It's kind of like peering into your Granny's old kitchen cabinets.

December 22, 2005 9:17 PM

The best helicopter gunship in the world, flown by the best pilots in the world, the British Army (sic), against the best handling car in the world, driven by an idiot. Who wants to be an idiot for Christmas?
posted by hindmost (82 comments total)

you?
posted by slogger at 9:24 PM on December 22, 2005

Your uncle?
posted by Mr Bluesky at 9:43 PM on December 22, 2005

How much of the earth is paved with smooth asphalt? 0.00000001%?
posted by shoos at 9:47 PM on December 22, 2005

I love the Elise, and moreso the Exige. Totally impractical of course, but I still love it.
posted by Stunt at 9:48 PM on December 22, 2005

Fun, but a pointless comparison. Better still was the time when Clarkson flew in a helicopter gunship and shot up a shitty american quasi-sportscar in a desert somewhere.
posted by marvin at 9:53 PM on December 22, 2005

All that engineering brilliance put into the car, and they built the steering wheel on the wrong side! What a gaf!

[cool video anyways]
posted by Citizen Premier at 9:58 PM on December 22, 2005

This is such a dumb stunt . . .

When I was a kid, I had a little remote control car. Over short distances and from a standing start, say 25-50 feet or so, it'd beat out any car on the planet. It's just basic physics.

So it's not terribly surprising that an Apache can't lock on to a car when forced to deal with it in close quarters. This is why, I suspect, no helicopter pilot in the world would attempt to chase down a vehicle like this. It'd be like asking a sumo wrestler to chase down an olympic gymnast.

Still, it was kinda cool to see a fancy ass car with a big scary helicopter tailing it. Except for the idiot behind the wheel. Who is that guy?
posted by aladfar at 9:59 PM on December 22, 2005

Who is that guy?
Jeremy Clarkson, british car journalist. One of them "you either like him or hate him" characters.
posted by slater at 10:16 PM on December 22, 2005

Just download and watch every episode of Top Gear. It's worth it.
posted by smackfu at 10:17 PM on December 22, 2005

As a joke in the original Top Gear episode, once they were back in the studio Clarkson offered to show what happened if the Apache actually did what it was designed to do, (i.e., pop up behind a tree from a distance). It was a helicopter-perspective shot of a frantically turning Elise being blown to smithereens.

Fun show.
posted by Ickster at 10:20 PM on December 22, 2005

"soft American underbellly"

Hee.
posted by MarvinTheCat at 10:28 PM on December 22, 2005

The video was ok ... but hearing old Black Sabbath and Motorhead kinda made it worth it.
posted by forforf at 10:32 PM on December 22, 2005

But *lip trembling* as far as helicopters go, though Apache is sexy.
posted by drezdn at 10:48 PM on December 22, 2005

So is clarkson driving the one-off racecar in the 3rd liink (400hp, F1 suspension etc.) or is is the stock exige that mortals can buy?
posted by lalochezia at 10:50 PM on December 22, 2005

One of the benefits of being in the U.S. Army was going out in the field as OPFOR and getting a feel for what it would be like on the receiving end of American military might. I can tell you there is nothing in the world like the Apache. It's like you took a shark, deified it, gave it wings and the ability to see in the dark. I am not a war pornophile, but this machine left me in awe.

One of the ironies of modern politics/warfare is that the mission of this machine, to destroy the waves of Warsaw Pact armor steaming into Western Germany, has entirely evaporated. History's greatest tank killer is left with nothing at all to kill.
posted by Nahum Tate at 10:53 PM on December 22, 2005

I knew that was going to be Clarkson before I even clicked on the link. I love Top Gear. The one where they all buy the shittiest cars they can find and drive them from London to Manchester is hilarious. The one where they roadtested the Yugo? Comedy Gold.

