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Edoardo Agnelli was a moslem
November 3, 2005 4:07 PM   Subscribe

Iranian students demonstrate outside Italian embassy in Iran.Chanting anti-Zionism slogans, the ralliers called for the withdrawal of the Zionists from the occupied Palestine.
They also called for the Italian government's explanation on the Nov 15, 2000 assassination of the Eduardo Agnelli suspiciously at the hand of the zionists. Edoardo Agnelli, born in June 9, 1954 in New York of a Christian father and a Jewish mother, had converted to Islam four years before the victory of the Islamic Revolution in Iran in 1979. He was the only son of the Italian tycoon Gianni Agnelli -director and the main shareholder of Fiat and Ferrari automaking factories - who died of prostate cancer in January 24, 2003.
Some pictures which prove he was a Moslem.
posted by persia (103 comments total) 1 user marked this as a favorite

 
How nice for them. I hope a sandstorm blows in.
posted by caddis at 4:19 PM on November 3, 2005


Okay, I see some pictures of vaugly muslim people.
posted by delmoi at 4:19 PM on November 3, 2005


'Wipe out Israel', says Iran's new president
27/10/2005 - 07:30:50

Iran’s ultra-conservative new president yesterday broke his silence on Israel and declared the Jewish state was a “disgraceful blot” that should be ”wiped off the map”.
http://news.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=us/0-0&fp=436a693d21b317b2&ei=o6lqQ5LJK6-cFeL-7TQ&url=http%3A//breakingnews.iol.ie/news/story.asp%3Fj%3D196243611%26p%3Dy96z44474&cid=0


Iran leader defends Israel remark
Iran's president has defended his widely criticised call for Israel to be "wiped off the map".

Attending an anti-Israel rally in Tehran, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said his remarks were "just" - and the criticism did not "have any validity".

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4384264.stm

Also:

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/640954.html
http://news.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=us/7-2&fp=436a0e8012e3baa6&ei=PKlqQ8qJFZPoFYbFhDU&url=http%3A//www.theage.com.au/news/World/Iran-to-process-fresh-batch-of-uranium/2005/11/03/1130823305857.html&cid=1102133062
http://news.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=us/4-0&fp=436a81e96b4c7d00&ei=galqQ8v4Ja_wFeOGzZsE&url=http%3A//www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/HRW/54db78391345c6504a9781eb658ed3b4.htm&cid=1102115931
http://news.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=us/0-0&fp=436a693d21b317b2&ei=o6lqQ5LJK6-cFeL-7TQ&url=http%3A//breakingnews.iol.ie/news/story.asp%3Fj%3D196243611%26p%3Dy96z44474&cid=0

War with Israel will prove disastrous for the Persians.
posted by dolphin917 at 4:24 PM on November 3, 2005


Israel has been a pain in the ass since it was formed. Maybe it's time to just give the land back.
posted by mischief at 4:26 PM on November 3, 2005


IRANIAN PAPER CLAIM EDOARDO AGNELLI MIGHT BE KILLED BY ZIONISTS
posted by persia at 4:29 PM on November 3, 2005


Israel has been a pain in the ass since it was formed. Maybe it's time to just give the land back.

Bold statement, whether you are joking or not.
posted by snsranch at 4:29 PM on November 3, 2005


I really wonder why Edoardo had to be killed! What was wrong whit his becoming a Moslem?!
posted by persia at 4:31 PM on November 3, 2005


Moslem is not the correct term, geez. It's Muslim.
posted by Hildegarde at 4:38 PM on November 3, 2005


Israel has been a pain in the ass since it was formed. Maybe it's time to just give the land back.

Is this a line from the "Oy oY Oy Show"?
posted by billysumday at 4:38 PM on November 3, 2005


Italian Police concluded to a possible suicide, but the English language newspaper "Iran Daily" claimed, quoting an e-mail received from an unidentified friend of Edoardo, that "being a good Muslim and having a strong faith, it is difficult to believe to his suicide, rather, he might have been assassinated".

