Comments on: Comments on 4679

Post number 4679

tomorama — Thu, 07 Dec 2000 22:38:46 -0800

Priceless quotes from web design clients. "I think this should always be spinning." "I don't think people will be able to focus on the words..." "Make it spin DAMMIT!!" Some of these are downright hilarious.

By: owillis

owillis — Thu, 07 Dec 2000 23:18:28 -0800

While a lot of these are totally ludicrous and hilarious, I think some are great examples of web designers being inflexible, unrealistic bastards. Things like making the site load faster, changing design elements should be a part of the deal. Some designers need to get off of their high horse...

By: jkottke

jkottke — Thu, 07 Dec 2000 23:39:50 -0800

>I think some are great examples of web designers being >inflexible, unrealistic bastards Hear, hear. Educating clients about design and the realities of the medium is all part of the job. The adversarial attitude many industry "professionals" have with their clients is absurd and ultimately self-defeating.

By: tomorama

tomorama — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 00:42:40 -0800

True, you need to flex. After all, you're the one being paid. It's the client's site, you need to come to a clear understanding with each other in order to work together effectively. But I can still feel my heart sink when someone insists on putting in those cool bright yellow 3d stars, the ones that spin and glow. On top of neon green.But that discussion still has to be one of the funniest things I've read in a while.

By: tomorama

tomorama — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 00:44:57 -0800

I guess it's all a matter of people dropping their "I'm the designer damnit. I know everything and you are illiterate." attitude.

By: Optamystic

Optamystic — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 00:59:15 -0800

Makes me wonder if that hifalutin' attitude is endemic to the job. (By "the job" I mean not just web designers, but pretty much any gig that has a technical nature and involves interaction with less knowledgeable clients). I work in tech support, and I often find a tone of superiority and/or condescension creeping into my voice, almost despite myself. I think those of us who have these positions should make a concerted effort not to be snide when dealing with the less knowledgeable. We all started somewhere.

By: lagado

lagado — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 02:56:26 -0800

My experience in the web/multimedia world makes me want to empathize with everyone: graphos, customers, techos...even sales! (but not accounts). It's a stinking sweatshop industry. graphos - overworked, creative, naive, prima donnas techos - overworked, smart, grumpy, narrow, elitist trolls sales - overworked, naive, stressed, flighty bullshit artists customers - overcharged, ignorant, unreasonable victims ... accounts - totally useless blood sucking parasites ;-j

By: Caffa

Caffa — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 03:05:39 -0800

My experience of working with a particularly narky bunch of developers (outsourced; I'm their client) leads me to believe that, often, the only way I can get anything done is to confess complete and total ignorance, and ritually humiliate myself by begging them to help me. I have done this time and time again. I have sent off countless e-mails pleading with them to keep me informed of progress, and to let me know if something cannot be done and why it cannot be done, so that I can try and come up with a reasonable alternative. I never hear anything from them, and they will not return my phone calls.

I am just trying to do a job, but the more obstructive they are the more difficult the situation gets for both parties. If they kept me informed, I wouldn't have to bombard them with the e-mails. They must loathe me. But it could be so much easier if their attitude was a little less confrontational...

*whinge ends*

By: lagado

lagado — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 04:03:53 -0800

fair enough, sack 'em and get some that can communicate with you.

By: Caffa

Caffa — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 05:16:31 -0800

I wish I could, but the big cheese says no...

Let's all direct anger at big bosses instead.

By: fvw

fvw — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 06:48:05 -0800

This one's funny: "our web site doesn't load if I turn javascript off ... please fix this" *sigh* Seems like a valid complaint to me, I'm beginning to think webdesigners, not the clients are responsible for the enormous amount of crappy flash-websites out there...

By: gsh

gsh — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 09:14:55 -0800

It's a professional services industry, kids. If the clients knew how to get this work done on their own, they wouldn't be coming to us. And having worked both on internal corporate web teams, and in an agency, I can say without hesitation that the former is a nightmare. But since they are coming to us (the agency) - they need to sit back and allow us to do our work, as professionals, and apply our knowledge and experience. Instead, designers/developers are often forced by the clueless (on both the client and agency side) to cave into demands and specs that produce crappy work - to which that thread on Dreamless testifies so accurately.

