November 15, 2000
9:58 AM Subscribe
The Christian Declaration on Marriage claims that "homosexual acts are 'intrinsically disordered'". Um, what...? Sounds like Martha Stewart pontificating on a shop window display.
Catholics also teach that masturbation is wrong. Why aren't they trying to pass legislation in that realm? I'd say it's silly to take seriously people who believe in talking snakes and giants, but there's just so many of them.
posted by Doug at 10:26 AM on November 15, 2000
posted by Doug at 10:26 AM on November 15, 2000
Catholics don't like fast food either.Thanks, YAWL.I don't care what people do in their own bedrooms as long as it is consensual and doesn't involve children or animals. Anyone that thinks otherwise needs to mind their own damn buisness.
posted by Mr. skullhead at 10:45 AM on November 15, 2000
posted by Mr. skullhead at 10:45 AM on November 15, 2000
::yawn::
Was there ever a chance they would do anything BUT "reject same-sex marriage"?
Give it another ten years, I think.
-Mars
posted by Mars Saxman at 10:54 AM on November 15, 2000
Was there ever a chance they would do anything BUT "reject same-sex marriage"?
Give it another ten years, I think.
-Mars
posted by Mars Saxman at 10:54 AM on November 15, 2000
The catholics will come around.
Gay couples are usually two-earner families, and on average make more money than heterosexual couples, so they have a lot to offer for the collection plate.
And to paraphrase George Carlin, being in a gay couple means you will never have an abortion, so how could the chruch possibly ignore them forever?
posted by mathowie at 11:06 AM on November 15, 2000
Gay couples are usually two-earner families, and on average make more money than heterosexual couples, so they have a lot to offer for the collection plate.
And to paraphrase George Carlin, being in a gay couple means you will never have an abortion, so how could the chruch possibly ignore them forever?
posted by mathowie at 11:06 AM on November 15, 2000
I don't see any problem with religious groups declaring that they think marriage can only be between a man and a woman. The problem is when the government gets involved and endorses what is mostly a religious idea.
Now, that said, there are a variety of legal rights RE property, estate, taxes, insurance, children that married couples have by law. I say get the government out of "marriage," and replace it with a "civil union" available to any two individuals (who aren't related...) that provides all the same tax, estate, property, insurance, and child-related rights that married couples have.
When a man and a woman decide to get married, they can go to the courthouse and get a civil union as well. That's pretty much how it works now, only the government says you can't bestow tax-free inheritance rights to someone of the same sex as you, etc. etc.
posted by daveadams at 11:11 AM on November 15, 2000
Now, that said, there are a variety of legal rights RE property, estate, taxes, insurance, children that married couples have by law. I say get the government out of "marriage," and replace it with a "civil union" available to any two individuals (who aren't related...) that provides all the same tax, estate, property, insurance, and child-related rights that married couples have.
When a man and a woman decide to get married, they can go to the courthouse and get a civil union as well. That's pretty much how it works now, only the government says you can't bestow tax-free inheritance rights to someone of the same sex as you, etc. etc.
posted by daveadams at 11:11 AM on November 15, 2000
Oh, and the "homosexual acts are 'intrinsically disordered'" bit is from the Catholic Catechism, not this more-ecumenical Declaration on Marriage.
posted by daveadams at 11:12 AM on November 15, 2000
posted by daveadams at 11:12 AM on November 15, 2000
the catholics will come around AFTER they decide that every sperm isn't actually sacred. That decision basically opens up the congregation to premarital sex and masturbation and a whole bunch of other decidedly "non-catholic" activities.
It also begins to shifts their anti-abortion stance into a grey area. Since every sperm (and egg, but we all know how often females get mentioned in Catholic literature. One thing that is changing, finally) is the possiblity of a life, and therefore sacred, abortion is just an even better chance at a life.
I suppose they could switch to every inseminated egg is sacred easily enough, but a whole bunch of dogma sits on the fact that sperm = potential life = sacred.
To expect them to change that is to expect the church to radically change one of the major tenants of their religion. Sure, it can happen and something similar has happened in the past, but I can't see it happening in the next decade, it's just too fundamental a tenant for too many aspects of Catholocism.
If you talk with most Catholic priests, they'll take a "Hate the sin love the sinner" stance, and they'll probably wish the 2 men or 2 women the best, privately at keast. As a priest though, they'll also warn the 2 people that what they're doing is considered a sin according to their religion.
Priests are much more aware of differing world views, and often willing to discuss different religions and philosophies then a lot of people realize. It's like Microsoft. Great programmers, shitty company. Great priests, shitty religion.
(note: there are a lot of things about catholicism I admire, and if you're a catholic I probably respect you more than you think, but the organization's world view pisses me off. Much like Microsoft's! :-)
posted by cCranium at 1:54 PM on November 15, 2000
It also begins to shifts their anti-abortion stance into a grey area. Since every sperm (and egg, but we all know how often females get mentioned in Catholic literature. One thing that is changing, finally) is the possiblity of a life, and therefore sacred, abortion is just an even better chance at a life.
I suppose they could switch to every inseminated egg is sacred easily enough, but a whole bunch of dogma sits on the fact that sperm = potential life = sacred.
To expect them to change that is to expect the church to radically change one of the major tenants of their religion. Sure, it can happen and something similar has happened in the past, but I can't see it happening in the next decade, it's just too fundamental a tenant for too many aspects of Catholocism.
If you talk with most Catholic priests, they'll take a "Hate the sin love the sinner" stance, and they'll probably wish the 2 men or 2 women the best, privately at keast. As a priest though, they'll also warn the 2 people that what they're doing is considered a sin according to their religion.
Priests are much more aware of differing world views, and often willing to discuss different religions and philosophies then a lot of people realize. It's like Microsoft. Great programmers, shitty company. Great priests, shitty religion.
(note: there are a lot of things about catholicism I admire, and if you're a catholic I probably respect you more than you think, but the organization's world view pisses me off. Much like Microsoft's! :-)
posted by cCranium at 1:54 PM on November 15, 2000
Gay couples are usually two-earner families, and on average make more money than heterosexual couples, so they have a lot to offer for the collection plate.
But they can't offer up the one thing that the Church values even more than money:
Babies. The church needs babies. Lots and lots of babies. It hungers for babies. Babies are its lifeblood. It needs babies. It can't live without babies. Yep, that's right, babies.
posted by lagado at 3:05 PM on November 15, 2000
But they can't offer up the one thing that the Church values even more than money:
Babies. The church needs babies. Lots and lots of babies. It hungers for babies. Babies are its lifeblood. It needs babies. It can't live without babies. Yep, that's right, babies.
posted by lagado at 3:05 PM on November 15, 2000
I think you missed the point, Brad. Don't you see? It's about babies!
posted by daveadams at 6:54 AM on November 16, 2000
posted by daveadams at 6:54 AM on November 16, 2000
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posted by dcodea at 10:21 AM on November 15, 2000