Dark Wal-Mart
January 31, 2007 3:25 PM   Subscribe

That Wal-Mart is evil (or even just filthy) has been discussed numerous times on MeFi. How about a "Dark Wal-Mart"? This is the industry term given to a Wal-Mart that has been vacated (pdf deep link), often in favor a Supercenter nearby. Wal-Mart still has a few years left on the lease, so there is an income stream for the landlord for a while. Industry observers note, however, that "having a dark Wal-Mart does not help you valuewise."
posted by Adamchik (36 comments total) 2 users marked this as a favorite
 
If you plot the locations of all the dark Wal-Marts in America and then connect them with a line, in order of first appearance, the resulting figure is identical to an inverted star. We are five dark Wal-Marts away from completing the figure.
posted by Falconetti at 3:31 PM on January 31, 2007 [5 favorites]


The Wal-Mart in my home town (Anadarko, OK) "moved" to a SuperCenter across the street and down a bit (you can see one from the other). It took a year or two, but the old location is now a lumber store.

The grocery store that was in the shopping center with the old location was put out of business by the SuperCenter opening up down the street.

People were already coming "into town" to go to Wal-Mart, so now they had no reason to go anywhere BUT the Wal-Mart for all the stuff they needed.
posted by mrbill at 3:35 PM on January 31, 2007


Hello mrbill in Anadarko, we have the same thing here in Edmond Oklahoma, a big empty WalMart and a band new "super center" 2 miles away.
posted by BillsR100 at 3:40 PM on January 31, 2007


Here in Claremore, the old Wal-Mart turned into an Atwood's when the supercenter opened up.
posted by drleary at 3:44 PM on January 31, 2007


Is this considered a phenomenon or a business practice?
posted by jake3456 at 3:45 PM on January 31, 2007


Billsr100 and drleary - same thing in Tulsa. They closed the small WalMart across the road from my house on 91st and Memorial, and opened up 2 supercenters .... one in Bixby and one on 71st. They're just a few miles from each other, and they are the biggest friggin' stores I have ever seen.
posted by bradth27 at 3:47 PM on January 31, 2007


It's curious how they can make the economics work, esp. being so frugal in every other aspect of their business model.
posted by Keith Talent at 3:47 PM on January 31, 2007


If you see the Wal-Mart, kill the Wal-Mart.
posted by Eideteker at 3:51 PM on January 31, 2007 [2 favorites]


"The building was shut down for six months, and we had to pay to keep the lights and air conditioning running so the property wouldn’t deteriorate," Moreau says.

Erm. If someone here could explain this, I'd be grateful.
posted by Kwantsar at 3:51 PM on January 31, 2007


“The building was shut down for six months, and we had to pay to keep the lights and air conditioning running so the property wouldn’t deteriorate,” Moreau says. “People in the community wanted it to happen overnight and it never does.”

How do lights keep the building from "deteriorating"?
posted by delmoi at 3:56 PM on January 31, 2007


No lights = vandals?
posted by zsazsa at 4:01 PM on January 31, 2007


Metafilter: Having a dark Wal-Mart does not help you valuewise.
posted by infinitywaltz at 4:03 PM on January 31, 2007


Well, the two Wal-Marts around here that went dark recently were "retenanted" (awesome word that) pretty quickly. One became a Hastings, the other a farm store.

Also, are dark Wal-Marts dark-sided?
posted by aerotive at 4:09 PM on January 31, 2007


How do lights keep the building from "deteriorating"?

I'm guessing, along with the air conditioning to dehumidify, it's to hold at bay the various types of mold and mildew? The stores were in Louisiana, and apparently the bayou area, so who knows what ill things doth the wind blow thereabouts.

