half time

November 20, 2007 11:02 AM

The Gate D tradition at Giants Stadium involves hundreds of men circled around a ramp, cheering for the scarce women to go topless - the women that refuse are booed, spit on, and pelted with plastic bottles.

“The problem is, you got to watch four or five hundred people sometimes in the one particular spiral,” Patrick Aramini, the vice president for security said. “What do we do, arrest everybody that starts chanting?”
posted by four panels (38 comments total)

Ah, Jets fans.

This doesn't happen during Giants games for whatever reason.
posted by selfnoise at 11:05 AM on November 20, 2007

No, you arrest the ones that assault. Throwing objects and spitting crosses a line.

I would think the National Football League would be all over this, unless they want to start losing ticket sales to women (and perhaps the men who which to go with said women).
posted by spock at 11:08 AM on November 20, 2007

I need an editor.
posted by spock at 11:08 AM on November 20, 2007

"What do we do, arrest everybody that starts chanting?”

Perhaps so, sexual harassment, assault... Tack a seasonal surcharge on tickets and spell out exactly what it is for. either that of face the inevitable lawsuit for failure to maintain security.
posted by edgeways at 11:10 AM on November 20, 2007

Good to see the little kids in that photo. Father-son time is important.
posted by jtron at 11:11 AM on November 20, 2007 [1 favorite]

“What do we do, arrest everybody that starts chanting?”

I dunno. Maybe the same thing cops do to peaceful protests, i.e. bust out the batons and go taser-crazy. If the police can't be expected to control unruly crowds, then they might as well quit en masse.

If nothing else, the cops could unfurl banners reading "GATE D TRADITION OVER - RESPECT ALL PATRONS." They'd only have to make a few examples out of the problem-causing dicks to put the fear of God into those who could use it most. A night in jail followed by some criminal charges has a way of shaping people up.

Alternatively, they could just hire a giant to go topless. With the men distracted by the enormous, exposed breasts of the giant, all the normal-sized women could file past safely. You might find this plan implausible, but let me put this to you: you only need to find one giant to make this work.
posted by Sticherbeast at 11:12 AM on November 20, 2007 [4 favorites]

...the women that refuse are booed, spit on, and pelted with plastic bottles.

Assuming this "Giants Stadium" is a place in the USA and in the 21st century: W. T. F.
posted by DU at 11:12 AM on November 20, 2007

"What do we do, arrest everybody that starts chanting?"

Hmm, where was that post about the 300rpm shotgun...
posted by EndsOfInvention at 11:12 AM on November 20, 2007 [1 favorite]

It's amazing watching every possible responsible authority admit to being aware of this happening and still pass the buck to someone else. This article did have bizarre moments, such as contrasting security's claim that they can't do anything because of freed of speech and then detaining a reporter for asking questions and the totally unnecessary and not relevant reference to Janet Jackson.
posted by thecjm at 11:13 AM on November 20, 2007

Simple. Have some Christian group run a full-page ad in the NYT stating that the failure of staff to deal with these issues has made Jets games to cease being "family friendly" and that they encourage Meadowlands staff to take care of this.
posted by Ironmouth at 11:15 AM on November 20, 2007

What do we do, arrest everybody that starts chanting?

No, just arrest some of them, and the rest will scatter pretty quickly. Repeat as many times as necessary until the behavior stops, and then put a few cops near that area at halftime at each game.
posted by cerebus19 at 11:16 AM on November 20, 2007 [1 favorite]

Another guard later said they were not permitted to do anything about the chants at Gate D because of free speech laws. Yet when a reporter tried to interview two security guards after halftime, he was detained in a holding room, threatened with arrest and asked to hand over his tape recorder.

Mmm, free speech.