According to the same source, Edoardo had converted secretly to Islam several years ago on studying the Koran, the Muslim's holly book and adopted the name of Mehdi. "Because of this conversion that was not accepted by the family, he had been rejected and hospitalised in a psychiatric hospital cared by Zionist doctors", Iran Daily said.
Are we supposed to take this seriously?
posted by kickingtheground at 4:38 PM on November 3, 2005


mischief, a lot of people would say the same thing about the US.
posted by Asparagirl at 4:39 PM on November 3, 2005


Asparagirl: And they may be right.
posted by brundlefly at 4:40 PM on November 3, 2005


Dear kickingtheground,
That e-mail was only a start point, did you read other documentations?!
There is also a documentary film broadcasted last night in Italian TV which also proves he was a Moslem. I'll try to find some link to that.
posted by persia at 4:45 PM on November 3, 2005


Ok, it's the first I've heard of this story, but I'm skeptical. If they didn't want the Fiat fortune in the hands of a Muslim, why not just write him out if the will? And the second link all but calls the story an urban legend. The Iran Daily story is even worse, it is relying on "an e-mail received from an unidentified friend of Edoardo" for all of its information.

Is there any more concrete information that he may have been assassinated? Or a more credible source of information about the story (either as an actual event or as a cultural element in the Muslim landscape)? Wikipedia gives me nothing.

Wait, did I just call Wikipedia authoritative? I must have been reading Iran Daily.
posted by whir at 4:46 PM on November 3, 2005


And the point of this post was? When aren't the Iranians protesting something.

"Zionist, Zionist, Zionist..." Nice flamebait. Some rich Italian guy dies, ruled suicide, friends and family say otherwise, the fact the he's Muslim somehow means he was assassinated by Zionists?

This is a shit post.

"Some pictures that prove he was Moslem"
-- So what? He was also rich, and from my experience money seems to get people killed too. Lots of things get people killed, not just their religion.
posted by Mijo Bijo at 4:47 PM on November 3, 2005


Moslem is not the correct term, geez. It's Muslim.

Why is "Moslem" incorrect?
posted by Kwantsar at 4:49 PM on November 3, 2005


Do Iranian students spend any time in a fucking classroom?
posted by Armitage Shanks at 4:52 PM on November 3, 2005


"Why is 'Moslem' incorrect?"

Because, if I recall correctly, in Arabic there is no equivalent for "o" or "e." The general transliteration is, as was noted, Muslim.
posted by Seth_Messinger at 4:54 PM on November 3, 2005


Awful, awful post.

To interpret: by "assassination of the Eduardo Agnelli suspiciously at the hand of the zionists," Persia means that he was killed by his Jewish doctors as part of an evil world-spanning plot. Of which there seems to be no evidence other than an anti-Jewish fiction spread by the Iranian government, which also publishes the Protoccols of the Elders of Zion as nonfiction.

From the Italian article:
... A short distance away is the Museum of Martyrs of Islam, where a section is given over to non-Iranian “shahid” and others who have done something for the Cause. For years, a portrait-shrine has been dedicated to the FIAT heir and a chatty attendant tells visitors the most famous of the urban legends about Italian “Zionism”. The story has it that Edoardo converted to Islam and did not commit suicide. He was actually killed so that the Agnelli empire would not end up in the hands of a Muslim. This rumour became news on Tuesday, when it was circulated by FARS, a press agency with close links to the Iranian president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad....
posted by blahblahblah at 4:55 PM on November 3, 2005


"Iranian students demonstrate outside Italian embassy in Iran.Chanting anti-Zionism slogans, the ralliers called for the withdrawal of the Zionists from the occupied Palestine."

The linked article, in fact, begins:

"Iran's Foreign Ministry on Wednesday summoned Italy's ambassador to protest about plans to hold a rally outside the Iranian embassy in Rome on Thursday.

Italian politicians from both government and opposition ranks are due to attend the rally on Thursday evening to protest against comments by Iran's President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad last week in which he said Israel should be "wiped off the map."

An Italian embassy spokesman said Ambassador Roberto Toscano had reiterated Rome's condemnation of Ahmadinejad's remarks during the meeting.

Italy "wants good relations with Iran and for Israel to exist in a safe environment," the spokesman said.

Italian Reforms Minister Roberto Calderoli, a member of the far-right Northern League party, said Rome should react to the summons by recalling its ambassador from Tehran.

