Comments on: Vets against war

Vets against war

c13 — Sun, 21 May 2006 19:17:55 -0800

A 20-minute video that will change your life! Well, maybe not.

By: stenseng

stenseng — Sun, 21 May 2006 19:20:17 -0800

busted already?

By: fatbobsmith

fatbobsmith — Sun, 21 May 2006 19:31:14 -0800

By: bugmuncher

bugmuncher — Sun, 21 May 2006 19:52:40 -0800

Jessie Macbeth is saying that Rangers executed civilian children as part of the interrogation of their parents. Maybe I have been living under a rock, but I have not heard of such an allegation before. Is anyone else saying this?

By: bugmuncher

bugmuncher — Sun, 21 May 2006 20:07:47 -0800

He also says Rangers infiltrated a mosque, waited for men, women, and children to pray, then slaughtered them and defiled the building... ...And he says he executed an unarmed woman and her three children, despite the woman's pleas for mercy, because that's what he had to do... If the MSM jumped all over Abu Ghraib, wouldn't they also catch onto stories like these?

By: Joseph Gurl

Joseph Gurl — Sun, 21 May 2006 20:15:56 -0800

broken

By: bugmuncher

bugmuncher — Sun, 21 May 2006 20:24:59 -0800

Jessie Macbeth is also called Jesse MacBeth and Jesse Macbeth in other online media. I'd like to hear more from him, but he's a hard man to google.

By: Surfurrus

Surfurrus — Sun, 21 May 2006 20:29:10 -0800

If the MSM jumped all over Abu Ghraib, wouldn't they also catch onto stories like these? Haditha? Even the Washington Post is on it now ... six months after the killings. .

By: c13

c13 — Sun, 21 May 2006 20:51:38 -0800

busted already? broken You mean the link? Seems to work fine for me. But here is the URL: www.peacefilms.org/menu.html There are other clips that are worth watching. Especially about a young protester. I'd like to hear more from him, but he's a hard man to google. He sure is. The only other thing I could find about him is essentially the transcript of the video.

By: bugmuncher

bugmuncher — Sun, 21 May 2006 21:45:32 -0800

Macbeth isn't talking about Haditha (he says he was a Ranger, while Haditha appears to be a Marines issue). He says he personally killed roughly 200 unarmed civilians at close range. That's very alarming and sad. So is sneaking into a house of worship and massacring people in prayer. Oh, c13, I did find an ASU student newspaper editorial about some anti-coffeehouse protests in Tempe that involved Macbeth. I didn't link it earlier because the editorial doesn't describe him in the best light. I'm not out to discunt the guy -- though I really would like to see his statements investigated. Removal of any war criminals from the Army is good for America.

By: Chuckles

Chuckles — Sun, 21 May 2006 21:46:33 -0800

A couple of articles about Jesse Macbeth on this page.

By: Chuckles

Chuckles — Sun, 21 May 2006 21:51:38 -0800

Pictures of Jesse Macbeth at a march and talk in Tacoma, Washington here.

By: Chuckles

Chuckles — Sun, 21 May 2006 21:54:39 -0800

Community media broadcast schedule for The Truth About Iraq, from Gresham, Oregon (broadcasts coming up on May 24th and 25th).

By: bugmuncher

bugmuncher — Sun, 21 May 2006 21:58:04 -0800

From c3's other link: What medals did you get in Iraq? I got a lot. I got a purple heart. Half of them, I don't remember. I got five or six medals just for landing. I got a bronze star. What injuries did you get? I got stabbed many times. I got shrapnel in my knee. I got shot in the back. Maybe it is flippant of me to suggest that perhaps he should have 2 or 3 purple hearts? What Veteran's benefits have you gotten? I ain't getting nothing. A card and that's it. As a combat veteran, he should get free health care for 2 years after his release from active duty. So, either the VA screwed up and he isn't pursuing a remedy, or he is eligible for free health care and not using it.

By: Chuckles

Chuckles — Sun, 21 May 2006 22:16:32 -0800

Seems like he has been back in the USA since late 2003, so 2 years has run out. Denying it just because it recently ran out is a little misleading though.. Here is a letter by Jesse Macbeth (you'll need bugmenot) to the Arizona State University newspaper regarding that Plantation coffee shop issue. He says he is on the verge of being shipped out again, April 2004.

