Living WAY off the grid.
May 21, 2004 10:56 AM   Subscribe

Father and 12 year old daughter camp undiscovered for four years in city park. A heartwarming story of love, generosity, and happy endings.
posted by karmaville (38 comments total)
 
In the city with both the world's smallest and largest urban parks.
posted by karmaville at 10:58 AM on May 21, 2004


crazy. the silhouette picture made it look like a joke, but it's real.

Officials said the girl, who would be normally in 7th grade, is at a 12th grade equivalency.

a stellar endorsement of our public-education system.
posted by mrgrimm at 11:05 AM on May 21, 2004


I am floored by this. This man did everything he could to protect his daughter and educate her. It does say a great deal, little of it good, about not only our public education system but our culture in general.
posted by janespeed at 11:07 AM on May 21, 2004


HAHA!

this was a heartwarming story, knowing that the only bad thing was being cut off from civilization, but not really, considering they went into town twice a week. and they get to stay together, which, being a single father, makes me happy.

i'm pretty happy about the man educating her, also, but seriously, he must have been pretty bored, so schooling his kid prolly came pretty naturally.
posted by taumeson at 11:09 AM on May 21, 2004


I'm from Portland, and I'll throw this light on this thread: Forest Park is well-used, but it's big and wild enough that it's not that surprising they made it so long without being discovered.
posted by jeremy at 11:21 AM on May 21, 2004


After reading this article, my heart has grown three times in size.

The only thing that would have made this story cooler would be if the pair had an elaborate system of caves and tunnels underneath Oregon in which they crawled to get to secret places undiscovered, and fight crime.
posted by whoshotwho at 11:25 AM on May 21, 2004


he must have been pretty bored, so schooling his kid prolly came pretty naturally

ding, ding, ding! a ringing endorsement of the leisure-time movement!

on preview: it's big and wild enough that it's not that surprising they made it so long without being discovered

for four years? i think they must have been pretty darn good at concealing their home.
posted by mrgrimm at 11:26 AM on May 21, 2004


"What was so clear was that their living conditions were unacceptable, but their relationship was a real deep love and caring for each other," Barkley said.

...

"The amazing part of this was the fact that Sergeant Barkley really evaluated what was best for these people," North Precinct Cmdr. Scott Anderson said. "Sometimes police would be a little quicker to hand things off to state workers. But instead ... he saw this through to the end."


These quotes really rub me the wrong way.

"Thanks for a country where nobody's allowed to mind the own business.

Thanks for a nation of finks. "
posted by thirteen at 11:28 AM on May 21, 2004


Like to see a follow up story about the two. The two returning sounds realistic.
posted by thomcatspike at 11:28 AM on May 21, 2004


When will the movie be coming out?
posted by whoshotwho at 11:33 AM on May 21, 2004


you're right karmaville, it's a very moving story. thanks for the link. and the writer is spot-on in pointing out that "the amazing part of this was the fact that Sergeant Barkley really evaluated what was best for these people," North Precinct Cmdr. Scott Anderson said. 'Sometimes police would be a little quicker to hand things off to state workers. But instead ... he saw this through to the end."

it's good, solid, compassionate neighborhood cop work. you really can't let somebody raise a kid in the woods like a dog -- you're not supposed to give up heat in the winter and running water and basic health care for your kid because you're poor -- but splitting the family after all the father did not to lose his daughter would have been a bureaucratic atrocity. the system can be really inhuman when laws are applied blindly.
in ancient Rome, when in doubt, the judge had to act as a bonus pater familias, as a "good family man".
Sergeant Barkley did just that. which somehow made me think of this film:

"A lot of people think this is just a job that you go to. Take a lunch hour, the job's over, something like that. But it's a 24 hour deal. No two ways about it.. And what most people don't see: just how hard it is to do the right thing. Sometimes people need a little help. Sometimes people need to be forgiven. And sometimes they need to go to jail. And that's a very tricky thing on my part... making that call. The law is the law and heck if I'm gonna break it. But can you forgive someone? Tough part of the job... tough part of walking down the street."


thirteen:
I'm just not sure Burroughs was talking about a case like this.
posted by matteo at 11:35 AM on May 21, 2004


v. cool story, karmaville. And I completely agree, janespeed.
posted by shoepal at 11:37 AM on May 21, 2004


