Nurture My Pig

May 26, 2007 10:08 AM

Bigpig.
posted by fandango_matt (176 comments total)

"I probably won't ever kill anything else that big."

.
posted by humannaire at 10:14 AM on May 26, 2007 [2 favorites]

He said he shot the huge animal eight times with a .50- caliber revolver and chased it for three hours through hilly woods before finishing it off with a point-blank shot.

That kid is absolutely unfuckwithable.
posted by nasreddin at 10:18 AM on May 26, 2007 [2 favorites]

Wow. How did the kid not die? Hell, how did that pig even move?
posted by spiderskull at 10:19 AM on May 26, 2007

He said he shot the huge animal eight times with a .50- caliber revolver and chased it for three hours through hilly woods before finishing it off with a point-blank shot.

I used to hunt all the time when I was growin' up. I envy that kid. He was on a three hour rush. I mean he was high.
posted by MarshallPoe at 10:24 AM on May 26, 2007

That kid's gonna get SOOOOO sick of having ham for dinner.
posted by miss lynnster at 10:28 AM on May 26, 2007 [8 favorites]

Jamison is now looking for a big shotgun and hoping Dragons are real.

Sounds like a recipe for some good healthy fun!
posted by brain_drain at 10:29 AM on May 26, 2007

Seems strange to me that when you encounter an exceptional animal you want to kill it.
posted by jouke at 10:30 AM on May 26, 2007 [23 favorites]

That kid's gonna get SOOOOO sick of having ham for dinner.

No hey are making sausages out of 'im, "500-700 pounds" of sausages...

I dunno, my first instinct on seeing that pig would be to run the other way, not to try to kill it. Wild boars can be crazy if you startle them, they are scary even at 1/4 that size...
posted by gemmy at 10:32 AM on May 26, 2007

Seems strange to me that when you encounter an exceptional animal you want to kill it.

That was my reaction, too. This triumphalism is just fucking bizarre.
posted by psmealey at 10:34 AM on May 26, 2007

On second look at that boar, I suddenly pictured that thing running after Sawyer in an episode of Lost. This kid doesn't live on some weird fictional island off of Fiji, does he?
posted by miss lynnster at 10:36 AM on May 26, 2007

Sweet hooooooome Alabama!
posted by chrismear at 10:38 AM on May 26, 2007 [1 favorite]

I love how the act of killing an exceptional animal is something to be proud of. I don't really have anything against hunting, especially animals whose natural predators have been reduced to homo sapiens, but the whole "I done love killin' stuff" attitude is pretty off-putting.
posted by maxwelton at 10:43 AM on May 26, 2007 [5 favorites]

What a sick little bastard.
posted by cmonkey at 10:44 AM on May 26, 2007

"And see that ring right there, Jimmy? ... That's another time when the old fellow miraculously survived some big forest fire."
posted by arialblack at 10:47 AM on May 26, 2007 [11 favorites]

Some pig.
posted by cerebus19 at 10:50 AM on May 26, 2007 [8 favorites]

What pathetic cretins. It disgusts me to see them boast killing such a spectacular creature. Woo-woo. Big gun - little dick.
posted by chance at 10:54 AM on May 26, 2007

I appreciate there's a cultural difference and all that but let me get this straight: That kid was out in the woods, alone, wielding a .50 calibre handgun?

When I was a 12-year old, I wasn't even allowed to leave the house if my mum thought I had my spudgun on me.
posted by NeonSurge at 10:56 AM on May 26, 2007

no NeonSurge , the kid wasn't alone. This was on a "pay to hunt" type of wildlife reserve and there were adults with him carrying high-powered rifles just in case.
posted by zengargoyle at 11:02 AM on May 26, 2007

Okkoto: "Look at my tribe, Moro. We grow small and stupid. We will soon be nothing but squealing game that the humans hunt for their meat."
posted by Mister Cheese at 11:04 AM on May 26, 2007 [7 favorites]

Previous oversized pig.
posted by Siberian Mist at 11:04 AM on May 26, 2007

Quite the culture clash here. I didn't grow up around guns, but I know people who did, and I don't go around yammering about how awful they are because they kill living creatures. (How do you think that meat got on your plate? Vegetarians excluded from this snark.) And I would hope that if I had grown up with guns and hunting, I wouldn't respond to the "OMG guns!!!" stuff with "What a bunch of pussies!"... but I'm sure I'd be tempted.
posted by languagehat at 11:04 AM on May 26, 2007 [8 favorites]

Pffft, I jumped on the back of a hog that size this one time and snapped its neck with my bare hands.
posted by The Straightener at 11:11 AM on May 26, 2007 [2 favorites]

Please, languagehat. We're not upset because he killed a living creature. We're upset because he didn't feel sad after doing it.
posted by chrismear at 11:13 AM on May 26, 2007 [1 favorite]

What languagehat said. My dad is the only one of his brothers that didn't hunt deer (I think he did when he was young, though) and I've never hunted. My male cousins have. I don't really understand hunting and I'm very empathic with animals, but I really do think this is a cultural thing and either side projecting what they imagine the other side "must" be feeling and then judging them for it is ignorant.

Anyway, I am astounded at the size of that hog. I can't even really understand how anything that size manages to find enough to eat in the contemporary US. I can't understand how everyone didn't already know that a hog that size existed. (Maybe they did? Maybe it was cultivated on that private game preserve?)
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 11:14 AM on May 26, 2007

Feral hogs are a non-native invasive species that cause tremendous damage to the southern forests. We need to give this boy a 4x4 full of weapons and set him loose.
posted by LarryC at 11:15 AM on May 26, 2007 [4 favorites]

On the other hand those pics look fake as hell to me.
posted by LarryC at 11:18 AM on May 26, 2007

Dang.

That's, like, a really great barbecue for a small city, that one critter there. I have half a mind to offer to pay that boy's NRA dues for next year.
posted by pax digita at 11:22 AM on May 26, 2007

Pffft, I jumped on the back of a hog that size this one time and snapped its neck with my bare hands.

