CNN Holograms, not so much
November 6, 2008 1:07 PM Subscribe
The jedi council may have to wait a few more years to incorporate holograms for absentee members.
damn, 100%, not 10%
posted by piratebowling at 1:11 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by piratebowling at 1:11 PM on November 6, 2008
I think it was obvious to anyone familiar with the state of the art that it was just a sophisticated form of blue-screening.
posted by Class Goat at 1:12 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by Class Goat at 1:12 PM on November 6, 2008
Ignorance is bliss.
Press release -> hook, line and sinker.
posted by StickyCarpet at 1:13 PM on November 6, 2008
Press release -> hook, line and sinker.
posted by StickyCarpet at 1:13 PM on November 6, 2008
Metafilter: obvious to anyone familiar with the state of the art
posted by plexi at 1:15 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by plexi at 1:15 PM on November 6, 2008
You have to ask yourself what the point of that exercise was. If it was to waste a whole bunch of money on some unnecessary pony trick, they nailed it!
posted by self at 1:15 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by self at 1:15 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
Kids? Hell, that looks kind of crappy to me right now. Nasty haloing there.
posted by echo target at 1:16 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by echo target at 1:16 PM on November 6, 2008
Ziggy, center me on Wolf Blitzer!
posted by vorfeed at 1:18 PM on November 6, 2008 [5 favorites]
posted by vorfeed at 1:18 PM on November 6, 2008 [5 favorites]
I saw it "live", and it was just ugly and annoying. Stupid, useless, gimmicky inanity.
posted by Justinian at 1:18 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by Justinian at 1:18 PM on November 6, 2008
wow...so basically they wasted a ton of cash on what could have been done on the cheap with the weatherman's green screen...
posted by scarello at 1:18 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by scarello at 1:18 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
Wolf should have tried to tackle Will.I.am (who wouldn't, he's partially responsible for Fergie), whiffed straight through him, then retreated to John King's touch map yelling "He's got a hologram!"
posted by cashman at 1:19 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by cashman at 1:19 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
That fake hologram donkey show is almost as bad as this post.
posted by loquacious at 1:23 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by loquacious at 1:23 PM on November 6, 2008
I am hoping hoping hoping hoping that the next step will be to have them mimic entirely the Star Wars technique of having a little hologram of a person on a tabletop. It would be thrilling to see Anderson Cooper looking down on a little blue hologram of Christiane Amanpour as she gives her report. I envision an entire show where one master anchor in a robe sits at a counter with five or six little holograms for a discussion, turning commentators on and off like a lady playing the glass harmonica.
posted by troybob at 1:24 PM on November 6, 2008 [19 favorites]
posted by troybob at 1:24 PM on November 6, 2008 [19 favorites]
I felt holograms helped me understood the issues better.
posted by mazola at 1:25 PM on November 6, 2008 [13 favorites]
posted by mazola at 1:25 PM on November 6, 2008 [13 favorites]
ANN COULTER: Finally, they'll stop calling me one-dimensional!
/fantasy
posted by troybob at 1:28 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
/fantasy
posted by troybob at 1:28 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
odinsdream, that was our favorite part too, because we weren't really paying attention to CNN and it was only when he tapped Iowa that we thought, "HEY, WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING THERE, OUR POLLS AREN'T CLOSED YET AND THEY SURE DIDN'T LEAN THAT WAY."
It might have just been me though, I really enjoy yelling at the television.
posted by mikeh at 1:31 PM on November 6, 2008
It might have just been me though, I really enjoy yelling at the television.
posted by mikeh at 1:31 PM on November 6, 2008
You're a hologram now, Jessica.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:33 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:33 PM on November 6, 2008
the fact that it wasn't an actual hologram is only overshadowed by the fact that all they talked about was the fact that she was a hologram. If she hadn't been talking about the technology, she wouldn't have had anything to say at all except "the mood is electric here in chicago."
posted by shmegegge at 1:33 PM on November 6, 2008 [3 favorites]
posted by shmegegge at 1:33 PM on November 6, 2008 [3 favorites]
These are not the holograms you are looking for.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:34 PM on November 6, 2008 [2 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:34 PM on November 6, 2008 [2 favorites]
There's no way we can repel hyperbole of that magnitude!
posted by WolfDaddy at 1:36 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by WolfDaddy at 1:36 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
Maybe I should copy my comment from the last time this link was posted?