Of course, if they actually wanted to stop it, they could arrest women who do show their breasts, that way, they would stop doing it, and the men would stop asking for it. I realize that seems unfair, but so would be tasering and tear gassing hundreds of people over some obnoxious behavior.
posted by delmoi at 11:18 AM on November 20, 2007

Don't places get their liquor licenses pulled for bullshit like this? Stop selling beer, explain that it's because of the assholes, and count the seconds until it never, ever happens again.
posted by mullingitover at 11:21 AM on November 20, 2007 [2 favorites]

So Jets games are boyzones?
posted by These Premises Are Alarmed at 11:21 AM on November 20, 2007

Amen, selfnoise. I went to the Jets' "Last day at Shea", also against Pittsburgh, in 1983 (I think I was 13 at the time). It was completely frightening, a disastrous game that helped cement my pro-Giant position. It was also Terry Bradshaw's last game. I thought there would be more about this on the internet, but you can glean some info here and here.

The fans rioted, and the police just kind of stayed out of the way, not wanting things to turn even worse, allowing the crowd to rip out seats, rip up turf, rip down the posts, and so on. We (my dad and my friend from school) got out of there quick, and got to see a drunken fist fight on the way to the gate. I am surprised that I only saw the one fight, honestly, but I am sure there were many more.

The Jets' fans have a long history of being obnoxious bordering on criminal.
posted by Mister_A at 11:21 AM on November 20, 2007

DU: Assuming this "Giants Stadium" is a place in the USA and in the 21st century: W. T. F."

It's in Jersey but I'm sure that those idiots are all from New York.

*ducks*
posted by octothorpe at 11:22 AM on November 20, 2007

mullingitover: "...count the seconds until it never, ever happens again."

So.. infinity?
posted by Plutor at 11:23 AM on November 20, 2007

they could arrest women who do show their breasts,

Which is actually legal in New York, but since the NY Jets play in New Jersey, it doesn't matter.
posted by yeti at 11:24 AM on November 20, 2007

What do we do, arrest everybody that starts chanting?

Okay asshole, then don't pull me over when everyone else is speeding, too. What are you gonna do, pull everyone over?
posted by Mikey-San at 11:25 AM on November 20, 2007 [4 favorites]

“The problem is, you got to watch four or five hundred people sometimes in the one particular spiral,” Patrick Aramini, the vice president for security said. “What do we do, arrest everybody that starts chanting?”

Solution: Post cops about every five feet along the ramp. Arrest anyone who's intoxicated, spitting, or throwing plastic cups at women. Problem solved.
posted by fandango_matt at 11:25 AM on November 20, 2007

yeti: The scoreboard operator put the home team up as "NJ JETS" during their last day at Shea stadium. See my excellent post a few comments up for more.
posted by Mister_A at 11:25 AM on November 20, 2007

Fire hoses aren't just for dousing flames.
posted by gottabefunky at 11:28 AM on November 20, 2007

I remember hearing a quote that "nationalism is the father of fascism," and I thought a lot about it. After a while, I realized that unchecked and blind patriotism was actually the father of nationalism. And that this sort of patriotism shares a basic impulse with sports fanaticism. Professional sports teams are completely artificial constructs. They don't actually represent the city they "represent" in any meaningful way, except through the fanatic nature of local fans. I could understand somewhat blind support if all the guys on (say) the Chicago Bulls were actually *from* Chicago. Even if that were an accident of birth and geography, at least it would be something, I suppose. I can understand admiring this year's version of a particular team too, or a sport itself. But people who are lifelong Cubs or Red Sox (et al) fans are just fodder for future right-wing political movements in my opinion.

So to me, these gargantuan, commercial and senseless sports teams actually foster a sort of quasi-patriotism that paves the way for fascism by supporting a sort of Pavlonian response to (in a sane world) otherwise benign or unimportant stimuli. I could go on and on about the connections between sport and extremist politics . . . but it amazes me that people don't get it. Where I live, people put up huge (and ugly) banners on their homes to show their support for local teams. Why don't they do this for other brands, like Coca-Cola? It's a pretty good product too! But you'd be insane to do that, wouldn't you?

I'm sure everyone will disagree, but I've seen firsthand paramilitary brigades adopt team logos and chants and colors as a unifying force which helped blind the individuals involved to the atrocities they committed, so it's not like I'm a total nutter. And you could go back in time and find loads of things which support this.

So screw this team, the NFL and their sad fans. They could clear it up in three seconds if they wanted to, but they probably consider it a draw for fans. Fascists.
posted by Dee Xtrovert at 11:29 AM on November 20, 2007 [15 favorites]

Stay classy, New Jersey.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 11:29 AM on November 20, 2007

Of course, if they actually wanted to stop it, they could arrest women who do show their breasts, that way, they would stop doing it, and the men would stop asking for it.

