Comments on: Who is Grady Harp?

Who is Grady Harp?

farishta — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 05:11:35 -0800

The murky demimonde of Amazon's Top Reviewers. I suppose I shouldn't have been surprised, but I had imagined Amazon's customer reviews as a refuge from the machinations of the publishing industry: "an intelligent and articulate conversation ... conducted by a group of disinterested, disembodied spirits..."

By: farishta

farishta — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 05:13:28 -0800

via.

By: Blazecock Pileon

Blazecock Pileon — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 05:20:16 -0800

Thanks for posting this. It seems self-evident that the review system is gamed when the top reviewer has time to read and review more than six books a day, seven days a week. What button do I press to Digg this up? Who watches the watchmen?

By: jouke

jouke — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 05:27:41 -0800

That explains a lot of the effusive reviews on amazon. My suspicions confirmed.

By: Skeptic

Skeptic — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 05:48:55 -0800

A new venture for Holden Karnofsky?

By: DU

DU — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 05:56:33 -0800

This is why I only read the negative reviews on Amazon. Much more informative.

By: willmize

willmize — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 06:06:39 -0800

Thank goodness I didn't send Harriet either of my last two books. Her speed reading probably would have led to her misspell my name in my glowing review. Or at least get me confused with whatever else was on her bookshelf for that day. And I'm with DU above, I look for the negative reviews of products first, just to see what I might be getting into.

By: MrMerlot

MrMerlot — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 06:24:46 -0800

Reminds me of the way that Malcolm McLaren used to write his own letter of complaint about the Sex Pistols and then post them to the NME.

By: starman

starman — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 06:56:15 -0800

I had Amazon's #2 reviewer as a high school drama and literature teacher. This was before Amazon, or at least before anyone knew about Amazon. I was impressed with the fact that he had seemed to have watched every movie ever made, owned just about every CD you could think of, and knew more about contemporary pop culture than the high schoolers to which it was aimed. Plus, he picked Sweeney Todd for our class play, which was pretty cool (non-musical version, thankfully).

By: stbalbach

stbalbach — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:01:01 -0800

I'm in the Amazon Vine program. Every month they send two free things, which I pick from a list of available items - books, health care, electronics, music, etc.. it's pretty nice honestly, these are things that would cost $50 or more had I to buy them, it isn't crap. The electronics in particular can be very high value items. In return, all I have to do is write reviews. It's unclear how Vine members are chosen, I'm ranked around 3500 but there are people ranker higher who were not chosen. Everything this Salon article says is true, and worse. For example, I've seen self-published authors self-reviewing (bad books) with sock puppets giving dozens of 5-star reviews. I've seen reviewers gang up and help or hurt other reviewers. People getting paid to write reviews. If reviewing for Amazon determines what you read, than it's gone too far. I review a lot of out of print obscure stuff that might get one helpful vote in 5 years - who cares, I review what I like to read. If your goal is to get helpful votes, than you must review new books for a number of reasons - first reviews get double the number of ranking points, and new books get a lot more people looking at them trying to decide to buy or not, thus more helpful votes. The ranking algorithm was disclosed by Amazon a while back in the discussion forum - something like, the first 5 votes gets one point, 20 votes get another (all doubled if your the first reviewer). Unhelpful votes likewise remove points in similar block sizes (but never removes more than that review gained ie. 50 unhelpfuls and 20 helpfuls would net out to zero points).

By: stbalbach

stbalbach — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:04:27 -0800

..oh on the ranking, the number of points caps out after 20 votes, so you have to keep writing new reviews to get more points, each review has a limited number of possible points.

By: misha

misha — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:23:02 -0800

I was actually approached on a job board to write reviews of products "under several aliases" for a prominent web retailer and refused, because it didn't smell right to me. I don't know that the retailer was Amazon, but it wouldn't surprise me if this kind of thing went on all the time.

By: Thorzdad

Thorzdad — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:29:16 -0800

I don't know why anyone would be surprised by this. Hell, I always just assumed this went on anywhere public comment/reviews were encouraged. It just seems like a no-brainer, from a marketing point-of-view.