By: Dreama

Dreama — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 11:12:14 -0800

Amen Gabby. It's similar to what I get -- people come to me for legal advice, then tell me that my counsel is wrong based on what they saw on Court TV or (worse) Law & Order last night. Yes, the web design client should, of course, have the final word on what information is there and on the general context in which it is presented, but there are instances where deferring to the judgment and experience of the trained professionals you've hired is crucial. I don't understand the mindset of people who are paying someone (or multiple someones) for their expertise, then discount it when it conflicts with their untested, neophyte ideas.

By: leo

leo — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 11:13:57 -0800

I'm beginning to think webdesigners, not the clients are responsible for the enormous amount of crappy flash-websites out there... No reason to trash a whole profession now, is there?

By: amanda

amanda — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 12:05:06 -0800

I read that dreamless.org thread a few weeks ago (took me the greater part of a day -- procrastination) and I know what you're saying about flexibility. I think you have to take that thread with a grain of salt. People are just venting over there. And as for the guy up above who can't get them to call you back -- that's ridiculous. On the other hand, make sure you're not micromanaging. The clients that needed to speak with me everyday on the phone drove me absolutely batshit. The gem in that thread for me was something along the lines of: "I asked a friend and they said that there *is* a rainbow filter in Photoshop -- why did you say there wasn't one?" Classic.

By: thirdball

thirdball — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 12:18:43 -0800

I wouldn't imagine a client coming into a design office and requesting flash just because they've heard the buzzwords. Most likely designers want to floor the client with little work necessary instead of educating the client about what's involved with design on the Web.

By: tj

tj — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 12:21:30 -0800

Amanda: I would have found that funnier if the same damn thing hadn't happened to me.

By: amanda

amanda — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 13:45:25 -0800

Thirdball: I wouldn't imagine a client coming into a design office and requesting flash just because they've heard the buzzwords. You're kidding right? Tongue in cheek? Pullin' my leg? Alright you kidder, you, that's pretty funny. Tj: Yes. Me, too.

By: u_quality

u_quality — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 16:09:15 -0800

You know why web developers and designers act and vent this way? I've asked several clients how often they surf the web... "uhh.. i check my email all the time". You've just admitted your opinion on web design is moot cuz you dont surf. I've designed dozens of sites in my years as a developer.. and all the crappy ones came from clients who just didnt get it.. All they know about the web is their friggin email and buzzwords like 'portal' and 'ebusiness' Do these people tell surgeons how to operate on them??? Dont even talk to me until you've read: http://www.useit.com/alertbox/9706b.html Jakob Neilsons top ten web management mistakes... you've broken em all.

By: leo

leo — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 18:51:33 -0800

I think he spells it "Nielsen", U.

By: will

will — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 19:06:00 -0800

here is my fav: Us: So what words come to mind when you think about how your logo should look. Client: Well it should be 'fast' and 'very friendly' ...oh, and maybe look like an octapus with tentacles stretching out' ok, that is just plain stupidity.

By: grank

grank — Fri, 08 Dec 2000 21:40:09 -0800

Client: "We want a website that can play DVD quality video, but we don't want to use streaming video and the load time must be zero." Designer: "That's impossible. Everything has a load time. DVD quality runs about 100 megs a minute." Client: "We'll take our business elsewhere..."

By: titboy

titboy — Mon, 11 Dec 2000 00:47:36 -0800

u_quality: "I've designed dozens of sites in my years as a developer.. and all the crappy ones came from clients who just didnt get it.." i'm with you here. if i look back at the sites i've designed, the ones i'm most happy with are ones where the client knew what the internet is about, and had a vision for what they wanted the site to achieve. the crap ones, the ones i make sure aren't associated with me, are all for people who just 'wanted a website'. people who decide they need to be in on this internet thing, but don't use it themselves. the ones you have to struggle through a meeting with, where you're carrying the whole thing, because they're still figuring out how to attach something to their damn email.