Splendid chap, both of them

October 22, 2007 7:12 PM

The Two Doctors: "David Tennant's Tenth Doctor is set to meet Peter Davison's Fifth Doctor in a special scene commissioned for BBC One's Children in Need."

This brief segment, to be aired on November 16 as part of a charity special, will link last season's cliffhanger ending and this year's Christmas special.

posted by Artifice_Eternity (64 comments total)

...and, it is being written by the always wonderful Stephen Moffatt. This should be a nice little 15 minute treat.
posted by tgrundke at 7:18 PM on October 22, 2007

"I can feel the hand of history on my shoulder, even if I can't do the buttons up!"

Peter's definitely looking a bit plumper these days, but he's got nothing on Colin Baker, who is now the size of a Sontaran.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 7:20 PM on October 22, 2007 [2 favorites]

Yes, poor Colin. He definitely has....ummm.....aged.
posted by tgrundke at 7:22 PM on October 22, 2007

oooh....

I like Davison's Doctor.

Though I still think Tennant should meet the eighth. Great character, only seen in a terrible movie, with years of offscreen time still available to play with as they wish.
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 7:46 PM on October 22, 2007

I just nerded in my pants.
posted by spec80 at 7:47 PM on October 22, 2007 [1 favorite]

This brief segment... will link last season's cliffhanger ending and this year's Christmas special.

Pure speculation.
posted by crossoverman at 7:53 PM on October 22, 2007

that doesnt make sense. the tardis hit the titanic! he didnt just leave to go hang out with celery doctor with a big gapping hole in the side of the tardis!

...unless its out of continuity/ then its ok
posted by Nick Fisher at 7:55 PM on October 22, 2007

Peri : "Doctor, why do you wear a stick of celery in your lapel?"
The Doctor : "Does it offend you?"
Peri : "No, just curious."
The Doctor : "Safety precaution. I'm allergic to certain gases in the praxis range of the spectrum."
Peri : "Well how does the celery help?"
The Doctor : "If the gas is present, the celery turns purple."
Peri : "And then what do you do?"
The Doctor : "I eat the celery. If nothing else I'm sure it's good for my teeth."
posted by Lord Chancellor at 8:02 PM on October 22, 2007

Chaser
posted by mattoxic at 8:13 PM on October 22, 2007

Maybe the 5th Doc is on board the Titanic for some reason?

Not a smart place for a time traveler to be, but perhaps he's indulging in a little disaster tourism.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 8:24 PM on October 22, 2007

...and, it is being written by the always wonderful Stephen Moffatt.

Excellent. "The Girl in the Fireplace" and "Blink" are my two favorite episodes.
posted by homunculus at 8:26 PM on October 22, 2007

Awww...Peter Davidson was always my favorite doctor.

Too bad this will always be overshadowed by his other, more-famous role in the BBC Hitchhiker's miniseries.
posted by lester the unlikely at 8:28 PM on October 22, 2007 [1 favorite]

"...and, it is being written by the always wonderful Stephen Moffatt."

Thanks, when I read the headline through my RSS reader, I held my breath as I clicked, hoping against hope for this exact news.
posted by Eideteker at 8:34 PM on October 22, 2007 [1 favorite]

Excellent. "The Girl in the Fireplace" and "Blink" are my two favorite episodes

Don't forget "The Empty Child," which was one of the few genuinely creepy episodes of the new series.
posted by Rangeboy at 8:35 PM on October 22, 2007

Blink was a good episode, quite creepy. But the ending was a let down.

The endings are quite often disappointing these days.

There is the big setup, the aliens run amok, then the doctor performs some fairly simple operation, accomplished with stomach churning cheeriness that restores the tranquility of that English village.
posted by mattoxic at 8:55 PM on October 22, 2007

I rather liked the ending of Blink. And Girl in the Fireplace.

Not that iI think Moffat is perfect. Good as Empty Child/Doctor Dances are, the "everybody lives" bit was a bit groanworthy, IMO.
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 9:55 PM on October 22, 2007

Ah, come on, it was great! Despite everything, there was no body count! When you're the Doctor, everyone living through a full episode deserves a little mention.
posted by Lord Chancellor at 10:16 PM on October 22, 2007 [1 favorite]

Too bad this will always be overshadowed by his other, more-famous role in the BBC Hitchhiker's miniseries.

