Comments on: Now, here's the way I work...

Now, here's the way I work...

miss lynnster — Thu, 26 Jun 2008 23:58:06 -0800

Meet Dmitri. He's a complete catch. Women approach him 6-7 times a day.

By: maryh

maryh — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:11:09 -0800

I must say, I don't really care for this fellow. Of course, I am a timid woman. And psychologically abnormal. I may even have been abused as a child. I leave it up to some worthier elegante to reel in this catch. now THAT'S a chicago accent. I can actually hear his bushy cop 'stache.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:15:16 -0800

If you don't call me by 3.00pm tomorrow, Miss Lynnster, you can lose my number. Who posts a FPP on Metafilter, and then doesn't sleep with every single one of the fedora-sporting stalkers that respond in the thread? I'm a catch ferchrist's sake. I make good money, I'm great in bed, I hit on women in the street and they *all* do my bidding. Look into the eyes, look into the eyes. When I snap my fingers, you will be wake up as though nothing has happened, but you will be completely under my control. You will favourite every single one of my posts, and you will post an Askme looking for suggestions as to the best way of persuading me to fall in love with you. Sleepy, sleepy, sleepy... *snap* Don't forget what I said now. 3.00pm tomorrow.

By: davejay

davejay — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:16:46 -0800

Now, Miss Lynnster, I figure I'd better leave you a detailed comment and explain why I favorited you. I'm a MeFite, I have no trouble finding FPPs to read, people post FPPs for me maybe 6, 7 times a day, but I'm ver particular about what I like to read. Your FPP is extremely elegant. I couldn't take my eyes off of it and your Contacts were very jealous, so even if they say they weren't, they were very envious of the fact that I favorited your FPP, and I was very taken by your FPP.

By: GavinR

GavinR — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:16:59 -0800

Uh...yeah....Gawker and all that

By: davejay

davejay — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:18:34 -0800

nobody says "call me", hands a person a business card, and then doesn't return calls. Wait, I thought everybody did that. Except people without business cards; they write their number on the back of your hand, then don't return calls.

By: dersins

dersins — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:25:08 -0800

I dunno why, but I suspect shenanigans.

By: maryh

maryh — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:31:21 -0800

Some men trawl for women, this guy trolls for women.

By: fourcheesemac

fourcheesemac — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:33:32 -0800

Lame assed post about a lame assed hoax. Get the hook.

By: stavrogin

stavrogin — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:37:30 -0800

Dmitri the Lover and The Toronto Real Men.

By: kanewai

kanewai — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:40:40 -0800

I don't buy it. It's too "I got this from a friend of a friend" to not be a hoax.

By: tula

tula — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:59:42 -0800

Pepsi Blue Balls.

By: orthogonality

orthogonality — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 01:09:31 -0800

Gah. Face now set in permanent cringe. Will send bill to miss lynster.

By: loquacious

loquacious — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 01:15:51 -0800

CHOOSE YOUR OWN ~~ADVENTURE~~ COMMENT: A) This has to be fake.* B) Oh, why isn't he being punched in the mouth repeatedly? C) A and B. *speaking as someone who fell for a virus recently. Guh.

By: Blazecock Pileon

Blazecock Pileon — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 01:17:03 -0800

I'd hit it.

By: BrotherCaine

BrotherCaine — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 01:32:31 -0800

NOOOOOOOOOOO!

By: ooga_booga

ooga_booga — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 01:36:14 -0800

Yet another self-styled "Pick Up Artist". I remember reading about him on Metachat quite a while ago and someone just mentioned this link to me at a dinner party earlier this evening. Quite weird to see him pop up here on the blue. He seems more like the kind of guy who propositions every woman he meets with the expectation that at least one out of the many he asks will relent. It also seems that he's trying to pimp his services as a pick up artist guru, so click on the following links at your own peril. Official web site of Dmitri The Lover. Article in the Eye . The Metachat thread where one Mefite describes her online personals encounter with this fellow.. And, most importantly, Dimitri the Lover's very own Livejournal.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 01:40:55 -0800

I can actually hear his bushy cop 'stache. Ladies, I only wear this bushy cop 'stache because I sure do love cunnilingus.

By: weapons-grade pandemonium

weapons-grade pandemonium — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 01:52:33 -0800

One of my friend's from work and her friend were out one night in the SF Marina district and were hanging outside of the bars trying to find a cab. One of the girl's, Olga... Correction: One of the girl's Olgum. Two of the girl's Olga.

By: EatTheWeak

EatTheWeak — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 02:32:41 -0800

Each subsequent Dimitri the Lover link that is posted only confuses me further. I want to call shenanigans, cuz really, who talks and acts like that? It crosses out of "creepy" and into pathology just a few paragraphs into that frightening livejournal. On the other hand, he seems to have spent an awful lot of time on this persona - above and beyond the average prank, to be sure. Either way, the entertainment and the ick values are pretty high.

By: churl

churl — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 02:40:23 -0800

I was laughing at this until I read his livejournal. Ooga_booga linked it upthread. Listen to me. Do not read this man's livejournal. Please take my word for it. Do not read the horrible things I am about to quote. Skip this comment entirely.

My secret? Using criteria I developed over many years, I chose to only approach women which displayed a certain style and gait indicative of a SLUT DESPERATE FOR COMPANIONSHIP, then customized my opening lines to each slut's unique psychological profile.

Oh god you are reading this. I told you not to read this. Stop right now. For the love of christ, no matter what you do, do not read this horrid coup de grâce.

I FULFILLED EVERY MAN’S FANTASY! Yes, I’ve had mother/daughter threesomes twice and sister/sister threesomes half a dozen times, with full blown incest every time.

Lord I swear he goes on. He describes the incest. I cannot bring myself to quote it here. It is so bad. There is mothers and daughters and semen and everything. It is extremely bad. There are certain extremely bad things in this world, and this man is one of those things.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 02:47:48 -0800

That stuff about him being a doctor who was disbarred for inappropriate conduct is just insane. I mean doctors generally *are* thought of as being a catch. Presumably, unless he looks like that Therapy Cat that doesn't have a face, he wouldn't have any trouble getting dates, so why cross those professional boundaries unless you're sexually compulsive? If the doctor stuff is true, then perhaps the high IQ stuff is true as well? There's a definite Aspergic quality to his whole schtick. I mean, if he's as smart as he thinks/says he is, then now come he can't figure out how genuinely repellant he comes across to anybody who isn't totally and utterly desperate? And probably to those as well? Perhaps those geeks who inappropriately embrace the aspergic label as an explanation for their social incompetence should be getting worried when they see this stuff. Women might start associating you with Dmitri the Lover, and then you'll be even worse off than simply being dismissed as being a common-or-garden geek.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 02:48:16 -0800

"passive-aggressive personality disorder, you should look it up." WE HAVE A WINNER! I AWARD DIMITRI THE FIRST ANNUAL UBUROIVAS AWARD FOR OUTSTANDING ACHIEVEMENT IN THE FIELD OF AWESOME SELF-REFERENTIAL IRONIC HUMOUR! (either that, or he's a clueless fucktard, i'm not sure which)

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 02:49:40 -0800

I look at women as “tri-orificed beings” What, you let the nostrils and the ear-holes go to waste? Amateur!

By: nudar

nudar — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 02:50:38 -0800

I'm a catch There's nothing wrong with me Yeah... you keep telling yourself that dude. Bahh.

By: Phanx

Phanx — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 02:55:36 -0800

Viral promotion for new Sacha Baron Cohen character.

