Is Rice Right?

February 10, 2008 1:55 PM

Think Condi

Is Condoleezza Rice a viable candidate for Vice President on the Republican Ticket? She has experience, she would help McCain mollify the far right with her strong faith and she is an obvious deviation from the "old white boy" standard.

Here is an even more interesting idea. What about Condi as Obama's running mate?

posted by pearlybob (108 comments total)

what
posted by XQUZYPHYR at 2:02 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

No, she's not. Can you imagine the monster "Condi lying to 'Meet the Press' and other Sunday morning news/punditry show people" montage that any campaign manager with half a brain could put together? One commercial full of that would be devastating.
posted by raysmj at 2:05 PM on February 10, 2008

So because she acknowledged that Obama exists, we are free to speculate on her being picked as his running mate?
posted by shakespeherian at 2:05 PM on February 10, 2008 [2 favorites has favorites]

who
posted by cytherea at 2:05 PM on February 10, 2008

We live in times of science fiction as fact.

Someone please wake me up from this horrendous fucking nightmare.
posted by dbiedny at 2:05 PM on February 10, 2008 [3 favorites has favorites]

Yeah, 'cause someone connected to the Bush Administration running on the Republican ticket would be perfect.

For Democrats.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 2:09 PM on February 10, 2008 [8 favorites has favorites]

her?

/too much arrested development
posted by iso_bars at 2:10 PM on February 10, 2008 [7 favorites has favorites]

I don't see it happening - Rice running for anything, that is. Her personality seems much more suited to bureaucratic roles, and that's what she's always done, not running for office. But no matter how conservative she is, she's always been willing to acknowledge accomplishments by African Americans, no matter their political affiliations. That's all she's doing here. Someone is ginning it up with speculation, but there's nothing there.
posted by krinklyfig at 2:11 PM on February 10, 2008

she would help McCain mollify the far right with her strong faith and she is an obvious deviation from the "old white boy" standard

Not only that, but if McCain were to win and then die in office, she would become both the first black president and the first female president. The Democrats are only aiming for one or the other this year.
posted by sillygwailo at 2:11 PM on February 10, 2008

What about Condi as Obama's running mate?

what about as Hilary's running mate? I mean, they're both women, right?

sheesh.
posted by jonmc at 2:13 PM on February 10, 2008 [17 favorites has favorites]

Good point jonmc. Either way would be interesting.
posted by pearlybob at 2:14 PM on February 10, 2008

I just threw up a little.
posted by parallax7d at 2:15 PM on February 10, 2008 [3 favorites has favorites]

Well, if we're going to suggest people who are bad at their jobs, but just keep rising higher because of loyalty to a corrupt and incompetent boss, there is a loser and asskisser at my last job who might make a brilliant vice president.
posted by Astro Zombie at 2:20 PM on February 10, 2008 [3 favorites has favorites]

I'm genuinely curious - is there anything that Condi has been a success at during her roles in the Bush administration? Anything that people can easily point at and say "She sure got that right," or, "she did a good job on that issue"?
posted by Staggering Jack at 2:21 PM on February 10, 2008 [2 favorites has favorites]

Well if these rumors are correct (and I wonder why if they were, it wasn't blaring all over the media) the right-wing might have "issues" with Condi. But let's face it, this ain't gonna happen. McCain isn't dumb.

http://signorile2003.blogspot.com/2007/09/condis-best-friends-yesterday-on-show-i.html

http://www.dykestowatchoutfor.com/condis-housemate

I have no idea about them, but a cousin of mine, who is a somewhat big mucky-muck in local gay-rights politics swears it is.
posted by xetere at 2:24 PM on February 10, 2008

There was once a time when I woulda considered seriously voting for a McCain/Powell ticket. That ship has sailed. McCain and Rice would be the funniest thing since Bush/Quayle. So from a pure humorist position, I'm all for it. I'm not voting for any of them anyway. I'm just gonna point and laugh.
posted by ZachsMind at 2:27 PM on February 10, 2008

Staggering Jack:

I'm genuinely curious - is there anything that Condi has been a success at during her roles in the Bush administration? Anything that people can easily point at and say "She sure got that right," or, "she did a good job on that issue"?

Certainly.