Among the wider audience, I believe Davison is best known for his role as Tristan in All Creatures Great and Small.

There. I've participated in a Dr Who discussion. My internet checklist is complete.
posted by pracowity at 11:18 PM on October 22, 2007 [1 favorite]

What kind of endings do you expect when your main character travels around in a deus ex machina?
posted by fleacircus at 11:22 PM on October 22, 2007

My concern is with the idea that the endings are "disappointing these days" - as if Doctor Who Classic always had superb endings.
posted by crossoverman at 11:32 PM on October 22, 2007

I kind of prefered New Who when it seemed like more of a reboot without continuity with the old one.

(also before it sucked. Doctor Space Jesus saving the world with glowing lights... ugh)
posted by Artw at 11:34 PM on October 22, 2007 [1 favorite]

Blinks ending was fucking awesome: Here's a bunch of random statues ...they could be alive kiddies, LIVE IN FEAR!

Here's hoping some young minds are thoroughly scarred.
posted by Artw at 11:36 PM on October 22, 2007 [1 favorite]

I thought Blink was awesome, ending and all (and much better than Moffatt's children's story written version).

I don't find the endings terrible, certainly not by comparison with the all-time champion of terrible endings, Star Trek: Voyager. The storylines with the 45-minute format are nothing like the storylines for the 100- or 150-minute formats. They have to be resolved more quickly and more viscerally than cerebrally at times. All in all I think they've done well with the format.

Artw: It was never a reboot. Eccleston was always the Ninth Doctor, Tennant the Tenth, and the aspects of the Time War have been a crafty technique to gradually reintroduce the enormous weight of continuity inherent in the series in manageable chunks. This offers the writers some obvious freedoms.

Davison, I would say, is about my fourth favorite Doctor (after Baker, Tennant, and Pertwee, and maybe Eccleston's slightly mad Doctor right after him). It will be fantastic to see him again, even if it's brief and somewhat violates continuity (unless he's from an alternate timeline or whatnot). I expect that his showing up on the Big T has a great deal to do with why the Little T collided with it.

mattoxic: You think the ending of "Family of Blood" fits that view? What about "The Lazarus Experiment"? (I'll grant you "Last of the Time Lords", though.)
posted by dhartung at 12:26 AM on October 23, 2007

dhartung, Family of Blood was actually the episode I was thinking of when I posted.

The Doctor is in such mortal fear of these people that he actually rescinds his time-lordship in order to hide.

The episode winds up with the doctor boarding their ship as some sort of eccentric clutz, TOTALLY disarming their suspicions, presses an array of buttons that seem to be part of the worse user interface invented, then blows the ship up- begging the question... why didn't he just to that?

The The Lazarus Experiment was fun, mainly because it starred Mark Gatiss of League of Gentlemen fame. And I am partial to a spot of Crème brûlée.
posted by mattoxic at 4:57 AM on October 23, 2007

John Kenneth Fisher - The eighth Doctor is Christopher Eccleston, Paul McGann will never be a Doctor and FOX can go die in a fire for making that piece of shit.

That said, multiple Doctor episodes are always awesome!
posted by MrBobaFett at 4:59 AM on October 23, 2007

dhartung, are you 33-36 years old? My pet WHO theory is that your favourite Doctor is the one playing the part when you are 8-10 or thereabouts.
posted by alasdair at 5:15 AM on October 23, 2007

Your theory fits me perfectly.
posted by vbfg at 5:41 AM on October 23, 2007

...apart from the opening titles of the Baker episodes that is. My sister once threatened to throw me down that kaleidoscope effect, and thereafter the football results and Dr Who sandwiched a brief moment of terror.
posted by vbfg at 5:42 AM on October 23, 2007

Oh, MrBobaFett, that is so hilariously wrong. Paul McGann is part of New Who canon now... and whatever you think of the 1996 Fox movie, the 8th Doctor is a wonderful creation.
posted by crossoverman at 5:46 AM on October 23, 2007

Paul McGann is not canon, if he was then the Doctor would be half human, which he's not. Anyone who says otherwise, BBC producers included can fuck off.
posted by MrBobaFett at 6:17 AM on October 23, 2007

Blink was very well done. How was it a cliffhanger ending though, clearly he somehow ran into the Titanic.
posted by drezdn at 6:43 AM on October 23, 2007

But where does Captain Jack come in?
posted by GuyZero at 6:44 AM on October 23, 2007

Damn, I suppose I'll have to watch the always terrible Children in Need telephone then.

