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	<title>Comments on: Nature Aquariums</title>
	<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums/</link>
	<description>Comments on MetaFilter post Nature Aquariums</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:58:12 -0800</pubDate>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:58:12 -0800</lastBuildDate>
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	<item>
		<title>Nature Aquariums</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums</link>	
		<description>&lt;a href="http://www.adana-usa.com/"&gt;Nature Aquariums.&lt;/a&gt; Little plastic castle and bubbling treasure chest don&apos;t do it for you? Me neither. But the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.adana-usa.com/images/gallery0/25.jpg&quot;&gt;living&lt;/a&gt; &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.adana-usa.com/images/gallery0/10.jpg&quot;&gt;landscapes&lt;/a&gt; Aqua Forest Aquarium creates in fishtanks are &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.adana-usa.com/images/gallery0/21.jpg&quot;&gt;gorgeous&lt;/a&gt;. [&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.adana-usa.com/index.php?main_page=afa_portfolio&quot;&gt;Flash-based image gallery&lt;/a&gt;]</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">post:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:51:10 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>scarabic</dc:creator>		<category>aquariums</category>
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		<title>By: oneirodynia</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014782</link>	
		<description>These are beautiful. Exactly the sort of thing I&apos;ve been trying to do in my little aquariums.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014782</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 10:58:12 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>oneirodynia</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: mealy-mouthed</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014799</link>	
		<description>Takashi Amano&apos;s &lt;i&gt;Nature Aquarium World&lt;/i&gt; is a beautiful coffeetable book on this subject. I only have the first book, so I can&apos;t comment on the other two. Also, I read newer editions don&apos;t have the nice glossy paper.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014799</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:11:17 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>mealy-mouthed</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: R. Mutt</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014805</link>	
		<description>Those are pretty amazing.  The exact opposite of the deathtrap goldfish tanks of my youth.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014805</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:12:14 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>R. Mutt</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: DU</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014821</link>	
		<description>&lt;i&gt;The &lt;strike&gt;exact&lt;/strike&gt;apparent opposite of the deathtrap goldfish tanks of my youth.&lt;/i&gt;

Not that I&apos;m about to strike a blow of freedom for fish, but they are still enclosed for your enjoyment.  

But I like them.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014821</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:21:04 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>DU</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: StickyCarpet</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014830</link>	
		<description>If I gave my fish that many places to hide I&apos;d never see them.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014830</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:27:40 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>StickyCarpet</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: R. Mutt</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014833</link>	
		<description>&lt;small&gt;Actually, one of my childhood goldfish did try to jump to his .... freedom.  I saw him jump out and land on the desk, so I put him back in.   The next day, when I got home from school, he was dead on the desk.  &lt;/small&gt;</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014833</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:29:59 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>R. Mutt</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: ambrosia</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014844</link>	
		<description>&lt;i&gt;If I gave my fish that many places to hide I&apos;d never see them.&lt;/i&gt;

Funny,  you&apos;d think so, but when I gave my fish tons of thick plantings to hide in, I saw a lot more of them- I think they feel a lot more confident being out and about when there&apos;s a good hidey hole a short dash away.  

Takashi Amano&apos;s work is gorgeous, and has been a source of inspiration for years.  I&apos;d not yet stumbled upon Aqua Forest Aquarium, and I&apos;ll have to go check it out.  Great link, scarabic!</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014844</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:39:02 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>ambrosia</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: nzero</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014860</link>	
		<description>There is a &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.thefishstore.com/&quot;&gt;great place&lt;/a&gt; in Atlanta that is just like that.  I go there not so much to buy anything, so much as to relax on a couch in front of one of their saltwater aquariums and watch the fish while soothing music plays in the background.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014860</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:53:34 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>nzero</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: Muddler</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014876</link>	
		<description>This seems like a nice fresh water alternative to salt water tanks with coral if you are interested in a more beautiful landscape for your fish.

My questions are how much effort does this really take to do at home and just how expensive is it.  I didn&apos;t see a kit being sold on that website, which leads me to believe you&apos;d have to spend tons of hours reading up on this, many more hours contemplating what products to buy, then tallying it all up to find out you&apos;ll need a second job to pay for the thing (leaving you with no time to care for it).  

