Murdered by skinheads for being gay. When will the igorance and hate stop?

July 4, 2009 5:05 PM

A family tries to cope after their son is killed for being gayRemarkable family. Interesting, layered documentary but bad translation.
posted by hooptycritter (53 comments total)

Ack. I totally didn't watch this the other night on purpose. And now it's being MeFi'ed at me? Okay, I'll check it out later.
posted by hippybear at 5:17 PM on July 4, 2009

The grim patience they present in the face of all this is shattering to behold.
posted by hermitosis at 5:21 PM on July 4, 2009

Merci.
posted by Decimask at 5:31 PM on July 4, 2009

The family is remarkable indeed.
I was attacked in December 2005. It is so very difficult not to feel intense anger, hatred and a desire for vengeance, including rough justice.
posted by hooptycritter at 6:27 PM on July 4, 2009

http://www.pinkpistols.org
posted by MaggieL at 6:44 PM on July 4, 2009 [5 favorites]

Remarkable.
I can't even begin to imagine.
The devastation. The insanity and the outright pure, primitive, desire to wipe out those who destroyed something so cherished and apart of your life.

The translation is poor. English is always a clumsy language to translate to.
posted by DonnyMac at 6:49 PM on July 4, 2009

P.O.V. is the best thing on TV.
posted by Mayor Curley at 7:37 PM on July 4, 2009

nthing MaggieL.
posted by kldickson at 7:47 PM on July 4, 2009

I only watched part, and stopped when I got too pissed off to continue.

SOMEONE ELSE - A FRIEND OF THE VICTIM - WAS THERE, IN A CAR, AND HE DID NOTHING.

What. The. Fuck. Seriously. You have a CAR. It's a huge weapon - why didn't you HIT THEM WITH IT? Why didn't you GET OUT AND DEFEND HIM? Why aren't you dead too, faceless dude who let it happen and stayed in the car?

I got a man. He's a good man, and we've been together for almost 13 years now. I cannot imagine a situation in which I would let anyone, for any reason, put their hands on him without trying to intervene. I can think of at least three instances where we were somewhere doing something (grocery shopping, out at a bar, whatever) and some stranger fucked with either me or my partner, and we backed each other up regardless of the situation. Three on two? And faceless dude who let it happen and stayed in the car LET IT HAPPEN AND STAYED IN THE CAR?!?

Yeah, maybe I should reserve my anger for the perpetrators. But they are what they are - rightwing Skins with fag issues. You have to expect fagbashing from them - it's kind of implicit in the whole definition of "rightwings Skins with fag issues", if you get me.

But the victim's friend/trick/partner/whoever, who didn't even try to help, oh fuck that guy. Sit in a car while a total stranger you just picked up for mutual blowjobs is murdered? No, NOT OK. Sit in a car and not do a goddamn thing while a bunch of fascism-fetishists kill your friend and you don't even try to intervene? NOT OK. Your partner is beaten, insulted, and drowned and you SIT IN THE CAR AND LET IT HAPPEN? What? No, that is NOT OK.

Arrrrgh. I'm yammering almost stream-of-consciousness style. But I will post this.

Because sitting back and letting someone be killed instead of stepping up and trying to defend them is NOT OK.
posted by mountain_william at 7:52 PM on July 4, 2009 [14 favorites]

I can't watch this. On top of what happened in Ft Worth last week, I cannot sit through something like this.
posted by crataegus at 8:45 PM on July 4, 2009

What he said.

And no, I won't watch this. I've been fortunate (despite my mouthiness) to have never been attacked for being gay. Other friends have not been so lucky, and I think watching this would depress and enrage me in equal measure.

That being said, it does need to be watched, but not by those of us likely to be victims. By those who perpetrate these acts, and by those whose silence is complicit in them.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 8:59 PM on July 4, 2009

What. The. Fuck. Seriously. You have a CAR. It's a huge weapon - why didn't you HIT THEM WITH IT? Why didn't you GET OUT AND DEFEND HIM? Why aren't you dead too, faceless dude who let it happen and stayed in the car?

I read this sentence, and figured you were being sarcastic. But after the rest, I'm not so sure. Wouldn't driving at the attackers put Francois at just as much risk? And would the world be better off if he had gotten out, and both of them had been killed instead?
posted by Clandestine Outlawry at 9:03 PM on July 4, 2009

RE: the afforementioned Ft Worth incident. I hadn't heard anything but I found this
clicky
And it's pretty incredibly maddening stuff. You must read.