What, both hands? Pussy. Hogs that small I just kill with harsh language if they annoy me.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 11:22 AM on May 26, 2007 [2 favorites]

Mea culpa, zengargoyle. RTFA and all that.
posted by NeonSurge at 11:22 AM on May 26, 2007

Um, am I the only one who thinks this photograph is carefully staged? Maybe the hog isn't that big, it's just in the foreground
posted by Deathalicious at 11:23 AM on May 26, 2007 [2 favorites]

But can he clean the Augean stables in a single day?
posted by hindmost at 11:27 AM on May 26, 2007 [7 favorites]

Yeah, I don't think the unease being expressed in this thread is at hunting per se. What I see is the convergence of a few elements: 1) A holy-shit-big wild hog; 2) A kid playing to blue state notions of what Southern Kids Who Kill Giant Pigs look like: he's big, he has a ball cap, and a big-ass handgun; and 3) A paid, semi-rigged hunting expedition on a private game preserve.

I would prefer that hog be still running around, just so I can get an effete frisson of dread knowing there's a real monster running around in the woods somewhere. YMMV.
posted by everichon at 11:28 AM on May 26, 2007

languagehat: and I don't go around yammering about how awful [...]
No, you go yammering about comments on metafilter.
posted by jouke at 11:29 AM on May 26, 2007

Um, double?
posted by MissNefertiti at 11:33 AM on May 26, 2007

I'm still skeptical about the pictures, but...

JESUS can you imagine come across this thing unarmed? This is the kind of thing I've only seen people encounter in Miyazaki movies--if I saw this thing while out on a hike I would seriously consider never going outdoors again (at least not without a 12-gauge).

And what about trying to convince other people of what you saw? Somewhere in Alabama there's someone frantically emailing these pictures to his or her friends with "I TOLD YOU I SAW A GIANT PIG IN THE WOODS!!!" typed in red 48-point font at the top, vindicating themselves after years of mocking.
posted by Benjy at 11:40 AM on May 26, 2007

psmealey writes "That was my reaction, too. This triumphalism is just fucking bizarre."

Why ? I wouldn't have expected that he could figure how to point a gun away from himself and , woah, pull a trigger ! Even aim ! I mean, that's requires edumacation !

Anyway I don't know how rare such an animal was..and oddity or common ? Studying his behaviors could have been interesting.
posted by elpapacito at 11:42 AM on May 26, 2007

Well, not exactly a double, but this Snopes link from the earlier thread discusses the topic of this post (with the same picture and a link to monsterpig.com).

No, you go yammering about comments on metafilter.

What the fuck is your point, if you have one? Would you prefer that I not comment in any threads, or just ones you've already commented in?
posted by languagehat at 11:43 AM on May 26, 2007

I used to work at a newspaper in central Pennsylvania, and my desk was right next to the sports reporters' bullpen. One day I watched as our sports editor had a conversation with a guy who wanted his picture in the paper because he had just shot a bear. I looked out the window and saw it in the back of his truck -- he had shot it, then rushed right over to the newspaper office to get his picture taken.

Languagehat, I don't think anyone here is a pussy (so I don't really understand your temptation), and I don't really see too many people here saying this guy is a jerk because he killed an animal (maybe chance's comment). Most of us are educated enough to know how the burger got on our plate, and I for one respect anyone with the guts and know-how to go out and get their own dinner. I also don't agree that hunting is a way to hide your small dick behind your big gun -- that's just a lame surface argument whose time has come.

What bugs me -- and I'd wager I'm not the only one -- is the fact that there are a lot of people in the world whose reaction to seeing an animal that is exceptional in some way (be it size, ferocity, antler span, whatever), is to want to blast the fuck out of it. And to want to say "Look at me: I am the one who felled this beast." It's certainly an accomplishment; killing this pig was no easy task. But there's a mindset there that (a) I just don't get, and (b) seems really, really primitive to me no matter how hard I try to keep an open mind.
posted by hifiparasol at 11:48 AM on May 26, 2007 [13 favorites]

Some pig!
posted by hermitosis at 11:49 AM on May 26, 2007

Are you achin' (oink oink oink)
For some bacon? (oink oink oink)
Iiiiiiii'm a big pig
You can be a big pig too!
posted by evilcolonel at 11:50 AM on May 26, 2007 [1 favorite]

hifiparasol said it better.
posted by everichon at 11:51 AM on May 26, 2007

On a note unrelated to my last comment: That pig's ear is bigger than the kid's whole head. Forget making a silk purse; you could make an overight bag out of that thing.
posted by hifiparasol at 11:53 AM on May 26, 2007 [1 favorite]

It was probably coming right for him.
posted by gomichild at 11:58 AM on May 26, 2007 [2 favorites]

Well, right, culture clash. I can tell you from personal experience (which is, um, only personal) that hunting is really fun. Gets the juices flowing. I haven't done it in years, but I can remember just having a blast. And if you had a particularly successful day (and remember, many days you just get wet and cold), then it was more of a blast and you had something to talk about. Guns are also really entertaining, and that adds to the joyful mix.

Of course people who hunt are hicks, killing is bad, and guns are evil and blah, blah, blah. But still...
posted by MarshallPoe at 12:00 PM on May 26, 2007

hifiparasol: I don't get the mindset either (not having grown up with it or experienced it), and sure, it's primitive, like many aspects of human life (sex, for instance). But my reaction to a mindset I don't understand is not to want to blast the fuck out of it. I have no idea how I'd react to hunting if I ever tried it; I might hate it or I might really like it. (I've read enough accounts by people who hated the very idea of guns but then loved shooting them when they got the chance to realize it's one of those things there's no predicting.) I just roll my eyes at the sight of a bunch of good liberal MeFites who have probably never seen a gun in real life talking about "triumphalism" or saying "What a sick little bastard." For heaven's sake, "Look at me: I am the one who felled this beast" is as ancient a reaction as there is; go back far enough in any poetic/literary tradition and you'll find it. People were killing huge hogs in ancient Sumer and bragging about it. It's just silly to pretend it's some psychological flaw in this particular kid.
posted by languagehat at 12:01 PM on May 26, 2007 [1 favorite]

Or what MarshallPoe said.
posted by languagehat at 12:02 PM on May 26, 2007

My only issue with this is that it took 8 shots and a 3 hour chase to kill the animal. For an animal that size, even a massive handgun is pretty clearly the wrong weapon, although the boy was probably shooting it for record book purposes. Still, someone should have taken a kill shot with an appropriate rifle when the hunt turned to a chase of a wounded animal, particularly a chase that involved 7 additional shots, after first blood.
posted by paulsc at 12:04 PM on May 26, 2007 [8 favorites]

Feral hogs are a non-native invasive species that cause tremendous damage to the southern forests. We need to give this boy a 4x4 full of weapons and set him loose.

