Are the Conservatives actively trying to lose votes amongst the 18-24 demographic?
May 10, 2001 1:39 PM   Subscribe

Are the Conservatives actively trying to lose votes amongst the 18-24 demographic? Whilst executives at the BBC are rapidly losing their nerve when it comes to home grown programming, Channel 4 has consistently experimented with new formats and programming styles. The intent of the Blue party seems to facilitate the blanding out of television. Would a privatised C4 have the nerve to show its excellent history programmes in primetime? You can expect it will only lead to attitudes like those expressed by the producers of the US version of 'Survivor'.
posted by feelinglistless (18 comments total)
 
this is the 'Big Brother' running C4 is it?

Sorry, that was a cheap shot. Erm, they could make it have the nerve by regulating it to death (which I think is the plan). But apart from that probably not.

But excellent history programmes? As a history student without a TV set I feel ably qualified to comment. :-]

Sorry, but C4 is a bit like the discovery channel these days with endless secrets of the Pharaohs/UFO's/other frivolous pursuits when really they should be investigating:

"To what extent can the abolition of the slave trade and the emancipation of slaves in the British empire be attributed to the rise of 'capitalism'."

As my recent history essay put it so clearly. If you want serious history, don't watch TV (Scharma's history of Britain excluded), read my marvelous [?] essay's instead!
posted by nedrichards at 1:49 PM on May 10, 2001


Is the 18-24 demographic in the UK so superficial that one of their most important issues is whether or not to privatize a TV network?
posted by aaron at 2:01 PM on May 10, 2001


Don't ask me how I found this but... thedogsbollocks.com resolves to an interesting place - I wonder if this is some lame Tory attempt at viral marketing. The domain is owned by a UK hosting company.
posted by johnny novak at 2:11 PM on May 10, 2001


Hey you have to admit, if PBS produced a show like Queer as Folk, it'd get sold off a hell of a lot more quickly in the US...
posted by DiplomaticImmunity at 2:19 PM on May 10, 2001


The average age of the Tory party membership is over 60 (BBC R4 news, just now). So answering the questions about votes: they've probably got very little left to use...
posted by andrew cooke at 2:24 PM on May 10, 2001


In support of Channel 4 - the evening news program is the best there is...
posted by andrew cooke at 2:25 PM on May 10, 2001


aaron: C4 is more than a "tv network", as such. It's a kind of test case for the ability of a commercial channel to be, well, something other than ITV. It gave us "Father Ted".

It's the channel of top-ranking imported comedy, challenging films and documentaries, and people who say "fuck". (ie the Sopranos and Sex in the City.) I actually have a soft spot for "Time Team": guerilla archeology presented by Baldrick. Though you have to wonder whether e4 -- if not the excellent FilmFour -- is spreading the "talent" too thinly.

But you're right: the 18-24 demographic should be more worried about the Tory plan to scrap the New Deal. And while it's certainly not the panacea that Labour claims, it's been a better attempt to challenge youth unemployment than successive schemes in the 80s and early 90s. To be quite honest, though, the under-24s just don't vote. Both parties will be ploughing the "working families" furrow that our American readers will be oh-so-familiar with.

(andrew: I'd imagine the C4 election coverage is going to be the only channel worth watching. Andrew Rawnsley dishing out brickbats on all sides.)
posted by holgate at 2:32 PM on May 10, 2001


Everything in proportion, of course. Some thoughts.

We unfortunately live in a media led age, opinions being informed by print media, this internet thing, but mostly television - which opens the issue into a wider debate - who should be controlling media outlets?

Channel 4 isn't perfect. It does seem to have a problem with all the 'Pharaohs/UFO's/other frivolous pursuits', now and then. But a look at this week's schedule does yield some gems - Saturday night saw a doc about homosexuals in the Catholic church; there is the journalist Jon Ronson's 'The Secret Ruler's of the World' which looks at the various theories concerning a 'cabal' controlling the world - this week focus on David Ike (who you'd never take seriously if you knew about his past as a sport compentator and self proclaimed messiah - but that off thread - sorry); Bank Holiday Monday brings a two hour documentary about Henry VIII by renouned historian David Starkey (which Ned probably missed); Tuesday offered a stunning doublebill - 'Brian's Story', the touching story of journalist Brian Davis mental illness, then 'Faking It' in which a Devon student had take on the lifestyles of a London Bouncer and learn how the say 'fuck' properly ('fac'); tonight (Thursday) we find a look at the hallucinogenic drugs used in the massacre of 40,000 'witches' across the world.