'I believe one cannot have a civilised relationship with people who have shown themselves to be uncivilised,' he said, upping the war of words between two countries which have traditionally enjoyed good relations."
posted by semmi at 4:56 PM on November 3, 2005


Ladies and Gentelman,
please prepare to be distracted again, the war on terror episode II The Phantom Menace.
posted by elpapacito at 4:56 PM on November 3, 2005


Do Iranian students spend any time in a fucking classroom?

All of Iran's protests are staged. The government rounds people up and makes them protest. They chant "Death to America", but when asked off-camera their feelings, most Iranian students have no problems with America.
posted by Mijo Bijo at 4:58 PM on November 3, 2005


Moslem is not the correct term, geez. It's Muslim.

Uhh, both are correct, guy. Moslem is just an older spelling, but it's still perfectly acceptable. Although, it's kind of fallen out of use except here in the West because it's phonetically close to "Za'lem", which means oppressor in Arabic.

All of Iran's protests are staged. The government rounds people up and makes them protest. They chant "Death to America", but when asked off-camera their feelings, most Iranian students have no problems with America.

Bingo, and this exactly the reason why we shouldn't be rattling our sabers towards Iran. Half the population is under the age of 21, and most of them don't want to live under a theocracy.

But if we start bombing them to shit, well...

"Zionist, Zionist, Zionist..." Nice flamebait.

What exactly is wrong with the term Zionist? No one's talking "Protocol's of Zion" here, so it's silly to imply that the term is an attempt at a troll. Zionism is the belief that a Jewish State must exist in the Holy Land, as I'm sure you know. You can be against Zionism and not be an anti-semite.
posted by SweetJesus at 5:05 PM on November 3, 2005


That e-mail, which was the first clue, belongs to 5 years ago, now there are lots of facts which can not be unnoticed …

As you see in the pictures Edoardo is praying with other Moslems in Tehran's Friday prayer with Iran's grand leader ayatollah Khamenie. Do Christians and Jews also pray with Moslems!!??
posted by persia at 5:09 PM on November 3, 2005


Awful, awful post.

Seconded. I just flagged my first post ever--a special moment!
posted by halcyon_daze at 5:09 PM on November 3, 2005


pics : 1, 2, 3 , 4.
posted by persia at 5:13 PM on November 3, 2005


And what makes it awful?! The fact that a moslem has been killed?
posted by persia at 5:14 PM on November 3, 2005


This isn't even borderline incoherent. It's full-on batshitinsane conspiracy rant incoherent. Christ.

Yeah, those pictures of some guy with a beard convinced me!
posted by mr_roboto at 5:14 PM on November 3, 2005


Moslem is just an older spelling, but it's still perfectly acceptable. Although, it's kind of fallen out of use except here in the West because it's phonetically close to "Za'lem", which means oppressor in Arabic.

For some reason I was under the impression that "moslem" is actually a derogatory term. Wikipedia says nothing about it, though, and backs up your version.
posted by brundlefly at 5:15 PM on November 3, 2005


"I believe one cannot have a civilised relationship with people who have shown themselves to be uncivilised,"

That just covers so many bases!
posted by stirfry at 5:18 PM on November 3, 2005


What exactly is wrong with the term Zionist?

Nothing usually. The context in which Persia is using it alludes to a conspiracy: "assassination of the Eduardo Agnelli suspiciously at the hand of the zionists."

A later post:
I really wonder why Edoardo had to be killed! What was wrong whit his becoming a Moslem?!

He believes this propagandaist article, and thusly I would have to reason that believes in a Zionist conspiracy that Iran believes in.
posted by Mijo Bijo at 5:20 PM on November 3, 2005


And what makes it awful?! The fact that a moslem has been killed?

Um... the fact that you are repeating apparently baseless propaganda, without any shred of evidence, attributing the death to "the Zionists" (by which you seem to mean his possibly Jewish doctors) as part of a crazy anti-Jewish conspiracy theory designed to stir up hatred. And that, to boot, it was a badly written post with badly sourced information that does not back up your claims. That is what makes it awful. Mr. Agnelli's death is doubtless sad, whether he was Muslim, Christian, or Unitarian, but your post is really offensive.
posted by blahblahblah at 5:25 PM on November 3, 2005


OK I thought you guys know him, here is a pic focused on him.

and another one from corriere
posted by persia at 5:30 PM on November 3, 2005


Persia, you have flimsy evidence at best to prove he was even murdered, then you extrapolate that to he was murderered by Zionists? You're off your fucking rocker.
posted by Mijo Bijo at 5:30 PM on November 3, 2005


I thought about "offensive." But in the end, "noise" seemed to say it all.

