Comments on: Stand clear of the closing doors

Stand clear of the closing doors

grouse — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:23:53 -0800

Ever wonder what the London Underground Map [105 KiB PDF] would look like if it were geographically accurate [255 KiB GIF]? If you could morph [13.7 KiB Flash] between those two versions and Harry Beck's 1933 map [112 KiB JPG]? What it will look like in 2016 [218 KiB PDF]? What if you replaced all the stations, even ones that are no longer used, with well-known personalities [46 KiB JPG inset]? If you knew exactly which carriage to get on so you'd already be at the Way Out (never "exit" [23 MiB PDF]) when your train stops (or doesn't stop)? If you had a similar schematic for buses [245 KiB PDF] or river boats [50 KiB PDF]?

Pass your Oyster card over the reader and go on a tour of interesting, imaginative, and subversive maps and diagrams of London public transport. And as you leave, remember to Mind the Gap, Stand on the Right [671 KiB JPG], and Always Touch Out.

By: 327.ca

327.ca — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:28:59 -0800

Oh, god. I love this stuff!

By: shoepal

shoepal — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:33:58 -0800

too cool!

By: loquacious

loquacious — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:34:45 -0800

What an insanely great post. Thank you.

By: dmt

dmt — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:41:29 -0800

grouse you rule. This is brilliant stuff. The 2016 map is fascinating, I love the modification stickers but the geographically accurate map is simply wonderful. You've also just depressed the hell out of me for taking a job in Canary Wharf. Where the hell am I supposed to live?!? On preview, just reminded me a of a piss take doing the rounds a few years ago. 'Is he all there?' 'End of the Hammersmith n City, mate.'

By: carter

carter — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:47:02 -0800

This is great! That idea of route maps based on nodes rather than lines is pretty cool ...

By: sklero

sklero — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:49:24 -0800

whatta post!

By: devbrain

devbrain — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:50:30 -0800

Wow, and wow again. Neat stuff.

By: devbrain

devbrain — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:52:44 -0800

I wonder ... was this intentional?? "Proff checking is now in progress and hopefully everything should be ready in the next few weeks." (emphasis mine) (taken from http://www.simonclarke.org/lul/)

By: grouse

grouse — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:53:54 -0800

dmt: Well, after CrossRail is finished you'll have easy access to the Isle of Dogs from all over the place. Of course, I wouldn't hold my breath. For the Docklands, trains in South London [428 KiB PDF] are getting easier and more convenient to use. Of course, adding them in makes the map really hairy [146 KiB PDF] and much less elegant.

By: dirtynumbangelboy

dirtynumbangelboy — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 09:06:08 -0800

Dude. [this is not] just [good]; [this is fucking amazing]

By: blendor

blendor — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 09:14:35 -0800

ah, reviving metafilter with a single post. love the subversive link. love all of the links.

By: handee

handee — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 09:18:04 -0800

Great post. I have two of these maps framed on my living room wall.

By: louie

louie — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 09:21:39 -0800

Wow. Great old-skool post. [Emails to all the brits he knows.]

By: Ynoxas

Ynoxas — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 09:29:55 -0800

That system looks absolutely terrifying. Is it as hard to navigate as the maps imply? I fear I would never leave my flat if I lived in London.

By: ciderwoman

ciderwoman — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 09:42:00 -0800

Hah. 2016 and still Crouch End has no tube link. That'll teach those boho actor types. (well, it will teach them if they'd worked a bit harder they could have got a place in Primrose hill). And Ynoxas, the tube is easy. I think it's one of the better sign posted underground systems I've come across (bar a couple of stations like Kings Cross which is a confusing rat run). There are much more terrifying reasons for not leaving your flat in London than tube travel.

By: Matching Mole

Matching Mole — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 09:52:40 -0800

I'm opening with a preemptive Grundy Gambit in the second quadrant: Mornington Crescent! (Oh shit. This post just made me lose.)

By: seanyboy

seanyboy — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 09:57:20 -0800

They have an "overground" map pinned up in a large number of the pubs here. It's basically an underground style aid to pub crawling. (For example, the Green Line will include the stops "Hughes", "The Ring 'o bells" and the "3 Pigeons" I'd post a picture, but rather annoyingly can't find one.