Either way.
posted by paisley henosis at 1:36 PM on November 6, 2008
Either way.
posted by paisley henosis at 1:36 PM on November 6, 2008
I am being measured when I say that that "hologram" was the stupidest fucking thing I've ever seen in my whole life.
posted by dirtdirt at 1:37 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by dirtdirt at 1:37 PM on November 6, 2008
What I fail to understand about the 2D touchscreen is why they didn't just put that screen's output on the TV feed (like a telestrator used in football coverage), rather than have a camera film the physical television.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 1:38 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 1:38 PM on November 6, 2008
It will also be cool to see the first time Bay Buchanan comes on with half her skirt tucked into her panties, or when Tucker Carlson has his zipper down. Or especially when Campbell Brown bends over and says, "Help me, Wolf Blitzer, you're my only hope!"
posted by troybob at 1:39 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by troybob at 1:39 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
BLITZER: ... I want to talk to you as I would normally be talking to you if you were really face to face with me. I know you're at least 1,000 miles away, but it looks like you're right here.
Remember this when you see your media these days. Their statements about the "hologram" are lies. Blitzer was talking to empty space, not "face to face," and in general the whole presentation as a "hologram" rather than a fancier green screen are lies.
They will lie to you about petty shit like their special effects, so what does that say about their general trustworthiness?
Specifically, Wolf Blitzer is a liar and Jessica Yellin is a liar and they should feel bad, though the bulk of the blame falls on nameless others.
posted by TheOnlyCoolTim at 1:46 PM on November 6, 2008 [2 favorites]
Remember this when you see your media these days. Their statements about the "hologram" are lies. Blitzer was talking to empty space, not "face to face," and in general the whole presentation as a "hologram" rather than a fancier green screen are lies.
They will lie to you about petty shit like their special effects, so what does that say about their general trustworthiness?
Specifically, Wolf Blitzer is a liar and Jessica Yellin is a liar and they should feel bad, though the bulk of the blame falls on nameless others.
posted by TheOnlyCoolTim at 1:46 PM on November 6, 2008 [2 favorites]
I, too, was confused as to why CNN broadcast from the Death Star. It certainly didn't improve the content of the reporting, didn't make the information easier to understand, and didn't make it more appealing to the eye. Now, if they'd had a golden retriever in a correspondent window, and used animation to make it seem like the dog was talking, while audio of an actual reporter on the phone with Blitzer was broadcast - that would have been journalism gold. But apparently CNN doesn't read any of my e-mails.
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 1:46 PM on November 6, 2008 [12 favorites]
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 1:46 PM on November 6, 2008 [12 favorites]
As far as I can tell, it was like bluescreening, in that they had to overlay the image (and the halo was kept intentionally, according to CNN), but that they could rotate the camera around and the image would act like it was an object in space, and the image would also rotate. I imagine this would be done through simultaneous rotation of the camera that's pointed at the image being "hologrammed," or maybe that is a true 3D hologram image with a wireframe, with the texture being the images captured from various camera angles running at the same time. But maybe I'm not understanding how this works ...
posted by krinklyfig at 1:47 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by krinklyfig at 1:47 PM on November 6, 2008
You guys are looking at this the wrong way...first, it's fun...but also, with all their preoccupation with the slick technology, they might inadvertently say some stuff that is true.
posted by troybob at 1:48 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by troybob at 1:48 PM on November 6, 2008
Heh. I think it's kind of nifty technology (and I sort of expect the haloing was intentional, to remind you that there's something going on). It didn't add anything to the news broadcast, though. A splitscreen or cuts back and forth would have been just as good and probably less distracting. But as a video processing demo, I liked it.
posted by hattifattener at 1:52 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by hattifattener at 1:52 PM on November 6, 2008
Come on people, they had to do SOMETHING with the huge campaign advertising windfall from the last few weeks! My guess is some guy said "hologram" at the meeting and everyone else was too hung over to disagree. Then the tech people rolled their eyes and started setting up the camera array.
