Charlie's Angels: It's Not About the Half-Wit Retarded Children
July 1, 2009 12:00 PM Subscribe
Ayn Rand discusses in a 1979 Donahue appearance her love of "Charlie's Angels." Amy Wallace reveals the "unlikely friendship" between Rand and actress Farrah Fawcett. Chris Matthew Sciabarra explains the "The Dialectical Meaning of 'Charlie's Angels.'"
I think we already knew Ayn Rand had terrible, terrible taste.
posted by Astro Zombie at 12:08 PM on July 1, 2009 [6 favorites]
posted by Astro Zombie at 12:08 PM on July 1, 2009 [6 favorites]
Also: Ayn Rand's long-term addition to General Hospital and sour-cream Pringles.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 12:16 PM on July 1, 2009 [3 favorites]
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 12:16 PM on July 1, 2009 [3 favorites]
"Who is John Galt?" Bosley. Bosley is John Galt.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 12:24 PM on July 1, 2009 [6 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 12:24 PM on July 1, 2009 [6 favorites]
This nonsense is not the sort of thing I care to spend time on, but I glanced at the dialectical crapola and loved the idea that he could write knowingly about the show though he had never viewed it. That truly is cutting out the middle Angel to Go Gault.
posted by Postroad at 12:26 PM on July 1, 2009
posted by Postroad at 12:26 PM on July 1, 2009
What Rand identified as the Romanticism of the show explains why "Charlie's Angels" was one of the most popular shows of its time.
and all this time I thought it was Farrah's pokies that made the show popular.
posted by caddis at 12:27 PM on July 1, 2009 [3 favorites]
and all this time I thought it was Farrah's pokies that made the show popular.
posted by caddis at 12:27 PM on July 1, 2009 [3 favorites]
Jesus Christ, Knappster. I mean, I'm finally getting used to the fact that once people die they're bound to have their lifeless bodies rent asunder here on Metafilter, torn apart and thrown to the wolves like so much scrap. We've had plenty of obituary threads that were horribly offensive and completely lacking in any kind of taste, decency or respect. And I've almost come to accept this—it's inevitable at this point—I've almost come to accept that every post-mortem thread on Metafilter will be generally about insulting and degrading the recently departed; but to claim that Farrah Fawcett was well-liked by Ayn Rand of all people is simply beyond the pale.
posted by koeselitz at 12:32 PM on July 1, 2009 [16 favorites]
posted by koeselitz at 12:32 PM on July 1, 2009 [16 favorites]
Matthew Sciabarra [linked above]: What Rand identified as the Romanticism of the show explains why "Charlie's Angels" was one of the most popular shows of its time. It was, in fact, the number one show of the 1976-1977 season, and the biggest hit for the ABC network. Every Wednesday night, people tuned in to the show in search of objective values and romantic passion and they were rewarded accordingly.
caddis: and all this time I thought it was Farrah's pokies that made the show popular.
What's hilarious is that that statement actually undermines the Randian connection; if such a television program was really popular with the masses, with the halfwit retarded children and the common people at large, how could it appeal to them without stooping to their level?
I mean, the kids I know who watch the most television are halfwits or retarded. Or at least they act like it.
posted by koeselitz at 12:43 PM on July 1, 2009
caddis: and all this time I thought it was Farrah's pokies that made the show popular.
What's hilarious is that that statement actually undermines the Randian connection; if such a television program was really popular with the masses, with the halfwit retarded children and the common people at large, how could it appeal to them without stooping to their level?
I mean, the kids I know who watch the most television are halfwits or retarded. Or at least they act like it.
posted by koeselitz at 12:43 PM on July 1, 2009
Chris Matthew Sciabarra: (Significantly, if one adds 56 to 52, and subtracts 8, one arrives at the number 100, which, divided by 33 and 1/3, equals 3. Three! An unmistakable instantiation of the show's dialectically triadic motif.)
No! No! Charlie has FOUR angels. You are all EDUCATED STUPID.
posted by eritain at 12:46 PM on July 1, 2009 [5 favorites]
No! No! Charlie has FOUR angels. You are all EDUCATED STUPID.
posted by eritain at 12:46 PM on July 1, 2009 [5 favorites]
She likes Aristotle because he was a defender and advocate of reason, and yet she likes Charlie's Angels because it was the lone eaxmple of the Romantic tradition at the time of the show's taping?
