Iphone-Killer starts shipping
June 28, 2007 7:31 AM Subscribe
German Geek website reports that the The Iphone-Killer (the Iphone for geeks), OpenMoko, starts shipphing July. Unlike Apples Iphone, OpenMoke is not closed platform. The German Website reports further that OpenMokos 2nd hardware revision will provide WiFi, 3D acceleration and 256 MB Flash (shipping starts October 2007).
Forgive me, if the post is better suited for /.
Forgive me, if the post is better suited for /.
First, a link with more details. OpenMoko is the platform, the Neo is the phone.
Second, you could do a better job explaining how this is an iPhone killer. So it's open source. And? That does not make it an iPhone killer. It has a tiny amount of flash compared to an iPhone. Naturally, it does not sync with your iTunes.
Also, you and I both probably live in the US. What carrier exactly can I use this phone with?
posted by poppo at 7:41 AM on June 28, 2007 [1 favorite]
Second, you could do a better job explaining how this is an iPhone killer. So it's open source. And? That does not make it an iPhone killer. It has a tiny amount of flash compared to an iPhone. Naturally, it does not sync with your iTunes.
Also, you and I both probably live in the US. What carrier exactly can I use this phone with?
posted by poppo at 7:41 AM on June 28, 2007 [1 favorite]
If it can use open WiFi and didn't cost an arm and a leg I'd be reeeeeeeallly tempted. Of course, I doubt I can use the mobile phone portion in Canada. So. Well. Maybe not.
posted by the dief at 7:44 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by the dief at 7:44 AM on June 28, 2007
1 word: stylus
I meant to mention this one too...stylus vs the iPhone touchscreen? fuhgeddaboutit
this is a PDA running Linux, which is cool, but calling it an iPhone killer is ridiculous.
posted by poppo at 7:48 AM on June 28, 2007
I meant to mention this one too...stylus vs the iPhone touchscreen? fuhgeddaboutit
this is a PDA running Linux, which is cool, but calling it an iPhone killer is ridiculous.
posted by poppo at 7:48 AM on June 28, 2007
...stylus vs the iPhone touchscreen? fuhgeddaboutit
No kidding--who wants to constantly be forced to use their fat, greasy fingers to press tiny virtual buttons on a dirty screen?
posted by DU at 7:49 AM on June 28, 2007
No kidding--who wants to constantly be forced to use their fat, greasy fingers to press tiny virtual buttons on a dirty screen?
posted by DU at 7:49 AM on June 28, 2007
Also, no *holder* for the stylus, which means that it's gonna get lost. blugh.
posted by the dief at 7:50 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by the dief at 7:50 AM on June 28, 2007
No kidding--who wants to constantly be forced to use their fat, greasy fingers to press tiny virtual buttons on a dirty screen?
Stop with the fast food and they will be neither fat nor greasy :)
But seriously, if you haven't seen the videos about the use of the touchscreen yet, you should. It's quite amazing.
posted by poppo at 7:54 AM on June 28, 2007
Stop with the fast food and they will be neither fat nor greasy :)
But seriously, if you haven't seen the videos about the use of the touchscreen yet, you should. It's quite amazing.
posted by poppo at 7:54 AM on June 28, 2007
The size of the keyboard changes, even letters can get bigger or smaller or highlighted when the iPhone anticipates they must be used next.
No telling how good or bad this will work, but it seems cool.
posted by poppo at 7:56 AM on June 28, 2007
No telling how good or bad this will work, but it seems cool.
posted by poppo at 7:56 AM on June 28, 2007
To be fair, here's a list of Neo1973/OpenMoko compatible providers. It's a GSM thing, so there are a fair number of providers.
posted by the dief at 7:58 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by the dief at 7:58 AM on June 28, 2007
Second, you could do a better job explaining how this is an iPhone killer.
Because you decide what to do with it and not Apple.
Just imagine that in the future Zphone may run
on it.
What carrier exactly can I use this phone with?
AFAIK you neet a provider that offers GSM. T-Mobile should work in the US. Subsidisation by the carrier is another story.
posted by yoyo_nyc at 7:59 AM on June 28, 2007
Because you decide what to do with it and not Apple.
Just imagine that in the future Zphone may run
on it.
What carrier exactly can I use this phone with?
AFAIK you neet a provider that offers GSM. T-Mobile should work in the US. Subsidisation by the carrier is another story.
posted by yoyo_nyc at 7:59 AM on June 28, 2007
Iphone
iPhone, dude.
Iphone-Killer (the Iphone for geeks)
I'm sure it would like to think so.
USB 1.1? <1GB? I might call this "Treo-killer", though Treo is killing itself just fine.
Seriously, I appreciate that someone is trying to put out a lower-cost smartphone, but this looks hella-lame. Perhaps in a year there will be a convention where all 50 users of the device can get together.
posted by mkultra at 8:00 AM on June 28, 2007
iPhone, dude.
Iphone-Killer (the Iphone for geeks)
I'm sure it would like to think so.
USB 1.1? <1GB? I might call this "Treo-killer", though Treo is killing itself just fine.
Seriously, I appreciate that someone is trying to put out a lower-cost smartphone, but this looks hella-lame. Perhaps in a year there will be a convention where all 50 users of the device can get together.
posted by mkultra at 8:00 AM on June 28, 2007
this is a PDA running Linux, which is cool, but calling it an iPhone killer is ridiculous.
