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April 19, 2006 3:57 AM   Subscribe

Britain's New Labour have very short memories!

They are trying to persuade people to vote for them by highlighting exactly how they got in to power themselves as being a fault in the Conservative Party
posted by catchmurray (35 comments total)

 
It's bizarre how people imagine that political parties' idologies remain constant, regardless of social, cultural, personal, power and economic shifts.
Why would you vote for someone who is saying the things which were said 30 years ago and still aren't saving the country?

Besides that, shock!
New Labour: two-faced, willfully ignorant of their own past, the promises made and the needs of the people who trusted them. Again.
posted by NinjaTadpole at 4:14 AM on April 19, 2006


The chameleon is too cute. It will win.
posted by beerbajay at 4:15 AM on April 19, 2006


Well, 30 years ago is a different kettle of fish. I'm talking about 9 years ago.
posted by catchmurray at 4:33 AM on April 19, 2006


That picture has clearly been faked. No self-respecting chameleon would be seen dead on a full-sussy.
posted by veedubya at 4:34 AM on April 19, 2006


This is teh lame. Here is the equally lame blog and Video.

worth a little effort to find a few links, right?

He He, New Labour just like the Tories. Ho. Ho.

Do you remember the Tory government?

You're in for a suprise.
posted by grahamwell at 5:00 AM on April 19, 2006


link to film

Dave the chameleon is not just a character, it's David Cameron. Didn't quite get that from the article.
posted by beno at 5:02 AM on April 19, 2006


Do you remember the Tory government?

Oh yes. Vote Lib Dem.
posted by Decani at 5:05 AM on April 19, 2006


Did the Tories become sane? Since I started paying much attention to UK politics, some time in 1998 (BFBS radio in Germany), the Tories have sounded batshit insane. I haven't been paying much attention lately.

It puzzles me why liberal people, unhappy with so-called "New Labor" would look to the Tories. What's wrong with the Liberal Democrats? They sure seem to do well at the council level.

Of course I am mostly clueless about how British politics actually work (or fail to work).
posted by Goofyy at 5:07 AM on April 19, 2006


You don't win by giving your enimes cute mascots. Duh. This will make people want to vote for the torries. The Simple emotional message "torries are flip-floppers" will be overriden by the simple emotional message "Torries are cute!!!!"
posted by delmoi at 5:08 AM on April 19, 2006


Only in a very twisted political scene could changing your mind be considered a bad thing.

Hopefully you Brits will be able to flaunt your superior education and see through this particular smokescreen.
posted by Malor at 5:11 AM on April 19, 2006


It puzzles me why liberal people, unhappy with so-called "New Labor" would look to the Tories. What's wrong with the Liberal Democrats? They sure seem to do well at the council level.

Yeah it is odd. It seems to me that the over-all problem is that people think labor is too conservative: getting into Iraq, etc. Wouldn't it be better to vote for liberals?

Of course, I don't really know anything about the 'national mood' in england. What does the average, middle of the road british voter want?
posted by delmoi at 5:11 AM on April 19, 2006


He He, New Labour just like the Tories. Ho. Ho.

Do you remember the Tory government?


That's why you're doomed. You don't understand that when you vote Anybody But Tory, there's no reason for a Labour MP to listen to you. He's almost certainly got your vote, because he's not Tory.

The UK needs a short Tory government to remind Labour that they're supposed to listen to thier constiutents, and if they don't, they're out. If you aren't willing to risk that, then you've given New Labour carte blanch to do whatever they want to you -- as long, of course, as they are Not Tory.

What really sucks is you don't have to vote Tory to vote against Labour -- and yet, you act as if you do.
posted by eriko at 5:14 AM on April 19, 2006


Trust Beau Bo d'Or
One of the good political constants.
posted by NinjaTadpole at 5:15 AM on April 19, 2006


I determined that a tory is akin to a conservative, in colour and flavour, via a Gougle searche. Ooups, got a little carried away there.

Anyhoo, how did these guys end up with such cutesy ephemeral icons, when we get the perennial donkeys and elephants in the States?
posted by Clamwacker at 5:15 AM on April 19, 2006


What eriko just said rings loudly in my American ears. Owie.
posted by Clamwacker at 5:17 AM on April 19, 2006


I saw the ad last night, and couldn't believe what they'd done. It's far too slick and cute, and does a great job of emphasising that the Conservatives are changing.
posted by malevolent at 5:19 AM on April 19, 2006


The UK needs a short Tory government to remind Labour that they're supposed to listen to thier constiutents, and if they don't, they're out.