"The amazing part of this was the fact that Sergeant Barkley really evaluated what was best for these people" For shame, that such a natural thing is seen as "amazing". I just came back from a week in Mexico where such commonsense actions are routine.
posted by lometogo at 11:38 AM on May 21, 2004


The thing that struck me was that in her health examination, she had no cavities.

mrgrimm:
Jeremy's right. I hike in Forest Park regularly and if you go off trail there are acres and acres of dense forest. I would be surprised if there were not more people living in the park without ever being seen.
posted by karmaville at 11:42 AM on May 21, 2004


The thing that struck me was that in her health examination, she had no cavities

It didn't describe their diets at all, but my guess is that they stuck to really basic foods that didn't involve a lot of processing and addtion of sugar/corn syrup. If you don't have a lot of money and are cooking over an open fire, you can't really do Tuna Helper or eat Twinkies.

It's an incredible story all around and I have to say I think the cop did the right thing. I can understand why it's rare -- police have insane workloads and making sure the father found a job, they both found a place to live, and that they could stay together is waaaaay beyond the bounds of the job and worthy of our praise.
posted by mathowie at 11:49 AM on May 21, 2004


Karmaville -- maybe there's a dental practice in there, serving all the Forest Families.
posted by stupidsexyFlanders at 11:53 AM on May 21, 2004


She may be well-spoken, well-educated, and responsible, but without television and school, she still might be lost in trying to fit into society. Unfortunately, getting along with the right people, managing your appearance, and being able to follow arbitrary rules are necessary skills. The purpose of school today isn't education, it's socialization.
posted by fuzz at 11:53 AM on May 21, 2004


School can be a poor socialization method, peer pressure, cliques, being molded into socially acceptable forms, gender roles, harassment if you "different"... humbug. and TV is worse, there ARE good things on tv, but you have to hunt them down. Well-spoken, well-educated, and responsible are adult qualities. having lived in similar (not in a park but wi/out electricity, running water etc.) I recommend it for a few years in almost every child's upbringing.
posted by edgeways at 12:07 PM on May 21, 2004


"What was so clear was that their living conditions were unacceptable, but their relationship was a real deep love and caring for each other," Barkley said.

Other than the fact that they were living on public land, presumably illegally, what exactly was "unacceptable" about their living conditions? The child was well fed, healthy, clean and educated. That's rather more than I can say for many of the people who have the misfortune to live in the poorer areas of North American cities.
posted by jacquilynne at 12:11 PM on May 21, 2004


...what exactly was "unacceptable" about their living conditions?

If you were to tell a court that you had no house, but you did have a lovely vacant patch of land to raise your daughter on... they probably wouldn't accept that.
posted by Jart at 12:30 PM on May 21, 2004


...it's not that surprising they made it so long without being discovered.

Or at least that they made it so long without anyone alerting the authorities. I would imagine that any number of people probably happened across their lean-to over the years and just didn't really think anything of it. I mean, if you saw that someone had set up a fairly elaborate camp in the forest, but you didn't see that Mowgli was living there or have any other reason to think something bad was going on, would you report it? I wouldn't.

It is nice that the story has had a seemingly happy ending though...
posted by spilon at 12:33 PM on May 21, 2004


mrgrimm, it's indeed a long time to live out there without being discovered, but four things: first, as karmaville says, Forest Park is an extremely wild place, off-trail; second, even if people had seen them, they probably didn't see their camp; third, even if people had seen their camp, that's no guarantee they'd tell anyone about it; and fourth, they indeed did go years without being discovered. So it must be possible!

To reiterate about the park. It's miles across and miles wide. It is riddled with miles and miles of trails, but there are plenty of areas that are heavily forested and trail-free. This is no average city park, with a swing and a slide. It's basically a wilderness preserve nestled up right against the back of the city.
posted by jeremy at 12:38 PM on May 21, 2004


The purpose of school today isn't education, it's socialization

Fuzz... I disagree!! I think school should be about education with a little bit o' socialization on the side!! The brunt of socialization should come from family and friends... otherwise why are schools part of an 'Education System'?

I want to raise my children w/ MY values... not the school's policies.