I'm still having fun imagining the twisted, evil methods that "Dark Wal-Mart" will employ to subjugate the soul of America's heartland. No matter what, Dark Wal-Mart definitely sports a goatee and a cape and a furry black cat, and he's just strokin' that sucker.
posted by krippledkonscious at 4:10 PM on January 31, 2007


I keep thinking of that South Park episode where "Evil Cartman" showed up from the dark dimension and was like...nice...and stuff. It seems like "Dark Wal-Mart" should be at the top of those "best companies to work for" thanks to its overly generous benefits packages to part-time employees. Also, it revitalizes local business.
posted by infinitywaltz at 4:14 PM on January 31, 2007 [1 favorite]


Y'know, just today I had a conversation with an employment agency that wanted me to interview for some design work... at Walmart's headquarters. I stopped him mid-sentence and told him that I was really sorry but I probably wouldn't be right for the job, that I just couldn't work at Walmart. This conversation turned very uncomfortable as I was asked how I could possibly turn down an interview with a good potential client, sight unseen, when they might be offering something good. As I tried to say, "Well, I'm just not a Walmart girl" I heard myself & realized how incredibly snotty I sounded. I don't think he'll be sending my resume around much.

All of that said? I'm NOT a Walmart girl, though! I don't want to step foot inside of one, let alone their headquarters. Does that make me snotty? Or just stubborn?
posted by miss lynnster at 4:17 PM on January 31, 2007


miss lynnster, it makes you a decent person.
posted by clockzero at 4:24 PM on January 31, 2007


miss lynnster
Given your answer, pretty snotty. You probably could have at least just said "I don't agree with some of their business practices." The way you put it just sounds snobbish.
posted by Sangermaine at 4:48 PM on January 31, 2007


A bankruptcy attorney friend was telling me about this phenomena a few years ago. A common reason for the move is to renegociate the tax incentives that got them to that area in the first place. Commonly the dark site is Wal-Mart shaped and few business can come in and fill it, so many stay dark.

Kind of like Wal-Mart droppings. Or better, it's just shedding it's skin.
posted by keds at 5:13 PM on January 31, 2007


My city (Janesville, WI) got a SuperCenter/Sam's Club just before Christmas, about a mile down a street and under the Interstate away from the old one. It's probably not going to be dark very long -- there's a decent amount of redevelopment going on including a new Menard's (also moving about a mile from a less desirable location). Supposedly there's a tenant ready but they had to wait for the SuperCenter move and who knows now. Anyway, our city dueled with Wal-Mart for about two years over location and issues such as parking lot size, a large berm at the edge abutting a residential zone, and exterior decor. I think it turned out OK, as such things go, but the city's right that it's in a terrible location in terms of generating traffic with awkward ingress/egress choices.

Anyway, that was all nothing compared to the sturm und drang in the paper. The residents nearby were incensed that it was happening at all (the area was zoned commercial years ago, try again, NIMBY). Other city residents worried about competition or US jobs. Then you had the yahoos worshipping at the altar of commerce: "Wal-Mart offers good products at good prices. Thank God the city failed to stop them."

And yes, if you want to maintain a building ready for immediate tenancy, you keep the lights and HVAC on (but maybe not at work comfort levels). People don't realize the tendency for mold or even just frost heave.
posted by dhartung at 5:14 PM on January 31, 2007


All of that said? I'm NOT a Walmart girl, though! I don't want to step foot inside of one, let alone their headquarters. Does that make me snotty? Or just stubborn?

no, naive ... because you'll go and do work for other companies whose business practices you know nothing about and some of them will be worse than walmart's

Anyway, our city dueled with Wal-Mart for about two years over location and issues such as parking lot size, a large berm at the edge abutting a residential zone, and exterior decor.

same thing in kalamazoo ... but when meijers wants to build a big ass store, none of that stuff seems to matter

and this is what bugs me about the whole walmart thing every time it comes up ... people dislike them because of their business practices and ignore their competition, which indulges in the same practices, only sometimes even more so

my biggest problem with walmart is they carry a lousy selection of cheap-ass stuff ... sometimes it's stuff i can settle for ... most of the time ... no
posted by pyramid termite at 5:48 PM on January 31, 2007


Thing is, it's not my personality to offer up, "I don't agree with their business practices" though. I am not one to bring my politics into non-political conversations... I always tend to use my sense of humor to deflect things first and foremost. So saying "I'm just not a Walmart girl" felt like enough detail to me... I don't think it should be necessary to go into specifics. Especially since I'm not at all desperate for work. I think if I say I'm not into Walmart that statement leaves nothing to disrespect. Some people aren't into fast food restaraunts. Some people don't want to live in the suburbs. Some people refuse to eat anchovies. Everyone has their own personal tastes, yeah? Does that make them all snobs? I don't think so. It just makes them individuals with personal tastes, right?