By: wigglin

wigglin — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 03:03:39 -0800

Does anyone else feel sorry for the guy? The way he comes across is almost at a mentally ill level of social ineptness. He has probably had a really hard time connecting with people his entire life, and it seems unlikely that he will ever have a emotionally fulfilling relationship with anyone. Well, that's my pop psychology analysis of the guy at least. I guess I could just call him a creeper and move on. Either way, sad. Just sad.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 03:07:28 -0800

i'm on the fence whether Phanx or wigglin are correct. it can only be one or the other.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 03:39:53 -0800

from the MetaChat thread (ok, maybe somebody signed up as him for a joke, but the shtick is the same): "Chemistry" is pure phermones. If you don't believe it, try to meet a guy like me for a coffee and compare him to the "nice guys" with hidden agendas. I guarantee that it will be an eye opener. I sure hope so. In particular, I expect that with your medical degree & 170 IQ you will explain to me why - if chemistry is pure phermones (sic) - any of the pickup techniques you pimp online are worth a cent? Or why you bother spamming girls on their phones & dating accounts, if it all comes down to how you 'smell' to our pheromone receptors? Surely you could bypass all that spammy bullshit & all the transparent 'psychology' therein & just walk through a shopping mall without having showered for a week & have the women jump you? That is what you're saying, right? Or do you just use fancy-sounding terms that you don't actually understand, yet alone know how to spell?

By: crapmatic

crapmatic — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 04:54:57 -0800

Let this not be viral marketing.

By: mattoxic

mattoxic — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 05:23:44 -0800

What could it be viral marketing for? Douchebag insurance? A lesbian collective? I hope it is viral marketing. I want to know

By: h00py

h00py — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 05:37:23 -0800

I would just like to say, right here, right now, that I would not hit that. Even if I was elegant.

By: waraw

waraw — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 05:53:19 -0800

Damn you hoopy!

By: h00py

h00py — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 06:06:12 -0800

I said I wouldn't! That doesn't count, surely? Plus I'm a girl! Um.. okay, now I'm being sexist. Sorry, cooter-counters.

By: asok

asok — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 06:17:33 -0800

h00py, maybe he's so hot he's making you sexist?

By: revgeorge

revgeorge — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 06:20:51 -0800

Doesn't matter h00py: Blazecock beat you to it.

By: 256

256 — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 06:24:58 -0800

i'm a torontonian and i can assure you that this guy is 100% for real. uborovias: repellent as it may be, the technique he recommends is entirely consistent with with "it's all pheromones" theory. basically, he's working under the assumption that all he has to do is get a girl feeling comfortable in private and she won't be able to resist him. his "method" is pretty much just to get himself into that situation as quickly as possible.

By: Nelson

Nelson — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 06:31:47 -0800

Does anyone else feel sorry for the guy? No. I'm annoyed at the way things are made off and passed as real on the Internet.

By: wundermint

wundermint — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 06:32:03 -0800

I think the part that bothered me the most was that his name is Dmitri, he's "Greek", and he has a Canadian accent. Funny stuff.

By: loiseau

loiseau — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 06:40:45 -0800

It's definitely not viral marketing, y'all. This guy's been advertising in Toronto for a few years. I had to read the link to know what we were talking about at first, but once I did it was like, "Oh, that guy." If you find this kind of thing creepilicious you should read "The Game: Penetrating The Secret Society of Pickup Artists" by Neil Strauss -- but I must say that as a woman and a feminist I really wish I hadn't. It infuriated and in fact upset me for weeks after I finished.

By: Christ, what an asshole

Christ, what an asshole — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 06:56:59 -0800

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 06:59:01 -0800

loiseau - if it's any consolation, this kind of juvenile bullshit upsets me as well, speaking as a man and a masculist. as far as i could see from a quick internet skim, this pathetic dickhead will use whatever schmoozy lie or technique he can find just to 'score some pussy, mate'. he reminds me of a guy i used to live with. a 40-something ex-advertising exec, his wife (from mid 20s onwards) divorced him, and he spent his time fucking anything that moved. no standards, no shame. same cynical approach. smart enough to be able to do it, but nowhere near smart enough for self reflection. acknowledging that IQ is a bunch of bullshit, imagine somebody around 120 with a shitty agenda to achieve. that was him, and i swear it's this Dimitri wanker.

By: saysthis

saysthis — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:00:27 -0800

Yeah, I was going to mention "The Game" too. These guys are a dime-a-dozen. My favorite part about that book was that toward the end all the women on the Strip had heard the lines before. I really hope these things get more popular, actually, so that at some point every single woman will be able to spot techniques like this from a mile away and then we can be done with this schtick as a society. HEY BABY DO YOU BELIEVE IN PALM READING?

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:01:20 -0800

(i swear it's *the same deal as with* this Dimitri wanker)

By: fuse theorem

fuse theorem — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:08:28 -0800

You'd think these guys would be ruining their "game" be becoming so public about it. Uh oh, on the Internet, they do know you're a dog.

By: nola

nola — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:08:30 -0800

I don't know why I didn't just put my coffee down while I listened to that but now my bib overalls are covered in Ecuadorian-Sumatra-French-hazelnut roast.

By: Jody Tresidder

Jody Tresidder — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:09:46 -0800

It disturbed you that much to learn that men seek to get laid, and in some cases pull out all the stops? There's women out there who eat men just the same. It's human nature. It's lucky, then, that human nature tends to favor men who pull out all stops because they actually like women, Christ, what an asshole Even feminists can be charmed into bed, you know!

By: goshling

goshling — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:12:15 -0800

He appears to like attention, and he joined mecha to respond to the thread about him there, so I am predicting that he will somehow be summoned here by the mention of his name, will fork out his $5 and will respond to this thread also.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:18:07 -0800

Ecuadorian-Sumatra-French-hazelnut roast? that blend shows elegance. you know, i'm totally freaking awesome, like, i knock back doctorate scholarships at the Sorbonne on a daily basis, but i've just come out of a long distance relationship, like, twelve years ago, but i'm like 26 & really buff & i have a humungous 7" cock and own twenty seven shelf companies, and like, what was your name again? *shit, i departed from the script. don't show ANY interest in them as a person, only demean them enough to make them feel priviliged to be on the receiving end of your bukkake* (damn, did i say that aloud?)

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:19:20 -0800

(privileged. the i was freudian)

By: Christ, what an asshole

Christ, what an asshole — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:38:05 -0800

[It disturbed you that much to learn that men seek to get laid, and in some cases pull out all the stops? There's women out there who eat men just the same. It's human nature.] It's lucky, then, that human nature tends to favor men who pull out all stops because they actually like women, Christ, what an asshole Even feminists can be charmed into bed, you know! I am completely lost on the tone and insinuations of this point. Is it a counter-point? Someone smarter than me help me out here...

By: cowbellemoo

cowbellemoo — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:39:47 -0800

boy. I hope my gait looks slutty.

By: chunking express

chunking express — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:40:20 -0800

Bizarre. I live in Toronto, but have managed to avoid hearing about this dude all this time. Damn you MetaFilter.

By: availablelight

availablelight — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:44:38 -0800

What could it be viral marketing for? Douchebag insurance? A lesbian collective? I hope it is viral marketing. I want to know If you go to his website he's got a bunch of "projects" (documentary, reality TV show, etc) "coming in 2009" so I think this is yet another tiresome viral. I saw this on gawker and and am disappointed to see it followed here as well. Also, yaaah, a pickup artist with a Canadian accent, dontcha know, makes me giggle. What a hoser, eh?

By: Christ, what an asshole

Christ, what an asshole — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:47:53 -0800

You'd think these guys would be ruining their "game" be becoming so public about it. Uh oh, on the Internet, they do know you're a dog. But they have something to sell. And you think their clientele are rooting for or against them? All publicity is good publicity. He appears to like attention, and he joined mecha to respond to the thread about him there, so I am predicting that he will somehow be summoned here by the mention of his name, will fork out his $5 and will respond to this thread also. Common sense would suggest otherwise, but he isn't the most socially-astute guy out there, so I wouldn't be surprised. He will get reamed. He already comes off as a desperate wanker that will spend more time on a call leaving messages than in the time he talked face-to-face with the woman. It's embarrassing. He probably violated several dozen principles of the "techniques" he espouses. The funniest part for me is the radio interview he leaves on his homepage. He admits he has low standards in women, and the best he could get was a long-distance relationship from some woman he met on the internet. The radio DJs go on to mock him. And this is the shining endorsement he leaves for people to hear? I honestly thought it was a joke.