For example, when President Bush, at the United Nations, asked her if it was possible for him to take a bathroom break, no horrifyingly embarrassing international incident occurred.
posted by Flunkie at 2:28 PM on February 10, 2008 [3 favorites has favorites]

She would tank as a candidate for either party.
posted by timsteil at 2:28 PM on February 10, 2008

Think naught.
Stay the curse!
posted by hal9k at 2:30 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

Vote for someone who let 9/11 happen on her watch. No, thank you, I'll pass.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 2:38 PM on February 10, 2008 [2 favorites has favorites]

Didn't they alter the 911 commissions' report, at Rove's behest, that described Rice as utterly incompetent as head of the NSA?

After this administration why would anyone want her near ANYTHING in government?
posted by Max Power at 2:39 PM on February 10, 2008

STUPID HUMANS

A KLINGON WARRIOR WOULD NEVER SUBMIT TO BEING 'VICE' ANYTHING

SOON THE TRAP WILL CLOSE
posted by mattoxic at 2:42 PM on February 10, 2008 [9 favorites has favorites]

I don't think she'd be a terrible choice for McCain, for the following reasons:

1) The Republicans get to pretend like they're being progressive, with a black woman on the ticket. Netroots rhetoric aside, most Republicans aren't overtly racist or sexist; where it does exist in the party, it's more of a soft and subtle bigotry that they don't like to admit to themselves. So Condi would give them a chance to say "Look! We like ladies AND Negros!"

2) She's actually got some decent foreign policy credibility. She hasn't been a complete disaster as Secretary of State, and in the Bush Administration, that's about as glowing a job performance review as you can get. Her main expertise is on the Soviet Union, which is less useful these days, but with the Putinocracy on the rise in Russia, maybe that wouldn't be such a terrible thing.

3) Conservatives like her. McCain needs to reassure the party's base that he's one of them, and picking George W. Bush's best buddy to run with him would do that. It'd probably murder him with independent voters, but if he's running against Obama (which looks increasingly likely) he can probably write most of them off anyway.

4) It makes it an all-Iraq-all-the-time ticket, which has its positives and negatives. Again, it hurts him with the left and a lot of moderates, but anyone who's pissed about the war (i.e., most of the country) is going to be voting Democratic this year anyway. He might as well throw a big bear hug around the war and pretend like it's a strength, not a weakness. And Iraq's been largely replaced in the headlines by the economy and the election horserace. Assuming nothing goes horribly wrong (wronger) there this year, it may not be the biggest factor in people's minds at the voting booth.
posted by EarBucket at 2:46 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

What about Condi as Obama's running mate?

Yeah! Because American political parties have a long history of reaching across party lines when selecting a vice-presidential candidate! Especially during extremely divisive, partisan periods! And especially when the person in question is a highly visible member of a disastrous, disgraced, outgoing administration! That's fucking brilliant!
posted by ook at 2:48 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

Please remember that heterosexual friends often assist each other in ways that are normally associated with domestic unions. I won't go into details, but I have been the recipient of financial support and help from friends that one would normally associate with marriage or a romantic relationship. If I were in Condi's financial position (she is extremely wealthy) I can easily imagine accepting a plea from a responsible friend who'd had a lot of bad luck and needed my help to build equity.

Condi may well be a lesbian. She also may very well be someone with an indeterminate sexuality that has been subsumed in favor of total, unrelenting commitment and single-minded devotion to her career. She may be one of those personalities- commonly found in high-achieving professions such as investment banking- who perceive a personal life and a romantic relationship as an impediment to their work. She may also be another example of a high-achieving, accomplished women who is having difficultly finding a male partner who is her intellectual and professional equal but doesn't find her intimidating as hell.

Some commenter on other boards have cited Rice's supportive and professional attitude to the sexual reassignment surgery of Stanford professor Jonathan/Joan Roughgarden as "evidence" of her sexuality. I find it entirely plausible that a conservative obsessed with foreign policy rather than social moralizing might be entirely capable of responding professionally to this particular situation, particularly since, as the University provost, a hostile response might serve as grounds for a future lawsuit by Prof. Roughgarden.

Condi can be a lesbian, for all I care. But it's a mistake to draw that conclusion through innuendo. And there are far better targets for this sort of sexual scrutiny.
posted by foxy_hedgehog at 2:49 PM on February 10, 2008 [2 favorites has favorites]

Think Condi

ugh. my heavens. must i ?????
posted by CitizenD at 2:50 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

The Democrats are only aiming for one or the other this year.