Anyone have any practical experience with these things?</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014876</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 11:59:06 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Muddler</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: jamjam</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014960</link>	
		<description>You know, I&apos;ve been wondering whether you might not be able to get really good-tasting drinking  water out of an aquarium with just the right balance of organisms, though I&apos;m not sure how many &lt;em&gt;fish&lt;/em&gt; I&apos;d want in there. 

I&apos;ve tried filtering of all kinds and it does get rid of a bunch of noxious tastes, but something is missing. The best-tasting water I can remember ever having came out of the tap of an old cabin on Mt. Hood in Oregon, stream fed and carried to the cabin in wooden pipes. I finally decided it must be chemicals the living things there were adding to the water that made it so good.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014960</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 12:46:36 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>jamjam</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: Area Control</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014967</link>	
		<description>A lot of these folks use supplemental CO2 in their tanks to get the plants to grow so lushly.  Haven&apos;t taken that plunge myself.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014967</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 12:49:43 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Area Control</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: WinnipegDragon</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014971</link>	
		<description>I think &lt;a href=&quot;http://fish.mongabay.com/images/bigtank.jpg&quot;&gt;this&lt;/a&gt; is Takashi Amano&apos;s signature tank.

I&apos;m an aquarium nut.  Planted tanks upstairs, and a 120g Reef tank on the go in the basement.  The man is a god in my circles.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014971</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 12:51:09 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>WinnipegDragon</dc:creator>
	</item>	<item>
		<title>By: WinnipegDragon</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2014984</link>	
		<description>&lt;em&gt;This seems like a nice fresh water alternative to salt water tanks with coral if you are interested in a more beautiful landscape for your fish.&lt;/em&gt;

Both rely on a lot of specialized gear, and careful attention to water parameters.  Coral reefs are a little more expensive, but easier to keep in balance in my experience.

&lt;em&gt;Anyone have any practical experience with these things?&lt;/em&gt;

Sure.  What do you want to know?

The basics are very clean water, filters that do not over oxygenate the water, a good clean up crew, excellent lighting, rigid and controlled dosing of fertilizers, and CO2 supplementation.  All very easy to accomplish in a home aquarium, but hard to keep in balance.

Fortunately, many options exist for smaller aquariums now, and with the increased interest in &apos;home hydroponics&apos; lighting and other gear is readily accessible.

&lt;em&gt;You know, I&apos;ve been wondering whether you might not be able to get really good-tasting drinking water out of an aquarium with just the right balance of organisms, though I&apos;m not sure how many fish I&apos;d want in there. &lt;/em&gt;

Not at all.  The plants do a good job of filtering out the fish waste, but the water is still not suitable for consumption.  Like, rinse-your-mouth-out-with-Listerine-if-you-get-a-mouthful-while-siphoning bad.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2014984</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 12:57:32 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>WinnipegDragon</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: Salmonberry</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2015021</link>	
		<description>Those are cool. I like big, huge aquariums. I think they&apos;re really neat. That&apos;s the kind of thing I&apos;d do if I were rich....put giant aquariums in my house and pay people to take care of them.

But I&apos;m not rich, and I am lazy. As pretty as these are I doubt they&apos;d thrive in my home. Ah well.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2015021</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 13:20:07 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Salmonberry</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: Dr. Curare</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2015055</link>	
		<description>Scarabic, you just killed my 6 months in the making first post, now you get to see me rant :)

It was planted aquarium folks the first people I met after moving to San Francisco. They were very generous and friendly. In the pictures of your desks thread you&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.flickr.com/photos/22995944@N08/2200932486&quot;&gt; can see a tiny tank&lt;/a&gt; where I keep some of the most exotic anubias and mosses I have. If you are interested, join your local planted aquarium group. It will save you a lot of money and trouble.