Now if they were to bring back Peri as well it would be worth it...

I'm slowly getting more and more disappointed by New Who... the Moffat episodes are pretty great but the dire stuff like the Jesus Who end of season is just about unwatchable. And as bloody Scooby Doo sorry Torchwood, dear oh dear. Weirdly I'm managed to catch a couple of episodes of the Sarah Jane spin-off and it was pretty good for a kids show.
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 6:49 AM on October 23, 2007

IIRC Captain Jack can only meet up with him two more times.
posted by drezdn at 6:49 AM on October 23, 2007

Paul McGann is canon. That line, MrBobaFett, however, seems not to be. And rightly so. Let's just assume he was kidding. Or speaking metaphorically. Or whatever fanwank we need to do to remove that stupid-ass line, but the movie, and doctor #8, are indeed canon.

And I'm glad. As i said, the movie? terrible. absolutely terrible. But the Doctor himself? I quite like #8. Which is why I keep hoping they do a "two doctors" with him. They could bring him in and make up whatever backstory they wanted. They could give him whatever companions were appropriate for that story. The fact that he looks older would be no problem, as we have no idea how long his time was. (Unlike Davison, who looks notably olde.r. They could use characters and broad strokes from the eigtht doctor novels... or not if they prefer. And considering McGann's appearance in audio books, etc. as the character, I have to assume he'd be game.

It seems a great way to give a great doctor some screentime in way that enhances the character and tells us things we didn't know, rather than the glorified "look, kids! it's xxxx" that the multi-doc eps usually are. And, you know, to see this great character in something that doesn't suck as hard as the movie did.

I'm very excited to see #5 and #10 team up, even if briefly. "Celery Doctor," as my brother referred to him, is one of my favorite Doctors. But I can't help but be disappointed by this, as it makes a #8 appearance any time soon seem so much less likely.
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 6:51 AM on October 23, 2007

I'm slowly getting more and more disappointed by New Who... the Moffat episodes are pretty great but the dire stuff like the Jesus Who end of season is just about unwatchable.

Oh, I thought season 29 / season 3 was quite disappointing, with a few notable exceptions. Human Nature/Family of Blood, Blink, and I guess Utopia, though really just for Sir Derek Jacobi's parts, were all excellent.

Still, with season 27/1 and particularly 28/2 as good as they were, I'll allow a slump without getting too worried. This next season will hopefully show some real improvement over the last though - otherwise, maybe the GOOD seasons were the flukes...
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 6:57 AM on October 23, 2007

This next season will hopefully show some real improvement over the last though - otherwise, maybe the GOOD seasons were the flukes...

I fear the latter. Russel T. Davies has said he wants the show to be even bigger, which means he'll almost certainly pen more horrible episodes, the Christmas Special being one of them.
posted by juiceCake at 7:10 AM on October 23, 2007

John Kenneth Fisher - The nice thing about fiction is we can throw out the crap we don't have to keep it. So the movie is out, besides it was made by FOX not BBC so that's another reason to throw it out. There can be a Doctor between Sylvester McCoy and Christopher Eccleston, it just can't be Paul, because that would just confuse things. People might mistake his appearance in the movie as part of the Who universe.

Side note on the new series, would they please stop making the Doctor even semi-romantically interested in all the companions.
posted by MrBobaFett at 8:17 AM on October 23, 2007

John Kenneth Fisher - The nice thing about fiction is we can throw out the crap we don't have to keep it. So the movie is out, besides it was made by FOX not BBC so that's another reason to throw it out. There can be a Doctor between Sylvester McCoy and Christopher Eccleston, it just can't be Paul, because that would just confuse things. People might mistake his appearance in the movie as part of the Who universe.