And they probably told Wolf Blitzer that only truly great reporters can see the hologram.
You can see it, can't you Wolf?
Uhh...sure I can, I mean, of course I can see it!
posted by Salvor Hardin at 1:56 PM on November 6, 2008 [8 favorites]
And they probably told Wolf Blitzer that only truly great reporters can see the hologram.
You can see it, can't you Wolf?
Uhh...sure I can, I mean, of course I can see it!
posted by Salvor Hardin at 1:56 PM on November 6, 2008 [8 favorites]
So, yeah, not a hologram projected into the space in front of Blitzer ... Maybe the 3D hologram was created as normal, but the blue screen was the fakey part? It's hard to project images like that into 3D space without lasers, and it's hard to capture laser holography in camera effectively.
I'm not sure the point of that, either. I tuned in at one point when Blitzer was bragging about it and had to change the channel quickly. That sort of gimmickry doesn't bode well for focused reporting, and it was the last thing I cared about at that point.
posted by krinklyfig at 2:06 PM on November 6, 2008
I'm not sure the point of that, either. I tuned in at one point when Blitzer was bragging about it and had to change the channel quickly. That sort of gimmickry doesn't bode well for focused reporting, and it was the last thing I cared about at that point.
posted by krinklyfig at 2:06 PM on November 6, 2008
This was the dumbest thing I have ever seen in a newscast. Well, that and Bill O'Reilly.
posted by fusinski at 2:10 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by fusinski at 2:10 PM on November 6, 2008
odinsdream writes "... and the guy spent the next few minutes tapping every. single. state. into the Red column and it still didn't add up to a win. He purposefully avoided stating the conclusion staring everyone in the face, and for the next hour the dance continued."
I finally figured out that the SNL skit with the map was directly pardoying CNN's map, cause I had barely watched any of their coverage until election night. I'm sure there's a video out there somewhere ...
posted by krinklyfig at 2:11 PM on November 6, 2008
I finally figured out that the SNL skit with the map was directly pardoying CNN's map, cause I had barely watched any of their coverage until election night. I'm sure there's a video out there somewhere ...
posted by krinklyfig at 2:11 PM on November 6, 2008
Dumb, yes, but not nearly as distracting as the constant steadicam moves. I switched over to CNN a few times and thought they had been taken over by Brian De Palma.
posted by brundlefly at 2:16 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by brundlefly at 2:16 PM on November 6, 2008
Pfft, there were working desktop holograms back in February 2008! Of course, these were a bit smaller than the full person, and it probably takes a bit of set-up to make a video ready for these HoloCubes.
But when it comes down to it, how can you top NBC's elections on ice? I really wished Obama and Biden would have done a duet once they were known to be the winners. Maybe next time?
posted by filthy light thief at 2:17 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
But when it comes down to it, how can you top NBC's elections on ice? I really wished Obama and Biden would have done a duet once they were known to be the winners. Maybe next time?
posted by filthy light thief at 2:17 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
These are not the holoragms you are seeking.
Join the dark side, they have imaging systems beyond your wildest dreams.
posted by Balisong at 2:18 PM on November 6, 2008
Join the dark side, they have imaging systems beyond your wildest dreams.
posted by Balisong at 2:18 PM on November 6, 2008
They are not holograms until you can go around behind them and check out the hologram's ass.
posted by Balisong at 2:20 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by Balisong at 2:20 PM on November 6, 2008
I finally figured out that the SNL skit with the map was directly pardoying CNN's map, cause I had barely watched any of their coverage until election night. I'm sure there's a video out there somewhere ...
Fred Armisen and his Giant Megapixel Touch Map of the US
posted by Atom Eyes at 2:38 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
Fred Armisen and his Giant Megapixel Touch Map of the US
posted by Atom Eyes at 2:38 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
Pfft, there were working desktop holograms back in February 2008!