The reason I selected that link in particular is that it has a bunch of contact info and links at the bottom of it for action on this.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 9:31 PM on July 4, 2009

Interview with filmmaker Olivier Meyru

L'Affaire Chenu [FR Wikipedia]
posted by dhartung at 9:49 PM on July 4, 2009

And would the world be better off if he had gotten out, and both of them had been killed instead?

It has nothing to do with the world... if someone was attacking my wife, yes, I'd be out of the car and defending her, even if it meant my own death. If it was my friend, I'd be out there defending him. It's personal.
posted by Huck500 at 9:53 PM on July 4, 2009 [1 favorite]

RE: the afforementioned Ft Worth incident. I hadn't heard anything but I found this
clicky

Jesus fucking Christ. On the anniversary of Stonewall, yet. I have a sneaking suspicion that this wasn't accidental. Teach the queers a lesson: you don't get to be safe anywhere. Modern-day Klan.

I am shaking with rage after reading that.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 10:07 PM on July 4, 2009

Regarding the DFW raid on the Rainbow Lounge:

Police Deny Targeting Gays in Violent Fort Worth, TX Bar Raid.

Candlelight Vigil Planned as Police Chief Floats 'Gay Panic' Defense in Violent Bar Raid in Fort Worth, Texas.

Facebook Page: Rainbow Lounge Raid.

Star-Telegram: Web helps mobilize protest against incident at gay club.

Chad Gibson's Mother Speaks Out.

Eyewitness Accounts of the Raid.

posted by ericb at 10:31 PM on July 4, 2009

Homophobia has no place in our society, but it's up to us everyday participants to let homophobes know their views are ugly and unacceptable.

Don't let anyone - anyone - get away with it. Call the haters on it every time. Make them uncomfortable, more uncomfortable than they make you. Don't be polite, don't give them any comfort at all - tell them their comments are hateful and wrong, and that you won't have any part of it. Some situations, of course will be too dangerous for direct confrontation; this is understandable - caution is of primary importance, and personal safety is always the ultimate concern.

If you're in the service industry, recuse yourself from helping anyone spouting slurs or displaying anti-gay behavior.
If you're in the business world, talk to HR about any behavior or activity that seems to be singling out or targeting gays.
If you're related to a bigot, try to talk to them about their behavior.

If you're out in public, try passive-aggressive behavior, but by all means, play it safe - don't be obvious, and don't get yourself hurt! just be an obstruction: Make the antagonist's life difficult for them: stop suddenly of they are behind you. Obstruct the sidewalk. Take the time to pay in exact change, then realize you don't have it on you. Call the cops on every parking/noise complaint you can find. Be ambiguous about your turn signal. Be in the way. Be a nuisance.

Stay safe, but make the haters suffer. Cost them every minute of their lives you can, and tell your friends - gay or straight - that it's important that they do the same.

Just don't carry a pistol.
posted by Graygorey at 11:30 PM on July 4, 2009 [1 favorite]

RE: The DFW "raid". How absolutely insulting for the police to claim that they were groped when entering a gay bar. Do they expect to be believed?

And not to downplay the terrible wrong done to Chad Gibson, but what are "bar checks"? I have been in many bars, in many places and I have never seen groups of police entering a bar to check ID's and states of sobriety with the ability to arrest people for public drunkeness - in a bar!

Is this done at non gay establishments in DFW? The witnesses interviewed did not seem suprised by the presence of the police, just the outcome. Do the police do this to shake down bar owners to get payoffs? I don't know why upstanding citizens who have every right to drink and get drunk if they choose to would stand for this kind of government interference.

I'd like to think that there will come a day when homophobia is a thing of the past.
posted by readery at 11:33 PM on July 4, 2009

Stay safe, but make the haters suffer.

Uhh, that just gives them more ammunition. Thanks for playing, though.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 11:47 PM on July 4, 2009

I don't know why upstanding citizens who have every right to drink and get drunk if they choose to would stand for this kind of government interference.

Public intoxication is still illegal in a lot of places.