Clearly we have our sights too low. What we really need is a transgendered mixed-ethnicity bisexual athiest candidate. There's no way they could top that.
posted by spiderskull at 2:53 PM on February 10, 2008

What about Condi as Obama's running mate

Too black, too strong. Needs a cripple.
posted by meehawl at 2:54 PM on February 10, 2008

/me buys thinkfonzie.com
posted by Plutor at 2:56 PM on February 10, 2008

She hasn't been a complete disaster as Secretary of State, and in the Bush Administration, that's about as glowing a job performance review as you can get.

What she has done is an exceptional job of preventing the bush administration taint from infecting her in the publics mind, and she's accomplished mostly by staying out of the public eye. She's never on TV saying idiotic things -- well, beyond the bare minimum idiocy required to be part of the administration.

She also seems very passive, and so I think people have a tendency to imagine her not being at the fore of causing all this damage.

But, when you look at the details she's been terrible. She let the state department run off on it's own, hiring and defending blackwater in Iraq. She's absolutely loathed in Lebanon. She has zero accomplishments beyond avoiding public blame for all the failures of the administration. She has zero presence, zero charisma unlike women like Barbra Boxer, Nancy Peloci, Madeline Albright, etc. (And Hillary Clinton, of course)

A lot of her white house carrier has been sucking up to president bush, getting what he wants done done, rather then being an adviser or someone who was willing to push back, although some people say that she moderated the influence of Chaney.

There is absolutely no reason why Obama would pick her as VP. I think it would make sense for McCain to pick her as VP, especially if he runs against Clinton. I don't think she would contribute much to a McCain administration, but she would help with ticket balancing. I think the two of them have similar views when it comes to foreign policy and where they differ, she would easy deffer.
posted by delmoi at 3:00 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

Is the internet so bereft of good ideas that we have to discuss these?
posted by Epenthesis at 3:02 PM on February 10, 2008 [8 favorites has favorites]

Given the last eight years, it's clear that anything smarter than an iguana is a "viable candidate" on the Republican ticket. But what has Obama done to make anyone think he's such a fool as to pick someone who encouraged the US to get into the war he opposed? And apparently was willing to lie to do so.

I'd look for him to pick a governor, maybe someone like Richardson, to give some "executive experience" to the ticket as well and bolster support from Latinos.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 3:10 PM on February 10, 2008

"Nobody could have imagined terrorists taking planes and crashing them into buildings"
posted by Flashman at 3:11 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

Umm, hello? Condi isn't a lesbian. She dated Jack Donaghy ferchrissakes. Putin, too.
posted by Tullius at 3:16 PM on February 10, 2008

What about Condi as Obama's running mate?

what about MY SWEATY BALLS???
posted by mr_book at 3:18 PM on February 10, 2008

There was once a time when I woulda considered seriously voting for a McCain/Powell ticket.

Colin Powell: I May Support Democrat Or Independent In '08.
posted by ericb at 3:20 PM on February 10, 2008

I'm sorry, I can't even muster snark for this. What can you say, but this is the fucking stupidest shit ever.

America hates the Bush administration, and Rice sucks at everything except getting Bush to like her and playing the piano.
posted by ibmcginty at 3:21 PM on February 10, 2008 [4 favorites has favorites]

What she has done is an exceptional job of preventing the bush administration taint from infecting her

Bush's taint -- it's insane.
posted by oncogenesis at 3:22 PM on February 10, 2008 [2 favorites has favorites]

Apparently we do have to discuss these. OK, Earbucket:

1) The Republicans get to pretend like they're being progressive, with a black woman on the ticket. Netroots rhetoric aside, most Republicans aren't overtly racist or sexist; where it does exist in the party, it's more of a soft and subtle bigotry that they don't like to admit to themselves. So Condi would give them a chance to say "Look! We like ladies AND Negros!"

That might be great if the Democrats weren't on the verge of nominating a black man or a woman, possibly both. If you want to peel away some moderate or liberal votes from people who would probably vote Democrat but want to feel like they're making history, this is the wrong year to try it--all that's gonna happen is that the racist and sexist vote will end up being neutralized. There's no scenario under which that's good for Republicans.

2) She's actually got some decent foreign policy credibility. She hasn't been a complete disaster as Secretary of State, and in the Bush Administration, that's about as glowing a job performance review as you can get. Her main expertise is on the Soviet Union, which is less useful these days, but with the Putinocracy on the rise in Russia, maybe that wouldn't be such a terrible thing.