That's not even remotely a hologram, either. It's a flat video screen reflected off a flat piece of glass.
posted by loquacious at 2:38 PM on November 6, 2008
That's not even remotely a hologram, either. It's a flat video screen reflected off a flat piece of glass.
posted by loquacious at 2:38 PM on November 6, 2008
Dumb, yes, but not nearly as distracting as the constant steadicam moves.
They had to do the steadicam moves to justify the whole thing, because the only "breakthrough" here is being able to sync up with the camera movement. It's basically "bullet time" from the Matrix, processed in real-time.
If the camera wasn't arbitrarily moving, then the reporter could have just stood in front of a green-screen like they've done for 80 years, and it would have been much harder to hype. "Only on CNN tonight—witness our exclusive Point A Camera At The Reporter's Butt technology!"
posted by designbot at 2:54 PM on November 6, 2008
They had to do the steadicam moves to justify the whole thing, because the only "breakthrough" here is being able to sync up with the camera movement. It's basically "bullet time" from the Matrix, processed in real-time.
If the camera wasn't arbitrarily moving, then the reporter could have just stood in front of a green-screen like they've done for 80 years, and it would have been much harder to hype. "Only on CNN tonight—witness our exclusive Point A Camera At The Reporter's Butt technology!"
posted by designbot at 2:54 PM on November 6, 2008
I won't be happy until there's an eighteen inch high three-dimensional Wolf Blitzer on my coffee table and my cat walks through him.
posted by longsleeves at 2:55 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
posted by longsleeves at 2:55 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
What I fail to understand about the 2D touchscreen is why they didn't just put that screen's output on the TV feed (like a telestrator used in football coverage), rather than have a camera film the physical television.
Well, then you wouldn't be able to see them touch it, would you? How are people supposed to know it's a touchscreen if they can't see anybody touching it?
posted by InfidelZombie at 2:57 PM on November 6, 2008
Well, then you wouldn't be able to see them touch it, would you? How are people supposed to know it's a touchscreen if they can't see anybody touching it?
posted by InfidelZombie at 2:57 PM on November 6, 2008
Pinball 2000 anyone?
posted by i_cola at 3:22 PM on November 6, 2008 [2 favorites]
posted by i_cola at 3:22 PM on November 6, 2008 [2 favorites]
What I thought was funniest about the not-holograms was how fuzzy and staticky they were. Like Max Headroom. If I understand correctly how they were produced, there's no reason for the poor image quality. I like to think they added it so we'd know we were looking at something really SciFi.
posted by Nelson at 3:29 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by Nelson at 3:29 PM on November 6, 2008
The breathless "hologram" hype was unbelievably idiotic, but CNN got a lot of viewers. So I guess it worked. Do we need Captain Obvious to tell us it wasn't really a hologram?
If anyone is dying to know how they did it, here's a behind-the-scenes video.
posted by O9scar at 3:59 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
If anyone is dying to know how they did it, here's a behind-the-scenes video.
posted by O9scar at 3:59 PM on November 6, 2008 [1 favorite]
They had to do the steadicam moves to justify the whole thing, because the only "breakthrough" here is being able to sync up with the camera movement.
Actually, that I understand. It's that CNN moves the camera way too much in general, pseudo-hologram or no.
posted by brundlefly at 4:02 PM on November 6, 2008
Actually, that I understand. It's that CNN moves the camera way too much in general, pseudo-hologram or no.
posted by brundlefly at 4:02 PM on November 6, 2008
I still think this was a galactic FAIL, unable to compete with the hardest working Apes in showbiz.
posted by butterstick at 4:13 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by butterstick at 4:13 PM on November 6, 2008
We won't know that the hologram has truly made its mark on the world until we get holographic porn.
posted by baphomet at 4:40 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by baphomet at 4:40 PM on November 6, 2008
So this is CNN's answer to the calls for more in-depth coverage? Brilliant.
posted by mr.grum at 4:49 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by mr.grum at 4:49 PM on November 6, 2008
The holograms should have had a big 'H' on their forehead.
posted by mike3k at 5:56 PM on November 6, 2008 [2 favorites]
posted by mike3k at 5:56 PM on November 6, 2008 [2 favorites]
It occurs to me that that's not that far off from a bullet-time rig (which are done with still cameras).