It's not just the southern States. Feral hogs are moving northward and are now in British Columbia. There are a lot of them and they are hard to kill.

See Hogs Wild by Ian Frazier for more...
posted by KokuRyu at 12:12 PM on May 26, 2007 [1 favorite]

Seeing as you have "Replica" written on the side of your gun...and I have "Desert Eagle .50" written on the side of MY gun..."
I'm guessing viral advertising for a new Guy Ritchie film.
posted by acro at 12:15 PM on May 26, 2007

I never said it was a psychological flaw -- I just said I don't understand it, and it seems brutish to me despite my efforts to contextualize it. And if provides perspective to my argument, I'll say that I've shot guns before and thoroughly enjoyed it. I never thought I wouldn't. (My target shooting skills leave a bit to be desired, however.)

I'm not judging this kid. Nor did I judge the guy who showed up with the dead bear in his pickup bed. The part that seems brutish isn't killing the animal -- it's the looking around afterward to make sure everyone knows you did it. Blasting the life out of something seems a strange place to draw a sense of accomplishment when the thing that you just killed didn't necessarily warrant killing.

Just because a motivation is ancient and primitive doesn't mean it really has any use for us anymore. This pig wasn't terrorizing the populace or decimating livestock. The kid shot it in a canned hunt -- Gilgamesh he ain't.
posted by hifiparasol at 12:16 PM on May 26, 2007

To follow up on an earlier comment, made by Deathalicious, it really does look like forced perspective. If you look at the picture with the kid with the gun, notice that the top of the pig, just below the boy, is slightly out of focus, yet the boy is much sharper and in focus.

The only way for that to happen, particularly with the background in focus as well, is for the pig to be closer to the camera, in fact, possibly quite a bit closer to the camera, and the boy to be further away, closer to the woods. The boy is then leaning forward into nothing, and it appears as if he is next to the hog, when in fact, there is some distance between them.

Because the pig is closer to the camera, it appears much bigger than it is.

This is not to say that this isn't a big pig, just that the pictures look staged to appear bigger than it is.
posted by MythMaker at 12:16 PM on May 26, 2007

Come on ... giant pigs, .50 caliber handguns...
posted by acro at 12:16 PM on May 26, 2007

KokoRyu, I should have previewed. I was going to mention that aspect of all this, but didn't want to derail my own argument.

As a part of my general effort to consider things in the best possible light, I'll think of this kid's actions as good environmental stewardship. :)
posted by hifiparasol at 12:19 PM on May 26, 2007

From the looks of young, stout, bacon-loving Jamison, I'm going to guess that a pig will eventually kill him.
posted by william_boot at 12:23 PM on May 26, 2007 [7 favorites]

I'll think of this kid's actions as good environmental stewardship

According to Ian Frazier, there is no easy or humane way to eradicate feral hogs (and this is based on the assumption that feral hogs are an invasive species that should be removed).

Poisoning doesn't work, and the hogs are too smart for traps. They're too hard to hunt...unless you use dogs.

Sez Frazier, dog teams are really the only effective way to get rid of feral hogs. And if you picture the difference between being tracked, chased and terrorized by dogs and tracked and chased by a boy with a large handgun, perhaps what the kid did isn't really so bad after all.
posted by KokuRyu at 12:27 PM on May 26, 2007

I guess this succinctly answers the questions:

Could a typical young man, armed only with a gun, (say, 40 or 50 caliber) be trained to consistently "win" fights with a giant pig? Assume no element of surprise.
posted by blue_beetle at 12:29 PM on May 26, 2007

Beowulf was a big pussy with a small dick.
posted by Falconetti at 12:29 PM on May 26, 2007

Kind of reminds me of the geologist who found what was probably the oldest tree in the world, some 4800 years old, and cut it down to count the rings.

There are plenty of responsible hunters. As other people have said, though, this is unquestionably a unique animal. It is not just some big hog. It is like finding a live dinosaur, then hunting it down and shooting it.

Given that they are starting the filming of the movie Hogzilla, this sure sounds suspicious, though.

That kids is pretty big himself, but I wonder if someone that age could handle the kick of a 50 caliber pistol. Wouldn't it have made more sense to go hunting with a rifle?
posted by eye of newt at 12:31 PM on May 26, 2007

Part of me understands what hifiparasol is talking about. I was on a cave tour once and the guide just finished explaining how some delicate mineral blossom took eons to form and was the only one of its kind known to exist. As soon as he turned his back a kid that looked almost exactly like that one stuck his hand into it.

Another part of me is imagining a heating-oil tank cut in half and turned into a giant BBQ grill.
posted by StickyCarpet at 12:32 PM on May 26, 2007

Mythmaker is right. It is staged to look like the kid of leaning over top of the boar but if you look carefully you can see that the kid is leaning on his knee. Immediate reduction of 10 badass points.

You can also clearly see a bullet hole in the left haunch. 5 point reduction for unsportsmanlike conduct.
posted by jmccw at 12:40 PM on May 26, 2007

The kid wasn't alone. There were several grown men armed with rifles with him, but they gave him the privilege of making the kill. If the hog had turned and charged, all of them would have opened up, but since he didn't they let the kid do all the shooting.
posted by Steven C. Den Beste at 12:43 PM on May 26, 2007

"... And if you picture the difference between being tracked, chased and terrorized by dogs and tracked and chased by a boy with a large handgun, perhaps what the kid did isn't really so bad after all."
posted by KokuRyu at 3:27 PM on May 26

Nothing says Greg Whidden didn't previously catch that hog with his dogs, and sell it to that preserve (on condition it never be allowed to get out of containment), where it may have been considerably fattened on dropped feed, in anticipation for the boy to hunt. So, that hog could have been hunted several times, and gotten pretty mean and crafty. By the time it was killed, I doubt you could really call it a "feral" hog, anymore.
posted by paulsc at 12:46 PM on May 26, 2007

Most of us are educated enough to know how the burger got on our plate ...

