Black hole of Mars

May 24, 2007 9:39 PM

Black hole mystery on MarsIf a future earth ever needs a place to send convicts, the high-resolution camera on the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter may have found it a few nights back. (via crikey.com.au)
posted by mattoxic (65 comments total)

ATTEMPT NO LANDING THERE!
posted by blue_beetle at 9:42 PM on May 24, 2007 [5 favorites]

More here...
posted by mattoxic at 9:42 PM on May 24, 2007

Somewhere out there there's a Martian getting chewed out for forgetting to close the hatch.
posted by pompomtom at 9:42 PM on May 24, 2007 [6 favorites]

Must be a really negative martian.
posted by CitrusFreak12 at 9:44 PM on May 24, 2007

Almost like a bullet hole.
posted by anticlock at 9:46 PM on May 24, 2007

This is exactly why I keep telling people to keep their damn cigarettes away from my film.
posted by IronLizard at 9:49 PM on May 24, 2007

This is no cave...
posted by dazed_one at 9:49 PM on May 24, 2007 [4 favorites]

meanwhile on Earth
posted by hortense at 10:03 PM on May 24, 2007

Finally, new grist for conspiracy/alien theories! I was getting tired of decades of "Face On Mars", "Fake Moon Landing", and "Crop Circles".

I figure this one will be spun for a good 10 or more years.
posted by Bugbread at 10:04 PM on May 24, 2007

Christ, what an Arsia hole.
posted by gubo at 10:09 PM on May 24, 2007 [1 favorite]

I knew it, Mars is alive! NASA just better figure out which way its facing before sending in a probe.
posted by BostonJake at 10:11 PM on May 24, 2007

Did you all not see Pitch Black? Those holes are filled with really unpleasant things.

Our only hope is to ship a hardened convict to the surface to deal with the threat.

::Bring me a convict, a knife, and a big fucking rocket and I'll sort this whole "hole thing" out. Hollywood style::
posted by quin at 10:20 PM on May 24, 2007

It looks like a blackhead... I have the urge to reach into my screen and pop it.
posted by amyms at 10:22 PM on May 24, 2007

This black spot is one of seven possible entrances to subterranean caves identified on Mars

What, this hole leads to caves on earth! Wow, that's nifty.

Ha, at least I thought that was funny. So what's the word for "subterranean" on Mars? Because "subterranean" is below the earth, and that obviously won't do. Submartian, I guess.

/silly pedant.

This hole is fascinating. I've been caving -- it's amazingly fun. Now, caving on Mars, I bet that's even better.
posted by teece at 10:29 PM on May 24, 2007

Looks like a face!!!!!!
posted by The Deej at 10:45 PM on May 24, 2007

So what's the word for "subterranean" on Mars?

Submarsanean? or maybe Subariesanean?

A god-of-war-'ean' either way.
posted by quin at 10:46 PM on May 24, 2007

We can finally get rid of those Australians for good.
posted by stavrogin at 10:49 PM on May 24, 2007 [3 favorites]

That'll be the plughole, into which the ocean drained.
posted by aeschenkarnos at 10:50 PM on May 24, 2007 [8 favorites]

We can finally get rid of those Australians for good.

(spoken like a man truly possessed)
posted by UbuRoivas at 12:08 AM on May 25, 2007

It's happening in Russia, too! Oh noes! Marvin!
posted by five fresh fish at 12:08 AM on May 25, 2007

So what's the word for "subterranean" on Mars?

Subarenean. But it sounds kind of dumb.

Subselenean is much cooler.

(Selenology is the study of the moon.)
posted by blacklite at 12:27 AM on May 25, 2007

Thats really a strange cave entrance, a large circular puncture. No fade to black, just a sudden blackness. It makes no sense...there's nothing geological like that here on Earth.
posted by vacapinta at 12:41 AM on May 25, 2007

It's a godawful small affair
posted by bunglin jones at 12:50 AM on May 25, 2007

It's a godawful small affair

MY GOD IT'S FULL OF SPIDERS!
posted by Joeforking at 12:56 AM on May 25, 2007 [1 favorite]

vacapinta: Thats really a strange cave entrance, a large circular puncture. No fade to black, just a sudden blackness. It makes no sense...there's nothing geological like that here on Earth.

Sinkhole, perhaps?
posted by zippy at 1:18 AM on May 25, 2007

quin writes "Submarsanean? or maybe Subariesanean?"

You're mixing Aries and Ares.

vacapinta writes "Thats really a strange cave entrance, a large circular puncture. No fade to black, just a sudden blackness. It makes no sense...there's nothing geological like that here on Earth."

I dunno. If the opening below isn't so much a tube as a big bubble, with a little hole on top, it would look like a sudden black dot. It only fades to black if the cave walls fall roughly perpendicular to the edge of the hole. Like this.
posted by Bugbread at 1:27 AM on May 25, 2007

You know the bum probes? the ones the aliens do? This is pratice site no.1, beginner.

