languid dirge
November 20, 2005 4:25 PM Subscribe
New Orleans Today : It's Worse Than You Think. Neighborhoods are still dark, garbage piles up on the street, and bodies are still being found.
If you can find a hotel room, balisong. FYI it's actually MarDi Gras.
Katrina exposed (to those, who haven't paid attention) a profound incompetence and carelessness in the leadership of this country. And in the aftermath it showed the greed and criminal selfishness which prevails in the government and corporate world. This is such a f.cking outrage!!!
PBS Now aired this on friday
http://www.pbs.org/now/society/katrinalabor.html
and PBS Frontline will air this on Tuesday
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/storm/
posted by threehundredandsixty at 4:59 PM on November 20, 2005
Katrina exposed (to those, who haven't paid attention) a profound incompetence and carelessness in the leadership of this country. And in the aftermath it showed the greed and criminal selfishness which prevails in the government and corporate world. This is such a f.cking outrage!!!
PBS Now aired this on friday
http://www.pbs.org/now/society/katrinalabor.html
and PBS Frontline will air this on Tuesday
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/storm/
posted by threehundredandsixty at 4:59 PM on November 20, 2005
Well actually I think it's probably incredibly bad. The city wasn't flat-out destroyed, it was left in some nightmare-ish middle state of semi-destruction. Residents, rescuers, and those cleaning up will be affected for life. They'll be finding bodies for years. Lives have been permanently altered in a thousand ways. I just don't follow how it makes sense to rehabilitate the lowest-lying sections and have people move back in there and I have no useful suggestion for what to do instead.
posted by scheptech at 5:10 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by scheptech at 5:10 PM on November 20, 2005
The most underreported story today...
posted by Sagres
Saw an hour long special on one of the big three about the situation in new orleans just a few nights ago.
From this very post you see the current situation reported and discussed in time magazine, the ny times, cnn, pbs, etc...
Exactly what is your definition of "underreported"?
posted by justgary at 5:13 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by Sagres
Saw an hour long special on one of the big three about the situation in new orleans just a few nights ago.
From this very post you see the current situation reported and discussed in time magazine, the ny times, cnn, pbs, etc...
Exactly what is your definition of "underreported"?
posted by justgary at 5:13 PM on November 20, 2005
Balisong, apologies if my comment implied a lack of travel resources on your end.
I was rather referring to the sorry state of affairs in NOLA.
posted by threehundredandsixty at 5:18 PM on November 20, 2005
I was rather referring to the sorry state of affairs in NOLA.
posted by threehundredandsixty at 5:18 PM on November 20, 2005
In arguably the most advanced nation in the world today, this is an abomination. The US has seemingly unlimited funds to throw around for weapons and to promote itself as the Protector of the Free World, but can't even provide basic facilities for its own citizens.
posted by dg at 5:21 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by dg at 5:21 PM on November 20, 2005
Balisong...it's usually too cold to camp out during mardis gras time...
Not sure if this is a double post, but it is quite amazing.
They are just gonna bulldozer everything and try to erase what they did wrong. So so sad.
posted by gminks at 5:26 PM on November 20, 2005
Not sure if this is a double post, but it is quite amazing.
They are just gonna bulldozer everything and try to erase what they did wrong. So so sad.
posted by gminks at 5:26 PM on November 20, 2005
What is underreported is how under-addressed the problems in NOLA are. The federal government stooped down to help only after a media blitz of outrage at the lack of resources. Now that the media has died down, so has the motivation of the federal government to organize a recovery. After four weeks most of the displaced families still have no homes to return to, neighborhoods are still without water and power, and bodies are still being found (and not by "the authorities" but by family members.) What is being underreported is the colossal failure of the government to help its citizens in any meaningful way.
posted by elwoodwiles at 5:27 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by elwoodwiles at 5:27 PM on November 20, 2005
Thre french quarter and burbon street were left primaraly intact, no flooding.
I would imagine that there will be a lot of hotel space available come marti gras.
posted by Paris Hilton at 5:39 PM on November 20, 2005
I would imagine that there will be a lot of hotel space available come marti gras.
posted by Paris Hilton at 5:39 PM on November 20, 2005
it's usually too cold to camp out during mardis gras time...
I'm used to camping on 14'ers in December, that's how I met my wife.. heh.
But I'm not into bugs.. There's no big creepy bugs in Louisiana, are there?
posted by Balisong at 5:44 PM on November 20, 2005
I'm used to camping on 14'ers in December, that's how I met my wife.. heh.
But I'm not into bugs.. There's no big creepy bugs in Louisiana, are there?
posted by Balisong at 5:44 PM on November 20, 2005
Mardi Gras is a free celebration that is put on and entirely paid for by citizens who have organized themselves into "Krewes."
Without its residents, there won't be a Mardi Gras.
posted by ColdChef at 5:44 PM on November 20, 2005
Without its residents, there won't be a Mardi Gras.
posted by ColdChef at 5:44 PM on November 20, 2005
Here's something I've been wanting to ask. It's hard for me to judge, since I'm down here in the middle of this, and all we seem to do down here is talk about the hurricane and reconstruction.
Tell me honestly: does anyone care anymore about what is happening in New Orleans and the Gulf Coast?
posted by ColdChef at 5:52 PM on November 20, 2005
Tell me honestly: does anyone care anymore about what is happening in New Orleans and the Gulf Coast?
posted by ColdChef at 5:52 PM on November 20, 2005
Paris Hilton writes "I would imagine that there will be a lot of hotel space available come marti gras."
There are few hotel rooms available during Mardi Gras in good years. Plus, downtown may not have been flooded, but there are hotels with glass walls shattered. A lot of hotels, I suspect, will not be up and running in time.
Balisong writes "But I'm not into bugs.. There's no big creepy bugs in Louisiana, are there?"
Oh, no. Of course not. Unless you count the nuclear mosquitos and the palmetto bugs.
posted by brundlefly at 5:54 PM on November 20, 2005
There are few hotel rooms available during Mardi Gras in good years. Plus, downtown may not have been flooded, but there are hotels with glass walls shattered. A lot of hotels, I suspect, will not be up and running in time.
Balisong writes "But I'm not into bugs.. There's no big creepy bugs in Louisiana, are there?"