By: cog_nate

cog_nate — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 07:51:10 -0800

Could somebody please please introduce Dimitri to Aleksey Vayner? I'm sure they'd hit it off right away, then go around bench pressing the shit out of things, running charities and corporations, diagnosing passive-aggressive personality disorder, solving mysteries and bagging elegant women. They never play games, because nothing is impossible. Let the romance begin.

By: quin

quin — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:01:34 -0800

"there's nothing wrong with me" When I was still a part of the dating scene, I used this tactic all the time. I would approach a good looking young lady and say "I'm not contagious. When we get naked, it may look a little red and blotchy, but don't worry, you won't catch anything. Other than pleasure, naturally. That's just a given. I mean, I'm all kinds of awesome, and I'm not disease ridden. So you'll have nothing to worry about when we are knocking boots later. I'm not a serial killer either. So there is no chance that I will murder you and have sex repeatedly with your corpse, no matter how attractive you may look with all the blood drained out of you. Out of curiosity, how far do you live from the river? Hey, do you have a roommate half as attractive as you? Because I sure do love threesomes. By the way, what's your name?" For some reason, girls would never call me back. I bet it they were afraid their roommates would see me and try to steal me away. In fact, I'm sure that's it.

By: rmless

rmless — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:04:28 -0800

Elegant women are very rare. I'm Greek. He sounds like Markov Filter sometimes.

By: rusty

rusty — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:05:48 -0800

Ecuadorian-Sumatra-French-hazelnut roast? That's just wrong in so many ways. * Mixing Ecuadorian and Sumatra? Why? If you know the origins why not have them separately and enjoy the distinct differences? I mean, the Ecuador is probably a pretty balanced Central American cup, and the Sumatra would have more of a funky rustic character. So you've basically just made diluted Sumatra. The real reason that coffee is blended is to cover up defects in the source lots. Take a hopelessly bland Ecuador and mix it with a baggy, moldy last-year's Sumatra and you get something you can maybe serve at the truckstop without Butch and Bubba walking out in disgust. * And then French roasted it, like every other Starbucks-influenced 'tard who thinks "burnt" is the way Good Coffee tastes. If you wanted to burn it, why not use the cheapest shit you could find? Oh wait. See above. You did. That's why. * And as if it weren't already ruined twice, you sprayed some chemical extract shit on it so it doesn't smell like coffee anymore. Not that it did, after you burned it, but maybe there'd be a hint left. But not after you mask it with your air freshener spray. PROTIP: Lysol's cheaper than hazelnut extract, and the effect is the same. Perhaps the hazelnut spray is to mask the Lysol residue. In any case, you should be grateful. Staining overalls brown is the optimal use for that swill.

By: Divine_Wino

Divine_Wino — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:14:27 -0800

You know what a terrible job would be? Having to do the psychological forensics on how a person gets like this, sifting through the awful banal garbage dump of their history. That having been said I'd probably love to watch a PBS Nova type show that breaks down the biomechanics of the gait of a slut. What is that? Knock-kneed? Tip-toe? Kinda a chicken walk type of thing? "Ah, the spacing of the steps, skittish but determined, a mincing wobbly gait, the fragments of leopard print material, see here a Virginia Slim butt with brown lipstick traces. A slut Watson, our culprit is a slut!"

By: weezy

weezy — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:17:13 -0800

"now THAT'S a chicago accent. I can actually hear his bushy cop 'stache." Actually it's a textbook Toronto accent, which is a little different from the stereotypical Canuck accent. It's the Chicago-style abruptness combined with the Hoser-style pronunciations that makes it Toronto. ...and what a douchebag!

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:22:34 -0800

rusty: i never say this kind of thing, but your taste in coffee is exquisite. i should know - i'm mongolian, and we are passionate about our coffee. do you dare memail me, you cowardly asexual piece of shit? i can understand if you're a jehova's witness with repulsive tumours cascading down your face - in which case, fuck off and die because I don't work that way - but otherwise, what the hell is wrong with you if you refuse to bathe in my golden shower? xxxoooxxx dimitrithelover.

By: nola

nola — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:22:40 -0800

rusty I can only hope you makin' a joke about coffee too. If not I should come clean and tell you, I don't really know what it was I was drinking, except that it was dark and hot and made of coffee.

By: popcassady

popcassady — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:26:39 -0800

Do you like Phil Collins? I've been a big Genesis fan ever since the release of their 1980 album, Duke. Before that, I really didn't understand any of their work. Too artsy, too intellectual. It was on Duke where, uh, Phil Collins' presence became more apparent. I think Invisible Touch was the group's undisputed masterpiece. It's an epic meditation on intangibility. At the same time, it deepens and enriches the meaning of the preceding three albums.

By: orange swan

orange swan — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:32:32 -0800

Oh gaaaaawwwd. I'm the MeChazen who posted about my Lavalife (AND Plenty of Fish) encounter with this... this... person. In my many varied experiences with online dating, this really was one for the books. His weirdly entrepreneurial, astoundingly egotistical, and misogynist approach to dating left me petrified. I'd mostly managed to block it from my memory, until I saw this thread.

By: rmless

rmless — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:36:25 -0800

orange swan- How did he know to approach you? He can't see your slutty gait from the internets... Or did he ask you to post a video of you walking by?

By: delmoi

delmoi — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:36:33 -0800

Well it sounds like it is viral marketing, wherein the product is sex with Dimitri. Or does it need to be ironic and insincere to be considered viral?

By: the cydonian

the cydonian — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:46:44 -0800

I refuse to believe this dude is a playa. I've known playas, I don't understand their kind, but have met them on quite a few occasions, and have been told that one of the top tenets of their belief-system is to never leave a voice-message, much less two. Apparently, such an act of banal servitude messes up their game quite a bit or some such thing. Instead, they leave SMS'es.

By: Christ, what an asshole

Christ, what an asshole — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:47:10 -0800

Yelling "viral!" seems to be the new knee-jerk to anything that defies comprehension, which is pretty stupid considering how avant-garde most postmodern artforms are.

By: xod

xod — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 08:48:40 -0800

I love dogs, chocolate, food, and chiropractors. He's a surrealist.

By: orange swan

orange swan — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:01:12 -0800

He's been doing this for a very long time. I remember seeing his pink posters tacked to telephone poles when I first moved to Toronto back in 1992.

By: sevenyearlurk

sevenyearlurk — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:04:19 -0800

Dmitri used to post in the tor.eats USENET newsgroup... if you do a search for "Dmitri the Greek Stud" you can check out some of his restaurant reviews.

By: rmless

rmless — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:08:17 -0800

It's viral in the sense that it makes me want to throw up, like the virus that's been going around my office recently.

By: zarah

zarah — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:12:30 -0800

If you go to his website he's got a bunch of "projects" (documentary, reality TV show, etc) "coming in 2009" so I think this is yet another tiresome viral. So far I can't find any evidence that these projects are in any stage of production. This guy has been trying hard for a long time with very poor results, so I'd be shocked to find any production company behind any of his dorky ideas. Unless someone wants to use him for an unwitting train wreck/comedy show. Like an old guy version of Keys to the VIP. Anyway, I apologize if someone has already posted this link, as I didn't have time to read the whole thread but just had to jump in, since I have run into this douche several times over the last few years. His real name is James Sears and he really was a doctor, stripped of his license for sexual impropriety. I cannot believe anyone falls for his bullshit in person, because from 100 paces he reeks of crazy old guy.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:19:24 -0800

Listen folks, we shouldn't be so snarky. If we can attract his 170 IQ over here and have him do the IQ test, we might finally be able to make Metafilter the website with the highest IQ!

By: weapons-grade pandemonium

weapons-grade pandemonium — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:32:26 -0800

I notice you're doing your part, Peter.

By: quin

quin — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:36:10 -0800

Here is a look inside one of his classes.

By: msalt

msalt — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:40:40 -0800

Even feminists can be charmed into bed, you know! Really!? That's very intriguing. Tell me more...