However, I can agree with what you're saying in terms of a school's inadvertent function... but I'll disagree that socialization is it's purpose.
posted by matty at 1:03 PM on May 21, 2004


A nice story all around, but one has to keep in mind that this is only newsworthy because it's warm and fuzzy and rare. The status quo in Portland are laws that make it illegal to *sit* on the sidewalk, or go in a park after dark or set up camp that are specifically designed and enforced to harass homeless people. The police often sweep out camps in one area to purposefully move homeless people to poorer, more dangerous neighborhoods. Dignity Village, a self-governing, semi-permanent homeless camp, has been pushed from site to site by the police and the businessman lobbies that motivate the po.

The good news is that, hopefully, the upcoming mayoral election will finally oust the Portland Business Alliance's grip on city hall for good. I expect good things will finally start happening in Portland again so long as that dickweed Francesconi gets his ass handed to him.
posted by Skwirl at 1:14 PM on May 21, 2004


This man did everything he could to protect his daughter and educate her.

Well, everything short of getting a job and send her to school, that is.

These stories always leave me with more questions then answers...
posted by chaz at 1:31 PM on May 21, 2004


If they must be assimilated, I hope they find an intentional community to join.

A child in the public school system is socialized, but in a most unnatural way. Roomed with people based more on age than ability, taught subjects mostly without context, and shuffled about from topic to topic with the purpose of checking it off. At the end of it all are kids who derive satisfaction from having their achievements recognized, and kids who are cynical but have learned to work within the system to get where they need to go. Rare is the child who enjoys learning for its own sake.

Learning should be individualized and/or in a multi-age setting interacting with older and younger mentors. Having one teacher in front of a class of 25, the final authority, sets up a person to act like a sheep. The public school system is flawed from the start.
posted by Feisty at 1:36 PM on May 21, 2004


If you were to tell a court that you had no house, but you did have a lovely vacant patch of land to raise your daughter on... they probably wouldn't accept that.

Assuming my daughter is clean, clothed, educated, and healthy, why should the courts even be involved?

As an additional point on this, I grew up in a small town in a rural area. Our town had running water and paved roads and electricity and all the usual modern conveniences except cable TV (we had regular broadcast TV, though, 3 channels of it, can we still call ourselves civilized, fuzz?). But there were people in the surrounding areas that lived completely off the grid. Their housing situation was generally better than what's described here, although in many cases the cabins and shacks were pretty rudimentary. Those people seemed to get by just fine.
posted by jacquilynne at 1:42 PM on May 21, 2004


Fuzz... I disagree!! I think school should be about education with a little bit o' socialization on the side!! The brunt of socialization should come from family and friends... otherwise why are schools part of an 'Education System'?

What if your family happens to be psychotic?
posted by Kwantsar at 2:05 PM on May 21, 2004


Well, everything short of getting a job and send her to school, that is.

Hmm, guess I better go back to work and stop homeschooling my kids, since being a working parent and stuffing your kid into the educational system is, apparently, the only way to properly protect and educate them.
posted by Dreama at 2:36 PM on May 21, 2004


> Father and 12 year old daughter camp undiscovered for four years in city park.

She stayed 12 for four years? And they laugh when I say I'm fixing to be 21 again for the thirtieth time.
posted by jfuller at 3:50 PM on May 21, 2004


Just imagine how smart and healthy they would be if they were never discovered. Now it's gain weight, cavities, mind rot TV and Internet -- whoo! Seriously, I lived in the out of doors for 5 weeks recently and I returned in better health and spirits then I have ever felt. There is something about the day to day survival, simplicity of the outdoors that is part of being human.

Also re: cavities, native people the world over don't get cavities. Not until they are exposed to civilized foods. As you can imagine this health aspect confers to not just teeth but bones, organs, etc.. the teeth are just the easiest to quickly gauge they are the barometer of overall health.
posted by stbalbach at 5:39 PM on May 21, 2004


Did anyone read My Side of the Mountain. Except here the kid has her father rather than a falcon for a companion.

Oh, and jacquilynne is right. Aside from living on public land without permission, what was this dad doing wrong? It sounds like he was better than average at parenting, just not so hot at getting work. A very non-traditional upbringing, but I think it is not the state's place to question that as long as she is being well cared for.
posted by caddis at 1:11 AM on May 22, 2004


Why can't Australian cross-country runners and their wives mind their own fucking business?
posted by Witty at 2:09 AM on May 22, 2004


"The amazing part of this was the fact that Sergeant Barkley really evaluated what was best for these people" - I get the impression, based on Barkley's approach, that he would have actually been inclined - as a human being - to ignore the whole situation and let the father and daughter continue to live their healthy woods-lifestyle. But somebody complained and so it became an official "issue" (requiring a policereport) and so Barkley, in his official capacity as a cop, had to do something.