Oh, no. Of course not. Unless you count the nuclear mosquitos and the palmetto bugs.
posted by brundlefly at 5:54 PM on November 20, 2005
ColdChef: I'm able to know what's going on there because I actively seek it out, plus I get regular updates from my mother. Most people seem to have moved along, however. New Orleans is a political issue/card now. It's not an ongoing story in their view.
posted by brundlefly at 5:58 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by brundlefly at 5:58 PM on November 20, 2005
Tell me honestly: does anyone care anymore about what is happening in New Orleans and the Gulf Coast?
posted by ColdChef at 5:52 PM PST on November 20 [!]
Yes.
posted by jb at 6:10 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by ColdChef at 5:52 PM PST on November 20 [!]
Yes.
posted by jb at 6:10 PM on November 20, 2005
The federal government decided long ago to try to tame the river and the swampy land spreading out from it. The country needed this waterlogged land of ours to prosper, so that the nation could prosper even more.
Some people in Washington don't seem to remember that. They act as if we are a burden. They act as if we wore our skirts too short and invited trouble.
posted by ColdChef at 6:10 PM on November 20, 2005
Some people in Washington don't seem to remember that. They act as if we are a burden. They act as if we wore our skirts too short and invited trouble.
posted by ColdChef at 6:10 PM on November 20, 2005
ColdChef, I have to agree with brundlefly.
The burning Bush issue has taken over.
I suspect it with be a little while before the dots will be connected and Katrina will become part of the discussion again.
Until then, anything we can do to actually help?
posted by threehundredandsixty at 6:12 PM on November 20, 2005
The burning Bush issue has taken over.
I suspect it with be a little while before the dots will be connected and Katrina will become part of the discussion again.
Until then, anything we can do to actually help?
posted by threehundredandsixty at 6:12 PM on November 20, 2005
Marti Gras this year will be wild, I'll bet. Might be worth it to go.
posted by Balisong at 6:38 PM CST on November 20 [!]
Incorrect.
Mardi Gras will be sad and forced this year. The only reason they will have it at all is because the city and businesses will be depending on tourist dollars to help rebuild. By depending I mean completely and totally reliant to have any chance at all to survive.
There is no reason to celebrate. The sorrow of Lent came half a year early.
I don't think anyone who holds New Orleans dear would want to be anywhere near it for Mardi Gras 2006. I expect some people would be suicidal.
It will never be "the same".
ColdChef makes an excellent point, a significant number of locals are still not home yet. Without them, there is no Mardi Gras.
posted by Ynoxas at 6:38 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by Balisong at 6:38 PM CST on November 20 [!]
Incorrect.
Mardi Gras will be sad and forced this year. The only reason they will have it at all is because the city and businesses will be depending on tourist dollars to help rebuild. By depending I mean completely and totally reliant to have any chance at all to survive.
There is no reason to celebrate. The sorrow of Lent came half a year early.
I don't think anyone who holds New Orleans dear would want to be anywhere near it for Mardi Gras 2006. I expect some people would be suicidal.
It will never be "the same".
ColdChef makes an excellent point, a significant number of locals are still not home yet. Without them, there is no Mardi Gras.
posted by Ynoxas at 6:38 PM on November 20, 2005
does anyone care anymore about what is happening in New Orleans and the Gulf Coast?
Honestly. I haven't thought of New Orleans in over a month. Does that make me a bad person? Probably, but at least I feel a little bad about it.
They are just gonna bulldozer everything and try to erase what they did wrong. So so sad.
I agree, but perhaps some of it needed to be bulldozered. There should always be a New Orleans, but perhaps it is best to get rid of the low-level and flood-prone housing and build it up to a higher elevation while they have the chance to make permanent changes. It's a sad situation all around, so they should take the opportunity to prevent future tragedies.
posted by my sock puppet account at 6:40 PM on November 20, 2005
Honestly. I haven't thought of New Orleans in over a month. Does that make me a bad person? Probably, but at least I feel a little bad about it.
They are just gonna bulldozer everything and try to erase what they did wrong. So so sad.
I agree, but perhaps some of it needed to be bulldozered. There should always be a New Orleans, but perhaps it is best to get rid of the low-level and flood-prone housing and build it up to a higher elevation while they have the chance to make permanent changes. It's a sad situation all around, so they should take the opportunity to prevent future tragedies.
posted by my sock puppet account at 6:40 PM on November 20, 2005
balisong....you are kidding about the big scary bug question right?
ColdChef, I am originally from the FL panhandle, and the only news I hear is from my family (brothers spend almost every weekend in Mississippi helping out now).
No one talks about it up here at all any more.
very very scary.
posted by gminks at 6:40 PM on November 20, 2005
ColdChef, I am originally from the FL panhandle, and the only news I hear is from my family (brothers spend almost every weekend in Mississippi helping out now).
No one talks about it up here at all any more.
very very scary.
posted by gminks at 6:40 PM on November 20, 2005
300&60: Read ColdChef's link. Write, write, write. Make sure that our leaders don't forget NOLA.
posted by brundlefly at 6:40 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by brundlefly at 6:40 PM on November 20, 2005
Until then, anything we can do to actually help?
anything. everything.
send something
posted by eustatic at 6:43 PM on November 20, 2005
anything. everything.
send something
posted by eustatic at 6:43 PM on November 20, 2005
my sock puppet account...none of NO above water level...so that would make all of it low-level and flood-prone.
The editorial from NOLA.com that ColdChef is a great answer for people who imply they had it coming.
I think its sad that the place is going to be bulldozed because they are still finding bodies. People don't have the means to get home, even if they did there is no way to work and get money to survey for most folks.
What other choice do they have but to resign themselves to the fact that they have been f'ed over, and to try and find work where they landed?
Those are the people who can't go back for the ones that were left behind...the ones whose bodies will be entombed in the buldozed rubble. The ones everyone has already forgotten.
THAT is what is sad......
posted by gminks at 6:51 PM on November 20, 2005
The editorial from NOLA.com that ColdChef is a great answer for people who imply they had it coming.
I think its sad that the place is going to be bulldozed because they are still finding bodies. People don't have the means to get home, even if they did there is no way to work and get money to survey for most folks.
What other choice do they have but to resign themselves to the fact that they have been f'ed over, and to try and find work where they landed?
Those are the people who can't go back for the ones that were left behind...the ones whose bodies will be entombed in the buldozed rubble. The ones everyone has already forgotten.