And yeah, gay crowds--especially gay men of a certain age--are extremely used to cops coming in on any pretext.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 11:49 PM on July 4, 2009

@dirtynumbangelboy
I have been attacked so I am acutely aware of this problem.
I think you need to watch this - that is what this is all about - self imposed ignorance from any side is not acceptable. That is what the family lives out. Watch it then comment.
posted by hooptycritter at 5:15 AM on July 5, 2009

Because sitting back and letting someone be killed instead of stepping up and trying to defend them is NOT OK.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bystander_effect

It is not ok but it is also understandable and very common.

You and I may like to think we would be the sort of people that would step up and do something in situations like that but until we are actually tested you can't really know and, chances are, we aren't.

Think of all the times you haven't helped someone and could have (that did not involve and angry violent mob). You may think that you have some magic switch that flips and changes your default behavior when someone's life is in jeopardy but most people just do not.

I think it is important that people understand that they are flawed so they can better prepare themselves and perhaps have a better chance to go against their nature and make themselves help. Assuming you aren't one of those people that would stand around and watch is arrogance.
posted by prak at 6:08 AM on July 5, 2009 [7 favorites]

if someone was attacking my wife, yes, I'd be out of the car and defending her, even if it meant my own death.

I agree with prak. There is really no way of knowing what you would do, and judging someone else for reacting just as any of us might is really unfair and misses the point.
posted by hermitosis at 6:54 AM on July 5, 2009 [2 favorites]

As noted above, I don't think anyone here has a right to judge the guy in the car who you don't know from Adam. You were not there you don't know him, you can't evaluate his fear and his reaction to the situation. Do you think he is proud of his reaction? Do you think he doesn't wish he had reacted differently?
posted by MrBobaFett at 7:57 AM on July 5, 2009 [1 favorite]

self imposed ignorance

I am intimately familiar with the pain that gaybashing causes. Having sat with a friend's husband in the hospital while he was in a coma for a week somewhat drives that home.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 11:42 AM on July 5, 2009

This just makes me so incredibly sad. I am proud of the progress that we have made as a community. And then I see something like this.

What the hell have we ever done to you? I live my quiet life with my wonderful partner. We pay our taxes. We help the needy. We don't lie, cheat or steal. I can't even conceive of someone who thinks they have the moral authority to hurt and punish us for having the virtue to love someone.
posted by kamikazegopher at 1:34 PM on July 5, 2009

mountain_william: Because sitting back and letting someone be killed instead of stepping up and trying to defend them is NOT OK.

You know, real life isn't an action movie. In real life normally nonviolent people often panic and freeze when confronted with violence, or act unpredictably. You have to have special training to reliably cope with such a situation, and even with that it isn't a given that you'll make rational decisions or act the most effective way possible in a situation.

Not to mention that driving a car into a fight sounds like a great idea if you know they're trying to murder someone but a terrible idea if you think they're just trying to kick their ass. You stand a substantial chance of accidentally killing the person you're intervening to save. It sounds like a good plan in hindsight, but at the time it probably wouldn't have, since you wouldn't have known what they were trying to do.
posted by Mitrovarr at 2:56 PM on July 5, 2009

@ dirtynumbangelboy
This post is about a documentary about how a specific family deals with this and what may be gained from their experiences - it is not a general post about gay bashing.

So perhaps you could make a post that addresses your needs and concerns rather than posting here when you refuse to see the film. You obviously have very strong feelings about this.

The film centers on how to move forward after such a horrible crime that affects so many people.
posted by hooptycritter at 4:49 PM on July 5, 2009

You have to have special training to reliably cope with such a situation, and even with that it isn't a given that you'll make rational decisions or act the most effective way possible in a situation.

Indeed. Various military forces were alarmed when, in the wake of WW II, studies on combat effectiveness suggested as few as a third to a half of soldiers actually fired in combat - the rest would freeze, hide, or generally do something other than try to kill the guys shooting at them.
posted by rodgerd at 7:12 PM on July 5, 2009

In the documentary, the dude who stayed in the car didn't say "I was paralyzed - I was frozen - I could not move". He stated that he stayed in the car because he was afraid of getting attacked himself. That sounds like a decision, not a reaction. Reactions are forgivable and understandable. Deciding to let someone be beaten while you wait it out in relative safety - that's pretty unforgivable.