I predict this phone will do just as well as all the iPod killers and iMac killers. Actually, to make product descriptions more clear and truthful, every time we see the phrase "iProduct killer" we should substitute "iProduct also-ran."
posted by peeedro at 8:00 AM on June 28, 2007 [1 favorite]
I predict this phone will do just as well as all the iPod killers and iMac killers. Actually, to make product descriptions more clear and truthful, every time we see the phrase "iProduct killer" we should substitute "iProduct also-ran."
posted by peeedro at 8:00 AM on June 28, 2007 [1 favorite]
I found what I assume is the same video on YouTube. I'm not amazed yet. When even the propaganda training video warns you to go slow and is mostly about how to correct errors, it doesn't bode well for the performance.
posted by DU at 8:01 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by DU at 8:01 AM on June 28, 2007
doesn't a stylus do the same thing your finger does? Just more precisely?
posted by TechnoLustLuddite at 8:02 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by TechnoLustLuddite at 8:02 AM on June 28, 2007
Never apologize for your post in the main post, it just incites criticism. Anyway, given all the Apple love spewed here, this seems like quite the appropriate post, assuming that the phone really is an iPhone killer. Then agains, I am one who fails to see what makes the iPhone so cool, well at least cool enough to justify the extreme cost.
posted by caddis at 8:02 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by caddis at 8:02 AM on June 28, 2007
This is an iPhone killer the same way an iRiver is an iPod killer, right?
posted by chunking express at 8:03 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by chunking express at 8:03 AM on June 28, 2007
I predict this phone will do just as well as all the iPod killers and iMac killers.
To be fair: AFAIK OpenMoko was under development when nobody had ever heard of the iPhone but I may be wrong.
posted by yoyo_nyc at 8:03 AM on June 28, 2007
To be fair: AFAIK OpenMoko was under development when nobody had ever heard of the iPhone but I may be wrong.
posted by yoyo_nyc at 8:03 AM on June 28, 2007
BTW: I must disclose, I don't own a single Apple product, and I don't plan on getting an iPhone.
posted by poppo at 8:06 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by poppo at 8:06 AM on June 28, 2007
doesn't a stylus do the same thing your finger does? Just more precisely?
i'll reply to myself-
i'll reply to myself-
- "In a brief hands on test at Computex, the touch screen proved difficult to use, responding consistently only when tapped or scaped with a fingernail, and often ignoring input with the wider area of the fingertip. The device can also be operated more easily with a supplied stylus, staff said, but the phone does not have a clip or docking bay to hold this."
the iphone will be the iphone killer. (it will fail miserably)
posted by quarter waters and a bag of chips at 8:07 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by quarter waters and a bag of chips at 8:07 AM on June 28, 2007
BTW: I must disclose, I don't own a single Apple product, and I don't plan on getting an iPhone.
Well, actually I have iTunes. Sorry, I'll stop talking now.
posted by poppo at 8:09 AM on June 28, 2007
Other than the multi touch, what exactly is it that the iPhone brings to the table that the HTC TyTN doesn't do now? Not trolling, I'm genuinely curious.
posted by JaredSeth at 8:11 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by JaredSeth at 8:11 AM on June 28, 2007
Doesn't "Mokos" mean "boogers" in Argentine Spanish?
posted by zarq at 8:11 AM on June 28, 2007 [2 favorites]
posted by zarq at 8:11 AM on June 28, 2007 [2 favorites]
Apple's closed dev system isn't what kills the idea of the iPhone for me. The two-years of constantly aggravating and aggressively obnoxious customer service from ATT-nee-Cingular is the deal killer. I pledged I would never use their mobile service again and I meant it.
Also, while I can see that it will be entirely useful for many, many people, I am still at the point where I want my cell phone to be just.a.phone.
posted by beelzbubba at 8:12 AM on June 28, 2007
Also, while I can see that it will be entirely useful for many, many people, I am still at the point where I want my cell phone to be just.a.phone.
posted by beelzbubba at 8:12 AM on June 28, 2007
The iPhone is marketing for the next wave of iPods, and therefore cannot be "killed." And certainly not by OMG OPEN SOURCE! I CAN HAS OGG!!!1!!11!!!
posted by aaronetc at 8:23 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by aaronetc at 8:23 AM on June 28, 2007
zarq: not just Argentine. :)
posted by invitapriore at 8:23 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by invitapriore at 8:23 AM on June 28, 2007
As much as I would love to see an open-source phone and platform, I don't think the Neo and OpenMoko will be able to compete with the iPhone.
What I think would really be great is a simple, slim, no-frills phone that runs some easily-extensible operating system.
posted by thebigdeadwaltz at 8:30 AM on June 28, 2007
What I think would really be great is a simple, slim, no-frills phone that runs some easily-extensible operating system.
posted by thebigdeadwaltz at 8:30 AM on June 28, 2007
JaredSeth: I'm with you here, too. My HTC universal did everything the iphone does, and more, 18 months ago. Stream full-screen, non re-encoded video over wifi; voice control; stereo bluetooth - handwriting recognition - I don't get how a device that can't install software, has the flaky incompatibility of safari/konqueror as it's main application interface, and uses a Nintendo-DS style 'on-screen keyboard' is a step forward.