Do I get a t-shirt now?

*flags own comment as noise*

exeunt
posted by halcyon_daze at 5:31 PM on November 3, 2005


googled "our moslem friends"
posted by longsleeves at 5:32 PM on November 3, 2005


attributing the death to "the Zionists" by which you seem to mean his possibly Jewish doctors ...

Come on! Who said that, no body claims he was killed by his doctor …
posted by persia at 5:34 PM on November 3, 2005


What a fantastically shitty post. Tagged, Flagged and double-bagged (yes, I gagged).
posted by basicchannel at 5:42 PM on November 3, 2005


at the hands of the zionists

All few million of them put their political, temporal and spatial differences aside, came together and killed this guy.

Did they poison the wells too? Maybe snacked on some blood matzah?
posted by kosem at 5:43 PM on November 3, 2005


I like that the one piece of English-language commentary persia was able to link to refers to this story as a "myth" and an "urban legend". Heh.
posted by mr_roboto at 5:43 PM on November 3, 2005


OK I thought you guys know him, here is a pic focused on him.


Yea, that's the guy!

Awesome!
posted by snsranch at 5:44 PM on November 3, 2005


Okay, I admit it. I killed him. Me and my Jew buddies, we have a bad habit of offing people whose surnames/nicknames translate to "lamb of God".

Sorry, everyone.

(But for one of these, wouldn't you have done it too?)
posted by Asparagirl at 6:01 PM on November 3, 2005


Moslem is not the correct term, geez. It's Muslim.

Now, if he had used Mohammedan, I could see why you would be upset. Lighten up pedant.
posted by tweak at 6:01 PM on November 3, 2005


Please don’t go too far. How can you judge about this case when you even have not seen the documentary film yet? In the film Edoardo says that he has been threatened to death by Zionists.

Maybe it was better I wouldn’t post this link before the film being available on the web.
posted by persia at 6:37 PM on November 3, 2005


Hey persia, could you recommend an Iranian weblog like MeFi, where anyone can contribute a link or a comment to break down the barriers between people and to foster discussion among its members, so I could visit it and piss into it?
posted by semmi at 6:45 PM on November 3, 2005


Persia: Come on! Who said that, no body claims he was killed by his doctor

Persia's link: ...he had been rejected and hospitalised in a psychiatric hospital cared by Zionist doctors", Iran Daily said

I am sorry if I misunderstood whether the "Zionist doctors" were part of the plot to kill him, or whether that was an entirely different group of evil Zionists. You do realize that the Jews or "Zionists" are not part of a plot to destroy people who might convert to Islam, right? You do know that it might be difficult to trust the word of Iran in blaming the Jews for faking the suicide of a chronically depressed man when the same government actually prints the Protoccols of the Elders of Zion and other anti-Semitic tracts as fact? At the very least, you may want to make sure that the articles you link to actually talk about the things you mention.

Sometimes, MeFi teaches me that cross-cultural dialogue can be very depressing.
posted by blahblahblah at 8:13 PM on November 3, 2005


Whether these allegations are true or not, why should we care? I mean, why is this post and thread here?

For an anti-theocratic view of Iranian society that I gather is mostly written by second-generation exiles, see Iranian.com. I doubt that has anything to do with anything about this thread, but still.

And by the way longsleeves, one gets orders of magnitude more hits googling for "our muslim friends".

And oh, wait a minute, wasn't the "Jewish doctors' plot" motif used once already?
posted by davy at 8:26 PM on November 3, 2005


persia, you brought up a story that none of us had heard before, but you failed to explain why it's important. I mean, okay, he was a Muslim -- and so? And seriously, what the fuck does this have to do with Ahmadinejad fulminating about Israel?