Personally, I'd rather die because my boyfriend plowed the truck into a group of thugs who were beating me up and hit me too than because he sat in the truck and let them beat be to death.
posted by mountain_william at 9:21 PM on July 5, 2009

I hate that the people who hate us can make us afraid like this. I hate having to do a quick tactical analysis before holding hands in public; I hate knowing that just by going someplace where gay people hang out, I make myself a target.

What I hate even more is that it makes my mother afraid for me. It would have been so much easier for her to deal with me being gay if she didn't have to be afraid of my being attacked just for who I am.

The people who love us the most are terrified. These goons are out there, and they don't think we've got a right to live. They've been fed so much vitriol about us, from the right-wing radio fearmongers and the christian bully pulpits that they can't see us as people, just a threat.

And all we can do is keep educating them. Keep letting them see that gay people are people, and no matter who we have sex with, no matter who we love, it doesn't make us a threat. We love despite the fact that it may get us killed; what better proof of our humanity is there than that?
posted by MrVisible at 9:22 PM on July 5, 2009

So perhaps you could make a post that addresses your needs and concerns rather than posting here when you refuse to see the film.

Perhaps you could refrain from telling me where and when and how I am permitted to post? That would be ever so kind.

I don't want to see this movie because I don't want to re-experience that level of pain and trauma--and resultant anger--again. Sorry if that offends you, but it's just how it is.

We love despite the fact that it may get us killed; what better proof of our humanity is there than that?

They don't appear to believe that love enters into the equasion. That's sort of the problem, and it doesn't seem possible to educate them otherwise.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 10:03 PM on July 5, 2009

They don't appear to believe that love enters into the equasion. That's sort of the problem, and it doesn't seem possible to educate them otherwise.

It's not, of course, if we consider them as a monolithic monobrow monoculture. There are educable individuals among them, though; there are teachable moments, where some of these hardened homophobes can learn that there's nothing to fear from us, and nothing to hate, either.

I know, it's totally lunatic optimism, but I've seen homophobes get over their prejudices before. For some of them, it's a key to growing up and out of their self-centered worldviews. Other bigots, sadly, are bigots forever.

We have to teach them that we're individuals, not a threatening group they can hate with impunity. Hating and fearing them as a group seems like a bad place to start.
posted by MrVisible at 10:22 PM on July 5, 2009

Hating and fearing them as a group seems like a bad place to start.

Oh, that's where you mistake me. I don't hate these people. I pity them for the terrible paucity of anything remotely like civilised thought they possess. I do fear them, and rightly; they want me to not have the same rights as they do, and an astonishing number of them think it's okay to beat us up and/or kill us. I take exception to that.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 10:36 PM on July 5, 2009

As well you should. As do I. Just keep in mind that some of them can be reasoned with, and can grasp the idea that we're really human beings. These people can become our staunchest allies, and they're surprisingly good at spreading the word.

See them as individuals, each of whom has different goals, abilities, prejudices, flaws and virtues.

It's what we're asking of them, after all.
posted by MrVisible at 11:08 PM on July 5, 2009

@dirtynumbangelboy
You sound as self righteous as the people you hate but that you say you "pity."
You didn't watch the movie so you as just pontificating.
Your intolerance and fixed ideas of your superiority are exactly what the film addresses.
You have not been attacked so you do not know what it is like.
But you seethe and continue the whole toxic cycle.
I hope you learn that hate breeds hate.
But you don't see yourself as part of the problem so from your lofty and self-beatified remove you judge and are also not part of the solution.
posted by hooptycritter at 4:02 AM on July 6, 2009

hooptycritter: you are arguing out of your own ignorance, since you don't know Dirtynumbangelboy. This isn't really helpful for anything. So here's something helpful, people call it a "clue": Some of us have experience that runs rather deep. And seriously, if you've lived through an experience, you really don't need to watch a video about it. Someday, you might understand that simple truth.
posted by Goofyy at 5:39 AM on July 6, 2009

@hooptycritter

dirtynumbangelboy's friends have been attacked. He's sat in the hospital while his friend's partner lay in a coma from an attack. This is practically the same as being attacked. He has been through what that family has been through already. It's perfectly valid for him to protect himself by not living through that again by watching this movie.

I'm really not sure why you're posting to him so often here. Other people in this thread have also said that they're not going to watch the film because it will trigger bad memories and bad emotions that they can't handle at the moment. It's a mature decision. They're here discussing the issue, contributing their experiences, which is what often happens in MeFi. You posted the link, but you can't control the discussion, and ... it's going well! I'm not sure what you're on about. He's not saying he won't watch the film because it's bad; he's saying he won't watch it because it's likely pretty good and he can't handle having all those memories and emotions triggered right now.