Can you explain why you think this is different? I'm really serious... I'd like to understand it better.
posted by miss lynnster at 6:12 PM on January 31, 2007 [1 favorite]


pyramid termite... by the way, it's not even entirely about their business practices by the way. I just am completely uninterested in Walmarts... always have been. I have never ever found a need to walk into one, I try to support small businesses when I can instead.

And as for working at other obnoxious corporations, I'm a former Disney castmember (quit in 2003) so I crossed that line a million years ago. Like I said, this isn't about politics. Walmart just turns me off.

Maybe I am a snot...?

I'm a nice snot though. At least that's what my mom says.

posted by miss lynnster at 6:19 PM on January 31, 2007


They did this by my house. A Wal Mart closed, replaced by a super Wal Mart two miles up the street (which just happen to put it in a different municipality -- I'm sure it was a sweet tax-free decade or two that got Wal Mart to move).

The old Wal Mart sat empty for a few years. Until the big box was occupied again -- by a Wal Mart.

WTF?
posted by teece at 7:13 PM on January 31, 2007


Anadarko, Edmond, Claremore, Tulsa... Okies represent!

I think every town in Oklahoma has a Dark Wal Mart. Okmulgee I know has one right next to the new one.

The first Wal-Mart in Tulsa was on Admiral; in fact, it remained the only Wal-Mart in town until the late 1980s and was more like a TG&Y than a discount store. Then they built the first true Wal-Mart in the city limits at 71st and Peoria.

Which they closed less than five years later when they built the Supercenter on ORU's land at 81st and Lewis.

Less than five years.

My brother is an architect; most of his business is in Wal-Marts. He told me that Wal-Mart makes a lot of money off leasing the Dark stores.

He also told me that he went into a town council meeting in the northeast where there was some opposition to the Wal-Mart opening. The mayor pointed out that if they didn't approve the Wal-Mart, in all likelihood the neighboring town would, and he'd rather have the other town over spending their money in his city limits than his own people spending it in a Wal-Mart in the other town's city limits. The council voted unanimously to approve construction.
posted by dw at 8:09 PM on January 31, 2007


My grandfather's home town (in SW Louisiana) was just about destroyed by a dark Wal-Mart several years ago. When Wal-Mart moved in, they sucked the life out of every other business in town. When Wal-Mart left, the next Wal-Mart opened up 20 miles up the highway, and the town just withered.
posted by gimonca at 9:06 PM on January 31, 2007


As a bit of counterpoint, here in the Twin Cities, Target has been transmogrifying its own legacy stores into SuperTargets at a terrifying speed. The same location will go from an operating old Target, to hole in the ground, to shiny new SuperTarget, all on the same lot, in a very short period of months. It's science-fictiony, like they release a cloud of nanobots to remold the structure overnight. If it's in a part of town you don't visit every day, you could miss the entire demolition/construction process.
posted by gimonca at 9:12 PM on January 31, 2007


bradth27, dw, et al, I was just thinking about that Wal-Mart at 71st and Memorial 10 minutes ago as I drove by. ;) I thought "gee, it's enough space to run a good data center..too bad there's not much in the way of nearby fiber."

It seems like every town of a decent size I go to has a "dark" Wal-Mart. Before SuperCenters, Wal-Mart closed one over in Fort Smith so they could move it up the road less than a mile. Less than ten years later, they built a SuperCenter out on the edge of town, but were kind enough to turn the old one into a Neighborhood Market.

In Fayetteville, they've had good luck renting out the old Wal-Marts. The one on the south side of town they rented half of to Tractor Supply Company and use the other half for an optical lab, while the one more to the north was rented out fairly quickly to Stein Mart or some other similar chain store.

I've noticed that developers who are willing to subdivide the Wal Mart space have a lot better luck renting them out, but they're so deep that it's still hard except in areas where there's lots of growth going on anyway.
posted by wierdo at 8:28 AM on February 1, 2007


They make it so easy to comply

Well, duh.

more and more everything is there

Well, except for independent and cottage-industry produced books, music, clothing, etc. Not to mention uncensored versions of movies and music.