By: grouse

grouse — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 09:57:20 -0800

Ynoxas: I actually think it is really, really easy. That's why people love the Tube Map [108 KiB PDF] so much--it makes a really complicated system very simple. I bet, looking at that map, you can easily tell me how to get from Heathrow Terminals 1, 2, 3 (bottom left of the map) to Westminster (very center of the map, right next to the river). The free pocket versions of the maps have grids and indexes as well. There are general maps on the wall all over every station, strip maps on the trains, and special strip maps at each station that show only the stations reachable from a particular platform. All organized according to a rigorous set of design standards. I was able to figure out where I was going on the first day here with no trouble whatsoever. Where the system breaks down is the fact that it is non-geographic. Look at that same map and tell me how to get from St. Paul's (on the Central (Red) Line to Mansion House (on the District/Circle (Green/Yellow) Lines). The easy thing seems to be to take the Central Line east to Bank, and then the District back from there. That will take you about 25 minutes. It's only a seven minute walk though [PDF], according to the Journey Planner.

By: grouse

grouse — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 10:00:30 -0800

seanyboy: We have something like that here in Cambridge too.

By: QuietDesperation

QuietDesperation — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 10:21:02 -0800

Wonderful post. One thing: as a Yank, I never quite got the "Way Out" business. Isn't "Exit" considered an English word nowadays?

By: The Salaryman

The Salaryman — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 10:27:28 -0800

This is a truly superb post. However, non-London living people should not feel too jealous. For some reason, the ticketing systems, Jubilee Line stations and LUL website are state-of-the-art – yet the rest of the network is usually less punctual than it was in 1920 due to the 'British disease' of under-investment. It is painfully unreliable, especially at rush hour – even on the newer lines you find yourself inexplicably stuck in a tunnel or your train judders uncomfortably between two speeds: slow and stop. Big chunks of the city are served by 'overground' train lines that come at odd 20-40 minute intervals and are generally even worse. Crossrail should have been built 25 years ago. The East London Line (a relatively straightforward conversion of mainline rail to light rail) should have been done by 1990. The Tube is iconic, sometimes romantic, but is a truly awful – stuck together with chewing gum and plywood old transport system that will get much more expensive but not much better in the next decade. Most Londoners would give their eye teeth to swap it for the plain, useful NYC system. Or even the Budapest one...

By: Razzle Bathbone

Razzle Bathbone — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 10:31:01 -0800

Great post. I love Tube maps. I have about 4 or 5 different ones as desktops on my computer. A nice scan of Mr. Becks original. But two of my favourites: one is a geographically-accurate map superimposed over a satellite image, and another with all the station names in German, which I have no idea where I found it. It is like it is out of a Alternative History novel or something, I love it.

By: grouse

grouse — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 10:36:37 -0800

Salaryman: the East London Line Extension will not be light rail. In fact when the extension is done, the whole line will run on rolling stock much more similar to National Rail surface trains than to the current tube stock.

By: Orange Goblin

Orange Goblin — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 10:51:31 -0800

Great post, but I just thought I'd point out I've posted one of the links before. Now if only they'd build a station where I live...

By: Ynoxas

Ynoxas — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:06:19 -0800

Ciderwoman and Grouse: I think maybe it looks different at "eye level". The complexity just took me somewhat by surprise when I saw the map, and the enormity of it made it baffling in the abstract. Note also I am an American from the South... so my experience with tubes has been limited to the Washington DC Metro... which seemed rather serviceable to me, and to my untrained eye looks several orders of magnitude less... intimidating.

By: amberglow

amberglow — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:13:09 -0800

great stuff--what's weird tho, is that there'll still be big gaps in areas covered even in 2016--why nothing along the south thames in the west? (like kingston, putney, clapham, vauxhall to waterloo, etc)? or along the other bank? (like heathrow, gunnersbury, parsons green, imperial wharf, pimlico to westminster, etc)? Why does the east get most of the new lines?

By: matteo

matteo — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:41:35 -0800

this is post is so good I'm almost peeing myself -- I can't wait to check all the links!

By: grouse

grouse — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:42:47 -0800

amberglow: Well mainly cause Sarf London always gets the shaft. But also because there is already a fairly extensive rail network [PDF again] in the south. Although 4 trains per hour from Kingston hardly compares to the usual Tube standards (I think the trains come every 90 seconds on the Piccadilly line in peak hours), multimodal transportation is much easier here than in NYC. A MetroCard won't let you take the Metro-North Railroad to the Bronx, but a Travelcard here is good on all modes of transportation. I don't think people in the west north of the river have a lot to complain about. The east gets a lot of new lines because that's all the new development is, especially the Docklands (including Canary Wharf) which is an ever-growing commercial center.