By: miss lynnster

miss lynnster — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:50:15 -0800

Hey guys. I'm back. What did I miss? I was outside... some guy in a furry hat and puka shells told me there was an insane fight going on out there. Something about two girls pulling eachother's hair and stuff. Crazy! But then when I went out there, I didn't see anything. Weird. Guess I missed all the action. Damn.

By: Vindaloo

Vindaloo — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 09:56:37 -0800

Even feminists can be charmed into bed, you know! Lies! All lies! Huh... what are we talking about again?

By: Christ, what an asshole

Christ, what an asshole — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:04:04 -0800

By: Blazecock Pileon

Blazecock Pileon — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:04:56 -0800

Listen folks, we shouldn't be so snarky. That sounds what like some smart city fellar talk. Get 'im boys!

By: effbot

effbot — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:12:32 -0800

I notice you're doing your part Nice diagram. Is it just me, or does that site appear to be built by the same guys that created that Crates game?

By: Caduceus

Caduceus — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:16:59 -0800

I die a little inside when I think that anyone could possibly fall for his bullshit.

By: Jody Tresidder

Jody Tresidder — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:28:29 -0800

Even feminists can be charmed into bed, you know! Really!? That's very intriguing. Tell me more... You had me at "Really!?..." msalt:)

By: lunit

lunit — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:33:50 -0800

Yeah, but the fedora is so hard to resist.

By: dirtynumbangelboy

dirtynumbangelboy — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:37:41 -0800

Oh my God, this guy.. wow. I'm honestly surprised that he's still pulling the same old shtick. As for The Game (which you just lost, btw), I'd only ever heard about it until recently, had never seen it in action. Then a couple weeks ago I was heading home from seeing Sex and the City, and ended up sitting on the subway opposite these two guys. They were talking about something--it seemed like business talk at first, but then I realized they were talking about the Game. They were going on and on about "I used all seven of my opens" and a whole bunch more BS. It was kind of sad. I mean, first that they want to get girls into bed with them through manipulation rather than honesty, which just seems deeply weird to me. Second because they were decent-looking guys. Well.. correction: one was decent-looking, nothing to write home about, but nothing to sneeze at. The other was so spectacularly gorgeous in a wholesome-boy-next-door-with-a-glint-in-his-eye kind of way that I was frankly astonished that he would ever need to do anything other than say "Hi" to get more ass than a toilet seat. I mean, I can understand--I guess--when you're an average-looking guy, or below average, or whatnot. The human desire to get laid is incredibly strong, and of course people will do pretty much anything to get some. Which doesn't do anything to change the sleaze factor of this--sex as a competitive sport, rather than as something fun--nor does it answer the question of why you would rather use Jedi mind tricks to get someone into bed. I mean really.. pay for a professional. It's more honest, at least. But when you are stunningly good-looking, it just makes absolutely no sense at all.

By: chunking express

chunking express — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:37:44 -0800

I die a little inside when I think that anyone could possibly fall for his bullshit. There are lots of gullible people out there. And lonely people. And sad people. And horny people. etc.

By: Caduceus

Caduceus — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:42:11 -0800

What the hell? There's nothing wrong with fedoras. How did fedoras even enter this conversation?

By: dirtynumbangelboy

dirtynumbangelboy — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:49:19 -0800

Caduceus, that's a reference to an epic-fail AskMe thread from a few months ago.

By: Gary

Gary — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:53:40 -0800

Yelling "viral!" seems to be the new knee-jerk to anything that defies comprehension, which is pretty stupid considering how avant-garde most postmodern artforms are. Because we're sick and tired of everything cool, interesting or just plain bizarre turning out to be an ad. "It was crazy! I was walking home and saw a giraffe in the middle of the street smoking a joint while blind hobos danced the jitterbug around him." "Oh, that. They're introducing the McWaffle".

By: adipocere

adipocere — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 10:56:52 -0800

I've said similar things before, but if manipulation and lack of honesty when it comes to getting someone to date/mate with you is bad for men to do, carefully examine the magazines in the checkout aisle at a grocery store. No, skip the Home & Garden and the celebrity rags, check out the ones with makeup tips (honest?) and the "10 Ways to Make Him ..." checklists. Granted, I've only seen a few episodes of Sex in the City, but I don't recall any of the women showing at a first date without any makeup on, playing it straight with the guys, and breaking wind when they feel the urge. Maybe I missed that one. You can call it "putting your best foot forward" or you can call it Jedi mind tricks (I am the droid you're looking for, baby!), but attracting someone has long been about being less than perfectly truthful for everyone who isn't completely gorgeous, brilliant, charming, and overloaded with cash. Lots of sins of omission and manipulation. If it's good for the goose, I see no reason why the gander cannot do the same. This guy's only crime is that he's gloriously unsubtle and floats somewhere between comical and repellent. This is partially him, and partially because this current phase of the Pick-Up Artist hasn't matured and become so commonplace that it is as invisible as foundation, high heels, and a touch of rouge. That and apparently deceiving someone for *gasp* sex is somehow more sleazy than getting a guy to "commit" to "where the relationship is going" (translation: it's going to the altar, then the maternity ward, and then the grave. The question is never truly where only if and when).

By: effbot

effbot — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:09:54 -0800

Because we're sick and tired of everything cool, interesting or just plain bizarre turning out to be an ad. Agreed. Finding out that the great band Devo was just viral for a Happy Meal (video) campaign done to promote American Idol definitely ruined my day.

By: dirtynumbangelboy

dirtynumbangelboy — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:14:15 -0800

You can call it "putting your best foot forward" or you can call it Jedi mind tricks There is a vast gulf of difference between the two. Manipulating someone into bed is, I think, fairly universally condemned as reprehensible behaviour, whatever the genders of the people involved are. Yes, people dress up when they go out on dates, they behave (hopefully) a little better. There's a difference between donig that--"best foot forward"--and using psychological trickery to get them to do so. Think of it as the difference between blatant advertising and viral marketing; the blatant advertiser is trying to sell you their product, and you know they are, so you know they are going to display it in the best possible light. The viral marketer is trying to suck you in under false pretences. And yeah, sure, the line between the two can be blurry--but the elasticity of that line doesn't mean that there aren't two very different things. That and apparently deceiving someone for *gasp* sex is somehow more sleazy than getting a guy to "commit" to "where the relationship is going" (translation: it's going to the altar, then the maternity ward, and then the grave. The question is never truly where only if and when). I'm really not comprehending how getting someone to commit--absent false pretences and/or shady manipulation--is sleazy in any way, shape, or form.

By: dirtynumbangelboy

dirtynumbangelboy — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:15:57 -0800

Because we're sick and tired of everything cool, interesting or just plain bizarre turning out to be an ad. Yeah.. but it says something very clear about MeFi that even after several people--people with personal experience of this guy--have pointed out that it is not viral that other commenters keep on beating the viral drum. What that says about MeFi is an exercise best left up to the reader.

By: Zambrano

Zambrano — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:16:13 -0800

Look at the douchebag, everyone. Let's do another 90 posts.

By: WalterMitty

WalterMitty — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:19:36 -0800

Seconding the "What's wrong with fedoras". Why? It's a perfectly serviceable hat. :(

By: mrgrimm

mrgrimm — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:21:20 -0800

Dmitri sounds too ridiculous and to be true rather than satire, but apparently he is real (or an excellent hoax - secret member of the Yes Men?). It disturbed you that much to learn that men seek to get laid, and in some cases pull out all the stops? There's women out there who eat men just the same. It's human nature. ... It's lucky, then, that human nature tends to favor men who pull out all stops because they actually like women, Christ, what an asshole Even feminists can be charmed into bed, you know! ... I am completely lost on the tone and insinuations of this point. Is it a counter-point? Someone smarter than me help me out here... (editor's bolding) Eponysterical? I think that what JT was implying was that with all of the "slut list" talk, some of these PUAs come off as not respecting women, or perhaps even being actively misogynist, i.e. getting off on manipulating or "fucking over" these women. (Admittedly, we're all likely colored by pop culture, e.g. In The Company of Men, etc. PUAs don't often get portrated in a great light (excluding RDJ, of course)). I also think he/she was saying that evolution favors the nice guys, i.e. the ones who will respect women. I'm not positive that's true, but it's nice to think so...if you're a nice guy...or women who don't enjoy being treated "badly" (in the conventional, emotionally supportive sense). The blogto author agrees: "So while I encourage anyone sufficiently outraged by Dimitri and his "real men" to let them know exactly how you feel, this kind of thing, like the KKK and Scientology, has no future." (Thanks for the link, whoever posted that...)