I eat meat. It tastes good. After getting "educated enough" about exactly what it goes through before it gets to my grocery store, though I eat a lot less meat than I used to. As for burgers, I actually think I have eaten my last McWendyKinginthebox patty. If I'd killed and butchered the meat myself, I think I'd digest in peace.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 12:46 PM on May 26, 2007

hi,
what's giving me a bad feeling about it is that something narcissistic is linked with death and destruction. But maybe it's just one of the roots of violence ?
posted by nicolin at 12:47 PM on May 26, 2007

Yes, but did its hide bristle with the broken weapons of those who had come before, and failed? Did he have to betray the trust of those he had sworn to protect, and make a pact with dark entities in the employ of a fallen angel in order to acquire the weapon capable of killing it?
posted by agentofselection at 12:48 PM on May 26, 2007 [9 favorites]

I love everything about this story.
posted by bshort at 12:54 PM on May 26, 2007

What LarryC said (Both times; the perspectivedepth/resolution of the pics look off to me.).

On the chance that it was real, I'd feel safer if there was a bear roaming the area than that monstrosity.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 12:58 PM on May 26, 2007

I was going to say something similar to paulsc.
I knew gamekeepers and poachers in the villages I grew up in and have been shooting myself.
There were men I respected then and who I continued to respect after later becoming a vegetarian. They were the ones who knew and loved the woods and the creatures in them. They practised stewardship and killed to eat or make a living and that alone. They took pleasure in their craft but never in the death itself, which they'd be ashamed if they had to accomplish in more than a single clean shot.
posted by Abiezer at 1:04 PM on May 26, 2007

Though we never had fucking gurt pigs like that.
posted by Abiezer at 1:05 PM on May 26, 2007

Of course people want to tell of the glory of their hunt. That sort of thing goes so far back into human history I'd be surprised to find it's not hard-wired right into our brains.
posted by Mr.Encyclopedia at 1:17 PM on May 26, 2007 [2 favorites]

I don't agree Mr.Encyclopedia. My impression was much of early hunting art was in praise of the quarry and in propitiation to its spirit so the land would continue to provide.
The trophy/thrill of the chase stuff I associate more with the nobility making it a sport and those who followed after.
posted by Abiezer at 1:22 PM on May 26, 2007

"hi, i'm from metafilter and i could overthink a plate of pork and beans!"
posted by pyramid termite at 1:26 PM on May 26, 2007

gun owner/infrequent hunter here to say there was nothing wrong with killing the pig, but there was something missing in the aftermath. in the hunting culture i know, there is a tinge of reverence for a magnificent animal and solemn acknowledgment of its sacrifice overlaying the pride of a successful hunt and the anticipation of 500-700 pounds of sausage. this young fellow hasn't learned that yet. right now, he's probably learning not to make unguarded comments which end up on the internet.
posted by bruce at 1:33 PM on May 26, 2007

“My impression was much of early hunting art was in praise of the quarry and in propitiation to its spirit so the land would continue to provide. The trophy/thrill of the chase stuff I associate more with the nobility making it a sport and those who followed after.”

Abiezer, with all due respect, I have a strong feeling that this is just "noble savage" romanticism on your part. I'm pretty sure that if you look at accounts of "primitive" hunting cultures you'll see that both an animistic (or quasi-animistic) cultural ethos exists with the thrill/joy of the hunt.
posted by Ethereal Bligh at 1:35 PM on May 26, 2007

In the gorilla warfare thread.

Dang, that is one GIGANTIC hog! Incredible. On Catalina Island off the coast of California there used to be wild hogs, apparently called "feral swine", that roamed around. When I visited I was scared of them and they were only the size of fat cocker spaniels. This Alabama monster was somewhere between a hippo and an elephant.

While I'm sad this extraordinary brute died, the fancy pistol toting *11 year old* kid was some hunter. Even though he's a plump little rascal he chased the hog for 3 hours. Had to be some serious exercise in that forest.
posted by nickyskye at 1:36 PM on May 26, 2007

I'd be a little more impressed if the kid had been the one with seven bullets in him when he brought the pig down. The story doesn't say so specifically, but as far as I can tell the pig didn't even have a gun.
posted by George_Spiggott at 1:39 PM on May 26, 2007

he didn't have an apron, a grill or a set of barbeque brushes either, george ... sheesh
posted by pyramid termite at 1:43 PM on May 26, 2007

That's more than possible EB; I haven't studied the subject in any depth at all.
posted by Abiezer at 1:48 PM on May 26, 2007

According to the "accurate measurements" from the taxidermist, it's 74 inches around the shoulders. Assuming it's roughly round there, as it looks like it is, that means about 2 feet diameter. Comparing breadth to length in the photos indicates it's 5-6 feet long. Add to that the fact that more than one of the photos is pretty obviously staged to make it look bigger than it is.

A big pig, but not quite so big as claimed.
posted by sfenders at 2:05 PM on May 26, 2007

...chased it for three hours through hilly woods...

...and next was seen lashed to the pig's side, tangled in the lines from the harpoons, killed by his own obsession.
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:31 PM on May 26, 2007 [2 favorites]

Got to disagree with you there, sfenders. According to this photo, it's over ten feet long.
posted by fandango_matt at 2:32 PM on May 26, 2007

You could cut one of those open with a lightsaber and fit your freezing buddy in there real good, I reckon.
posted by brain_drain at 2:46 PM on May 26, 2007

Couldn't these people afford a ruler to put in front of the damned pig?
posted by stavrogin at 2:51 PM on May 26, 2007

I'm pretty sure there's a KMFDM song about this.
posted by thirteenkiller at 3:07 PM on May 26, 2007 [3 favorites]

Beowulf was a big pussy with a small dick.

A hermaphrodite, then . . .
posted by donovan at 3:28 PM on May 26, 2007

Wait, did I just see a Loco Gringos reference on MeFi?
posted by 2sheets at 3:45 PM on May 26, 2007

+ 1000 for Horton Heat reference.
posted by jessamyn at 4:08 PM on May 26, 2007

I'm sure no one is left reading this thread, but I'm still going to put this in.

My dad's in the meat and seafood business. I've visited slaughterhouses. I know how meat gets on your plate. I don't have a problem with animals being killed for food.