By: 27

27 — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:50:26 -0800

Top-quality post, grouse. I'll be revisiting all the links later when time permits. Ynoxas: Just visited London for the first time in November. I'd heard tales of frustration surrounding the Underground from other people who'd visited, but I didn't find it that daunting. But it is a vast system, and very crowded at rush hour.

By: teleskiving

teleskiving — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 11:59:44 -0800

Outstanding post! The tube map with walklines seems potentially useful, I'll try it out next time I'm visiting London.

By: fet

fet — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 12:08:05 -0800

Ynoxas -- the biggest difference between DC's system (where I grew up) and systems like London, New York, Paris, and others is sheer station density. It's hard to go 3-4 blocks in Manhattan and not hit a train entrance. The distance between say, Friendship Heights and Bethesda in DC is quite further.. (and yeah, great post.) For New York transit nerds, HopStop is useful as well -- shows combinations of bus/train required to get from destination to destination within the city. Good stuff. Loves me some mass transit.

By: armoured-ant

armoured-ant — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 12:13:31 -0800

Don't forget the sort of unfinished Tube Map in 3D, grouse.

By: The Salaryman

The Salaryman — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 12:22:59 -0800

Sorry for my ignorance about the true nature of the ELL, grouse and thanks again for such a great post! One question I still have is if the ELL is as as ludicrously simple an engineering project compared to most of the other rail related stuff (Thameslink 2000, CrossRail, Jubilee Line etc) as an LUL-affiliated person in the know once told me, why is it taking so long and been broken into 2 phases even after the scope of the project was reduced? As someone about to move Sarf, yes I am bitter it has been neglected Tube wise. In terms of network priorities I still think you need to have fewer phantom 'signal failures' gumming things up before you put in bleeding edge PAYG fare cards.

By: absalom

absalom — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 12:28:57 -0800

wow! the winner is you!

By: grouse

grouse — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 12:44:58 -0800

armoured-ant: I've seen that but didn't think of putting it in, it's fantastic! :) Salaryman: It was mainly just a technical nit--as you say the ELLX does not compare to CrossRail. CrossRail would be the biggest project ever completed in the United Kingdom (uh oh, that's what they said about the Big Dig). It involves a massive tunnel through a densely utilized area, and tons of new and enormous stations. Remember it is a mainline project, so everything will be on a scale much bigger than the typical Tube stuff. Thameslink ~~2000~~3000, if it ever happens, will require rebuilding some highly used mainline stations, and some junction work. The ELLX will just require some connections and new stations, so it doesn't compare to anything that requires new tunnel or even the major reconstructions of Thameslink 2000. Sadly, updating the signals to a modern standard is MUCH harder than deploying even a complex whiz-bang fare system like Oyster. Since signals are a safety-critical system, they have to really make sure things go right. And if there is any kind of fault, you get stopped trains along a whole line until things get figured out or fixed. A single broken barrier can be taken out of service without screwing up anything else. Some lines will have their signals upgraded over the next 10-15 years. *groan*

By: jokeefe

jokeefe — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:06:34 -0800

Now that's what I call a front page post. Looks like I'm going to be lost in the Underground for the next while. Thank you.

By: Chunder

Chunder — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:09:02 -0800

Awesome post, grouse - especially as it's your first! Have you been composing it since you joined up? :-) I love stuff like this; the difference between the stylised diagram and the geographical map is incredible, and the thought of hidden, officially abandoned stations (that may still be used secretly gives) me a nice little shiver!

By: grouse

grouse — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:15:42 -0800

Chunder: Thanks! And thanks to everyone else who had kind words, as well. I came across the morph Flash today which was the impetus for the whole post. I didn't post earlier because I wanted to wait until I had something good.

By: The Salaryman

The Salaryman — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:22:53 -0800

Thanks for the info, Grouse! If its not to selfish of me to ask - do you know why the ELLX is taking so long and was scaled back? I know there was a legal case over a listed viaduct that delayed it, but other than that, is it the same old money/planning/procuring/poor project management stuff? Or is that an unfair assumption on my part? I have longed looked at the tube map and have fastasised about putting coloured lines on the 'blank' bits...