Oh, and labor unions.
posted by scratch at 8:28 AM on February 1, 2007


miss lynnster
Given your answer, pretty snotty. You probably could have at least just said "I don't agree with some of their business practices." The way you put it just sounds snobbish.

posted by Sangermaine at 7:48 PM EST on January 31

Oh I don't know. I see no reason for anyone to hide their disgust with WalMart-- it is just a company, after all, and has no feelings. If anything I think Miss Lynster's answer was overly polite.

Sure there are other businesses out there that employ disgusting techniques to ensure growth, but there is nothing that rivals WalMart, which has invaded every nook and cranny of this country offering up cheap, imported and often shoddy merchandise while driving out other American businesses all the while conflating itself with "America."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:42 AM on February 1, 2007


miss lynnster
The reason is was snotty is the way you put it. There's nothing wrong with, as you say, having opinions. But it's how you express your opinions that makes the difference. In the situation you listed, you are speaking with someone who is going to help you find employment. He asked a perfectly legitimate question about why you would refuse a job at a company. The answer you gave, in the form that you gave it, seems snotty and dismissive to me. Even you said you realized it sounded that way. I'm not saying you should get into a fight about politics, but just that you should do exactly what you were saying you wanted to: express your opinion in a polite and respectful way.
posted by Sangermaine at 9:42 AM on February 1, 2007


Hah! I live 5 miles from the "filthy WalMart". It's almost worth a field trip. Almost.
posted by LordSludge at 10:32 AM on February 1, 2007


That "filthy Wal-Mart" is all too typical of backwoods Wal-Marts here in the Palmetto State. I dunno if it's the vibe of the overseers for this state, but a friend of mine used to refer to a trip to Wal-Mart as "going to X-Files Live" for both the condition of the store and the clientele who would go at the late night hours. He was convinced he'd find the leech-man hanging around the fish tanks one night.
posted by 1f2frfbf at 11:25 AM on February 1, 2007


Truly baffling, those filthy wal-mart photos, and the comments here and there saying this store is not an exception.

This scares me. Having grown up here in Northeast Europe, whenever I look at the USA, it's like I'm looking into the future.

The future, it seems, sucks ass.
posted by Anything at 2:35 PM on February 1, 2007


These dark Wal-marts are touched in the movie about Wal-Mart called the high cost of low prices. The film explains that these can't be torn down or used for other purposes because of zoning or some such laws so they will just sit there indefinitely.

I'm not sure why exactly, but when I saw images of the giant closed buildings the first thing I thought of is that it can be used as some sort of internment camp. Or even if not an internment camp, it seemed as if the buildings were being built for a purpose other than the store, but that the stores were a convenient cover. I think one reason this came to mind is because the empty buildings look a lot like the Portland Convention Center where Japanese American citizens were at one time interned by the government.

If I'm not mistaken Wal-mart is owned by some entity or another in China. If Chinese troops ever end up being brought into the US to help enforce martial law it will be quite convenient for them to have a giant warehouse facilities already built near every community.

Of course I'm not absolutely convinced that's what they are for. But I do find it strange and hard to believe that this phenomenon just happens by accident, whatever the reason may be.
posted by chowder at 9:13 PM on February 1, 2007


Actually, I didn't think I sounded snotty. I said that he reacted as though I was when I didn't think it was such a bad comment. If I was actually feeling that I was being snotty, I probably wouldn't have brought it up in conversation here. It wouldn't have struck me as a strange conversation.

Fact is, since moving from LA to SF I've become somewhat hypersensitive to hurting people's feelings because even though it's only 300 miles away, I'm in a very different culture. People aren't as direct here and often have thinner skin. So, even if I don't feel I'm doing anything wrong it doesn't necessarily matter... and I try to be aware as best I can. Sometimes I just want to tell people to lighten the Hell up, though. A little sense of humor goes a Hell of a long way in this world if ya ask me. Life is too short to spend it uptight.

I'm still not a Walmart girl. And know what? I like me that way. A lot.

And btw, I got booked for a design project today... and not for Walmart, it's for an organic food company. So yay. Things always work out if you're true to who you are.
posted by miss lynnster at 11:13 PM on February 1, 2007


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