This animal was not killed for food, and it spent the last three hours of its life on the run, terrified, and in pain. And THAT'S why I have a problem with this kill, this kid, and this thread.
posted by tzikeh at 4:13 PM on May 26, 2007

Make me an angel a porkchop
That flies from Montgomery
posted by flapjax at midnite at 4:13 PM on May 26, 2007

This animal was not killed for food

I'm not saying that you may not have other good points, but they are definitely planning to eat that animal: "Mike Stone is having sausage made from the rest of the animal. 'We'll probably get 500 to 700 pounds,' he said."
posted by jessamyn at 4:21 PM on May 26, 2007

You go hunt, kid.
I'll stay here & gather.
posted by Floydd at 4:25 PM on May 26, 2007 [2 favorites]

Sweet hooooooome Alabama!

chrismear, I hear ya, buddy, but that's about two o's too many.
posted by flapjax at midnite at 4:27 PM on May 26, 2007

they are definitely planning to eat that animal

You're right. My mistake, and I take that part back. But not the rest, and I didn't even start on my disgust of the "pay-per-hunt" business.

"Look at that astounding, unique animal; let's kill it" is a sentiment I will never, ever understand. I would stand in awe, possibly take photos if I could, and let it go on with its life. It's like people who kill deer, chop off their heads and mount them on plaques on their wall, and the point them out to visitors by saying "Isn't she a beauty?" Yes, I'm sure she was quite beautiful; now she's a head on your wall. Feel good about yourself, do you?

It makes me angry, and it makes me sad.
posted by tzikeh at 4:28 PM on May 26, 2007

....500 to 700 pounds of sausage...

Reminded me of this controversial video by New Zealand's the Skeptics.
posted by humannaire at 4:36 PM on May 26, 2007

The BBQ from a pig that big would require an awesome invitation.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:42 PM on May 26, 2007

Big pig, eh? Well, you missed a perfect opportunity to flesh out yourpost with, say, this and this. You know what they say, the more links the better! ;-)
posted by flapjax at midnite at 4:42 PM on May 26, 2007

I had a friend in college who spent a summer on the coast of Georgia riding around on an ATV with a rifle to slaughter feral pigs like this one (much smaller of course).

He was paid to do this by the state government. And for lack of a better word, he's what you'd call an "environmentalist." Feral pigs are a big proglem in some areas, and they aren't a native species. (If I remember correctly, he was actually paid to protect sea turtle nests from said pigs, but it was much cooler to tell people he slaughtered FERAL FUCKING PIGS all summer.)
posted by bardic at 4:46 PM on May 26, 2007

hehe. "proglem."
posted by bardic at 4:47 PM on May 26, 2007

Kidding aside, if you eat pork, chances are it came from a factory farm. The pigs there live a life of filth, near-immobility and darkness. This monster pig had it okay -- his last hours can't have been much fun but the rest of its life was a real life. If you're going to get outraged about this, better stop eating pork first, because every bite you take supports practices that cause incomparably more animal suffering (and let's not even get into the environmental impact) than this incident did.
posted by George_Spiggott at 5:14 PM on May 26, 2007

First off, I have no problem with hunting or hunters. I have done a little in my past and didn't really enjoy it much. (Shooting guns: fun. Wandering around in the outdoors and searching: fun. The actual kill: disappointing and sad.) I know quite a few people that hunt and take it seriously. The problem I have with this is the whole staged pseudo-macho gonna make my son a man thing. It's the trophy-hunt with a handgun. Maybe afterwards they bought him a prostitute as well to seal the deal. So much emphasis is put on the size of the beast, and the fact it was shot with a handgun. Very messily at that. It reeks of the weak guy with big friends beseeching them to hold him back before he hurts someone.

The other side of the issue for me is that this was shot on a private pay to hunt place. It's a sign of "sport" becoming an activity of the elite. More and more trout streams are becoming private fishing clubs so as a fly fisherman good waters become harder to access. The same with private hunting lands as guides make agreements with large ranchers so they can take high paying clients on "trophy hunts" for something to hang on the wall. It's an ongoing trend, and a far cry from the father/son hunts my friends do. So little about learning about the animals and their manners, and about hiring someone to stake out a trophy for you to kill so you can talk about it with friends over brandy and cigars in the den.
posted by Eekacat at 5:21 PM on May 26, 2007 [1 favorite]

" Jamison received a congratulation from:
Rickey Medlocke of Lynyrd Skynyrd - Kenny Chesney - Tom Knapp & Tim Bradley of Benelli - Jerry Miculek of Smith & Wesson
and his Hero's from our Armed Forces around the world "

Why not? The kid was husky and he had an exotic $1,500 handgun that could blow your entire body clean off. It’s the American way.
posted by Huplescat at 5:22 PM on May 26, 2007

I'm not saying that you may not have other good points, but they are definitely planning to eat that animal: "Mike Stone is having sausage made from the rest of the animal. 'We'll probably get 500 to 700 pounds,' he said."


I vaguely remember hearing somewhere that you want to kill the animal with one shot because if you spook it, the adrenaline makes the meat all tough. Is that just total bullshit/apocrypha?
posted by juv3nal at 5:48 PM on May 26, 2007

Oh won't you pass that apple pie?
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:50 PM on May 26, 2007

500-700 pounds of sausage

From a wild uncastrated bore that they spent three hours running down. That’s going to be some nasty tasting and smelling meat. Hopefully they cut it with something else to get rid of the testosterone and adrenaline taint.
posted by Tenuki at 6:05 PM on May 26, 2007

none, for me, thanks ... that pork chop sure did fill me up
posted by pyramid termite at 6:07 PM on May 26, 2007

Got to disagree with you there, sfenders. According to this photo, it's over ten feet long.

True, that's a good point. I guess these things do happen once in a while, nature brings us the occasional animal of ridiculously gigantic proportions. One time for example, I almost caught a lake trout that was well over four feet long, but it got away.
posted by sfenders at 6:11 PM on May 26, 2007

I'm having trouble picturing the size of a 1051 lb hog. Can someone convert that into pulled pork sandwiches for me?
posted by [expletive deleted] at 6:28 PM on May 26, 2007

True, that's a good point. I guess these things do happen once in a while, nature brings us the occasional animal of ridiculously gigantic proportions.

My guess is that it was a hunting preserve and the handlers grow these once domesticated pigs--which turn warthogish in the wild--with piles of corn set out for them to eat, and then sell the hunting experience by the weight of the kill, just like they do in Montana on trout farms.
posted by Brian B. at 6:38 PM on May 26, 2007

Wow, those guys really went the whole hog.
posted by Effigy2000 at 6:44 PM on May 26, 2007

I'm unimpressed.

Let's review the facts:

His father paid for the hunt.
He was armed with a powerful, but inappropriate weapon.
He had backup in the form of dozens of people armed with appropriate weapons.
Despite all these advantages he took three hours to made a *very* sloppy kill.

