by "typically" you mean, "when used as an expletive by Rush and his millions of ditto-heads," then yes, you're right.
posted by soyjoy at 8:13 AM on July 24, 2003


Since when did "Liberal" mean "ban cigarettes"? I guess we learn something new every day....
posted by dabitch at 8:51 AM on July 24, 2003


Glad I could clear that up.
posted by insomnyuk at 11:03 AM on July 24, 2003


insomnyuk: "I'm just pointing out skallas for the slender douchebag that he really is."

"Glad I could clear that up."

My goodness your a nasty little pissant.

Instead of calling people names and relying on sarcasm, why not at least make an honest attempt to explain your position?

You talk about semantics, yet can't be bothered to define the words you use. BTW, "slender douchebag" makes about as much sense as the rest of your babble. If your going to flame people, at least make an attempt to use something resembling english.
posted by cedar at 12:45 PM on July 24, 2003


I did define the word I used, I explained why I used it, and I'm quite astonished that you actually care whether or not my insults are incoherent.
posted by insomnyuk at 1:15 PM on July 24, 2003


Cedar: I think the reason insomnyuk doesn't explain any of his positions is that he doesn't really have any.

He's only interested in prolonging a conversation by arguing with people.

Or in other words, he's a troll. In the most common, Americanized form of the word...

on preview:
I did define the word I used, I explained why I used it, and I'm quite astonished that you actually care whether or not my insults are incoherent.

As far as I can tell, the only definition you gave was: "Anybody that bans cigarettes from all buildings in New York City and raises taxes to well-nigh astronomic heights is liberal in my book." which, by the way, would mean that there are actually no liberals anywhere.

Don't you have a bridge to go hide under?
posted by bshort at 1:19 PM on July 24, 2003


Yes, and that bridge is also known as skallas' ample ass.
posted by insomnyuk at 2:12 PM on July 24, 2003


" Yes, and that bridge is also known as skallas' ample ass."

You simple minded asshat.

Don't you have a clue when to stop? I don't see skallas, who you seem to have some wacky obsession with, egging you on.

Going out of your way to insult someone who isn't even messing with you is inexcusable. Your a troll, quite a good one, but I have the feeling you won't be around much longer anyway.
posted by cedar at 2:23 PM on July 24, 2003


Metatalk
posted by skallas at 2:58 PM on July 24, 2003


People sitting in a council seat don't exactly have much power to do anything substantial in the world, so why would someone want to kill one specifically?

well, what do you think? Who really knows. Have you heard of this case before
posted by clavdivs at 8:18 AM on July 25, 2003


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