One of my major life ambitions is to do that "reasonably priced family car" timed lap thing. It would almost be worth going to all the effort of becoming a famous Hollywood type for that alone.
posted by fshgrl at 10:59 PM on December 22, 2005

So it couldn't get radar lock. The helo could've shot the damn car with the nose cannon any time it wanted.
posted by frogan at 11:10 PM on December 22, 2005

Maybe it's just me, but that's some badass cinematography/editing/general production.
posted by Firas at 11:14 PM on December 22, 2005

just me who thinks so
posted by Firas at 11:15 PM on December 22, 2005

Brilliant video work, I seconded.
posted by alteredcarbon at 11:32 PM on December 22, 2005

That whole show is very well produced. I'm surprised it hasn't become a transatlantic hit.
posted by nyterrant at 11:38 PM on December 22, 2005

yeah, the editing on that was phenomenal. I actually started thinking, without reading this thread, that THAT'S how my old company should have made their auto shows.
posted by shmegegge at 11:45 PM on December 22, 2005

I got hooked on Top Gear in South Africa. Yeah, like many British shows (such as the original "The Office"), it's a shame it hasn't crossed the pond--at least not without being Stupidized.
posted by trigonometry at 11:50 PM on December 22, 2005

That whole show is very well produced. I'm surprised it hasn't become a transatlantic hit.

Seems to me that i've seen this type of show on the "Science" Channel -- a standard part of my digital cable package. Very nice editing in this segment, indeed.

Too bad it's a totally ludacris comparison.

Also: Is the British Army always for hire? Do they do Birthdays? [mine is on the 26th].
posted by phylum sinter at 11:51 PM on December 22, 2005

Being a motoring show, Top Gear has lots of young male viewers. I'm sure the British Army is very keen to make themselves look cool to a lots of young male viewers. Clarkson has also raced a Range Rover against a Challenger 2 tank and Top Gear's tame racing driver Stig raced a Saab 9-5 against a Sea Harrier jet. Of course, they've also raced a Ferrari against Airplane to Switzerland, an Aston Martin against the TGV to Nice, A Bugatti against a Cessna from Italy to London, some rock-climbers against an Audi S4, a marathon runner against a Fiat Panda through London in rush hour, a Renault Clio against a bicycle through old Lisbon and a Mercedes McLaren SLR against a ferry+speedboat to Oslo. Sure, the comparisons are silly, but it's fun nonetheless.
posted by fred_ashmore at 12:03 AM on December 23, 2005

It must take a lot of courage or even more stupidity to slide a car that wispy -- it's essentally just bits of car bolted onto an engine -- under an Apache hovering at approximately zero altitude. You want to talk downforce? I'm surprised it didn't pancake him.
posted by George_Spiggott at 12:16 AM on December 23, 2005

Why the "(sic)"?

As I posted in the last thread we had on Top Gear, episodes can be downloaded from Final Gear.
posted by salmacis at 12:29 AM on December 23, 2005

fred_ashmore: You're forgetting the one where Clarkson drove an SLK and a Boxster through an abandoned hamlet while British Army soldiers shot at him with practice laser rifles. The idea was that the car with the best handling would be the car in which Clarkson didn't "die."

Word is the Discovery Channel is considering an all-new American version of Top Gear. Frankly, considering how the Americans screw up anything to do with British television (except Cathy Rogers), I don't have high hopes for this.
posted by chrominance at 12:39 AM on December 23, 2005

You can get Top Gear in the US, or you could. It was on Speed a couple of years ago.
posted by fshgrl at 12:57 AM on December 23, 2005

enough fucking Jeremy Clarkson.
"you either love him or hate him"
If ever I was tempted to write "WTF" it's now. Can anyone actually like this complete dickhead ? Please no more posts about him or his stupid TV program. And it's really, really not badass cinematography/editing/general production. they just shoot the whole program though a ridiculous barrage of straw filters and vignettes to give it a spurious and tacky "film look". I'm going to stop now before I *really* start ranting.
posted by silence at 12:59 AM on December 23, 2005

Can anyone actually like this complete dickhead ?

Well, he is a dickhead. However, what is really important is that he is a funny and entertaining dickhead. Therefore, I'd rather watch him on TV than a whole lot of boring and unentertaining reasonable people.
posted by fred_ashmore at 1:13 AM on December 23, 2005

Heh, I never claimed to be a film critic. I was referring to the last quarter where the 'copter flirts with the sports car and I wouldn't be surprised if it was my 'w00t!' response speaking. The opening minutes are pretty tacky, I'd agree. That said, you seem to harbour a fair bit of bile for the program's anchor that may jaundice your critique of its technical merit, don't you think?
posted by Firas at 1:19 AM on December 23, 2005

that was re: silence
posted by Firas at 1:19 AM on December 23, 2005

Yes, some people could. I personally love the show; I find it entertaining. I also really like the way it's shot and put together. Regardless of how tacky or cheesy you think the production quality is I happen to think it makes it look a hell of a lot more interesting that the way most shows of the sort are shot. I also think that it lends to a great feel for some of the shots.