By: Chuckles

Chuckles — Sun, 21 May 2006 22:23:12 -0800

That's all I've got.. Jesse Macbeth himself seems very credible, but the details he discusses seem too sensational to believe.

By: c13

c13 — Sun, 21 May 2006 22:30:48 -0800

He says he is on the verge of being shipped out again, April 2004. Man, the army must really be hard up if that's the case -- the guy can barely speak!

By: brundlefly

brundlefly — Sun, 21 May 2006 23:00:43 -0800

You don't have to speak to kill people. Or be president. But I repeat myself.

By: shoepal

shoepal — Sun, 21 May 2006 23:03:16 -0800

STUTTERING AS A VARIANT OF POST TRAUMATIC STRESS DISORDER?

By: Chuckles

Chuckles — Sun, 21 May 2006 23:30:21 -0800

I just can't get over the comparison between what this video talks about, and the opinions being expressed one thread up.

By: bugmuncher

bugmuncher — Mon, 22 May 2006 06:07:45 -0800

Jesse's letter to the ASU paper says he was asked to leave the coffee shop because he was in uniform. If that's true, it's disgusting. I also think it's illegal, but for some reason I can't find that law anywhere. (Maybe because I am not a lawyer.)

By: effwerd

effwerd — Mon, 22 May 2006 06:11:23 -0800

"If we have to fight again, man, it would be to take that asshole out of office." Seems fair. If the administration's argument is that it's okay to kill tens of thousands of random and innocent Iraqis in pursuit of freedom and democracy in Iraq, I imagine it's equally justifiable, if not more so, to advocate killing tens of very specific and guilty American politicians in pursuit of the same goal here. And I believe the evidence of guilt for these American politicians in their betrayal of the constitution is far greater than the pretext for invading Iraq, the USA PATRIOT Act, NSA warrantless wiretapping and data collection on American citizens, and whatever else they are probably doing that has yet to come to light. Of course advocating the former is generally considered patriotism while advocating the latter is considered treason. The former might get you a free yellow ribbon sticker to put on your car; the latter might get you an indefinite stay at Gitmo. And to be clear to my NSA case worker: I am neither advocating nor promoting the assassination of our glorious and divinely inspired leader.

By: elpapacito

elpapacito — Mon, 22 May 2006 06:27:56 -0800

I also think it's illegal, but for some reason I can't find that law anywhere. I think it is legal , because it is private property. If the host decides one guest isn't welcome then the would-be guest can't enter even if the place is generally open to public. Is it disgusting ? Depends..discrimination on the basis of just wearing a military uniform seems superficial to me, but so are people in uniform who discriminate people because they don't wear any.

By: bugmuncher

bugmuncher — Mon, 22 May 2006 07:32:01 -0800

I think it is legal , because it is private property. Ordinarily I would take this position, as well, but I do recall reading (and currently can't find) some federal law (probably unenforceable) that protects servicemembers from discrimination based on wearing their uniform.

By: Steven C. Den Beste

Steven C. Den Beste — Mon, 22 May 2006 09:30:47 -0800

Word is the guy's a phony. People who actually know how the rangers operate say details of his story are clearly bogus. Even his trophy photograph in uniform is wrong. This has happened before, you know.

By: shoepal

shoepal — Mon, 22 May 2006 11:26:15 -0800

Thanks, Steven C. Den Beste. Much appreciated. How embarassing.

By: Chuckles

Chuckles — Mon, 22 May 2006 12:02:02 -0800

Yes, Thanks Steven C. Den Beste! You can actually see his story evolving over time, come to think about it. The video makes no mention of Afghanistan, but one of the earlier articles does (from 'a couple of articles about Jesse Mcbeth'):

MacBeth, a ranger in the U.S. Army, returned to the states two-and-a-half months ago after sustaining an injury in his back. He spent 14 months serving in the Middle East -- first in Afghanistan and then in Baghdad.

Quite different from the story in the video. I wonder what his real story is..

By: bugmuncher

bugmuncher — Mon, 22 May 2006 12:16:23 -0800

As a journalist, I might want to interject that journalists make mistakes too. Maybe he told the story the same way in Arizona, but reporters heard him differently. But in this case, it is more likely that he is changing his story over time.