THAT is what is sad......
posted by gminks at 6:51 PM on November 20, 2005
From the NOLA.com Mardi Gras weblog:
Fourteen weeks before the parade season starts, here's what we know about Mardi Gras 2006:
* There will be no parades in St. Bernard Parish.
* Gretna's three parades ... will roll as scheduled.
* All of Metairie's 13 parades will roll...
* The three krewes that parade on the westbank ... will roll, but it is not certain whether they will ... maintain their original route ...
* Thirty-one of the 34 clubs that paraded in Orleans Parish in 2005 ... want to roll in 2006.... Due to communications problems ... there is considerable confusion about the parade schedule.... The six-day parade season is far from definite.
The biggest issue ... is overtime funds, which are lacking for 2006. The NOPD will be trying to handle as many as four weekend parades ... a logistical impossibility. Suggestions have included seeking help from [outside]. Additional funding could come from a hotel room tax (some 26,000 rooms will be available by January)....
The city's shortage of money, equipment and manpower is not in question. Yet there seems to be a general agreement that a successful Mardi Gras is essential to the region's recovery. A canceled Mardi Gras would send the message, “New Orleans remains closed for business.”
This is a special a year, being the 150th anniversary of the first Mardi Gras parade in New Orleans. We owe it to our ancestors and our children to keep this cultural celebration alive. Krewe members, locals and visitors all need a reason to spread a little cheer, just as other generations did when Mardi Gras returned after the tragedies of world wars. This may be the most historic Mardi Gras ever and many will want to be a part of it.
The city's party image, however, must be balanced by one of financial responsibility. This has never been an issue before. ... No one can project numbers for next year, but we can assume that even a modest Mardi Gras would yield profits.
The real story for 2006 is not that Mardi Gras might be a little compressed, but that the region is able to present such a celebration at all, just months after being largely wiped out. Truly, the glass is more than half-full.
Me, I'm thinking about going, if I can cadge the fundage. I was supposed to be there for Voodoo on Halloween.
posted by dhartung at 6:53 PM on November 20, 2005
Fourteen weeks before the parade season starts, here's what we know about Mardi Gras 2006:
* There will be no parades in St. Bernard Parish.
* Gretna's three parades ... will roll as scheduled.
* All of Metairie's 13 parades will roll...
* The three krewes that parade on the westbank ... will roll, but it is not certain whether they will ... maintain their original route ...
* Thirty-one of the 34 clubs that paraded in Orleans Parish in 2005 ... want to roll in 2006.... Due to communications problems ... there is considerable confusion about the parade schedule.... The six-day parade season is far from definite.
The biggest issue ... is overtime funds, which are lacking for 2006. The NOPD will be trying to handle as many as four weekend parades ... a logistical impossibility. Suggestions have included seeking help from [outside]. Additional funding could come from a hotel room tax (some 26,000 rooms will be available by January)....
The city's shortage of money, equipment and manpower is not in question. Yet there seems to be a general agreement that a successful Mardi Gras is essential to the region's recovery. A canceled Mardi Gras would send the message, “New Orleans remains closed for business.”
This is a special a year, being the 150th anniversary of the first Mardi Gras parade in New Orleans. We owe it to our ancestors and our children to keep this cultural celebration alive. Krewe members, locals and visitors all need a reason to spread a little cheer, just as other generations did when Mardi Gras returned after the tragedies of world wars. This may be the most historic Mardi Gras ever and many will want to be a part of it.
The city's party image, however, must be balanced by one of financial responsibility. This has never been an issue before. ... No one can project numbers for next year, but we can assume that even a modest Mardi Gras would yield profits.
The real story for 2006 is not that Mardi Gras might be a little compressed, but that the region is able to present such a celebration at all, just months after being largely wiped out. Truly, the glass is more than half-full.
Me, I'm thinking about going, if I can cadge the fundage. I was supposed to be there for Voodoo on Halloween.
posted by dhartung at 6:53 PM on November 20, 2005
Here's one ray of light: Baton Rouge's always bawdy, always randy, mostly gay Spanishtown Parade will be rolling in 2006.
Their theme?
FEMAture Evacuation
posted by ColdChef at 6:56 PM on November 20, 2005
Their theme?
FEMAture Evacuation
posted by ColdChef at 6:56 PM on November 20, 2005
Those Gretna parades should be a hoot. Wonder if they'll block the bridges again?
posted by Scram at 6:59 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by Scram at 6:59 PM on November 20, 2005
We face more potential disasters. Lucky it wasnt ME. (summation of the current national zeitgeist).
posted by stbalbach at 7:27 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by stbalbach at 7:27 PM on November 20, 2005
Exactly what is your definition of "underreported"?
posted by justgary
WTF do I know. I don't read newspapers, subscribe to magazines or watch TV. In fact, I never leave my basement - which is cold and dark.
posted by Sagres at 7:46 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by justgary
WTF do I know. I don't read newspapers, subscribe to magazines or watch TV. In fact, I never leave my basement - which is cold and dark.
posted by Sagres at 7:46 PM on November 20, 2005
<idealist>
Y'know what would be really cool? If all, most or even some of the tens (and hundreds) of thousands people that went to go visit New Orleans for Mardi Gras pitched in to help clean up and rebuild.
Someone should organize a bunch of clean up parties. That's a whole lot of able bodies and hands that could be tapped for a few hours or a few days. It just needs to be focused and directed properly.
Sure, spending money there is nice. But why not spend some money and lend some elbow grease, too? People could have their party and lend a hand, they don't have to be mutually exclusive.
</idealist>
posted by loquacious at 7:52 PM on November 20, 2005
Y'know what would be really cool? If all, most or even some of the tens (and hundreds) of thousands people that went to go visit New Orleans for Mardi Gras pitched in to help clean up and rebuild.
Someone should organize a bunch of clean up parties. That's a whole lot of able bodies and hands that could be tapped for a few hours or a few days. It just needs to be focused and directed properly.
Sure, spending money there is nice. But why not spend some money and lend some elbow grease, too? People could have their party and lend a hand, they don't have to be mutually exclusive.
</idealist>
posted by loquacious at 7:52 PM on November 20, 2005
<realist>
Of course, having watched numerous videos of the incredibly drunken, boobie-grabbin', pants-pissing fratboy crowd, this idea would likely only end in tears and even more destruction.