Big whoop.

Honestly, I'm unimpressed with hunting in general. If a person is hunting for survival then naturally he should take all the advantages he can get, but wheres the sport in shooting a deer with a high powered rifle from nearly a kilometer away?

You want sport, take up bow hunting, or (better yet) hunting with a spear. Now that's sporting. Of course, you'd have to learn whole sheaf of difficult skills and risk actual personal harm, so naturally it doesn't appeal to the sort of idiot the kid and his parents obviously are.

What this kid did was more like bullfighting than hunting.
posted by sotonohito at 6:52 PM on May 26, 2007 [2 favorites]

forced perspective indeed.
posted by longsleeves at 6:53 PM on May 26, 2007

Uncle Chuck vs. The Giant Pig.
posted by homunculus at 7:09 PM on May 26, 2007

Good story, homunculus.
posted by Huplescat at 7:46 PM on May 26, 2007

Honestly, I'm unimpressed with hunting in general. If a person is hunting for survival then naturally he should take all the advantages he can get, but wheres the sport in shooting a deer with a high powered rifle from nearly a kilometer away?

Can YOU hit a target the size of a deer from a kilometer away? Would you be able to SEE a deer from that far away? Maybe you should try it sometimes so that, you know, you could speak from experience.
posted by c13 at 7:51 PM on May 26, 2007

but wheres the sport in shooting a deer with a high powered rifle from nearly a kilometer away?

See the third photo in the series, specifically the baby sitting at the shooting bench.
posted by Brian B. at 8:28 PM on May 26, 2007

1 MetaFilter users nearest this user:
greasepig (21 miles)

I'm just sayin.
posted by dreamsign at 8:59 PM on May 26, 2007

"Oh nameless God of Rage and Hate, I bow before you. A mound will be raised and funeral rights performed on this ground where you have fallen. Pass on in peace and bear us no hatred." from Princess Mononoke. That was my first thought after seeing the picture.
posted by Sailormom at 9:03 PM on May 26, 2007 [5 favorites]

From a wild uncastrated bore that they spent three hours running down. That’s going to be some nasty tasting and smelling meat. Hopefully they cut it with something else to get rid of the testosterone and adrenaline taint.

Wow, that's what I was thinking. That sausage better be pretty well seasoned - it's gonna taste like crap.
posted by The Light Fantastic at 9:28 PM on May 26, 2007

Hawaiian kahunas knew how to intone a special chant that would put a pig to sleep and eventually stop its heart.
posted by Burhanistan at 9:33 PM on May 26, 2007

Good story, homunculus.
posted by Huplescat at 10:46 PM on May 26

Thanks! It also happens to be true.
posted by Lafe at 9:58 PM on May 26, 2007

I thought you were gonna stop at 1000 Burhanistan.

And geez sotonohito. Do you ever get tired of talking out of your ass? Talk about a big boor.
posted by vronsky at 10:19 PM on May 26, 2007

Ah crap! I did go over, didn't I? Now I'll have to go until 1111 and maybe post a few more links to keep my profile spiffy.
posted by Burhanistan at 10:25 PM on May 26, 2007

I wouldn't mind if you stayed for a million my friend;)
posted by vronsky at 10:36 PM on May 26, 2007 [1 favorite]

You want sport, take up... hunting with a spear."
You asked for it.
The pigs aren't big, but I think it would be fair to say, in this case, that the hunters' testicles are.
posted by agentofselection at 10:40 PM on May 26, 2007

Was anyone else reminded of Jane Smiley's Moo?

Apparently feral pigs are a big environmental problem in Texas. Also, the meat is not supposed to be that great.

Feral Hog Abatement Program.

I agree with those who think this is a viral promo for Lost.
posted by craniac at 11:20 PM on May 26, 2007

They're not bashful about posting all the flames they've received as well as the positive.
posted by Burhanistan at 12:12 AM on May 27, 2007

"You asked for it."

That man needs a cross spar on his spear, keeps the pissed off boar from running up your spear and making a mess of you.
posted by Tenuki at 12:34 AM on May 27, 2007

Nice. Saustex recently re-released a Locos Gringos album. Didn't expect to see a reference to that here, but hell, though it's pretty appropriate given the size of that monster and that's one of the things that rules about Metafilter.
posted by bluevelvetelvis at 12:48 AM on May 27, 2007

I just roll my eyes at the sight of a bunch of good liberal MeFites who have probably never seen a gun in real life talking about "triumphalism" or saying "What a sick little bastard."

I called him a sick little bastard because he is, and contrary to your assumption, I'm very familiar with guns - I've shot them, many times, had them pulled on me, and even seen people shot with them. I don't own any guns, but that's just because I can think of other things to do with a couple hundred dollars. So roll your eyes all you want but the kid's a sick fucker because he shot an animal eight times over the course of three hours just so he could have 600 pounds of sausage or whatever other stupid justification the adults in his life are making. That's not heroic or tough, that's just sick, weak, and pathetic.
posted by cmonkey at 12:51 AM on May 27, 2007

Two and a half hours of torturing an animal is ok, but three is just way over the line.
posted by BillBishop at 1:30 AM on May 27, 2007

This hog was not remotely 'wart-hogish'. Warthogs are quite small in comparison, and don't seem especially agressive. They shared space at the campground where we stayed (together with bushpigs and unknown numbers and varieties of antelope).

My dad went boar hunting in Tenesee one year. The boar he shot was no feral hog, but the real bristle-haired variety. Turned out totally inedible (and stank up the house when mom tried to cook some).
posted by Goofyy at 3:23 AM on May 27, 2007

vronsky: How was I talking out of my ass? I used what I thought was somewhat comic exageration (the kilometer bit) to hammer my point home, but I'm pretty sure that other than that deliberate exageration everything I said is perfectly factual.

The parts specifically relating to the kid and the pig are the facts that the kid's own website lists.

As for the rest, I am unimpressed with hunting in general. I think I've got a fair grasp of the skill level involved because I'm a damn fine shot with a rifle; and while there's no denying it took time to acquire that skill there's also no denying that it is nowhere near as difficult or time consuming as becoming a similarly accomplished archer.

Seriously, look at deer hunting: you spray scent, or scatter corn, or whatever, back off to a blind, wait around until a deer shows up, then shoot it with a high powered rifle. Have I left anything out? Its just target shooting with live targets.