We have to teach them that we're individuals, not a threatening group they can hate with impunity. Hating and fearing them as a group seems like a bad place to start.

Personally, this is how I moved from my raised-evangelical gay-is-a-sin stance to my current position (gay people are normal). I found a blog in the mid-90s by a hilarious gay guy and read it for a few years. When he and his partner broke up, I surprised myself by being sad about that, and realised that my ideas had changed, just by getting to know one person a bit and seeing their real life, not a caricature of it.
posted by heatherann at 5:51 AM on July 6, 2009 [1 favorite]

You sound as self righteous as the people you hate but that you say you "pity."

Don't you fucking dare say that I am lying when I say I pity these people and do not hate them.

Your intolerance and fixed ideas of your superiority are exactly what the film addresses.

My what? Tolerance of hatred is not a virtue, kiddo. Please forgive me, but I tend to be rather intolerant of those who want to take away my rights and/or see me dead.

But you seethe and continue the whole toxic cycle.
I hope you learn that hate breeds hate.

Uh. What part of "Oh, that's where you mistake me. I don't hate these people" was unclear to you? Seriously, I'd like to know. What part of 'I don't hate' gets interpreted by you as me hating them?

But you don't see yourself as part of the problem so from your lofty and self-beatified remove you judge and are also not part of the solution.

Um. Exactly how are gay people part of the problem of gay people being beaten to death? Are black people part of the problem of lynchings?
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 9:53 AM on July 6, 2009

In fact, the more I have thought about what you said, the more I am enraged. How dare you suggest that? What on Earth gives you the right to tell a gay man that he doesn't see himself as part of the problem (gee, what a shock there, I don't see myself as part of the problem of gaybashing) and clearly isn't part of the solution? Where, seriously, do you get off on telling me that?

And it would be great--no, really it would be just fantastic--if you could show me exactly where I judged? Could you do that? We both know you can't, because I didn't, but boy howdy would I like to see you try.

Here's a hint, kid: attacking one of the more openly gay members of this site because he doesn't particularly wish to revisit memories of trauma and pain related to gaybashing is a spectacularly stupid idea.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 1:49 PM on July 6, 2009

You know it really isn't worth it.
You really haven't understood why I posted this or made andy effort to understand my experience either.
Shine on.
And I think I have been out gay for longer than you have been on this earth. And worked for gay causes and marched, and sat in and visited the sick and on and on but you are the mostest, most valid gay on this site.
Acting like a victim is contributing to the problem.
Again the film spoke to this point.
Groovy. I am done.
Best of luck. Enrage on. That was what the post was about - getting beyond rage.
posted by hooptycritter at 3:55 PM on July 6, 2009

Wow, umm.. way to miss the point. Is there a reason you're attacking me? is there a reason you said I was lying?

You really haven't understood why I posted this or made andy effort to understand my experience either.

Says who? Hmm, looks like the opposite, actually. Try reading what I've actually written, ok? "That being said, it does need to be watched, but not by those of us likely to be victims. By those who perpetrate these acts, and by those whose silence is complicit in them." Would be a good place for you to start.

And I think I have been out gay for longer than you have been on this earth.

If you are who some quick googling seems to indicate you are, you're a whopping eleven years or so older than I am. So that's doubtful.

And worked for gay causes and marched, and sat in and visited the sick and on and on
As have I. That doesn't seem to stop you from being a dick, however.

but you are the mostest, most valid gay on this site

I said that where? Oh right, I didn't. I did say I was one of the more openly gay members, however. Which I am.

Acting like a victim is contributing to the problem.

I did that where? Oh right, I didn't.

That was what the post was about - getting beyond rage.

Thus quite neatly missing the point that it is your behaviour that is enraging.