</realist>
posted by loquacious at 8:19 PM on November 20, 2005
Of course, having watched numerous videos of the incredibly drunken, boobie-grabbin', pants-pissing fratboy crowd, this idea would likely only end in tears and even more destruction.
</realist>
posted by loquacious at 8:19 PM on November 20, 2005
Not to be a boobie-grabbin' fratboy, but :
Do you know what the biggest complaint is for the people I know who came back? It's that mostly guys came back. Few women came back, and most that came back are married. It is now one of the hardest towns to get laid in.
posted by suckerpunch at 8:42 PM on November 20, 2005
Do you know what the biggest complaint is for the people I know who came back? It's that mostly guys came back. Few women came back, and most that came back are married. It is now one of the hardest towns to get laid in.
posted by suckerpunch at 8:42 PM on November 20, 2005
This only happened a couple months ago. You people actually expect the various governments to be on top of this already? Ha!
First off, Katrina hit during a peak government employee vacation period. Only once everyone got back to work could they sit down and do any real planning, you know, forming committees, doing research, trying to figure out jurisdictions, the usual.
Well whoa! Thanksgiving is this week, and with the Christmas/New Years/King Day triumvirate upcoming, we are entering another major period of government employee vacations.
OK, mid-January, let's get those Requests For Quotes out for all these contracts. It's going to take a couple months because big money like this brings out the oversight folks in droves. Cross every i, dot every t, double check, triple check, pass the drafts up and down the management chain.
Oops, Easter!
Don't expect anything substantial to begin before late spring/early summer. Oh and guess what, not only are government employees taking their vacations again, but we are slap back into the next hurricane season.
The bottom line is this: Government agencies do not move fast. They are hampered by rules, regulations, oversight and all the rest of the bureaucratic folderol. Quick response? It just ain't gonna happen.
... and the Democrats would be slower still.
posted by mischief at 8:58 PM on November 20, 2005
First off, Katrina hit during a peak government employee vacation period. Only once everyone got back to work could they sit down and do any real planning, you know, forming committees, doing research, trying to figure out jurisdictions, the usual.
Well whoa! Thanksgiving is this week, and with the Christmas/New Years/King Day triumvirate upcoming, we are entering another major period of government employee vacations.
OK, mid-January, let's get those Requests For Quotes out for all these contracts. It's going to take a couple months because big money like this brings out the oversight folks in droves. Cross every i, dot every t, double check, triple check, pass the drafts up and down the management chain.
Oops, Easter!
Don't expect anything substantial to begin before late spring/early summer. Oh and guess what, not only are government employees taking their vacations again, but we are slap back into the next hurricane season.
The bottom line is this: Government agencies do not move fast. They are hampered by rules, regulations, oversight and all the rest of the bureaucratic folderol. Quick response? It just ain't gonna happen.
... and the Democrats would be slower still.
posted by mischief at 8:58 PM on November 20, 2005
"Someone should organize a bunch of clean up parties."
What they need is a fleet of bulldozers.
posted by mischief at 9:12 PM on November 20, 2005
What they need is a fleet of bulldozers.
"The outdoor mold spore concentrations could easily trigger serious allergic or asthmatic reactions in sensitive people," said Dr. Gina Solomon of the Natural Resources Defense Council. "The indoor air quality was even worse, rendering the homes we tested dangerously uninhabitable by any definition."If flood waters entered a home, that home is most probably permanently uninhabitable.
posted by mischief at 9:12 PM on November 20, 2005
Oh and one other thing, the federal government is not big enough to handle Katrina.
posted by mischief at 9:24 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by mischief at 9:24 PM on November 20, 2005
thanks for the links eustatic!!!
posted by threehundredandsixty at 9:59 PM on November 20, 2005
posted by threehundredandsixty at 9:59 PM on November 20, 2005
C'mon mischief, why mince words? It was Clinton, Kerry, and the French who are responsible.
Asshole.
posted by bardic at 10:11 PM on November 20, 2005
Asshole.
posted by bardic at 10:11 PM on November 20, 2005
i love reading all these discussions, but frankly, they all seem so academic - nobody can even comprehend the situation without being here, on the ground, living in new orleans. you can't begin understand the vastness of the destruction, or realize the depth of governmental failure that continues on every level, without seeing its effects every day, everywhere you go. i drive through lakeview every day on my way to work, and it never hurts any less to see. no television special or documentary can encapsulate our situation.
but more importantly, you can't understand the absolute determination of the people here to survive, to rebuild, to do whatever the hell it takes to make our lives and our city whole again. and the more they tell us we can't, the more we'll make it happen. if you're not a new orleanian, you simply can't understand the love we have for this place. we won't let it go; we just won't. never happen.
(Though many things are terrible here, some aren't as bad as are being reported, because people have made herculean efforts to get on with their lives already - though clearly impossible in the worst hit areas, I know many people who have already made the necessary repairs and mold remediation to make their homes liveable after having several feet of flooding.)
we need help, though. there WILL BE a mardi gras this year; hotels WILL BE open; PLEASE, if you've ever wanted to come here, DO. We need all the help we can get to bring our city back. we'll need that fleet of bulldozers, but we'll also need the clean up parties, and we'll certainly need the tourist economy back. everything helps.
most of all, please do what the Times Picayune suggests in today's editorial, and please, PLEASE WRITE congress on our behalf. write your congressmen and women and explain to them that there are no options here, it's not up for debate, New Orleans is a great American city, and we're doing what we can on our own, but we need all the money and federal assistance we can get to help bring back our city, and with it the food and music and history and culture (and oil) that we bring to the whole country.
posted by ab3 at 10:16 PM on November 20, 2005
but more importantly, you can't understand the absolute determination of the people here to survive, to rebuild, to do whatever the hell it takes to make our lives and our city whole again. and the more they tell us we can't, the more we'll make it happen. if you're not a new orleanian, you simply can't understand the love we have for this place. we won't let it go; we just won't. never happen.