What the kid did was no more praiseworthy than what the sick bastards who work as matadors do. He killed, painfully and over a long period of time, a large aggressive animal, at no particular risk to himself due to the presence of well armed backup. Big whoop.

agentofselection: I am officially impressed. Can't say its my thing, but at least it isn't just glorified target shooting like deer hunting or an exercise in safe cruelty like the idiots this thread is about.
posted by sotonohito at 5:32 AM on May 27, 2007

I just roll my eyes at the sight of a bunch of good liberal MeFites who have probably never seen a gun in real life talking about "triumphalism"

What a privilege to be reduced to a caricature by the great languagehat. Not for nothing, I have fired tons of guns in my day, just never at a living creature. So I thought the celebrations surrounding the slaying of this pretty magnificent beast was bizarre.

I have always seen a significant moral difference between raising animals for slaughter to feed millions and killing them for fun to mount the carcass's head over your mantle. The triumphalism that arose from the latter just creeped me out a little bit.
posted by psmealey at 6:26 AM on May 27, 2007

I called him a sick little bastard because he is, and contrary to your assumption, I'm very familiar with guns - I've shot them, many times, had them pulled on me, and even seen people shot with them.... So roll your eyes all you want but the kid's a sick fucker because he shot an animal eight times over the course of three hours just so he could have 600 pounds of sausage or whatever other stupid justification the adults in his life are making.

My apologies—I disagree with your conclusion about the kid but I shouldn't have made assumptions about your background.

I have fired tons of guns in my day, just never at a living creature.

Similar apologies to you, but I still think it's ludicrous to act all shocked because this kid exhibited perfectly natural human behavior at having slain a large predator, however clumsily he did it. I respect people's choices about how to live their lives, and if you don't want to kill animals that's great, but why pretend that everyone else is somehow exhibiting appalling deviation from your preferred norm?
posted by languagehat at 9:08 AM on May 27, 2007

I just roll my eyes at the sight of a bunch of good liberal MeFites who have probably never seen a gun in real life talking about "triumphalism" or saying "What a sick little bastard."

Maybe they're familiar with deviant psychology. Or maybe it reminds them of Ted Nugent.
posted by Brian B. at 9:16 AM on May 27, 2007

I still think it's ludicrous to act all shocked because this kid exhibited perfectly natural human behavior at having slain a large predator

Well, I understand your point, but I wasn't talking about the kid's triumphalism, I was talking about everyone else's cries of hooting about it. It struck me as voyeuristic and weird.
posted by psmealey at 9:25 AM on May 27, 2007

I was talking about everyone else's cries of hooting about it. It struck me as voyeuristic and weird.

OK, fair enough.
posted by languagehat at 9:38 AM on May 27, 2007

They're not bashful about posting all the flames they've received as well as the positive.

The kid goes to a Christian Heritage school. The flames, they serve to support them in their beliefs about the need for Christian Dominion. Not exactly a good thing.
posted by five fresh fish at 10:35 AM on May 27, 2007

The flames, they serve to support them in their beliefs about the need for Christian Dominion.

Yep. To wit:
After reading all the negative comments:
May God bless rednecks and God-fearing people, for they are the backbone of a free America.
posted by Burhanistan at 11:51 AM on May 27, 2007

Also, I'll personally bet that they have selected only the most mindless and ALL CAPS negative comments they got, while omitting the more thoughtful ones.

I looked at their negative comments section and found exactly one sane sounding negative comment. To me this would tend to indicate that they are posting only those negative comments which add weight to their agenda by making their opponents sound like loons.
posted by sotonohito at 11:57 AM on May 27, 2007

I looked at their negative comments section and found exactly one sane sounding negative comment. To me this would tend to indicate that they are posting only those negative comments which add weight to their agenda by making their opponents sound like loons.

Yeah, they probably left that one in just to fuck with you. That's the problem with stupid, loud, mouth breathing, obnoxious hillbillies, they're just so damn clever and subtle.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 12:13 PM on May 27, 2007 [2 favorites]

posted by blue_beetle at said:

Could a typical young man, armed only with a gun, (say, 40 or 50 caliber) be trained to consistently "win" fights with a giant pig? Assume no element of surprise.


Oh I love you for posting that. I hadn't seen it. That may be the most awesome AskMe post ever.

As to hunting; not something I'd do, but not something I'm opposed to when it's "real" hunters. Pay-2-kill hunters are the worst evolution that could have happened to hunting.

Take this story for example. That's not real hunting. That's cruel, amateur, kill for killing sake, bloodsport. To take 3 hours and 8 shots to kill *anything* is unacceptable. There is no excuse, no adrenaline rush in the world that justifies glorifying cruelty. And that's what this is, animal cruelty, being celebrated in a orgasm of testosterone.

This kid went out after an animal with entirely the wrong weapon, and the adults who paid for and escorted the trip knew it was the wrong weapon. They were willing to torture this animal *just so* the kid could use the wrong weapon.

That's not hunting. That's bloodsport. Big difference.
posted by dejah420 at 12:56 PM on May 27, 2007

Erm...Sorry about the weirdness quoting blue beetle above, forgot to clean that up from a copy and paste. My bad.
posted by dejah420 at 12:57 PM on May 27, 2007

Alvy Ampersand wrote "That's the problem with stupid, loud, mouth breathing, obnoxious hillbillies, they're just so damn clever and subtle."

Ummm....

According to the price list from the trophy farm where the rich punk shot the pig his daddy paid at least $1,300 so his idiot kid could shoot a big boar with the wrong weapon. The wrong weapon in question is a custom made S&W Model 500 pistol, with a minimum list price of $900.

That's $2,200 so far, not including airfare, hotel accomidations, "guides" at the trophy farm, etc. Hillbillies is about as far from these twits as you can get.
posted by sotonohito at 1:16 PM on May 27, 2007

Boy, you people are really pissing on my enjoyment of that picture. I was astounded at the size of the pig, but now that you've all made it known that it was corn-fed, in captivity, shot with the wrong weapon, suffered for an entire day, and will make lousy sausage, all the fun is gone out of it.

Pigpoop.
posted by five fresh fish at 1:26 PM on May 27, 2007

Hillbillies is about as far from these twits as you can get.