I have a few issues with this post. You only linked to Aqua Forest. They have pretty looking tanks, but they are EXTRMELY expensive. If you are to believe Amano, and AF, you need a $400 tank with $500 lights, a $250 filter, $200 in CO2 tank an regulator, $120 in substrate, $100 in test kits and a lifetime addiction to expensive fertilizers. Hell, they even sell &quot;Amazon Forest&quot; scented CO1! Enough to discourage newcomers. Aqua Forest is good for inspiration, but you don&apos;t rally need such top quality stuff.

You can get equally impressive aquariums investing less than $100. 6th Avenue Aquarium sells acrylic tanks at $1 per gallon, but don&apos;t buy any live stuff there. You can do DIY CO2 with yeast and sugar, and you can use normal CF bulbs if you don&apos;t go for the very high light plants. Take a look at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.tropica.com/default.asp&quot;&gt;Tropica&apos;s&lt;/a&gt; list of plants to see all the options.

Then go stock at  &lt;a href=&quot;http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&amp;safe=active&amp;client=firefox-a&amp;rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&amp;resnum=0&amp;um=1&amp;ie=UTF-8&amp;q=ocean+aquarium&amp;near=San+Francisco,+CA&amp;fb=1&amp;view=text&amp;latlng=37786325,-122420174,14123472421797889463&quot;&gt;Ocean Aquarium&lt;/a&gt;. They don&apos;t have a website, the aquarium is in a dirty alley full of crackheads, but Justin LOVES his tanks and is a real expert. He will quarantine everything, and would rather not make $300 than sell fish to an unqualified customer (witnessed this a few times). When I cam for a job interview in San Francisco, not knowing if I was ever going to be her again, I used my free afternoon to go to Ocean Aquarium. Even in the backwoods of Mexico we know that this is the best place to go this side of Singapore and Japan.

Also, the Amano style is not the only impressive style in planted aquariums. Amano style is expensive and very labor intensive.In the cabinet under the tanks there is a lot of equipment to keep the water clear, and everything needs to be trimmed, replanted and cleaned at least weekly. The other extreme of the spectrum is a filter less, heavily planted tank with few fish, where you setup with as many species as possible, and keep what survives in your particular location. I don&apos;t have all the links handy, but if I ever get motivated enough, I may make a post on very low tech planted aquariums.

If anyone in S.F. wants to get started on this, contact me. I have a spare filter or two, and some plant cuttings. I have more Java Moss and Ferns than I can use.</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2015055</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 13:49:26 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dr. Curare</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: Dr. Curare</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2015064</link>	
		<description>Forgot to link to the &lt;a href=&quot;http://showcase.aquatic-gardeners.org/2007.cgi&quot;&gt;AGA galleries&lt;/a&gt;. You can see all kinds of styles, like &lt;a href=&quot;http://showcase.aquatic-gardeners.org/2004.cgi?&amp;op=showcase&amp;category=1&amp;vol=-1&amp;id=92&quot;&gt;this&lt;/a&gt; or &lt;a href=&quot;http://showcase.aquatic-gardeners.org/2005.cgi?&amp;Scale=3&amp;op=showcase&amp;category=1&amp;vol=-1&amp;id=109&quot;&gt;this&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2015064</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 13:55:44 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dr. Curare</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: jamaro</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2015067</link>	
		<description>The forums at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/&quot;&gt;plantedtank&lt;/a&gt; are a decent info source, too. 

/keeper of carnivorous aquatic greenery: utricularias, aldrovanda</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2015067</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 13:57:45 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>jamaro</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: scarabic</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2015227</link>	
		<description>Thanks for all the added links, everyone. I had no idea this was such a genre out there!</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2015227</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 15:38:36 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>scarabic</dc:creator>
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		<title>By: susanbeeswax</title>
		<link>http://www.metafilter.com/69111/Nature-Aquariums#2015600</link>	
		<description>Well.  There went my evening.  From plantedtank, I ended up at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.plantgeek.com&quot;&gt;PlantGeek&lt;/a&gt; &amp;amp; that&apos;s always the end for me.  Someday I will have a lush beautiful tank or three like those...</description>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">comment:www.metafilter.com,2008:site.69111-2015600</guid>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 23:53:54 -0800</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>susanbeeswax</dc:creator>
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