Thank god he's a smart man or this could have ended in tragedy and - in most places - it likely would have.

"you really can't let somebody raise a kid in the woods like a dog" (matteo) - First of all, my dog lives indoors. Second - he has cavities.

I was with a group last night that included a family which had home-schooled their kids. The kids seemed, to me, about three to five years more behaviorally advanced than the public school norm.

They hadn't been living in the woods, so maybe they had cavities. I don't know. I didn't ask.


"...what exactly was "unacceptable" about their living conditions?" - "If you were to tell a court that you had no house, but you did have a lovely vacant patch of land to raise your daughter on... they probably wouldn't accept that." (Jart) That doesn't answer the question! It's just a restatement of the fact that the father and daughter violated societal norms.

"...Unfortunately, getting along with the right people, managing your appearance, and being able to follow arbitrary rules are necessary skills." (Fuzz)

1) Get along with "right" people.
2) Groom.
3) Follow abitrary rules.

Well, from the sounds of it, the father and daughter had #2 covered. As for #1, would violation of that prescription be grounds for the state to break up a healthy, functional family? - "Mr. ___ , I'm sorry but we have to take away your daughter and lock her away in a state building, as if she were violently and criminally insane, while attempting to place her with an adoptive family which - statistically - very likely may be abusive to her. We are forced to do this because you haven't been teaching her to get along with the right people."

As for #3 ("Follow abitrary rules")......

(Experimenter) "Turn the knob up ALL the way, I said. ALL the way."

(Distraught subject) "But they're starting to scream. I think these electric shocks are starting to hurt them."

(Experimenter) "TURN IT UP ALL THE WAY!"

(Subject) "OK."


The general consensus here - with a few notable exceptions - is that people cannot be allowed to live in the woods.

Given the way most home-raised humans look to me - fat, cranky and ill (plus lots of cavities) - I'd have to wonder about this prescription.

It's really ridiculously tautological - "Humans live in HOUSES, not woods. Anyone knows that. Therefore, anyway who violates this accepted norm will be seized by the state and treated like a criminal and - if they pass all of our background checks and are deemed to not be excessively deviant and, additionally, if they are lucky enough to encounter a human within the system who has a conscience - they will be forced to live in a mobile home.

Humans cannot be allowed to live too close to plants and trees.

It's unnatural.
posted by troutfishing at 6:28 AM on May 22, 2004


(Alien #1, to Alien #2) - "It's really quite horrible. They live in these cramped, polluted enclosed structures they call "houses", set apart from the known life-giving vibratory energies of all the other forms of biological life on their planet. This is so backward, it's almost unimaginable..."

(Alien #2, interrupting) - "Well, so what would recommend ? Don't mince words."

(Alien #1) - "I propose that we set them all free. They should be allowed to have their "Free Will" and all, yes, but only up to a point, and this is quite beyond the pale. It's unacceptable. They're suffering, and they don't even know it. "

(Alien #2) - Well - with some reservations - I'd have to concur.

Make it so."
posted by troutfishing at 6:41 AM on May 22, 2004


However, I can agree with what you're saying in terms of a school's inadvertent function... but I'll disagree that socialization is it's purpose.

The "History of Education" courses taught in the University of Alberta Department of Education would beg to disagree.
posted by five fresh fish at 9:59 AM on May 22, 2004


and wanting to pipe in that the kid may not have had a house, but she had one hell of a home. Every kid should be so lucky as that.
posted by five fresh fish at 3:07 PM on May 22, 2004


Followup, from the Willamette Week:

Last Monday afternoon, May 24, the two hit the road again, reportedly after expressing concerns about a deluge of publicity, the potential stigma for the girl, and news helicopters flying overhead. Last Thursday, May 27, a group of "hashers"--off-road runners--reported seeing them at their old camp, but an officer who went to the site the next day didn't find any sign of them.
posted by cmonkey at 10:13 AM on June 2, 2004


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