Well... we all have our own views that may or may not match canon views. And that's fine. but as long as the people in charge consider it canon, I'd say it IS canon. It may not be YOUR canon, if you catch my tortured phrasing, and by all means, I don't begrudge you your personal choice to ignore it. I've done that myself with certain things. But I think it's important to note that while YOU don't accept it, the BBC powers-that-be have indeed indicated it is part of the history of their character. And they have also indicated they choose to ignore lines such as "half-human". And they get to declare "canon," though we have the right to choose our "own Same as if you decided to accept, say, Dimensions in Time as canon, well.. go right ahead if it improves your enjoyment of the show. But that doesn't mean anyone else needs to, you know?

That may be what you're saying and we're just crosstalking a bit, so, you know, sorry if so.

Side note on the new series, would they please stop making the Doctor even semi-romantically interested in all the companions.

It's really just Rose that he seems to have fallen for. Certainly not Martha, though she likes him.
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 9:02 AM on October 23, 2007

The Doctor is in such mortal fear of these people that he actually rescinds his time-lordship in order to hide.

... then blows the ship up- begging the question... why didn't he just to that?

You weren't paying very close attention to the voiceover from "Son of Mine" near the end of the episode. See the plot summary here.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 9:02 AM on October 23, 2007

Juice Cake. Oh dear. The words "Russel T. Davis" and "Big" do not go well together in my mind.
posted by Artw at 9:03 AM on October 23, 2007

besides it was made by FOX not BBC

Fox AND the BBC, both BBCTV and BBC Worldwide. And Universal, too, for some reason.
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 9:04 AM on October 23, 2007

Artw: It was never a reboot.

But one could just pretend it was. And it worked better that way, and one could happily enjoy it without any silly nerd questions or the risk that a bit of spaffing off over continuity would be used instead of any real substance.
posted by Artw at 9:04 AM on October 23, 2007

Hi again, also note that the new show has already shown that McGann is a past incarnation.
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 9:11 AM on October 23, 2007

That kind of shit, basically.
posted by Artw at 10:05 AM on October 23, 2007

So far it has only been Rose he's fallen for, but that doesn't stop me from worrying that the writers are gonna screw it up and put in romantic interests to draw in viewers who only watch for that kind of crap.
posted by MrBobaFett at 10:10 AM on October 23, 2007

Artw, a reboot would be lame, it always is. If you want to write a whole new series write a whole new series, don't hobble an existing one.
posted by MrBobaFett at 10:12 AM on October 23, 2007

Worked pretty well for BSG and for the Marvel Ultimate universe. For most of New Who you can see it as an ultimate style reboot and it works pretty well there as well.
posted by Artw at 10:25 AM on October 23, 2007

mattoxic: I didn't think that his vengeful Doctor at the end of FoB was very namby-pamby. And disabling baddies' spaceships by "randomly" pushing buttons, having literally disarmed them by charm, is just the sort of thing he's always done.

alasdair: I'm 43, and yes, Tom was my first Doctor. Jelly baby?

MrBobaFett: To Martha's chagrin (and Jack's as well), he isn't romantically interested. Personally, I feel that Davies is more realistically treating the companions' inner lives. To many of them, especially the Earth-bound humans, the Doctor is larger than life and his charisma will naturally impel some of them to have something like a student's crush on a teacher. At the same time, his interest in companions is being more explicitly fleshed out in terms of his own grief and loneliness, with something of the same teacher-like motivations. As well, the choice to spend time traveling with the Doctor is going to have impact on the Companions' real lives, both at the time and throughout their lives.

Anyway, if it's romance that bothers you, I don't think that Donna and the Doctor are going to have much of one.

Artw: See, the way they handle it is so that for those to whom it matters, they've preserved continuity and left easter eggs to discover, but for people like you, it just goes right on past. It doesn't affect the story at all whether or not you know.

