Gitmo executons chechens
December 31, 2005 9:33 AM Subscribe
Guantanamo, America's War on Human Rights The reference to the Gitmo executions came from a number of chechens who had been caught in afghanistan but who have since returned to Russia. They were taking part ina political debate show(Russia) here, the name of which I don't recall. I am sorry a personal family death was going on at the same time. The show dealt with whether the US can be considered any kind of haven for human rights anymore. The general consensus was absolutely not. Then these three chechens in the audience got up and talked about how they had seen summary executions while incarcerated there. The host was talking to the audience and the chechens spoke with a large enough number of people before and after them -- and include their own details of these executions -- that I was inclined to believe it was not a scam or some prearranged thing between three friends. They said, actually, that none of them had seen each other while there and had no connection to each other. A chechen stringer I know from the good old days agreed with me and actually did a little digging himself and found that, no, these guys were not connected at all. They were also, according to their stories, released from GITMO at separate times. Furthermore, they all returned home to different regions in Russia, one to Moscow, one to Ingushetia, and the third to Vladikavkaz, where all of them have family apparently.
Granted, there are about a hundred of these shows on Russian TV these days and most of them are geared toward firing up the audience against the US. But having seen the inside of Russia's own concentration camps for chechen men of fighting age, the so called relocation centers that the Russians started building in 1996, I have to say that their stories entirely jibed with that sort of lawless incarceration. And none of the speakers were foaming at the mouth about the injustice of the Bush administration. One in particular was quiet, well spoken and mentioned the executions and then sort of paused so the host could pick up on the fact that he was talking not only about torture but summary executions, but like most gleaming-toothed talk show hosts in Russia, the guy totally missed. it.
And so did any of the major western papers and the Russians they pay slave wages to watch television for them 24 hours a day. I know that just from the current make up of the bureau at the NYT here in Russia, that they are so reticence, that they would not report and print a story on this even if they could prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that it was true. The Washington Post is similarly conservative. If anyone would have picked up on it, it would have been Kim Murphy from the Los Angeles Times. She has been here for a really long time, actually speaks Russia, unlike her coevals at other giant western papers, and has refused cushier and better paid bureau assignments to see how the Russia story finally plays out. But even so, I doubt there wlll be a groundswell or even a trickle of coverage unless other nationals who were held there start saying the same things.
As for me, I am inclined to believe them absolutely. The chechens themselves have no real grudge with the US and recall how Gore actually tried to help them. Some of them probably resent the silent deal betwen Bush and Putin that Washington will keep its mouth shut about Moscow's atrocities and abominations so long as Moscow does, but there are really a very few chechens who have the educated conspiratorial turn of mind to make the connection to begin with. It's not like the University of Grozny exists anymore, and for the most part, those who live in the republic live, like the rest of the country, in an information black hole . They have just dropped out of view on Russian TV so they reason -- and rightly so -- that the west has become bored with the problem as well. So I doubt very much that these guys were just trying to get attention. In fact, sitting among the 150 or so studio audience members, there was no guarantee they would get any attention during the 10 minutes or so the host roved the audience. So I think a terrifying truth has just slipped out, but not even the most liberal of respected liberal media are going to be printing anything about it anytime soon.
I thought about trying to interest someone like Michael Moore in it. He has the resources to bankroll an investigation to track these guys down and get the cameras to Moscow. But he is so in the middle of everything he does that he manages to lose as much credibility as he gains, and this is just far too important to let loose until there is no possible way the Bush administration can avoid being dragged to the stocks in the Hague for war crimes. More likely, Seymour Hersh will unearth something. There is a very slight chance that the New Yorkers Russophile edtor David Remnick may have somehow got wind of this. I remember reading this blog as well as it being drilled into our heads in basic "Just following orders" is NOT an excuse for abuse of power. The fact that this abuse of prisoners has and is going on is found in the USA IG report as well as Amenesity International report
This post was deleted for the following reason: too. much. text.
Well, thank goodness there wasn't any "more inside."
posted by SPrintF at 9:36 AM on December 31, 2005
posted by SPrintF at 9:36 AM on December 31, 2005
ding ding ding
posted by the giant pill at 9:36 AM on December 31, 2005
posted by the giant pill at 9:36 AM on December 31, 2005
You ever been to a forward area?
I was opposed to Gitmo, until I saw this post.
Now, I say fuck it.
and, uh, [more inside] is your friend.
posted by Busithoth at 9:37 AM on December 31, 2005
I was opposed to Gitmo, until I saw this post.
Now, I say fuck it.
and, uh, [more inside] is your friend.
posted by Busithoth at 9:37 AM on December 31, 2005
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posted by shoepal at 9:34 AM on December 31, 2005