Leaving aside the high praise of "not a complete disaster": John McCain is going to try to run on "change," and Rice would be an unbreakable shackle to the outgoing administration. It doesn't matter whether she's directly blamed for Bush's failures; she represents continuity with them. (For that matter, she'd be an easy target since her work has not been very good by most standards.)

3) Conservatives like her. McCain needs to reassure the party's base that he's one of them, and picking George W. Bush's best buddy to run with him would do that. It'd probably murder him with independent voters, but if he's running against Obama (which looks increasingly likely) he can probably write most of them off anyway.

Appealing to conservatives is such an '04 strategy. The people who will turn out because they love Bush so much are not going to decide this election.

4) It makes it an all-Iraq-all-the-time ticket, which has its positives and negatives. Again, it hurts him with the left and a lot of moderates, but anyone who's pissed about the war (i.e., most of the country) is going to be voting Democratic this year anyway. He might as well throw a big bear hug around the war and pretend like it's a strength, not a weakness. And Iraq's been largely replaced in the headlines by the economy and the election horserace. Assuming nothing goes horribly wrong (wronger) there this year, it may not be the biggest factor in people's minds at the voting booth.

I wrote a paragraph in rebuttal to this before I realized that this isn't actually a point in Rice's favor. "Iraq is a terrible issue for the GOP with two-thirds of the country, but it's been slowly replaced in the headlines with other issues...so let's try to make the election about Iraq!" I don't get it. Henry Kissinger would also be a sop to the warmongers, yet his name isn't on any short lists. In any event, this "positive" would be dwarfed by the rest of the negatives attached to her.

There's an indubitable demographic appeal to putting an African-American woman on a Republican ticket; it would signal the end to a lot of what's bad about the GOP. But what's bad about the GOP has not ended, and I think that's ultimately the main reason why she'd be a non-starter.
posted by Epenthesis at 3:24 PM on February 10, 2008

ny times:
"The long buildup to Annapolis, together with Ms. Rice’s many trips to the region, have given birth to a new verb in Israeli government circles: “lecondel,” meaning, to come and go for meetings that produce few results. The word is based on Ms. Rice’s first name."

Not an outstanding reputation to have. Much less one that recommends her for the office of VP.
posted by JimmyJames at 3:26 PM on February 10, 2008

I'd look for him to pick a governor, maybe someone like Richardson, to give some "executive experience" to the ticket as well and bolster support from Latinos.

Please don't say things that are going to keep me awake at night in terror.

Richardson is god-awful--dumb as a post, surprisingly conservative, and a notorious womanizer just in case anyone thought he had any electoral viability. Throw in "ugly as sin" just for kicks, then close your eyes and: Camelot reborn!
posted by Epenthesis at 3:27 PM on February 10, 2008

Condi Rice Raps.

Keith Olbermann On Condi Rice As Being A Liar.
posted by ericb at 3:28 PM on February 10, 2008

I've not read all the comments here... so this may have already been said....but..

It is not legal for a lizard to run for office, therefore this is not a possibility...

stand down...all is well.
posted by HuronBob at 3:30 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

She hasn't exactly been a resounding success in either of the public-sector jobs she's had so far. "National Security Advisor on 9/11" isn't exactly something good to advertise, and as Secretary of State she's made more of a splash with her outfits than her relevant accomplishments (although on the plus side she hasn't really been in the spotlight enough to embarrass herself). And her foreign-policy opinions (as one of the Vulcans) are what's directly led to the current President being saddled with dismal approval ratings.

Any talk of putting her on a national ticket at this point is entirely driven by the idea of using the fact that she's a black woman as a distraction from serious political discussion, and I'm fairly sure that she's aware of that -- and probably disinclined to embrace a legacy that would be summed up as "the affirmative action candidate".
posted by clevershark at 3:31 PM on February 10, 2008

I just like the fact that her and her friends are Rice, Blacker, and Bean. That's funny.
posted by papakwanz at 3:33 PM on February 10, 2008

Here is an even more interesting idea. What about Condi as Obama's running mate?

Why, because they're both black and she doesn't hate him?

(with regards to Clinton + her)
Either way would be interesting.

Oh, I get it. It's because they're both women, right? So, it doesn't matter one whit that Rice has nothing in common politically with either Obama or Clinton, but two circumstances of her birth (race and gender) make her a match for, what, "her own folk"?

Now, if Bloomberg were to throw his hat into the ring, I imagine you'd get behind Lieberman as his VP because he's also Jewish, right?
posted by mkultra at 3:37 PM on February 10, 2008 [2 favorites has favorites]

Think, Condi.