Granted, it's a nicely shaped lump of plastic (as are the prada/LG phones that have been on the markets a few months already). But what it does is nothing new...
posted by davemee at 8:32 AM on June 28, 2007
Granted, it's a nicely shaped lump of plastic (as are the prada/LG phones that have been on the markets a few months already). But what it does is nothing new...
posted by davemee at 8:32 AM on June 28, 2007
Okay, a link to a Foreign language website, and various iphone links? This post sucks.
posted by delmoi at 8:33 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by delmoi at 8:33 AM on June 28, 2007
The iPhone is a non-starter for me because they went with Cingular. I was a T-Mobile customer for many years until I couldn't handle the constantly worsening reception, dropped calls and vain promises of improvements that never materialized.
Cingular uses the same towers as T-Mobile in NYC, and the service is supposed to be just as abysmal.
The Neo looks even worse on paper, even though it's more open that the iPhone.
posted by bshort at 8:38 AM on June 28, 2007
Cingular uses the same towers as T-Mobile in NYC, and the service is supposed to be just as abysmal.
The Neo looks even worse on paper, even though it's more open that the iPhone.
posted by bshort at 8:38 AM on June 28, 2007
I love when people talk about things as an iPhone- [and before that iPod] killer. iPhone isn't even out yet so it is too soon to kill it. And even if iPhone isn't a giant success it will change the phone market. Apple isn't even aiming for the Mac's tiny market share of the mobile phone market with this. Steve said he wanted to sell 10 million units by the end of next year. That's not a lot of mobile phones on a planet with 3.2 billion in use. Just as a MacBook Pro isn't competing with $499 Dell notebook, iPhone isn't competing with the free with contract Moto Razr. It really isn't competing with Blackberrys. It is doing what Apple does -- creating a category. The same pundits that say that iPhone will be a flop also said iPod would be a flop. Let's just wait and see.
The biggest impact I think we'll see is on future versions of Windows Mobile smartphones.
posted by birdherder at 8:39 AM on June 28, 2007 [1 favorite]
The biggest impact I think we'll see is on future versions of Windows Mobile smartphones.
posted by birdherder at 8:39 AM on June 28, 2007 [1 favorite]
The biggest impact I think we'll see is on future versions of Windows Mobile smartphones.
We're going to throw them at WM "smart"phones? Rock.
posted by eriko at 8:49 AM on June 28, 2007
We're going to throw them at WM "smart"phones? Rock.
posted by eriko at 8:49 AM on June 28, 2007
It is doing what Apple does -- creating a category.
Mind you, I'm not a hater and if the iPhone was more reasonably priced (and on a different carrier), I'd probably contemplate getting one, but my HTC (and davemee seems to echo my sentiment) does everything the iPhone is supposed to do and has been doing so for months. What category are they creating?
posted by JaredSeth at 8:51 AM on June 28, 2007
Mind you, I'm not a hater and if the iPhone was more reasonably priced (and on a different carrier), I'd probably contemplate getting one, but my HTC (and davemee seems to echo my sentiment) does everything the iPhone is supposed to do and has been doing so for months. What category are they creating?
posted by JaredSeth at 8:51 AM on June 28, 2007
I bought a top of the range Smartphone around a year ago.
It was crap. It was slow, unintuitive, and I've barely used it outside of making calls. I was very disappointed.
The thing was that reviewers thought it was brilliant. It was top of the range.
I realized then that the smartphone market was living in a different world. Standards were very low. Concept was preferred over practicality.
From what I've seen, the iPhone is little more than good hardware with the application of common sense. It's mind-blowingly easy to use. The interface is good. It seems pretty speedy.
None of this is brain surgery or rocket science. It just took a company like Apple to realize what's wrong and fix it. That's what Apple does best: It gets the point. It then creates a great product. They got the point of home computing. They got the point of digital music. Note that I think it's Jobs who is the chief "point getter".
I also think that many of us mere mortals get the point, but that, for some reason, software and hardware developers (and even music industry execs) never do. They live in a different world. This is the nature of bad business.
I think this Linux phone will suffer from the problems of all older smartphones, in that it just misses the point by a few thousand miles. Like somebody said, if it has a stylus, it misses the point.
If nothing else, I suspect many of the key features of the iPhone will be protected by patents.
posted by humblepigeon at 8:56 AM on June 28, 2007 [1 favorite]
It was crap. It was slow, unintuitive, and I've barely used it outside of making calls. I was very disappointed.
The thing was that reviewers thought it was brilliant. It was top of the range.
I realized then that the smartphone market was living in a different world. Standards were very low. Concept was preferred over practicality.
From what I've seen, the iPhone is little more than good hardware with the application of common sense. It's mind-blowingly easy to use. The interface is good. It seems pretty speedy.
None of this is brain surgery or rocket science. It just took a company like Apple to realize what's wrong and fix it. That's what Apple does best: It gets the point. It then creates a great product. They got the point of home computing. They got the point of digital music. Note that I think it's Jobs who is the chief "point getter".
I also think that many of us mere mortals get the point, but that, for some reason, software and hardware developers (and even music industry execs) never do. They live in a different world. This is the nature of bad business.