It's obvious from the show's immense popularity that many, MANY people like it. Just because you don't doesn't mean anything. Everyone has different tastes and opinions.
posted by Stunt at 1:21 AM on December 23, 2005

Yes silence, some of us actually do like this guy. Top Gear does do some serious car reviews, but it has to be said the majority of the show is rather silly.

They do some stupid stunts, drive very fast cars most of us will never be able to afford, and present it all in an imature fashion. They get to do daft things we have often thought up in drunken conversations with our mates down the pub, like playing conkers with caravans or driving full size remote control cars.

But the point is that it is entertaining and it's a refreshing change from the never ending lineup of dreary soap operas we are offered the rest of the time on TV.
posted by bap98189 at 1:21 AM on December 23, 2005

Why the "(sic)"?

I second the question.

hindmost - I'm guessing that sic doesn't mean what you want it to mean...
posted by benzo8 at 1:27 AM on December 23, 2005

Awwww, we got silence all upset.

Y'know, I have this little rule that anyone who publically declaims someone a 'complete dickhead' probably is one themselves.

Bu then, I'm a 'complete dickhead' myself.

Here's an idea; next time you see someone do a FPP about something you don't like, instead of putting on your stylish little art school hat and telling us in such wonderful words such as , "vignettes", "spurious" and "*really*", why not jump into that bag of internet acronyms and pull out another well known one, namely STFU and/or even GYOBF, and embace the name you have chosen for yourself.

Back to the post.

Liked it, would love to do something like that myself and I find both Clarkson and the show loads of fun.
posted by Dagobert at 1:28 AM on December 23, 2005

That said, you seem to harbour a fair bit of bile for the program's anchor that may jaundice your critique of its technical merit, don't you think?

Yeah, it's probably not coincidental that a tri-wheel rider does not like the cinematography of the notoriously anti-cycling Top Gear.
posted by fred_ashmore at 1:44 AM on December 23, 2005

Add me to the list of people who like Clarkson. He's definitely a punkass, but the dynamic between the three hosts works so well, I wouldn't have him any other way. And yes, the stunts are silly, but man, they're great fun to watch.

I've been into cars since I was a kid, and lately been subjected to a show, I think it's called Motorweek, on Speed. It's painful. It's nothing more than an advertisement for whatever car they have on that week. Top Gear is the car show I've wanted for years, and finally, finally (thank you, BitTorrent) I get to see it.

It's been airing here and there in an Americanized version on Discovery. They wiped out the time board and have started clean with cars that show up on the American version. They've also wiped out the interviews, and also taken out a few of the nasty insults volleyed at us Americans. I tend to hope that anyone who watches Discovery regularly can also handle some anti-American jokes, but then again, I also find I overestimate those around me.

Oh, and the show on Speed Channel was Fifth Gear (another fun show, but not nearly as silly as Top Gear).
posted by Swervo at 2:19 AM on December 23, 2005

Oh, and just as an added note, I bought a new car a month ago. I'm 29, not particularly well dressed, but not filthy either, and had no problem test driving a Mazda MX-5, Subaru Impreza STi, Lancer Evolution, and Honda S2000. The one place I did have a problem was at the Lotus dealership, the salesman essentially accused me of being there to get a free drive in the car with no real interest in an Elise.

I can't say I would have bought one, it's horribly impracticle. However, I was seriously considering buying one. Hell, I bought the MX-5, so practicality was not high on my list. Lotus, teach your salesman to not turn away prospective buyers.
posted by Swervo at 2:23 AM on December 23, 2005

Ferrari Enzo....
posted by gen at 2:26 AM on December 23, 2005

Ariel Atom...
posted by gen at 2:35 AM on December 23, 2005

Swervo if you heard the interviews on Top Gear as it is now you'll hear Clarkson respond with "put it into top gear, just a slight quirp at the competitors there" when someone said "I put it into fifth gear". Tiff Needell, Quentin Wilson and Vicky Butler Henderson used to co present Top Gear with Clarkson a few years ago when it ran a 30 min Thursday night slot and was a far more serious programme that it is now.

Clarkson was making priced to own home videos including him blowing up caravans and driving sideways lots - these where popular (if not for the reduced from £12 to a £1 bargain bin in motorway service stations) and I guess the BBC decided to change the format of the show accordinly.