"Moslem" and "Muslim" are simply different ways of transliterating Arabic, which has a variety of pronunciations. "Muslim" is newer and preferred, but "Moslem" is not derogatory. "Mohammedan" is an old term now considered derogatory, because it implies that Muslims worship Muhammad (again, there's that vowel thing); they do not, they worship Allah. Muhammad was just a man who was a prophet of God.

The business about protecting the FIAT fortune is confusing or just nonsense, as Giovanni Agnelli -- the father of Edoardo -- had sold 10% of the company to the Libyan government, and had close relations with Muammar Qaddafi (oh, speaking of transliteration problems, we were?).
posted by dhartung at 9:02 PM on November 3, 2005


Maybe it was better I wouldn’t post this link before the film being available on the web.
posted by Armitage Shanks at 9:07 PM on November 3, 2005


I heard they killed him because they were jealous of his luck dragon.
posted by homunculus at 9:10 PM on November 3, 2005


meta
posted by Krrrlson at 9:11 PM on November 3, 2005


Israel has been a pain in the ass since it was formed. Maybe it's time to just give the land back.
Bold statement, whether you are joking or not.
posted by


I have the bold solution: we give Israel back to the Palestinians, we give Quebec to the Israelis, we give the Canadian natives the NWT and Manitoba and several bits of BC, we give the Quebecois back to France, we give Texas and New Mexico back to Mexico, we build a biiiiig fucking wall around the Christian Supremecists, and... remove sanctions from Cuba. That should pretty much do the trick.
posted by five fresh fish at 9:21 PM on November 3, 2005


Maybe it was better I wouldn’t post this link before the film being available on the web.

Didn't Balisong link to it already?
posted by homunculus at 9:22 PM on November 3, 2005


I'd kill almost anyone for a luck dragon.
posted by Balisong at 9:26 PM on November 3, 2005


Oh, homunculus, you're just jealous that I linked to that 'luck dragon' video before you!
posted by Balisong at 9:28 PM on November 3, 2005


fff: Not enough. Give the US back to those who took the land route. Give Australia back to the Aboriginals. Give Ireland back to the Irish. Give Northern Songs back to McCartney. Give CCR back to John Forgerty. Give CPR to the economy. And give me back to my old Kentucky Home. Far Away.
posted by ?! at 9:32 PM on November 3, 2005


I have nothing against the jews and I have nothing against the arabs. But really, people, the west started this crap after WW2 by carving out this country, and the only reason to keep it around is its strategic military value for the west. Where is that strategic value when Isreal's continued existence is the basis for most of the overwhelming hate against the west?
posted by mischief at 9:34 PM on November 3, 2005


I'm jealous of the dragon. Lucky dragon.
posted by homunculus at 9:41 PM on November 3, 2005


fff: What about Tibet?!!
posted by homunculus at 9:42 PM on November 3, 2005


Have you ever met an angry jew, mischief? Ohhh, you don't want to piss off Israel. It'd be angry jews all over, man, all over the place!

I can tell you've never met an angry jew. And their God! Oy! You do not want to piss of the Jewish God. Man, there'd be locusts knee-deep, you piss off the Jewish God. None of this namby-pamby "oooh, he's such a forgiving God, forgive us our sins" bullshit! It's plagues and first-born sons and pillars of freakin' salt all over the place!

Do not taunt the Israel.
posted by five fresh fish at 9:43 PM on November 3, 2005


Free Tibet? I'll take three, thanks!
posted by five fresh fish at 9:43 PM on November 3, 2005


fff: don't you mean 'zionist'?
posted by kickingtheground at 9:45 PM on November 3, 2005


Met an angry jew? Nope. Met a lot of jews who couldn't point out Isreal on a map? Yep.

If they want a desert, give 'em Utah. Hell, we can even make it equivalent to an indian reservation.
posted by mischief at 9:50 PM on November 3, 2005


I really would blame the father before blaming anyone else--he's one of the most powerful men in Italy, no?
posted by amberglow at 9:56 PM on November 3, 2005


Doesn't Utah already have it's own Zion? Boy, that'll go over well.
posted by loquacious at 9:57 PM on November 3, 2005


"Doesn't Utah already have it's own Zion?"