/childhumor
posted by From Bklyn at 1:31 AM on May 25, 2007

It's mind-boggling in that it may be 10s if not 100s of years before we get to explore the Martian surface, and even longer than that before we fully map the cave system.

We're still discovering new caves here on Earth, even in countries like Britain.
posted by humblepigeon at 1:49 AM on May 25, 2007

Man goes into rocket. Rocket goes into hole. Aliens in the hole. Our aliens.

< /fairspanishladies>
posted by Jofus at 3:33 AM on May 25, 2007

You put your weed in there.
posted by Smart Dalek at 4:43 AM on May 25, 2007 [3 favorites]

Are they sure it's Mars? 'Cause it looks like Uranus.
posted by kimota at 4:53 AM on May 25, 2007 [4 favorites]

Well just look at the others sinkholes on mars. Using the thermal imaging is also an interesting way to determine that one black spot is an "hole" and not some noise or defect.
posted by elpapacito at 5:00 AM on May 25, 2007

Couldn't they just be something (eg. chunk of rock) between the camera and the surface?
posted by Pollomacho at 5:16 AM on May 25, 2007

Maybe its a reset button.
posted by bondcliff at 6:03 AM on May 25, 2007

subterranean caves

This has always been one of my favorite redundancies. Can someone tell me what other types of caves there might be that a subset needs to be described as subterranean?

That mars sinkhole is huge. ~100 meters, and obviously the ground there is a thin crust with a much larger void underneath. Probably not a volcanic bubble, but most likely a collapse as a result of up-stoping, which would indicate some sort of dissolution underground. Doubtful that it's limestone, so who knows what kind of dissoultion.
posted by Devils Rancher at 6:05 AM on May 25, 2007

Are we certain the Exxon Valdez hasn't been near there?
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 6:14 AM on May 25, 2007

Subarenean. But it sounds kind of dumb.

Marvin's in the basement
Mixing up the big bang
I'm on the spacecraft
Working on the carrotmat
The man in the helmet
trying to make the earth melt
Says he's got to detonate
Wants to make it modulate
Look out Doc
It's isn't a lock
God knows when
But you're landing again
Annoying duck and pig funk
Trying to steal your best junk
The man with space chrome
In the big dome
Wants a better Venus view
and you've no carrots left to chew

(harmonica)
posted by eriko at 6:28 AM on May 25, 2007 [2 favorites]

subterranean caves: This has always been one of my favorite redundancies. Can someone tell me what other types of caves there might be that a subset needs to be described as subterranean?

I'll bite. There are caves in mountain-sides too, of the type that our Stone-age ancestors supposedly lived in. These aren't subterranean.

A cave is simply "an underground chamber". That "ground" can be above the surface too, such as a big pile we call a hill or mountain.

Curiously, while at the dictionary, I looked up subterranean too. It doesn't mean quite what we think:

existing, occurring, or done under the earth's surface.
• secret; concealed
posted by humblepigeon at 6:31 AM on May 25, 2007

Argh. This is the sort of thing that's going to bug me for years, until they finally drop a probe down it or something. Grr. Thanks a lot.
posted by aramaic at 6:51 AM on May 25, 2007

Couldn't they just be something (eg. chunk of rock) between the camera and the surface?

No. That was the point of the article, really.
posted by dmd at 7:13 AM on May 25, 2007

This is probably a skylight into a very large lava tube. From what I understand, there is extensive evidence for lava tubes on Mars (just like Earth) and the martian ones can be quite large. Sorry no stalagtites or stalagmites, just something like this
posted by spaceviking at 7:16 AM on May 25, 2007

A cave is simply "an underground chamber". That "ground" can be above the surface too, such as a big pile we call a hill or mountain.

Does that mean to say that if you walked up a hill and into a cave, that while you were in that cave you wouldn't define yourself as being "underground?"

A caving friend made a good point years ago when someone mentioned two caves on opposite ridges that were likely part of the same system before the stream downcut the valley and eroded the rock between the two caves. He said that the definition of a cave being a void in the rock, that technically the cave was still there, only the rock surrounding it had been eroded away.
posted by Devils Rancher at 7:30 AM on May 25, 2007

Edit: what I should have added is that the boundary between "above ground" and "underground" is defined by the air/rock(soil) margin, whether that margin is at an angle to the general plane of the Earth's surface, or not.
posted by Devils Rancher at 7:34 AM on May 25, 2007

Gadzooks, they've found the hole in the plot!
posted by Uther Bentrazor at 7:40 AM on May 25, 2007 [1 favorite]

That was the point of the article, really.

Really? Because the article I read just jumped to the conclusion that it was a cave without any discussion of it being much else and it was based on a paper that stated that more pictures were needed to determine anything.
posted by Pollomacho at 7:44 AM on May 25, 2007

Marshole
posted by humannaire at 8:36 AM on May 25, 2007

Thats really a strange cave entrance, a large circular puncture.