I think this Linux phone will suffer from the problems of all older smartphones, in that it just misses the point by a few thousand miles. Like somebody said, if it has a stylus, it misses the point.
If nothing else, I suspect many of the key features of the iPhone will be protected by patents.
posted by humblepigeon at 8:56 AM on June 28, 2007 [1 favorite]
Also, telecoms companies are NOT keen to let open hardware onto their networks. The chance for one badly-hacked handset to bring down the entire local network is high.
You'll note that back in the days of wired phonelines, the phone companies didn't encourage people to build their own telephones, for very much the same reason.
posted by humblepigeon at 8:59 AM on June 28, 2007
You'll note that back in the days of wired phonelines, the phone companies didn't encourage people to build their own telephones, for very much the same reason.
posted by humblepigeon at 8:59 AM on June 28, 2007
Ok, I admit to being a little ignorant of cellphone/smartphone/whatthefuckever phone software, but seriously could one hacked phone truly bring down a local network? Seriously? I am pretty certain that in the "days of landlines" a self built phone would not do that. It'd either work or not.
There is a lot to be said for simplicity.
posted by edgeways at 9:10 AM on June 28, 2007
There is a lot to be said for simplicity.
posted by edgeways at 9:10 AM on June 28, 2007
Ok, I admit to being a little ignorant of cellphone/smartphone/whatthefuckever phone software, but seriously could one hacked phone truly bring down a local network? Seriously? I am pretty certain that in the "days of landlines" a self built phone would not do that. It'd either work or not.
There is a lot to be said for simplicity.
Landlines work via electrical currents, which are supplied via the phone line (hence your phone doesn't need mains power). Take too much power with a dodgy home-made phone and you'll blow a fuse at the switch. This could affect service for those near to you. Alternatively, you could create some slight fault that creates line noise for everybody else.
As for open source phones, I'm only quoting what a few industry people have said when responding to Linux phones in the past. I've no idea if it's possible to kill the network. I guess it depends on how fragile the network is. Bearing in mind it's essentially software we're talking about, and there might be bugs, I would say there's a risk there.
posted by humblepigeon at 9:22 AM on June 28, 2007
There is a lot to be said for simplicity.
Landlines work via electrical currents, which are supplied via the phone line (hence your phone doesn't need mains power). Take too much power with a dodgy home-made phone and you'll blow a fuse at the switch. This could affect service for those near to you. Alternatively, you could create some slight fault that creates line noise for everybody else.
As for open source phones, I'm only quoting what a few industry people have said when responding to Linux phones in the past. I've no idea if it's possible to kill the network. I guess it depends on how fragile the network is. Bearing in mind it's essentially software we're talking about, and there might be bugs, I would say there's a risk there.
posted by humblepigeon at 9:22 AM on June 28, 2007
This is an iPhone killer the same way an iRiver is an iPod killer, right?
It's sadder: this is an iPhone killer the same way a Neurosis was an iPod killer.
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 9:30 AM on June 28, 2007
It's sadder: this is an iPhone killer the same way a Neuros
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 9:30 AM on June 28, 2007
the iphone will be the iphone killer. (it will fail miserably)
posted by quarter waters and a bag of chips at 10:07 AM on June 28
This is an absurd thing to say. I think a lot of people are wrongly, very wrongly, assuming this is a "geeks only" product, and the geeks are going to balk because it doesn't have widget X or gizmo Y.
Make no mistake, the iPhone is SOLIDLY a mainstream device. People who would have never even accepted a free smartphone will line up to pay for the iPhone.
It breaks down like this: the iPhone is attractive to kids, students, parents, early adopters, apple devotees, iPod addicts, hipsters, status conscious yuppies, image based professionals, technological dabblers, bandwagon hoppers, and the gadget obsessed.
The iPhone is not attractive to: devoted mobile-phone-as-unlimited-platform evangelists, cheapskates.
This should be pretty clear by now.
The only "failure" regarding the iPhone was Verizon. They could conceivably loose 1 million subscribers in the next 72 hours. Seriously, whomever it was at Verizon that decided not to pursue the iPhone should loose their job, even if it was the CEO.
Jobs considers success selling 10 million iPhones by the end of NEXT year. I've read reports they may sell as many as 3 million in the next 4 weeks, depending on production.
Failure? Not likely. It's already succeeded.
My only worry is of AT&T's network buckling under the addition of so many data-heavy users in such a small period of time.
I'd love to see a graph showing purchases at iTunes for the last month and then this weekend.
[not an apple fanboi, I've used and loved my Treo 700w since the month it came out, but buying (hopefully) my wife an iPhone tomorrow, which will be our household's first Apple product.]
posted by Ynoxas at 9:33 AM on June 28, 2007 [2 favorites]
posted by quarter waters and a bag of chips at 10:07 AM on June 28
This is an absurd thing to say. I think a lot of people are wrongly, very wrongly, assuming this is a "geeks only" product, and the geeks are going to balk because it doesn't have widget X or gizmo Y.
Make no mistake, the iPhone is SOLIDLY a mainstream device. People who would have never even accepted a free smartphone will line up to pay for the iPhone.
It breaks down like this: the iPhone is attractive to kids, students, parents, early adopters, apple devotees, iPod addicts, hipsters, status conscious yuppies, image based professionals, technological dabblers, bandwagon hoppers, and the gadget obsessed.