Not so, Blairites would interpret a defeat as caused by their failure to go far enough with 'reform', for which they would hold the left responsible. Also, you can't vote for 'a short Tory government', only a Tory government. If you hate New Labour for leftish reasons, you might do better to join the Labour Party.
posted by Mocata at 5:45 AM on April 19, 2006


(Or, dare I say it, vote Lib Dem.)
posted by Mocata at 5:48 AM on April 19, 2006


It's bizarre how people imagine that political parties' idologies remain constant, regardless of social, cultural, personal, power and economic shifts.
Why would you vote for someone who is saying the things which were said 30 years ago and still aren't saving the country?


Ask these folks.


posted by XQUZYPHYR at 5:52 AM on April 19, 2006


What really sucks is you don't have to vote Tory to vote against Labour -- and yet, you act as if you do.

I'm sensing an opportunity for Ralph Nader across the pond.
posted by illovich at 6:05 AM on April 19, 2006


What's wrong with the Liberal Democrats?

Well, quite a lot, probably, given that they're politicians. But seriously, I think too many of my fellow Brits are simply stuck in the old two party mentality. They struggle to get out of that mindset.

I seriously do not understand how anyone has been able to vote Labour without throwing up since the 1997 election. Blair's crew sold the left down the river, and since the Iraq war crime it has simply been impossible for any person with a decent set of morals to entertain the idea of voting for them - well, at least in my view, and that of many other former Labour voters I know. I'm afraid for me, complicity in a huge war crime outstrips any mere domestic issues as a deciding factor; I don't care how well Labour may or may not have done on that front. It's no longer an issue. You do not vote for war criminals, period.

The Lib Dem's manifesto has been noticeably and significantly to the left of Labour's for years; certainly on many of what I regard as key issues, AND, they opposed the war crime. Sure, they're untried in government but how the hell is that going to change unless people are willing to give them the chance? The bottom line is that Labour have shifted horribly to the right, they are now the party who attack civil liberties, who try to protect religion from well-deserved mockery, who support "faith schools", who introduce ID cards... horrible. It is unthinkable to vote Tory, ever, under any circumstances. These people are conservatives. We need a Bill Hicks moment whenever we might be tempted to even think about voting for them...woah, woah, woah, you're confused....they're conservative.

Vote Lib Dem.
posted by Decani at 6:12 AM on April 19, 2006


The UK needs a short Tory government ...

Sadly, in my experience, there's no such thing. Careful what you wish for....

I seriously do not understand how anyone has been able to vote Labour without throwing up since the 1997 election.

To steal a quote, "It's the economy, stupid!"

.. but yes, the war is a downer.
posted by grahamwell at 6:25 AM on April 19, 2006


What seems more scary, perhaps, is that people have been reported to be switching votes from Labour to the BNP (not sure if it was ever an FPP; perhaps a bit too newsfilter-ish at present...).

The main reason people haven't really voted LibDem previously (during the last blue government) was from the fear that if they did so, the LibDems wouldn't get a large-enough majority and hence Labour would still get a big say in the parliament - so better to keep voting for Conservative.

Nowadays I'm not too sure; I think that there's a lot of dissatisfaction with how Labour have (mis-)managed things, yet as people have pointed out, Labour are becoming more like the Conservatives.
Same ideals, same lies, different faces.

I can't really say hand-on-heart that the BNP is the answer, but I can fully understand why people would choose to vote for them... just as long as we don't end up electing our very own Hitler...
posted by Chunder at 6:26 AM on April 19, 2006


Dave the chameleon is not just a character

Turns out there is a person named 'Dave Chameleon' (see first paragraph)
posted by darsh at 6:27 AM on April 19, 2006


What's wrong with the Liberal Democrats?

Exactly the same thing which was wrong with Nader... first-past-the-post voting.


What really sucks is you don't have to vote Tory to vote against Labour -- and yet, you act as if you do.


Only if you wanted to change the government. If it's just about feeling good, vote Lib Dem. Or go to the pub and get tanked. One of those.
posted by pompomtom at 6:30 AM on April 19, 2006


Of course, the Lib Dems are the only party who have steadfastly opposed the National ID Card scheme, and are now supporting an attempt to demonstrate unhappiness through Civil Servant overload.
They're the only party to have always opposed the encroachment on civil liberties by Labour's "anti-terror" legislation.
They're the only national party who opposed the war against Iraq.
They're the only major party (following the Green party's lead) who have campaigned stridently for green energy alternatives to be better funded, for energy efficient products to be incentivised and was calling for a national recycling scheme to service every household back in 2000.

But I can see why people might think they're not worth voting for enough to even get them into a coalition. They just haven't got the respectable history of failure and deceit to give them credibility.
Bloomin' misty-eyed hippies.

/derail
posted by NinjaTadpole at 7:26 AM on April 19, 2006


The Lib Dems are in fact the real chameleons. They present a different message depending on whether their main opponent is the tories or labour. The image they present is quite different in the rural south west than the one presented to voters in urban areas.