Top Gear rocks - its that simple.

But its rocked hard for a few years and nothing stays like so forever - much as that sucks. Though the day that Top Gear starts to suck and Aston Martins are no longer cool - I'm gonna cross the pond buy a gun (as a young Brit I assume its that easy) and shoot myself. Possibly.
posted by 13twelve at 2:37 AM on December 23, 2005

I do loathe Clarkson but can't help loving Top Gear and the stupid stunts like this that they do.

Why the "(sic)"?

Because Clarkson says "flown by the best pilots in the world, the British Army" which is unlikely to be true so Hindmost was making the point that the mistake is Clarkson's not his, but the comment is just hyperbolic nonsense really.
posted by electricinca at 3:05 AM on December 23, 2005

Well, he is a dickhead. However, what is really important is that he is a funny and entertaining dickhead.

Spot on. Top Gear has just started showing in Australia and I love every second of it. And it's exactly for trash like this. Perfect Monday-night escapism.

A man. A sportscar. A helicopter gunship. Motorhead.
What's not to like?

Thanks for posting, hindmost.
posted by bright cold day at 3:43 AM on December 23, 2005

I'm gonna cross the pond buy a gun (as a young Brit I assume its that easy)

No, you've pretty much got it right.
posted by BackwardsHatClub at 4:10 AM on December 23, 2005

I love Top Gear, and not just because it is completely unknown here in North America. I've posted previously about the Ariel Atom, but a few weeks ago I got really bored on a Sunday afternoon and spent the whole time watching Top Gear on Google Video. Beats the hell out of Motorweek. My other favs are the one where they play soccer in little Toyotas, and where they hipnotize his assistant.
posted by furtive at 4:57 AM on December 23, 2005

And it's really, really not badass cinematography/editing/general production. they just shoot the whole program though a ridiculous barrage of straw filters and vignettes to give it a spurious and tacky "film look". I'm going to stop now before I *really* start ranting.

Bad mouthing someone else's work without offering a better perspective or a better way of doing things is very 4th grade. Top Gear produced a few minutes of fast cut, well shot footage that was very entertaining. Of course, the BBCs production and editing teams are crap compared to how skilled and fantastic you are. I bet your dad could beat-up his dad too.

BBCs Top Gear is a great watch for any petrol head - 60 minutes of car-foolery without a single commercial break or product placement. Heaven!
posted by DrDoberman at 5:21 AM on December 23, 2005

This is exactly the sort of silliness that makes me like Top Gear so damn much.
posted by clevershark at 5:23 AM on December 23, 2005

Count me and my wife as HUGE top gear fans. We've been systematically going through all of the episodes from 2000 on when clarkson started.

It's turned us into "car people". The thing I've noticed watching that as well as readin clarkson and friend's times articles is that american car reviewers are VERY different than the european ones (and I'll clump the independents like truthaboutcars).

American reviewers tend to love anything. for them to disparage a car requires an act of god or a truly offensive automobile.

It's almost as if a car magazine/reviewer won't badmouth a car from a company that pays for advertising in their magazine..

Call me shocked :)

Regardless, I'm very very entertained by clarkson and friends.
posted by Lord_Pall at 5:28 AM on December 23, 2005

I saw Top Gear on US TV this summer - on Spike perhaps or maybe even Discovery something or other
posted by A189Nut at 6:41 AM on December 23, 2005

This is both juvenile and fun. And predictably British. But fun! But I'd still rather watch that video of Lelouche in Paris. Guess I'm a francophile wimp... (come to think of it, I'd like to see the lotus and the helicopter on an empty Route 17 in Paramus!)

By the way, are these video clips completely illegal, i.e., posted by some individual and then picked up by Google? How does that work?
posted by ParisParamus at 7:00 AM on December 23, 2005

I gotta say, I've never heard of Top Gear before, but now I'll certainly be hunting down as many old episodes as I can -- it looks like a lot of fun. Sure, the comparison to the Apache is silly, but it's clearly intended to be silly. (As others have said, put the Apache where it is intended to be for that hunt -- over a hill, or a half-mile away hovering a few hundred feet off the ground -- and there's no comparison. Likewise, even at that range, the nose cannon would have disabled the Lotus in about five seconds.) Count me a fan.
posted by delfuego at 7:05 AM on December 23, 2005