By: CheeseDigestsAll

CheeseDigestsAll — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:35:21 -0800

Even if people weren't gaming the system, (which is inevitable), I always assume that the reviews are biased towards the positive for the simple psychological reason that they've already purchased the product. They have therefore 1) shown a bias toward it, and 2) will feel come psychological pressure to validate that purchase by reaffirming it's value.

By: Mister_A

Mister_A — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:43:16 -0800

farista has set a new standard for FPPs with his/her/its latest opus, Who is Grady Harp? This post was superb. farista shows us his/her/its human/furry/cyborg side, but without succumbing to maudlin lugubriousness or its opposite. Rating: ***** ***** five asterisks

By: farishta

farishta — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:52:58 -0800

farista has set a new standard for FPPs with his/her/its latest opus, Who is Grady Harp? This post was superb. farista shows us his/her/its human/furry/cyborg side, but without succumbing to maudlin lugubriousness or its opposite. I found this review VERY helpful.

By: Wolfdog

Wolfdog — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:54:29 -0800

I'm going to the courthouse today and changing my name to Murky Demimonde.

By: bitter-girl.com

bitter-girl.com — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 08:25:23 -0800

Meh. It's better than the [expletive deleted] who "reviewed" my latest book in the Philadelphia Weekly by commenting on the cover model's hair and making a lot of incoherent remarks about "knit-Nazis" (never mind it's not even a knitting book). I think he did it just to be able to use the term "Adolf Knitler." What a tool. Review systems of all kinds are inherently flawed, but when you can't even expect the media to crack the cover when "reviewing" your book, well... I don't know what to tell you.

By: misha

misha — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 09:01:19 -0800

bitter-girl (eponysterical, by the way), after your comment I wanted to take a look at your book, but going to your profile and then your website still left me clueless. You might want to put a link on your blog for your book(s). 'Adolf Knitler' is really lame.

By: mediareport

mediareport — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 09:11:43 -0800

There's lots more info at the blog of Dayton Daily News reviewer Vick Mickunas, who for some reason is mentioned but not linked in the Slate piece. [Free clue to Slate folks reading this: fix that.] Here's the relevant post with news of "Gunny" retiring after admitting he used 27 different people for his reviews, with lots of great stories about the many bullshit artist Amazon reviewers in the comments. My fave bit: The #6 reviewer, John "Gunny" Matlock, reviews many highly technical books. His reviews are frequently filled with spelling errors. It was pointed out by some commenters that this reviewer also had a presence on Amazon as a bookseller where he routinely sold the same obscure books he claimed to have just reviewed. Most tellingly, he described the books he had just reviewed as "unread." Now *that's* how to bullshit your way to riches through Amazon reviewing. Bravo. More good stuff in the comments here. I've reviewed books professionally in the past, and almost all of the Amazon Top Reviewers have always seemed full of garbage to me, with their hilarious "But I'm a speed reader!" excuses and generally shallow, idiotic takes on books. I'm usually a big fan of user-generated content, but the "star system" Amazon has deliberately encouraged has become a complete crock. At this point, you're much better off totally avoiding reviews by anyone who lays claim to any special Amazon mantle.

By: Adam_S

Adam_S — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 09:41:05 -0800

I look for the negative reviews of products first, just to see what I might be getting into Captain obvious: This same principle might not apply in reverse?

By: sdodd

sdodd — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 09:50:31 -0800

I'm going to the courthouse today and changing my name to Adolf Knitler.

By: wittgenstein

wittgenstein — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 10:30:41 -0800

I still find Amazon reviews useful but that's perhaps because most of what I read is stuff that is not likely to be reviewed by large numbers of people. (i was still a bit disappointed by the article though.)

By: quin

quin — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 10:48:22 -0800

I also find myself almost immediately going to the negative reviews of any product that I am looking at. My rational being; that if I can identify what the worst aspect of something is before I buy it, I can decide whether or not that problematic element is going to be enough to keep me from enjoying or using it. In other words, I make my decisions to buy things based on what other people don't like about the product. There is probably a technical term for what is wrong with my brain.