(Though many things are terrible here, some aren't as bad as are being reported, because people have made herculean efforts to get on with their lives already - though clearly impossible in the worst hit areas, I know many people who have already made the necessary repairs and mold remediation to make their homes liveable after having several feet of flooding.)
we need help, though. there WILL BE a mardi gras this year; hotels WILL BE open; PLEASE, if you've ever wanted to come here, DO. We need all the help we can get to bring our city back. we'll need that fleet of bulldozers, but we'll also need the clean up parties, and we'll certainly need the tourist economy back. everything helps.
most of all, please do what the Times Picayune suggests in today's editorial, and please, PLEASE WRITE congress on our behalf. write your congressmen and women and explain to them that there are no options here, it's not up for debate, New Orleans is a great American city, and we're doing what we can on our own, but we need all the money and federal assistance we can get to help bring back our city, and with it the food and music and history and culture (and oil) that we bring to the whole country.
posted by ab3 at 10:16 PM on November 20, 2005
Tell me honestly: does anyone care anymore about what is happening in New Orleans and the Gulf Coast?
yep. it makes me crazy with grief.
i think it should be headline news every day, though. i can see why you would ask your question. if it's not on the news, you'd have to wonder if anyone remembers.
i'm pretty sure the government would like to forget since this interferes with their plans to bankrupt everything.
funny how the government is big enough for iraq but not the gulf coast.
a panel appointed by nagin from the urban land institute reported last week they want to a) not allow residents to rebuild themselves and b) wants the city to turn their finances over to the panel. this panel is headed by one smedes york, who is often described as "the former mayor of raleigh, nc." he was mayor something like 30 years ago. but he's mainly a mega-developer. you should be very wary of this guy. everything he touches turns into a boondooggle. whatever nola does, do not let your elected leaders turn your local goverment over to a non-elected NGO run by developers.
posted by 3.2.3 at 10:32 PM on November 20, 2005
yep. it makes me crazy with grief.
i think it should be headline news every day, though. i can see why you would ask your question. if it's not on the news, you'd have to wonder if anyone remembers.
i'm pretty sure the government would like to forget since this interferes with their plans to bankrupt everything.
funny how the government is big enough for iraq but not the gulf coast.
a panel appointed by nagin from the urban land institute reported last week they want to a) not allow residents to rebuild themselves and b) wants the city to turn their finances over to the panel. this panel is headed by one smedes york, who is often described as "the former mayor of raleigh, nc." he was mayor something like 30 years ago. but he's mainly a mega-developer. you should be very wary of this guy. everything he touches turns into a boondooggle. whatever nola does, do not let your elected leaders turn your local goverment over to a non-elected NGO run by developers.
posted by 3.2.3 at 10:32 PM on November 20, 2005
The only thing I trust the Federal Government to do with any sort of regularity is to try to take away whatever money I manage to get my hands on, and then try to spend it on mildly innovative ways of blowing people up.
Mold spores? Health risk? Y'know, to be honest I've never been to Mardi Gras, but the first pictures I think I ever smelled were ones of Bourbon Street taken very early the next morning after Good Friday.
Maybe they should just evacuate the whole area and bath it in sodium hypochlorite or chlorine dioxide, or whatever gas it is they're using recently to do mold abatement on whole (tented) buildings at once. (I just saw a small news segment on it, can't remember for sure what the name of the gas is they were using.)
posted by loquacious at 10:33 PM on November 20, 2005
Mold spores? Health risk? Y'know, to be honest I've never been to Mardi Gras, but the first pictures I think I ever smelled were ones of Bourbon Street taken very early the next morning after Good Friday.
Maybe they should just evacuate the whole area and bath it in sodium hypochlorite or chlorine dioxide, or whatever gas it is they're using recently to do mold abatement on whole (tented) buildings at once. (I just saw a small news segment on it, can't remember for sure what the name of the gas is they were using.)
posted by loquacious at 10:33 PM on November 20, 2005
bardic: We are going to have go back a whole hell of a lot further than Clinton and Kerry. Try Adams, Jefferson and Franklin (among others). The US Federal Government was never meant nor structured to handle catastrophes of this scale.
Ignorant pussy. ;-P
posted by mischief at 11:21 PM on November 20, 2005
Ignorant pussy. ;-P
posted by mischief at 11:21 PM on November 20, 2005
Face it. By the time the U.S. gets around to serious third world debt relief it will be because they qualify for it.
posted by srboisvert at 2:42 AM on November 21, 2005
posted by srboisvert at 2:42 AM on November 21, 2005
Tell me honestly: does anyone care anymore about what is happening in New Orleans and the Gulf Coast?
Yes. (Warning: self-link but more than willing to risk it)
This is a site intended for the volunteers who have spent their time helping Katrina victims in general and shoveling out Biloxi in particular. We go back home. We recruit more volunteers. It is an armload-at-a-time operation that I recommend highly.
Took a video camera and posted streams showing destruction you probably haven't seen on the news. We distribute the video to groups organizing their own volunteers.
posted by hal9k at 3:10 AM on November 21, 2005
Yes. (Warning: self-link but more than willing to risk it)
This is a site intended for the volunteers who have spent their time helping Katrina victims in general and shoveling out Biloxi in particular. We go back home. We recruit more volunteers. It is an armload-at-a-time operation that I recommend highly.
Took a video camera and posted streams showing destruction you probably haven't seen on the news. We distribute the video to groups organizing their own volunteers.
posted by hal9k at 3:10 AM on November 21, 2005
Does anyone still care about the Tsunami?
posted by Hildegarde at 5:14 AM on November 21, 2005
posted by Hildegarde at 5:14 AM on November 21, 2005
Does anyone still care about the WTC?
posted by localroger at 5:35 AM on November 21, 2005
posted by localroger at 5:35 AM on November 21, 2005
Quick! Look over there.
posted by srboisvert at 6:08 AM on November 21, 2005
posted by srboisvert at 6:08 AM on November 21, 2005
The bottom line is this: Government agencies do not move fast. They are hampered by rules, regulations, oversight and all the rest of the bureaucratic folderol. Quick response? It just ain't gonna happen.
... and the Democrats would be slower still.
posted by mischief at 11:58 PM EST
Yeah, let's jut give Halliburton some more no-bid contracts, that's the ticket! And the GOP is out to prove that government is the problem and so far they're doing a damn great and shoddy job of it.
Start a crazy war with no plan? check
Cut benefits to the poor and middle class? check
Run the deficit to new record highs? check
Funnel money to cronies? check
Massive tax breaks to corporations and the very wealthy? check
Break every law in existence to promote self interests? check
... and on and on ... GoF.ckYourself mischief!