I eagerly await holographic Anderson Cooper vs. holographic Wolf Blitzer face-offs set to Juno Reactor.
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 7:19 PM on November 6, 2008
I eagerly await holographic Anderson Cooper vs. holographic Wolf Blitzer face-offs set to Juno Reactor.
posted by fairytale of los angeles at 7:19 PM on November 6, 2008
You may complain it was a stupid stunt, but we aren't talking about MSNBC's coverage, are we?
posted by smackfu at 7:30 PM on November 6, 2008
posted by smackfu at 7:30 PM on November 6, 2008
The Jedi council may have to wait a few more years..?
Umm, wasn't that a long time ago in a galaxy far far away?
posted by nudar at 10:25 PM on November 6, 2008
Umm, wasn't that a long time ago in a galaxy far far away?
posted by nudar at 10:25 PM on November 6, 2008
That reminded to play around with EffecTV some more... One of the standard effects is "HolographicTV" in which the camera first takes a still image and then adds a star-warsy filter to everything that changes compared to that first image; so if you point the camera at, say, your empty chair and then enter with a towel draped over your head you will look almost exactly like one of those holograms. It's unbelievable how much fun something so cheesy can be.
posted by PontifexPrimus at 2:23 AM on November 7, 2008
posted by PontifexPrimus at 2:23 AM on November 7, 2008
I think they should have spent the money on getting the right people in there. The coverage, when compared to the BBC's or even France24's, was rubbish.
posted by chuckdarwin at 4:46 AM on November 7, 2008
posted by chuckdarwin at 4:46 AM on November 7, 2008
Now, if they'd had a golden retriever in a correspondent window, and used animation to make it seem like the dog was talking, while audio of an actual reporter on the phone with Blitzer was broadcast - that would have been journalism gold.
Back in the late 70s, Ted Turner's local Atlanta station WTBS (Channel 17, soon to be known as the Superstation) agreed to produce a half hour news program every weekday to fulfill a clause in their license renewal agreement. Deciding to obey the letter of the law if not the spirit, they put the newscast on at 3 in the morning. Even then it wasn't at a set time, sandwiched as it was between Late Late Late Show movies with irregular running times. The general apathy of the management regarding the show -- who's going to be watching at 3 AM, anyway? -- gave anchorman Bill Tush and his crew free reign to do what they wanted.
Eventually, as you would expect, they started goofing off on the air to amuse themselves. The goofing escalated into all-out tomfoolery with, I dare say, some shenanigans and goings-on as well. And as with many creative enterprises done primarily to amuse just the people working on them, the show gained a cult following of night owls who didn't mind watching through the end of an American International B movie to watch the news when it came on, whenever it came on. Suddenly the question "Who'd be watching at 3 AM, anyway?" wasn't rhetorical.
A lot of the appeal came from the fact that the show just didn't give a damn. There were no actual news resources on hand except for an AP feed, so they went with what they had. They regularly reported on old news. Very old news. "Dewey Defeats Truman" kinds of old news. In a nod to The Gong Show, one of their "correspondents" wore a paper bag over his head and called himself The Unknown Newsman. And Tush's co-anchor was frequently a German Shepherd who sat up at the newsdesk in a shirt and tie.
Every now and then Tush would feed the dog peanut butter and slip off camera but stay on mic, reading the news while the dog did the whole om-nom-nom thing that dogs eating peanut butter do. And even if the dog got bored and hopped off the chair, Tush would continue reading off-camera, while viewers were treated to the sight of an empty news set and whatever news picture they'd chromaed in the upper corner.
You're right. It is journalistic gold.