They do? Good, then they can share.
posted by mischief at 10:01 PM on November 3, 2005


So if I'm following the story:

1) There's a rich, depressed Italian guy, Edouardo Agnelli, who was a student of various philosophies (the iran-press-service one notes that he travelled to India to study Hinduism as well).

2) He was, according to a Website in Western Samoa, secretly a Moslem. This seemingly important fact is hidden from everybody that knew him.

3) He jumped off a bridge.

4) But everybody knows that Moslems don't commit suicide! Logically, this would lead one to believe that 1) he wasn't Moslem or 2) was a less than perfect Moslem, or 3) a VICTIM OF THE EVIL ZIONIST CONSPIRACY.

5) So five years later, "seething" Iranian students storm the Italian Embassy to demand the complete destruction of Israel.
posted by swell at 10:03 PM on November 3, 2005


Met an angry jew? Nope. Met a lot of jews who couldn't point out Isreal on a map? Yep.

Could they spell it?
posted by Armitage Shanks at 10:06 PM on November 3, 2005


swell: ain't political science fun?
posted by mischief at 10:07 PM on November 3, 2005


I-T?

I know it's Israel. I learned that sometime after my 35th birthday. I was using it for effect.
posted by mischief at 10:08 PM on November 3, 2005


"Doesn't Utah already have it's own Zion?"
They do? Good, then they can share.


Oh, geez. It'd all be "Moooooom! Israel touched my special underpants!" "Well you called my yarmulka a beanie!" "Well you're a big doo-doo head!" "Moooooom!"

Religious wackos, like siblings, should be kept in small cages.
posted by five fresh fish at 10:16 PM on November 3, 2005


We should deliberately spell it "Isreal" in the next MeFi FPP about it, see how many people can be persuaded that it's the correct spelling. I gotta admit, I'm never entirely sure if I've got it right myself.
posted by five fresh fish at 10:18 PM on November 3, 2005


"Religious wackos" : Exactly! This whole situation is the equivalent to Minnesota going to war with the rest of the United States over Paul Bunyan versus Johnny Appleseed. Fairy tales. Thousands of people continue to die over silly fairy tales. tsk tsk
posted by mischief at 10:19 PM on November 3, 2005


Substitute Superman for Johnny Appleseed to improve my analogy.
posted by mischief at 10:22 PM on November 3, 2005


Wipe Israel off the map? Israel is not on official Iranian maps.
posted by semmi at 10:28 PM on November 3, 2005


I was using it for effect.

bet you read playboy for the articles too.
posted by quonsar at 10:52 PM on November 3, 2005


I don't read Playboy, but I do look at the Hustler website!
posted by mischief at 10:57 PM on November 3, 2005


Dang, my bad. Somewhere I got the idea that Iranian students were demonstrating outside the Italian embassy in Iran. But, that link was about the Iranian ambassabor calling on the Italian ambassador to object to the Italian ambassador going to Israel and stating that "wiping Israel off the map" is not as good an idea as the Iranian president thinks it is, and that maybe letting these folks acquire nuclear weapons is not really a great idea.

But I missed this: Tehran says Ahmadinejad's comments were a re-statement of its pro-Palestinian policy and did not represent an actual threat of violence against Israel.

So. That's completely different, I thought we were dealing with antisemitic nutbars.

persia: OK I thought you guys know him
Oh yeah! Now that you mention it, there was that vaguely depressed, half-Jewish looking guy in a kaffiyeh at the Poughkeepsie MeFi meetup back in 1999. Had a really nice car. I was wondering what happened to him.

I'm still not sure I understand what the Western Samoans have to do with this.
posted by swell at 11:20 PM on November 3, 2005


So if I'm following the story:
A series of seemingly unrelated or completely insane events.


Dear. God. I. Am. Not. A. Religious. Man. But. Please. Help. Me. See. The. Connection. Here.

This whole thing makes no sense at all.
posted by 235w103 at 11:25 PM on November 3, 2005


235w103:This whole thing makes no sense at all.

Well, you know what happened to the last guy that said that.
posted by swell at 11:49 PM on November 3, 2005


What a clusterfuck this FPP and thread have turned out to be. I'm surprised it's still here.