The iPhone is not attractive to: devoted mobile-phone-as-unlimited-platform evangelists, cheapskates.
This should be pretty clear by now.
The only "failure" regarding the iPhone was Verizon. They could conceivably loose 1 million subscribers in the next 72 hours. Seriously, whomever it was at Verizon that decided not to pursue the iPhone should loose their job, even if it was the CEO.
Jobs considers success selling 10 million iPhones by the end of NEXT year. I've read reports they may sell as many as 3 million in the next 4 weeks, depending on production.
Failure? Not likely. It's already succeeded.
My only worry is of AT&T's network buckling under the addition of so many data-heavy users in such a small period of time.
I'd love to see a graph showing purchases at iTunes for the last month and then this weekend.
[not an apple fanboi, I've used and loved my Treo 700w since the month it came out, but buying (hopefully) my wife an iPhone tomorrow, which will be our household's first Apple product.]
posted by Ynoxas at 9:33 AM on June 28, 2007 [2 favorites]
Between iPhone sales and Leopard upgrades/sales (and who knows what else introduced between now and Christmas) this looks like a good time to buy Apple stock.
I had concerns about the touchscreen (ect) but after reading the Wall Street Journal review (which was HUGE) I know that won't be a concern. The battery life is amazing. There is always a market at the TOP END and iPhone will have it.
The only downside is using the EDGE network (and alternately Wi-Fi) as opposed to the higherspeed cell phone data network available, but I understand why Apple did this (to seel it to the WORLD, not just U.S.) Shareholders win again.
That being said, I would wait until a Generation 2 product before buying. (Those craving the attention having one will bring NOW can safely ignore that advise - and there is no shortage of them.)
posted by spock at 9:58 AM on June 28, 2007
I had concerns about the touchscreen (ect) but after reading the Wall Street Journal review (which was HUGE) I know that won't be a concern. The battery life is amazing. There is always a market at the TOP END and iPhone will have it.
The only downside is using the EDGE network (and alternately Wi-Fi) as opposed to the higherspeed cell phone data network available, but I understand why Apple did this (to seel it to the WORLD, not just U.S.) Shareholders win again.
That being said, I would wait until a Generation 2 product before buying. (Those craving the attention having one will bring NOW can safely ignore that advise - and there is no shortage of them.)
posted by spock at 9:58 AM on June 28, 2007
Make no mistake, the iPhone is SOLIDLY a mainstream device. People who would have never even accepted a free smartphone will line up to pay for the iPhone
I would like to back this up with the following anecdote.
I spent some of Tuseday afternoon talking with some friends of mine about the amusing number of iPhone-related articles flooding tech. blogs, the wire services, etc.
About ten minutes after the conversation, I received the following email from my mother, which I will now quote verbatim:
"I am thinking seriously about getting an Iphone. What is your opinion of them?"
Two things about this:
1) My mom ignoring Apple's idiosyncratic capitalization makes me LOL.
2) To be fair to my Mom, her current phone is a complete piece of shit. I currently have a phone that is very basic, but as basic phones go is a good one. Her phone isn't even good at being a basic cell phone, and the money isn't an issue for her.
But, yeah. This thing is not in geeks-only territory at all.
posted by sparkletone at 10:14 AM on June 28, 2007
I would like to back this up with the following anecdote.
I spent some of Tuseday afternoon talking with some friends of mine about the amusing number of iPhone-related articles flooding tech. blogs, the wire services, etc.
About ten minutes after the conversation, I received the following email from my mother, which I will now quote verbatim:
"I am thinking seriously about getting an Iphone. What is your opinion of them?"
Two things about this:
1) My mom ignoring Apple's idiosyncratic capitalization makes me LOL.
2) To be fair to my Mom, her current phone is a complete piece of shit. I currently have a phone that is very basic, but as basic phones go is a good one. Her phone isn't even good at being a basic cell phone, and the money isn't an issue for her.
But, yeah. This thing is not in geeks-only territory at all.
posted by sparkletone at 10:14 AM on June 28, 2007
David pogue's video iPhone review. He likes the device, hates ATT. I'm in the same boat, so I'm hanging back, but this thing will sell well. There's already people camping out in line in NYC, and Ballmer has probably commenced to throwing chairs in Redmond.
posted by Devils Rancher at 10:19 AM on June 28, 2007
posted by Devils Rancher at 10:19 AM on June 28, 2007
"Between iPhone sales and Leopard upgrades/sales (and who knows what else introduced between now and Christmas) this looks like a good time to buy Apple stock."
No, the good time was a few years ago, when the stock was down around $20.
If things keep going the way they have been, my gains on my Apple stock will soon offset every penny I've ever paid for Apple stuff. Now that there's a bargain!
*grins beamingly, but as humbly as possible*
posted by zoogleplex at 10:33 AM on June 28, 2007
No, the good time was a few years ago, when the stock was down around $20.
If things keep going the way they have been, my gains on my Apple stock will soon offset every penny I've ever paid for Apple stuff. Now that there's a bargain!
*grins beamingly, but as humbly as possible*
posted by zoogleplex at 10:33 AM on June 28, 2007
humblepigeon: Also, telecoms companies are NOT keen to let open hardware onto their networks. The chance for one badly-hacked handset to bring down the entire local network is high.