It's not that strange. The symmetry is neat, but of the caves I've explored, more than one was just a (roughly) circular hole in the ground at its entrance.

And there's that giant hole in S. America (and I mean giant): it'd probably look something like this, if the jungle were gone and it were view from orbit. The symmetry probably points to a method of formation different from the caves I've explored, yes (I've explored limestone caves, which were formed by water; and one "fake" cave which is a fault in a big pile of granite. This may have some other origin).

It's singular, but not totally bizarre, methinks. I really want to go explore it.
posted by teece at 8:53 AM on May 25, 2007

And there's that giant hole in S. America (and I mean giant)

*perk*

Details?
posted by sidereal at 8:58 AM on May 25, 2007

Almost like a bullet hole.

Thats really a strange cave entrance, a large circular puncture. No fade to black, just a sudden blackness. It makes no sense...there's nothing geological like that here on Earth.

True. Well, maybe it could be the result of a meteorite or ejecta strike on the roof of an eggshell like cavern (formed by drainage of lava from a bubble or rill?); there do seem to be craters of all diameters we have had camera resolutions to see.
posted by jamjam at 9:19 AM on May 25, 2007

Shadow?
posted by jeblis at 11:32 AM on May 25, 2007

sidereal: I've seen it on the discovery channel and what not. I don't recall the name of the cave or which country it is in (it might be Central America. Costa Rica?). But it is a huge cave.

I don't remember if is more complicated after you are inside, but the entrance is just a gigantic, gaping hole, on the magnitude of several football fields. The hole goes down several hundred (1000+?) feet.

People base jump into it. A helicopter, when landed on the floor of the cave, looks like a mosquito.

OK, I think it's Sotano de las Golondrinas, and it seems to be in Mexico.
posted by teece at 11:39 AM on May 25, 2007

sidereal: thre's also the giant Guatemala City sinkhole from a few months ago. And cenotes. All made by water erosion, though, which seems unlikely on Mars.
posted by hattifattener at 11:46 AM on May 25, 2007

teece is correct.

The giant hole in Mexico is Sotano de las Golondrinas

It is also occasionally known as the Cave of Swallows (wikipedia).
posted by knapah at 12:21 PM on May 25, 2007

The SF fan in me wants these holes to be alien plasma-drilled deep core mineshafts, within which we'll find ancient artifacts and clues to the visitors's awesome technology!

Sigh.
posted by zoogleplex at 12:58 PM on May 25, 2007

Between this, the blueberries and the rotten rocks, it really is another frigging planet.
posted by CynicalKnight at 1:02 PM on May 25, 2007

Wasn't Mars always one of the labyrinthan worlds?
posted by thecaddy at 2:44 PM on May 25, 2007

Dena, Chloe, Wendy, Annie, Abbey, Nikki, and Jeanne. Why do I think the next hole they find will be named Jenna, or Amber Lynn?
posted by bink at 2:52 PM on May 25, 2007

I volunteer Vin Diesel to explore it as a minor co-star so he gets killed off early.
posted by MiltonRandKalman at 3:40 PM on May 25, 2007

Perhaps those 'rotten' rocks are related to this particular phenomenon.
posted by IronLizard at 4:23 PM on May 25, 2007

From the Cave of Swallows¹

The cave was discovered in on 27 December 1966 by T. R. Evans, Charles Borland, and Randy Sterns.

I must ask: there was no evidence of human bones at the bottom?

A purported Twelve second freefall in that cave. Crazy. Thank goodness the Aztec didn't know about it.
posted by five fresh fish at 5:18 PM on May 25, 2007

As suggested by a link to a picture of that cave, find a second hand and count off twelve seconds of freefall.

Holy shit, it's enough to get boring before you splatter.

That's a damn deep hole. It's a wonder there aren't religions about it.
posted by five fresh fish at 5:21 PM on May 25, 2007 [1 favorite]

Cave religion:

Those at the top - We call it The Deep. It is a source of great power and fear. Occasionally it demands an offering and claims on of us. We have learned this tends to be after the big rains when The Deep is surrounded by mud. Mud makes the Deep Angry and it consumes a few of us who get too close.

Those at the bottom - We call it the Tall. The Tall frightens us. It occasionally drops muddy bodies on us. Who does something like that? As gods go, it's kind of a prick. We bury the bodies and try to ignore the Tall as much as possible.
posted by quin at 5:41 PM on May 25, 2007 [5 favorites]

I hate it when a cave claims on me.
posted by five fresh fish at 6:45 PM on May 25, 2007

My guess: mini black hole impact crater. It absorbed mass as it created the hole - leaving little ejecta - but eventually evaporated further down in Mars' core. With Mars' thinner atmosphere, it did not lose as much energy before striking the surface as it would on earth. Or giant sandworms...
posted by mediaddict at 11:04 PM on May 28, 2007

So THAT's what sucked up all the water.
posted by IronLizard at 12:24 AM on May 29, 2007