And Persia, cool it with the exclamation marks. All the exclamation marks in the world won't save this sorry ass "story".
posted by Devils Slide at 11:52 PM on November 3, 2005


There's to hoping that exposure to the outer world through the Internets will change the benighted minds of the likes of persian. Well, not bloody likely...
posted by Skeptic at 11:57 PM on November 3, 2005


Israel is not on official Iranian maps.
Iranians have maps?????
posted by Joeforking at 12:52 AM on November 4, 2005


This whole thing makes no sense at all.

It makes perfect sense to me: many people in Iran are taking the stern international criticism following Ahmadinejad's comment re Israel. The government of Iran deploys its usual strategy of drumming up hysteria among the populace by publicizing a "Zionist crime" against humanity. The fact that the sane world dismisses allegations of this "Zionist crime" for being tenuous is only proof positive that they are brainwashed by the Zionists. Rinse and repeat.
posted by ori at 1:30 AM on November 4, 2005


Okay, I admit it. I killed him. Me and my Jew buddies...

Damn it, Asparagirl, you forgot to invite me again. You are so not invited to my next Christian baby massacre.
posted by ori at 1:33 AM on November 4, 2005


Iranians have maps?????

No, there's just sand, camels, rugs, and "terrarists" as far as the eye can see.

See how using multiple punctuation marks makes you look stupid? Of course, the racist cheap shot doesn't help either.
posted by Devils Slide at 1:51 AM on November 4, 2005


Oh yeah! Now that you mention it, there was that vaguely depressed, half-Jewish looking guy in a kaffiyeh at the Poughkeepsie MeFi meetup back in 1999. Had a really nice car. I was wondering what happened to him.

swell just saved this trainwreck. awesome.
posted by miss tea at 5:04 AM on November 4, 2005


Yeah, many thanks to swell, without whom this thread would be purely depressing.
posted by languagehat at 5:59 AM on November 4, 2005


Use of "Moslem" is a mark of ignorance if not outright disrespect; Muslims prefer to be called Muslims, not "Moslems", and an unwillingness to call a people what they prefer to be called is naturally offensive.

And why is it mefites so often think "Hildegarde" must be a the name of a guy? How many male Hildegardes do you know? Honestly! If this part of assuming everyone online is a guy, and do I need to post all text in pink to get my gender across?
posted by Hildegarde at 6:26 AM on November 4, 2005


Use of "Moslem" is a mark of ignorance if not outright disrespect; Muslims prefer to be called Muslims, not "Moslems", and an unwillingness to call a people what they prefer to be called is naturally offensive.

Bullshit. It bothers some Muslims, it doesn't bother others. Why are you getting so indignant? If there's an actual Muslim here who's offended, let him or her speak for themselves. Christ, the amount of speech-policing that goes on around these supposedly freewheeling parts. (And please don't tell me that "Moslem" is equivalent to the N-word or I shall have to laugh you to scorn.)
posted by languagehat at 7:34 AM on November 4, 2005


You are so not invited to my next Christian baby massacre.

Aw, ori, don't be sore. If I get you a good deal on one of those late model ZOG® Mind Control Rayguns, will you forgive me?
posted by Asparagirl at 7:51 AM on November 4, 2005


fff -

Poland

You guys forgot about Poland
posted by Sk4n at 8:49 AM on November 4, 2005


I love this theory about Edoardo Agnelli being killed by his own family for supposedly converting to Islam, it's almost as good as the idea Princess Diana was killed because she was expecting a Muslim baby from Dodi Al Fayed. Almost. You have to admit that one is a lot more fascinating.

Edoardo had problems with depression and drugs. Another younger heir to the Agnelli empire is now in rehab after an overdose and three days in a coma. Maybe the overdose was actually a murder attempt because he was secretly converting to Islam too and his Jewish father just couldn't allow that.
posted by funambulist at 11:36 AM on November 4, 2005


Ok, the fun is over: I admit it was me all along.