So what's the point of this trawl through the schedule? If Channel 4 fall under the ownership of a private company (selected by a Conservative Government, who have always had a great record in selecting responsible companies - Camelot, Railtrack - oops), would their shareholders be happy to see these shows in a primetime slot? ( an obvious comparison here is ITV, who have quietly phased out most of its educational programming, leaving The South Bank show holding on the the 11pm slot on a Sunday like Kate Winslet to the Titanic).

[I've perhaps been a little harsh on BBC2, who have consistently been bringing some excellent drama and comedy. But the incoming exec has set her sights on an older deomgraphic and it won't be too long before gardening and cookery programmes are again clogging up the schedule. Let's get back to C4]

Perhaps I am taking the issue too seriously. Perhaps Ned is right, and the blanding out of TV will mean more people will be reading books. I feel though, the more likely outcome will be that the same number of people will still be watching TV, but the quality of what they are seeing will deteriorate. How can this be a good thing?

To be quite honest, though, the under-24s just don't vote.

Scary thing is, holgate might be right. I'm a Poll Clerk for the election (the guy who punches and issues the voting slips) and I'm in a student and pensioner area. Polling Day is going to be very slow, and all we will get are elderly people. Why should they have the controlling vote on a TV channel they don't even watch, or the New Deal which won't even effect them?)
posted by feelinglistless at 2:44 PM on May 10, 2001


Ronson is all right (in fact he's a nice bloke too). Maybe I come down a little hard on C$ (this was a shift key mistake but an appropriate one so I'll leave it in) as they ruthlessly abused their duopoly (with BBC2) on documentary film makers to dangerously exploit my uncle!

re: e4. When I do watch TV, which is rarely I go home to do it (we have the wonders of NTL digital cable) and e4 does prove that the airwaves are safe for people who say f*ck (my mother wouldn't approve without the asterisk!).

The trouble is that, with the increasing number of channels people will watch what they want to watch - soaps, reality tv, sport and naked ladies. Not important things like Opera, ballet or Time Team. In fact it's a bit like the net in that respect.

As an under 24 and proud of it - I'm 19 today :-] . I will be voting, I will even take an interest, but then again I listen to the Archers. I fear I'm scarily unrepresentative and most that people don't care at all. But what do I care, I'm me, I'm mildly happy, I often have a girlfriend (often the same one too) and I'm not in too much debt. The reason 'young people' don't vote is because by and large they're comfortable, reasonably well off and having a good time. Now, if there was a winter of discontent then we would all start getting interested. Maybe.
posted by nedrichards at 3:11 PM on May 10, 2001


Who's your uncle, Ned?
posted by feelinglistless at 3:25 PM on May 10, 2001


He's called Paul Bernays (I'm not sure if I'm supposed to mention that sort of think online :-). He did some good stuff a few years back on the Beeb ("Squeegies" etc.) then they stiffed him so he went to C4 where he did some stuff for them including the Kew gardens series a year or so ago. But they stiffed him on that (chopped him in half etc.) and other things so he's making programmes for the digital channel Artsworld at the moment. He's just set up his own company, Artisan-Films (.co.uk but only for email at present). And is making some cool stuff on outsider art. He's a pretty cool guy all in all, do a search for him on google and you get some seriously weird in depth discussions of Eric Costello lyrics by him!

All in all I'm not a great fan of faceless beaurocrats who muck around arty types. Though I will concede that c4, beeb2 et al do some good stuff.

hope that helped.
posted by nedrichards at 5:49 PM on May 10, 2001


He's called Paul Bernays (I'm not sure if I'm supposed to mention that sort of think online :-). He did some good stuff a few years back on the Beeb ("Squeegies" etc.) then they stiffed him so he went to C4 where he did some stuff for them including the Kew gardens series a year or so ago. But they stiffed him on that (chopped him in half etc.) and other things so he's making programmes for the digital channel Artsworld at the moment. He's just set up his own company, Artisan-Films (.co.uk but only for email at present). And is making some cool stuff on outsider art. He's a pretty cool guy all in all, do a search for him on google and you get some seriously weird in depth discussions of Eric Costello lyrics by him!