By: cortex

cortex — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:24:08 -0800

Ducle et fedorum est / pro matria nooki

By: dirtynumbangelboy

dirtynumbangelboy — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:37:47 -0800

some of these PUAs come off as not respecting women, You don't say. They all come off as not respecting women, I think; respecting a woman (or a man) means respecting their choice to get in bed with you or not without resorting to psychological manipulation to do so. or perhaps even being actively misogynist, Bingo. They don't like or respect women, they just want pussy. To them, a woman is just an orifice(s) to please them. Manipulate, pick up, bang, move on.

By: cmoj

cmoj — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:40:40 -0800

If you find this kind of thing creepilicious you should read "The Game: Penetrating The Secret Society of Pickup Artists" by Neil Strauss -- but I must say that as a woman and a feminist I really wish I hadn't. It infuriated and in fact upset me for weeks after I finished. On a recommendation I read that book and was also very disturbed, but pretty soon I started reading more carefully and the book is really incredibly well written. He actually (I assume he really did all that) subjects himself to this deranged ethos in order to expose it in a way that you could never get from phone messages and self help books from these people. I've wanted to read the biography of Tom Cruise by the same author ever since.

By: msalt

msalt — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:42:40 -0800

I mean, I can understand--I guess--when you're an average-looking guy, or below average, or whatnot. The human desire to get laid is incredibly strong,' I don't think it's about getting laid, it's control. Insecure people can get off on suddenly reversing their perceived mating weakness with magic, whether it's middle school girls with kissing spells or 20s-ish wimpy guys with PUA books. Much safer than facing yourself and whether you're actually an attractive person(ality).

By: loquacious

loquacious — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:43:34 -0800

Agreed. Finding out that the great band Devo was just viral for a Happy Meal (video) campaign done to promote American Idol definitely ruined my day. Don't blame that on Devo. They weren't even asked about it. It's probably lawsuit material.

By: rusty

rusty — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:46:53 -0800

UbuRoivas: I am so wet right now. Call me? -- nola: It was a joke, and it wasn't. "Wasn't," in the sense that I meant every word completely. "Was," in the sense that... uh, well maybe it amused someone? So, in that sense. Or something. But I totally meant it. Seriously.

By: princesspeach

princesspeach — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 11:49:53 -0800

I just can't stop laughing... but its so sad ... its funny because i just read this article today: Online Dater Douchebag They are everywhere!!!

By: Dr. Zira

Dr. Zira — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:00:48 -0800

The only best foot forward our boy Dmitri seems to be putting forth is the one attached to his third leg.

By: effbot

effbot — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:03:22 -0800

It's probably lawsuit material. Just being facetious, sir. And more off-topic than usual. (For those who don't know what we're talking about, see Are We McDevo?)

By: dirtynumbangelboy

dirtynumbangelboy — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:04:10 -0800

I don't think it's about getting laid, it's control. Mmm, yes I suppose. Well.. I think it's control in some cases, desperate need to get laid in others, often a combination of the two.

By: Jody Tresidder

Jody Tresidder — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:23:48 -0800

I also think he/she was saying that evolution favors the nice guys, i.e. the ones who will respect women. I'm not positive that's true, but it's nice to think so.. mrgrimm - you're pretty much on track here - except "nice" can seem too wan a word for what I mean. Also, men can behave like rotters out of genuine self-preservation at times - without being anything like 'Dimitri'. If a guy is capable of respecting a woman, he's probably halfway there. If he doesn't believe respecting a woman is even possible, he probably deserves what he gets.

By: orange swan

orange swan — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:41:09 -0800

LOVED the Online Dater Douchebag link, princesspeach! I think my three worst/best experiences with Lava include Dimitri. Here are the other two: One morning a guy IM'd me this: when do uwant to have kids and will u move to Calgary It was all I could do not to message back, "Yes i will live in yer house and have yer babbies send me $600O plain fair." The third "notable" guy I came across on there returned a smile I had sent him with the canned message, "I can't resist the fact that we are complete opposites." I always tried to only use my credits on guys who seem like really good leads, and so I reviewed the guy's ad again. Hmm. I was definitely getting a slightly off vibe, maybe one of jerkiness. But... it had been so long since I'd come across anyone I wanted to spend credits on I though, why not, and so I used to the six credits to send him a neutral initial message in which I told him a little about me, asked questions about him relating to his profile, and jokingly asked him why he thought we were opposites. The next day in my inbox I found a reply from him that said, in its entirety, "You sound shallow and I am not. You look pyschotic [sic] and I am not." He'd blocked me from replying to his message. Basically he'd only smiled at me to encourage me to waste credits on him and to give him a chance to indulge in some drive-by assholery. He was corrrect that we were complete opposites, but wrong about the ways in which we differ. To be fair, these three are exceptions, and most of the Lava lads I decided to meet in person seemed like quite decent people with honourable intentions. But after years of this sort of thing, I deleted my Lavalife account in April.

By: howling fantods

howling fantods — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:45:06 -0800

This happened in Toronto not SF, and it's for real. I work with a friend of the er... victim, as does the DJ on the radio show that aired the clip.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:48:27 -0800

I notice you're doing your part, Peter. That's clearly an impersonator. When I tried, using a pseudonym, I never managed to score higher than 63.

By: howling fantods

howling fantods — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:50:53 -0800

That came out wrong. The DJ is also friends with my co-worker, is what I meant.

By: weapons-grade pandemonium

weapons-grade pandemonium — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 13:04:50 -0800

What the hell? There's nothing wrong with fedoras. How did fedoras even enter this conversation? posted by Caduceus The fedora reference is from a previous AskMe. This pinstripe and fedora-sporting wannabe ladykiller got roasted alive.

By: evabraunstein

evabraunstein — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 13:04:50 -0800

Here's the transcript. I did it myself.

By: weapons-grade pandemonium

weapons-grade pandemonium — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 13:07:51 -0800

Good job, evabraunstein. Metafilter: There's nothing wrong with me.

By: weapons-grade pandemonium

weapons-grade pandemonium — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 13:17:05 -0800

Good username, too.

By: aftermarketradio

aftermarketradio — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 13:21:44 -0800

Metafilter: Let the romance begin!

By: damn dirty ape

damn dirty ape — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 13:32:21 -0800

I mean, I can understand--I guess--when you're an average-looking guy, or below average, or whatnot. The only dudes Ive ever known to engage in these methods have all been pretty boys. I think they're used to women throwing themselves at them when theyre younger so they go with 'the game' as they age or perhaps its just harder to meet one-night stands out of HS and college. Something tells me that 'the game' doesnt really work at all, it just gives certain guys who dont really need the help a bit more confidence in finding easy women. You dont see unattractive guys getting away with game-like antics. Well, ignoring guys with the kavorka of course.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 14:32:31 -0800

I think they're used to women throwing themselves at them when theyre younger so they go with 'the game' as they age or perhaps its just harder to meet one-night stands out of HS and college. You're joking, aren't you? The reality is in fact, the exact opposite to what you describe. As you get out of high school and college, it actually becomes much easier to pick up women, not harder. You've got the divorced faction, so fewer are saving it for 'the one'. Then you've got all kinds of anxieties about being left on the shelf, biological clocks, the notion that men age more gracefully than women, etc. etc. I'm pretty sure that the people who resort to the game type tactics aren't grouped by appearance, but by lack of confidence and lack of previous success with women. Men who know how to get on women don't lose that as they get older -- if anything, they tend to get better at it. I suppose if there is an exception, it's probably the Jock type. Men who relied on some sort of status to attract women that they no longer have any more. They might be drawn to Game type tactics as well? But pretty boys and guys who are comfortable with women? They can always cut it.