Hell of a job GOP Bushies!
posted by nofundy at 7:19 AM on November 21, 2005
... and the Democrats would be slower still.
posted by mischief at 11:58 PM EST
Yeah, let's jut give Halliburton some more no-bid contracts, that's the ticket! And the GOP is out to prove that government is the problem and so far they're doing a damn great and shoddy job of it.
Start a crazy war with no plan? check
Cut benefits to the poor and middle class? check
Run the deficit to new record highs? check
Funnel money to cronies? check
Massive tax breaks to corporations and the very wealthy? check
Break every law in existence to promote self interests? check
... and on and on ... GoF.ckYourself mischief!
Hell of a job GOP Bushies!
posted by nofundy at 7:19 AM on November 21, 2005
and the Democrats would be slower still.
posted by mischief at 11:58 PM EST
Yeah, I so remember how sloooooowwww hurricane disaster response was before the Dubya team outsourced it all to their crony friends.
Y'all remember that, don't you?
Thanks for enlighteneing us.
We collectively forgot how awful things were when the focus of the country's media and Congress was on someone getting a blowjob!
My, how things have improved now that the "grownups" are in charge!
posted by nofundy at 7:31 AM on November 21, 2005
posted by mischief at 11:58 PM EST
Yeah, I so remember how sloooooowwww hurricane disaster response was before the Dubya team outsourced it all to their crony friends.
Y'all remember that, don't you?
Thanks for enlighteneing us.
We collectively forgot how awful things were when the focus of the country's media and Congress was on someone getting a blowjob!
My, how things have improved now that the "grownups" are in charge!
posted by nofundy at 7:31 AM on November 21, 2005
Does it count as not caring if you think Katrina was nothing, just really nothing, compared to the tsunami that preceeded it and the Pakistan/Kashmir earthquake that followed it? 80,000 people died in the earthquake -- and that's not counting the further tens of thousands who are going to freeze to death in the Himalayan winter because relief hasn't even reached them yet. I sent a hundred bucks to the Red Cross for Katrina relief right after it happened but everything I can spare right now is going to Oxfam and Save the Children for earthquake rescue. None of the New Orleans displaced persons are going to freeze to death or starve. As for rebuilding N.O., it's a fool's battle and shouldn't be attempted.
> The federal government decided long ago to try to tame the river and the
> swampy land spreading out from it. The country needed this waterlogged
> land of ours to prosper, so that the nation could prosper even more.
No human decision lasts forever, and this too shall pass. Ask the Romans.
posted by jfuller at 7:33 AM on November 21, 2005
> The federal government decided long ago to try to tame the river and the
> swampy land spreading out from it. The country needed this waterlogged
> land of ours to prosper, so that the nation could prosper even more.
No human decision lasts forever, and this too shall pass. Ask the Romans.
posted by jfuller at 7:33 AM on November 21, 2005
Does anyone still care about the Tsunami?
Does anyone still care about the WTC?
Pakistan?
posted by mrgrimm at 8:39 AM on November 21, 2005
Does anyone still care about the WTC?
Pakistan?
posted by mrgrimm at 8:39 AM on November 21, 2005
... and the Democrats would be slower still.
posted by mischief at 8:58 PM PST on November 20
You know, FEMA under Clinton wasn't all that bad. I don't know what you've been up to lately, but you've been pretty weird and unreasonable and I wish you'd go back to being the mischief people liked.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 10:14 AM on November 21, 2005
posted by mischief at 8:58 PM PST on November 20
You know, FEMA under Clinton wasn't all that bad. I don't know what you've been up to lately, but you've been pretty weird and unreasonable and I wish you'd go back to being the mischief people liked.
posted by Optimus Chyme at 10:14 AM on November 21, 2005
I may be wrong, OC, but I think some of you are reading my comments as attacks on Demos. OK, one little snark, but the rest was neither blaming Demos nor apologizing for Repubs; that's just how it is with our federal system.
To put it in terms some of you may understand, the federal government does not scale. It can handle routine business, it can handle small disasters, it can even attack a country (but only because the military is centuries old). What it can't do is rebuild an entire coastline over night. What are we talking about here? 1/4 million square miles? Victims numbering in the millions?
FEMA only has 2600 employees, and subtracting out 600 to work in DC (probably too few) and then dividing the rest among its 10 regions, we only have 200 FEMA employees permanently assigned to Louisiana and surrounding states. Now, just what can 200 people do when faced with a disaster this big?
More to my point, just what is it do you all expect them to do? Specifically? I want a detailed analysis from one of you that specifies exactly what these 200 government employees are supposed to be doing?
Blaming the government is easy when you expect the government to be the answer for every social ill. Recognizing that government, especially the federal government, is severely limited in what it can do on a local level is being a responsible citizen.
posted by mischief at 10:56 AM on November 21, 2005
To put it in terms some of you may understand, the federal government does not scale. It can handle routine business, it can handle small disasters, it can even attack a country (but only because the military is centuries old). What it can't do is rebuild an entire coastline over night. What are we talking about here? 1/4 million square miles? Victims numbering in the millions?
FEMA only has 2600 employees, and subtracting out 600 to work in DC (probably too few) and then dividing the rest among its 10 regions, we only have 200 FEMA employees permanently assigned to Louisiana and surrounding states. Now, just what can 200 people do when faced with a disaster this big?
More to my point, just what is it do you all expect them to do? Specifically? I want a detailed analysis from one of you that specifies exactly what these 200 government employees are supposed to be doing?
Blaming the government is easy when you expect the government to be the answer for every social ill. Recognizing that government, especially the federal government, is severely limited in what it can do on a local level is being a responsible citizen.
posted by mischief at 10:56 AM on November 21, 2005
"Maybe they should just evacuate the whole area and bath it in sodium hypochlorite or chlorine dioxide, or whatever gas it is they're using recently to do mold abatement on whole (tented) buildings at once."
posted by mischief at 12:19 PM on November 21, 2005
It is important to remember that dead mold spores are just as allergenic as those that are actively growing.The problem remains, loq, that disposing of the dead mold costs more than the houses are now worth.
Mycotoxins are found in both living and dead mold spores. Materials permeated with mold need to be removed even after they are disinfected with cleaning solutions.But that's not really an issue because every FEMA employee is an expert on mold disposal in mass quantities and each has years of experience dealing with the problem.
posted by mischief at 12:19 PM on November 21, 2005
The previous comments have shown me that we are, in fact, being left to fend for ourselves down here. (except for the volunteers who are doing their part--I love you all).