By: grouse

grouse — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:34:56 -0800

...do you know why the ELLX is taking so long and was scaled back?... is it the same old money/planning/procuring/poor project management stuff? You've got it. Lots of other news links on the Always Touch Out page on the ELLX.

By: carter

carter — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:35:41 -0800

Excellent follow-up links, too; loved the 'design standards' pdfs. Mmm, New Johnston ...

By: paperpete

paperpete — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:50:30 -0800

Before I set off to live in London, I looked at the tube map and reacted with Ynoxas' quivery-lipped concern. My dad had regular meetings there, so I asked him to explain it, and he said: "Well, they're all northbound or southbound, except the District and Circle which is eastbound or westbound. Actually, so is the Central, and bits of the Piccadilly, but you'll figure it out. And change lines at the circles. And if a line crosses over into another one on the map, then whatever line you're on with the same colour, you can get off at that station." It all became crystal-clear within 30 minutes of actually boarding the tube. So don't worry, Ynoxas. And make sure you visit before all vestiges of the Tube's elderly nature are soullessly stripped away! When I lived in London, you used to be able to glimpse older, dark, disused stations from the present-day platforms and nobody gave a damn. But for me, it was like... well, I guess like it would be to live in New York and glimpse City Hall station every day. I really loved Mornington Crescent (the superbly restored station (from this equally superb site)) for that reason - and being jostled along inside Covent Garden on a Saturday afternoon has a lot of hurried, old world charm. I sometimes think. ;o) Oh, and while surfing a little further down memory lane, I came across this - the results of the 2003 Camden Town derailment. Scary stuff.

By: paperpete

paperpete — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 13:52:03 -0800

And ps. Thanks so much, grouse. Newly resolved to live in London again... some day.

By: floanna

floanna — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 14:15:54 -0800

er hum this should have been my post considering I work for LU and work directly with Oyster card (now shuffles to the nearest dark corner to wait for all the tube and Oyster bashing). Good post tho and now have some extra handy links to dish out to our customers :D

By: indiebass

indiebass — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 14:20:28 -0800

Wow. This is the best. Post. Ever. THIS is why i love Metafilter and all MeFites. MUCH LOVE, y'all!

By: Mr Bismarck

Mr Bismarck — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 14:40:42 -0800

I live just outside London, so get the thrill of being a semi-regular user of the LU and always really enjoy it. Even last week when signal problems took every other train out of the Victoria line between Oxford Circus and Kings Cross. People were defying the laws of physics to get onto the trains that day and I felt quite violated when I got off at the Cross. Great fun.

By: influx

influx — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 14:59:46 -0800

work directly with Oyster card My Oyster card stopped working in the rush hour at Victoria today, mere hours after buying a week's pass, and the 'helpful' LUL numpty at the gates just told me to buy a ticket. Oyster = the second worst idea LT/TfL has ever had (the first being the accursed bendy buses). Why does the east get most of the new lines? o_O Try asking that of the residents of Hackney.

By: influx

influx — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 15:04:04 -0800

Also, 'Stratford International for the Olympics' is immensely amusing.

By: dmt

dmt — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 15:43:18 -0800

I work for LU and work directly with Oyster car Fi, fi, fo, fum! I smell the blood of, er, a management consultant!

By: floanna

floanna — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 16:10:21 -0800

Oyster = the second worst idea LT/TfL has ever had Influx, I will agree to disagree with you on that one ;) I've personally never had a problem with my Oyster in the two years I've had it. Don't forget that magnetic tickets are/were still prone to failing (about 4 times more) and everyone seems to forget that as soon as something new is introduced.

By: floanna

floanna — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 16:13:18 -0800

Fi, fi, fo, fum! I smell the blood of, er, a management consultant! ha ha not quite, just a lowly minion.

By: jokeefe

jokeefe — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 16:41:39 -0800

I didn't post earlier because I wanted to wait until I had something good. posted by grouse at 1:15 PM PST on March 7 Those words should be emblazoned on the new users signup page as an example to all who enter there.

By: polaroid

polaroid — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 16:42:56 -0800

Nice post grouse. A few links in there I've not seen before, and will be sure to revisit. There is probably some arcane rule about not self-posting on a first post (if at all), but I'll throw caution to the wind. A while ago I overlaid the geographically accurate map on a NASA satellite image and came up with this.