FTFY.
posted by dhartung at 3:41 PM on February 10, 2008 [4 favorites has favorites]

she's made more of a splash with her outfits than her relevant accomplishments

While Rome burned Nero fiddled.

While New Orleans drowned, Condi diddled.*

* - Shopping for shoes and taking in Broadway's Spamalot.
posted by ericb at 3:41 PM on February 10, 2008

Holy crap! Does it matter in the least that she's been a complete fucking DISASTER at her job? Does it matter at all that she's not even any good at her nominal area of expertise?

She's another of the incompetents who have brought us nearly eight years of unremitting disaster.

She's not worth the effort to run down the exact anecdote, but I seem to recall that during the run-up to Bush's attack on Afghanistan, she (as NSA) explained to Bush that we would handle the occupation of Afghanistan in some manner that would be distinct from how the Soviets handled it. And then proved to everybody in the room that she had no fucking idea of how the Soviet Union had handled their occupation of Afghanistan, as she had not paid it any attention at all. And she was nominally the "Soviet expert" at the table.

Oh, and I can recall her musing out loud: "Who would ever have thought that our enemies would ever attack us with suicide airplanes?" I went across the street to ask my neighbor about this inconceivable idea - he had some choice words on the subject, as he's a survivor of the USS Franklin, back at the start of the kamikaze phase of the Pacific War.

Really, you could open the telephone book at random and find someone more qualified for high office. She's not in the first hundred million names of those you'd want near the levers of power.
posted by AsYouKnow Bob at 3:43 PM on February 10, 2008 [2 favorites has favorites]

Washington Post: Condoleezza Rice's Commanding Clothes.
posted by ericb at 3:44 PM on February 10, 2008

Oh, and I can recall her musing out loud: "Who would ever have thought that our enemies would ever attack us with suicide airplanes?"

It's hilarious considering that EXACTLY this scenario was considered in the Atlanta Olympics security plan, as is related in Richard Clarke's Against All Enemies.
posted by clevershark at 3:48 PM on February 10, 2008

It's too bad that Giuliani is out. The Republicans could have had a 9/11 dream team.
posted by grouse at 4:04 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

She can play a sonata at Obama's inaugural.
posted by lukemeister at 4:11 PM on February 10, 2008

Does Condi's have any qualifications to be "a heartbeat away" other than being an African American woman?

For what it's worth, Rice may indeed be a fabulous pianist, terrific figure skater and an expert on Soviet Russia, but she has a singularly unimpressive presence for such a noted public figure.
posted by psmealey at 4:18 PM on February 10, 2008

Just out of curiosity, has there ever been a VP who had never run for any public office prior to being tapped for the no. 2 slot?
posted by psmealey at 4:21 PM on February 10, 2008

What about Condi as Obama's running mate?

Obama would have to be not just plain stupid, but George-Bush-idiotic to make this choice. Aside from the fact that Condi offers nothing positive to the ticket, is a lying incompetent tool, and was the National Security Advisor on 9/11, choosing Condi as his VP would make me too worry that Obama would be mysteriously assassinated in his first year by a unhinged Iraq vet with a documented history of racist tendencies. Who would then die in a shootout with the FBI.
posted by tula at 4:23 PM on February 10, 2008

Cuthulu ticket.
posted by Balisong at 4:27 PM on February 10, 2008

That's The NY Post without a sports section now, remember.
posted by Jay Reimenschneider at 4:41 PM on February 10, 2008

Sure, it sounds like a terrible idea, but consider: wouldn't China be more likely to deal favorably with a Vice President named Rice? They love that shit. The quickest way to the heart of a rising global superpower is through its stomach.
posted by Rhaomi at 4:54 PM on February 10, 2008

I just like the fact that her and her friends are Rice, Blacker, and Bean. That's funny.

Which reminds me that everything I've heard/read about her on a personal level is quite positive. Just another member of Team Bush that seems like she'd be cool to hang out with, but is a disaster in government.
posted by LooseFilter at 5:03 PM on February 10, 2008

We already have a candidate whose husband was President.
posted by George_Spiggott at 5:03 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

Just another member of Team Bush that seems like she'd be cool to hang out with, but is a disaster in government.

I actually can't think of anyone on Team Bush that would be cool to hang out with.
posted by psmealey at 5:12 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

Viable candidate? No, but it would be fun to watch.
posted by Sys Rq at 5:21 PM on February 10, 2008

Which reminds me that everything I've heard/read about her on a personal level is quite positive.