By: farishta

farishta — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 10:59:32 -0800

Just read the 'Adolf Knitler' review, if you could call it a review. Of everything I've read in my entire life, nothing comes to mind that's less informative, clever, or enjoyable to read. A part of me just died.

By: Devils Rancher

Devils Rancher — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 11:04:08 -0800

As usual, I'm shocked! Shocked to find gambling here!

By: klangklangston

klangklangston — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 11:45:10 -0800

The only reviews I trust are of David Hasselhoff albums. Hot Shot City is particularly good.

By: Mister_A

Mister_A — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 12:02:54 -0800

I have found that, in general, consumer-generated reviews on the internet are negative. People love to bitch about how this dildo goes through batteries, that trepanning knife goes dull after only a few skulls, etc. When I wanted to buy a car, I did some research on the internet, and discovered that ALL CARS SUCK IN A NUMBER OF WAYS, but mostly in the transmission area. i bought one anyway. '86 Buick FTW.

By: designbot

designbot — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 12:34:07 -0800

AlterNation, by bitter-girl.com: ***** (1 review) Being a wearable art designer, I'm always looking for sources of new inspiration. This book fits the bill for new ways on transforming those tired clothes you no longer feel the desire to wear. Its fun, easy and a real joy to make something that looks like it came from a designers line. Tits Out Teenage Terror Tottys, by Steven Wells: **** (1 review) Well! How can i describe this book? This is the most demented, shocking thing i have ever read. This is either the best book ever written or the biggest load of rubbish ever. It's a very funny, virtually plotless book. It's literally undescribable. It's definitely not for everyone, but is recommended for headcases everywhere. Mein Kampf, by Adolf Knitler: ***1/2 (146 reviews) this book is a book from some person, what the world seems as a bad person. In the most way i agree with is, but not with some things. Cultures are different, there are so many people on this world, with differend looks and looking into the world. Also is there a different between strong and weakniss people. We most protect weakness from the strongest. but also protect cultures and not become on big family. Let every land hold his culture, it is nice to go on vacation and to see the differences with your own land.

By: barjo

barjo — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 12:35:48 -0800

Speaking of gaming the system, this book has suddenly seen a flood of one-star reviews, and this explains why.

By: flotson

flotson — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 13:11:33 -0800

I found the linked article to be a muscular tour-de-force, subversively erotic and psychologically taut. I went to school with the author.

By: bitter-girl.com

bitter-girl.com — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 13:28:18 -0800

You guys are freaking hilarious, thanks for making my day. Misha, I don't link to my "professional" (read: books) site from my personal blog (the "bitter" one) because I've gotten crap from my publishers in the past for links between the two. My first knitting books were for tweens, and my shop website (a third and altogether different domain) was selling "The Only Bush I Trust Is My Own" panties. So then some lame-o Christian book club wouldn't carry my knitting books because clearly, I am the devil. Ai-yi. See the "about" on alternationbook.com for a link to my knitting website if you're interested. If anyone should be allowed to change their name to Adolf Knitler, it's me. ;)

By: Infinite Jest

Infinite Jest — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 13:50:05 -0800

Meh. It's better than the [expletive deleted] who "reviewed" my latest book in the Philadelphia Weekly Oh God, Steven Wells. Listen, you got to realise not to take anything he says seriously. I think he's a great and very funny writer, but he tends to, well, make a lot of stuff up (my favourite was his front page interview with the Sugarcubes for the NME, where he claimed that they ate puffins, among other things). His regular readers will realise what he's doing, and take it with a huge grain of salt.

By: Infinite Jest

Infinite Jest — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 13:58:00 -0800

Of course, the problem with Amazon isn't limited to reviews; plenty of people are gaming the tagging system too (I like this example).

By: bitter-girl.com

bitter-girl.com — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 15:23:20 -0800

Well, the problem, Infinite Jest, is that he's attacked the feminist bona fides of a whole gang o' women who are making their living doing art/craft-related work. It's one thing when you accuse Bjork of eating puffin-cakes. That's just goofy. But realizing that real feminism is about choice and making decisions for yourself in all aspects of your life is something he's clearly missing the boat on... Oh, also -- The AntiCraft is now sponsoring a "knit your own Vlad the Impaler" cap contest as a result of this review. Good times!