By: herting

herting — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 17:11:18 -0800

I'm an American who moved by himself to London about 5 months ago, was shocked by the ease to get from Gatwick Airport to Wood Green station with no prior planning or preparation. It is just when you come back to the surface that you realise that this city is not as simple or convenient as that map would have you believe. I emerged from the Underground carrying four big bags and knowing the basic direction of where it was I was supposed to go to find my house. Not knowing how inaccurate the Underground map is in regard to actual world placement let me believe that I could manage the trek using that map as a guide of where to go. Needless to say, I spent the next 3 hours walking in concentric circles as my hands evolved from relatively capable of delicate gestures, to blistered talons, to bloodied ropes that refused to let go of my bags when I finally collapsed in the car park of my housing. Really, I can only blame myself. I assumed that accuracy in topography would not be sacrificed for convenience; but those lines should have struck me as having been too straight to have captured reality within them. ___ BTB: an additional "thank you" to the submitter, I had been at a loss of subject matter for a composition I am to have completed by tomorrow, but it is clear to me now that I should write about the Underground. ___ If any readers think they know something particularly remarkable about the Underground that I should know for a non-fiction work on the Underground that I am about to begin, my email is: herting@gmail.com

By: dhruva

dhruva — Mon, 07 Mar 2005 21:20:07 -0800

Fantastic post, grouse! (that should take care of Stavros's blue ennui)

By: acb

acb — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 04:49:07 -0800

Apparently the reason that London's public transport has so many woes is due to it having been the first system of its kind, and having made the mistakes that everybody else learned from (i.e., making the tunnels small, having only one tunnel in each direction (which necessitates the Tube stopping for maintenance overnight; by contrast, New York has doubled tunnels, allowing for 24-hour service)).

By: quiet

quiet — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 06:40:03 -0800

The London Underground Song. Grab it from a random one of these to keep them alive longer: 1 2 3 4. (originally from http://www.backingblair.co.uk/london_underground/)

By: suleikacasilda

suleikacasilda — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 08:36:15 -0800

Grouse, (what a great post!), how did you get to that pdf tube local area map? I pick up the paper versions of these maps wherever I go, but I just can't find them off the main website. Where is my tfl-fu?

By: grouse

grouse — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 08:59:18 -0800

suleikacasilda: There are links to them from Journey Planner routes. I don't know any other way to get to them, other than guessing the URL. Which isn't usually that difficult.

By: SisterHavana

SisterHavana — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 09:12:07 -0800

Great post. I especially liked the Disused Stations link...I love that stuff for some reason. Man, I want to go back to London!

By: riviera

riviera — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 09:13:40 -0800

Try asking that of the residents of Hackney. Oh yeah. Sticking 'too bloody far from nearest Tube' on ads is always fun. Worth mentioning that the bus is less scary for visitors and newcomers since the Tube-ified the route maps appeared. Less chance of getting the wrong bus, or missing your stop and ending up in Dalston. One thing: a lot of the new lines are actually planned for trams, not underground trains. Whether that happens...

By: rxreed

rxreed — Tue, 08 Mar 2005 19:30:26 -0800

applauds. thanks grouse.

By: essexjan

essexjan — Wed, 09 Mar 2005 03:09:50 -0800

Also, 'Stratford International for the Olympics' is immensely amusing. I travel through Stratford every day to pick up the DLR (great service, btw). A couple of weeks ago, I got off the Central Line in Stratford at 6.45am and thought I'd stumbled into a parallel universe. There were hanging baskets and floral displays everywhere, the waiting rooms weren't padlocked, there were no Stella Artois cans or KFC boxes lying around, the staff were all in uniform with smiles on their faces ... Then I remembered - that was the day the Olympic bods were visiting for the 2012 London bid. The following day it was back to its normal filthy state, nowhere to sit, litter everywhere, junkies harassing people for their used travelcards, no staff around ...

By: banjo_and_the_pork

banjo_and_the_pork — Wed, 09 Mar 2005 06:03:54 -0800

This is a great post! The site about abandoned stations will keep me busy for hours.

By: amberglow

amberglow — Wed, 09 Mar 2005 14:40:52 -0800

now, will they be beefing up the nightbuses, hopefully? (especially with 24hour bar hours or whatever it is?)