Not according to Madeline Albright. Albright, whose father was Condi's mentor, essentially says in her book that Rice is an mean spirited opportunistic wanna be with no principles at all who got promoted beyond her nerd analyst capabilities becuase she hated all the "right" people.
posted by tkchrist at 5:24 PM on February 10, 2008 [3 favorites has favorites]

At my previous job, I worked with a bunch of Stanford PhD.s who had been at Stanford during Ms. Rice's tenure as provost. They described how their departmental meetings would convene, discuss nothing of import, and ostensibly adjourn, only to reconvene and discuss actual business once Ms. Rice's spies would leave. Yes, she had people on staff to monitor what went on in departmental meetings not as open representatives of her office, but rather to function as her eyes and ears and to do so through subterfuge. I have no experience in university politics but this practice strikes me as a little paranoid and abnormal.

But I guess it's no wonder how she fit right in with the rest of the Bush administration.
posted by ooga_booga at 5:27 PM on February 10, 2008 [4 favorites has favorites]

Rice is an mean spirited opportunistic wanna be with no principles at all

I knew there had to be a reason President Cheney picked her to be on the team...
posted by clevershark at 5:45 PM on February 10, 2008

Rice is an mean spirited opportunistic wanna be with no principles at all

as opposed to any other politician?
posted by jonmc at 5:48 PM on February 10, 2008

Not according to Madeline Albright.

No shit, I hadn't heard that. That's too bad.

I actually can't think of anyone on Team Bush that would be cool to hang out with.

Yeah, I retract my earlier sentiment. I was thinking of Bush's image as a guy people might wanna have a beer with, and then sort of that John Bolton might be fun to drink with in that funny cynical asshole kind of way, and Rice is a musician so she can't be all bad but given tkchrist's info from Albright, it makes sense that Condi could have been one of those hyper-competitive, incredibly arrogant and self-important virtuoso pianist type of musicians (that I have the misfortune of having to deal with occasionally), and I realize upon reflection that I have no idea how big or not an asshole any of those people are. So, in conclusion, I've officially said nothing so in this thread so far. Apologies to all.

To add something: I don't see her career in government going beyond this administration, and definitely not into politics (she's only held appointed positions). I think she might head back to Stanford, where her job is currently still waiting for her, if you can believe that.
posted by LooseFilter at 5:50 PM on February 10, 2008

I have no experience in university politics but this practice strikes me as a little paranoid and abnormal.

That's because you have no experience in university politics. We have tenure for good reasons.
posted by LooseFilter at 5:51 PM on February 10, 2008

saddest part?

I can't UNTHINK Condi.
posted by liza at 6:00 PM on February 10, 2008

I was thinking of Bush's image as a guy people might wanna have a beer with, and then sort of that John Bolton might be fun to drink with in that funny cynical asshole kind of way

Come on now. You just know that Bolton would be exactly like Begbie in Trainspotting -- an asshole's asshole.
posted by clevershark at 6:11 PM on February 10, 2008 [2 favorites has favorites]

if the Republicans really want to nominate a woman as VP to balance out the presence of a white woman or a black man (or both?) on the Democratic side, they might as well nominate Lynndie England. I mean, Iraq veteran, single mom, nobody can possibly say she's soft on terrar -- the good copy writes itself.
posted by matteo at 6:23 PM on February 10, 2008 [5 favorites has favorites]

I liked Grace Jones much better when she was making albums.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 6:36 PM on February 10, 2008

matteo just made me laugh so hard I nearly choked on my pretzel.
posted by tula at 6:40 PM on February 10, 2008

So Loosefilter, is such a thing within the bounds of what's considered normal for university politics? The guys I worked with were certainly portraying it as something rather outlandish even given the norms of Stanford academia. Not to derail things here, but I'm curious.
posted by ooga_booga at 6:45 PM on February 10, 2008

Bruce Vilanch has a better shot.
posted by munchingzombie at 6:46 PM on February 10, 2008

The vitriol here makes me want to vote for her just to spite MetaFilter.
posted by hjo3 at 6:51 PM on February 10, 2008

The vitriol here makes me want to vote for her just to spite MetaFilter.