By: popechunk

popechunk — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 19:27:23 -0800

I guess I'm a dope, but I've always kinda relied upon Amazon.com reviews. I, too, have always sought out negative reviews in order to make sure I understood the "worst case" of a purchase. But I'm left with the nagging worry that I bought some things based upon the recommendation of these jerks. I've even used Amazon reviews as a research tool for things I had no intention of even buying at Amazon. Color me naive.

By: Bookhouse

Bookhouse — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 19:36:42 -0800

I like to read the one-star reviews of classics that I dislike. Sometimes they use withering observations to make me feel less stupid for disliking high literature. Sometimes they make me feel stupider for agreeing with m0rons.

By: Kattullus

Kattullus — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 21:04:10 -0800

Infinite Jest: my favourite was his front page interview with the Sugarcubes for the NME, where he claimed that they ate puffins They probably have, at least some of them. Eating puffins is very common in some parts of Iceland, especially in Vestmannaeyjar. When I was a kid I was once there and ate puffin. Very oily. Of course, "eating puffin" sounds like a euphemism.

By: maxwelton

maxwelton — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 21:17:07 -0800

Of course, "eating puffin" sounds like a euphemism. There was the famous-for-a-day parody song about the MTV "VJ" entitled "Stuffin' Martha's Puffin," for an example.

By: Samizdata

Samizdata — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 21:35:01 -0800

You know who Knitler liked? Or did I just Godwindize this thread? (Seconding ANY bad reveiws first. First, I figure some people are going to dislike something and buck the popular trend. Second, if there's an odd quirk of something, it will end up showing up on my watch.)

By: Samizdata

Samizdata — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 21:35:16 -0800

Erm, reviews, even.

By: Infinite Jest

Infinite Jest — Mon, 28 Jan 2008 22:50:26 -0800

Kattalus: interesting, I didn't know it was common in Iceland; but IIRC, most or all of the band were vegetarians. Which was their objection to the article in question. bitter-girl.com: for what it's worth, the guy's a queer socialist punk who would at least claim to have sympathies with feminism, and he's got a strong record of writing stuff that supports feminist ideals. So I don't think he's missing the boat on feminist thinking in general, though he could very well be wrong in your particular instance. Like I say, though, he's often not serious, and writes stuff that is either wildly exaggerated or just plain made up - I think he fancies himself as a British version of Lester Bangs or someone...

By: ryansara

ryansara — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 21:13:00 -0800

Just curious: am I the only writer out there who's never (ever) checked her Amazon rankings?

By: bitter-girl.com

bitter-girl.com — Wed, 30 Jan 2008 08:41:54 -0800

Probably, ryansara. However, in my particular genre (how-to/craft books), it's a necessity, because if a problem crops up with a pattern or there's errata, it will get posted to an Amazon review more often than it will be submitted by the reader to the publisher or author. Infinite Jest, do you think it's particularly feminist-friendly to decry those who *choose* (emphasis there on choice) to engage in activities that have been traditionally considered "women's work"? I don't. I don't knit because I have to (because if I don't, my family will be running around naked), I do it because I want to. Calling us crochet-nazis is a bit extreme, yeah? It also proves he doesn't know jack-all about handwork, because traditionally, knitting was men's work (!!! I know, right? It's true, though). And also, crochet wasn't even invented until about 100 years ago, as a means of copying the fancy knitted lace that was out of reach price-wise for most consumers. So the knit/crochet divide could, until recently, have been more accurately framed as a class issue and not a gender one. But that's a little more data than Captain Snarky could accurately include in his rant... :) (Oh! and I'm also not even going to go into the recent Radical Lace and Subversive Knitting exhibit because the thought of craft as art would probably blow out what's left of his synapses).

By: petrilli

petrilli — Fri, 08 Feb 2008 12:15:52 -0800

I wonder if the "crochet nazis" is an attempt to spin the Craft Mafia into something "original" in the writer's mind? It's one thing to call yourself that, it's another thing entirely when someone else bestows that label.