All in all I'm not a great fan of faceless beaurocrats who muck around arty types. Though I will concede that c4, beeb2 et al do some good stuff.

hope that helped.
posted by nedrichards at 5:50 PM on May 10, 2001


Unlike in America, the 18-24 group in England actually votes. And it votes liberal.
posted by brucec at 8:36 PM on May 10, 2001


erm, sorry for the double posting there. My MeFi went down!

All I can say bruce is that if 18-24's in UK vote then I really don't want to see what not voting is (also not sure about the liberal bit too, we're all 'capitalist-oppressors-with-a-heart).

An idea for widening voter participation in the US. Let the under 21 drink, like most sane countries. But with a twist. Only at polling stations or political meeting. That way you might yet the Young Conservatives that we had a few years back!
posted by nedrichards at 12:53 AM on May 11, 2001


in the early 70's your 18-24 voted Labour. ours didn't vote. and those that did voted for nixon.
posted by brucec at 11:12 AM on May 11, 2001


Channel 4, and its spin offs (Film Four and E4), are amongst some of the best things the UK has right now. C4's programming never ceases to be interesting, and they even try to cater for people watching during the graveyard hours. Come on.. "Late Night Poker".. "Bitz".. Excellent!

Film Four continues to bring some of the best films into the country (Dancer in the Dark, for example).. and E4 is one of the best digital channels around (with their 'Sex and the City' and 'Trigger Happy' marathons).

That said, the Conservatives should be talking about part-privatising the BBC, rather than C4. It's pathetic that we should be forced to pay 100 pounds a year just to *own* a TV, even if we don't watch the BBC. What about those who just want to watch DVDs? It's a complete scam.

Of course, the BBC is a worthwhile organisation. They cover the things that 100% commercial organisations wouldn't bother to.

I am unsure whether I will vote in the coming election. But if I do, I will be voting Conservative. While Labour has done a great job, I just don't believe in the 'high tax and high services' thing. I think people should use their own money to pay for things.. rather than paying tons of tax to give piles of welfare money to people sitting idle in council housing.

(I see so many people on welfare/dole wearing Nike trainers etc.. if these people are so poor why are they buying designer labels?)

However, all in all.. we're pretty lucky in the UK. Our taxes are already amongst the lowest in Europe. We're pretty lucky. It could be a lot worse. I wish Tony Blair the best of luck in his next term (cuz we know he'll win).
posted by wackybrit at 1:37 PM on May 11, 2001


'Late Night Poker' was a work of genius. More casino games! Live!

Why not privatize both, but with regulatory control (so they have to make decent programmes on occasion). Of course, privatizing the BBC as such would be difficult because nobody's sure who owns it but we could just declare that it's 'in trust for the nation' or something. The massive BBC brand would be more than enough to carry it through, even if it was massively hobbled commercially with regulation.

Don't forget that the highest paid public servant is the head of c4 with about £400,000 odd a year. The PM only gets about £100,000. But this isn't a debate about how much public servants are paid.

I'll definitely vote, and I'll be voting Tory because, despite not speaking in Hansard for seemingly the entire 4 year term (I checked on the net) he responded to my email within about three days and helped me with my A-level Geography project. And you can't say fairer than that for constituency involvement!

Generally speaking I like being British. Do the Americans (or others) have this same sense of inner pride?
posted by nedrichards at 2:45 PM on May 11, 2001


brucec: there was a good letter in either the Indy or the Guardian today, arguing that the under-25s are essentially disenfranchised by having opinions to the left of the Lib Dems. Which is fairly accurate. Yes, there's the Greens and the Socialist Alliance, but without proportional representation, it's hardly even a protest vote.

That said, this 27-y-o has, by virtue of FaxYourMP.com and a couple of very courteous and informative replies, decided to vote for the incumbent Labour MP.
posted by holgate at 4:40 PM on May 11, 2001


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