(Eventually the late night news show was cancelled, but not because of any impropriety on the part of Tush & Co. Ted Turner was set to launch CNN and someone decided maybe the channel's credibility would be strained if the other journalistic mainstay of Turner Broadcasting was a dog eating peanut butter.)
posted by Spatch at 6:06 AM on November 7, 2008 [3 favorites]
Back in the late 70s, Ted Turner's local Atlanta station WTBS (Channel 17, soon to be known as the Superstation) agreed to produce a half hour news program every weekday to fulfill a clause in their license renewal agreement. Deciding to obey the letter of the law if not the spirit, they put the newscast on at 3 in the morning. Even then it wasn't at a set time, sandwiched as it was between Late Late Late Show movies with irregular running times. The general apathy of the management regarding the show -- who's going to be watching at 3 AM, anyway? -- gave anchorman Bill Tush and his crew free reign to do what they wanted.
Eventually, as you would expect, they started goofing off on the air to amuse themselves. The goofing escalated into all-out tomfoolery with, I dare say, some shenanigans and goings-on as well. And as with many creative enterprises done primarily to amuse just the people working on them, the show gained a cult following of night owls who didn't mind watching through the end of an American International B movie to watch the news when it came on, whenever it came on. Suddenly the question "Who'd be watching at 3 AM, anyway?" wasn't rhetorical.
A lot of the appeal came from the fact that the show just didn't give a damn. There were no actual news resources on hand except for an AP feed, so they went with what they had. They regularly reported on old news. Very old news. "Dewey Defeats Truman" kinds of old news. In a nod to The Gong Show, one of their "correspondents" wore a paper bag over his head and called himself The Unknown Newsman. And Tush's co-anchor was frequently a German Shepherd who sat up at the newsdesk in a shirt and tie.
Every now and then Tush would feed the dog peanut butter and slip off camera but stay on mic, reading the news while the dog did the whole om-nom-nom thing that dogs eating peanut butter do. And even if the dog got bored and hopped off the chair, Tush would continue reading off-camera, while viewers were treated to the sight of an empty news set and whatever news picture they'd chromaed in the upper corner.
You're right. It is journalistic gold.
(Eventually the late night news show was cancelled, but not because of any impropriety on the part of Tush & Co. Ted Turner was set to launch CNN and someone decided maybe the channel's credibility would be strained if the other journalistic mainstay of Turner Broadcasting was a dog eating peanut butter.)
posted by Spatch at 6:06 AM on November 7, 2008 [3 favorites]
Yah, it was obvious to me what they were doing, and that Wolf was staring out into empty space and that the whole thing was more augmented reality than hologram.
I thought NBC had a much better gimmick with the way they had the electoral podium VR room going on. Was much cooler. Told my fiancee: "yes, we are close to perfecting holodeck technology."
posted by daHIFI at 8:23 AM on November 7, 2008
I thought NBC had a much better gimmick with the way they had the electoral podium VR room going on. Was much cooler. Told my fiancee: "yes, we are close to perfecting holodeck technology."
posted by daHIFI at 8:23 AM on November 7, 2008
I won't be happy until there's an eighteen inch high three-dimensional Wolf Blitzer on my coffee table and my cat walks through him.
I was REALLY hoping that Wolf would poke at her with a stick.
posted by malocchio at 8:39 AM on November 7, 2008
I was REALLY hoping that Wolf would poke at her with a stick.
posted by malocchio at 8:39 AM on November 7, 2008
I was hoping that Michael Eddington would hack into CNN's systems and show up to mock Wolf.
posted by Halloween Jack at 10:35 AM on November 7, 2008
posted by Halloween Jack at 10:35 AM on November 7, 2008
So, to sum up: A bunch of you guys, despite knowing how to use the Internet, willingly watched TV news on election night. And now you're acting all surprised that it was totally masturbatory.
If this was a significant change from what your TV news is like the rest of the time ... shoot, tell me where you live and what the housing prices are like.
posted by eritain at 3:50 PM on November 7, 2008
If this was a significant change from what your TV news is like the rest of the time ... shoot, tell me where you live and what the housing prices are like.
posted by eritain at 3:50 PM on November 7, 2008
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posted by piratebowling at 1:11 PM on November 6, 2008 [2 favorites]