It is highly educational that you completely ignored the questions I put to you. Are you going to grow up and be a big kid now, or are you going to keep attacking me for shit I haven't done or said?
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 5:05 PM on July 6, 2009

your entire posts have been about trauma and victimization and how you could not bear to see what the post was about, namely a film.
And yet you have never been attacked, never been hospitalized, never had to have reconstructive surgery b/c of a bashing. but you know far more than me, a person who has had those experiences, so please I give the floor and all the gay creds and everything to you. Speak up, speak out, but please be more articulate than you have been.
You have posted Oprah encounter shtick and I guess that's what we've come to. Pat encounter group speak.
you really, really, really are always right aren't you?
cheers.
posted by hooptycritter at 6:31 PM on July 6, 2009

I'm not sure what alternate universe you are reading my posts in, but I urge you to try and read them in the same universe I wrote them.

I find it interesting that you didn't attack anyone else.

I find it interesting that you keep putting words in my mouth; I never said any of the things you're claiming I have.

But most of all, I find it interesting that rather than respond to anything I have actually said, you simply keep attacking me for things I have not.

And by 'interesting' I mean 'pathetic' in the last sentence.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 6:43 PM on July 6, 2009

Why did hooptycritter turn this into the dirtynumbangelboy and hooptycritter show?
posted by prak at 9:28 PM on July 6, 2009

the dirtynumbangelboy and hooptycritter show

Taken out of the context of Metafilter this might actually make an interesting show.

Seriously though, my wife and I watched the video last night. Such needless and boneheaded brutality those skinhead dipshits inflicted on that family. That DFW PD raid is some heinous bullshit as well.

Sure, maybe a skinhead here and there can be lead away from his moronic outlook eventually. But how many innocent people are going to be battered or worse in the meantime? Too damn many.

No, to hell with them. They can come to that realization all on their own if they have it in them.
posted by metagnathous at 9:44 PM on July 6, 2009

Why did hooptycritter turn this into the dirtynumbangelboy and hooptycritter show?

I wish I knew. Bizarre, to say the least.


No, to hell with them. They can come to that realization all on their own if they have it in them.

That's largely where I am about the issue.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 9:56 PM on July 6, 2009

dirtynumbangelboy - still haven't watched the film, right?
As I said, this is all yours - it was never a post about a documentary on a French family who lost a son. It was about you.
take it away, please, just go for it. you know all you need to know without seeing what a post is about.
posted by hooptycritter at 4:13 AM on July 7, 2009

You know, I still haven't watched this, and I'm going to stick with my initial gut reaction when PBS was feeding it to me: I don't need to sit and spend an hour reading bad subtitles illuminating a story which I know is just going to make me cry and piss me off.

Still, thanks for posting it it here to the Blue. Even when I decidedly do not wish to RTFA, the discussion can sometimes be worth reading.
posted by hippybear at 9:06 AM on July 7, 2009 [2 favorites]

Sure, maybe a skinhead here and there can be lead away from his moronic outlook eventually. But how many innocent people are going to be battered or worse in the meantime? Too damn many.

No, to hell with them. They can come to that realization all on their own if they have it in them.

Damning them to hell isn't going to prevent them from doing harm. The only alternative I can see to trying to educate them is to wait for them to hurt someone, and then throw them in jail.

Education is the only thing that can prevent them from hurting anyone, and it might end up turning an enemy into an ally. Isn't it worth trying?

After all, they weren't born hating us. Someone taught them that, carefully. They've got a head full of the wrong ideas about us, and while it's not our obligation to correct them, it's enormously to our advantage. If they understand us, they can't hate us anymore.

And, you know, vice versa.
posted by MrVisible at 9:18 AM on July 7, 2009

dirtynumbangelboy - still haven't watched the film, right?

Well no. Hippybear says it well: "and I'm going to stick with my initial gut reaction when PBS was feeding it to me: I don't need to sit and spend an hour reading bad subtitles illuminating a story which I know is just going to make me cry and piss me off."

Are you going to start attacking him now? And if not, why not? He said the same thing I did, before I did even.

As I said, this is all yours - it was never a post about a documentary on a French family who lost a son. It was about you.

*blink*

take it away, please, just go for it. you know all you need to know without seeing what a post is about.

What? At what point are you actually going to respond to what I have said as opposed to what for some reason you have decided I said? Note please that the two have nothing in common with each other. Why have you decided to shit on me here when others have said the exact same thing I did?
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 1:49 PM on July 7, 2009

Y'know, I am coming to the suspicion that you are not in fact the person I googled and are instead someone with some sort of grudge against me hiding behind a fake username.
posted by dirtynumbangelboy at 1:50 PM on July 7, 2009