By: Grangousier

Grangousier — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 14:38:34 -0800

Men who know how to get on women don't lose that as they get older It's not about getting on, it's about not getting pushed off again.

By: dsquid

dsquid — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 15:22:40 -0800

Sounds like the prototypical Metafilter poster. Including me.

By: 235w103

235w103 — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 15:43:02 -0800

I guess I don't understand stuff like this, and the whole pick-up artist stuff, because I've never considered just going up to someone on the street and hitting on them, or even going up to someone in a bar. Maybe I'm just too timid, but every relationship I've had has followed the pattern of meeting someone who is a friend's friend or with whom I'm working, hanging out with them for increasing periods of time until mutual attraction is acknowledged. I see attractive, seemingly interesting people on the subway or in bars all the time, but- given that I have a lot of female friends who regale me with stories of creepy dudes hitting on them in the subway- it seems like the odds are a lot better for the situation to end up a joke story told over mojitos next girls night out than in twue wuv. Besides, being on a subway with a dude doing the whole, "Hey. Hey girl. Hey beautiful. God bless you. You got a man? Huh? Yeah? You got a man? You're not just sayin that because you're not interested, right? You really got a man?" routine is so awkward for everyone on there, it's like showing random pedestrians nude shots of their mothers.

By: bwg

bwg — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 16:46:46 -0800

Gah, what a dick.

By: batmonkey

batmonkey — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 16:52:43 -0800

Jezebel has a great wrap-up on his exposure.

By: jonmc

jonmc — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 16:56:47 -0800

If this guy's for real, I bet he scores occasionally. No matter how unnatractive or weird you are, somebody out there wants to fuck you, sometimes just to be the one that does. So the key is to simply use the shotgun approach and try as often as possible. Of course, most of the time, getting laid is a fluke (at least for us guys): the woman has simply decided that she wants to have sex with someone and that you met the minnimum requirements. Your mission to not fuck up by doing something stupid or disgusting. It's that simple.

By: Countess Elena

Countess Elena — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 17:22:03 -0800

This man ruined my day. I mean it. I was doing my morning browsing, and saw this thread, and the LJ link . . . I thought it would be funny. I clicked it. God damn. There aren't, say, a number of young women gone missing from a nearby area, are there? Other than this guy, PUAs always struck me as laughable, not frightening. They can use their pathetic, transparent roll-your-charisma technique on as many women as they want, and any woman who's in the market for goods that damaged can have them. But Dmitri seems to want something worse than simply sex; he wants to make women into his hollowed-out meat puppets. He genuinely does remind me of Paul Bernardo -- who also had an incest threesome fetish. Okay, off to Cute Overload!

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 18:18:23 -0800

I must be strange: I figure that my twenty-odd years with a single woman count as much, much more success than any PUA's record. I get plenty of the sex plus I get to live with and love my very best friend forever. The idea of bagging strangers for one-night stands seems lonely and sad by comparison. Different strokes for different folks, I suppose.

By: jonmc

jonmc — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 18:29:55 -0800

Actually, the 'strokes' are generally of the domain of those who get neither the long-term-relationship or the pickups.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 23:25:06 -0800

It's not about getting on, it's about not getting pushed off again. Ick. I meant to write 'on with'. Freudian slip, obviously.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 23:42:57 -0800

He apparently found military medicine boring, "which led to compulsive masturbation up to six times per day, which was accomplished by going off to the washroom in between patients," the records state. Dmitri the self-lover. Nice catch, Batmonkey.

By: loiseau

loiseau — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 23:45:56 -0800

five fresh fish said: "I get plenty of the sex plus I get to live with and love my very best friend forever. The idea of bagging strangers for one-night stands seems lonely and sad by comparison." Yeah... well, it's nice that you feel lucky but it's pretty shitty to feel superior to people who either don't want or just can't find what you have. If it were just a matter of putting in an order for a soulmate I would've done it. But it's not so I do what I can in its absence.

By: fuse theorem

fuse theorem — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 23:55:52 -0800

some of these PUAs come off as not respecting women, You don't say. They all come off as not respecting women, I think; respecting a woman (or a man) means respecting their choice to get in bed with you or not without resorting to psychological manipulation to do so I think the PUA game is zero-sum for them so "success" has to mean the woman is a loser. or perhaps even being actively misogynist, Bingo. They don't like or respect women, they just want pussy. To them, a woman is just an orifice(s) to please them. Manipulate, pick up, bang, move on This. A gazillion times this. I also think he/she was saying that evolution favors the nice guys, i.e. the ones who will respect women. I think evolution is starting to favor the guys who fuck the most women who in turn have those guys' kids. The social stigma attached to having children out of wedlock has lessened quite a bit, in Western cultures at least, so "niceness" starts to lose out to persistence, "game", and sheer stamina. A generation or two from now, this movie will be considered a documentary.

By: Phanx

Phanx — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 01:47:05 -0800

Does a slutty gait give you round heels?

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 08:10:37 -0800

Yeah... well, it's nice that you feel lucky but it's pretty shitty to feel superior to people who either don't want or just can't find what you have. If it were just a matter of putting in an order for a soulmate I would've done it. But it's not so I do what I can in its absence. It appears that you feel it is superior to have a single soulmate. Don't be chewing on my ass for expressing what you believe.

By: loiseau

loiseau — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 09:42:52 -0800

You were the one who said you were "much, much more successful" and that one-night stands seem to you "lonely and sad". Of course I believe most people want to have love in their life. I certainly do. But not all people want that. Try not to judge.

By: orange swan

orange swan — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 09:46:52 -0800

Does a slutty gait give you round heels? [worries because her heels are rounded, as opposed to say, square or triangular]

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 10:03:54 -0800

One night stands do seem to me to be lonely and sad. I'm sorry that offends you so very greatly, but it is how I feel. And it certainly seems to be how you feel about it as well. As for judging, I think it's remarkable that you're singling out my rather innocuous comment when so many other comments in this thread are outright PUA-bashing and mockery. Against comments like a mentally ill level of social ineptness and a desperate wanker and how a person gets like this, sifting through the awful banal garbage dump of their history, it seems like your protest is a little contrived. I am truly sorry you haven't found love, and I'm sorry you feel a need to take it out on those of us who have.

By: loiseau

loiseau — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 11:01:49 -0800

You are some kinda drama queen, FFF.

By: miss lynnster

miss lynnster — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 11:17:04 -0800

Group huugggggg!!!!!!

By: P.o.B.

P.o.B. — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 12:55:35 -0800

I'm pretty sure that the people who resort to the game type tactics aren't grouped by appearance, but by lack of confidence and lack of previous success with women. Wow! A solid observation about these types of guys. I'm not going to defend all the inherent subjugation of women in the B.S. these PUA guys peddle. But I don't find anything wrong or evil in what these guys do. Especially if you go over to any AskMeFi thread about relationships and there is always an overabundance of "Do what makes you happy!" answers in there. There are plenty of people out there looking for meaningless sex, men and women.

By: Pronoiac

Pronoiac — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 13:43:33 -0800

h00py: I would just like to say, right here, right now, that I would not hit that. Even if I was elegant. then I said I wouldn't! That doesn't count, surely? Plus I'm a girl! Um.. okay, now I'm being sexist. Sorry, cooter-counters. Either way, Blazecock Pileon already made the delivery of fail for the day. As for your comment, I'm not sure whether it's the announcing, the judging, or both.. I might take the label "cooter-counters" more later, just not in this sleazy thread.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 14:07:09 -0800

But I don't find anything wrong or evil in what these guys do. Especially if you go over to any AskMeFi thread about relationships and there is always an overabundance of "Do what makes you happy!" answers in there. There are plenty of people out there looking for meaningless sex, men and women. Except that in real life, it's around 95% men & 5% women who are looking for meaningless sex. This is what makes this crap unethical, because the entire approach is a lie: "I don't approach many women; I chose you because you're particularly elegant" - lie. He approaches anybody who's still warm & who has a vag. "I've just come out of a long-term, long distance relationship" - lie. The guy has no interest in relationships, and probably couldn't pull one off if his life depended on it. "I have a 170 IQ" - yeah, pull the other one. "I'm a doctor" - er, was a doctor, disbarred for sexually assaulting patients, apparently. "I'm a catch" - epic lie. Basically, the guy is playing up his relationship / marriage potential, when he has zero intention of going through with it. There are all these claims about being upfront & honest, but the approach is framed in terms of this relationship potential, when he's really saying nothing other than "hey, babe, wanna fuck?" The entire routine is a lie, and that's even without considering the blatant "negging". This isn't just fiddling with your CV a bit. It's acting as if you earnestly want the job, when your only intention is to pilfer from the petty cash box.