But Romaticism was deliberately, and even meticulously, a rejection of and reaction to the scientific rationalism of the Age of Reason. Additionally, the dominant theme of Romaticism isn't the exceptional individual doing things that are impossible to the common mortal, which Rand seems to believe. In fact, Romantic literature is too varied to ascribe one single theme to it, although I'd say a lot of it deals with the experience of humanity encountering the fantastic or extraordinary, rather than being fantastic or extraodinary.
Of course, I'm just an armchair academic, whereas Ayn Rand was a highly respected philsopher, so far be it for me to suggest that Rand might be contradicting herself, or have a shallow or self-serving definition of Romaticism that she uses to justify the fact that she enjoys what was, by any standard, a pretty terrible television show.
posted by Astro Zombie at 12:52 PM on July 1, 2009 [5 favorites]
But Romaticism was deliberately, and even meticulously, a rejection of and reaction to the scientific rationalism of the Age of Reason. Additionally, the dominant theme of Romaticism isn't the exceptional individual doing things that are impossible to the common mortal, which Rand seems to believe. In fact, Romantic literature is too varied to ascribe one single theme to it, although I'd say a lot of it deals with the experience of humanity encountering the fantastic or extraordinary, rather than being fantastic or extraodinary.
Of course, I'm just an armchair academic, whereas Ayn Rand was a highly respected philsopher, so far be it for me to suggest that Rand might be contradicting herself, or have a shallow or self-serving definition of Romaticism that she uses to justify the fact that she enjoys what was, by any standard, a pretty terrible television show.
posted by Astro Zombie at 12:52 PM on July 1, 2009 [5 favorites]
Is this the part of the thread where I get to mention that I don't own a television?
No, wait, I got that wrong. One moment.
Is this the part of the thread where I get to mention that I've got a television but I don't watch any shows other than Charlie's Angels?
posted by Spatch at 1:13 PM on July 1, 2009
No, wait, I got that wrong. One moment.
Is this the part of the thread where I get to mention that I've got a television but I don't watch any shows other than Charlie's Angels?
posted by Spatch at 1:13 PM on July 1, 2009
Did I slide into an alternate reality again?
Because this... can't be right.
posted by merelyglib at 1:40 PM on July 1, 2009
Because this... can't be right.
posted by merelyglib at 1:40 PM on July 1, 2009
Shrug.
posted by srboisvert at 2:05 PM on July 1, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by srboisvert at 2:05 PM on July 1, 2009 [1 favorite]
But Romaticism was deliberately, and even meticulously, a rejection of and reaction to the scientific rationalism of the Age of Reason.
Romanticism was, among other things, a reaction to the scientific rationalism of the Age of Reason, yes, but to characterize it as a "deliberate" and "meticulous" "rejection" of that scientific rationalism would be extremely misleading. Everyone remembers Wordsworth saying, in his Preface to Lyrical Ballads that "all good poetry is the spontaneous overflow of powerful feelings"; nobody remembers that he goes on to say "and though this be true, Poems to which any value can be attached were never produced on any variety of subjects but by a man who, being possessed of more than usual organic sensibility, had also thought long and deeply."
Romanticism certainly saw itself as grounding the scientific rationalism of the C18th in a new and more holistic (their word would be "organic") context. But none of the major figures of either German or English Romanticism (French Romanticism is something rather different) saw themselves as simplistically rejecting rational scientific inquiry. Indeed, among the younger English Romantics you find a figure like Percy Shelley, for whom Hume (alongside even more trenchant critics of revealed religion, such as the Baron d'Holbach) was a major and much-admired influence.
posted by yoink at 2:33 PM on July 1, 2009 [3 favorites]
Romanticism was, among other things, a reaction to the scientific rationalism of the Age of Reason, yes, but to characterize it as a "deliberate" and "meticulous" "rejection" of that scientific rationalism would be extremely misleading. Everyone remembers Wordsworth saying, in his Preface to Lyrical Ballads that "all good poetry is the spontaneous overflow of powerful feelings"; nobody remembers that he goes on to say "and though this be true, Poems to which any value can be attached were never produced on any variety of subjects but by a man who, being possessed of more than usual organic sensibility, had also thought long and deeply."