Hillbilly is a gentle, nostalgic term unrelated to modern times (hence the TV show). Redneck is a littler more harsh and generally points out an anti-urban mentality, which many are proud of. White trash is very harsh, and should be reserved for only those who squander their resources and vote to keep their children in poverty. In my observations people buy very big pistols to camouflage a vast array of male in$ecurites, and then they must shoot something very large or dangerous to convince themselves they didn't waste their money.
posted by Brian B. at 1:39 PM on May 27, 2007

Hillbillies is about as far from these twits as you can get.

Hey, tell it to the folks getting their Culture War™ on, not me.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 2:28 PM on May 27, 2007

Apart from Larry C, has anyone else called BS (albeit tentatively)? I did a cursory search of the 140+ comments.
posted by uncanny hengeman at 10:03 PM on May 27, 2007

I can't decide whether the metafilter consensus is that although it's BS, that doesn't make any difference, or whether you're all just astoundingly credulous.
posted by sfenders at 6:44 AM on May 28, 2007

Here's a Snopes forum where a fella claims they are using "forced perspective" (a fancy way of saying he took a few steps back and pretended to lean on it?). Like the giant cat hoax from years back.

Here's some "proof" of the above theory from the same post.

And this:

The boy is hunting on a plantation with two guides and they just happen to discover a 1050 lbs hog that no one has ever seen before? Do you even know how much manure a hog generates and what kind of damage one normal sized hog can do to the land? If a pig that large lived there (and it didn't) a seasoned guide would have known it and it's doubtful he would have let someone else kill it and take credit for it.
posted by uncanny hengeman at 2:12 AM on May 29, 2007

Heh. It's earily quiet here.

Metafilter credulous.
The humiliation...
posted by jouke at 11:59 AM on May 29, 2007

Oh, it's totally bullshit. Fun, but bullshit.
posted by Pollomacho at 12:03 PM on May 29, 2007

Fun, but bullshit.

For sure. I'm a bit disappointed it isn't probably as big as it first looked. "I want to believe" and all dat.
posted by uncanny hengeman at 5:00 PM on May 29, 2007

Related.
posted by flapjax at midnite at 5:06 PM on May 29, 2007

Forced perspective or not, it's still one might big damn pig. Unfrackin' believable. Wouldn't ever want to encounter one in real life.

Not surprising to see the kid takes after the old man. What is it with parents killing their kids with overfeeding? Geesh.
posted by five fresh fish at 5:36 PM on May 29, 2007

Forced perspective or not, it's still one might big damn pig. Unfrackin' believable. Wouldn't ever want to encounter one in real life.

Mate, in Australia pigs that size are as common as stray dogs!

Word.
posted by uncanny hengeman at 8:01 PM on May 29, 2007

chased it for three hours through hilly woods

By the look of those great white hunters, it wouldn't take much more than one hill to use up most of three hours.

What a vile pastime.
posted by pracowity at 5:14 AM on June 1, 2007

ATVs, pracowity.
posted by five fresh fish at 8:21 AM on June 1, 2007

Really? ATVs?

If that's true, the next time I hope the pig flattens him and eats his face.
posted by pracowity at 8:40 AM on June 1, 2007

Breaking news!

The whole thing was FAKE!

It was a farm raised pig, not wild.

FRUITHURST, Ala. — Before he became known as "Monster Pig," the 1,051-pound hog shot in Delta was known by another name.

Fred.

Rhonda and Phil Blissitt told The Anniston Star on Thursday evening that, on April 29, four days before the hog was killed, Fred was one of many livestock on their farm.
posted by MythMaker at 4:40 PM on June 1, 2007

As the Blissitts recounted the events of the last two days, they told stories and made many references to the gentleness of their former "pet."

From his treats of canned sweet potatoes to how their grandchildren would play with him, their stories painted the picture of a gentle giant. They even talked about how their small Chihuahua would get in the pen with him and come out unscathed.

That kid's going to wake up someday and feel kind of crappy about this whole thing.
posted by Burhanistan at 7:44 PM on June 1, 2007

Evidence of Adobe® Photoshop® manipulation.
posted by doublesix at 11:16 PM on June 1, 2007

I hope there's some sort of real-life blowback for the father. And just enough for the kid that he realizes he doesn't have to become as grotesque as his father, both physically and, apparently, mentally.
posted by five fresh fish at 7:18 AM on June 2, 2007

Poor Fred.
posted by LarryC at 3:18 PM on June 2, 2007

Jesus Christ, that is sickening. Why not just shoot a Golden Retriever?
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 3:33 PM on June 2, 2007

.
posted by Brian B. at 5:00 PM on June 2, 2007

Oh, come, now. If it was so damn pet-like, its owners wouldn't have sold it to a private hunting reserve. It was a pig, same sort of beast you eat with your eggs in the morning.
posted by five fresh fish at 5:01 PM on June 2, 2007

Why not just shoot a Golden Retriever?

C'mon, who ever heard of Golden Retriever sausage?
[NOT KOREANIST]
posted by flapjax at midnite at 5:57 PM on June 2, 2007

It was a pig, same sort of beast you eat with your eggs in the morning.

The Blissitts' description of the pig sounds a heck of a lot more domesticated than your average livestock, which to me implies that it needed to be hurt or subjected to some sort of duress for it to lead a three hour chase. It was theirs to sell, and the transaction was legal, but it still really sucks.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 7:23 PM on June 2, 2007

Then the issue is with the original owners, not the dummies who paid too much to kill it.
posted by five fresh fish at 8:02 PM on June 2, 2007

My issue is with hunting tame animals, and the possible - but apparently legal - methods used to provoke those animals into giving the hunters sport. The article says that the original owners sold all their stock, and while it would be nice if they could have found a buyer who would see that the animal had a more humane ending, a large male pig probably wouldn't be good for butchering, so they probably didn't have a lot of offers.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 8:19 PM on June 2, 2007

My issue is with the lying.
posted by five fresh fish at 10:11 PM on June 2, 2007

My issue is with having issues.
posted by Burhanistan at 6:00 AM on June 3, 2007

People don't have issues, people have problems. Magazines have issues. Sheesh....
posted by sotonohito at 7:33 AM on June 3, 2007

I have magazines, therefore I have issues. Nyah!
posted by five fresh fish at 8:24 AM on June 3, 2007

This has nothing to do with sport, law or traditions. It is a moral question before it ever gets to that point. Is it ethical to be cruel to domesticated animals by having children chase them around with handguns? What kind of people would want to do this and why?
posted by Brian B. at 9:20 AM on June 3, 2007