Whenever I read something like that I'm glad that people who (claim to) use this sort of logic when voting generally don't even bother to vote at all.
posted by clevershark at 7:02 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

That'll show us!
posted by Balisong at 7:08 PM on February 10, 2008

has there ever been a VP who had never run for any public office prior to being tapped for the no. 2 slot

Perot's VP . . . Adm Whatshisface.
posted by panamax at 7:08 PM on February 10, 2008

Whenever I read something like that I'm glad that people who (claim to) use this sort of logic when voting generally don't even bother to vote at all.

Gee, I must've been wrong about the vitriol.

My point is that you people need to lighten the fuck up and stop wishing death on politicians. But nursing your bitterness is good too, so maybe just stick with that.
posted by hjo3 at 7:09 PM on February 10, 2008

I'll vote for her hairdresser, before I ever vote for her as VP.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 7:18 PM on February 10, 2008

pppft. I do not gamble EVER, but I will donate $1000 to the RNC if Rice made it on any ticket. She is, frankly a political liability. Her inclusion on a R ticket it would just push more centrists away from McCain. He has enough trouble with the conservatives a candidate like this would ensure he does not win the middle, and whoever wins the middle wins the election.
posted by edgeways at 7:33 PM on February 10, 2008

Is that what being the worst National Security Advisor ever qualifies you for?
posted by pmurray63 at 7:46 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

if the Republicans really want to nominate a woman as VP to balance out the presence of a white woman or a black man (or both?) on the Democratic side, they might as well nominate Lynndie England. I mean, Iraq veteran, single mom, nobody can possibly say she's soft on terrar -- the good copy writes itself.

Holy fuck that's funny.
posted by delmoi at 8:00 PM on February 10, 2008

Think Condi

I think not.
posted by willie11 at 8:19 PM on February 10, 2008

The woman who shopped for shoes while New Orleans drowned? or perhaps we can go a little more recent: while Iraq drowned in chaos - as her own republicon staffers attest? Condi should be tried like the rest of the administration along with her old pal and sycophant Philip Zelikow
posted by specialk420 at 9:20 PM on February 10, 2008

Black vice president? It won't happen.
posted by Uther Bentrazor at 9:28 PM on February 10, 2008

Sure, she's an incompetent perjurer, but apparently you can bounce a quarter off her buttocks like a rocket.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:50 PM on February 10, 2008

So Loosefilter, is such a thing within the bounds of what's considered normal for university politics?

Depends on degree, I think. I've not heard of the perfunctory-meetings-followed-by-secret-real-ones before, but no, it's not uncommon to have all sorts of skullduggery and subterfuge in university politics--not to mention all the outright conflict. Universities can be crazy places to work.
posted by LooseFilter at 10:31 PM on February 10, 2008

While New Orleans drowned, Condi diddled.*


Can someone explain why that was bad besides for PR reasons? What exactly should a Secretary of State be doing during Katrina?
posted by gyc at 11:00 PM on February 10, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

has there ever been a VP who had never run for any public office prior to being tapped for the no. 2 slot

Just of those that won:
* Garfield won in 1880 with Chester Arthur, who had run the New York Customs House (then a very prominent position with influence approaching that of the future Secretary of Commerce). Arthur, of course, succeeded to the Presidency when Garfield was shot.
* Coolidge won in 1924 with Charles Gates Dawes, who had only run for US Senate but had served with distinction in federal appointed posts.
* Roosevelt won in 1940 with his Secretary of Agriculture (and farming innovator), Henry Wallace. (Roosevelt himself had only briefly been in the NY State Senate before his service as Asst. Secretary of the Navy, which led to his own nomination as VP in 1920.)

Losers include:
* Harrison lost in 1892 with Whitelaw Reid, publisher of the New York Tribune and an ambassador.
* Bryan lost in 1896 with Arthur Sewall, a marine industrialist.
* Alf Landon lost in 1936 running with Frank Knox, whose greatest qualification (at the time, he was SECNAV during WWII) seemed to be publishing the Chicago Daily News.
* McGovern lost in 1972 with Sargent Shriver, only briefly a serious gubernatorial candidate in Maryland (and a Kennedy in-law). He was a late draftee after Sen. Eagleton withdrew.

There might be a few more losers, but I think I got all the winners.
posted by dhartung at 12:50 AM on February 11, 2008 [2 favorites has favorites]

Think Condi
Uh.. you think Condi.