By: P.o.B.

P.o.B. — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 14:17:44 -0800

Well, this guy is absolutely absurd. I can't deny that in any way. I was speaking in more of general terms about a random guy picking up The Game and trying to apply it.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 14:59:18 -0800

yeh, i might try to pick up on some of these awesome techniques & give them a road test at my local pub this afternoon. *clears throat* "by the way, that's a really nice hairdo you have; i like the way it draws attention away from your nose" "what a beautiful dress! it's good that the supersize mart makes sexy dresses for women of your build" I'll report back later with the results of this experiment.

By: dirtynumbangelboy

dirtynumbangelboy — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 15:01:33 -0800

There are plenty of people out there looking for meaningless sex, men and women. That's not the issue. The issue is the psychological manipulation used by PUAs to get it.

By: P.o.B.

P.o.B. — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 15:18:47 -0800

I don't really follow. Psychological manipulation like..."witty" banter to get a woman to smile? Whatever. If this crap gives a few guys who are down and out on themselves a little bit of courage to talk to a woman. Great. If any of these guys came up to me telling me how women are sluts and all they are good for is one thing. Then, by all means, I'll be standing right next you telling them how full of shit they are.

By: dirtynumbangelboy

dirtynumbangelboy — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 15:29:21 -0800

Witty banter is one thing. Calculatedly using tricks to get someone into bed is another. Again, see the distinction I made upthread between standard advertising and viral marketing.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 15:38:20 -0800

Psychological manipulation like..."witty" banter to get a woman to smile? But it's not witty banter at all. More than anything else, they come across like carpet salesmen in places like India or Morocco, and most of the 'banter' is formulaic & pre-scripted, most likely based on self-help books for people in sales: praise the product, flatter the buyer, make the offer 'special' and 'limited opportunity', play the buyer off against other people, talk as if the sale has already been made, turn aggressive & accusatory if the buyer starts to back down, etc. Always with the wolf eye for the final goal, which is the only thing that matters. Fuck actually getting to know people, screw the idea of caring what they want out of the situation. It's nothing other than shitty salesmanship - the domain of used car, cellphone, real estate & insurance salesmen the world over, ie the smarmy & conceited, half-witted detritus of society.

By: jonmc

jonmc — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 16:32:47 -0800

The issue is the psychological manipulation used by PUAs to get it. Um, dude, I think it's a rare occasion where a man dosen't use some level of psychological manipulation to get laid, even if it's just exaggerating one's accomplishments, pretending to be interested in something a girl wants to talk about, or simply telling someone what the want to hear. It's a matter of degree.

By: jonmc

jonmc — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 16:36:31 -0800

Not to mention, women are the Zen Fucking Jedi Masters Of The Omniverse at using sex appeal to manipulate people, so the whole 'virtue despoiled by smooth-talking ne'er-do-wells' don't play with me. Tell that shit to the tourists.

By: cortex

cortex — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 16:52:28 -0800

It's actually possible for a thing to be a matter of degree and still reasonably find a significantly higher degree objectionable when a lower degree isn't so much. I'd say "saying her shoes look nice" vs. "aggressively lying about your intentions" would be a good example, on that front.

By: jonmc

jonmc — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 16:54:42 -0800

It's actually possible for a thing to be a matter of degree and still reasonably find a significantly higher degree objectionable when a lower degree isn't so much. Sure. I'm just saying that realizing that almost none of us are pure-of-heart on this score means that maybe we should turn the righteous indignation down just a tad.

By: krinklyfig

krinklyfig — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 16:56:20 -0800

jonmc writes "Not to mention, women are the Zen Fucking Jedi Masters Of The Omniverse at using sex appeal to manipulate people, so the whole 'virtue despoiled by smooth-talking ne'er-do-wells' don't play with me. Tell that shit to the tourists." Have you read some of his sockpuppet responses, like in the comments on this post? Dude has some issues. Some of them are legal issues.

By: jonmc

jonmc — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 17:01:14 -0800

krinklyfig: this Dmipshit dosen't concern me. I was more responding to the whole 'manipulation in the name of getting laid! Gasp! Horrors!' I was hearing here. We're all adults, I think we realize that very few people are innocent on that score.

By: P.o.B.

P.o.B. — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 17:08:33 -0800

On that note, isn't there a video floating around where it shows what men and women are really saying/thinking on a date, and it translates to Man: "Sex, sex, sex!" Woman: "Money, money, money!"

By: miss lynnster

miss lynnster — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 18:52:49 -0800

I can honestly say I've only thought "Money, money, money!" on a date once. And that was only because I didn't feel like washing dishes in a Mexican kitchen. I can only speak for myself, but usually if I'm on a good date I'm thinking of things that are far more interesting than money. And if I'm on a bad date, I'm usually thinking about how I'd much rather be home watching tv with my dog.

By: msamye

msamye — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 20:38:03 -0800

Interesting to trace how news breaks over the web these days. On a bad date, I'm usually planning my escape. Extra points for the dramatic.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sun, 29 Jun 2008 04:03:21 -0800

this Dmipshit dosen't concern me. I was more responding to the whole 'manipulation in the name of getting laid! Gasp! Horrors!' I was hearing here. We're all adults, I think we realize that very few people are innocent on that score. i hear you, jonmc. in fact, i've lost count of the number of times women have approached me, said what a catch they were - astrophysics phds and all - told me i was specially sought out because of my macho gait, then taken me home, given me around two and a half minutes of "pleasure" and then left as suddenly as they came, even though i'd hoped we were heading for a relationship & had only put up with their pathetically inept groping in the hopes of maybe walking along a beach at sunset with them one day. it's refreshing to hear that guys act like those women, too. otherwise i would've thought i was being specifically singled out, or something.

By: cereselle

cereselle — Sun, 29 Jun 2008 09:15:44 -0800

Always with the wolf eye for the final goal, which is the only thing that matters. Fuck actually getting to know people, screw the idea of caring what they want out of the situation. It's nothing other than shitty salesmanship - the domain of used car, cellphone, real estate & insurance salesmen the world over, ie the smarmy & conceited, half-witted detritus of society. This. A million times this.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Sun, 29 Jun 2008 11:26:09 -0800

Man: "Sex, sex, sex!" Woman: "Money, money, money!" Personally, I follow the same philosophy as The Contours in such matters.

By: miss lynnster

miss lynnster — Sun, 29 Jun 2008 13:01:20 -0800

Life will be much easier if you follow their fashion philosophy, as you won't have to worry much about dates.

By: P.o.B.

P.o.B. — Sun, 29 Jun 2008 13:05:44 -0800

Ah, here it is! I don't remember it being so badly dubbed. Notice miss lynster, it was done as a comedy video. Always with the wolf eye for the final goal, which is the only thing that matters. Fuck actually getting to know people, screw the idea of caring what they want out of the situation. It's nothing other than shitty salesmanship - the domain of used car, cellphone, real estate & insurance salesmen the world over, ie the smarmy & conceited, half-witted detritus of society. This. A million times this. You can paint these guys however you want, and I'm sure there are enough people who are going to take up the pitch forks and torches. But I really don't see that. For the most part, aside from guys like this Dimitri ass (which are few and far between), I believe it is more or less what I said before. It's guys who are a little shy, a little lacking on the smooth talking, and just need a little help trying to talk to women. So they're told how to lie and how to "neg" a woman. Please explain specifically how this differs from regular playful teasing/flirting? If you're going to tell me it's the mindset, then please tell you're secrets of mind reading.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sun, 29 Jun 2008 14:06:17 -0800

It would have to come down to the intentions of the particular guy, P.oB. I can see truth in what you say; I just think I'm describing the cynical end of the spectrum, whereas you're talking about the hopeful end. It might be the difference between the pickup as an and in itself, as opposed to being a means to an end (ie becoming more comfortable, with a relationship possibly in mind), respectively.

