Lawyer turned Suicide Girl

October 17, 2005 3:17 AM

RealSuicideGirl. Probably one of the few members that has her visage at the center of an art exhibit. Taking the 'fashion goth' to heightened levels of realism.
posted by gsb (29 comments total)

um. whoa.
posted by blacklite at 4:43 AM on October 17, 2005

It's good that these personal stories come out - as happened with the suicide bombers on the London tube, one of whom was a primary school assistant.

Personalising the atrocities shows the vapidness of the extreme positions people can take on what's happening in the Middle East - "All Palestinians are terrorists and all terrorists are irredeemably evil" vs. "They're just innocent automatons provoked into it by the IDF".

Seeing terrorists as pantomime villains (Limbaugh) or as tools of mute historical forces (Galloway) denies them their humanity and their free will. Without recognising the free will of the participants in an evil act, you can neither properly condemn it, nor try to find whatever logic underlies it.

In this respect, these sorts of stories are like the stories of Dahmer, Sutcliffe or Hitler's willing executioners. They make us ask 'How could they?', but also think 'and what can we do to stop it?'.

Thanks for the link, gsb.
posted by athenian at 5:16 AM on October 17, 2005

I'm so confused. I mean, the suicidegirls account seems more than a little tasteless, and the fpp makes it seem like she really had an sg account or something.

I mean, you get that someone with either:

a) a sick sense of humor
or
b) no sense of humor at all

posted that account to sg, right?

either way, her story and the story about the art exhibit is fascinating. I just can't figure out where this fpp is taking it.
posted by shmegegge at 5:24 AM on October 17, 2005

I'm with you, shmegegge. Maybe I just need more coffee, but I can't tell if the SG profile is legit or a put-on. I'm leaning toward the latter.

Wasn't the art exhibit story posted here previously? I remember reading it somewhere, although I suppose I could have come across it elsewhere.
posted by mkhall at 5:27 AM on October 17, 2005

double-you tee eff for the first link, and a massive MEH to the rest.

Maybe i dont geddit.
posted by lemonfridge at 5:37 AM on October 17, 2005

Blowing herself up in a restaurant killing civilians (including children) *really* helped to even things out!

I'm against the Israeli assassinations, just like I'm against so-called "preemptive" wars, but this sort of shit is just sad.

The SG profile does seem pretty over the top, but then I have a feeling that this is one that a lot of people are going to remember. It's not every day that you see cheerleading for terrorism like that.
posted by clevershark at 5:58 AM on October 17, 2005

I didn't look at anything past the first link (so I only noticed just now that it's a link to Momus' journal -- I am sure he'd be amused that you're using his words to define fashion goth) but I thought it was pretty clear. I am quite sure that the SG account was created after the fact. The Wikipedia page on Ms Jaradat links to the SG account, pointing out that it's 'culture jamming', or subverting media to comment upon the media itself. It's slamming SuicideGirls -- and the Western world -- and we, the complacent fools on the internets.

MAKES ME SAD: Israeli colonial aggression. Your imperialist government. Your lying media. Your passivity. The need for sacrifice.

FANTASY: For you to understand.

Sure, it's a little blunt, but you can't really discuss things like this without bluntness. The woman blew herself up.

.
posted by blacklite at 5:58 AM on October 17, 2005

well, I thought it was pretty awesome but REALLY angry. don't know if it's a fake or not, but that doesn't really matter.

strikes me that the creator of the "real suicide girl" was more interested in a (uh-oh) meta-statement. but a pretty, puritanical one... seems like the insertion (intentional use of this word) of a violent tale of politically motivated martydom in the midst of a wank site seems pretty pointed. kind of like saying "you decadent western gals with your body mods and rubber halters have NO idea of what self sacrifice means. our fearless palestinian sistah's however know what it means. your western postures of decadence are self evident when compared to our righteous anger"... to put words into some strangers mouth.

I coud be totally wrong but I think it's kind of funny and kind of disturbing, but more so because of the puritanical anger behind the whole thing.
posted by saketini99 at 5:58 AM on October 17, 2005

I agree that "suicide" should not be a fashion statement. I've never liked SG for that reason. The name reeks of girls who cut for attention because they're not pretty. Everyone has problems, but when you compare your problems with someone whose family has been torn apart (quite literally, in the end).

It's a damn shame that these people are being turned against each other when they have more in common with each other than they do with anyone living in Upper Manhattan.
posted by Eideteker at 6:15 AM on October 17, 2005

Eideteker writes "Everyone has problems, but when you compare your problems with someone whose family has been torn apart (quite literally, in the end)."