I'll think about my next drink.
posted by revmitcz at 1:44 AM on February 11, 2008

Think Condi, laugh hard, move on.
posted by From Bklyn at 3:05 AM on February 11, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

Shouldn't it be Think Condily? /grammarnazi
posted by hangashore at 5:11 AM on February 11, 2008

Thanks, dhartung. Awesome job. If they ever ask that trivia question on Talk of the Nation, I'll be ready for it. Panamax, mentioned Adm. James "What am I doing here" Stockdale, who ran with Perot, but I was only interested in elected VPs that had never before run for office.
posted by psmealey at 5:28 AM on February 11, 2008

What exactly should a Secretary of State be doing during Katrina?

ACT LIKE YOU GIVE A SHIT.
posted by mkultra at 8:21 AM on February 11, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

I'm genuinely curious - is there anything that Condi has been a success at during her roles in the Bush administration? Anything that people can easily point at and say "She sure got that right," or, "she did a good job on that issue"?
posted by Staggering Jack

She's been a failure at all she's attempted since her days at Stanford-- except for one thing.

I believe that when we finally know the truth about the inner workings of the Bush administration's foreign policy (which will be so bad vomiting will briefly eclipse baseball as the national pastime) we will discover that the only thing which stood between us and ABSOLUTE CATASTROPHE in the form of an attack on Iran was little Condi Rice all by her lonesome, and that we will all then prostrate ourselves at her feet in gratitude, if there is any justice left in the world.
posted by jamjam at 10:49 AM on February 11, 2008

jamjam writes "I believe that when we finally know the truth about the inner workings of the Bush administration's foreign policy (which will be so bad vomiting will briefly eclipse baseball as the national pastime) we will discover that the only thing which stood between us and ABSOLUTE CATASTROPHE in the form of an attack on Iran was little Condi Rice all by her lonesome, and that we will all then prostrate ourselves at her feet in gratitude, if there is any justice left in the world."

From what I understand, her personal foreign policy leanings are to the Powell Doctrine, but she's more loyal to her boss than her convictions in almost every case. Iran could indeed be an exception.
posted by krinklyfig at 5:37 PM on February 11, 2008

Aboard the Condoleezza Rice
posted by homunculus at 12:43 PM on February 13, 2008

Lord, I wish she would sometime.
posted by Pollomacho at 1:21 PM on February 13, 2008

Pyr asked
What exactly should a Secretary of State be doing during Katrina?

Well, off the top of my head, when the Bush junta abandoned a major American city, the Secretary of State might have picked up the goddam telephone and assured our allies and trading partners that the thousands of foreign nationals visiting New Orleans - and all the merchant shipping in port - were all accounted for and safe; or at least that we were moving heaven and earth to rescue them.

(Which would have been lies, of course, as the Bush administration didn't even care about the American citizens they were ignoring; but still, that was what she was supposed to be doing.)

More realistically, she could have made some calls to line up some emergency aid from our allies and neighbors - given that Bush's FEMA did nothing to help New Orleans. I'm sure that Cuba and Venezuela would have been happy to help. Hell, Haiti might have been more help than FEMA was.

Anyway, that's what the Secretary of State could have been doing: talking to the international community during a major disaster.

Instead, she flew to New York and went shopping while New Orleans drowned.
posted by AsYouKnow Bob at 9:59 PM on February 13, 2008

"gyc", of course; I apologize for getting the name wrong. (Don't know where that came from...)
posted by AsYouKnow Bob at 10:00 PM on February 13, 2008

the Secretary of State might have picked up the goddam telephone and assured our allies and trading partners that the thousands of foreign nationals visiting New Orleans

I can't speak for Secretary Rice personally, but I can tell you that it was my jod at DHS during Katrina to do this task for the thousands of foreign students in the entire region.
posted by Pollomacho at 4:36 AM on February 14, 2008

Actually it was my job, my jod at that time was to misspell words. I did a really good jod at that too.
posted by Pollomacho at 4:38 AM on February 14, 2008 [1 favorite has favorites]

Rep. Wexler Confronts Condoleezza Rice On Iraq War Lies; Demands Contempt Vote
posted by homunculus at 2:13 PM on February 14, 2008

The thought of McCain choosing Condi as a running mate to "get the black and female vote" is such a crude mockery that it reminds me of Microsoft's "Hello from Seattle" in response to Apple's "Designed in California".
posted by lostburner at 7:27 AM on February 15, 2008

The thought of McCain choosing Condi as a running mate to "get the black and female vote" is such a crude mockery

It's craven, but would it even work? I suspect that Condi's approval ratings among African-Americans are right about where Clarence Thomas's are.
posted by psmealey at 9:55 AM on February 15, 2008