Pretty much what I thought.
I wasn't trying to say that the devastation to New Orleans and the Gulf Coast are equal to other recent tragedies (but it is nice to know that body count is apparently the only number that counts), I was just wondering if anyone in the world who isn't from here really fucking cares whether or not the city and region survives.
I guess I lived under the delusion that the world has missed us and will miss us. I'm sure that if Miami or Orlando or even, say, Atlanta had 80% of the city destroyed, the effort to rebuild would be larger and more determined. At least, I hope it would be.
I wonder what the problem is here. Is it us? Is it because we didn't evacuate soon enough? Is it because this could happen again someday in the future? Are we not worth the chance? Is it because no one takes us seriously because of Bourbon Street and Mardi Gras? Is it because we're black? Is it?
It's hard for me to be objective about this, it really is. So, I'll spare you all the anger I felt reading some of these comments. I hope nothing like this ever happens to any of you, but if I does, I hope I'll still be thinking about you 85 days later.
posted by ColdChef at 12:55 PM on November 21, 2005
Pretty much what I thought.
I wasn't trying to say that the devastation to New Orleans and the Gulf Coast are equal to other recent tragedies (but it is nice to know that body count is apparently the only number that counts), I was just wondering if anyone in the world who isn't from here really fucking cares whether or not the city and region survives.
I guess I lived under the delusion that the world has missed us and will miss us. I'm sure that if Miami or Orlando or even, say, Atlanta had 80% of the city destroyed, the effort to rebuild would be larger and more determined. At least, I hope it would be.
I wonder what the problem is here. Is it us? Is it because we didn't evacuate soon enough? Is it because this could happen again someday in the future? Are we not worth the chance? Is it because no one takes us seriously because of Bourbon Street and Mardi Gras? Is it because we're black? Is it?
It's hard for me to be objective about this, it really is. So, I'll spare you all the anger I felt reading some of these comments. I hope nothing like this ever happens to any of you, but if I does, I hope I'll still be thinking about you 85 days later.
posted by ColdChef at 12:55 PM on November 21, 2005
It's not that people don't care, it's that there's just...so...much going on everywhere in the world. Where does one start? As so many have said... the Tsunami? the earthquake in Pakistan? American soldiers dying in Iraq? I mean, the list goes on. I'm not trying to make excuses, here, just relate how I see myself responding to the overwhelmingness of all these tragedies.
posted by hapax_legomenon at 1:53 PM on November 21, 2005
posted by hapax_legomenon at 1:53 PM on November 21, 2005
And I understand that. Really, I do. And I'm not asking people to quit their jobs, come down here and haul trash. And I'm not asking for more handouts or another telethon.
I just want to know if anyone cares. Whether they are able to do anything or not...do you think about us? Will you miss us if we disappear?
posted by ColdChef at 1:58 PM on November 21, 2005
I just want to know if anyone cares. Whether they are able to do anything or not...do you think about us? Will you miss us if we disappear?
posted by ColdChef at 1:58 PM on November 21, 2005
I'm sorry. I really am. It's just...with the holidays coming, I can feel the depression setting in.
This year is going to suck.
posted by ColdChef at 1:59 PM on November 21, 2005
This year is going to suck.
posted by ColdChef at 1:59 PM on November 21, 2005
ColdChef, what is the most important thing we could do to help? I've thought of volunteering for a week or two, but the cost of taking a trip down there would probably be better spent as a donation. Also, the impression I got was there are a lot of people down there with few jobs and no homes -- and if I don't have any special skills to contribute (i.e. if I'm not a medic or a construction worker), it would make little sense for me to go down there when the same job could be done as well or better by a native Orleanian who is looking for something to do. I'm afraid I'd just be an extra mouth to feed and house.
Convince me that I'm wrong, and I'll honestly look into making a trip. Or if I'm right, what is the best thing I can do from here? I -hope- there are other MeFites with the same questions, and eagerness to act once we know what to do...
posted by purple_frogs at 2:43 PM on November 21, 2005
Convince me that I'm wrong, and I'll honestly look into making a trip. Or if I'm right, what is the best thing I can do from here? I -hope- there are other MeFites with the same questions, and eagerness to act once we know what to do...
posted by purple_frogs at 2:43 PM on November 21, 2005
I just want to know if anyone cares. Whether they are able to do anything or not...do you think about us? Will you miss us if we disappear?
posted by ColdChef at 1:58 PM PST on November 21 [!]
Yes, Cold Chef, we would.
Katrina hit me harder than any disaster I've ever watched from a distance - I saw the people on the tv, and I saw my family. I was crying much of that week, and I still worry now. I'll admit - it was because they were North American, and looked like my family - the weather was warmer and there were houses instead of apartment buildings, but it looked like where I grew up. It hit me that much more personally.
I recognise that in sheer numbers, the earthquake in Pakistan was a far worse disaster, but can you enumerate human lives like that? Disaster is disaster. All we can do is what we can. I don't know if it's enough.
But if it makes you feel any better, there are people all over thinking of you. Not everyone, and not all the time, our own lives take over, but the Gulf Coast is still thought of.
posted by jb at 2:45 PM on November 21, 2005
posted by ColdChef at 1:58 PM PST on November 21 [!]
Yes, Cold Chef, we would.
Katrina hit me harder than any disaster I've ever watched from a distance - I saw the people on the tv, and I saw my family. I was crying much of that week, and I still worry now. I'll admit - it was because they were North American, and looked like my family - the weather was warmer and there were houses instead of apartment buildings, but it looked like where I grew up. It hit me that much more personally.
I recognise that in sheer numbers, the earthquake in Pakistan was a far worse disaster, but can you enumerate human lives like that? Disaster is disaster. All we can do is what we can. I don't know if it's enough.
But if it makes you feel any better, there are people all over thinking of you. Not everyone, and not all the time, our own lives take over, but the Gulf Coast is still thought of.
posted by jb at 2:45 PM on November 21, 2005
First off, Katrina hit during a peak government employee vacation period.
You mean the Bush administration?
posted by Kirth Gerson at 6:12 PM on November 21, 2005
You mean the Bush administration?
posted by Kirth Gerson at 6:12 PM on November 21, 2005
The bottom line is this: Government agencies do not move fast.