Sparkfun has some GSM modules for sale - they offer a serial interface & take Hayes modems commands, if I remember correctly.
I know this because I know these guys. (It's not far along, but I think it's nifty anyway.)
posted by Pronoiac at 11:18 AM on June 28, 2007
Sparkfun has some GSM modules for sale - they offer a serial interface & take Hayes modems commands, if I remember correctly.
I know this because I know these guys. (It's not far along, but I think it's nifty anyway.)
posted by Pronoiac at 11:18 AM on June 28, 2007
I don't get the complaints about the EDGE network. I have a PPC-6700 on Verizon's supposedly-superior network, and websites just CRAWL. We're talking 3 minutes to load CNN.com, not to mention the fact that the page looks like shit and is practically unusable. Even if CNN.com takes 5 minutes to load on the iPhone, at least the page will be USABLE.
Speaking of usability, you know how long it takes me to find a phone number or directions for a restaurant on my PPC? About 5-6 minutes. How long will it take on the iPhone? From the looks of it, about 30 seconds. The iPhone will succeed because IT JUST WORKS.
The PPC-6700 gave me the worse cast of buyers remorse I've ever had. The sad thing is that at the time, based on my research, it appeared to really be the best option out there for my needs. Too bad I locked myself into a 2-year contract with Verizon the week before the iPhone was announced. :(
posted by afx114 at 11:37 AM on June 28, 2007
Speaking of usability, you know how long it takes me to find a phone number or directions for a restaurant on my PPC? About 5-6 minutes. How long will it take on the iPhone? From the looks of it, about 30 seconds. The iPhone will succeed because IT JUST WORKS.
The PPC-6700 gave me the worse cast of buyers remorse I've ever had. The sad thing is that at the time, based on my research, it appeared to really be the best option out there for my needs. Too bad I locked myself into a 2-year contract with Verizon the week before the iPhone was announced. :(
posted by afx114 at 11:37 AM on June 28, 2007
Just switched carriers to get me an iPhone. I feel like I'm waiting in line outside the cave where the dude with the really long beard figured out how to tie sharp rocks to long sticks and he's sellin' em to the scruffy masses.
posted by Baby_Balrog at 12:03 PM on June 28, 2007
posted by Baby_Balrog at 12:03 PM on June 28, 2007
If you don't need it to be a phone, the Nokia N800 is an open source tablet pc with awesome graphical display, touch screen, wi-fi (with amazing range), media player, 2 separate flash slots (up to 8Gb, just like an iPhone) and built in video. It can be used as a Skype phone over wifi. And it costs $350. There is a large development community working on apps for it.
posted by spitbull at 12:09 PM on June 28, 2007
posted by spitbull at 12:09 PM on June 28, 2007
The Nokia Internet Tablets are too slow to even run the bundled apps, much less some random app you cross-compile for it. They're been dumping the previous model for $130 new, and they're even less on eBay, so at least they have CHEAP going for them.
But they don't place or receive cellular phone calls, which kills it for me. I rarely carry my old 3G iPod I bought 4 years ago, and I rarely carried my Nokia phone (a second gen N-Gage, stop laughing it was free) until I lost it a few days ago in an airport.
I'm buying a fucking iPhone. I'll actually carry it with me everywhere. I will hack it the first day, barring their use of signed binaries. Unless they do that, there will be third-party iPhone apps, and fast. If they do it's just a matter of time before the key is recovered. People are creative fuckers.
posted by blasdelf at 1:05 PM on June 28, 2007
But they don't place or receive cellular phone calls, which kills it for me. I rarely carry my old 3G iPod I bought 4 years ago, and I rarely carried my Nokia phone (a second gen N-Gage, stop laughing it was free) until I lost it a few days ago in an airport.
I'm buying a fucking iPhone. I'll actually carry it with me everywhere. I will hack it the first day, barring their use of signed binaries. Unless they do that, there will be third-party iPhone apps, and fast. If they do it's just a matter of time before the key is recovered. People are creative fuckers.
posted by blasdelf at 1:05 PM on June 28, 2007
I'm looking forward to the meticulous attention paid towards usability and interface design that is often found with open source, linux-based products.
posted by mecran01 at 1:22 PM on June 28, 2007 [6 favorites]
posted by mecran01 at 1:22 PM on June 28, 2007 [6 favorites]
I don't see anything here that will kill and iPhony device. The iPhone will live and die by it's network plan. If the plan is expensive or slow, it will be stillborn. If the plan is cheap and fast, third-part apps will proliferate, especially if google gears/yahoo tubes/apple iNtestines work on it.
Blackberries and their ilk are popular now because network connections are expensive. BB genius was to minimize network time for email.
This won't kill the iPhone, AT&T will, if anybody does.
posted by bonehead at 1:24 PM on June 28, 2007
Blackberries and their ilk are popular now because network connections are expensive. BB genius was to minimize network time for email.
This won't kill the iPhone, AT&T will, if anybody does.
posted by bonehead at 1:24 PM on June 28, 2007
Oh, and if you don't need it to be a phone OR a computer you might consider the Audi Q7.
posted by spock at 1:36 PM on June 28, 2007 [1 favorite]
posted by spock at 1:36 PM on June 28, 2007 [1 favorite]
iPhone sounds nice but Nokia's phones will always win.