True. Then again this is also true of every single family who was torn apart (quite literally, in the end) by this woman's act of so-called "martyrdom". Blowing yourself up in a restaurant has that niggling little side-effect.

What do you think an Israeli is going to think when he buries his kid who was blown up in this incident... is he more likely to think "gee, we really ought to understand their plight more" or is he more likely to think "the problem is that we just don't kill enough of them"?

I'm not saying it's right, but I am saying that it's going to happen. And thus the beat goes on, and that's certainly one of the reasons that there's never going to be much of a peace in the whole Israel-Palestine area.
posted by clevershark at 6:20 AM on October 17, 2005

Is this safe for work? Because I'm at work right now...
posted by delmoi at 6:45 AM on October 17, 2005

Assuming you're addressing me (which is oftentimes the start of problems on this site as well as in the world), clevershark, let's just say that I agree with you 100%.

The reality of suicide is not as beautiful as the version we've been sold. But neither is it as glamorous as the version any suicide bomber has heard. It's just a different delusion, and I think the fake SG page shows that better than it intended. The glory needs to be taken out of homicide, whether it be for god, country, or anything but the most immediate self-defence.
posted by Eideteker at 6:49 AM on October 17, 2005

What do you think an Israeli is going to think when he buries his kid who was blown up in this incident... is he more likely to think "gee, we really ought to understand their plight more" or is he more likely to think "the problem is that we just don't kill enough of them"?

Obviously the latter, but we're not asking the people in general or bereaved relatives to make the first steps to peace, we're asking their political leaders to lead.

Political leaders can't listen only to those bereaved relatives. They will be angry, they will be sympathetic, of course. But if they let that anger and sympathy dictate their entire agenda, and don't let thought and strategy and a desire for peace come in alongside, then you're right, no-one will get anywhere.
posted by athenian at 7:20 AM on October 17, 2005

The glory needs to be taken out of homicide, whether it be for god, country, or anything but the most immediate self-defence

Indeed, but that's not what the fake SuicideGirl's page is all about. Not when it links to a page paying tribute to "Palestinian Women Martyrs against the israeli Occupation", who have "made the ultimate sacrifice for the freedom and the independence of the Palestinian people".
posted by Len at 7:24 AM on October 17, 2005

I think what people are missing here is that suicidal palestinians aren't doing this because they're bored and don't want to go to the mall today, they're doing it because they have been beaten up, abused, murdered, raped, dislocated, seen innocent relatives killed in front of their eyes, taken away to prison for years on trumped up charges and yet tried to 'work within the system' without success.
After all hope is removed, there is no hope. When life is not worth living because a group of people are denying another group of people the dignity and ability to live their lives peacefully and without harassment I can see how taking one's own life would seem to be a logical choice. Especially if it somehow punishes 'the system' that caused this problem to occur in the first place.
In the U.S. the population there is widely regarded as the most callous and uncaring on the planet due to it's desire to focus on consumerism rather than 'problems beyond our shores' that are caused because of consumerism and capitalism (third world sweatshops, onerous loans from the world bank to 'stabilize economies' while robbing them blind.
While those in the first world continue to ignore the problems of the third world suicide bombing will continue to seem to be a viable alternative to a thankless, oppresive existence.
posted by mk1gti at 7:33 AM on October 17, 2005

seen innocent relatives killed in front of their eyes

I'm not sure whether you were talking in general, or in reference to this particular case. But according to the link, the brother and cousin killed were not "innocent".
They may not have deserved death, and the killing of them may have been counter-productive, but they were part of an organization that used violent means against Israel.

If you're talking in general, then yes I agree. Indiscriminate violence has a way of killing indiscriminately.
posted by forforf at 7:45 AM on October 17, 2005

forfor - inoccence is subjective.
posted by iamck at 7:54 AM on October 17, 2005

mk1gti, you're saying that suicide bombing is a kind of escape for the vanquished, and I'd in part agree. There's some good music on the topic:

Micah: Yet, ere we give the reins to grief, say first
How died he? Death to life is crown, or shame.

Messenger: Unwounded of his enemies he fell,
At once he did destroy, and was destroy'd;
The edifice, where all were met to see,
Upon their heads, and on his own he pull'd!

Manoah: Oh, lastly overstrong against thyself!
A dreadful way thou took'st to thy revenge:
Glorious, yet dearly bought!

(Handel, Samson).
posted by athenian at 7:54 AM on October 17, 2005

iamck
I was talking in general, not about the specific case, which I agree they were not 'innocent'.