John Kenneth Fisher: My only question is where in the canon The Curse of Fatal Death is.
posted by dhartung at 10:53 AM on October 23, 2007 [1 favorite]

Artw, Marvel didn't reboot it's a Multiverse Earth 616 is still Earth 616, etc. Story lines are better in certain Marvel universes and crap in others.
As for BSG, um.. the new BSG is a good show, great maybe even.. it's just not really BSG. Why the hell are Cylons human looking now? Cylons are big scary looking robots built by a reptilian race. Just stealing the names and writing a whole new story is kinda lame. Why didn't they just write their damn totally new story and let it stand on it's own, instead of riding on the back of another successful sci-fi series.
Again I like the new BSG, it's just not really Battle Star Galactica.
posted by MrBobaFett at 10:56 AM on October 23, 2007

I think Curse of the Fatal Death comes just before Dr. Who visits Lauren Cooper
posted by MrBobaFett at 11:00 AM on October 23, 2007

I think Curse of the Fatal Death comes just before Dr. Who visits Lauren Cooper.

now THAT's canon.
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 11:34 AM on October 23, 2007

Why the hell are Cylons human looking now?

They were in Galactica 1980 as well.
posted by juiceCake at 11:36 AM on October 23, 2007

Did anyone mention the possibility of Bowie as evil Agatha Christie abductor?
posted by Dr. Zira at 12:41 PM on October 23, 2007

Never mind Fatal Death, Dimensions in Time brings the whole of Eastenders into canon!
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 1:34 PM on October 23, 2007

Keep filthy, no-talent David Bowie out of Dr. Who! Doesn't anybody understand? Nobody likes David Bowie! I once worked for a major TV network, and our David Bowie special was a ratings toilet item, and when we did follow-up research, we found out that he has no audience! Nobody likes him. Everybody thinks everbody else likes him. But when you actually ask people, nobody will actually come down and say "Yes, I am an enthusiastic fan of David Bowie." Five good songs in his whole 40 year career. How does that earn you a part on Dr. Who? All the Dr. Who people have to do is watch a DVD is the Jim Henson film "Labyrinth," and see his absolutely talentless performance as Jareth the Goblin King -- see how he is a charisma-negative black hole, sucking the whole movie in after himself. David Bowie's horrible karma will infect Dr. Who like some vile space germ, and destroy the greatest series (the new ones, I mean, with Eccleston and Tennant) in the history of television. Kids, write the BBC now! No David Bowie on Dr. Who! No David Bowie on Dr. Who!
posted by Faze at 6:18 PM on October 23, 2007

By the way, that Eastenders comment above is a good one.
posted by Faze at 6:20 PM on October 23, 2007

...I like David Bowie...
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 6:24 PM on October 23, 2007

...I liked him as Tesla in that movie about the magicians...
posted by homunculus at 7:52 PM on October 23, 2007

Dimensions in Time brings the whole of Eastenders into canon!

Interestingly, it would follow that Eastenders is also part of the Tommy Westphall multiverse. [discussion]
posted by dhartung at 10:46 AM on October 24, 2007

I hope that Moffatt eventually takes over as producer of the new series when Davies leaves, as has been rumored. Perhaps that's just wishful thinking from fandom. But RTD's episodes, esp. the season finales, keep getting more and more dire.

I shudder at the prospect of Catherine Tate as the main companion next season.
posted by Artifice_Eternity at 5:44 PM on October 24, 2007

Interestingly, it would follow that Eastenders is also part of the Tommy Westphall multiverse.

If Dimensions in Time was canon, but it isn't.
posted by crossoverman at 7:56 PM on October 24, 2007

crossoverman, you win the eponysterical prize for the thread, but I'm going to out-pedant you by pointing out the use of the conditional subjunctive.
posted by dhartung at 1:02 AM on October 25, 2007 [1 favorite]

Nobody will actually come down and say "Yes, I am an enthusiastic fan of David Bowie."

I know someone who went to live in Berlin solely because they're a Bowie fanboy. He did Herculian quantities of drugs and would have had sex with Iggy Pop had he tripped over him. He wouldn't say anything like "Yes, I am an enthusiastic fan of David Bowie" though so I guess technically you may be correct.
posted by vbfg at 1:28 AM on October 25, 2007