Fooled ya, persia!
posted by five fresh fish at 1:09 PM on November 4, 2005


Use of "Moslem" is a mark of ignorance if not outright disrespect; Muslims prefer to be called Muslims, not "Moslems", and an unwillingness to call a people what they prefer to be called is naturally offensive.
Everyone, I prefer to be called Jesus Christ. Failure to do so is naturally offensive.
posted by Count Ziggurat at 1:41 PM on November 4, 2005


Shut-up, honky.
posted by five fresh fish at 2:10 PM on November 4, 2005


Use of "Moslem" is a mark of ignorance if not outright disrespect; Muslims prefer to be called Muslims, not "Moslems", and an unwillingness to call a people what they prefer to be called is naturally offensive.

Well shit, you better let these guys know, professor...

Moron...
posted by SweetJesus at 4:03 PM on November 4, 2005


I think the term of art for offense is "Ishmaelite." Get it fucking right before you get fucking offended.
posted by OmieWise at 8:24 PM on November 5, 2005


Oh, and I missed this FPP, which is a shitbox of tinfoilhat anti-semitism made just occassionally more light by persia's command of English. Thank god for hypertext, which led me back here. Please see that my grave is kept clean.
posted by OmieWise at 8:27 PM on November 5, 2005


As I said before in the documentary film Edoardo says that he has been threatened to death by Zionists.

Doesn't that make any sense to you?
Are you going to blindly defend all the illegal movements of any Zionist group?!


posted by persia at 7:53 PM on November 6, 2005



posted by selfnoise at 8:01 AM on November 11, 2005


Do Christians and Jews also pray with Moslems!!??

Actually they do. Where I live the church, temple, & mosque leaders all work together on various community issues and periodically hold joint religious services where their combined congregations pray together.
posted by zarah at 7:11 PM on November 16, 2005


Edoardo Agnelli did indeed convert to being Muslim. Upon the death of Edoardo, the senior Agnelli made a substantial donation and built the Edoardo Agnelli center for religious study. The center is a non denominational place of comparative studies. Edoardo had overcome decades of drug abuse and alleged homosexual desires on his search for spiritual salvation. Mr. Agnelli despised the inner workings of the political and industrial family he was bred from. Edoardo traveled the entire world on his quest for God. Even at a very young age, he knew he did not belong in the family into which he was born. His insecurities became a constant form of torment for him and his family. Edoardo was sexually confused and his first sexual encounter with a girl resulted in her getting pregnant, and him having a son at the very young age of 14, out of fear for himself, the mother, and the child he arranged for them to live in America to be raised away from the pressures of being an Agnelli in Italy. He did not share his secret with anyone for 8 years. He chose to go to school in New Jersey to be near his son when he could. Edoardo became incredibly depressed during his time in America and his drug use escalated. He garnered the nick name "crazy Eddie" among his friends. Edoardo knew 20 years before his death he would not take control over FIAT, in fact he announced his desire to do so in a news conference during the mid 80's. The family and the company responded with public disapproval. Edoardo became more distraught and more withdrawn during the late 80's and into the 90's. During the 90's Edoardo spent equal amounts of time doing drugs and looking for god. He required family assistance at one point being detained in Africa while possessing large quantities of heroin, a member of the family had to fly to Africa and negotiate with authorities for his release. It was during this time that Edoardo became more and more drawn to the peace and love of the Muslim religion. It was his desire to build a center where people of all denominations on a quest for spirituality could come and worship in a place without fear of judgment and hatred. Before his death he expressed concerns that his life was in danger to close friends and his father. His father no longer being able to relate to his son assumed it was paranoid schizophrenia due to the large usage of drugs in his son’s lifetime and did not believe him. Edoardo asked his father three things weeks before his death. To take care of his sister, take care of his son (Gianni was the only family member who knew of his son) to finish his dream of creating a place of religious understanding. Upon his death his obituary read he never married and had no children. In 2001, the Edoardo Agnelli Centre for Religious Comparative Studies was established. This permanent centre is framed within the structure of the Giovanni Agnelli Foundation, but endowed with administrative, organizational and cultural autonomy.realityIts institutional and cultural purpose is to promote research and international cultural debate on the great religions, thereby contributing to the enhancement of a committed dialogue that supports the quest for shared spiritual and ethical values. The cultural activities of the centre are interdisciplinary. They comprise all the branches of knowledge that are involved in the study of religions: theology, philosophy, history, social sciences and law. His father kept his promises to his misunderstood son.
posted by center.religious.studys at 12:56 PM on November 23, 2005


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