By: Steven C. Den Beste

Steven C. Den Beste — Mon, 22 May 2006 15:15:37 -0800

By: Steven C. Den Beste

Steven C. Den Beste — Mon, 22 May 2006 16:03:22 -0800

One more, and then I'll stop: He has claimed he was home in April of 2004 after 16 months in Iraq. Not possible. (The invasion took place in March of 2003.) But he's also claimed he was involved in the Fallujah siege, which took place in April of 2004. The only problem is that it was the Marines who did that, not the Rangers. This post has a list of things which are wrong in that trophy photograph of MacBeth in his uniform.

By: effwerd

effwerd — Mon, 22 May 2006 17:03:24 -0800

I'm glad he's a fraud. Most of the things he was claiming were just way over the top. I want this war to end but I'd rather not have it happen because of backlash from the type of things he was claiming.

By: bugmuncher

bugmuncher — Mon, 22 May 2006 22:06:36 -0800

Of course, it's not a phenomenon until it appears on wikipedia.

By: Steven C. Den Beste

Steven C. Den Beste — Tue, 23 May 2006 09:04:44 -0800

The US Army says that Jesse MacBeth was not a Ranger and was not in the Special Forces.

By: Steven C. Den Beste

Steven C. Den Beste — Tue, 23 May 2006 16:39:59 -0800

Now it turns out that at some of the times he claimed he was in Iraq, he was actually in Arizona having trouble with the law. And he's also in trouble with the law in Washington. There's a warrant out for his arrest on a charge of assault. (As one wag put it, he may soon be telling his stories to a captive audience.) And just for the record, his legal name is "Jesse Adam MacBeth". It was legally changed by his parents when he was 2 years old from "Jesse Adam Al-Zaid".

By: Dunvegan

Dunvegan — Tue, 23 May 2006 22:32:32 -0800

Jesse Mac Bride is *also* Jesse Al-Zaid? Looks like Jesse MacBride has a bench warrant handed down today for failure to appear on an assault in the first degree/violation of protection order rap. http://www.sweetness-light.com/archive/warrant-out-for-ranger-macbeth-for-assault/ But that's not the real mess here, folks...THIS is: In other news, seems his original name (*sigh*) was originally [b]Jesse Al-Zaid[/b]...changed when he was at two years of age: "The Pima County AZ records also show that Jesse Adama Al-Zaid's parents are named Alrahman Al-Zaid and Leisha Campbell." http://www.sweetness-light.com/archive/jesse-adam-macbeth-was-born-jesse-adam-al-zaid/ I just have to wonder if this is one boot-leather stupid half-homeless con-artist that found some sort of free lunch with IVAW, and milked it until he was in over his head...or, some real piece-of-work con-artist that decided he was "in solidarity" with the Iraqis and went all "Micky Mouse mujahadeen" and suckered the IVAW on a nut-case agenda. Maybe he's even a Manchurian Mujahadeen candidate or ringer to discredit IVAW. The epitome of the "Tangled Web." Whatever...this is ALL BAD for EVERYONE on EVERY SIDE of this total Charlie Foxtrot.

By: Steven C. Den Beste

Steven C. Den Beste — Fri, 26 May 2006 20:06:05 -0800

I'm afraid this keeps getting more pathetic. Jesse MacBeth posted a scan of his form DD-214, the discharge form he got after Army service. He seems to have forged parts of it (mismatched fonts, incorrect terminology, and where have we heard that before?) but the parts he didn't change indicate that he was kicked out of the Army during basic training.

By: Chuckles

Chuckles — Fri, 26 May 2006 21:54:36 -0800

This internet thing seems to be working pretty well.. I find it really amazing that he has been riding this "I'm a veteran" thing for 2 years now.. There is probably still more to discover about his backstory, at least we need to know how he flunked out of basic (if that is what happened).

By: Steven C. Den Beste

Steven C. Den Beste — Wed, 31 May 2006 15:32:20 -0800

Jesse MacBeth tried to use his changed DD-214 to file for veterans benefits. (He's not entitled to them because he didn't serve long enough.) The VA is going to put out a federal warrant and he'll be prosecuted for it.