Asian market phones are all touch screen & stylus now. So the big boys will just copy Apple's good ideas for their asian market phones. Apple can't risk patent armageddon with any old timers.
But Nokia & co might not bring their touchscreen & stylus phones to the EU & US, even after copying all Apple's ideas. They've still got tons of research saying westerners like buttons.
posted by jeffburdges at 1:48 PM on June 28, 2007
Asian market phones are all touch screen & stylus now. So the big boys will just copy Apple's good ideas for their asian market phones. Apple can't risk patent armageddon with any old timers.
But Nokia & co might not bring their touchscreen & stylus phones to the EU & US, even after copying all Apple's ideas. They've still got tons of research saying westerners like buttons.
posted by jeffburdges at 1:48 PM on June 28, 2007
Jesus! The linked device is ass, the pages describing it are ass, and the claims that the iPhone is gonna bomb are without exception very obviously ass!!
I'm holding out for a cell phone that can carry a human embryo to term. Because I AM ENGINEER
posted by waxbanks at 1:54 PM on June 28, 2007
I'm holding out for a cell phone that can carry a human embryo to term. Because I AM ENGINEER
posted by waxbanks at 1:54 PM on June 28, 2007
Granted, it's a nicely shaped lump of plastic. . .
You mean plastic and optical quality glass?
posted by spock at 1:59 PM on June 28, 2007
You mean plastic and optical quality glass?
posted by spock at 1:59 PM on June 28, 2007
Steve Jobs mentioned in an apple employee keynote thing that they went with Edge because current 3G chip sets are battery hogs.
posted by chunking express at 2:09 PM on June 28, 2007
posted by chunking express at 2:09 PM on June 28, 2007
Gawd ... who ever thought so boring an object as a telephone could incite so much comment.
Sign of the times I guess.
posted by Twang at 2:41 PM on June 28, 2007
Sign of the times I guess.
posted by Twang at 2:41 PM on June 28, 2007
So the big boys will just copy Apple's good ideas for their asian market phones.
Why is Apple credited for ideas others have already had? Sure, the NeoNode in 2004 was light on features in comparison, but this is not unexpected when one company is small and the other large, but the similarities are obvious. Same with the latest one as well, and the first model, as will be this one, were and are available in Europe, or, available to westerners, if that means something.
posted by juiceCake at 3:19 PM on June 28, 2007
Why is Apple credited for ideas others have already had? Sure, the NeoNode in 2004 was light on features in comparison, but this is not unexpected when one company is small and the other large, but the similarities are obvious. Same with the latest one as well, and the first model, as will be this one, were and are available in Europe, or, available to westerners, if that means something.
posted by juiceCake at 3:19 PM on June 28, 2007
Christ, the iPhone has got to win the prize for most over-hyped piece of electronics since the Archos ("you'll never need your VCR again!").
It looks like a handheld with a good user interface. Apple fans shouldn't be patting themselves too hard on the back with the multi-touch, by the way. For some applications, multi-touch is definitely the way to go, but a phone? Great. Now not only do I have to look at the screen to use it (-1 points for usability) but now I have to use both hands? -100 points and a swift kick to the ass.
And as to the "this : iPhone :: iRiver : iPod" folks out there, I say, "Yeah, and your point is?" I have an iRiver h320 running Rockbox. The reason it's better than the iPod isn't only because there are more features, but because it's open-source, there will always be new features. With closed-source you have to pray that the manufacturer is kind enough to update their firmware; more than likely they'll already be on the "next" version of your toy and will kindly suggest you buy a new player instead of whining about it.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 8:22 PM on June 28, 2007
It looks like a handheld with a good user interface. Apple fans shouldn't be patting themselves too hard on the back with the multi-touch, by the way. For some applications, multi-touch is definitely the way to go, but a phone? Great. Now not only do I have to look at the screen to use it (-1 points for usability) but now I have to use both hands? -100 points and a swift kick to the ass.
And as to the "this : iPhone :: iRiver : iPod" folks out there, I say, "Yeah, and your point is?" I have an iRiver h320 running Rockbox. The reason it's better than the iPod isn't only because there are more features, but because it's open-source, there will always be new features. With closed-source you have to pray that the manufacturer is kind enough to update their firmware; more than likely they'll already be on the "next" version of your toy and will kindly suggest you buy a new player instead of whining about it.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 8:22 PM on June 28, 2007
bshort, Cingular..err AT&T no longer uses the same sites as T-Mobile in NYC or in California. They use the old AT&T network. Whether that's better or not is something you'd have to determine yourself.
Similarly to the experience of others, I've had phones that will do everything the iPhone does for years. Personally, I prefer the non touch-screen Nokia E61 at the moment, but that's just because it can almost entirely replace my laptop for most of what I do.
posted by wierdo at 10:30 PM on June 28, 2007
Similarly to the experience of others, I've had phones that will do everything the iPhone does for years. Personally, I prefer the non touch-screen Nokia E61 at the moment, but that's just because it can almost entirely replace my laptop for most of what I do.
posted by wierdo at 10:30 PM on June 28, 2007
You'll note that back in the days of wired phonelines, the phone companies didn't encourage people to build their own telephones, for very much the same reason.