Discovery aired Top Gear during the summer.
posted by drezdn at 7:09 AM on December 23, 2005

Another good episode involved this Clarkson person driving a diesel Audi from London to {faraway_city} and back again on a single tank. Very interesting.
posted by odinsdream at 7:24 AM on December 23, 2005

ParisParamus: god, I miss the blacklist function while I'm at work... but, what exactly is illegal about it? The recording of the show off TV? The distribution of said recording, or the downloading of the recorded copy? Hardly "completely" now is it?
posted by odinsdream at 7:25 AM on December 23, 2005

Copyright infringement? Have you heard of that?
posted by ParisParamus at 7:34 AM on December 23, 2005

Blacklist function? Gee, you actually admit using that--amazing. is odinsnightmare taken?
posted by ParisParamus at 7:37 AM on December 23, 2005

I think 'sic' was a knee-jerk response to the best apache pilots in the world not being 'Mmerican'.

I wouldn't know or care frankly, but north European weather would tend to sharpen your flying skills. (Probably why the very best I ever worked with were Fleet Air Arm Lynx Pilots who were, frankly, fucking gung).
posted by fingerbang at 7:39 AM on December 23, 2005

Paris, please contact your local british barrister re copyright infringement for a british TV show, otherwise leave the snark and other typicall PP crap off this thread.
Thank You

RE ParisParamus: Nothing to see here, move along. . .
posted by mk1gti at 7:40 AM on December 23, 2005

its a perfectly reasonable question. Grow up.
posted by ParisParamus at 7:41 AM on December 23, 2005

Thanks to this page, I learned the Brits fly the AH-64; I thought that only the US and Israelis did until I went to this page and scrolled down.

It's a totally bullshit comparison, of course, because the helo was designed to kill tanks, not fly exactly like sports cars, but it's enjoyable "leave your mind behind" video nonetheless. It reminds me of a similarly silly drag race between a top-fuel dragster and an F-14 taxiing at full 'burner -- the car won the quarter-mile easily, but we all know which vehicle is really faster overall.
posted by alumshubby at 7:42 AM on December 23, 2005

Google doesn't "pick up" any videos. Someone took the time to upload them to Google Video, and their screening process didn't notice the uploader didn't have the copyright. Google does make you attest that you do have it, so I suppose they can always blame the uploader.

I am a bit surprised they don't take stuff down — the traffic for illegal stuff is probably very noticeable.
posted by smackfu at 7:43 AM on December 23, 2005

I suspect that, in the future, there will be fewer videos chez Google. On the other hand, the "pseudo-bootlegs" for promotion will increase. Enjoy the present wild, wild west state of things while it lasts...
posted by ParisParamus at 7:58 AM on December 23, 2005

Enjoy the present wild, wild west state of things while it lasts...

This is ironic, because of the fact that when the movie industry we all know and love today was first getting started, the overly-repressive copyright laws on the east coast caused them to move their business out of its reach, to the "wild, wild west side of things" so that they could thrive, albeit "illegally."
posted by odinsdream at 8:13 AM on December 23, 2005

Awwww, we got silence all upset.

Huh? Silence makes a comment about the post, and so in return you make fun of him? Are you a complete shithead?

Here's an idea; next time you see someone do a FPP about something you don't like, instead of putting on your stylish little art school hat and telling us in such wonderful words such as , "vignettes", "spurious" and "*really*", why not jump into that bag of internet acronyms and pull out another well known one, namely STFU and/or even GYOBF, and embace the name you have chosen for yourself.

What the hell do you think MetaFilter is for? The idea is that it stimulates discussion, presumably about what is posted (wow, surprise!).
posted by Elpoca at 8:19 AM on December 23, 2005

I'd like to see the lotus and the helicopter on an empty Route 17 in Paramus!

Sorry but the term "empty Route 17 in Paramus" returns no hits, so to speak.
posted by clevershark at 8:29 AM on December 23, 2005

what is it with top gear and the armed forces? they had a drag race between an aston martin and a nimrod a while back.

anyway, this is the most apalling glorification of war, pointless over-consumption, stupid, overweight middle aged males, environmental damage and agressive posturing.

yeah yeah, so i'm grinning from ear to ear....
posted by andrew cooke at 8:37 AM on December 23, 2005

AFAIK The BBC actually makes those Top Gear segments available on their web sites, so I wouldn't be surprised if the distribution through Google Video was actually authorized.
posted by clevershark at 8:42 AM on December 23, 2005

The scary thing is that Jeremy Clarkson is actually quite a smart chap. If you've ever seen him on QI he has quite an extraordinary breadth of knowledge. He's not the match of Stephen Fry by any means but you shouldn't sell him short because he appears to be a middle aged lout.
posted by longbaugh at 8:44 AM on December 23, 2005

Blacklist function? Gee, you actually admit using that--amazing.