The other thing is that there is no comparison between national politics and local politics. I'd suggest that in the popular imagination (tabloid fed no doubt) local councils are generally derided as nests of beaucracy, tinkering with the few things they still have power over whilst wasting vast pots of cash. The idea that experience as a local councillor in charge of rubbish collection might make you a good MP is laughable.

The other problem is that the Lib Dems are going to suffer a major split between factions after Menzies Campbell steps down as leader. The newer MPs approach civil liberties in a "less state interference" way which they also see extending into the economic sphere (some even want lower taxes, gasp!). In that sense they are old-school "liberals".

The more left-leaning MPs like Simon "maximum wage" Hughes approach things from the other angle and think that the government should be guaranteeing freedoms and equality. They are much more interventionist.

The tension inherent in this situation can only last so long and it's likely to come out after the next election as the Lib Dems are butchered as the Iraq protest vote fades and Cameron's image compares favourably with their leader's.
posted by patricio at 8:12 AM on April 19, 2006


Chunder- heartening to hear that you can't advocate "hand-on-heart" that folk vote BNP but really it is rather worrying that it is being touted as an alternative. I was reading the Telegraph the other day and they were canvassing whether people would vote BNP instead of Labour and some of the replies were along the lines of "now you come to mention it..." Aaargh. Surely no-one the correct side of Atilla the Hun would advocate that these racists should have any power in our society but the question seems to elicit an answer the Telegraph is gagging to hear- that people are becoming more "rightist"

On the Lib Dem front they seem to be caught in third party spot forever. I'll moan and groan about the aspects of Labour I dislike (i.e. the fact they are Tories in disguise, opening up schools to faith based idiologues, the unconditional support of the preent American regime yadda yadda) but come election time if there is a danger my Lib Dem vote would allow the Tories in I will probably shirk my gut instinct and vote Labour again. The LIbs are caught of being always a wastedvote because so many think they are a wasted vote.
posted by Gratishades at 10:44 AM on April 19, 2006


It will be interesting to see what, if anything, changes if and when Brown becomes leader.

Meanwhile, please don't suggest that the fascist, racist, violent, lunatic scum in the BNP are an alternative to anything but democracy and civil society.
posted by normy at 12:30 PM on April 19, 2006


People won't vote for the Lib Dems because they are gay and that Kennedy bloke was a drunkard. And they're hippies or something. And we don't know much about them.

That's how people feel, sadly.
posted by Drexen at 12:41 PM on April 19, 2006


Whereas the BNP are Decent Pub-going Blokes and wow, are those statistics really true? I guess there really are too many brown people in England! Britain never shall be slaves -- oi oi!! Stuff the PC idiots and Euro fanatics who want to take away our pints and pounds!

Yeah, it happens that easily when people are fed up with their options.
posted by Drexen at 12:44 PM on April 19, 2006


"Sleaze has become the hallmark of the dying days of this administration" - Tony Blair just before the 1997 election
posted by quarsan at 1:05 PM on April 19, 2006


Sadly, in my experience, there's no such thing. Careful what you wish for....

It's why Labour has become what it has. They know you are so afraid of another Thatcher that you'll take just about anything from Blair.

Blair knows this. So, for that matter, does Gordon Brown. Why should they listen to you? You're telling them that they'll get your vote as long as it means the Tories won't be the government.

Ideally, you need a coalition government, but if you can't manage that, you have to let the government know that you *will* vote them out if they get out of line. If you keep promising to elect them -- which is what you do when you talk about "Anyone But Tory" and then wave off the idea of voting LibDem -- why will they try to earn your vote? They already have it!

The reason the Blair Government stinks? Noseplug voters.
posted by eriko at 2:22 PM on April 19, 2006


.. so afraid of another Thatcher ..

That's not quite right. My real fear is of another Howe, Lawson, Major or Lamont. Remember those guys? The Thatcher Chancellors. Remember how the eighties and nineties were just one economic crisis after another, how your mates didn't have jobs and those did lived in terror of the boot, how it went on, and on, and on.

If you don't remember all of that, and I guess most people here don't - then throwing rocks at Labour probably feels smart and cool.

Noseplug? Labour have become captive to producer interests, the Treasury, the Americans, the Army and the Police. Surprised? Really?

Do you think for a minute that Cameron or Campbell would be any different? At least our guys can count.
posted by grahamwell at 1:48 AM on April 20, 2006


But the Labour treasurer and deputy leader had no idea about clandestine multi-milllion pound loan deals to the party, so that would suggest that some of "your guys" are busy doing the counting in shadowy back rooms.

It's going to take at least one very messy and unsatisfactory election to get the lib Dems anywhere near power. Firstly they will need to be part of a coalition, and they have already stated that they are not willing to do so unless they are far more than a useful way to make up the numbers, then they will need to prove that they have a steady hand when it's on the wheel.
Until then, yes, they will always be seen as the also-rans: a self-fulfilling prophesy.
posted by NinjaTadpole at 3:19 AM on April 20, 2006


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