A little bit of background about me; I've got Israeli friends I still keep in contact with 'over there' who are both liberal and conservative. Both sides widely agree that the policy that's been instigated since the birth of Israel of 'punish, punish, punish, humiliate, humiliate, humiliate, destroy, destroy, destroy.' does nothing but cause 'blowback' and has been completly unsuccessful in solving 'the problem'.
Until Sharon, Netenyahu and the other Likudniks are no longer allowed an influence over Israel's destiny these things will continue to occur and innocent Israelis and innocent Palestinians will continue to suffer.
Sharon, by the way, has been involved personally in the slaughter of Palestinians since the birth of Israel. Someone who should have been imprisoned for 'war crimes' many, many years ago.
posted by mk1gti at 9:21 AM on October 17, 2005

mk1gti writes "I think what people are missing here is that suicidal palestinians aren't doing this because they're bored and don't want to go to the mall today"

You know, I don't think I've ever heard or seen anyone make that case with a straight face. I for one have always been sure that someone who blows him/herself up hasn't done so on a whim.
posted by clevershark at 9:39 AM on October 17, 2005

mk1gti writes "Until Sharon, Netenyahu and the other Likudniks are no longer allowed an influence over Israel's destiny these things will continue to occur and innocent Israelis and innocent Palestinians will continue to suffer. "

Yes, but then as long as people like Hanadi Jaradat will strap on explosives and walk into crowded restaurants there's zero chance that the Likudniks' influence will be *diminished*, now, is there.

And the beat goes on... in a situation like this where both sides are convinced that they are fighting for the very survival of their people this sort of back-and-forth can go on for a long, long time.
posted by clevershark at 9:43 AM on October 17, 2005

(clicks SG profile link)

Maybe if she had more than one friend or if others had posted comments in her blog things wouldn't need to have taken so drastic a turn.
posted by Peter H at 10:05 AM on October 17, 2005

I agree with shmegegge. This joke is in bad taste.
posted by mr_roboto at 12:23 PM on October 17, 2005

clevershark
As you said, 'he said, she said', over and over again until somone or some group figures a way out of it once and for all . . . Here's hoping sooner than later.
posted by mk1gti at 12:26 PM on October 17, 2005

The suicide girls website was written by Mika Minio-Paluello, who google says is a Cambridge activist whose wife is currently beind held by Israel for filming a protest. So this site isn't a joke, but a thought-provoking political statement about suicide, humanity, and the nature of evil.

According to the artist mentioned in the second link, the installation using the bomber's image was not meant to be anti-Semitic or pro-violence, but was made to "call attention to how weak people left alone can be capable of horrible things.".

Political activism, as well as art, is meant to allow people to view things from a new perspective. To quote Picasso: "Art is the lie that helps us understand the truth."
posted by sacrilicious at 3:54 PM on October 17, 2005

clevershark: The Palestinian terrorism coupled with the Palestinians' understanding of how to bring attention to their plight has been effective. The Palestinians have provoked the Israelis into retaliation that is seen by many people as being out of proportion to the things done to them.

Outside of the US, Israel is coming to be seen as a pariah state. Israel is seen as being like Apartheid era South Africa. People are aware that during the 90s Israel moved hundreds of thousands of people into the West Bank whilst saying they did not want to take any more land. People are aware of the path that the wall makes through the West Bank that disregards the UN resolutions on the return of land gained in the 1967 war. When Europeans are asked what countries are the greatest threat to world peace Isreal tops the list.

In many peoples' eyes the only thing that keeps Israel from being treated is the influence of Israel in Washington.

The post is interesting though. A simultaneous comment on Suicide Girls and the real face of people who carry out violent acts.
posted by sien at 4:06 PM on October 17, 2005

RealSuicideGirl has no upcoming calendar events.

Ah. Just checking.

Wait till Pretty Hate Machine gets hold of this one.
posted by dhartung at 4:13 PM on October 17, 2005

While I can certainly empathize with her situation and having seen two people close to her murdered for no reason. But I just can't wrap my head around the middle step between that and going and blowing yourself up in a crowded building as some form of payback.

It seems to me that she could have done so much more by staying alive and fighting in their memories. But I can't put myself in her place and really don't think I have any room to say what she did was right or wrong. The reality of her situation and her world are so far removed from my own experiences that I really can't even begin to fathom how awful it must be to decide that a suicide bombing is the solution.
posted by fenriq at 4:18 PM on October 17, 2005

dhartung: Won't she get 100 golden Hasselhoffs in heaven or something?


posted by sien at 4:22 PM on October 17, 2005