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Sun, 29 Jun 2008 19:15:43 -0800

Sex differences: men are generally okay with one-night stands; women generally are not.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Sun, 29 Jun 2008 20:18:40 -0800

While men reported feeling more content, sexually satisfied and confident after meaningless sex, women were more likely to worry about feeling used and "letting themselves down". Some of the their reasons for the encounters were because they felt there was the possibility of a longer term relationship. Which is exactly why I feel that many of these PUAs & their followers are probably acting unethically. If there were equal tons of guys & tons of girls out for meaningless sex, then you could put it down to a fair market exchange between consenting adults. However, women in general are overwhelmingly not after that kind of encounter (as argued well by thehmsbeagle in FedoraFilter) which means that many who fall for the PUA ploys presumably must do so because the guys present themselves as being relationship material, when in reality they're only after a fuck.

By: dersins

dersins — Sun, 29 Jun 2008 22:56:30 -0800

please tell you're secrets of mind reading. OK. I'm secrets of mind reading. Don't tell the government, please. I've seen Firestarter.

By: PeterMcDermott

PeterMcDermott — Mon, 30 Jun 2008 00:13:22 -0800

men are generally okay with one-night stands; women generally are not. Huh? That article says that just under half of women who responded felt their one night stands were a bad idea. Leaving just over half who, presumably, thought they were a perfectly fine idea. By my math, that makes women generally OK with them as well. Or at worst, evenly divided on the issue.

By: LordSludge

LordSludge — Mon, 30 Jun 2008 08:37:45 -0800

Dmitri, if you're reading this: Big dogs don't have to bark. If you're bragging about yourself, that means you're not entirely convinced of your own awesomeness, and you need some reassurance from other people -- it's a clear indicator of low self-esteem, hence low social value, which translates to unattractive-to-women (also to male friends)... which is pretty clear by the responses in this thread. It sounds like you're doing pretty well with women now, and that's great. But if you will simply STFU about yourself, stop trying to prove yourself, and let women discover your awesomeness on their own, your "game" will go through the roof. But, hey, if you're happy, truly happy and fulfilled, keep doing what you're doing. My hunch is that you are not, and everybody deserves happiness. Life is short. I sincerely hope you find what you're looking for.

By: msalt

msalt — Mon, 30 Jun 2008 11:21:20 -0800

re: UbuRoivas vs. jonmc I agree with jonmc generally, but there is something a bit creepy about the PUA thing, a certain cold-heartedness at its ideological core, as if it's WRONG to actually feel for or connect with the woman/target. Or maybe it's just this: the concept of the neg, which is closely related to playful teasing of course, can also be a conduit for mysogynistic feelings, and I think there is something about this approach that encourages that.

By: krinklyfig

krinklyfig — Mon, 30 Jun 2008 15:29:37 -0800

msalt writes "I agree with jonmc generally, but there is something a bit creepy about the PUA thing, a certain cold-heartedness at its ideological core, as if it's WRONG to actually feel for or connect with the woman/target." For me it comes down to informed consent. If everyone involved knows what's going on, even if they're lying to get there, then that's not so bad. If someone is just lying to get what he or she wants, and not everyone is in on the game, then that's more akin to using people.

By: P.o.B.

P.o.B. — Mon, 30 Jun 2008 20:42:07 -0800

If everyone involved knows what's going on That's just an unrealistic expectation in most situations. If that happened, vast amounts of interactions on a day to day basis would play out between people in a totally different matter.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Mon, 30 Jun 2008 22:13:57 -0800

"In any interaction, there are at least six people involved: each person as they see themselves; each person as the other sees them; and each person as they really are"

By: LordSludge

LordSludge — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 21:59:44 -0800

I agree with jonmc generally, but there is something a bit creepy about the PUA thing, a certain cold-heartedness at its ideological core, as if it's WRONG to actually feel for or connect with the woman/target. Neil Strauss seems creepy as hell and mysogynistic to me, but David DeAngelo does good work, basically teaching men how to act right -- how to stop being needy, insecure, and passive and be men that women will be attracted to. It's a mistake to lump them all together. Mystery basically teaches men how to put on an appearance of not being insecure, which is better than nothing, but it's a sort of acting job until something *clicks* and you "get" what you're supposed to be doing. It's more of a facade than real self-esteem change. But at least it teaches that social interactions can be modeled, and it does teach a good bit about the subtle cues women are looking for. Or maybe it's just this: the concept of the neg, which is closely related to playful teasing of course, can also be a conduit for mysogynistic feelings, and I think there is something about this approach that encourages that A good "neg" should not be an insult, nor even playful teasing. It's a really subtle thing that says to a very attractive woman, "I'm not going to go gaga over you simply for your looks, unlike EVERY OTHER MAN you meet. I require... something more than mere physical attractiveness." An example would be talking to her less attractive friend more than her, or making eye contact with everybody else at the table but her for the first 3 minutes. A guy who throws out insult after insult is just an asshole. Good "pickup" should be a positive experience for everybody involved. It should be two people meeting, clicking on a deep emotional level, and... whatever from there, whether a hawt one night stand or a cute story of How I Met Your Mother. If it's a negative experience for the woman, there's something wrong with the PUA's approach. And, unfortunately, that's usually the case, which gives the PUA community a bad name. Sorry, that got long. There's just a lot of fear & loathing towards the PUA community that really isn't warranted. There are a lot of people that are just trying to help shy guys find love.

By: UbuRoivas

UbuRoivas — Tue, 01 Jul 2008 23:32:41 -0800

Thanks for that, LordSludge. Your comment added some much-needed balance to my perceptions of the PUA guys. Especially this bit: Good "pickup" should be a positive experience for everybody involved. It should be two people meeting, clicking on a deep emotional level, and... whatever from there, whether a hawt one night stand or a cute story of How I Met Your Mother. If it's a negative experience for the woman, there's something wrong with the PUA's approach.

By: dersins

dersins — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 00:54:40 -0800

And, unfortunately, that's usually the case, which gives the PUA community a bad name. Actually, what gives the "PUA community" a bad name is that they refer to themselves as pick-up artists. Which makes them sound like a bunch of fucking douchebags. More specifically, the kind of douchebags who think of women as objects to be picked up rather than people to relate to. Just, y'know, fyi.

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 06:52:47 -0800

It should be two people meeting, clicking on a deep emotional level, and... ...not developing a lasting friendship and long-term relationship? On how deep an emotional level can you possibly have clicked if it's all wham, bam, thank you ma'am? Deep emotional level appears to be the last thing on a PUA's mind.

By: LordSludge

LordSludge — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 13:26:58 -0800

what gives the "PUA community" a bad name is that they refer to themselves as pick-up artists. Yeah, I agree, the word "pick-up" has a bad connotation -- if they called themselves "social coaches" or something. ...not developing a lasting friendship and long-term relationship? On how deep an emotional level can you possibly have clicked if it's all wham, bam, thank you ma'am? Not much, but who says that's all guys are after? Not me. I want to fall in love. I guess I'm a greedy motherfucker. And thanks to social skills I've learned from this stuff, I'm doing that right now. Before, I was that creepy guy who couldn't even say "hello". How am I going to develop a deep, meaningful relationship if can't even fucking say hello? You seem to think it's easy for a guy to approach a beautiful woman he has never met and he has nothing in common and start a conversation. It's just... not.

By: LordSludge

LordSludge — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 14:07:56 -0800

Sorry if that came out harsh. It's just that I feel like I'm being told that the only reason I want to meet a woman is to have a one-night stand with her. That is really, really insulting.