Romanticism certainly saw itself as grounding the scientific rationalism of the C18th in a new and more holistic (their word would be "organic") context. But none of the major figures of either German or English Romanticism (French Romanticism is something rather different) saw themselves as simplistically rejecting rational scientific inquiry. Indeed, among the younger English Romantics you find a figure like Percy Shelley, for whom Hume (alongside even more trenchant critics of revealed religion, such as the Baron d'Holbach) was a major and much-admired influence.
posted by yoink at 2:33 PM on July 1, 2009 [3 favorites]
If, on the other hand, the main point of your comment is that Ayn Rand wouldn't know Romanticism from a hole in the ground, I quite agree. Her particular form of "great man" Romanticism is really a post-Romantic development (see Hegel on the World Historical Individual and Carlyle on Heros and Hero Worship).
posted by yoink at 2:45 PM on July 1, 2009
posted by yoink at 2:45 PM on July 1, 2009
"Charlie's Angels" was one of the most popular shows of its time. . . . Every Wednesday night, people tuned in to the show in search of objective values and romantic passion and they were rewarded accordingly.
Uh . . . right.
posted by flug at 3:20 PM on July 1, 2009
Uh . . . right.
posted by flug at 3:20 PM on July 1, 2009
And were you rewarded accordingly?
A IS A!
AND T IS T!
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 3:37 PM on July 1, 2009 [3 favorites]
A IS A!
AND T IS T!
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 3:37 PM on July 1, 2009 [3 favorites]
"First, I should note that I personally never watched "Charlie's Angels," but did hear about it. "
This is comedy gold. Is it a requirement someplace that you have to be an intellectual poser to be a proper Randist?
posted by AsYouKnow Bob at 7:58 PM on July 1, 2009 [4 favorites]
This is comedy gold. Is it a requirement someplace that you have to be an intellectual poser to be a proper Randist?
posted by AsYouKnow Bob at 7:58 PM on July 1, 2009 [4 favorites]
One need not actually inspect a text to come to definitive conclusions about its content and meaning
I was engaged in important cultural research on the influence of primordial beats on the most recent generation of culturally bankrupt, drugged-out teens. This important research often took me to discos, where I could observe first-hand the culturally decadent atmosphere and take notes on the morally impoverished mating rituals.
Then the truly great part:
Chris Matthew Sciabarra [...] is the world authority on the transcendent dialectic implications of triadically-implicated dualism.
And this is not satire? Oh, the horror...
posted by Idle Curiosity at 3:49 AM on July 2, 2009
I was engaged in important cultural research on the influence of primordial beats on the most recent generation of culturally bankrupt, drugged-out teens. This important research often took me to discos, where I could observe first-hand the culturally decadent atmosphere and take notes on the morally impoverished mating rituals.
Then the truly great part:
Chris Matthew Sciabarra [...] is the world authority on the transcendent dialectic implications of triadically-implicated dualism.
And this is not satire? Oh, the horror...
posted by Idle Curiosity at 3:49 AM on July 2, 2009
"Charlie's Angels" is thus a searing testament to dialectical (de)construction, and must on those grounds alone have appealed to Rand on a deeply psycho-epistemological level.
Personally, I don't believe Randians are mentally developed enough to do satire. If you can stomach the absurdities, their dramatic head-up-their-own-ass pronouncements can be lots of laffs.
posted by telstar at 12:22 PM on July 2, 2009
Personally, I don't believe Randians are mentally developed enough to do satire. If you can stomach the absurdities, their dramatic head-up-their-own-ass pronouncements can be lots of laffs.
posted by telstar at 12:22 PM on July 2, 2009
Having just read Rand's comments as relayed by FF, I have decided to use the word "triumphs" more often in conversation.
posted by sour cream at 1:03 PM on July 2, 2009
posted by sour cream at 1:03 PM on July 2, 2009
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posted by ZenMasterThis at 12:06 PM on July 1, 2009