That's the beauty of your frequent ejaculations in the blue, PP -- they've made killfiling not only acceptable, but noticeably pleasant. It's only too bad the mefi-killfile user script doesn't work with Firefox 1.5, which is why I see your posts at all when surfing from work.

I can do without frequent thread-shitters, frankly, and so can a lot of others.
posted by clevershark at 9:02 AM on December 23, 2005

The animosity between car and 'copter is only staged - afterwards, in the hanger, they cuddled.
posted by CynicalKnight at 9:09 AM on December 23, 2005

Lord_Pall nailed something I've been noticing for a long time - car mags and bike mags in the Ew Ess Ay aren't nearly as entertaining as the ones our cousins across the pond produce.

Performance Bikes is a great magazine even if you're not into motorcycles, and they're perfectly willing to flog a manufacturer in print if they don't like what said manufacturer produces. And yet they advertise anyway...go figure.

The topless chicks with the bikes certainly helps, too...IJS
posted by TeamBilly at 9:36 AM on December 23, 2005

Yeah, I totally agree re U.S. car mags, just a massive wankfest vs. the overseas mags which actually have *gasp* CONTENT.
posted by mk1gti at 10:31 AM on December 23, 2005

Probably why the very best I ever worked with were Fleet Air Arm Lynx Pilots who were, frankly, fucking gung

fingerbang, you were in the service? I was REME attached to AAC. Avionics - all of it on Lynx. I did a secondment to RN, and hung out with Fleet. They were insane. I guess you'd have to be to take that thing out over open water, but it takes an obsession with power lines to make a truly great pilot.
posted by veedubya at 10:52 AM on December 23, 2005

Too funny, i just discovered Top Gear less then 10 days ago and i have been obsessed (read as: obsessed) since my first episode. i have devoured as many episodes as i could get my greedy hands on.

Speaking of which; bless you salmacis for your finalgear link, it makes my life so much easier.

Best stunt i've seen so far: the ep where they play soccer (er... football) with Toyota citycars. had me laughing out loud and demanding that it be made into a real sport.
posted by quin at 11:11 AM on December 23, 2005

clevershark; I'm using Firefox 1.5 right now on a Mac, and the blacklist function works just fine. I'm using Greasemonkey 0.6.4, and the Metafilter Blacklist plugin. Sorry to say I don't know where I originally got the plugin, but if someone knows - I'd love to hear.
posted by odinsdream at 11:13 AM on December 23, 2005

Ah - okay, it's Metafilter Blacklist version 1.2 by Mystyk.
posted by odinsdream at 11:18 AM on December 23, 2005

Yeah, I totally agree re U.S. car mags, just a massive wankfest vs. the overseas mags which actually have *gasp* CONTENT.

This is also true, btw, of US motorcycle magazines vs. UK motorcycle mags. The UK ones are MUCH more interesting to read as they do slag bad bikes and they have a lot more fun doing it. The US mags are woefully boring and lame- with the exception of Motorcycle Consumer News, which takes no advertisers.
posted by gen at 2:30 PM on December 23, 2005

Yeah, it looks like the video is available for all the world to see, on the BBC Top Gear website (unfortunately, in RealVideo format: broadband, narrowband). So I don't know if the Beeb cares all that much that it's on Google Video...
posted by delfuego at 2:51 PM on December 23, 2005

Hey Veedubya. No I wasn't in 'the' service =)
I spent some time in Fermanagh and Tyrone mostly supported by (RAF) Pumas. Everytime it got a bit dicey they had no problems pulling the plug. The Navy pilots never did, ever.
posted by fingerbang at 8:06 AM on December 25, 2005

But *lip trembling* as far as helicopters go, though Apache is sexy.

True, but the Apache has nothing on the MIL HIND Gunship for pure awe-inspiring power.


posted by nlindstrom at 5:19 PM on December 26, 2005