Worked so well with prostitution.
posted by justgary at 11:30 AM on November 20, 2007

I'm sure everyone will disagree...

Not me. I've always wondered the same thing about sports fans. They trade them around every season or two, right? So....why are you so loyal to a team composed of pieces of the teams you hated last year? Makes zero sense.
posted by DU at 11:32 AM on November 20, 2007

Don't go to Italy during soccer season, Dee Xtrovert-- your head will explode!

Interesting that this does not happen during Jets games. The Times article does not address that.
posted by wfc123 at 11:34 AM on November 20, 2007

Or, why do you care more about the victory record of this randomly assembled squad of overpaid, physically gifted giants than that of the next one?

Watching someone do something well is one thing. Caring about who triumphs, I don't get.
posted by gottabefunky at 11:36 AM on November 20, 2007

"Loyalty to any one sports team is pretty hard to justify. Because the players are always changing, the team can move to another city--when you get right down to it, you're actually rooting for the clothes. You know what I mean, you are standing and cheering and yelling for your clothes to beat the clothes from another city. Fans will be so in love with a player but if he goes to another team, they boo him. This is the same human being in a different shirt, but now they hate him. Boo! different shirt! Boo."

--Jerry Seinfeld
posted by fandango_matt at 11:39 AM on November 20, 2007 [7 favorites]

Ha! You sound like a Cardinals fan, gottabefunky.

jk
posted by Mister_A at 11:39 AM on November 20, 2007

fandango_matt writes "Arrest anyone who's intoxicated, spitting, or throwing plastic cups at women. Problem solved."

Er...arresting for "spitting" and "throwing cups" I understand, but "arrest anyone who's intoxicated"? For?

"There are a lot of men who spit at women, throw cups at women, and wear pants. Therefore, we should arrest anyone who is spitting, throwing cups, or wearing pants"
posted by Bugbread at 11:40 AM on November 20, 2007

I think that publicity will have a big effect. If all of the non-assholes at the game hang out on the entrance ready to spit on the few assholes at the game, that would help.
posted by roll truck roll at 11:41 AM on November 20, 2007

Public intoxication is an arrestable offense in some locales. NYC is one, at least at certain times. Presumably NJ would be similar.
posted by DU at 11:42 AM on November 20, 2007

posted by bugbread Er...arresting for "spitting" and "throwing cups" I understand, but "arrest anyone who's intoxicated"? For?

Public intoxication.
posted by fandango_matt at 11:42 AM on November 20, 2007

“The problem is, you got to watch four or five hundred people sometimes in the one particular spiral,” Patrick Aramini, the vice president for security said. “What do we do, arrest everybody that starts chanting?”

First thing you do is fire your "vice president of security" for being a clueless moron. Then you arrest everybody that starts chanting for public nuisance and disturbing the peace or local variants thereof. You only need to do it with sufficient numbers once, possibly twice, before they get the hint and security folk can be reduced to deal with the few longstayers who are psychologically incapable of getting the hint.
posted by Sparx at 11:42 AM on November 20, 2007

Another post about Boston sports fans?




What?
posted by Kirth Gerson at 11:44 AM on November 20, 2007

DU writes "Public intoxication is an arrestable offense in some locales. NYC is one, at least at certain times."

Really? Weird.

So that answers half the question (arrest them for what), but what about the "why" part? If your problem is booing, spitting, and pelting, why arrest folks for unrelated victimless crimes (being drunk outside your own home)? Is it the "if you can't bust the mafia for organized crime, bust them for tax evasion" approach?

(Oh, also, this public intoxication thing is new to me...does that mean you can't get drunk at a bar, since it's a public place? Or, if you can, because it's indoors, does it mean you can't leave the bar until you sober up?)
posted by Bugbread at 11:47 AM on November 20, 2007

Perhaps a shift to positive reinforcement could work. Offer the ladies beads. Its been known to work in other places.
posted by Sailormom at 11:48 AM on November 20, 2007