Then.
Get.
Faster.
What the motherfuck am I paying taxes for if the goddamn federal government can't handle this in a timely, efficient fashion?
There is no good excuse for why America is not much further along in the process of rebuilding the Gulf coast.
"Oh, but there's mold this, and flood that, and damaged this, and blah blah blah blah." Get fucking bent. What sorry drivel. With all of the resources of this country, this is a problem that can be fixed and probably should have been fixed already. How can this be in such bad shape that we've got to trot out some weak nonsense about being allergic to the mold that's grown on the houses that have been left to rot. FUCKING FIX IT ALREADY. Requisition some goddamn respirators and get to work. We could even *gasp* bring some of the troops home from I-fucking-raq to help out!
Oh, and:
Does anyone still care about the Tsunami?
Does anyone still care about the WTC?
Pakistan?
Just because we're talking about Katrina doesn't mean that we don't care about those other disasters, too. I'm pretty tired of the mentality that seems to require that we be equally pissed off about all tragedies simultaneously and that our outrage is somehow invalidated if we can't maintain an equal amount of attention devoted between every past or present injustice on the planet at once.
/flameout
posted by Jon-o at 8:03 PM on November 21, 2005
Then.
Get.
Faster.
What the motherfuck am I paying taxes for if the goddamn federal government can't handle this in a timely, efficient fashion?
There is no good excuse for why America is not much further along in the process of rebuilding the Gulf coast.
"Oh, but there's mold this, and flood that, and damaged this, and blah blah blah blah." Get fucking bent. What sorry drivel. With all of the resources of this country, this is a problem that can be fixed and probably should have been fixed already. How can this be in such bad shape that we've got to trot out some weak nonsense about being allergic to the mold that's grown on the houses that have been left to rot. FUCKING FIX IT ALREADY. Requisition some goddamn respirators and get to work. We could even *gasp* bring some of the troops home from I-fucking-raq to help out!
Oh, and:
Does anyone still care about the Tsunami?
Does anyone still care about the WTC?
Pakistan?
Just because we're talking about Katrina doesn't mean that we don't care about those other disasters, too. I'm pretty tired of the mentality that seems to require that we be equally pissed off about all tragedies simultaneously and that our outrage is somehow invalidated if we can't maintain an equal amount of attention devoted between every past or present injustice on the planet at once.
/flameout
posted by Jon-o at 8:03 PM on November 21, 2005
With all of the resources of this country, this is a problem that can be fixed and probably should have been fixed already.
Sorry. All the good resources are in "I-fucking-raq". Or otherwise busy being indignant. We'll throw some more tax dollars at it so it won't bother you anymore. I'll write a letter to the President and we'll see if we can get it all mopped up.
This is a natural catastrophe of historical significance that is too big for a government, certainly our present band of thieves otherwise indisposed, to fix.
So it comes down to you. What are you going to tell your grandchildren? That you stated for the record your displeasure on a blog?
Why not volunteer? Serious. Call up a church in your area. Pick a denomination. Write me and I'll find you one. Atheists welcome too. Or agnostics like myself. They are setting aside funds and sending volunteers, paying for transportation, room and board. All they need is your time, your arms, your ears. Food is great. You don't have to fill out those long mortgage-like Red Cross Volunteer forms.
Don't be worried that you'll be preached at. The days start at 5:30am and can end at midnight. There won't be time. And this isn't about you anyway.
You'll see some scary things that will haunt you the rest of your life. Good. You need to be shocked out of this stupor that thinks your government, any government, is capable of fixing anything larger than a pot hole.
You'll come back just as pissed off as you left. That's good too. You, yes you: one of the actual "resources of this country" we can count on will have done your part. Your friends will not be able to shut you up and you won't shut up until you can get a handful of them to themselves volunteer. Even though it might not show up on a Google search, it is real, it is being done even as we sit here and lazily scan our email.
For December, I've helped recruit 60 local people to go down in alternating weeks. I go back in January. And I'm meeting my nephew and his roommate there to work alongside since he grew up in another state. Great place to get to know people. And yourself.
Feel free to message me if you want more info or look for the links in my previous post.
posted by hal9k at 2:50 AM on November 22, 2005
Sorry. All the good resources are in "I-fucking-raq". Or otherwise busy being indignant. We'll throw some more tax dollars at it so it won't bother you anymore. I'll write a letter to the President and we'll see if we can get it all mopped up.
This is a natural catastrophe of historical significance that is too big for a government, certainly our present band of thieves otherwise indisposed, to fix.
So it comes down to you. What are you going to tell your grandchildren? That you stated for the record your displeasure on a blog?
Why not volunteer? Serious. Call up a church in your area. Pick a denomination. Write me and I'll find you one. Atheists welcome too. Or agnostics like myself. They are setting aside funds and sending volunteers, paying for transportation, room and board. All they need is your time, your arms, your ears. Food is great. You don't have to fill out those long mortgage-like Red Cross Volunteer forms.
Don't be worried that you'll be preached at. The days start at 5:30am and can end at midnight. There won't be time. And this isn't about you anyway.
You'll see some scary things that will haunt you the rest of your life. Good. You need to be shocked out of this stupor that thinks your government, any government, is capable of fixing anything larger than a pot hole.
You'll come back just as pissed off as you left. That's good too. You, yes you: one of the actual "resources of this country" we can count on will have done your part. Your friends will not be able to shut you up and you won't shut up until you can get a handful of them to themselves volunteer. Even though it might not show up on a Google search, it is real, it is being done even as we sit here and lazily scan our email.
For December, I've helped recruit 60 local people to go down in alternating weeks. I go back in January. And I'm meeting my nephew and his roommate there to work alongside since he grew up in another state. Great place to get to know people. And yourself.
Feel free to message me if you want more info or look for the links in my previous post.
posted by hal9k at 2:50 AM on November 22, 2005
What are you going to tell your grandchildren? That you stated for the record your displeasure on a blog?
Ask around, hal9k. I did absolutely as much as I could.
I could go into detail but my charity is my own business, thank you.
posted by Jon-o at 7:28 AM on November 22, 2005
Ask around, hal9k. I did absolutely as much as I could.
I could go into detail but my charity is my own business, thank you.
posted by Jon-o at 7:28 AM on November 22, 2005
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posted by Balisong at 4:38 PM on November 20, 2005