First of all, AT&T didn't want people to build their own phones because they were an illegal monopoly who made money by renting people handsets (no one was even allowed to own a phone.
Second of all, once they were broken up, anyone could attach whatever they wanted to the phone network, which is why modems and the Internet itself became popular.
Landlines work via electrical currents, which are supplied via the phone line (hence your phone doesn't need mains power). Take too much power with a dodgy home-made phone and you'll blow a fuse at the switch.
Again, anyone could attach whatever device they wanted to the phone system. There were hundreds of companies that made modems, fax machines, etcetera, and no one stopped them (once AT&T's stranglehold was broken) There was never any chaos, or anything like.
As far as "the network" look, you can attach whatever you want to the internet and it doesn't break. You can attach whatever you want to a WiFi thing and it doesn't break, etc. You seriously have no idea what you're talking about, and are just making excuses for monopolistic and anticompetitive behavior by greedy telcos (is there any other kind?)
It breaks down like this: the iPhone is attractive to kids, students, parents, early adopters, apple devotees, iPod addicts, hipsters, status conscious yuppies, image based professionals, technological dabblers, bandwagon hoppers, and the gadget obsessed.
Attractive, but not $600 attractive.
I'm buying a fucking iPhone. I'll actually carry it with me everywhere. I will hack it the first day, barring their use of signed binaries. Unless they do that, there will be third-party iPhone apps
Well, they are going to do that. Do you have any information that says otherwise?
posted by delmoi at 11:04 PM on June 28, 2007
This is an iPhone killer the same way an iRiver is an iPod killer, right?
iRiver's devices kick the living shit out of iPods, you know.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 12:17 AM on June 29, 2007
iRiver's devices kick the living shit out of iPods, you know.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 12:17 AM on June 29, 2007
now I have to use both hands?
This is completely true: Apple's Steve Jobs will personally sucker punch you in the crotch, if he so much as catches you using the iPhone with one hand, let alone one finger.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 2:42 AM on June 29, 2007
This is completely true: Apple's Steve Jobs will personally sucker punch you in the crotch, if he so much as catches you using the iPhone with one hand, let alone one finger.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 2:42 AM on June 29, 2007
The Nokia Internet Tablets are too slow to even run the bundled apps,
Not the N800. "Slow" is the last word I'd use. And good luck hacking that iPhone.
posted by spitbull at 3:45 AM on June 29, 2007
Not the N800. "Slow" is the last word I'd use. And good luck hacking that iPhone.
posted by spitbull at 3:45 AM on June 29, 2007
Oh, and now that t-mobile is offering home wi-fi plus connection anywhere to its wifi network, and free calls over the wifi network, the Nokia and its wi-fi ilk look even better. I can skype anywhere. For free.
posted by spitbull at 3:46 AM on June 29, 2007
posted by spitbull at 3:46 AM on June 29, 2007
And I'll make the rest of the case: 800 x 480 brilliant touch screen, praised unanimously by all reviewers as the best display in any mobile device; runs opera and flash; skype; mplayer for media; rhapsody; can read and edit MS Office docs and PDFS; FM radio; really good onboard speakers for the size; connect over wifi (with what every reviewer says is unbelievable range) or over bluetooth paired with a cellphone; infinitely hackable, and large open source development community, can be browsed (and soon synched) over USB; touch-sensitive on-screen keyboard (that also wins raves) but also stylus or bluetooth keyboard input; fits in a shirt pocket; extremely long battery life, and you can change the battery yourself for a standard Nokia cell phone battery or carry a spare for long trips for $39.
If I need to make a regular call, my cell phone weighs 3 ounces.
I'll wait for Rev B of the iPhone, and something besides AT&T as a provider, on principle. I had the worst customer service experience of my life with (the "old) AT&T cellular division. Never will they see another dollar from me.
posted by spitbull at 4:08 AM on June 29, 2007
If I need to make a regular call, my cell phone weighs 3 ounces.
I'll wait for Rev B of the iPhone, and something besides AT&T as a provider, on principle. I had the worst customer service experience of my life with (the "old) AT&T cellular division. Never will they see another dollar from me.
posted by spitbull at 4:08 AM on June 29, 2007
The only thing you need to kill the iPhone is a hammer.
posted by deusdiabolus at 5:51 AM on June 29, 2007
posted by deusdiabolus at 5:51 AM on June 29, 2007
stavrosthewonderchicken, that might be the case -- they certainly are crazy ass devices -- but did they "kill off" the iPod?
posted by chunking express at 6:03 AM on June 29, 2007
posted by chunking express at 6:03 AM on June 29, 2007
No, no, not at all. Just saying.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 6:55 AM on June 29, 2007
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 6:55 AM on June 29, 2007
and the best part is you are not limited to using the NSA AT&T internet hubs sporting massive NSA data-mining and recording machinery to let the NSA illegally record all your phone calls, copy all your contacts, keep records of all your Web and IM activity, watch you through the camera, listen in on your household through the mic, and probably put you in a terrorist no-fly database for listening to Cynthia McKinney singing that stupid Pink song.
posted by caddis at 1:10 PM on June 29, 2007
posted by caddis at 1:10 PM on June 29, 2007
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posted by DU at 7:39 AM on June 28, 2007